Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations system: pay for a feature

[Charles-H. Schulz]

Hello Carlo,

Le jeudi 16 mai 2013 à 14:07 +0200, Carlo Strata a écrit :
> Hi Charles,
> 
> thank you very much but with "approved new feature" I meant "next 
> releases features" that are not yet implemented but wanted features, 
> wanted by Community and/or TDF.
> 
> I have found something similar here:
> https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/QA
> 
> in the "Enhancement requests (experimental)" link that take you here:
> https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Vote_for_Enhancement
> 
> that is, obviously, a set of collected enhanced "issues"...
> I also remember that the initial pdf/a develop was done by an Italian 
> developer...
> 
> I think to be part of the big the digital preservation of electronic 
> documents business is one of the good thing to pursuit.
> 
> In the famous release plan page would be useful to put the features that 
> TDF, Developer and Community intend to include in each version: if you 
> want say it a "featured road map", something like this:
> http://wiki.scribus.net/canvas/1.5.x_Roadmap
> 
> Have a nice afternoon,


We do indeed have a few dedicated page in the wiki as you pointed out,
but as you know we don't have a roadmap they way it is classically
understood; release notes exist however not just at the time of the
release and appear much earlier, in this sense, they are the next
features page you may be looking for.

best,

Charles.

> 
> Carlo
> 
> ing. Carlo Strata
> -
> via Botticelli 1/4
> 30031 Dolo - VE
> Italia - Italy
> -
> tel./fax +39.041.822.0665
> cell. +39.347.85.69.824
> Skype carlo.strata
> Google carlo.strata.69
> -
> carlo.str...@tiscali.it
> PEC: carlo.str...@ingpec.eu
> 
> Il 16/05/2013 10.50, Charles-H. Schulz ha scritto:
> > Hello Carlo,
> >
> > Le jeudi 16 mai 2013 à 09:09 +0200, Carlo Strata a écrit :
> >> Hi Everyone,
> >>
> >> in any case (!) none has answered to my initial question and moreover
> >> has to be avoided changing the thread object and throw away one person's
> >> suggest or a simply discuss. So that now I have to renew my question
> >> with another all new post!!! Thank you!
> >>
> >> [OT] I have donate to LibreOffice some money and sure many of my time
> >> since 28.09.2010 to spread his use, to make it in mind to many people in
> >> Italy and in my local engineer professional association.
> >>
> > Thank you a lot BTW!
> >
> >> In any case I think that resources like University Students, Google SoC,
> >> ... are and remain useful to both sides ;-) (TDF/Community/Users and
> >> Students themselfes).
> >>
> >> I also want to find an approved new feature list in TDF or LibreOffice
> >> site...
> > I think we do have what you are looking for:
> > https://www.libreoffice.org/features/ (and linked pages from there)
> > https://www.libreoffice.org/index.php/download/4-0-new-features-and-fixes/
> >
> > and of course, the wiki pages:
> > https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/ReleaseNotes/4.0
> >
> > Hope this helps,
> >
> > Charles.
> >
> >
> >> Have all a sunny day,
> >>
> >> Carlo
> >>
> >> ing. Carlo Strata
> >> -
> >> via Botticelli 1/4
> >> 30031 Dolo - VE
> >> Italia - Italy
> >> -
> >> tel./fax +39.041.822.0665
> >> cell. +39.347.85.69.824
> >> Skype carlo.strata
> >> Google carlo.strata.69
> >> -
> >> carlo.str...@tiscali.it
> >> PEC: carlo.str...@ingpec.eu
> >>
> >> Il 16/05/2013 01.58, Steve Edmonds ha scritto:
> >>> On 2013-05-16 07:45, Joel Madero wrote:
> >> Any payments and/or donations must be accounted for and if the person
> > paying has any intent it to go to xyz, then by regulations we may
> > need to
> > account for that payment/donation and where it went to.
> >
> > That is the real problem with targeted donations and payments.
> > There will
> > be a mess in paperwork to deal with it.  Opt in, opt out, What it
> > was used
> > for.  Keeping track of all of who pays what, for what, can cost more
> > than
> > thepayment in paperwork and legal fees.
>  This has been discussed quite a bit on user list and brought up
>  during ESC
>  at some point and I thought the consensus was "we'll just let them do
>  what
>  they want" and not endorse, support, etc... any of that. I thought that
>  kept us out of legal muddy waters. It'd be similar to me just going to a
>  friend who is a programmer and saying "dude, can I pay you $100 to
>  fix this
>  issue" - a contract completely out of TDF's hands.
> 
> 
>  Best,
>  Joel
> >>> Would this paid for feature not then create a fork in the code, then
> >>> are you committing to maintaining that branch until some time (may be
> >>> never) that the branch feature is voted into the main code base. It
> >>> seems a bit impractical when you have a continually evolving product
> >>> to pay to add a feature unless you are assured it will be included in
> >>> the main code base and maintained.
> >>> Steve
> >>>
> >>
> >
> 
> 


-- 
Charles-H. Schulz
Co-Founder & Director, The Document Foundation,
Zimmerstr

Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations system: pay for a feature

[Carlo Strata]

Hi Charles,

thank you very much but with "approved new feature" I meant "next 
releases features" that are not yet implemented but wanted features, 
wanted by Community and/or TDF.


I have found something similar here:
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/QA

in the "Enhancement requests (experimental)" link that take you here:
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Vote_for_Enhancement

that is, obviously, a set of collected enhanced "issues"...
I also remember that the initial pdf/a develop was done by an Italian 
developer...


I think to be part of the big the digital preservation of electronic 
documents business is one of the good thing to pursuit.


In the famous release plan page would be useful to put the features that 
TDF, Developer and Community intend to include in each version: if you 
want say it a "featured road map", something like this:

http://wiki.scribus.net/canvas/1.5.x_Roadmap

Have a nice afternoon,

Carlo

ing. Carlo Strata
-
via Botticelli 1/4
30031 Dolo - VE
Italia - Italy
-
tel./fax +39.041.822.0665
cell. +39.347.85.69.824
Skype carlo.strata
Google carlo.strata.69
-
carlo.str...@tiscali.it
PEC: carlo.str...@ingpec.eu

Il 16/05/2013 10.50, Charles-H. Schulz ha scritto:

Hello Carlo,

Le jeudi 16 mai 2013 à 09:09 +0200, Carlo Strata a écrit :

Hi Everyone,

in any case (!) none has answered to my initial question and moreover
has to be avoided changing the thread object and throw away one person's
suggest or a simply discuss. So that now I have to renew my question
with another all new post!!! Thank you!

[OT] I have donate to LibreOffice some money and sure many of my time
since 28.09.2010 to spread his use, to make it in mind to many people in
Italy and in my local engineer professional association.


Thank you a lot BTW!


In any case I think that resources like University Students, Google SoC,
... are and remain useful to both sides ;-) (TDF/Community/Users and
Students themselfes).

I also want to find an approved new feature list in TDF or LibreOffice
site...

I think we do have what you are looking for:
https://www.libreoffice.org/features/ (and linked pages from there)
https://www.libreoffice.org/index.php/download/4-0-new-features-and-fixes/

and of course, the wiki pages:
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/ReleaseNotes/4.0

Hope this helps,

Charles.



Have all a sunny day,

Carlo

ing. Carlo Strata
-
via Botticelli 1/4
30031 Dolo - VE
Italia - Italy
-
tel./fax +39.041.822.0665
cell. +39.347.85.69.824
Skype carlo.strata
Google carlo.strata.69
-
carlo.str...@tiscali.it
PEC: carlo.str...@ingpec.eu

Il 16/05/2013 01.58, Steve Edmonds ha scritto:

On 2013-05-16 07:45, Joel Madero wrote:

Any payments and/or donations must be accounted for and if the person

paying has any intent it to go to xyz, then by regulations we may
need to
account for that payment/donation and where it went to.

That is the real problem with targeted donations and payments.
There will
be a mess in paperwork to deal with it.  Opt in, opt out, What it
was used
for.  Keeping track of all of who pays what, for what, can cost more
than
thepayment in paperwork and legal fees.

This has been discussed quite a bit on user list and brought up
during ESC
at some point and I thought the consensus was "we'll just let them do
what
they want" and not endorse, support, etc... any of that. I thought that
kept us out of legal muddy waters. It'd be similar to me just going to a
friend who is a programmer and saying "dude, can I pay you $100 to
fix this
issue" - a contract completely out of TDF's hands.


Best,
Joel

Would this paid for feature not then create a fork in the code, then
are you committing to maintaining that branch until some time (may be
never) that the branch feature is voted into the main code base. It
seems a bit impractical when you have a continually evolving product
to pay to add a feature unless you are assured it will be included in
the main code base and maintained.
Steve








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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations system: pay for a feature

[Charles-H. Schulz]

Hello Carlo,

Le jeudi 16 mai 2013 à 09:09 +0200, Carlo Strata a écrit :
> Hi Everyone,
> 
> in any case (!) none has answered to my initial question and moreover 
> has to be avoided changing the thread object and throw away one person's 
> suggest or a simply discuss. So that now I have to renew my question 
> with another all new post!!! Thank you!
> 
> [OT] I have donate to LibreOffice some money and sure many of my time 
> since 28.09.2010 to spread his use, to make it in mind to many people in 
> Italy and in my local engineer professional association.
> 

Thank you a lot BTW!

> In any case I think that resources like University Students, Google SoC, 
> ... are and remain useful to both sides ;-) (TDF/Community/Users and 
> Students themselfes).
> 
> I also want to find an approved new feature list in TDF or LibreOffice 
> site...

I think we do have what you are looking for:
https://www.libreoffice.org/features/ (and linked pages from there)
https://www.libreoffice.org/index.php/download/4-0-new-features-and-fixes/

and of course, the wiki pages:
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/ReleaseNotes/4.0

Hope this helps,

Charles.


> 
> Have all a sunny day,
> 
> Carlo
> 
> ing. Carlo Strata
> -
> via Botticelli 1/4
> 30031 Dolo - VE
> Italia - Italy
> -
> tel./fax +39.041.822.0665
> cell. +39.347.85.69.824
> Skype carlo.strata
> Google carlo.strata.69
> -
> carlo.str...@tiscali.it
> PEC: carlo.str...@ingpec.eu
> 
> Il 16/05/2013 01.58, Steve Edmonds ha scritto:
> >
> > On 2013-05-16 07:45, Joel Madero wrote:
> >>>
>  Any payments and/or donations must be accounted for and if the person
> >>> paying has any intent it to go to xyz, then by regulations we may 
> >>> need to
> >>> account for that payment/donation and where it went to.
> >>>
> >>> That is the real problem with targeted donations and payments.  
> >>> There will
> >>> be a mess in paperwork to deal with it.  Opt in, opt out, What it 
> >>> was used
> >>> for.  Keeping track of all of who pays what, for what, can cost more 
> >>> than
> >>> thepayment in paperwork and legal fees.
> >>
> >> This has been discussed quite a bit on user list and brought up 
> >> during ESC
> >> at some point and I thought the consensus was "we'll just let them do 
> >> what
> >> they want" and not endorse, support, etc... any of that. I thought that
> >> kept us out of legal muddy waters. It'd be similar to me just going to a
> >> friend who is a programmer and saying "dude, can I pay you $100 to 
> >> fix this
> >> issue" - a contract completely out of TDF's hands.
> >>
> >>
> >> Best,
> >> Joel
> > Would this paid for feature not then create a fork in the code, then 
> > are you committing to maintaining that branch until some time (may be 
> > never) that the branch feature is voted into the main code base. It 
> > seems a bit impractical when you have a continually evolving product 
> > to pay to add a feature unless you are assured it will be included in 
> > the main code base and maintained.
> > Steve
> >
> 
> 


-- 
Charles-H. Schulz
Co-Founder & Director, The Document Foundation,
Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint




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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations system: pay for a feature

[Carlo Strata]

Hi Everyone,

in any case (!) none has answered to my initial question and moreover 
has to be avoided changing the thread object and throw away one person's 
suggest or a simply discuss. So that now I have to renew my question 
with another all new post!!! Thank you!


[OT] I have donate to LibreOffice some money and sure many of my time 
since 28.09.2010 to spread his use, to make it in mind to many people in 
Italy and in my local engineer professional association.


In any case I think that resources like University Students, Google SoC, 
... are and remain useful to both sides ;-) (TDF/Community/Users and 
Students themselfes).


I also want to find an approved new feature list in TDF or LibreOffice 
site...


Have all a sunny day,

Carlo

ing. Carlo Strata
-
via Botticelli 1/4
30031 Dolo - VE
Italia - Italy
-
tel./fax +39.041.822.0665
cell. +39.347.85.69.824
Skype carlo.strata
Google carlo.strata.69
-
carlo.str...@tiscali.it
PEC: carlo.str...@ingpec.eu

Il 16/05/2013 01.58, Steve Edmonds ha scritto:


On 2013-05-16 07:45, Joel Madero wrote:



Any payments and/or donations must be accounted for and if the person
paying has any intent it to go to xyz, then by regulations we may 
need to

account for that payment/donation and where it went to.

That is the real problem with targeted donations and payments.  
There will
be a mess in paperwork to deal with it.  Opt in, opt out, What it 
was used
for.  Keeping track of all of who pays what, for what, can cost more 
than

thepayment in paperwork and legal fees.


This has been discussed quite a bit on user list and brought up 
during ESC
at some point and I thought the consensus was "we'll just let them do 
what

they want" and not endorse, support, etc... any of that. I thought that
kept us out of legal muddy waters. It'd be similar to me just going to a
friend who is a programmer and saying "dude, can I pay you $100 to 
fix this

issue" - a contract completely out of TDF's hands.


Best,
Joel
Would this paid for feature not then create a fork in the code, then 
are you committing to maintaining that branch until some time (may be 
never) that the branch feature is voted into the main code base. It 
seems a bit impractical when you have a continually evolving product 
to pay to add a feature unless you are assured it will be included in 
the main code base and maintained.

Steve




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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations system: pay for a feature

[Andrew Douglas Pitonyak]

On 05/15/2013 03:45 PM, Joel Madero wrote:



Any payments and/or donations must be accounted for and if the person

paying has any intent it to go to xyz, then by regulations we may need to
account for that payment/donation and where it went to.

That is the real problem with targeted donations and payments.  There will
be a mess in paperwork to deal with it.  Opt in, opt out, What it was used
for.  Keeping track of all of who pays what, for what, can cost more than
thepayment in paperwork and legal fees.


This has been discussed quite a bit on user list and brought up during ESC
at some point and I thought the consensus was "we'll just let them do what
they want" and not endorse, support, etc... any of that. I thought that
kept us out of legal muddy waters. It'd be similar to me just going to a
friend who is a programmer and saying "dude, can I pay you $100 to fix this
issue" - a contract completely out of TDF's hands.


Best,
Joel


In other words, you (the user who wants the feature) offers a bounty to 
anyone willing to fix the bug for you. This does not involve LO 
directly, so they are in the clear.


--
Andrew Pitonyak
My Macro Document: http://www.pitonyak.org/AndrewMacro.odt
Info:  http://www.pitonyak.org/oo.php


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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations system: pay for a feature

[Steve Edmonds]

On 2013-05-16 07:45, Joel Madero wrote:



Any payments and/or donations must be accounted for and if the person

paying has any intent it to go to xyz, then by regulations we may need to
account for that payment/donation and where it went to.

That is the real problem with targeted donations and payments.  There will
be a mess in paperwork to deal with it.  Opt in, opt out, What it was used
for.  Keeping track of all of who pays what, for what, can cost more than
thepayment in paperwork and legal fees.


This has been discussed quite a bit on user list and brought up during ESC
at some point and I thought the consensus was "we'll just let them do what
they want" and not endorse, support, etc... any of that. I thought that
kept us out of legal muddy waters. It'd be similar to me just going to a
friend who is a programmer and saying "dude, can I pay you $100 to fix this
issue" - a contract completely out of TDF's hands.


Best,
Joel
Would this paid for feature not then create a fork in the code, then are 
you committing to maintaining that branch until some time (may be never) 
that the branch feature is voted into the main code base. It seems a bit 
impractical when you have a continually evolving product to pay to add a 
feature unless you are assured it will be included in the main code base 
and maintained.

Steve

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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations system: pay for a feature

[Joel Madero]

>
>
>> Any payments and/or donations must be accounted for and if the person
> paying has any intent it to go to xyz, then by regulations we may need to
> account for that payment/donation and where it went to.
>
> That is the real problem with targeted donations and payments.  There will
> be a mess in paperwork to deal with it.  Opt in, opt out, What it was used
> for.  Keeping track of all of who pays what, for what, can cost more than
> thepayment in paperwork and legal fees.


This has been discussed quite a bit on user list and brought up during ESC
at some point and I thought the consensus was "we'll just let them do what
they want" and not endorse, support, etc... any of that. I thought that
kept us out of legal muddy waters. It'd be similar to me just going to a
friend who is a programmer and saying "dude, can I pay you $100 to fix this
issue" - a contract completely out of TDF's hands.


Best,
Joel


-- 
*Joel Madero*
LibreOffice QA Volunteer
jmadero@gmail.com

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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations system: pay for a feature

[Kracked_P_P---webmaster]

On 05/15/2013 02:03 PM, Joel Madero wrote:

On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 11:00 AM, Kracked_P_P---webmaster <
webmas...@krackedpress.com> wrote:


Spending money, via donations, geared to one feature and not the whole
package can be a VERY bad marketing issue.

I never liked it.  If you donate money to one feature and it does not get
added, or fixed, in "your time line" and not the developer's, it can be a
mess.

We do not know what can be fixed easily, or if something that looks simple
will be a real hard add or fix.  The simple things tend to be not so simple.

We cannot even make a paper trail to show an agency [required by] that the
donation towards a "feature" would even go to it.  That would make a big
legal mess.

Paying a third party to "fix" things has been used by spammers for a long
time.


+1 to all that, but I think offering a payment and letting a developer opt
in or out is fine. As long as user and developer understand LibreOffice has
no part in the process.


Best,
Joel



Any payments and/or donations must be accounted for and if the person 
paying has any intent it to go to xyz, then by regulations we may need 
to account for that payment/donation and where it went to.


That is the real problem with targeted donations and payments.  There 
will be a mess in paperwork to deal with it.  Opt in, opt out, What it 
was used for.  Keeping track of all of who pays what, for what, can cost 
more than thepayment in paperwork and legal fees.




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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations system: pay for a feature

[Joel Madero]

On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 11:00 AM, Kracked_P_P---webmaster <
webmas...@krackedpress.com> wrote:

>
> Spending money, via donations, geared to one feature and not the whole
> package can be a VERY bad marketing issue.
>
> I never liked it.  If you donate money to one feature and it does not get
> added, or fixed, in "your time line" and not the developer's, it can be a
> mess.
>
> We do not know what can be fixed easily, or if something that looks simple
> will be a real hard add or fix.  The simple things tend to be not so simple.
>
> We cannot even make a paper trail to show an agency [required by] that the
> donation towards a "feature" would even go to it.  That would make a big
> legal mess.
>
> Paying a third party to "fix" things has been used by spammers for a long
> time.


+1 to all that, but I think offering a payment and letting a developer opt
in or out is fine. As long as user and developer understand LibreOffice has
no part in the process.


Best,
Joel

-- 
*Joel Madero*
LibreOffice QA Volunteer
jmadero@gmail.com

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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations system: pay for a feature

[Kracked_P_P---webmaster]

Spending money, via donations, geared to one feature and not the whole 
package can be a VERY bad marketing issue.


I never liked it.  If you donate money to one feature and it does not 
get added, or fixed, in "your time line" and not the developer's, it can 
be a mess.


We do not know what can be fixed easily, or if something that looks 
simple will be a real hard add or fix.  The simple things tend to be not 
so simple.


We cannot even make a paper trail to show an agency [required by] that 
the donation towards a "feature" would even go to it.  That would make a 
big legal mess.


Paying a third party to "fix" things has been used by spammers for a 
long time.


On 05/15/2013 01:22 PM, Joel Madero wrote:

Well some are already doing this through 3rd party places, we won't do it
internally as I think it's prevented due to our non profit nature but third
party sites do allow it. One such site is freedomsponsors.org, this is NOT
officially sanctioned by TDF but some people do indeed contribute there and
then post on the bug "I have pledged $X on freedomsponsor for a fix"


Best,
Joel


On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 9:54 AM, Guillermo Molleda Jimena wrote:


Traducción de texto o de páginas web
I think it would be good to allow donations to certain feature of the
program.
If there is a particular functionality, the team could estimate cost as a
budget with a code attached. If the donations do you put the code, once you
reach the budget target the team could prioritize such development.

It seems right??


Translated with Google, I know Spanish, I am willing to learn Esperanto,
but impose English as the national language is any unfair.
Escribe texto o la dirección de un sitio web, o bien, traduce un documento


.

Cancelar 

Ejemplo del uso de "":
traducido automáticamente por Google


El 15/05/13 17:04, Carlo Strata escribió:


Hi Everyone,

are there some plans to extend PDF/A export to new versions of that
standard other than and in addition to PDF/A-1?
I mean PDF/A-2 and PDF/A-3 that are already ISO standards:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/**PDF/A 

Nice Google SoC activity? ;-)

Have All a sunny day,

Carlo



--
Usa el esperanto para acelerar el aprendizaje de idiomas, ganarás años
como demuestran los estudios científicos realizados (
http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/**Valor_proped%C3%A9utico_del_**esperanto).
Puede leer más sobre el idioma en http://personal.us.es/**
gmolleda/lingvoj.html ,
http://www.2-2.se/es/ y 
http://esperantofre.com/edu/**iloj01h.htm#celo
.

El inglés, francés, alemán o chino mandarín son muy ineficientes para su
aprendizaje como segundo idioma (mejor tercero) y fuente de grandes
movimientos de divisas de países pobres hacia los más ricos. Igual que
aprendes a escribir primero trazos y no directamente las letras, es mejor
para el cerebro aprender primero una lengua regular y planificada.

***
   Guillermo Molleda Jimena

 Departamento de Economía Financiera y
   Dirección de Operaciones
Facultad de Turismo y Finanzas
Universidad de Sevilla

Avda. San Francisco Javier s/n
41018 Sevilla
 Tfno: 954 55 16 55 Fax: 954 55 75 70
E-mail: gmoll...@us.es http://personal.us.es/gmolleda
***



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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations system: pay for a feature

[Joel Madero]

Well some are already doing this through 3rd party places, we won't do it
internally as I think it's prevented due to our non profit nature but third
party sites do allow it. One such site is freedomsponsors.org, this is NOT
officially sanctioned by TDF but some people do indeed contribute there and
then post on the bug "I have pledged $X on freedomsponsor for a fix"


Best,
Joel


On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 9:54 AM, Guillermo Molleda Jimena wrote:

> Traducción de texto o de páginas web
> I think it would be good to allow donations to certain feature of the
> program.
> If there is a particular functionality, the team could estimate cost as a
> budget with a code attached. If the donations do you put the code, once you
> reach the budget target the team could prioritize such development.
>
> It seems right??
>
>
> Translated with Google, I know Spanish, I am willing to learn Esperanto,
> but impose English as the national language is any unfair.
> Escribe texto o la dirección de un sitio web, o bien, traduce un documento
> 
> >.
> Cancelar 
> 
> >
> Ejemplo del uso de "":
> traducido automáticamente por Google
>
>
> El 15/05/13 17:04, Carlo Strata escribió:
>
>> Hi Everyone,
>>
>> are there some plans to extend PDF/A export to new versions of that
>> standard other than and in addition to PDF/A-1?
>> I mean PDF/A-2 and PDF/A-3 that are already ISO standards:
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/**PDF/A 
>>
>> Nice Google SoC activity? ;-)
>>
>> Have All a sunny day,
>>
>> Carlo
>>
>>
> --
> Usa el esperanto para acelerar el aprendizaje de idiomas, ganarás años
> como demuestran los estudios científicos realizados (
> http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/**Valor_proped%C3%A9utico_del_**esperanto).
> Puede leer más sobre el idioma en http://personal.us.es/**
> gmolleda/lingvoj.html ,
> http://www.2-2.se/es/ y 
> http://esperantofre.com/edu/**iloj01h.htm#celo
> .
>
> El inglés, francés, alemán o chino mandarín son muy ineficientes para su
> aprendizaje como segundo idioma (mejor tercero) y fuente de grandes
> movimientos de divisas de países pobres hacia los más ricos. Igual que
> aprendes a escribir primero trazos y no directamente las letras, es mejor
> para el cerebro aprender primero una lengua regular y planificada.
>
> ***
>   Guillermo Molleda Jimena
>
> Departamento de Economía Financiera y
>   Dirección de Operaciones
>Facultad de Turismo y Finanzas
>Universidad de Sevilla
>
>Avda. San Francisco Javier s/n
>41018 Sevilla
> Tfno: 954 55 16 55 Fax: 954 55 75 70
> E-mail: gmoll...@us.es http://personal.us.es/gmolleda
> ***
>
>
>
> --
> To unsubscribe e-mail to: 
> discuss+unsubscribe@**documentfoundation.org
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> unsubscribe/
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> http://listarchives.**documentfoundation.org/www/**discuss/
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> deleted
>
>


-- 
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jmadero@gmail.com

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[tdf-discuss] Donations system: pay for a feature

[Guillermo Molleda Jimena]

Traducción de texto o de páginas web
I think it would be good to allow donations to certain feature of the 
program.
If there is a particular functionality, the team could estimate cost as 
a budget with a code attached. If the donations do you put the code, 
once you reach the budget target the team could prioritize such development.


It seems right??


Translated with Google, I know Spanish, I am willing to learn Esperanto, 
but impose English as the national language is any unfair.
Escribe texto o la dirección de un sitio web, o bien, traduce un 
documento .

Cancelar 
Ejemplo del uso de "":
traducido automáticamente por Google


El 15/05/13 17:04, Carlo Strata escribió:

Hi Everyone,

are there some plans to extend PDF/A export to new versions of that 
standard other than and in addition to PDF/A-1?

I mean PDF/A-2 and PDF/A-3 that are already ISO standards:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PDF/A

Nice Google SoC activity? ;-)

Have All a sunny day,

Carlo



--
Usa el esperanto para acelerar el aprendizaje de idiomas, ganarás años como 
demuestran los estudios científicos realizados 
(http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valor_proped%C3%A9utico_del_esperanto). Puede 
leer más sobre el idioma en http://personal.us.es/gmolleda/lingvoj.html, 
http://www.2-2.se/es/ y http://esperantofre.com/edu/iloj01h.htm#celo.

El inglés, francés, alemán o chino mandarín son muy ineficientes para su 
aprendizaje como segundo idioma (mejor tercero) y fuente de grandes movimientos 
de divisas de países pobres hacia los más ricos. Igual que aprendes a escribir 
primero trazos y no directamente las letras, es mejor para el cerebro aprender 
primero una lengua regular y planificada.

*
  Guillermo Molleda Jimena

Departamento de Economía Financiera y
  Dirección de Operaciones
   Facultad de Turismo y Finanzas
   Universidad de Sevilla

   Avda. San Francisco Javier s/n
   41018 Sevilla
Tfno: 954 55 16 55 Fax: 954 55 75 70
E-mail: gmoll...@us.es http://personal.us.es/gmolleda
*



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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations

[Florian Effenberger]

Hi Harold,

Harold Fuchs wrote on 2010-10-12 10.28:

I just noticed that the TDF "Donations" web page at
http://www.documentfoundation.org/contribution/  gives bank account
details for something called "Openoffice.org Deutschland e.V."

Does this mean the money goes to Oracle?


no. Team OpenOffice.org != OpenOffice.org Deutschland e.V. The latter 
one has several members in the Steering Committee of TDF (André and me, 
and Thomas and Jacqueline are co-founders of TDF), and acts as interim 
legal entity, providing the infrastructure and the like.


So, donating money to OOoDeV means donating money to the efforts of TDF.

Florian

--
Florian Effenberger 
Steering Committee and Founding Member of The Document Foundation
Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108
Skype: floeff | Twitter/Identi.ca: @floeff

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[tdf-discuss] Donations

[Harold Fuchs]

I just noticed that the TDF "Donations" web page at 
http://www.documentfoundation.org/contribution/  gives bank account details 
for something called "Openoffice.org Deutschland e.V."


Does this mean the money goes to Oracle?

--
Harold Fuchs
London, England 




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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations ?

[Jean Hollis Weber]

On Wed, 2010-10-13 at 22:32 +0200, Cor Nouws wrote:
> Sophie Gautier wrote (13-10-10 22:27)
> 
> > I remember Jean request, but not yours sorry. Again, I've tried to get
> > these information displayed with no success.
> 
> It did help. Finally we started to add some data to the council wiki.
>   See 
> http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Community_Council/Funding_And_Budgets
> Do check the section at the bottom.

Thanks, Cor! I had stopped paying attention to CC stuff because it was
too frustrating. Good to know that things finally started happening when
I wasn't looking. :-)

--Jean


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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations ?

[Cor Nouws]

Sophie Gautier wrote (13-10-10 22:27)


I remember Jean request, but not yours sorry. Again, I've tried to get
these information displayed with no success.


It did help. Finally we started to add some data to the council wiki.
 See 
http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Community_Council/Funding_And_Budgets

Do check the section at the bottom.

--
 - giving openoffice.org its foundation :: The Document Foundation -
 - ideas/remarks for the community council? See
   http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Community_Council


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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations ?

[Sophie Gautier]

Hi,


On Wed, Oct 13, 2010 at 10:11 PM, Bernd Glueckert
 wrote:
>
>> I have been asking for this from the OpenOffice.org community council
>> for many years, with no results. I don't like to give money if I don't
>> know where it's going.
>
> I've made the same experience. No answer. So I learn, that informations in
> this "open project" are not so open like it can be. Why?

I remember Jean request, but not yours sorry. Again, I've tried to get
these information displayed with no success. I really hope this will
not be the case for the Foundation. Being a member of it, I'm quite
sure we will be successful this time :)

Kind regards
Sophie

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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations ?

[Bernd Glueckert]

I have been asking for this from the OpenOffice.org community council
for many years, with no results. I don't like to give money if I don't
know where it's going.


I've made the same experience. No answer. So I learn, that informations 
in this "open project" are not so open like it can be. Why?


The more I know about the money usage in such an organisation, the 
easier is it for me to ask my board of directors to support them by some 
donation.


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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations ?

[Cor Nouws]

Hi Jean,

Jean Hollis Weber wrote (13-10-10 14:31)


I think transparency is a good way to show TDF is working well... and,
in my opinion, it also invites people to donate more money.




I have been asking for this from the OpenOffice.org community council
for many years, with no results. I don't like to give money if I don't


It did help. Finally we started to add some data to the council wiki.
 See 
http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Community_Council/Funding_And_Budgets

Do check the section at the bottom.

Regards,
Cor

--
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 - ideas/remarks for the community council? See
   http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Community_Council


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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations ?

[Sophie Gautier]

Hi,

On Wed, Oct 13, 2010 at 2:31 PM, Jean Hollis Weber  wrote:
> On Tue, 2010-10-12 at 23:27 +0200, elcico2001 wrote:
>
>> Maybe it's a little early but...
>> I would suggest, as I already said to Italo Vignoli, a page on the
>> website to show a TDF annual financial report, like, for example, wikimedia:
>>
>> http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Finance_report
>>
>> I think transparency is a good way to show TDF is working well... and,
>> in my opinion, it also invites people to donate more money.
>> Namaste :)
>
> +1
+1
>
> I have been asking for this from the OpenOffice.org community council
> for many years, with no results.

And I've been asking the same when I was at the CC with no results.
 I don't like to give money if I don't
> know where it's going. I hope The Document Foundation will do better. I
> don't expect auditing, but I do expect some basic accounting.

I agree with you and have the same expectation. Transparency is very
important for me too.

Kind regards
Sophie
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations ?

[Harold Fuchs]

On 13 October 2010 14:54, Drew Jensen  wrote:

> On Wed, 2010-10-13 at 22:31 +1000, Jean Hollis Weber wrote:
> > On Tue, 2010-10-12 at 23:27 +0200, elcico2001 wrote:
> >
> > > Maybe it's a little early but...
> > > I would suggest, as I already said to Italo Vignoli, a page on the
> > > website to show a TDF annual financial report, like, for example,
> wikimedia:
> > >
> > > http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Finance_report
> > >
> > > I think transparency is a good way to show TDF is working well... and,
> > > in my opinion, it also invites people to donate more money.
> > > Namaste :)
> >
> > +1
> >
> > I have been asking for this from the OpenOffice.org community council
> > for many years, with no results. I don't like to give money if I don't
> > know where it's going. I hope The Document Foundation will do better. I
> > don't expect auditing, but I do expect some basic accounting.
> >
> > Here is an example, from the group that handles the money raised for
> > OOoAuthors from sales of printed copies of the OOo user guides:
> > http://www.friendsofopendocument.com/newsite/?page_id=181
> >
>
> HI,
>
> Well I a bit lost here, doesn't http://www.ooodev.org/ have to do this,
> as a matter of law?
>
> Drew
>
>


Is the difference that by law the financials must be submitted to the
relevant [government] authority but not necessarily published on the web?
It's the latter that is being requested, I think.

-- 
Harold Fuchs
London, England

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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations ?

[Drew Jensen]

On Wed, 2010-10-13 at 22:31 +1000, Jean Hollis Weber wrote:
> On Tue, 2010-10-12 at 23:27 +0200, elcico2001 wrote:
> 
> > Maybe it's a little early but...
> > I would suggest, as I already said to Italo Vignoli, a page on the 
> > website to show a TDF annual financial report, like, for example, wikimedia:
> > 
> > http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Finance_report
> > 
> > I think transparency is a good way to show TDF is working well... and, 
> > in my opinion, it also invites people to donate more money.
> > Namaste :)
> 
> +1
> 
> I have been asking for this from the OpenOffice.org community council
> for many years, with no results. I don't like to give money if I don't
> know where it's going. I hope The Document Foundation will do better. I
> don't expect auditing, but I do expect some basic accounting.
> 
> Here is an example, from the group that handles the money raised for
> OOoAuthors from sales of printed copies of the OOo user guides:
> http://www.friendsofopendocument.com/newsite/?page_id=181
> 

HI,

Well I a bit lost here, doesn't http://www.ooodev.org/ have to do this,
as a matter of law?

Drew




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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations ?

[Jean Hollis Weber]

On Tue, 2010-10-12 at 23:27 +0200, elcico2001 wrote:

> Maybe it's a little early but...
> I would suggest, as I already said to Italo Vignoli, a page on the 
> website to show a TDF annual financial report, like, for example, wikimedia:
> 
> http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Finance_report
> 
> I think transparency is a good way to show TDF is working well... and, 
> in my opinion, it also invites people to donate more money.
> Namaste :)

+1

I have been asking for this from the OpenOffice.org community council
for many years, with no results. I don't like to give money if I don't
know where it's going. I hope The Document Foundation will do better. I
don't expect auditing, but I do expect some basic accounting.

Here is an example, from the group that handles the money raised for
OOoAuthors from sales of printed copies of the OOo user guides:
http://www.friendsofopendocument.com/newsite/?page_id=181

(Which reminds me, I should have put the January-June 2010 figures on
that website some time ago.)

--Jean




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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations ?

[Bernd Glueckert]

 hi all,


I would suggest, as I already said to Italo Vignoli, a page on the 
website to show a TDF annual financial report, like, for example, 
wikimedia:


http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Finance_report

I think transparency is a good way to show TDF is working well... and, 
in my opinion, it also invites people to donate more money.

yes, thats a really good idea.



Maybe it's a little early but...

no, i think its the rigth time for it lo is starting and why should 
this information not online not only the annual report! during 
startup a weekly or monthly report...


so long - bernd

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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations ?

[elcico2001]

Harold Fuchs ha scritto:

I just noticed that the TDF "Donations" web page at
http://www.documentfoundation.org/contribution/  gives bank account details
for something called "Openoffice.org Deutschland e.V."

Does this mean the money goes to Oracle?



  

Hello *,
Maybe it's a little early but...
I would suggest, as I already said to Italo Vignoli, a page on the 
website to show a TDF annual financial report, like, for example, wikimedia:


http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Finance_report

I think transparency is a good way to show TDF is working well... and, 
in my opinion, it also invites people to donate more money.

Namaste :)

--
cico

Icq/Licq/Gaim #175451007
Debian Powered Linux Registered User #310800 at http://counter.li.org
No retreat baby no surrender
tad evaarthamaatra-nirbhaasaM svaruupa-shuunyam iva samaadhiH
Sanskrit - Realize it's the common language ;-)


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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations ?

[Harold Fuchs]

On 12 October 2010 12:38, Volker Merschmann  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> 2010/10/12 Harold Fuchs :
> > I just noticed that the TDF "Donations" web page at
> > http://www.documentfoundation.org/contribution/  gives bank account
> details
> > for something called "Openoffice.org Deutschland e.V."
> >
> > Does this mean the money goes to Oracle?
> >
> No!
>
> I think you mixed the actual organisational form of Oracle in Europe
> which is "BV" (a company form from the Netherlands) with the german
> "e.V.".
> The latter is a non-profit and "Openoffice.org Deutschland e.V."
> collects the money until the TDF is founded at full form.
>
> Bye
>
> Volker
>
>
> --
> ++ Volker Merschmann - ODF-Software Contributor
>
> --
> To unsubscribe, e-mail to 
> discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org
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> deleted.
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> http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/
>
>
It was the "openoffice.org" name that led me astray. I thought that was a
name owned by Oracle and therefore ...


-- 
Harold Fuchs
London, England
Please do *not* reply to my personal e-mail address

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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations ?

[Volker Merschmann]

Hi,

2010/10/12 Harold Fuchs :
> I just noticed that the TDF "Donations" web page at
> http://www.documentfoundation.org/contribution/  gives bank account details
> for something called "Openoffice.org Deutschland e.V."
>
> Does this mean the money goes to Oracle?
>
No!

I think you mixed the actual organisational form of Oracle in Europe
which is "BV" (a company form from the Netherlands) with the german
"e.V.".
The latter is a non-profit and "Openoffice.org Deutschland e.V."
collects the money until the TDF is founded at full form.

Bye

Volker


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Re: [tdf-discuss] Donations ?

[Andre Schnabel]

Hi Harold,

> Von: Harold Fuchs 
> An: discuss@documentfoundation.org
> Betreff: [tdf-discuss] Donations ?

> I just noticed that the TDF "Donations" web page at
> http://www.documentfoundation.org/contribution/  gives bank account
> details
> for something called "Openoffice.org Deutschland e.V."
> 
> Does this mean the money goes to Oracle?

No, definately not.

"Openoffice.org Deutschland e.V." is a German non-profit founded by
German community members about 6 years ago. OOoDeV is actually
hosting most of our infrastructure, pays legal fees and handles some
of the assets (like domain names, trademark). It will hand over
the collected donations and assets to the foundation, as soon as this
is astablished as a legal entity.

hope that helps,

André
-- 
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[tdf-discuss] Donations ?

[Harold Fuchs]

I just noticed that the TDF "Donations" web page at
http://www.documentfoundation.org/contribution/  gives bank account details
for something called "Openoffice.org Deutschland e.V."

Does this mean the money goes to Oracle?



-- 
Harold Fuchs
London, England
Please do *not* reply to my personal e-mail address

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