Re: [IxDA Discuss] Do business objectives belong in personas?
On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 9:14 PM, Jared Spool wrote: > Have you asked your colleague what he wants to use this persona for? Can he > give examples on how this might change the design? [snip] Ok, sparing the mundane details of interoffice juggling, it turns out that the personas he is using are not the ones that I will have to use. I'll be able to create my own, and I am planning on using user research to base them on. (Getting that is another internal issue, but I'm hopeful). So sorry for the detour, but I still learned some good things from everyone's comments, so thank you. I guess that brings me back to my original question about biz requirements and I think the situation here dictates leaving them out. Right now I'm going to base my personas on Steve Mulder's book, with a bit of cross pollination from Todd Warfel's template. If there are any suggestions on persona stuff I should look at before I begin, that would be appreciated. Thanks! -- Marooned - A Space Opera in the Wrong Key! http://www.maroonedcomic.com Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Do business objectives belong in personas?
On Mar 2, 2009, at 7:14 AM, Tom Dell'Aringa wrote: "Can voice a 'no%' and make the selling process more difficult. Requires overcoming specific objections. Will share experiences with the Marketing Director, and likely to be the person to show the Marketing Director how to use the system or outcome from the system. " Hi Tom, Have you asked your colleague what he wants to use this persona for? Can he give examples on how this might change the design? Out of curiosity, are the personas your designing for general functionality or are the purposed for specific functionality? Have there been specific research to inform the personas? Has your colleague collected data from actual individuals that show that the attributes of the "decision maker"? From what you've said, it sounds to me like he's describing a Technical Buyer right out of Miller / Heinman's Strategic Selling. This doesn't really sounds like a persona attribute as much as it is a role description. I've found role descriptions to be less helpful in informing design decisions. As I mentioned before, I advice our clients to use a very specific razor on every sentence in the persona description: can they describe how that sentence will alter the outcome of the design from other alternatives? If there was a scenario that involved a free trial period or a interactive demo, I could see this being the start of a useful description. But it's probably lacking because it doesn't describe how the persona might investigate objections or what they'll be looking for in the process. Getting beyond the role and into specific behaviors of the persona (hopefully based on actual observed behaviors of potential technical buyers in sales scenarios) will help tremendously iron this out. If, on the other hand, this isn't from research and is fabricated from a perception of what the sales process is like, it would be a red flag to me that you and your colleague don't really have enough information to do this justice. You can either decide to invest in the research, you can decide to let the fabrication go through (and probably weight it less than anything else in a pick-your-battles strategy), or you can decide to suggest you remove it from the persona until you have data. Hope that helps, Jared Jared M. Spool User Interface Engineering 510 Turnpike St., Suite 102, North Andover, MA 01845 e: jsp...@uie.com p: +1 978 327 5561 http://uie.com Blog: http://uie.com/brainsparks Twitter: jmspool UIE Web App Summit, 4/19-4/22: http://webappsummit.com Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Do business objectives belong in personas?
On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 7:14 AM, Tom Dell'Aringa wrote: > It seems to me a persona is not about selling, it's about designing > properly. And if we design properly, we won't have to concern > ourselves with how the sales force is going to sell it, because it > will satisfy our target user needs and they should want it. We've successfully developed and used both design personas and marketing personas. Design personas address user needs and goals during an individual's use of the product, and are strictly focused on design considerations. On the other hand, marketing personas address the decision-making environment in which the person will be considering product acquisition or service selection. This includes information sources, technical context, and so on. Like a design persona, it also addresses user goals and needs, but with the perspective of "what is the value proposition that will speak to this person?" Marketing personas may also be developed around roles that may never be actual product users, such as corporate purchasing agents or IT staff. I find it best to separate the design and marketing personas. Otherwise, you tend to load too much onto a single document, and create confusion for persona users with different roles in the company. - Oliva -- Olivia C. Williamson User Experience Architect White Horse Productions ocwilliam...@gmail.com 650-305-5950 Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Do business objectives belong in personas?
Thanks everyone for the great answers. I have a follow up question. The colleague that has put together the initial persona sketches has included a couple of attributes that are specifically geared toward selling the end product. Specifically, for example, he created one called "Decision Maker" that he explains the purpose as "Links to the selling process that we use (if any). Likely candidates are: SPIN, Solution Selling, or Strategic Selling. Agree regarding the goals. " Here's how that is articulated on one of the personas: "Can voice a %u201Cno%u201D and make the selling process more difficult. Requires overcoming specific objections. Will share experiences with the Marketing Director, and likely to be the person to show the Marketing Director how to use the system or outcome from the system. " Again I'm thinking - this doesn't belong. It seems like that information could be included in the personal profile section, if at all? Basically we can say they are an influencer in decision making? It seems to me a persona is not about selling, it's about designing properly. And if we design properly, we won't have to concern ourselves with how the sales force is going to sell it, because it will satisfy our target user needs and they should want it. I'm having a hard time articulating myself on this one, especially with my colleague, and I feel like he may dig his heels in on this one. I'm really not sure how I would go about using what he wrote there as part of the design process. It's good to know they may have a certain effect on the decision making process, but again - if I've understood his needs and met them with my product... I'm just repeating myself now. Thoughts? . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Posted from the new ixda.org http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=39287 Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Do business objectives belong in personas?
A successful project has to balance user goals and business goals. I agree with Jared that it is important to be able to draw clear connections between the two. Seeing where the goals align will point to your easiest wins. When they are in conflict or merely skewed from one another, there will be design challenges. Solving only the user's problems = fail Solving only business' problems = fail -Jeremy Kriegel www.methodsansmadness.com . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Posted from the new ixda.org http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=39287 Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Do business objectives belong in personas?
I usually work with specifically grouped information in separate docs. Market research (competitive analysis etc), User needs and behaviors (including personas), and Biz requirements (sometimes including technical constraints, but sometimes its better as a fourth bucket). The reason I keep these separate is that I like to NOT have ownership of these, but have them provided buy subject experts, kept current and then I utilize them in the design process. Mark On Thu, Feb 26, 2009 at 6:10 PM, Tom wrote: > We're working on building some personas for some desktop software. > I've been going over Todd Warfel's template and Steve Mulder's > (The User is Always Right). > > Steve includes Business Objectives, Todd does not. The argument is > that you want to include what you as an organization want to > accomplish. > > I guess I would argue that a persona is not about my organization and > it's goals, it's about the person and their goals. And if I am > satisfying their goals, that's going to be good for my org and my > software. > > Am I missing something as to why they should be included? Love to > hear your thoughts. > > Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! > To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org > Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe > List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines > List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help > Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Do business objectives belong in personas?
On Thu, Feb 26, 2009 at 9:16 PM, Jared Spool wrote: > Hi Tom, > > Excellent question. Here's my take: > > First, I want to ask: are we talking about whether the business objectives > are in the persona or with the persona description document? [snip] I was mainly speaking to the document, but your response definitely addressed that. Thanks a lot, it's very helpful! Tom -- Marooned - A Space Opera in the Wrong Key! http://www.maroonedcomic.com Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Do business objectives belong in personas?
On Feb 26, 2009, at 3:10 PM, Tom wrote: Steve includes Business Objectives, Todd does not. The argument is that you want to include what you as an organization want to accomplish. I guess I would argue that a persona is not about my organization and it's goals, it's about the person and their goals. And if I am satisfying their goals, that's going to be good for my org and my software. Am I missing something as to why they should be included? Hi Tom, Excellent question. Here's my take: First, I want to ask: are we talking about whether the business objectives are in the persona or with the persona description document? A common mistake that people make is they confuse the persona description document with the actual persona. Personas exist as a shared meme in the minds of the team members. The persona description document is an artifact the team users to create and maintain that meme. It's an important distinction, because the persona description document is not the end goal -- it's the means to the end. When we work with teams to create personas, we help them create the description document. In our work, we recommend that every sentence in the description document have a direct connection to a design outcome. For example, if the document describes that the persona has two pit bulls and drives Chevy Suburban, the team needs to have a rationale as to how those facts will impact the design. (In personas we worked on with the Home & Garden TV network, the dogs influenced decisions about pet-friendly home improvement & landscaping projects and the car influenced decisions about the size & quantities of supplies transported.) So, because the construction process for the persona descriptions involves talking about design impact, the business impact becomes an undercurrent. I think there's really no way to separate them out. That said, the question then becomes: do you list explicit business objectives along side the persona descriptions? I think the answer to this has to do with how well the team is on the same page with the business objectives. Some teams we work with all inherently understand their business's objectives clearly. No need to reiterate them here. However, some teams have a diverse project portfolio or conflicting business objectives. In this case, I think clearly stating the business objectives behind the specific persona development makes a lot of sense. It will help guide the conversation around the project, ensuring better adoption of the personas going forward. It also helps, when business objectives shift, to understand if the personas are still meeting their original goals. I don't think it make any sense to explicitly exclude business objectives at any point in the design process. And reiterating them frequently through the project, in various deliverables, can help remind everyone what the goals are. (I think it was Cameron Moll who had the idea of replacing "lorem ipsum" in design comps with the business and project objectives. I think that's brilliant.) This doesn't mean that you make the persona description and the scenario descriptions explicitly talk to the goals. The persona is still going to be about the target user's goals and behaviors. However, if the team members can't draw the lines between how something is good for the user and good for the business, then there's likely to be a conflict later in the design process. The connection has to be there, whether explicit or implicit. Hope that helps, Jared Jared M. Spool User Interface Engineering 510 Turnpike St., Suite 102, North Andover, MA 01845 e: jsp...@uie.com p: +1 978 327 5561 http://uie.com Blog: http://uie.com/brainsparks Twitter: jmspool UIE Web App Summit, 4/19-4/22: http://webappsummit.com Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Do business objectives belong in personas?
This is something that I've run into before, and here are my thoughts on it. 1) to include business objectives in a persona is to build in the assumption that your customers care about your business. They do not. 2) The underlying reasoning -- to my mind -- to build a persona is to provide a "purer" means for understanding what your customers want and how they can be expected to behave. Including business assumptions shoots that down immediately. 3) If you build in business objectives, you are saying that your customers are the same as your stakeholders. If this is true, fine. Otherwise, forget it. 4) Why bother having personas at all if all they're really going to tell you is what you want to do? It seems a pointless exercise. In 97% of all cases (and yes, I made that number up) your customers will have exactly zero interest in your business objectives. The goal of User Experience and Interaction Design is to develop methods whereby the customer goals will coincide with the business goals as naturally as possible, so that the customer doesn't get the sense that their behavior has to suit your business needs or that they have to "qualify" to give your business money. The most valuable thing personas can do for you is to tell you that you're approaching the wrong market or the wrong customer or using the wrong method. If they can't deliver that information then they necessarily make it possible for you to go merrily on your way spending time, money and effort developing things that your marketing division can market to people who don't want them. Building in business objectives pre-supposes acceptance and compliance. I think I've said that enough ways, now. Katie Katie Albers Founder & Principal Consultant FirstThought User Experience Strategy & Project Management 310 356 7550 ka...@firstthought.com On Feb 26, 2009, at 3:10 PM, Tom wrote: We're working on building some personas for some desktop software. I've been going over Todd Warfel's template and Steve Mulder's (The User is Always Right). Steve includes Business Objectives, Todd does not. The argument is that you want to include what you as an organization want to accomplish. I guess I would argue that a persona is not about my organization and it's goals, it's about the person and their goals. And if I am satisfying their goals, that's going to be good for my org and my software. Am I missing something as to why they should be included? Love to hear your thoughts. Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
[IxDA Discuss] Do business objectives belong in personas?
We're working on building some personas for some desktop software. I've been going over Todd Warfel's template and Steve Mulder's (The User is Always Right). Steve includes Business Objectives, Todd does not. The argument is that you want to include what you as an organization want to accomplish. I guess I would argue that a persona is not about my organization and it's goals, it's about the person and their goals. And if I am satisfying their goals, that's going to be good for my org and my software. Am I missing something as to why they should be included? Love to hear your thoughts. Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
