Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] presenting open source software or open source projects

[Steven Feldman]

Jody 

We can get that into a concise text

Steven


> On 22 Sep 2017, at 18:16, Jody Garnett  wrote:
> 
> I am going to grab a couple quotes from the other email thread:
> Maria: Our projects are much more than pieces of code. Behind our software 
> there are communities
> Ben passing on: "Jon Kuperman‏ @jkup Stop treating open source like a product 
> you purchased and start treating it like a team you belong to." 
> https://twitter.com/jkup/status/909887066103676928
> Ben:  We offer something that proprietary GIS never can: the opportunity to 
> join a community of peers.
> I strongly agree with these statements; I think we have to present a list of 
> open source projects (rather than software) or we would not be doing good 
> outreach.
> 
>  Educating non-community members about this aspect - that open source is a 
> team, rather than a technology should be taken on from the very first page.
> 
> Steve, if the discussion list can come to an agreement here, I would like to 
> ask for phrasing to use when restoring the home page to "choose-a-project". 
> It will be challenging to word in a way that communicates well.
> 
> (I also note the above quotes would be excellent for a "why open source" page)
> 
> --
> Jody Garnett
> 
>> On 20 September 2017 at 06:02, Jody Garnett  wrote:
>> I would like to bring to discuss a question that we are struggling with for 
>> the website/rebranding - do we present "open source software" or "open 
>> source projects"?
>> 
>> This is not an easy answer, as the earlier discussion on this list did not 
>> know how to recognize projects doing a rewrite (example OL2 --> OL3, or 
>> project teams expanding and developing additional software components like 
>> QGIS Server.
>> 
>> Here is the email from the marketing list:
>> 
>>> The choose-a-project wizard is now working, we had to cut down some of the 
>>> tags last week and change how the pages were done to make it happen.
>>> This touches on a conversation with Steve Feldman from the code sprint. As 
>>> part of the focus exercise the home page was changed to says "Choose your 
>>> software" which then links to "choose-a-project". 
>>> It does bring up two interesting cases:
>>> 1) http://osgeo.getinteractive.nl/projects/qgis/ 
>>> QGIS - has several software projects now under one banner: QGIS Desktop, 
>>> QGIS Server, more?
>>> This is kind of messing with the system (and resulting in oddities like 
>>> QGIS being listed as a cloud processing service, I assume QGIS server could 
>>> run in the cloud and qgis desktop offers processing).
>>> 2) http://osgeo.getinteractive.nl/projects/gvsig/
>>> Same thing, there are now multiple gvSig software projects: gvSIG Desktop, 
>>> gvNIX, gvSIG Mobile, i3Geo 
>>>  
>>> Recommendation for the beta website:
>>> - Making the QGIS Association page under Partners, linking to individual 
>>> pages for QGIS and QGIS Server project pages.
>>> - Makin the gvSIG Association link to the individual software project pages 
>>> for gvSIG Desktop, gvNIX, gvSIG  Mobile, i3Geo.
>> 
>> And Steven Feldman's reply:
>> 
>>> My 1st thoughts on ‘projects’ and ‘software' are to look at definitions:
>>> Project:
>>> "In contemporary business and science, a project is an individual or 
>>> collaborative enterprise, possibly involving research or design, that is 
>>> carefully planned, usually by a project team, to achieve a particular 
>>> aim.[1]
>>> A project may also be a set of interrelated tasks to be executed over a 
>>> fixed period and within certain cost and other limitations.[2]
>>> It may be a temporary (rather than permanent) social systems as work 
>>> systems that is constituted by teams within or across organizations to 
>>> accomplish particular tasks under time constraints.[3] A project may be a 
>>> part of a wider programme management” https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project
>>> Software:
>>> "Computer software, or simply software, is a part of a computer system that 
>>> consists of data or computer instructions, in contrast to the physical 
>>> hardware from which the system is built. In computer science and software 
>>> engineering, computer software is all information processed by computer 
>>> systems, programs and data. Computer software includes computer programs, 
>>> libraries and related non-executable data, such as online documentation or 
>>> digital media.” https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software 
>>> 
>>> My interpretation: 
>>> Each different application e.g. QGIS Desktop, QGIS server is ‘software’ (or 
>>> we could alternatively use ‘application’ or 'program')
>>> The QGIS Project is the umbrella organisation/collaboration/social 
>>> construct/enterprise that encompasses and coordinates the individual 
>>> software/applications/programs
>>> I think the important thing for us as a marketing group is to consider what 
>>> these terms mean to potential users rather than how we use them internally 
>>> (for our community 

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] presenting open source software or open source projects

[Jody Garnett]

I am going to grab a couple quotes from the other email thread:

   - Maria: *Our projects are much more than pieces of code. Behind our
   software there are communities*
   - Ben passing on: "Jon Kuperman‏ @jkup Stop treating open source like a
   product you purchased and start treating it like a team you belong to."
   https://twitter.com/jkup/status/909887066103676928
   - Ben:  *We offer something that proprietary GIS never can: the
   opportunity to join a community of peers.*

I strongly agree with these statements; I think we have to present a list
of open source projects (rather than software) or we would not be doing
good outreach.

 Educating non-community members about this aspect - that open source is a
team, rather than a technology should be taken on from the very first page.

Steve, if the discussion list can come to an agreement here, I would like
to ask for phrasing to use when restoring the home page to
"choose-a-project". It will be challenging to word in a way that
communicates well.

(I also note the above quotes would be excellent for a "why open source"
page)

--
Jody Garnett

On 20 September 2017 at 06:02, Jody Garnett  wrote:

> I would like to bring to discuss a question that we are struggling with
> for the website/rebranding - do we present "open source software" or "open
> source projects"?
>
> This is not an easy answer, as the earlier discussion on this list did not
> know how to recognize projects doing a rewrite (example OL2 --> OL3, or
> project teams expanding and developing additional software components like
> QGIS Server.
>
> Here is the email from the marketing list:
>
> The choose-a-project wizard is now working, we had to cut down some of the
>> tags last week and change how the pages were done to make it happen.
>> This touches on a conversation with Steve Feldman from the code sprint.
>> As part of the focus exercise the home page
>>  was changed to says "Choose your
>> software" which then links to "choose-a-project".
>> It does bring up two interesting cases:
>> 1) http://osgeo.getinteractive.nl/projects/qgis/
>> QGIS - has several software projects now under one banner: QGIS
>> Desktop, QGIS Server, more?
>> This is kind of messing with the system (and resulting in oddities like
>> QGIS being listed as a cloud processing service, I assume QGIS server could
>> run in the cloud and qgis desktop offers processing).
>> 2) http://osgeo.getinteractive.nl/projects/gvsig/
>> Same thing, there are now multiple gvSig software projects: gvSIG
>> Desktop, gvNIX, gvSIG Mobile, i3Geo
>
>
>
> Recommendation for the beta website:
>> - Making the QGIS Association page under Partners, linking to individual
>> pages for QGIS and QGIS Server project pages.
>> - Makin the gvSIG Association link to the individual software project
>> pages for gvSIG Desktop, gvNIX, gvSIG  Mobile, i3Geo.
>>
>
> And Steven Feldman's reply:
>
> My 1st thoughts on ‘projects’ and ‘software' are to look at definitions:
>> *Project*:
>>
>>
>> *"In contemporary business
>>  and science
>> , a project is an individual or
>> collaborative enterprise, possibly involving research or design, that is
>> carefully planned , usually by a
>> project team, to achieve a particular aim.[1]
>> A project may also be a
>> set of interrelated tasks to be executed over a fixed period and within
>> certain cost and other limitations.[2]
>> It may be a temporary
>> (rather than permanent) social systems
>>  as work systems
>>  that is constituted by teams
>>  within or across organizations to
>> accomplish particular tasks
>>  under time
>> constraints.[3]  A
>> project may be a part of a wider programme management
>> ” **https://en.*
>> wikipedia.org/wiki/Project 
>> *Software*:
>> *"Computer software, or simply software, is a part of a computer system
>>  that consists of data
>>  or computer instructions,
>> in contrast to the physical hardware
>>  from which the system is
>> built. In computer science
>>  and software engineering
>> , computer software is
>> all information  processed
>> by computer systems
>> 

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Proprietary GIS on our OSGeo website

[DelazJ]

Hi,

I read this long and passionate thread and, that might have been
proposed earlier, in which case, apologies...but
In case it's not possible to directly state in the website, "Migrate
from XXX proprietary software", what about filling the "Migrate to
Open Source GIS" page with users/customers words? They'd share why
they choose an Open Source project, what they were looking for but
they could also explain why they left their old proprietary software
for a FOSS and if they are happy. I guess in that case it's not OSGeo
that's making a comparison or "tackling" any proprietary software -
just experiences sharing (i'm not a lawyer though).
In backend we could also keep the search tool (suggested by Sandro?)
that would bring newcomers to each story-telling related to a
proprietary tool when they search for that software (still without
exposing those softwares in our site).

Regards,
Harrissou

2017-09-21 23:52 GMT+02:00 Jody Garnett :
> Thanks Even I was going to try and circle back to this today.
>
> We do have the wish to list product names, notably for supported formats and
> interoperability. The http://osgeo.getinteractive.nl/projects/geoserver/
> page lists for example:
>
> Server data from a variety of data sources
> Vector: Shapefiles, External WFS, PostGIS, ArcSDE, DB2, Oracle Spatial,
> MySql, SQL Server and more!
> Raster: GeoTiff, JPG and PNG (with world file), image pyramid, GDAL formats,
> Image Mosaic, Oracle GeoRaster, NetCDF
>
>
> We do have a legitimate reason to use product names, but there is reason to
> be careful/respectful when doing so. In the above list we should probably
> add SQLServer® for example, and a footnote to the page.
>
> --
> Jody Garnett
>
> On 21 September 2017 at 12:10, Even Rouault 
> wrote:
>>
>> On jeudi 21 septembre 2017 11:20:54 CEST Jeffrey Johnson wrote:
>>
>> > We have that kind of page here
>>
>> > http://osgeo.getinteractive.nl/about/migrate-open-source-gis/ ... The
>>
>> > link was removed from the hero area when Steve Feldman changed this in
>>
>> > Boston, so there is no content there now.
>>
>> >
>>
>> > Are we not willing to even mention the names of these proprietary
>>
>> > products for fear of 'promoting' them? Or do we want to present the
>>
>> > user coming from outside our community some context about which open
>>
>> > source projects are an analogue or replacement for the proprietary
>>
>> > products they are already familiar with? Thats the real question in my
>>
>> > mind.
>>
>>
>>
>> I cannot honestly think that anyone would seriously believe we are
>> promoting
>>
>> proprietary software if they are mentionned under a "Migrate from" label.
>> But
>>
>> the point here about if we can legally use other product names (and if
>> that
>>
>> is a use of a trademark) in that context is a good one. They are probably
>> rules
>>
>> and good practices to follow in doing so, which can depend on juridictions
>> (probably
>>
>> US law applies here if the site is hosted in the US).
>>
>> Quickly researching about the topic leads to this article:
>>
>>
>> https://moz.com/blog/comparative-advertsing-can-i-talk-about-my-competitor-on-my-website
>>
>> The bottom line is that there are legal ways of comparing to a competitor
>> (is a
>>
>> "Migrate from " mention considered as comparative advertising is
>> another questio),
>>
>> but you can still be sued even if you follow the rules, so it is a matter
>> of
>>
>> appreciating the benefit vs the risk. Funnily they recommand to explictly
>> mention
>>
>> that you're not affiliated with the other product owner! (I guess that's
>> in the
>>
>> same vein as the "Caution: Contents Hot" mention on coffee cups ;-))
>>
>>
>>
>> I had a quick look at https://www.libreoffice.org/ to see if they for
>> example
>>
>> mentionned MS Office or Google docs. The only mention of MS Office I could
>> find
>>
>> is at the bottom of
>>
>> https://www.libreoffice.org/discover/libreoffice/ and it is a link to an
>> external
>>
>> site (they do mention the compatibility with Microsft Word, Excel,
>> *formats*,
>>
>> but that's a bit different than comparing to the products themselves).
>>
>> On http://www.openoffice.org/ similar situation, only mention of MS
>> formats,
>>
>> and for compraisons with MS itself, links to externals reviews from
>>
>> http://www.openoffice.org/product/reviews.html
>>
>>
>>
>> Sandro mentionned GIMP's "like Photoshop, only better" motto but on
>>
>> https://www.gimp.org/ no mention of Photoshop I could find
>>
>>
>>
>> If you go on
>> http://www.pitneybowes.com/us/location-intelligence/geographic-information-systems/mapinfo-pro.html,
>>
>> no mention of ESRI
>>
>> Same on
>> http://www.hexagongeospatial.com/products/power-portfolio/erdas-imagine
>>
>>
>>
>> Just trying to decrease the emotional level of the debate with facts ;-)
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Spatialys - Geospatial professional services
>>
>> http://www.spatialys.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Kickoff meeting (IRC) for the Code-in

[Guido Stein]

I should be able to attend, see you there.

On Fri, Sep 22, 2017 at 12:20 PM SERGIO ACOSTAYLARA <
sergio.acostayl...@mtop.gub.uy> wrote:

> I won't be able to join at that time but I will like to be informed about
> the meeting. Thanks,
>
> Sergio Acosta y Lara
> Departamento de Geomática
> Dirección Nacional de Topografía
> Ministerio de Transporte y Obras Públicas
> URUGUAY
> (598)29157933 ints. 20329/20330
> http://geoportal.mtop.gub.uy/
>
> 
> De: Discuss  en nombre de Jeff McKenna <
> jmcke...@gatewaygeomatics.com>
> Enviado: jueves, 21 de setiembre de 2017 15:57
> Para: osgeo
> Asunto: [OSGeo-Discuss] Kickoff meeting (IRC) for the Code-in
>
> Following Madi's announcement on the Google Code-in
>
> http://osgeo-org.1560.x6.nabble.com/Google-Code-In-GCI-2017-just-announced-And-we-want-to-participate-td5335036.html
> we're having a kickoff meeting on IRC this coming Monday.  Please join
> if you have questions and ideas for tasks for the students, or if you
> just want to be a mentor.  It's gonna be fun!  A nice way to share our
> passion with young energetic students.
>
> Meeting time and connection details at:
>
> https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Google_Code_In_2017#Kickoff_.28virtual.29_meeting
>
> Exact time:
>
> https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?year=2017=09=25=20=0
>
> -jeff
>
> --
> Jeff McKenna
> President Emeritus, OSGeo Foundation
> http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Jeff_McKenna
>
>
>
>
> ___
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Kickoff meeting (IRC) for the Code-in

[SERGIO ACOSTAYLARA]

I won't be able to join at that time but I will like to be informed about the 
meeting. Thanks,

Sergio Acosta y Lara
Departamento de Geomática
Dirección Nacional de Topografía
Ministerio de Transporte y Obras Públicas
URUGUAY
(598)29157933 ints. 20329/20330
http://geoportal.mtop.gub.uy/


De: Discuss  en nombre de Jeff McKenna 

Enviado: jueves, 21 de setiembre de 2017 15:57
Para: osgeo
Asunto: [OSGeo-Discuss] Kickoff meeting (IRC) for the Code-in

Following Madi's announcement on the Google Code-in
http://osgeo-org.1560.x6.nabble.com/Google-Code-In-GCI-2017-just-announced-And-we-want-to-participate-td5335036.html
we're having a kickoff meeting on IRC this coming Monday.  Please join
if you have questions and ideas for tasks for the students, or if you
just want to be a mentor.  It's gonna be fun!  A nice way to share our
passion with young energetic students.

Meeting time and connection details at:
https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Google_Code_In_2017#Kickoff_.28virtual.29_meeting

Exact time:
https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?year=2017=09=25=20=0

-jeff

--
Jeff McKenna
President Emeritus, OSGeo Foundation
http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Jeff_McKenna




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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Google Code In (GCI) 2017 just announced! And we want to participate

[SERGIO ACOSTAYLARA]

Hi Madi. As we are working with Secondary students in some FOSS4G projects I 
thought that there might be some opportunity to join in this initiative. I have 
a colleague in my office that had already joined GSoC twice and we were sharing 
ideas about how to be part of Google Code-In. We would like to be part of but 
don't know exactly how.


Sergio Acosta y Lara
Departamento de Geomática
Dirección Nacional de Topografía
Ministerio de Transporte y Obras Públicas
URUGUAY
(598)29157933 ints. 20329/20330
http://geoportal.mtop.gub.uy/

De: Discuss  en nombre de Margherita Di Leo 

Enviado: martes, 19 de setiembre de 2017 8:48
Para: OSGeo Discussions; geofor...@lists.osgeo.org; OSGeo-SoC
Cc: gsoc-adminosgeo.org
Asunto: [OSGeo-Discuss] Google Code In (GCI) 2017 just announced! And we want 
to participate

Dear Community,

great news! Google Code-in has just been officially announced [1] and we are 
excited to apply for the first time as mentoring organization! Google Code In 
is a program addressed to students aged 13 to 17.

As always, we need your help! We need mentors.
Mentors for Google code in are not necessarily top developers (they are also 
needed, but not only). Also educators, advocates, researchers are much needed, 
people that normally take care of documentation and preparation of educational 
material, that give presentations, take care of web site or wiki etc.

In fact, the tasks for google code in are supposed to take 3 to 5 hours for 
students to complete, and entail:
* coding
* documentation / training
* outreach / research
* quality assurance
* user interface

See examples here [2].

The idea is to individuate suitable tasks and submit them in the bug tracker 
with a special keyword like "beginner" or something TBD. In this way, students 
can easily find and claim the task they're interested in.

Note that the whole "how to" is to be discussed yet, for the moment, let's try 
to create a critical mass of interested volunteers.

Here [3] I created a wiki page with relevant info, instructions, timeline etc. 
Kindly take a look and if you are willing to participate, please write an email 
to gsoc-admin AT osgeo.org, we will send you a form to fill 
with your data. Next step: in less than one week from now we'll have the first 
kickoff meeting on IRC in the channel #osgeo-gsoc at Freenode. Everyone that 
will have filled the form will be informed about exact date and time.

Please, do participate, and bring your questions, your ideas and your energy 
with you. We don't have all the answers, but will try to figure things out 
together.. We believe that engaging the young generation will bring in OSGeo a 
breeze of innovation and fresh energy. Don't miss the opportunity to be part of 
the change!

Cheers!!


[1] 
https://opensource.googleblog.com/2017/09/announcing-google-code-in-2017.html
[2] https://developers.google.com/open-source/gci/resources/example-tasks
[3] https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Google_Code_In_2017

--
Margherita Di Leo
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[OSGeo-Discuss] completed branding and collateral materials are now in github

[Jody Garnett]

In this weeks meeting we have received the complete branding and collateral
material which I have had a chance to place in github:

https://github.com/OSGeo/osgeo

Please have a look, the marketing committee is reviewing this material for
sign-off.

Highlights
- styleguide-osgeo.pdf

showing
how everything fits together
- print  -
contains everything that was ready to print for foss4g, including our
multi-page brochure and the one-page information hand outs produced by our
project teams.
- social media

-
with collateral for facebook, twitter and linkined, and an example of
trying the templates for osgeo japan

- logo 
and subbrands
 -
keep in mind many of these are examples which were not used

If you have any skill with InkScape, Scribus or LibreOffice the marketing
committee would love to request your help reviewing, adapting and applying
this content for community use.
--
Jody Garnett
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