Re: [Elecraft] Can't update KAT500 firmware

[Andy Durbin]

I can't help with that error but you can download the firmware directly from 
here:

https://ftp.elecraft.com/KAT500/firmware/

Put it in a local directory then point the utility to that directory and it 
should show it is available for loading.

Andy, k3wyc
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[Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction

[Pete Smith N4ZR]

Last weekend during the 10 meter contest I was experiencing very loud 
line-noise-like interference when my antenna was pointing south.  I 
tried both my K3's Noise Reduction and Noise Blanker functions, and was 
unable to find any setting that gave useful relief.  With the noise 
blanker, in particular, I noticed that when it was on, not only was the 
buzz still very strong, but it seemed as if all CW signals on the band 
were being hum-modulated.  As soon as I turned off the noise blanker, 
the CW signals cleaned up.  Is there something wrong with my radio, or 
an adjustment issue, or is this interference simply too strong?  
Obviously, I'll be trying to track it down, but it's not there all the 
time, so that could be tough.


--
73, Pete N4ZR
Check out the new Reverse Beacon Network
web server at .
For spots, please use your favorite
"retail" DX cluster.

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction

[Dave]

I have that same issue...
I have some very dirty grow lights about two blocks from me.  They are 
dirty as they come...  Splattering across 80-20 meters.  The K3 has 
never been able to adequately clean up the crud from them.


In defense of the NB/NR on the K3, the signals are on the order of S7 to 
S9, so my expectations may be too high for the K3.  I just hope the K4 
NB/NR work better in my environment.


73, and thanks,
Dave (NK7Z)
https://www.nk7z.net
ARRL Volunteer Examiner
ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources

On 12/15/21 06:36, Pete Smith N4ZR wrote:
Last weekend during the 10 meter contest I was experiencing very loud 
line-noise-like interference when my antenna was pointing south.  I 
tried both my K3's Noise Reduction and Noise Blanker functions, and was 
unable to find any setting that gave useful relief.  With the noise 
blanker, in particular, I noticed that when it was on, not only was the 
buzz still very strong, but it seemed as if all CW signals on the band 
were being hum-modulated.  As soon as I turned off the noise blanker, 
the CW signals cleaned up.  Is there something wrong with my radio, or 
an adjustment issue, or is this interference simply too strong? 
Obviously, I'll be trying to track it down, but it's not there all the 
time, so that could be tough.



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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction

[David Hachadorian]

For 12 years I've tried to get any enhancement of s/n from the K3 IF/RF 
NB and NR.  I haven't seen one case where there is any improvement under 
contest conditions.  When the s/n just starts to improve, the desired 
signal is modulated and degraded by nearby signals to the point where 
reception is better with NB/NR turned off.  As far as I can see, both of 
these features are useless on the K3 under contest conditions.


Dave Hachadorian, K6LL
Yuma, AZ


On 12/15/2021 7:36 AM, Pete Smith N4ZR wrote:
Last weekend during the 10 meter contest I was experiencing very loud 
line-noise-like interference when my antenna was pointing south. I 
tried both my K3's Noise Reduction and Noise Blanker functions, and 
was unable to find any setting that gave useful relief.  With the 
noise blanker, in particular, I noticed that when it was on, not only 
was the buzz still very strong, but it seemed as if all CW signals on 
the band were being hum-modulated.  As soon as I turned off the noise 
blanker, the CW signals cleaned up.  Is there something wrong with my 
radio, or an adjustment issue, or is this interference simply too 
strong?  Obviously, I'll be trying to track it down, but it's not 
there all the time, so that could be tough.



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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft K3 with uninstalled KRX3 for sale

[Scott Manthe]

The K3/KRX3 combo has been sold. The PR6-10 is still available.

73,
Scott N9AA


On Tue, Dec 14, 2021, 5:39 PM Scott Manthe  wrote:

> I have an Elecraft K3, SN3019, and a uninstalled KRX3 that I'd like to
> sell. I'm offering it here first, as this is where I originally picked
> it up.
>
>
> K3/100 with original synth board, works as it should.
> The configuration:
> KAT3 internal tuner
> KBPF3 general coverage board
> KIO3A I/O board
> KXV3 RX antenna/transverter board
> KFL3B-FM 13kHz filter
> KFL3A-6K AM filter
> KFL3A-2.7K SSB filter
> KFL3A-500 CW filter
> KFL3A-200 CW narrow filter
> With all manuals and a Cady K3 book.
> Pics available on request.
>
> KRX3 with original synth board, not installed in K3:
> KFL3B-FM
> KFL3A-2.7K
> KFL3A-500
> with manuals.
>
> I'd like $2300 for both the K3 and the KRX3. I'd prefer not to split
> them up, unless I get strong offers for both.
>
> I also have a PR6-10 that I'll include for an extra $145, or I can sell
> it separately after the rig sells. If these prices are out of line, let
> me know.
>
> 73,
> Scott N9AA
>
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction

[Carl Yaffey]

I had the same issue with my K3s. Now that I have an FTdx101D, no more problems 
with noise.
73
Carl Yaffey  K8NU
614 268 6353, Columbus OH
http://www.carl-yaffey.com
http://www.bluesswing.com
http://www.timbrewolvesband.com
http://www.folkramblers.carl-yaffey.com
Http://www.clintonvillegrass.com

> On Dec 15, 2021, at 9:36 AM, Pete Smith N4ZR  wrote:
> 
> Last weekend during the 10 meter contest I was experiencing very loud 
> line-noise-like interference when my antenna was pointing south.  I tried 
> both my K3's Noise Reduction and Noise Blanker functions, and was unable to 
> find any setting that gave useful relief.  With the noise blanker, in 
> particular, I noticed that when it was on, not only was the buzz still very 
> strong, but it seemed as if all CW signals on the band were being 
> hum-modulated.  As soon as I turned off the noise blanker, the CW signals 
> cleaned up.  Is there something wrong with my radio, or an adjustment issue, 
> or is this interference simply too strong?  Obviously, I'll be trying to 
> track it down, but it's not there all the time, so that could be tough.
> 
> -- 
> 73, Pete N4ZR
> Check out the new Reverse Beacon Network
> web server at .
> For spots, please use your favorite
> "retail" DX cluster.
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction

[Alan Higbie]

I too was skeptical about finding ANY improvement to s/n ratio under
contest conditions.

A couple of years ago, I was confronted with some S-7 broadband
digital-like RFI while using my K3 in an extremely urban environment.  But,
using BOTH NB and NR and fiddling with settings eventually allowed me to
operate and to make a whole bunch of contest QSO’s in CQWW CW.

It is possible - but still unpleasant.

73, Alan K0AV





On Wed, Dec 15, 2021 at 8:15 AM David Hachadorian 
wrote:

> For 12 years I've tried to get any enhancement of s/n from the K3 IF/RF
> NB and NR.  I haven't seen one case where there is any improvement under
> contest conditions.  When the s/n just starts to improve, the desired
> signal is modulated and degraded by nearby signals to the point where
> reception is better with NB/NR turned off.  As far as I can see, both of
> these features are useless on the K3 under contest conditions.
>
> Dave Hachadorian, K6LL
> Yuma, AZ
>
>
> On 12/15/2021 7:36 AM, Pete Smith N4ZR wrote:
> > Last weekend during the 10 meter contest I was experiencing very loud
> > line-noise-like interference when my antenna was pointing south. I
> > tried both my K3's Noise Reduction and Noise Blanker functions, and
> > was unable to find any setting that gave useful relief.  With the
> > noise blanker, in particular, I noticed that when it was on, not only
> > was the buzz still very strong, but it seemed as if all CW signals on
> > the band were being hum-modulated.  As soon as I turned off the noise
> > blanker, the CW signals cleaned up.  Is there something wrong with my
> > radio, or an adjustment issue, or is this interference simply too
> > strong?  Obviously, I'll be trying to track it down, but it's not
> > there all the time, so that could be tough.
> >
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction

[Victor Rosenthal 4X6GP]

The problem of all signals distorted can be cleared up by adjustment. I 
don't know which blanker you are using (RF or DSP), but try reducing the 
blanker level until signals sound normal. Then strong noise pulses will 
still be supressed.
The RF blanker also has three choices of pulse width in addition to 
various levels, which can help with different types of noise. The DSP 
blanker can cause distortion when its level is adjusted to the higher 
levels.
The NR will not help with this kind of noise. It just reduces band noise 
in the background.


73,
Victor, 4X6GP
Rehovot, Israel
CWops #5
Formerly K2VCO
https://www.qsl.net/k2vco/
On 15/12/2021 16:36, Pete Smith N4ZR wrote:
Last weekend during the 10 meter contest I was experiencing very loud 
line-noise-like interference when my antenna was pointing south.  I 
tried both my K3's Noise Reduction and Noise Blanker functions, and was 
unable to find any setting that gave useful relief.  With the noise 
blanker, in particular, I noticed that when it was on, not only was the 
buzz still very strong, but it seemed as if all CW signals on the band 
were being hum-modulated.  As soon as I turned off the noise blanker, 
the CW signals cleaned up.  Is there something wrong with my radio, or 
an adjustment issue, or is this interference simply too strong? 
Obviously, I'll be trying to track it down, but it's not there all the 
time, so that could be tough.



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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction

[Ray]

I am Not a big fan of the K3 Noise reduction !
NB work OK, but NR is Poor!

That’s My 2 Cents worth.  Ray WA6VAB


From: Alan Higbie
Sent: Wednesday, December 15, 2021 7:46 AM
To: David Hachadorian
Cc: Reflector Elecraft
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction

I too was skeptical about finding ANY improvement to s/n ratio under
contest conditions.

A couple of years ago, I was confronted with some S-7 broadband
digital-like RFI while using my K3 in an extremely urban environment.  But,
using BOTH NB and NR and fiddling with settings eventually allowed me to
operate and to make a whole bunch of contest QSO’s in CQWW CW.

It is possible - but still unpleasant.

73, Alan K0AV





On Wed, Dec 15, 2021 at 8:15 AM David Hachadorian 
wrote:

> For 12 years I've tried to get any enhancement of s/n from the K3 IF/RF
> NB and NR.  I haven't seen one case where there is any improvement under
> contest conditions.  When the s/n just starts to improve, the desired
> signal is modulated and degraded by nearby signals to the point where
> reception is better with NB/NR turned off.  As far as I can see, both of
> these features are useless on the K3 under contest conditions.
>
> Dave Hachadorian, K6LL
> Yuma, AZ
>
>
> On 12/15/2021 7:36 AM, Pete Smith N4ZR wrote:
> > Last weekend during the 10 meter contest I was experiencing very loud
> > line-noise-like interference when my antenna was pointing south. I
> > tried both my K3's Noise Reduction and Noise Blanker functions, and
> > was unable to find any setting that gave useful relief.  With the
> > noise blanker, in particular, I noticed that when it was on, not only
> > was the buzz still very strong, but it seemed as if all CW signals on
> > the band were being hum-modulated.  As soon as I turned off the noise
> > blanker, the CW signals cleaned up.  Is there something wrong with my
> > radio, or an adjustment issue, or is this interference simply too
> > strong?  Obviously, I'll be trying to track it down, but it's not
> > there all the time, so that could be tough.
> >
> __
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[Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction

[Bob McGraw]

The approach I use for the Noise Blanker is this.

I first activate the NB and then the Level.   I start with the DSP OFF 
and the IF OFF.  I then adjust the DSP value for optimum results without 
it destroying the quality of the signal.  DO MAKE A NOTE OF THIS VALUE.  
Then set the DSP back to OFF.  Then move to the IF and scroll through 
the settings in an effort to find optimum results.  Once this is done, 
leave the IF value as determined and return to the DSP and set it to the 
value previously determined.


This works for a given band and given type of noise.  Change bands or 
noise and do it all again.  There is no ONE setting correct for every 
condition.   Right now my 6M noise buzz is S-7 with the NB off.  Then 
turning it ON and adjusted as above the 6M noise is S-3.  That's 4 S 
units or 24 dB improvement.  I doubt you will get much better than this.


As to Noise Reduction, I find it best performs for CW mode. Again it 
takes careful adjustment to obtain optimum results.   I don't use NR for 
SSB signals. I prefer to adjust the Attenuation value and the RF Gain to 
produce optimum results when operating SSB.   I find optimum results 
occur when the no signal band noise is about 10 dB above the receiver 
noise floor.   In order to accomplish this operating point, one will 
need to use ATTENUATION and RF Gain reduction.   More gain won't aid in 
receiving weak signals, but just the opposite, as the signal will pop 
out of the noise.


I generally find using either NB or NR, but not both, is the better way 
to operate.  I doubt there is anything wrong with your radio.  Most 
likely the result is more related to receiver setting parameters.


73

Bob, K4TAX


On 12/15/2021 9:46 AM, elecraft-requ...@mailman.qth.net wrote:

Message: 15
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2021 09:36:26 -0500
From: Pete Smith N4ZR
To: Elecraft List
Subject: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed

Last weekend during the 10 meter contest I was experiencing very loud
line-noise-like interference when my antenna was pointing south.? I
tried both my K3's Noise Reduction and Noise Blanker functions, and was
unable to find any setting that gave useful relief.? With the noise
blanker, in particular, I noticed that when it was on, not only was the
buzz still very strong, but it seemed as if all CW signals on the band
were being hum-modulated.? As soon as I turned off the noise blanker,
the CW signals cleaned up.? Is there something wrong with my radio, or
an adjustment issue, or is this interference simply too strong??
Obviously, I'll be trying to track it down, but it's not there all the
time, so that could be tough.

-- 73, Pete N4ZR Check out the new Reverse Beacon Network web server 
at . For spots, please use your 
favorite "retail" DX cluster. -- Message: 
16 Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2021 06:55:25 -0800 From: Dave  
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise 
Reduction Message-ID:  
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed I have that 
same issue... I have some very dirty grow lights about two blocks from 
me. They are dirty as they come... Splattering across 80-20 meters. 
The K3 has never been able to adequately clean up the crud from them. 
In defense of the NB/NR on the K3, the signals are on the order of S7 
to S9, so my expectations may be too high for the K3. I just hope the 
K4 NB/NR work better in my environment. 73, and thanks, Dave (NK7Z) 
https://www.nk7z.net ARRL Volunteer Examiner ARRL Technical 
Specialist, RFI ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources 
--

Message: 17
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2021 08:05:59 -0700
From: David Hachadorian
To: Pete Smith N4ZR, Reflector Elecraft

Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed

For 12 years I've tried to get any enhancement of s/n from the K3 IF/RF
NB and NR.? I haven't seen one case where there is any improvement under
contest conditions.? When the s/n just starts to improve, the desired
signal is modulated and degraded by nearby signals to the point where
reception is better with NB/NR turned off.? As far as I can see, both of
these features are useless on the K3 under contest conditions.

Dave Hachadorian, K6LL
Yuma, AZ





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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction

[G4GNX]

I have a similar issue with what is possibly the filthiest wall-wart in the 
country. Unfortunately, our equivalent of the FCC failed miserably to do 
anything to get it stopped, despite my offer to simply buy a new one and the 
dear lady who owns it wouldn’t let anyone in to check.

I am now using a directional LZ1AQ mag-loop setup, with one of the MFJ NR boxes 
and a BHI audio DSP and signals are bearable but not great.

When things are really bad, I resort to cheating and listen on one or other SDR 
via the Internet, where antennas are good and local noise is minimum. What 
surprises me is how good the NR is on them, particularly Hack Green. There may 
not be nearly as much noise as I hear on the K3S, but there must always be some 
and with very little ‘fiddling’ it will sound like a quality FM broadcast (as 
long as the audio itself is clean.

73,
Alan - G4GNX



> On 15 Dec 2021, at 14:55, Dave  wrote:
> 
> I have that same issue...
> I have some very dirty grow lights about two blocks from me.  They are dirty 
> as they come...  Splattering across 80-20 meters.  The K3 has never been able 
> to adequately clean up the crud from them.
> 
> In defense of the NB/NR on the K3, the signals are on the order of S7 to S9, 
> so my expectations may be too high for the K3.  I just hope the K4 NB/NR work 
> better in my environment.
> 
> 73, and thanks,
> Dave (NK7Z)
> https://www.nk7z.net
> ARRL Volunteer Examiner
> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
> 

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction

[Jim Brown]

Lots of good advice here. A major problem with the K3 NB is the way it 
is described on screen and in the manual. There are two blankers, one 
ahead of the crystal roofing filters, one after them. Each has multiple 
tweaks. In contest conditions, I've found good noise reduction from 
using the one AFTER the roofing filter, and set for the greatest depth 
and shortest time. I THINK it's called the DSP Blanker.


Yes, by their nature, NBs will modulate signals by the noise.

Let's hope the NB in the K4 is better.

73, Jim K9YC

 On 12/15/2021 8:52 AM, Bob McGraw wrote:

The approach I use for the Noise Blanker is this.

I first activate the NB and then the Level.   I start with the DSP OFF 
and the IF OFF.  I then adjust the DSP value for optimum results without 
it destroying the quality of the signal.  DO MAKE A NOTE OF THIS VALUE. 
Then set the DSP back to OFF.  Then move to the IF and scroll through 
the settings in an effort to find optimum results.  Once this is done, 
leave the IF value as determined and return to the DSP and set it to the 
value previously determined.


This works for a given band and given type of noise.  Change bands or 
noise and do it all again.  There is no ONE setting correct for every 
condition.   Right now my 6M noise buzz is S-7 with the NB off.  Then 
turning it ON and adjusted as above the 6M noise is S-3.  That's 4 S 
units or 24 dB improvement.  I doubt you will get much better than this.


As to Noise Reduction, I find it best performs for CW mode. Again it 
takes careful adjustment to obtain optimum results.   I don't use NR for 
SSB signals. I prefer to adjust the Attenuation value and the RF Gain to 
produce optimum results when operating SSB.   I find optimum results 
occur when the no signal band noise is about 10 dB above the receiver 
noise floor.   In order to accomplish this operating point, one will 
need to use ATTENUATION and RF Gain reduction.   More gain won't aid in 
receiving weak signals, but just the opposite, as the signal will pop 
out of the noise.


I generally find using either NB or NR, but not both, is the better way 
to operate.  I doubt there is anything wrong with your radio.  Most 
likely the result is more related to receiver setting parameters.


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[Elecraft] KAT3 ATU Problem

[Tom Boucher]

Mike K8CN wrote
























*< It wouldn't have occurred to me to look atthe LPA stage as a source of
trouble, but ifthe TX power is ramping up slowly, then I cansee where the
ATU control algorithm isconfused by the change in power levels bothforward
and reflected.  My ATU seems tochange relay settings very fast, and the
controlalgorithm is looking at change direction (maybechange magnitude as
well) in SWR to decidewhich relays to flip next.  The relative
adaptationspeed of the control algorithm and the TX powerramp-up could
certainly cause interactions thatmight slow the ATU convergence, but I
wouldthink that once the TX output power stabilized,the ATU control
algorithm would be receivingvalid SWR readings as it flips relays.When you
say it takes seconds to ramp upto full (TUNE) output power, does this
happenon every TUNE button press?  Does it also occurwhen you send CW from
the paddle/key? Canyou watch the RF envelope on a scope to timethe power
ramp-up?73,Mike, K8CN >*

Mike,
Thanks for that and I do understand what you say about the possibilty of
the control algorithm getting confused by the slow ramp up of power. Last
week Rob at Elecraft Support had me using a 50 ohm dummy load with the KAT3
bypassed. Set PWR to 5.0 W and hold down XMIT to TUNE, this performs a Tx
gain calibration. Then set to 11.9 W and TUNE again. My results were 5W
immediately but rising from 8.4 to 9.8 W in about 6 seconds

Rob then had me checking WMTR LP setting in CONFIG menu (TECH MD ON). This
was set to the default value of 70 which he suggested I increase . (I'm not
at all sure what this is doing). Increasing this value to the maximum of
180 gave me 10 W increasing to 12.0 W in 2 seconds, faster but still quite
a delay.

This does happen on every TUNE button press but I don't have any problem
during my daily use of the rig on CW. I have not fired up my old Tektronix
scope yet to look at the keying envelope.

Elecraft Support have gone quiet this week so no further progress.

73 and thanks for your help,
Tom G3OLB
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction

[David Gilbert]

Anybody know if they are less useless on the K4?

73,
Dave   AB7E


On 12/15/2021 8:05 AM, David Hachadorian wrote:
For 12 years I've tried to get any enhancement of s/n from the K3 
IF/RF NB and NR.  I haven't seen one case where there is any 
improvement under contest conditions.  When the s/n just starts to 
improve, the desired signal is modulated and degraded by nearby 
signals to the point where reception is better with NB/NR turned off.  
As far as I can see, both of these features are useless on the K3 
under contest conditions.


Dave Hachadorian, K6LL
Yuma, AZ


On 12/15/2021 7:36 AM, Pete Smith N4ZR wrote:
Last weekend during the 10 meter contest I was experiencing very loud 
line-noise-like interference when my antenna was pointing south. I 
tried both my K3's Noise Reduction and Noise Blanker functions, and 
was unable to find any setting that gave useful relief.  With the 
noise blanker, in particular, I noticed that when it was on, not only 
was the buzz still very strong, but it seemed as if all CW signals on 
the band were being hum-modulated.  As soon as I turned off the noise 
blanker, the CW signals cleaned up.  Is there something wrong with my 
radio, or an adjustment issue, or is this interference simply too 
strong?  Obviously, I'll be trying to track it down, but it's not 
there all the time, so that could be tough.


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction

[David Gilbert]

I applaud the persistence it must have taken you to come up with that 
procedure, but it's actually kind of amusing to think about repeatedly 
doing all of that during a contest.


73,
Dave   AB7E



On 12/15/2021 9:52 AM, Bob McGraw wrote:

The approach I use for the Noise Blanker is this.

I first activate the NB and then the Level.   I start with the DSP OFF 
and the IF OFF.  I then adjust the DSP value for optimum results 
without it destroying the quality of the signal.  DO MAKE A NOTE OF 
THIS VALUE.  Then set the DSP back to OFF.  Then move to the IF and 
scroll through the settings in an effort to find optimum results.  
Once this is done, leave the IF value as determined and return to the 
DSP and set it to the value previously determined.


This works for a given band and given type of noise.  Change bands or 
noise and do it all again.  There is no ONE setting correct for every 
condition.   Right now my 6M noise buzz is S-7 with the NB off.  Then 
turning it ON and adjusted as above the 6M noise is S-3.  That's 4 S 
units or 24 dB improvement.  I doubt you will get much better than this.


As to Noise Reduction, I find it best performs for CW mode. Again it 
takes careful adjustment to obtain optimum results.   I don't use NR 
for SSB signals. I prefer to adjust the Attenuation value and the RF 
Gain to produce optimum results when operating SSB.   I find optimum 
results occur when the no signal band noise is about 10 dB above the 
receiver noise floor.   In order to accomplish this operating point, 
one will need to use ATTENUATION and RF Gain reduction.   More gain 
won't aid in receiving weak signals, but just the opposite, as the 
signal will pop out of the noise.


I generally find using either NB or NR, but not both, is the better 
way to operate.  I doubt there is anything wrong with your radio.  
Most likely the result is more related to receiver setting parameters.


73

Bob, K4TAX


On 12/15/2021 9:46 AM, elecraft-requ...@mailman.qth.net wrote:

Message: 15
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2021 09:36:26 -0500
From: Pete Smith N4ZR
To: Elecraft List
Subject: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed

Last weekend during the 10 meter contest I was experiencing very loud
line-noise-like interference when my antenna was pointing south.? I
tried both my K3's Noise Reduction and Noise Blanker functions, and was
unable to find any setting that gave useful relief.? With the noise
blanker, in particular, I noticed that when it was on, not only was the
buzz still very strong, but it seemed as if all CW signals on the band
were being hum-modulated.? As soon as I turned off the noise blanker,
the CW signals cleaned up.? Is there something wrong with my radio, or
an adjustment issue, or is this interference simply too strong??
Obviously, I'll be trying to track it down, but it's not there all the
time, so that could be tough.

-- 73, Pete N4ZR Check out the new Reverse Beacon Network web server 
at . For spots, please use your 
favorite "retail" DX cluster. -- Message: 
16 Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2021 06:55:25 -0800 From: Dave  
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise 
Reduction Message-ID:  
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed I have that 
same issue... I have some very dirty grow lights about two blocks 
from me. They are dirty as they come... Splattering across 80-20 
meters. The K3 has never been able to adequately clean up the crud 
from them. In defense of the NB/NR on the K3, the signals are on the 
order of S7 to S9, so my expectations may be too high for the K3. I 
just hope the K4 NB/NR work better in my environment. 73, and thanks, 
Dave (NK7Z) https://www.nk7z.net ARRL Volunteer Examiner ARRL 
Technical Specialist, RFI ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical 
Resources --

Message: 17
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2021 08:05:59 -0700
From: David Hachadorian
To: Pete Smith N4ZR,    Reflector Elecraft

Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed

For 12 years I've tried to get any enhancement of s/n from the K3 IF/RF
NB and NR.? I haven't seen one case where there is any improvement under
contest conditions.? When the s/n just starts to improve, the desired
signal is modulated and degraded by nearby signals to the point where
reception is better with NB/NR turned off.? As far as I can see, both of
these features are useless on the K3 under contest conditions.

Dave Hachadorian, K6LL
Yuma, AZ





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[Elecraft] K-Line Station for Sale

[Lyn Haddock via Elecraft]

At age 80, I decided to close the mountain shack and move the an “antenna-free” 
location in the city. My much-enjoyed K-Line station is looking for a new home. 
Here is what is included…

 K3 Transceiver  s/n 6832
Single receiver
0.5, 2.8 and 6.0khz filters
No internal ATU
All K3s upgrades except for the 6/10m preamp.
 
 P3 Panadapter  s/n 2323
TX monitor with 2kw sensor
No SVGA
 
KPA500 500 Watt Amp  s/n 894
 
KAT500 500 Watt ATU  s/n 3056
 
MH2 Hand mic
 
Price for above - $3800 (plus shipping if required)

All equipment was purchased in kit form and assembled by me.

Would much prefer local pickup in central Colorado.
Would consider shipping at additional cost.

73,
Lyn - KC8I
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction

[Fred Jensen]

I find both the NB and NR on my K3 to be moderately underwhelming, not 
sure why.  Ignition noise used to predominate in urban and suburban 
areas and blankers like the one in the 75A4 were very effective.  I 
don't know what Detroit did, but I haven't heard ignition noise in 
years.  A general rule of thumb has always been to use blanking in wider 
bandwidths which sort of makes sense I guess ... the blanking pulses 
consume a smaller fraction of the overall signal passband.  My 
understanding of the K3 NR is that the DSP processor tries to build a 
matched filter around the signal on the fly.  It may be a bit too much 
for the algorithms, I've never had much success with it on broader noise 
such as power mains hash.  Backing off the RF gain seems to be more 
effective.


The best noise reduction I've ever encountered was on the receivers in 
the transportable AN/TRC-96 2.5 KW HF ISB system back in the 60's.  3 
voice channels and 16 TTY channels on the 4th.  Don't remember the mfr 
and don't know how they did it but you could literally make noise 
disappear with minimal effects on the signals.


73,

Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

Jim Brown wrote on 12/15/2021 10:16 AM:
Lots of good advice here. A major problem with the K3 NB is the way it 
is described on screen and in the manual. There are two blankers, one 
ahead of the crystal roofing filters, one after them. Each has 
multiple tweaks. In contest conditions, I've found good noise 
reduction from using the one AFTER the roofing filter, and set for the 
greatest depth and shortest time. I THINK it's called the DSP Blanker.


Yes, by their nature, NBs will modulate signals by the noise.

Let's hope the NB in the K4 is better.

73, Jim K9YC





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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction

[Jim Brown]

On 12/15/2021 10:52 AM, David Gilbert wrote:
I applaud the persistence it must have taken you to come up with that 
procedure, but it's actually kind of amusing to think about repeatedly 
doing all of that during a contest.


If you know what you're doing, it can be done in a minute or two. I 
managed to change my settings from optimized for 6M to optimized for the 
10M contest in about half a minute.


73, Jim K9YC
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction

[Nate Bargmann]

* On 2021 15 Dec 10:03 -0600, Ray wrote:
> I am Not a big fan of the K3 Noise reduction !
> NB work OK, but NR is Poor!

Sadly, I must agree and this is probably the most glaring deficiency in
an otherwise stellar radio.  Fortunately, where I live now I am able to
control the noise for the most part unless the electric fence gets an
arc and then that needs to be tracked down anyway.

I had hopes that work on improving the NR would continue but it is
apparent the K3 is now an abandoned radio in league with many others.
:-(

73, Nate, N0NB

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possible worlds.  The pessimist fears this is true."
Web: https://www.n0nb.us
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction

[Drew AF2Z]

On the K3 I use AFX BIN mode (stereo speakers) which really cuts the 
background noise to my perception.


Whatever other NR the K4 will have I hope there is an AFX binaural mode 
also.


73,
Drew
AF2Z



On 12/15/21 15:11, Nate Bargmann wrote:

* On 2021 15 Dec 10:03 -0600, Ray wrote:

I am Not a big fan of the K3 Noise reduction !
NB work OK, but NR is Poor!


Sadly, I must agree and this is probably the most glaring deficiency in
an otherwise stellar radio.  Fortunately, where I live now I am able to
control the noise for the most part unless the electric fence gets an
arc and then that needs to be tracked down anyway.

I had hopes that work on improving the NR would continue but it is
apparent the K3 is now an abandoned radio in league with many others.
:-(

73, Nate, N0NB


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[Elecraft] LPA Mod for K3/K3S

[Roy Morris, Jr. via Elecraft]

I would like to see how these diodes are placed on the LPA board.  Thanks for 
any info on this.  Roy Morris  W4WFB
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Re: [Elecraft] KAT500 Attenuator

[Al Lorona]

 Have we, in fact, established that this attenuator is enabled at any point of 
the tune cycle? Because if not, then we're all spun up for nothing.
Is it reasonable to believe that the attenuator was one of those design 
elements that might have been deemed necessary at one time but then the 
designers changed their mind for the finished product?  I think so. The 
mysterious R7 may have been left off of the final circuit board precisely to 
cause such a bad mismatch that it would be obvious to operator, software, or 
both, and so that corrective action could be taken.
Al  W6LX/4




   
  
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction

[john]

I have contested from several locations with noise issues and I have also
not been able to find a NB/NR setting on my K3S that offers any improvement.

John KK9A


David Hachadorian  k6ll wrote:

For 12 years I've tried to get any enhancement of s/n from the K3 IF/RF 
NB and NR.  I haven't seen one case where there is any improvement under 
contest conditions.  When the s/n just starts to improve, the desired 
signal is modulated and degraded by nearby signals to the point where 
reception is better with NB/NR turned off.  As far as I can see, both of 
these features are useless on the K3 under contest conditions.

Dave Hachadorian, K6LL
Yuma, AZ

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Re: [Elecraft] LPA Mod for K3/K3S

[ks4v]

Try this
 Original message From: "Roy Morris, Jr. via Elecraft" 
 Date: 12/15/21  4:41 PM  (GMT-06:00) To: Elecraft 
Reflector  Subject: [Elecraft] LPA Mod for K3/K3S I 
would like to see how these diodes are placed on the LPA board.  Thanks for any 
info on this.  Roy Morris  
W4WFB__Elecraft 
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Re: [Elecraft] KAT500 Attenuator

[Andy Durbin]

" Have we, in fact, established that this attenuator is enabled at any point of 
the tune cycle? Because if not, then we're all spun up for nothing."

KAT500 Serial Command Reference Revised 8/18/2021 firmware version 02.00 says:

"ATTN Enable Attenuator GET format: ATTN; SET/RESPONSE format: ATTN0; 
(disabled) or ATTN1; (enabled). Selects relay K22, which switches in an 
attenuator resistor. It may take a few milliseconds after issuing an ATTNx; 
setter before the relay changes. Firmware releases the attenuator if it detects 
power high enough to damage to the attenuator. Firmware normally inserts the 
attenuator during “full search tune” to present a more consistent load to a 
transceiver during tune operations. The attenuator is disabled if the tune 
power is too low with the attenuator in place."

This version was released so the document was compatible with firmware 2.05 
changes.

As I have said earlier in this thread I see no evidence that ATTN changes state 
during a "full search tune".

We are left with an attenuator design change that no one seems to understand 
and documentation that may not be correct.  Whether that is "spun up for 
nothing" probably depends on one's perspective.

Andy, k3wyc



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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Reduction

[Victor Rosenthal]

I agree. I once suggested to Wayne that Elecraft charge something for
feature upgrades after a certain point in order to provide a revenue stream
to justify them. I received a chewing out unmatched since I got caught
driving a jeep without a helmet. This is not part of the Elecraft
philosophy.
As a result, like all the other manufacturers, there comes a time when the
answer has to be "buy a K4."

Victor 4X6GP

On Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 22:13 Nate Bargmann  wrote:

> * On 2021 15 Dec 10:03 -0600, Ray wrote:
> > I am Not a big fan of the K3 Noise reduction !
> > NB work OK, but NR is Poor!
>
> Sadly, I must agree and this is probably the most glaring deficiency in
> an otherwise stellar radio.  Fortunately, where I live now I am able to
> control the noise for the most part unless the electric fence gets an
> arc and then that needs to be tracked down anyway.
>
> I had hopes that work on improving the NR would continue but it is
> apparent the K3 is now an abandoned radio in league with many others.
> :-(
>
> 73, Nate, N0NB
>
> --
> "The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of all
> possible worlds.  The pessimist fears this is true."
> Web: https://www.n0nb.us
> Projects: https://github.com/N0NB
> GPG fingerprint: 82D6 4F6B 0E67 CD41 F689 BBA6 FB2C 5130 D55A 8819
>
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