Re: [DNG] The FSF seems to have finally sold out

[Chillfan]

Since Purism have created a fully libre distribution, it seems like that would 
be the reason for having a seat there. Not that I'm saying you're wrong here - 
it's important that hardware with binary only blobs are not endorsed by anyone 
as free hardware.

It's true that they disable ME in their laptops according to all accounts 
anyway. Afaik it's not fully possible to remove intel ME yet, just disable it 
(or so we think) and tinker with the partitions. By definition that 
disqualifies them as producing free or libre hardware or even being certain ME 
isn't still doing something.

Also I haven't heard of Novena/Talos until now despite being on the lookout so 
you may have a point there. Afaict it's only crowd funding or pre order so far, 
what's the TLDR? Any others around?

Thanks,

chillfan

‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐

On March 7, 2018 11:05 PM, taii...@gmx.com taii...@gmx.com wrote:

> In exchange for money they are now advertising and endorsing a maker of
> 
> fake libre hardware by letting them have a booth at libreplanet an
> 
> endorsing their debian copy "PureOS"
> 
> https://libreplanet.org/2018/sponsors
> 
> "Grassroots: Purism, makers of fine free hardware"
> 
> Purism is NOT free hardware and certainly not "grassroots" as their
> 
> mysterious founder somehow has a bottomless pit of money to burn on
> 
> hardware costs and propaganda campaigns.
> 
> Purism donates to their own crowd-funding campaigns to make them seem
> 
> more successful and whenever negative facts about them are posted on the
> 
> internet some random guy shows up to insist that the person is mistaken.
> 
> I encourage everyone who cares about the future of free computing to
> 
> contact the FSF about this.
> 
> Here are posts that help explain the purism situation better than I can.
> 
> https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/3anjgm/on_the_librem_laptop_purism_doesnt_believe_in/
> 
> While purism's newer laptops come with "coreboot" all the hardware
> 
> initiation is performed by Intel's FSP binary blob, and while they claim
> 
> to have "disabled" ME (by running ME cleaner which they didn't make)
> 
> they have not as disabling ME is both impossible and illegal.
> 
> (archived due to the powers that be removing these posts after receiving
> 
> political pressure)
> 
> https://web.archive.org/web/20161010040458/https://blogs.coreboot.org/blog/2015/02/23/the-truth-about-purism-why-librem-is-not-the-same-as-libre/
> 
> https://web.archive.org/web/20161010100959/https://blogs.coreboot.org/blog/2015/08/09/the-truth-about-purism-behind-the-coreboot-scenes/
> 
> Other companies produce brand new legitimately libre hardware (TALOS 2,
> 
> Novena, etc) so don't believe purism when they say
> 
> we-are-doing-the-best-we-can.
> 
> Isn't it strange that purism receives so much coverage in the tech press
> 
> but real freedom hardware gets none at all?
> 
> Dng mailing list
> 
> Dng@lists.dyne.org
> 
> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
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Re: [DNG] Please, provide a means to remove the default wallpapers.

[m712]

It's your choice to remove or keep them, and the color of a wallpaper is 
entirely subjective. I think it's arrogant to request Devuan to remove artwork 
because you want them removed.

On March 9, 2018 11:34:28 AM GMT+03:00, Edward Bartolo  wrote:
>Dear All,
>
>I would like to ask the Devuan Distribution to provide a means to
>permanently remove the purple wallpapers (golinux's creation). I would
>like to have either wallpapers that users can individually choose or
>some light blue/green gradient wallpapers.
>
>Thank you all.
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Re: [DNG] Ascii install in VM

[KatolaZ]

On Fri, Mar 09, 2018 at 02:21:15PM +0100, Adam Borowski wrote:

[cut]

> > There is no way to force a package in an existing ASCII
> > installation, besides forking, rebuilding
> 
> If, for a distribution, rebuilding a package with a single-word diff, is an
> issue, then it's a far bigger problem than bad deps of wicd.
>

Yes, we know, everything is easy and straightforward, especially when
somebody else should take care of it while you are busy with other
more important business :)

Anyway, there is an amended wicd package in ascii-proposed
(1.7.4+tb2-4+devuan1) with a hard dep on net-tools. The package should
be in pkgmaster.devuan.org in a few minutes. Please test it and report
any regression.

It's quite hilarious that I ended up maintaining both wicd and
network-manager for Devuan, given that I wrote setnet exclusively
because I did not want to have anything to do with wicd and
network-manager (and I haven't used either in the last 8+ years)... :P

HND

KatolaZ

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Re: [DNG] Please, provide a means to remove the default wallpapers.

[golinux]

On 2018-03-09 02:34, Edward Bartolo wrote:

Dear All,

I would like to ask the Devuan Distribution to provide a means to
permanently remove the purple wallpapers (golinux's creation). I would
like to have either wallpapers that users can individually choose or
some light blue/green gradient wallpapers.

Thank you all.
___



Right click on your Xfce desktop. Choose desktop settings.  Navigate to 
the wallpaper of your choice.  You can also create gradients there. The 
default images in /usr/share/images/desktop-base/ can be permanently 
deleted.

Done.  Was that so hard?

golinux

PS  Note that on distrowatch and elsewhere there has been much love for 
darkpurpy desktop. Here's a screenie for those who have missed it: 
https://dev1galaxy.org/files/ascii_desktop.png   New icons are not yet 
integrated but available here in a version that now has all the needed 
symlinks: https://dev1galaxy.org/files/DarkPurpy-links.tar.gz

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Re: [DNG] Ascii install in VM

[Adam Borowski]

On Fri, Mar 09, 2018 at 09:25:52AM +, KatolaZ wrote:
> On Thu, Mar 08, 2018 at 11:42:06PM +0100, Adam Borowski wrote:
> 
> this simply re-establishes the same default as in Jessie.

Which is a regression from Debian, IMO.  net-tools have been deprecated for
so long, that I believe they should have been removed from the default
install at least a decade ago, instead of letting people dig themselves
deeper into the hole and try to use it.

> This does not solve the bug in wicd, which is due to the maintainer
> believing that net-tools would have remained Priority: important

Well, debates about the priority of net-tools are irrelevant to this bug.
Papering it over in _some_ cases don't help fixing it.

> > > Actually, the Debian source package still has the correct Priority:
> > > important, while the binary strangely has Priority: optional ...o_O It
> > > must have been a last-minute override in Stretch.
> > 
> > It's only the override file what matters, the field in binary (not source)
> > packages affects only the initial value; all updates currently need to be
> > done by hand.  That's an artefact of the way DAK works.
> 
> This is why I see dak as a quite big overcomplication.

I agree here; there's no real gain in being able to change priority without
a sourceful upload.

DAK conflates two pieces of information: "is package X allowed in the
archive (or does it need to go to NEW)?" and "what's the priority field".
It'd be nice to disentangle the two, but no one volunteers to do so, and
I for one have my hands in too many pies already to do an adequate job for
what I committed myself to doing, thus there's no way I go fixing this...

> Debian is making a lot of fuss around "reproducible builds", and then
> almost any property of the package you have just reproducibly built can
> have been mangled with by dak just before entering the repo, effectively
> making your package function *differently* from the stock package you get
> from Debian's repos...

Uhm, nope.  On stretch:

apt download wicd
dpkg-deb -I net-tools_1.60+git20161116.90da8a0-1_amd64.deb

 Priority: important

The .deb is unmodified from what was built.  The override affects only apt's
list; the package is bit-to-bit identical with what you'd get by building it
with the same build-dep versions (although I'm not sure if reproducible
toolchain was in place for stretch).

The package functions the same once installed, it just doesn't get installed
by default.

> > > Please test the "new" package. I guess we will include the
> > > ascii-proposed version in ascii straight away.
> > 
> > Without even looking, I can tell you it won't work: priority:Important
> > packages don't get included on existing installs (neither on upgrades nor
> > when you install wicd on a machine that used no or another way to set up
> > wifi).  net-tools will be also absent on minimal installs.
> 
> It will work on new installations, and re-establishes the same default
> as in Jessie.

Only within straightforward use cases.  I can tell you about a certain piece
of software that is also advertised to work adequately in straightforward
use cases, but I guess its name is a swear word here. :)

> There is no way to force a package in an existing ASCII
> installation, besides forking, rebuilding

If, for a distribution, rebuilding a package with a single-word diff, is an
issue, then it's a far bigger problem than bad deps of wicd.

> and maintaining wicd as well.

As I understand, Devuan would need to keep rebuilding wicd for the lifetime
of stretch/ascii in case of security and point release updates -- but those
are pretty rare, and expected number of such updates for a package that's
not imagemagick or libxml is very close to 0.  There's no extra burden as
you already need to set up some kind of notification for every package you
modified.

> Do you volunteer to do that?  That would be helpful.

Alas, I don't use stretch/ascii on any keyboard-attached machines, thus I'm
not a good person to handle old versions of wicd.  I also don't know
Devuan's workflow enough.

Molesting wicd's maintainer about a stable update, so it's fixed in both
stretch and ascii, could be a good idea, though.

> > This is #881225 by the way, fixed in buster but not stretch.
> 
> Great, but ASCII merges stretch, not Buster, you know

At least you know it's not an issue for Beowulf. :)


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Re: [DNG] Ascii install in VM

[KatolaZ]

On Thu, Mar 08, 2018 at 11:42:06PM +0100, Adam Borowski wrote:

[cut]

> > 
> > Just an update on this: there will soon be a "new" net-tools in
> > ascii-proposed (version 1.60+git20161116.90da8a0-1+devuan1), with the
> > correct Priority: important.
> 
> Uhm, why?  This doesn't solve the bug — priority affects only defaults.
> If package foo requires bar to function, it needs Depends: bar (or an
> equivalent, such as bar being Essential: yes).
>

Hi Adam, 

this simply re-establishes the same default as in Jessie. This does
not solve the bug in wicd, which is due to the maintainer believing
that net-tools would have remained Priority: important (hence
installed uder almost all circumstances except possibly for the
minimal install, where wicd does not belong anyway), while it was
shifted to Piority: optional just before stretch entereed freeze.

> > Actually, the Debian source package still has the correct Priority:
> > important, while the binary strangely has Priority: optional ...o_O It
> > must have been a last-minute override in Stretch.
> 
> It's only the override file what matters, the field in binary (not source)
> packages affects only the initial value; all updates currently need to be
> done by hand.  That's an artefact of the way DAK works.

This is why I see dak as a quite big overcomplication. Debian is
making a lot of fuss around "reproducible builds", and then almost any
property of the package you have just reproducibly built can have been
mangled with by dak just before entering the repo, effectively making
your package function *differently* from the stock package you get
from Debian's repos...

This is just *sick*, IMHO.

> 
> > Please test the "new" package. I guess we will include the
> > ascii-proposed version in ascii straight away.
> 
> Without even looking, I can tell you it won't work: priority:Important
> packages don't get included on existing installs (neither on upgrades nor
> when you install wicd on a machine that used no or another way to set up
> wifi).  net-tools will be also absent on minimal installs.
>

It will work on new installations, and re-establishes the same default
as in Jessie. There is no way to force a package in an existing ASCII
installation, besides forking, rebuilding and maintaining wicd as
well. Do you volunteer to do that? That would be helpful.

> This is #881225 by the way, fixed in buster but not stretch.
> 
> 

Great, but ASCII merges stretch, not Buster, you know

HND

KatolaZ

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[   @)   http://kalos.mine.nu ---  Devuan GNU + Linux User  ]
[ @@)  http://maths.qmul.ac.uk/~vnicosia --  GPG: 0B5F062F  ] 
[ (@@@)  Twitter: @KatolaZ - skype: katolaz -- github: KatolaZ  ]


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[DNG] Please, provide a means to remove the default wallpapers.

[Edward Bartolo]

Dear All,

I would like to ask the Devuan Distribution to provide a means to
permanently remove the purple wallpapers (golinux's creation). I would
like to have either wallpapers that users can individually choose or
some light blue/green gradient wallpapers.

Thank you all.
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