Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500 not amplifying

[Robert Rennard via Elecraft]

Eric et al -

I performed the wattmeter calibration from page 52 of the user manual, 
and then did the 5 and 50 watt TX gain calibration using the K3(s) Utility.


I notice that during the first transmission of AFSK RTTY into a Palstar 
dummy load, the KPA1500 output power grows to the desired output level 
in a few seconds, but in subsequent transmissions, the power level 
immediately reaches the desired level. Unfortunately, I did not have the 
LP-100 between the K3s and the amp.


I've been using the KPA1500 with my K3 using KEY line instead of the 
KPAK cable, but not on RTTY and do not see this ramp up.


73,

Bob R - KPA1500 #67

On 2018-10-24 19:44, Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft wrote:
Hi Bob - Have you run the K3 TX gain calibration on each band into a 
dummy load (or very low SWR Ant.) ?   If that is out of cal, it could 
easily create symptoms like this.


73,
Eric
/elecraft.com/

On 10/22/2018 2:02 PM, n7wy via Elecraft wrote:

Turns out, it is not the KPA1500 not amplifying, but rather the KPA3A final 
amplifier stage in my K3S is acting like it has tubes, not FETs.  It has to 
warm up at 30 watts out, and then the power can  be reduced to 20 watts.  
Weirdly, changing the power level above 20 watts seems to reset tbe behavior so 
it has to be warmed again.  The KPA3A module that is present is the 2nd 
replacement/exchange.  The first 2 had high 2 tone IMD issues on SSB.
My trustworthy K3 is now driving tbe KPA1500 without issues.
Thanks for all the off reflector counsel and 73,
Bob R  n7wy




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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500 not amplifying

[Don Wilhelm]

Bob,

That power ramp up is often caused by not driving the K3 with sufficient 
audio.
Your audio level should be adjusted to produce 4 bars solid on the K3 
ALC meter with the 5th bar flashing.


I have an article on my website www.w3fpr.com explaining the audio settings.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 11/9/2018 8:32 AM, Robert Rennard via Elecraft wrote:

Eric et al -

I performed the wattmeter calibration from page 52 of the user manual, 
and then did the 5 and 50 watt TX gain calibration using the K3(s) Utility.


I notice that during the first transmission of AFSK RTTY into a Palstar 
dummy load, the KPA1500 output power grows to the desired output level 
in a few seconds, but in subsequent transmissions, the power level 
immediately reaches the desired level. Unfortunately, I did not have the 
LP-100 between the K3s and the amp.


I've been using the KPA1500 with my K3 using KEY line instead of the 
KPAK cable, but not on RTTY and do not see this ramp up.



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[Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question

[Jim KO5V]

Well, after checking that all of the components in the fan circuit were 
correct, I decided to follow Don's usual advice about checking my soldering, so 
I re-flowed all of their joints. None looked bad, but now the fan works as it 
should, so...

I'm still curious about my 11A @ 100W measurement. I think I'll borrow a 
friend's DMM and see if I get the same voltage measurement across R1 
(unless 11A is in the ballpark).

73, Jim KO5V

-Forwarded Message-
>From: Jim KO5V 
>Sent: Nov 8, 2018 2:11 PM
>To: Elecraft List 
>Subject: K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question
>
>I just finished building and testing the KPA100 that goes with K2 #7225. This 
>kit was a rev C, and I have brought it up to the latest specs. U1 says PA 1.1.
>
>#1: It has passed all of the tests, except it apparently has no low fan speed. 
>I have set the temperature of the heat sink using CAL tPA, after measuring it 
>with an IR thermometer, and I have set and re-set the fan parameters in the 
>secondary menu. On "nor" and on "LoHi" the fan is off. On "Hi" it runs. I have 
>tested the amp's output into my power meter at 100w, but I haven't transmitted 
>long enough to really heat anything up.
>
>When I first applied power to the KPA100 for the initial tests, I believe the 
>fan ran at low speed, so I have probably broken something...
>
>#2: When I key the amp at 100w, through the power meter, and into a dummy 
>load, I measure about .055v across R7, so that's ~11A. I expected higher 
>current. Does that seem about right?
>
>Any insight would be appreciated.
>
>Thanks in advance, & 73,
>
>Jim KO5V
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Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question

[Don Wilhelm]

Jim,

I would expect that the current at 100 watts would be closer to 17 or 18 
amps.
Has the bias been set correctly for a 400mA rise in PA current with no 
RF input?  That bias setting will alter the operating class of the 
amplifier and it must be correct to be linear.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 11/9/2018 11:46 AM, Jim KO5V wrote:

Well, after checking that all of the components in the fan circuit were 
correct, I decided to follow Don's usual advice about checking my soldering, so 
I re-flowed all of their joints. None looked bad, but now the fan works as it 
should, so...

I'm still curious about my 11A @ 100W measurement. I think I'll borrow a 
friend's DMM and see if I get the same voltage measurement across R1
(unless 11A is in the ballpark).

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Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question

[Jim KO5V]

Don,

Yes, I set the bias as described, and at that setting, R6 is rotated about 1/3 
clockwise from fully CCW (I saw a reference to that reference in the archives). 
My guess is that my 35 year-old Beckman meter may be having trouble measuring 
small voltages, so I'll try another meter, and I'll report what I find. 

Thanks!

73, Jim KO5V


-Original Message-
>From: Don Wilhelm 
>Sent: Nov 9, 2018 9:56 AM
>To: Jim KO5V , Elecraft List 
>Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question
>
>Jim,
>
>I would expect that the current at 100 watts would be closer to 17 or 18 
>amps.
>Has the bias been set correctly for a 400mA rise in PA current with no 
>RF input?  That bias setting will alter the operating class of the 
>amplifier and it must be correct to be linear.
>
>73,
>Don W3FPR
>
>On 11/9/2018 11:46 AM, Jim KO5V wrote:
>> Well, after checking that all of the components in the fan circuit were 
>> correct, I decided to follow Don's usual advice about checking my soldering, 
>> so I re-flowed all of their joints. None looked bad, but now the fan works 
>> as it should, so...
>> 
>> I'm still curious about my 11A @ 100W measurement. I think I'll borrow a 
>> friend's DMM and see if I get the same voltage measurement across R1
>> (unless 11A is in the ballpark).
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Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question

[Bob McGraw K4TAX]

At 13.8 volts, 11amps is about 152 watts input. 100/152 = .658 * 100 for about 
66% efficiency.  

All in all , looks about right to me. AKA - I wouldn't be concerned.  


Bob, K4TAX


Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 9, 2018, at 10:46 AM, Jim KO5V  wrote:
> 
> Well, after checking that all of the components in the fan circuit were 
> correct, I decided to follow Don's usual advice about checking my soldering, 
> so I re-flowed all of their joints. None looked bad, but now the fan works as 
> it should, so...
> 
> I'm still curious about my 11A @ 100W measurement. I think I'll borrow a 
> friend's DMM and see if I get the same voltage measurement across R1 
> (unless 11A is in the ballpark).
> 
> 73, Jim KO5V
> 
> -Forwarded Message-
>> From: Jim KO5V 
>> Sent: Nov 8, 2018 2:11 PM
>> To: Elecraft List 
>> Subject: K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question
>> 
>> I just finished building and testing the KPA100 that goes with K2 #7225. 
>> This kit was a rev C, and I have brought it up to the latest specs. U1 says 
>> PA 1.1.
>> 
>> #1: It has passed all of the tests, except it apparently has no low fan 
>> speed. I have set the temperature of the heat sink using CAL tPA, after 
>> measuring it with an IR thermometer, and I have set and re-set the fan 
>> parameters in the secondary menu. On "nor" and on "LoHi" the fan is off. On 
>> "Hi" it runs. I have tested the amp's output into my power meter at 100w, 
>> but I haven't transmitted long enough to really heat anything up.
>> 
>> When I first applied power to the KPA100 for the initial tests, I believe 
>> the fan ran at low speed, so I have probably broken something...
>> 
>> #2: When I key the amp at 100w, through the power meter, and into a dummy 
>> load, I measure about .055v across R7, so that's ~11A. I expected higher 
>> current. Does that seem about right?
>> 
>> Any insight would be appreciated.
>> 
>> Thanks in advance, & 73,
>> 
>> Jim KO5V
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Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question

[Jim KO5V]

Thanks Bob,

That makes me feel a bit better. I'm still going to remeasure it with a newer 
meter and see if the measurements check.

73, Jim KO5V


-Original Message-
>From: Bob McGraw K4TAX 
>Sent: Nov 9, 2018 10:29 AM
>To: Jim KO5V 
>Cc: Elecraft List 
>Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question
>
>At 13.8 volts, 11amps is about 152 watts input. 100/152 = .658 * 100 for about 
>66% efficiency.  
>
>All in all , looks about right to me. AKA - I wouldn't be concerned.  
>
>
>Bob, K4TAX
>
>
>Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Nov 9, 2018, at 10:46 AM, Jim KO5V  wrote:
>> 
>> Well, after checking that all of the components in the fan circuit were 
>> correct, I decided to follow Don's usual advice about checking my soldering, 
>> so I re-flowed all of their joints. None looked bad, but now the fan works 
>> as it should, so...
>> 
>> I'm still curious about my 11A @ 100W measurement. I think I'll borrow a 
>> friend's DMM and see if I get the same voltage measurement across R1 
>> (unless 11A is in the ballpark).
>> 
>> 73, Jim KO5V
>> 
>> -Forwarded Message-
>>> From: Jim KO5V 
>>> Sent: Nov 8, 2018 2:11 PM
>>> To: Elecraft List 
>>> Subject: K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question
>>> 
>>> I just finished building and testing the KPA100 that goes with K2 #7225. 
>>> This kit was a rev C, and I have brought it up to the latest specs. U1 says 
>>> PA 1.1.
>>> 
>>> #1: It has passed all of the tests, except it apparently has no low fan 
>>> speed. I have set the temperature of the heat sink using CAL tPA, after 
>>> measuring it with an IR thermometer, and I have set and re-set the fan 
>>> parameters in the secondary menu. On "nor" and on "LoHi" the fan is off. On 
>>> "Hi" it runs. I have tested the amp's output into my power meter at 100w, 
>>> but I haven't transmitted long enough to really heat anything up.
>>> 
>>> When I first applied power to the KPA100 for the initial tests, I believe 
>>> the fan ran at low speed, so I have probably broken something...
>>> 
>>> #2: When I key the amp at 100w, through the power meter, and into a dummy 
>>> load, I measure about .055v across R7, so that's ~11A. I expected higher 
>>> current. Does that seem about right?
>>> 
>>> Any insight would be appreciated.
>>> 
>>> Thanks in advance, & 73,
>>> 
>>> Jim KO5V
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Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question

[Don Wilhelm]

Jim,

That 11 amps would sound more reasonable to me if you can say that the 
base K2 is being powered separately, but I would expect something closer 
to 50% efficiency rather than 66%.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 11/9/2018 12:42 PM, Jim KO5V wrote:

Thanks Bob,

That makes me feel a bit better. I'm still going to remeasure it with a newer 
meter and see if the measurements check.

73, Jim KO5V


-Original Message-

From: Bob McGraw K4TAX 
Sent: Nov 9, 2018 10:29 AM
To: Jim KO5V 
Cc: Elecraft List 
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question

At 13.8 volts, 11amps is about 152 watts input. 100/152 = .658 * 100 for about 
66% efficiency.

All in all , looks about right to me. AKA - I wouldn't be concerned.


Bob, K4TAX



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Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question

[Michael Blake via Elecraft]

Efficiency is an interesting point in a linear amplifier.  As the linear is 
“efficiency” modulated when it is driven to full power output it does in fact 
approach the 70% efficiency level of a class C amplifier.  Not quite but it 
closes in.  The 30% to 50% rating a linear amplifier normally receives is more 
of an average number which approximates the SSB talking power efficiency.

Very 73 - Mike - K9JRI

> On Nov 9, 2018, at 1:37 PM, Don Wilhelm  wrote:
> 
> Jim,
> 
> That 11 amps would sound more reasonable to me if you can say that the base 
> K2 is being powered separately, but I would expect something closer to 50% 
> efficiency rather than 66%.
> 
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
> 

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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500 fan on stby

[Ned Mountain WC4X]

Eric,
I totally agree that the KPA 1500 PS fan noise is mildly irritating to the
point that I moved mine to the other side of the wall--An option not
available to all.  It sure seems like it could run much less than it does. 
I have yet to feel any heat coming from the PS unit even after relatively
heavy use.  Maybe we can hope for this to be addressed in the future. 
Otherwise---a fantastic product!! 
Ned  WC4X



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[Elecraft] FS: KPA500/KAT500 Combo

[W0FK]

Selling a KPA500/KAT500 Combo. With optional KPAK3AUX and cables to interface
both units to a K3/K3S. Please email me off the list for details.

Lou, W0FK
lladerman AT earthlink DOT net



-
St. Louis, MO

"The difference between stupidity and genius is that 
genius has its limits." Albert Einstein


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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500 fan on stby

[Richard Thorne]

As soon as the supply has a load on it a good bit of the noise is reduced.

Maybe there's a way to put a small constant load on the supply?

Rich - N5ZC

On 11/8/2018 6:59 AM, eric norris via Elecraft wrote:

Why is the KPA1500 PS fan making so much noise when the amp is in STBY and just 
the ATU is being used?  What are those big boys cooling?
I'd hoped this would change with the new firmware but it did not.  Any hope for 
the future?
73 Eric WD6DBM

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android
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Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question

[Jim KO5V]

Don and Bob,

The K2 and amp are both powered from the amp's supply. 

I used a known good DVM to measure the voltage across R7, and it agrees with 
old Beckman. I now think my old kit-built Ten Tec power meter may be badly out 
of calibration. I have a dead LP-100 that is on its way back to Larry for 
upgrade and calibration, so I'll just wait until it is back to finish 
calibrating the KPA's power setting.

Here are what I measured and calculated at the approximate center of each band, 
in cw, when the K2's LCD read 100W:

10M: .067V, 13.4A
12M: .049V, 9.8A
15M: .064V, 12.8A
17M: .065V, 13A
20M: .048V, 9.6A
30M: .056V, 11.2A
40M: .052V, 10.4A
60M: .056V, 11.2A
80M: .054V, 10.8A

The current seems to vary significantly between bands, but maybe that's normal?

Thanks again. 73, 

Jim KO5V



-Original Message-
>From: Don Wilhelm 
>Sent: Nov 9, 2018 11:37 AM
>To: Jim KO5V , Bob McGraw K4TAX , 
>Elecraft List 
>Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question
>
>Jim,
>
>That 11 amps would sound more reasonable to me if you can say that the 
>base K2 is being powered separately, but I would expect something closer 
>to 50% efficiency rather than 66%.
>
>73,
>Don W3FPR
>
>On 11/9/2018 12:42 PM, Jim KO5V wrote:
>> Thanks Bob,
>> 
>> That makes me feel a bit better. I'm still going to remeasure it with a 
>> newer meter and see if the measurements check.
>> 
>> 73, Jim KO5V
>> 
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>>> From: Bob McGraw K4TAX 
>>> Sent: Nov 9, 2018 10:29 AM
>>> To: Jim KO5V 
>>> Cc: Elecraft List 
>>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question
>>>
>>> At 13.8 volts, 11amps is about 152 watts input. 100/152 = .658 * 100 for 
>>> about 66% efficiency.
>>>
>>> All in all , looks about right to me. AKA - I wouldn't be concerned.
>>>
>>>
>>> Bob, K4TAX
>>>
>>>
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Re: [Elecraft] FS: KPA500/KAT500 Combo

[Mike - W5JR]

Wow, I was interested, but not now that I have to “register” and get approval 
from the poster for him to receive my emails to his advertisement. 

Oh, well. 

tnx
Mike / W5JR
Alpharetta GA


> On Nov 9, 2018, at 5:50 PM, W0FK  wrote:
> 
> Selling a KPA500/KAT500 Combo. With optional KPAK3AUX and cables to interface
> both units to a K3/K3S. Please email me off the list for details.
> 
> Lou, W0FK
> lladerman AT earthlink DOT net
> 
> 
> 
> -
> St. Louis, MO
> 
> "The difference between stupidity and genius is that 
> genius has its limits." Albert Einstein
> 
> 
> --
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Re: [Elecraft] FS: KPA500/KAT500 Combo

[Ken G Kopp]

Hi Mike!

Rose (elecraftcov...@gmail.com) ran into one of these guys ... maybe the
same one ... the sale simply not worth the effort.

73

K0PP

On Fri, Nov 9, 2018, 16:19 Mike - W5JR  Wow, I was interested, but not now that I have to “register” and get
> approval from the poster for him to receive my emails to his advertisement.
>
> Oh, well.
>
> tnx
> Mike / W5JR
> Alpharetta GA
>
>
> > On Nov 9, 2018, at 5:50 PM, W0FK  wrote:
> >
> > Selling a KPA500/KAT500 Combo. With optional KPAK3AUX and cables to
> interface
> > both units to a K3/K3S. Please email me off the list for details.
> >
> > Lou, W0FK
> > lladerman AT earthlink DOT net
> >
> >
> >
> > -
> > St. Louis, MO
> >
> > "The difference between stupidity and genius is that
> > genius has its limits." Albert Einstein
> >
> >
> > --
> > Sent from: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/
> > __
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[Elecraft] Say it ain’t so... KPA1500 died

[W1PEF]

Sorry to report but my 6 month old KPA1500 died (near death to be factual). My 
amp is #172 and has been in service since May 2018. It has been super and 
haven’t had any problems until yesterday. Was on a 160m net, checked in without 
issue. When my turn happen I keyed the mic and immediately got a fault. Reduced 
power and checked out. The amp will now only produce about 400-500 watts but 
the audio is not good per on air reports. Elecraft has my config file and fault 
table and I’m sitting waiting to see the next steps. This is my first major 
issue with Elecraft and I hope all goes well. Will keep the group updated.

I’m sure glad I kept the the KPA500 and  KAT500. That equipment has been in 
service a couple of years without any problems. Hope it didn’t catch anything 
from it’s big brother LOL.

Paul - W1PEF 


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Re: [Elecraft] FS: KPA500/KAT500 Combo

[W0FK]

Geez guys, I have a spam filter. Sorry it’s an inconvenience to you, but I
was getting 300 a day snd had to do something 

As running on the major sites as well



-
St. Louis, MO

"The difference between stupidity and genius is that 
genius has its limits." Albert Einstein


--
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500 fan on stby

[Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft]

The PS fans run at a constant slow speed to primarily cool the main 50V 
switching PS. Interestingly, even at idle, a switcher is a little less efficient 
than at full load, so it still needs some cooling air flow.


We design all of our product cooling on a very conservative basis. There is a 
chance we over did this and can slow down the the 1500's PS fans a bit - I'll 
report back here after we do some further temperature testing.


I don't understand the comment about the PS fans getting quieter when the supply 
is under load in TX. They always run at the same speed. Is there something else 
I'm missing?


73,
Eric
/elecraft.com/

On 11/9/2018 2:52 PM, Richard Thorne wrote:

As soon as the supply has a load on it a good bit of the noise is reduced.

Maybe there's a way to put a small constant load on the supply?

Rich - N5ZC

On 11/8/2018 6:59 AM, eric norris via Elecraft wrote:
Why is the KPA1500 PS fan making so much noise when the amp is in STBY and 
just the ATU is being used? What are those big boys cooling?
I'd hoped this would change with the new firmware but it did not.  Any hope 
for the future?

73 Eric WD6DBM

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android
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Re: [Elecraft] Say it ain’t so... KPA1500 died

[Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft]

Hi Paul - we'll make sure to get this resolved for you quickly!

73,
Eric
/elecraft.com/

On 11/9/2018 3:51 PM, W1PEF wrote:

Sorry to report but my 6 month old KPA1500 died (near death to be factual). My 
amp is #172 and has been in service since May 2018. It has been super and 
haven’t had any problems until yesterday. Was on a 160m net, checked in without 
issue. When my turn happen I keyed the mic and immediately got a fault. Reduced 
power and checked out. The amp will now only produce about 400-500 watts but 
the audio is not good per on air reports. Elecraft has my config file and fault 
table and I’m sitting waiting to see the next steps. This is my first major 
issue with Elecraft and I hope all goes well. Will keep the group updated.

I’m sure glad I kept the the KPA500 and  KAT500. That equipment has been in 
service a couple of years without any problems. Hope it didn’t catch anything 
from it’s big brother LOL.

Paul - W1PEF


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Re: [Elecraft] Say it ain’t so... KPA1500 died

[Paul Baldock]

Sounds like 1 of the 2 output stages died. Not unheard of.

- Paul

At 03:51 PM 11/9/2018, W1PEF wrote:
Sorry to report but my 6 month old KPA1500 died 
(near death to be factual). My amp is #172 and 
has been in service since May 2018. It has been 
super and haven’t had any problems until 
yesterday. Was on a 160m net, checked in without 
issue. When my turn happen I keyed the mic and 
immediately got a fault. Reduced power and 
checked out. The amp will now only produce about 
400-500 watts but the audio is not good per on 
air reports. Elecraft has my config file and 
fault table and I’m sitting waiting to see the 
next steps. This is my first major issue with 
Elecraft and I hope all goes well. Will keep the 
group updated. I’m sure glad I kept the the 
KPA500 and  KAT500. That equipment has been in 
service a couple of years without any problems. 
Hope it didn’t catch anything from it’s big 
brother LOL. Paul - W1PEF 
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Re: [Elecraft] FS: KPA500/KAT500 Combo

[Walter Underwood]

That is a pretty common anti-spam filter. I don’t mind it.

wunder
K6WRU
Walter Underwood
CM87wj
http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)

> On Nov 9, 2018, at 3:18 PM, Mike - W5JR  wrote:
> 
> Wow, I was interested, but not now that I have to “register” and get approval 
> from the poster for him to receive my emails to his advertisement. 
> 
> Oh, well. 
> 
> tnx
> Mike / W5JR
> Alpharetta GA
> 
> 
>> On Nov 9, 2018, at 5:50 PM, W0FK  wrote:
>> 
>> Selling a KPA500/KAT500 Combo. With optional KPAK3AUX and cables to interface
>> both units to a K3/K3S. Please email me off the list for details.
>> 
>> Lou, W0FK
>> lladerman AT earthlink DOT net
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -
>> St. Louis, MO
>> 
>> "The difference between stupidity and genius is that 
>> genius has its limits." Albert Einstein
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> Sent from: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/
>> __
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Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question

[Don Wilhelm]

Jim,

That is normal.  The Transmit RF Gain varies from band to band, and that 
will cause the current draw to vary.  I am surprised that 12M is so low, 
it is normally on a par with 10 meters.


Part of the RF Gain variation is in the base K2 and some more of it is 
in the KPA100.


Remember that those are steady state current draws.  The dynamic current 
such as with SSB operation may peak at greater than what you measured.


Yes, use the LP-100 for calibrating the KPA100 wattmeter.  Since the 
LP-100 has NIST traceable calibration, I would believe it over the 
readings on a calibrated BIRD.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 11/9/2018 5:56 PM, Jim KO5V wrote:

Don and Bob,

The K2 and amp are both powered from the amp's supply.

I used a known good DVM to measure the voltage across R7, and it agrees with 
old Beckman. I now think my old kit-built Ten Tec power meter may be badly out 
of calibration. I have a dead LP-100 that is on its way back to Larry for 
upgrade and calibration, so I'll just wait until it is back to finish 
calibrating the KPA's power setting.

Here are what I measured and calculated at the approximate center of each band, 
in cw, when the K2's LCD read 100W:

10M: .067V, 13.4A
12M: .049V, 9.8A
15M: .064V, 12.8A
17M: .065V, 13A
20M: .048V, 9.6A
30M: .056V, 11.2A
40M: .052V, 10.4A
60M: .056V, 11.2A
80M: .054V, 10.8A

The current seems to vary significantly between bands, but maybe that's normal?




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[Elecraft] OT: SPAM filtering ...

[Ken G Kopp]

Between Rose and me we have four email addresses, yet SPAM is rare.  Can't
help but credit our provider, CenturyLink.

73 !

K0PP
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Re: [Elecraft] FS: KPA500/KAT500 Combo

[Don Wilhelm]

A good Bayesian spam filter is quite effective and is implemented in 
several email clients.


Oh yes, you have to initially identify the Spam, but the filter learns 
what is spam and what is not and automatically directs it to the Junk 
folder.


The Embarq (CenturyLink) "reject everything" is IMHO the worst solution 
to Spam - it not only requires the respondent to go to extra steps 
saying you are genuine, but requires those using it to respond as well.


I know Thunderbird has the Bayesian spam filter built in, and yes, I 
identify anything that comes into my email with no reasonable content in 
the text body as Junk Mail.  I do not count how many I receive, and I do 
not click on links that have no associated valid text telling me why I 
should click on it.


Just my opinion.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 11/9/2018 6:56 PM, W0FK wrote:

Geez guys, I have a spam filter. Sorry it’s an inconvenience to you, but I
was getting 300 a day snd had to do something

As running on the major sites as well



-
St. Louis, MO

"The difference between stupidity and genius is that
genius has its limits." Albert Einstein


--
Sent from: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/
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[Elecraft] KPA1500 new software 1.87

[Don Minkoff]

I just went from my 1.62 rev to 1.87 and something changed.  My fan use 
to come on at 60 deg and now comes on at 50 and off at 40.


I need to go back and try and reload the older version.  I don't think 
this is correct.


Anyone else run across this?

--
Don Minkoff
NK6A

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[Elecraft] Thanks all around

[Dauer, Edward]

It is not at all unusual for the Reflector to carry posts thanking and in 
praise of Eric, Wayne, Jack, Alan, their colleagues, and Elecraft in general.  
And in those I concur.  I would like to offer a similar kudos to the Reflector 
participants as well.  My recent request for advice about sourcing vintage 
radio parts resulted in a huge trove of great info.  That was not the first 
time.  It was typical.  Thanks, folks.  Great group.

Ted, KN1CBR



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Re: [Elecraft] FS: KPA500/KAT500 Combo

[ktalbott]

Deal killer. 
Ken ke4rg

-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net  On 
Behalf Of Ken G Kopp
Sent: Friday, November 9, 2018 6:42 PM
To: Mike - W5JR ; Elecraft 
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] FS: KPA500/KAT500 Combo

Hi Mike!

Rose (elecraftcov...@gmail.com) ran into one of these guys ... maybe the same 
one ... the sale simply not worth the effort.

73

K0PP

On Fri, Nov 9, 2018, 16:19 Mike - W5JR  Wow, I was interested, but not now that I have to  register  and get 
> approval from the poster for him to receive my emails to his advertisement.
>
> Oh, well.
>
> tnx
> Mike / W5JR
> Alpharetta GA
>
>
> > On Nov 9, 2018, at 5:50 PM, W0FK  wrote:
> >
> > Selling a KPA500/KAT500 Combo. With optional KPAK3AUX and cables to
> interface
> > both units to a K3/K3S. Please email me off the list for details.
> >
> > Lou, W0FK
> > lladerman AT earthlink DOT net
> >
> >
> >
> > -
> > St. Louis, MO
> >
> > "The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its 
> > limits." Albert Einstein
> >
> >
> > --
> > Sent from: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/
> > __
> > Elecraft mailing list
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> >
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> > email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to 
> > w5jr.li...@gmail.com
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500 new software 1.87

[John Hiatt]

The firmware release notes seem to support what you are seeing:

Changed temperatures for fan speeds:
- On 160 thru 10 meters, fans increase speed at 50, 70, 80, 87, and 95 degrees, 
and slow at 40, 55, 75, 81, and 88 degrees.
- On 6 meters the fans increase speed at 40, 50, 65, 80, and 90 degrees and 
slow at 35, 41, 51, 66, and 81 degrees.
- New serial command ^FP0; can be entered in the KPA1500 Utility command tester 
to revert to previous fan profile, which sped up at 60, 70, 78, 85, and 90 
degrees and slowed at 57, 67, 75, 82, and 87 degrees.  ^FP1; selects the "new" 
fan speed profile, ^FP0 selects the "old" fan speed profile.

John, KC7DRI


From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net  on 
behalf of Don Minkoff 
Sent: Friday, November 9, 2018 4:56 PM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: [Elecraft] KPA1500 new software 1.87

I just went from my 1.62 rev to 1.87 and something changed.  My fan use
to come on at 60 deg and now comes on at 50 and off at 40.

I need to go back and try and reload the older version.  I don't think
this is correct.

Anyone else run across this?

--
Don Minkoff
NK6A

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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500 new software 1.87

[Dick Dievendorff]

This is as intended. The release notes describe this. 

The intent is to use higher fan speeds less often by starting a bit lower.

73 de Dick, K6KR

> On Nov 9, 2018, at 16:56, Don Minkoff  wrote:
> 
> I just went from my 1.62 rev to 1.87 and something changed.  My fan use to 
> come on at 60 deg and now comes on at 50 and off at 40.
> 
> I need to go back and try and reload the older version.  I don't think this 
> is correct.
> 
> Anyone else run across this?
> 
> -- 
> Don Minkoff
> NK6A
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] OT: SPAM filtering ...

[Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT]

I ran an ISP for 20 years or so.

Server-side filtering is great.  I still run my own mail server.

If you use a mail client on your own machine, POPFile is awesome.



It can even classify a list like this one into different mail folders 
based by topic and is fairly easy to set up.


It will even filter the massively off-topic topics that spiral out of 
control.


73 -- Lynn

On 11/9/2018 4:21 PM, Ken G Kopp wrote:

Between Rose and me we have four email addresses, yet SPAM is rare.  Can't
help but credit our provider, CenturyLink.

73 !

K0PP
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[Elecraft] please ignore previous comment on fan speed for KPA1500

[Don Minkoff]

I now see that the fan speed specs changed with the new firmware.  Just 
not use to the new 50 deg on from 60 deg on.



--
Don Minkoff
NK6A

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Re: [Elecraft] FS: KPA500/KAT500 Combo

[Mike - W5JR]

Way off topic by now, so my final post. 

I get the inundation by spam situation. I utilize 17 email addresses to 
separate personal, hobbies, lists (like this one), public facing (club contact) 
and one used just for bingo card registrations. The club related email gets 
about a thousand spam emails a day, but most go directly to the junk folder. 
Unfortunately, so do legitimate ones on occasion. 

Some of the email accounts never receive a spam message and others get bushel 
baskets full. Kind of like robo calls, where the work cell number gets 20-30 an 
hour, mostly from spoofed mobile numbers, as that’s the latest workaround for 
these guys. 

BTW, the text scrappers are savvy enough to recreate the most likely email 
address from spelling out words (like DOT) or trying to disguise what a word 
is. And a fully & properly constructed email address is contained in the FROM 
portion of every email posted to this group. 

Back to lurking

tnx
Mike / W5JR
Alpharetta GA


> On Nov 9, 2018, at 6:56 PM, W0FK  wrote:
> 
> Geez guys, I have a spam filter. Sorry it’s an inconvenience to you, but I
> was getting 300 a day snd had to do something 
> 
> As running on the major sites as well
> 
> 
> 
> -
> St. Louis, MO
> 
> "The difference between stupidity and genius is that 
> genius has its limits." Albert Einstein
> 
> 
> --
> Sent from: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/
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Re: [Elecraft] FS: KPA500/KAT500 Combo

[W0FK]

“Deal killer. 
Ken ke4rg“

Interesting reaction to having a “grant permission” spam filter. It takes
just a minute or less to verify the email  you’re sending from isn’t junk. I
don’t see how a small inconvenience could be a deal breaker. But to each
his/her own. 

My isp screens out most spam, but I had to go to a more robust spam filter
after I got on some spammer list that used emails that defeated typical spam
screens. I was getting over 300 spam emails a day. I’ve reduced that
substantially but still see them flow through on occasion. 



-
St. Louis, MO

"The difference between stupidity and genius is that 
genius has its limits." Albert Einstein


--
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[Elecraft] OT: Re: FS: KPA500/KAT500 Combo

[Ken G Kopp]

I honestly forgot ... I also have Norton 360 that's updated daily.  It's
likely that much of my lack of SPAM should be credited there.

73 !

K0PP

On Fri, Nov 9, 2018, 18:40 W0FK  “Deal killer.
> Ken ke4rg“
>
> Interesting reaction to having a “grant permission” spam filter. It takes
> just a minute or less to verify the email  you’re sending from isn’t junk.
> I
> don’t see how a small inconvenience could be a deal breaker. But to each
> his/her own.
>
> My isp screens out most spam, but I had to go to a more robust spam filter
> after I got on some spammer list that used emails that defeated typical
> spam
> screens. I was getting over 300 spam emails a day. I’ve reduced that
> substantially but still see them flow through on occasion.
>
>
>
> -
> St. Louis, MO
>
> "The difference between stupidity and genius is that
> genius has its limits." Albert Einstein
>
>
> --
> Sent from: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/
> __
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question

[Jim KO5V]

Thanks again, Don.

It's good to know that the variation in current isn't a problem. I was also a 
bit surprised with the 12M and 20M measurements. 

I think I will do a complete realignment of the K2, and set up the wattmeter on 
the KPA when I get the LP100 back. Meanwhile, I'll try a few QSOs at 50W or so 
and see what happens.

73, Jim KO5V


-Original Message-
>From: Don Wilhelm 
>Sent: Nov 9, 2018 5:15 PM
>To: Jim KO5V , Bob McGraw K4TAX , 
>Elecraft List 
>Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question
>
>Jim,
>
>That is normal.  The Transmit RF Gain varies from band to band, and that 
>will cause the current draw to vary.  I am surprised that 12M is so low, 
>it is normally on a par with 10 meters.
>
>Part of the RF Gain variation is in the base K2 and some more of it is 
>in the KPA100.
>
>Remember that those are steady state current draws.  The dynamic current 
>such as with SSB operation may peak at greater than what you measured.
>
>Yes, use the LP-100 for calibrating the KPA100 wattmeter.  Since the 
>LP-100 has NIST traceable calibration, I would believe it over the 
>readings on a calibrated BIRD.
>
>73,
>Don W3FPR
>
>On 11/9/2018 5:56 PM, Jim KO5V wrote:
>> Don and Bob,
>>
>> The K2 and amp are both powered from the amp's supply.
>>
>> I used a known good DVM to measure the voltage across R7, and it agrees with 
>> old Beckman. I now think my old kit-built Ten Tec power meter may be badly 
>> out of calibration. I have a dead LP-100 that is on its way back to Larry 
>> for upgrade and calibration, so I'll just wait until it is back to finish 
>> calibrating the KPA's power setting.
>>
>> Here are what I measured and calculated at the approximate center of each 
>> band, in cw, when the K2's LCD read 100W:
>>
>> 10M: .067V, 13.4A
>> 12M: .049V, 9.8A
>> 15M: .064V, 12.8A
>> 17M: .065V, 13A
>> 20M: .048V, 9.6A
>> 30M: .056V, 11.2A
>> 40M: .052V, 10.4A
>> 60M: .056V, 11.2A
>> 80M: .054V, 10.8A
>>
>> The current seems to vary significantly between bands, but maybe that's 
>> normal?
>>
>>
>
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Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question

[Bob McGraw K4TAX]

Not at all unusual for the currents to be different on different bands.

Since most power meters are voltage sensing devices, the value of the 
dummy load will affect the power indication.  Thus as the R value 
increases the voltage across the R increases for a given power value and 
thus the meter will indicate more power than actually exists.   And the 
better power meters are typically +/- 5% full scale, i.e. Bird 43.   
Many ham meters are +/- 10%.   The LP-100 is +/- 3% with NIST factory 
calibration.


As to dummy loads, I have 3 and they all say 50 ohms on the label. In 
fact they measure between 48 ohms and 54 ohms when cold.  The value goes 
up as the element and radiator heats.   While that's not much, in fact 
it is approaching 10%.    That throws another variable in power 
measurements.


I stopped frettin' over power values a long long time ago.

73
Bob, K4TAX



On 11/9/2018 4:56 PM, Jim KO5V wrote:

Don and Bob,

The K2 and amp are both powered from the amp's supply.

I used a known good DVM to measure the voltage across R7, and it agrees with 
old Beckman. I now think my old kit-built Ten Tec power meter may be badly out 
of calibration. I have a dead LP-100 that is on its way back to Larry for 
upgrade and calibration, so I'll just wait until it is back to finish 
calibrating the KPA's power setting.

Here are what I measured and calculated at the approximate center of each band, 
in cw, when the K2's LCD read 100W:

10M: .067V, 13.4A
12M: .049V, 9.8A
15M: .064V, 12.8A
17M: .065V, 13A
20M: .048V, 9.6A
30M: .056V, 11.2A
40M: .052V, 10.4A
60M: .056V, 11.2A
80M: .054V, 10.8A

The current seems to vary significantly between bands, but maybe that's normal?

Thanks again. 73,

Jim KO5V



-Original Message-

From: Don Wilhelm 
Sent: Nov 9, 2018 11:37 AM
To: Jim KO5V , Bob McGraw K4TAX , Elecraft 
List 
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question

Jim,

That 11 amps would sound more reasonable to me if you can say that the
base K2 is being powered separately, but I would expect something closer
to 50% efficiency rather than 66%.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 11/9/2018 12:42 PM, Jim KO5V wrote:

Thanks Bob,

That makes me feel a bit better. I'm still going to remeasure it with a newer 
meter and see if the measurements check.

73, Jim KO5V


-Original Message-

From: Bob McGraw K4TAX 
Sent: Nov 9, 2018 10:29 AM
To: Jim KO5V 
Cc: Elecraft List 
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question

At 13.8 volts, 11amps is about 152 watts input. 100/152 = .658 * 100 for about 
66% efficiency.

All in all , looks about right to me. AKA - I wouldn't be concerned.


Bob, K4TAX





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Re: [Elecraft] OT: SPAM filtering ...

[Bob McGraw K4TAX]

What's spam?   I never see any using Greymail as my filter and none of 
the senders ever know they've been filtered.   I do check the contents 
on a regular basis and rarely, very rarely, do I ever find a message 
that should have passed through.  Best of all, it is easy to use and FREE.


73

Bob, K4TAX


On 11/9/2018 6:21 PM, Ken G Kopp wrote:

Between Rose and me we have four email addresses, yet SPAM is rare.  Can't
help but credit our provider, CenturyLink.

73 !

K0PP
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Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question

[Jim KO5V]

Thanks Bob,

Yet another variable! I just measured my dummy load at 54 ohms (cold). Maybe I 
should just declare victory and move on!

73, Jim KO5V  


-Original Message-
>From: Bob McGraw K4TAX 
>Sent: Nov 9, 2018 8:51 PM
>To: Jim KO5V , donw...@embarqmail.com, Elecraft List 
>
>Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question
>
>Not at all unusual for the currents to be different on different bands.
>
>Since most power meters are voltage sensing devices, the value of the 
>dummy load will affect the power indication.  Thus as the R value 
>increases the voltage across the R increases for a given power value and 
>thus the meter will indicate more power than actually exists.   And the 
>better power meters are typically +/- 5% full scale, i.e. Bird 43.   
>Many ham meters are +/- 10%.   The LP-100 is +/- 3% with NIST factory 
>calibration.
>
>As to dummy loads, I have 3 and they all say 50 ohms on the label. In 
>fact they measure between 48 ohms and 54 ohms when cold.  The value goes 
>up as the element and radiator heats.   While that's not much, in fact 
>it is approaching 10%.    That throws another variable in power 
>measurements.
>
>I stopped frettin' over power values a long long time ago.
>
>73
>Bob, K4TAX
>
>
>
>On 11/9/2018 4:56 PM, Jim KO5V wrote:
>> Don and Bob,
>>
>> The K2 and amp are both powered from the amp's supply.
>>
>> I used a known good DVM to measure the voltage across R7, and it agrees with 
>> old Beckman. I now think my old kit-built Ten Tec power meter may be badly 
>> out of calibration. I have a dead LP-100 that is on its way back to Larry 
>> for upgrade and calibration, so I'll just wait until it is back to finish 
>> calibrating the KPA's power setting.
>>
>> Here are what I measured and calculated at the approximate center of each 
>> band, in cw, when the K2's LCD read 100W:
>>
>> 10M: .067V, 13.4A
>> 12M: .049V, 9.8A
>> 15M: .064V, 12.8A
>> 17M: .065V, 13A
>> 20M: .048V, 9.6A
>> 30M: .056V, 11.2A
>> 40M: .052V, 10.4A
>> 60M: .056V, 11.2A
>> 80M: .054V, 10.8A
>>
>> The current seems to vary significantly between bands, but maybe that's 
>> normal?
>>
>> Thanks again. 73,
>>
>> Jim KO5V
>>
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>>> From: Don Wilhelm 
>>> Sent: Nov 9, 2018 11:37 AM
>>> To: Jim KO5V , Bob McGraw K4TAX , 
>>> Elecraft List 
>>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question
>>>
>>> Jim,
>>>
>>> That 11 amps would sound more reasonable to me if you can say that the
>>> base K2 is being powered separately, but I would expect something closer
>>> to 50% efficiency rather than 66%.
>>>
>>> 73,
>>> Don W3FPR
>>>
>>> On 11/9/2018 12:42 PM, Jim KO5V wrote:
 Thanks Bob,

 That makes me feel a bit better. I'm still going to remeasure it with a 
 newer meter and see if the measurements check.

 73, Jim KO5V


 -Original Message-
> From: Bob McGraw K4TAX 
> Sent: Nov 9, 2018 10:29 AM
> To: Jim KO5V 
> Cc: Elecraft List 
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K2: KPA100 fan issue + current question
>
> At 13.8 volts, 11amps is about 152 watts input. 100/152 = .658 * 100 for 
> about 66% efficiency.
>
> All in all , looks about right to me. AKA - I wouldn't be concerned.
>
>
> Bob, K4TAX
>
>
>
>
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500 fan on stby

[K9MA]

I could be wrong, but I don't think the PS fan is controlled by the 
KPA1500 at all. The power supply itself is from a third party, and I 
think the fan is integral to it, and probably also the fan controller.


73,
Scott K9MA

On 11/9/2018 16:52, Richard Thorne wrote:
As soon as the supply has a load on it a good bit of the noise is 
reduced.


Maybe there's a way to put a small constant load on the supply?

Rich - N5ZC

On 11/8/2018 6:59 AM, eric norris via Elecraft wrote:
Why is the KPA1500 PS fan making so much noise when the amp is in 
STBY and just the ATU is being used? What are those big boys cooling?
I'd hoped this would change with the new firmware but it did not.  
Any hope for the future?

73 Eric WD6DBM


--
Scott  K9MA

k...@sdellington.us

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Re: [Elecraft] FS: KPA500/KAT500 Combo

[Michael Walker]

Since I moved to Gmail a long time ago, I get zero Spam.  I even moved my 
domains there. 

It just works the way it should and easier than the spam filters.  

Mike va3mw

Sent from my iPad

> On Nov 9, 2018, at 8:40 PM, W0FK  wrote:
> 
> “Deal killer. 
> Ken ke4rg“
> 
> Interesting reaction to having a “grant permission” spam filter. It takes
> just a minute or less to verify the email  you’re sending from isn’t junk. I
> don’t see how a small inconvenience could be a deal breaker. But to each
> his/her own. 
> 
> My isp screens out most spam, but I had to go to a more robust spam filter
> after I got on some spammer list that used emails that defeated typical spam
> screens. I was getting over 300 spam emails a day. I’ve reduced that
> substantially but still see them flow through on occasion. 
> 
> 
> 
> -
> St. Louis, MO
> 
> "The difference between stupidity and genius is that 
> genius has its limits." Albert Einstein
> 
> 
> --
> Sent from: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/
> __
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