[ECOLOG-L] SERDP Student Travel Awards - Deadline June 1, 2010

[Nicole Beetle]

SERDP Student Travel Awards 2010



The Ecological Society of America (ESA) announces the availability of ten (10) 
travel awards of $500 each to students presenting papers at ESA's 2010 Annual 
Meeting in Pittsburgh, PA. These awards are sponsored by the Strategic 
Environmental Research and Development Program (SERDP). SERDP is the U.S. 
Department of Defense's (DoD) environmental science and technology program, 
executed in partnership with DOE and EPA. SERDP invests in basic and applied 
research, and exploratory development.



Students with abstracts accepted in one of four areas are eligible to

apply:

* Ecological Systems Ecology and Management

* Living Marine Resources Ecology and Management

* Watershed Processes and Management

* Species Ecology and Management





Eligibility



Please note that students whose research or research assistantship position is 
currently being funded by DOD SERDP are not eligible for this award. Students 
whose research involves ecological systems or species that are relevant to a 
DoD natural resource management concern have preference, though the research 
does not need to have been conducted on a DoD installation.



Deadline:

June 1, 2010 - Two weeks remain to submit your application!



For full application information, please go to 
http://www.esa.org/education_diversity/serdp_awards.php

[ECOLOG-L] Wyoming Shrub Ecology PhD Assistantship

[Angela L. Hild]

A doctoral assistantship is available in the Dept of Renewable Resources at
the University of Wyoming to conduct spatial analyses in shrub steppe
systems. Candidates must have 1200 GRE, expertise in GIS and vegetation
monitoring methods. The stipend includes tuition and fees. Student will be
expected to teach a lab in the undergraduate life sciences curriculum.

We expect to fill this position very quickly. Applicants should express
their interests immediately  via email to Ann Hild at annh...@uwyo.edu.
Applicants should send:
Transcripts (copies are fine for now)
Gre scores
Resume and contact information for 3 references to:

Ann Hild, Professor
Dept. of Renewable Resources-3354
University of Wyoming
1000 E. University Ave.
Laramie, WY 82071

Office:(307) 766-5471
Fax: (307) 766-6403
Dept. info, http://uwadmnweb.uwyo.edu/UWRENEWABLE

[ECOLOG-L] Post-Doctorate Notre Dame (quantitative analysis and modeling)

[Michelle Budny]

Position Description: 
At least one postdoctoral research position is available to pursue 
collaborative projects involving 
the spread and ecological and economic impacts of aquatic invasive species in 
the Laurentian 
Great Lakes and neighboring inland waterways.  Supported by funding from a new 
5-year NOAA-
funded project and other on-going and pending projects, the postdoc housed in 
the Department 
of Biological Sciences, University of Notre Dame will report to project leader 
David Lodge, and will 
collaborate with risk analyst Roger Cooke (Resources for the Future), 
economists Richard Jensen 
(UND) and David Finnoff (U Wyoming), and ecologists including Lodge and Lindsay 
Chadderton 
(The Nature Conservancy) to apply new tools in research at the interface of 
science with 
management and policy.  

Qualifications: 
We are seeking postdoc(s) with some combination of the following skills and 
experience: 
population modeling, food web modeling, structured expert judgment, and spatial 
and 
multivariate statistics.  Screening of applicants will begin in early May.  
Salary and benefits will be 
competitive. 
 
Contact: 
Applicants should consult the project abstract (Research - Ecological Risk 
Analysis and 
Bioeconomics), and then email (in one pdf document) a letter describing their 
prior research 
experience and current interests, a curriculum vitae, and the names and contact 
information of 
three references to: Joanna McNulty, Center for Aquatic Conservation, Galvin 
Life Science Center, 
University of Notre Dame, Notre Dame, IN 46556 (fax:  574-631-7413; email: 
mcnult...@nd.edu 
(with a cc to dlo...@nd.edu). 

Re: [ECOLOG-L] Science and Religion Dogmatic conflict?

[Wayne Tyson]

Ah-HA!

I think she's GOT IT! By Jove, I think she's got it! The rain in Spain . . .

Eureka!  Peak experiences!

As in all art, the concentration of the intellect somehow gets "processed" 
by our inner resources, and "breaks through" back into the conscious after a 
period of gestation and there is a birth of insight. Burning bushes and 
other hallucinations aside, just about all scientific discovery is thus 
produced.


WT


- Original Message - 
From: "Jane Shevtsov" 

To: 
Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 7:48 PM
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] Science and Religion Dogmatic conflict?



I think it's a mistake to reduce religion to
anthropomorphism/explanations and morality/politics. There is a
crucial third element -- the human capacity for spiritual (meditative,
oceanic, transcendent, pick your favorite adjective) experiences.
These experiences are now being studied by psychologists and
neuroscientists (look up "neurotheology") and are often connected to
experiences in nature.

My hypothesis about the origins of such experiences is partially
inspired by a passage from E.O. Wilson's book _Biophilia_. "In a twist
my mind came free and I was aware of the hard workings of the natural
world beyond the periphery of ordinary attention, where passions lose
their meaning and history is in another dimension, without people, and
great events pass without record or judgment. I was a transient of no
consequence in this familiar yet deeply alien world that I had come to
love. The uncounted products of evolution were gathered there for
purposes having nothing to do with me; their long Cenozoic history was
enciphered into a genetic code I could not understand. The effect was
strangely calming. Breathing and heartbeat diminished, concentration
intensified. It seemed to me that something extraordinary in the
forest was very close to where I stood, moving to the surface and
discovery. ... I willed animals to materialize and they came
erratically into view."

What does this passage, which describes an experience I suspect most
members of this list have had, most resemble? It sounds a lot like how
practitioners of some types of meditation describe their experience.
But what is this "naturalist's trance" good for, other than science?
Hunting, gathering and looking out for predators! Maybe, just maybe,
this was our ancestors' normal state of consciousness and maybe
various religious and spiritual practices arose as a way of
recapturing this state as, for biological and social reasons, our
minds changed.

This is, of course, a guess, but what do you folks think?

Jane Shevtsov


On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 10:14 AM, William Silvert  
wrote:

Another consideration, given that James has brought William of Occam into
this, is that a comprehensive scientific overview of the issue would 
involve
paying some attention to the question of where religion comes from. If 
there

were no reasonable alternative explanation, then the idea of gods making
themselves known to people might be the only option.

There are however plausible explanations for the development of religion
that make sense to an atheist. Since we tend to see the world in
anthropomorphic terms (even contemporary scientists speak of furious 
storms
and treacherous riptides), no doubt early man associated natural 
phenomena
with human-like gods or spirits. There were no doubt individuals who 
claimed

that they understood these spirits and became shamans and priests.
Eventually the priesthood hooked up with the politicians in the powerful
symbiosis that has existed throughout recorded history - priests maintain
the state religion and kings rule by divine right. Priests and ministers
accompanied colonialists to ensure that the minds of those conquered were
enslaved as well as their bodies.

So there is an alternative explanation that covers most religions, and I
think that should be an important part of scientific thinking about the
relation between science and religion.

Bill Silvert


--
-
Jane Shevtsov
Ecology Ph.D. candidate, University of Georgia
co-founder, 
Check out my blog, Perceiving Wholes

"The whole person must have both the humility to nurture the
Earth and the pride to go to Mars." --Wyn Wachhorst, The Dream
of Spaceflight







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Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
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06:26:00

[ECOLOG-L] Postdoc: terrestrial and aquatic biogeochemistry, HI

[David Inouye]

POST-DOCTORAL RESEARCHER IN TERRESTRIAL AND AQUATIC BIOGEOCHEMISTRY


The successful candidate's primary responsibility will be to investigate
and understand terrestrial to aquatic (i.e., anchialine ponds)
biogeochemical dynamics and linkages relating to the presence of the
non-native, N-fixing tree, Prosopis pallida (a.k.a. "Kiawe" in Hawaii)
in dry coastal and lowland ecosystems of leeward Hawaii. Specifically,
the researcher will investigate how Prosopis productivity is influenced
by contrasting water availability, and how it alters terrestrial C and N
accumulation and cycling as well as water quantity and quality of
anchialine ponds and groundwater. Measurements will include Prosopis
stand productivity and nutrient cycling, soil water availability and
salinity, isotope values of water, plant tissue, dissolved nutrients,
and soils, and a variety of climate parameters. The researcher will work
in close collaboration with terrestrial and aquatic ecologists as well
as geochemists, and will be expected to assist supervision of
undergraduate and graduate students. This work will be a key component
of an interdisciplinary research program seeking to understand the
sources, sinks and biogeochemical evolution of groundwater nutrient
pathways along the central Kona coast of Hawaii, with its main thrust
being the differentiation and interaction between pristine,
anthropogenic and invasive species nutrient flux/reservoir components.
This program further seeks to characterize the economic benefits and
costs of reducing nutrient loading through management of all identified
drivers. The postdoctoral researcher will focus on measurement of
Prosopis stand processes as they relate to terrestrial and aquatic
nutrient cycling and productivity, soil hydrologic processes, and
climate, as well as collaborating and coordinating with researchers at
UH, USDA-Forest Service, and state agencies that are developing a
cross-cutting initiative in water resources and ecohydrology in Hawaii.
PRIMARY QUALIFICATIONS: EDUCATION: Ph.D from an accredited university in
biology, ecology, environmental science, botany, geography, or related
field. EXPERIENCE: Four to six (4-6) years in field and lab research
relating to biogeochemical measurements of plants, soils, and/or water.
ABIL/KNOW/SKILLS: Ability to work independently and collaboratively with
a diverse team of scientists, technicians, community members, and
students (graduate and undergraduate); ability to collect and analyze
biogeochemical data; strong interpersonal and organizational skills;
excellent writing and verbal skills; ability to work on rough terrain
and in otherwise physically demanding environments.  Valid driver's
license.  PHYSICAL/MEDICAL REQUIREMENTS: Physically fit to be able to
conduct outdoor work. SECONDARY QUALIFICATIONS: A demonstrated record of
research publication; experience with isotopes and watershed-scale
ecological processes. INQUIRIES: Dr. Rebecca Ostertag
(oster...@hawaii.edu) or Dr. Flint Hughes 
(fhug...@fs.fed.us).  Please

see www.rcuh.com for more details about applying through the online
system (details on this specific position coming soon).

David Inouye wrote:
Posting is now restricted to subscribers, to reduced spam, and I 
don't see a subscription for you.  If you don't want to subscribe 
you can send me the message to post.


David

[ECOLOG-L] NEON - Job Opportunity - Mammal Ecologist

[Laura Reynolds]

Overview
The National Ecological Observatory Network (NEON, Inc.) is a nonprofit 
science corporation dedicated to understanding how changes in climate, 
land use and invasive species impact ecology. Currently under design is 
the NEON project - an observatory comprising more than 60 environmental 
and biological monitoring locations distributed throughout twenty domains 
across the United States, Hawaii, Alaska & Puerto Rico.  The observatory 
network will be the first of its kind designed to detect and enable 
forecasting of ecological change at continental scales over multiple 
decades.

Essential Duties and Responsibilities:
•   Coordinate and oversee data processing and analyses for field 
sampling associated with small mammal sampling, specifically deer mice.
•   Work with NEON disease ecologist to develop best methods for 
sampling for biodiversity, density, population dynamics, and disease. 
•   Research and evaluate the appropriate methods and sample sizes to 
meet NEON science requirements.
•   Provide methods and scientific support to NEON permitting team for 
IACUC approval. 
•   Coordinate data management between outsourced analytical 
facilities and NEON cyberinfrastructure team.
•   Work with NEON scientists to develop appropriate ways to maintain 
data and formats for public data access.
•   Coordinate information sharing with relevant communities 
•   Work with collaborating laboratories and NEON scientists to 
facilitate publication of results, and collaborate with other NEON 
scientists to prepare reports and develop recommendations for best 
practices, future analyses and data processing.

Education
•   PhD in ecology, evolutionary biology, or related field. 

Required Experience
•   Specific knowledge in small mammal field sampling for biodiversity 
and population dynamics. 
•   5 years experience or familiarity with planning surveillance 
schemes, analyzing data and refining approach based on results.

Preferred Experience:
•   Experience working with Peromyscus species
•   Experience with Lyme disease and Hantavirus
•   Experience working in diverse habitats for mammal sampling

Skills and Abilities:
•   Scientific writing and review 
•   Strong communication and interpersonal skills
•   Experience working in a collaborative scientific enterprise
•   Open to undertaking responsibilities beyond those associated with 
individual research projects
•   Ability to work independently and as part of an active science team
•   Problem solver who can successfully apply experience, judgment, 
and creativity to both short- and long-term challenges
•   Self-starter who can create new opportunities within this field 
and use novel methods, analyses and approaches to tackle continental-scale 
research

Physical Abilities: 
•   The candidate may be exposed to conditions in the field, and 
therefore must be able to traverse uneven ground such as dirt banks, 
stream beds, and shallow ponds carrying equipment and materials up to 40 
lbs. 

Apply to:www.neoninc.org

NEON Inc. is an Equal Opportunity Employer. Women, Minorities, Veterans 
and Disabled Persons are encouraged to apply. 

[ECOLOG-L] Job Announcement - Science Coordinator for SFBJV

[Tom Gardali]

Job Announcement: Science Coordinator for the San Francisco Bay Joint Venture - 
http://sfbayjv.org/jobs_details.php?index_jobs=233

NOTE that application deadline is 31 May 2010.

Best,

Tom


Thomas Gardali
Associate Director, Terrestrial Ecology Division
PRBO Conservation Science
Palomarin Field Station
P.O. Box 1157
Bolinas, CA 94924
415.868.0655 x381
www.prbo.org

[ECOLOG-L] Question on extracting DNA from cambial tissue

[Lakshmi Narayan]

Hi,

I'm seeking advice on extracting DNA from cambial tissue for microsatellite
analysis.  Please shoot me an e-mail (shmi.narayan at gmail dot com) if you
would be willing to share expertise or suggest relevant papers.

Thanks!

Lakshmi Narayan

[ECOLOG-L] Registration Open! Energy Use in Fisheries Symposium

[Energy.Fish]

*Registration is now open!*

Energy Use in Fisheries: Improving Efficiency and Technological 
Innovations from a Global Perspective 



Join us for a discussion about energy use in commercial and recreational 
fisheries, aquaculture operations, and the processing and marketing of 
fish. We'll address improved efficiency and technological innovations 
from a global perspective with a focus on:

* increased profits by reducing energy costs;
* reducing the carbon footprint of fisheries and aquaculture production 
on the environment;
* near and over the horizon energy saving technologies to reduce energy 
costs;

* regulatory changes to reduce energy costs and greenhouse gas emissions;
* alternative fuels and distribution systems to reduce energy demands; and
* changes in boat, power plant, and gear design to increase fuel 
efficiencies.


For more information and to register, visit www.energyfish.nmfs.noaa.gov.

*Who:* Commercial fishermen, recreational fishing operators, seafood 
processors, seafood distributors and marketers, aquaculturists, 
engineers, fishery management professionals and regulators, 
environmental non-government organizations, economists, university 
academicians, fisheries consultants, and others from around the world.


*What:* Symposium results will include:
* alternative operational and management strategies to reduce the carbon 
footprint of the fishing industry;
* demonstrated strategies of potential financial gains to symposium 
participants through reduced energy use;
* proposed roles for government and fishing organizations in improving 
energy efficiency and reducing the carbon footprint associated with 
fisheries and aquaculture;
* the identification of current gaps in energy efficiency research and 
the development of a research agenda;
* proposed sustainability certification criteria for seafood products 
related to energy efficiency; and
* a set of metrics to be used to measure the level of energy reduction 
or improved environmental efficacy of different fuel types used by the 
fishing industry.


*When:* November 14-17, 2010

*Where:* Seattle Sheraton Hotel, Seattle, WA

For more information and to register, visit www.energyfish.nmfs.noaa.gov

[ECOLOG-L] Laboratory Manager position

[Tracy Gartner]

Laboratory Manager

Carthage College seeks a full-time laboratory manager.   
Responsibilities within the chemistry and biology departments  
include supervising and training laboratory assistants, ordering and  
maintaining laboratory materials and equipment, setting up  
instructional lab experiments, and managing laboratory safety and  
hazardous waste.  The successful candidate will also assume the role  
of Chemical Hygiene Officer for the College's Division of Natural  
Sciences.


Minimum qualifications are a M.S. degree in biology, chemistry, or a  
related field, or a bachelor’s degree with 2-3 years of related  
experience, and the ability to work successfully with teaching staff  
and students.  Knowledge of or willingness to learn regulations for  
waste disposal and laboratory safety is also desirable. Salary and  
benefits are competitive, including 403b and medical plans.   
Candidates should submit a cover letter, resume, and names of three  
references to Professor Kevin Crosby, Chair of the Division of  
Natural Sciences by email to: labmana...@carthage.edu.  The  
preferred format for email attachments is PDF.  Applications  
received by June 1, 2010 will receive full consideration. 
Carthage College values the diversity of its faculty, staff, and  
students, and encourages applications from members of  
underrepresented groups.




Dr. Tracy Blickhan Gartner
Director of the Environmental Science Program
Assistant Professor of Biology, Geography and Earth Science

www.carthage.edu/dept/environment
tgart...@carthage.edu
262-551-5803

[ECOLOG-L] Microbial Ecology Postdoc: MSU/KBS

[Jay Lennon]

A postdoctoral research position is available in the Lennon Lab at Michigan
State University’s W.K. Kellogg Biological Station (KBS).  Applicants may
propose their own research or collaborate on one of the ongoing projects in
the lab that focuses on microbial dormancy, functional traits and microbial
biodiversity, resource subsidies in aquatic food webs, the ecology and
evolution of virus-bacteria interactions, and the evolutionary ecology of
plant-soil feedbacks.  For more details on the research conducted in the
Lennon Lab see http://microbes.kbs.msu.edu. 

The primary responsibility of the postdoc will be to develop a new project
or take the lead on one of the above-mentioned existing projects.  This will
include implementation of experiments, data analysis, and manuscript
preparation.  The postdoc will be in residence at KBS
(http://www.kbs.msu.edu/), which has an excellent infrastructure for
conducting microbial, evolutionary, community, and ecosystem ecology.  The
postdoc will also have the opportunity to collaborate with people in the
Department of Microbiology & Molecular Genetics (www.mmg.msu.edu); the
Ecology, Evolutionary Biology, and Behavior Program (www.eebb.msu.edu); and
the KBS Long-Term Ecological Research (LTER) site (www.lter.kbs.msu.edu). 

Highly qualified applicants will have experience in ecological and
evolutionary theory; PCR-based microbial analyses, including phylogenetic
and metagenomic analyses; quantitative methods, including statistics,
simulation modeling, and bioinformatics; microbial physiology, including
culture-based approaches; and fieldwork in aquatic and/or terrestrial
ecosystems.  

Applicants must have a Ph.D. in Ecology, Evolution, Microbiology or a
related field.  Two years of funding is available. The position is available
immediately, although the start date is somewhat flexible.  Interested
parties should email a cover letter explaining why they are interested in
the position, a CV, and a brief statement of research interests to Jay
Lennon (lenno...@msu.edu).  Applications will be evaluated as they are
received and will continue until the position has been filled.

Re: [ECOLOG-L] Science and Religion Dogmatic conflict?

[Derek Pursell]

There are multiple responses I'd like to field to various comments, so I'll 
attempt to be concise and systematic in my replies.
David - Thank you for the explanation of the selfish gene metaphor. In all of 
the modern interpretations of the original idea, I lost sight of the basic 
meaning of it, and thank you for pointing it out. It's quite sound, really, to 
think that certain genes are encouraged in populations if they grant attributes 
or characteristics that are beneficial for survival. It seems that some of the 
interpretations that have since come from that original notion are what seem 
suspect to me.
Jim - I agree, the principles and methodologies of science and religion are not 
compatible and it is folly to apply them to each other. To go beyond that 
though, it seems difficult to truly
 apply that notion. Scientific minds think scientifically, and religious minds 
think religiously. How (or can?) these ideas, these ways of thinking mesh and 
form some logically/emotionally consistent world view/belief system? Is this a 
process of individualization? Is it this sort of hybridization something that 
should be taught or encouraged, or just the opposite? It's interesting to think 
about, and I can confidently claim I have little idea what to think of such 
notions, or even how one would go about it (or whether they should).
Bill - Your suggestion of the "enslaving of minds" when colonial-era Europeans 
spread across the globe is interesting in a conversation that dances around the 
topic of history and the human condition. Considering the human mind's amazing 
ability to justify one's own actions to itself (an expression of fitness if 
I've ever heard of one), it'd seem to me that most likely these priests that 
went with the
 colonialists were there to spread "the truth" (read: whatever they defined the 
truth as, a very convenient definition for the converter). Thus, any of the 
aggressive cultural and social acts (of which there is considerable evidence) 
to "spread the word of God" (In this example, the Christian God and the 
religious/lingual/social framework that surrounds it) were entirely justified 
in the minds of the colonials. I think your alternative explanation of the 
interplay of history and religion in history is useful in seeing the issue from 
a different perspective, one typically not examined when many people learn 
about history.
Wayne - I agree that the prehistory era polytheistic faiths were much more 
nature-oriented than later monotheistic faiths. I think this is mainly due to 
how people lived at that time: in nature. To use the western example, from 
1,000 BCE to the present day, most humans lived in some degree of civilization, 
whether that was a city, town, or village (with exceptions, of course). 
Considering these structures were very much tied to the surrounding wilderness 
(nature), they were still separate from it, and considered as such. The 
priestly figures in society spent a few hundred, then a few thousand years 
surrounded by humans rather than animals, and slowly but surely "God" is no 
longer a animistic man/animal hybrid, but a man, a divine man no less, but 
still. As the old testament says, man was created in the image of God, and thus 
the religious belief system of humans evolved to one far more human-centered 
than nature-centered.
Micah - Before we go into your topic, I have a disagreement with some of your 
initial statements. In your post, you said...
"One must approach the discussion
delicately for the sake of discussion; if the purpose is to discover
truth. We all know from our courses in logic and critical thinking that,
truth needs no defense. Truth exists independent of what anyone thinks,
wishes or claims it to be.
Thought and discussion, that attempt to
exclude emotion (bias) will make the human species more fit, and it will
be  necessary minimize bias if we are to overcome the challenges
that confront us. Science would not emphasize the need to minimize bias
if it were not so.
My disagreement is with your assertion that logic is the only tool suitable to 
expanding human understanding of truth. The ancient Greeks were familiar with 
the three appeals of debate: ethos, pathos, and logos (morality, emotion, and 
logic). While I agree with your idea that the truth exists independently of 
what people perceive or believe it to be, I disagree that logic is the only 
proper tool to be used to expand understanding. Considering that to the 
non-scientist (which represents the vast majority of the human population) an 
emotional or moral appeal is oft far more effective at convincing people of the 
"rightness" of a course of action rather than a logical appeal. Any adept 
politician could tell you this. We might consider this to be an "unenlightened" 
means of spreading understanding, but I think scientists often forget that 
logic and its prodigy are not always the most effective tools for spreading 
knowledge. I think Al Gore's "Inconvenient
 Tr

Re: [ECOLOG-L] Science and Religion Dogmatic conflict?

[Jane Shevtsov]

I think it's a mistake to reduce religion to
anthropomorphism/explanations and morality/politics. There is a
crucial third element -- the human capacity for spiritual (meditative,
oceanic, transcendent, pick your favorite adjective) experiences.
These experiences are now being studied by psychologists and
neuroscientists (look up "neurotheology") and are often connected to
experiences in nature.

My hypothesis about the origins of such experiences is partially
inspired by a passage from E.O. Wilson's book _Biophilia_. "In a twist
my mind came free and I was aware of the hard workings of the natural
world beyond the periphery of ordinary attention, where passions lose
their meaning and history is in another dimension, without people, and
great events pass without record or judgment. I was a transient of no
consequence in this familiar yet deeply alien world that I had come to
love. The uncounted products of evolution were gathered there for
purposes having nothing to do with me; their long Cenozoic history was
enciphered into a genetic code I could not understand. The effect was
strangely calming. Breathing and heartbeat diminished, concentration
intensified. It seemed to me that something extraordinary in the
forest was very close to where I stood, moving to the surface and
discovery. ... I willed animals to materialize and they came
erratically into view."

What does this passage, which describes an experience I suspect most
members of this list have had, most resemble? It sounds a lot like how
practitioners of some types of meditation describe their experience.
But what is this "naturalist's trance" good for, other than science?
Hunting, gathering and looking out for predators! Maybe, just maybe,
this was our ancestors' normal state of consciousness and maybe
various religious and spiritual practices arose as a way of
recapturing this state as, for biological and social reasons, our
minds changed.

This is, of course, a guess, but what do you folks think?

Jane Shevtsov


On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 10:14 AM, William Silvert  wrote:
> Another consideration, given that James has brought William of Occam into
> this, is that a comprehensive scientific overview of the issue would involve
> paying some attention to the question of where religion comes from. If there
> were no reasonable alternative explanation, then the idea of gods making
> themselves known to people might be the only option.
>
> There are however plausible explanations for the development of religion
> that make sense to an atheist. Since we tend to see the world in
> anthropomorphic terms (even contemporary scientists speak of furious storms
> and treacherous riptides), no doubt early man associated natural phenomena
> with human-like gods or spirits. There were no doubt individuals who claimed
> that they understood these spirits and became shamans and priests.
> Eventually the priesthood hooked up with the politicians in the powerful
> symbiosis that has existed throughout recorded history - priests maintain
> the state religion and kings rule by divine right. Priests and ministers
> accompanied colonialists to ensure that the minds of those conquered were
> enslaved as well as their bodies.
>
> So there is an alternative explanation that covers most religions, and I
> think that should be an important part of scientific thinking about the
> relation between science and religion.
>
> Bill Silvert

-- 
-
Jane Shevtsov
Ecology Ph.D. candidate, University of Georgia
co-founder, 
Check out my blog, Perceiving Wholes

"The whole person must have both the humility to nurture the
Earth and the pride to go to Mars." --Wyn Wachhorst, The Dream
of Spaceflight

Re: [ECOLOG-L] Science and Religion Dogmatic conflict?

[Micah Moore]

This is a wonderful discussion, and it is one well worth having! The nature of 
this topic will elicit almost as many individual responses, as there are 
people. One must approach the discussion delicately for the sake of discussion; 
if the purpose is to discover truth. We all know from our courses in logic and 
critical thinking that, truth needs no defense. Truth exists independent of 
what anyone thinks, wishes or claims it to be.
Thought and discussion, that attempt to exclude emotion(bias) will make the 
human species more fit, and it will be necessary minimize bias if we are to 
overcome the challenges that confront us. Science would not emphasize the need 
to minimize bias if it were not so.

 Any language has inefficiencies which hinder its users from precisely 
describing observations, repeated results or truth, and people often argue over 
terminology when the terms are, indeed, expressing the same concept. The 
following will attempt to express the relatedness of Science and Religion by 
starting with "Energy" and concluding with the collections of energy termed 
"humans". I hope that all who read it will consider it knowing that I realize 
it limitations as I write, but that I am joining the discussion for the very 
same fundamental reason that it is taking place.

We must ask ourselves; "Do we really want to know?" It is very easy to take 
sides and blindly accept a claim. It requires energetic work in the form of 
kilojoules to put various amounts of thought and energy into examining 
different claims, but one can still arrive at a conclusion that is not the 
truth. No matter the belief system, we must ask ourselves if we really want to 
know the truth, no matter where the chips fall. Religion and Science are 
thought to be mutually exclusive by most discussing the issue, and both 
concepts claim to be a more a accurate representation of truth. They are 
different expressions of the same root cause. 

Most people will agree that different professions, disciplines, beliefs and 
life forms are related: physics, chemistry, biology, geology, psychology, 
sociology, economics, marketing, accounting, art etc... The general consensus 
is that they are related, but must do not or cannot consider the depths of the 
"universal" relationship of all energy forms. The concepts or mind strategies 
of Religion and Science are more related than most think. Conflict arises due 
to many variables or barriers that exist between systems and limit energy flow 
or "idea exchange". Language is a large barrier, and discussions of any topic 
are attempts to open energetic pathways, break down barriers, ultimately to 
arrive at a consensus(equilibrium). The purpose of this very discussion is so 
that the participants arrive at a more efficient "mind strategy" for viewing 
Science and Religion, whether or not they are aware of the energetic purpose. 

There are other variables are besides language; differential genetics, 
different informational stimuli, environmental stimuli, resource availability 
etc..., and these variables make "conflict" inevitable. A deeper understanding 
this topic is possible today because knowledge evolves, just like we evolve. It 
is almost certain that a deeper understanding will be possible for future 
generations. Any topic of discussion can integrate information from every 
subject that is known because energy is the base that gives rise to all 
expressions that exist or could exist. A deeper understanding of the "Ecology 
of Energy"(human behavior) will not be reached if the discussion does not 
incorporate all fields of knowledge. 

Keep in mind a word, sentence, paragraph, article, text, body language, sign 
language or any communication contains the amount of energy(in kilojoules) that 
it took to force air over the vocal chords, make hand signals, dance or write 
them. The amount of (kj) in any human communication does not equal the (kj) in 
the energy system, which it attempts to describe. The sides of the equation are 
not equal. Is it any wonder where so many sayings come from such as "words fall 
short", "words can't describe", "there's no explanation" etc?

 Literally, the energetics in language will fall short of precisely 
representing the other side. Communication will encounter electrical 
resistance(ohms), which produces energy loss in the form of heat. Discussions 
will get "heated". Tempers will "flare". Some will become "hot-heads". So, we 
must do what we can to lower resistance, to remain open, to remain objective 
and not waste our energetic efforts through "ohms" while discussing.

This is the "information age", and we must look for the relationships between 
all that exists. Today, physics recognize energy systems and continues to 
discover the vastness of the system we call the universe. The total energy in 
existence and the systems that comprise the totality are currently, of course, 
inexplicably dynamic. The stability of energy systems is limited, and Newton's