Re: [Elecraft] Birdies

[Wilson Lamb via Elecraft]

Thanks, Wayne. 
I'm glad they are normal. 
They have never caused a problem. 
WL 
    

-Original Message-

  
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] Birdies

[Wayne Burdick]

Hi Wilson,

What bands and frequencies?

Virtually all high-dynamic-range superhets have some birdies. These are usually 
caused by high-order mixer products interacting with the VFO, BFO, etc. We went 
to some lengths to minimize them, e.g. by using a balanced low-pass filter in 
the mixer's commutating path. But there will still be a few, typically on the 
highest bands (10 and 6 m).

Some birdies can be substantially suppressed on a per-band basis using a 
built-in spur-avoidance tool in the CONFIG menu. See the "SIG RMV" menu entry 
description in the owner's manual. 

73,
Wayne
N6KR



> On Jul 1, 2022, at 11:23 AM, Wilson Lamb via Elecraft 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> I've meant  for years to ask about the birdies I hear from my K3. 
> At many frequencies across HF, I hear obviously internally generated birdies. 
> They are very narrow and quite strong. 
> I've noticed recently that I can cause them to occur by setting the high and 
> low ends of the filter to overlap (zero or negative bandwidth), but there are 
> still come heard with normal settings. 
> I see this regularly, on two K3, so feel it must be something experts know 
> about? 
> Thanks, 
> WL 
>  
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

[Elecraft] Birdies

[Wilson Lamb via Elecraft]

I've meant  for years to ask about the birdies I hear from my K3. 
At many frequencies across HF, I hear obviously internally generated birdies. 
They are very narrow and quite strong. 
I've noticed recently that I can cause them to occur by setting the high and 
low ends of the filter to overlap (zero or negative bandwidth), but there are 
still come heard with normal settings. 
I see this regularly, on two K3, so feel it must be something experts know 
about? 
Thanks, 
WL 
 
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] Birdies

[GRANT YOUNGMAN]

I might fiddle some more with cable placement.  I also plan to clear all of the 
signal removal data and just rework it.

I had the birdies cleaned up with the removal tool in most areas of the bands I 
operate.  But since relocating the middle of last year into an “antenna free” 
zone, I’ve been primarily using my KX3 with various temporary and stealth 
antennas.  Had the K3 out the past couple of weeks to put a couple of updates 
in, and while tuning around to make sure everything was working again, really 
noticed them.  Most likely I didn’t get the various cables back in the same 
place they were the last time I had the radio torn down, and that affected the 
previous removal settings.

As someone suggested, it might be external signals, but they move backwards 
like a birdie and don’t show up on the KX3, so it isn’t likely.  It didn’t help 
either that at least part of the time, I had no antenna connected, which made 
even the weak ones that normally get buried in band noise stick out … :-)


> 
> The firmware birdie removal took care of every bothersome birdie (and I am a 
> stickler about weak signal performance) except for one that was still an S2 
> or so ... and that was in a portion of the band that I don't care much about.
> 
> I did play around quite a bit with cable placement (see humorous note below) 
> to prior to using the firmware fix, and didn't necessarily find the best 
> arrangement to be the ones that Elecraft recommends.  By the way, the best 
> layout is quite dependent upon whether or not you have the 2nd receiver 
> installed.
> 

Grant NQ5T
K3 #2091, KX3 #8342



__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com

Re: [Elecraft] Birdies

[David Gilbert]

The firmware birdie removal took care of every bothersome birdie (and I 
am a stickler about weak signal performance) except for one that was 
still an S2 or so ... and that was in a portion of the band that I don't 
care much about.


I did play around quite a bit with cable placement (see humorous note 
below) to prior to using the firmware fix, and didn't necessarily find 
the best arrangement to be the ones that Elecraft recommends.  By the 
way, the best layout is quite dependent upon whether or not you have the 
2nd receiver installed.


Of course the firmware birdie removal won't remove them from the 
panadapter ... don't know why you'd think it would.  If you read the 
description of how it works it simply shifts them out of the normal 
listening passband, but they will still be in the IF window.


Dave   AB7E

Note:  Prior to the firmware fix, I tried all sorts of things to reduce 
the birdies.  Once I got the cable placement as best I could, I even cut 
up sheets of carbon impregnated foam, put them inside of plastic 
sandwich bags, and stuffed the K3 with them to hopefully absorb some of 
the coupled energy between cables and various metal parts.  It was a 
total waste of time.  ;)




On 3/8/2017 7:30 PM, ab2tc wrote:

Hi,

Can you give me a list (frequencies) of your worst birdies and I will check
if I have them. In general I have not found many bothersome birdies in the
K3S, but there are some. If I don't have them, there is clearly something
wrong with your radio which may warrant a return to Elecraft. BTW, I don't
have much faith in firmware birdie removal. It certainly doesn't remove
birdies in the panadapter display (LP-Pan and NaP3 in my case).

AB2TC - Knut


Grant Youngman-2 wrote

I LOVE my K3 … It’s the best radio I’ve owned (and I’ve owned
many/most/all of the very best)., except on AM where my old Orion/Orion II
(the ones I sold to buy the K3) were much better … but that’s a different
issue.  (And E’craft won’t “formally" deal with it).   Everything else
about the K3 is FAR superior.
  
After, I don’t know 8-9 years of ownership ..  ALL (and I do mean ALL)

hardware/software updates have been applied, including the new K3S boards
that have been made available.  So it’s as up to date as possible.
Still — the age old issue of “birdies” has been an elusive problem to
solve.

Just for the record .. I have 2x KYSYN3A’s installed, a subreciever, and
the other usual updated stuff.  I’ve fiddled for hours with the birdie
removal routines in firmware.  And yet — they’re everywhere.  Most are low
enough in signal strength to ignore — but there are many LOUD ones here
and there on 80/4020/and elsewhere that are just “there”.  Nothing really
helps.  I just spent an evening fiddling with cable placement AGAIN, to no
avail.

I’ve followed carefully all of the cable routing instructions provided by
Elecraft.  To no real effect.

So my question is — has anyone found a SOLUTION??  I’m considering sending
my radio to CA, but I'm concerned that after spending the $$$ to do that I
won’t be any better off.

To be clear — this isn’t a deal killer by any stretch  … just looking for
input.

Grant NQ5T
K3 #2091, KX3 #8342






--
View this message in context: 
http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Birdies-tp7627796p7627797.html
Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to xda...@cis-broadband.com


__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com

Re: [Elecraft] Birdies

[Ken G Kopp]

Obvious questions 

Do the birdies (mostly) go away when the antenna is disconnected?  Could
they be coming from in-house sources?

Are they there when the receiver is operated (on a battery) away from
potential sources?

73!

K0PP

On Mar 8, 2017 18:38, "GRANT YOUNGMAN"  wrote:

> I LOVE my K3 … It’s the best radio I’ve owned (and I’ve owned
> many/most/all of the very best)., except on AM where my old Orion/Orion II
> (the ones I sold to buy the K3) were much better … but that’s a different
> issue.  (And E’craft won’t “formally" deal with it).   Everything else
> about the K3 is FAR superior.
>
> After, I don’t know 8-9 years of ownership ..  ALL (and I do mean ALL)
> hardware/software updates have been applied, including the new K3S boards
> that have been made available.  So it’s as up to date as possible.
> Still — the age old issue of “birdies” has been an elusive problem to
> solve.
>
> Just for the record .. I have 2x KYSYN3A’s installed, a subreciever, and
> the other usual updated stuff.  I’ve fiddled for hours with the birdie
> removal routines in firmware.  And yet — they’re everywhere.  Most are low
> enough in signal strength to ignore — but there are many LOUD ones here and
> there on 80/4020/and elsewhere that are just “there”.  Nothing really
> helps.  I just spent an evening fiddling with cable placement AGAIN, to no
> avail.
>
> I’ve followed carefully all of the cable routing instructions provided by
> Elecraft.  To no real effect.
>
> So my question is — has anyone found a SOLUTION??  I’m considering sending
> my radio to CA, but I'm concerned that after spending the $$$ to do that I
> won’t be any better off.
>
> To be clear — this isn’t a deal killer by any stretch  … just looking for
> input.
>
> Grant NQ5T
> K3 #2091, KX3 #8342
>
>
>
> __
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to kengk...@gmail.com
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com

Re: [Elecraft] Birdies

[ab2tc]

Hi,

Can you give me a list (frequencies) of your worst birdies and I will check
if I have them. In general I have not found many bothersome birdies in the
K3S, but there are some. If I don't have them, there is clearly something
wrong with your radio which may warrant a return to Elecraft. BTW, I don't
have much faith in firmware birdie removal. It certainly doesn't remove
birdies in the panadapter display (LP-Pan and NaP3 in my case).

AB2TC - Knut


Grant Youngman-2 wrote
> I LOVE my K3 … It’s the best radio I’ve owned (and I’ve owned
> many/most/all of the very best)., except on AM where my old Orion/Orion II
> (the ones I sold to buy the K3) were much better … but that’s a different
> issue.  (And E’craft won’t “formally" deal with it).   Everything else
> about the K3 is FAR superior.
>  
> After, I don’t know 8-9 years of ownership ..  ALL (and I do mean ALL)
> hardware/software updates have been applied, including the new K3S boards
> that have been made available.  So it’s as up to date as possible.  
> Still — the age old issue of “birdies” has been an elusive problem to
> solve.
> 
> Just for the record .. I have 2x KYSYN3A’s installed, a subreciever, and
> the other usual updated stuff.  I’ve fiddled for hours with the birdie
> removal routines in firmware.  And yet — they’re everywhere.  Most are low
> enough in signal strength to ignore — but there are many LOUD ones here
> and there on 80/4020/and elsewhere that are just “there”.  Nothing really
> helps.  I just spent an evening fiddling with cable placement AGAIN, to no
> avail.
> 
> I’ve followed carefully all of the cable routing instructions provided by
> Elecraft.  To no real effect.
> 
> So my question is — has anyone found a SOLUTION??  I’m considering sending
> my radio to CA, but I'm concerned that after spending the $$$ to do that I
> won’t be any better off.
> 
> To be clear — this isn’t a deal killer by any stretch  … just looking for
> input.
> 
> Grant NQ5T
> K3 #2091, KX3 #8342
> 





--
View this message in context: 
http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Birdies-tp7627796p7627797.html
Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com

[Elecraft] Birdies

[GRANT YOUNGMAN]

I LOVE my K3 … It’s the best radio I’ve owned (and I’ve owned many/most/all of 
the very best)., except on AM where my old Orion/Orion II (the ones I sold to 
buy the K3) were much better … but that’s a different issue.  (And E’craft 
won’t “formally" deal with it).   Everything else about the K3 is FAR superior.
 
After, I don’t know 8-9 years of ownership ..  ALL (and I do mean ALL) 
hardware/software updates have been applied, including the new K3S boards that 
have been made available.  So it’s as up to date as possible.  
Still — the age old issue of “birdies” has been an elusive problem to solve.

Just for the record .. I have 2x KYSYN3A’s installed, a subreciever, and the 
other usual updated stuff.  I’ve fiddled for hours with the birdie removal 
routines in firmware.  And yet — they’re everywhere.  Most are low enough in 
signal strength to ignore — but there are many LOUD ones here and there on 
80/4020/and elsewhere that are just “there”.  Nothing really helps.  I just 
spent an evening fiddling with cable placement AGAIN, to no avail.

I’ve followed carefully all of the cable routing instructions provided by 
Elecraft.  To no real effect.

So my question is — has anyone found a SOLUTION??  I’m considering sending my 
radio to CA, but I'm concerned that after spending the $$$ to do that I won’t 
be any better off.

To be clear — this isn’t a deal killer by any stretch  … just looking for input.

Grant NQ5T
K3 #2091, KX3 #8342



__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com

[Elecraft] Birdies If Backlight off

[hb9trt]

Hi

I found some birdies in the KX3 on the 20m band which are only there if the
backlight is of. If I turn the backlight on, the birdies are gone. I think
10 ore more can be found and all disappeared if the backlight is on. Maybe
there are also birdies corresponding to the same effect on other bands. I
don't tried it yet. 
Does anyone have an idea why. I wondering about that, normally I expect such
effects if the backlight is on not off

vy 73
Reto/hb9trt



--
View this message in context: 
http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Birdies-If-Backlight-off-tp7559923.html
Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[Elecraft] Birdies

[Max Kempson]

When I was involved with development of military radios we used IGUS or
internally generated unwanted signals. That says it all.

73

Max ZL4VV

__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Re: [Elecraft] birdies on 20m/ K2

[Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy]

John,

It is possible to get rid of the K2's birdies, but unfortunately in most 
cases it requires some delicate surgery to get rid of each birdie *after* 
one has determined why it exists.

I do not have here in Scotland the notes that I made when getting rid of my 
K2/100's birdies, so I am not certain whether or not I found birdies around 
14.168 MHz and 14.222 MHz. Not all K2s are equal when it comes to birdies.

If you have not solved your birdie problem in the meantime, I will be 
leaving Scotland to return to Luxembourg in late July 2011 at which time I 
will have my birdie notes again, and I might be able to help you then.

If this is of any interest to you, could you please let me know.

73,
Geoff
GM4ESD


On April 01, 2011 9:34 PM, John Cooper WT5Y wrote:

 I have an annoying birdie around 14.168 and 14.222 on the K2.  anyway to 
 move or get rid of these?

 wt5y


__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[Elecraft] birdies on 20m/ K2

[John Cooper]

I have an annoying birdie around 14.168 and 14.222 on the K2.  anyway to move 
or get rid of these?

wt5y
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[Elecraft] Birdies

[bruce whitney]

I have strong birdies at 3.507 and 3.517 - with my factory assembled K3 S#2474 
firm#2.78.
Some time ago I heard there is a firmware fix for eliminating them through some 
procedure to identify them and put in some sort of IF shift procedure - they 
are still there but it makes them go away as far as the operator is concerned. 
Any help?
Bruce W8RA
 
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Re: [Elecraft] Birdies

[Iain MacDonnell - N6ML]

bruce whitney wrote:
 I have strong birdies at 3.507 and 3.517 - with my factory assembled K3 
 S#2474 firm#2.78.
 Some time ago I heard there is a firmware fix for eliminating them through 
 some procedure to identify them and put in some sort of IF shift procedure - 
 they are still there but it makes them go away as far as the operator is 
 concerned. Any help?

Go to:

http://n2.nabble.com/Elecraft-f365791.html

and search for birdie removal firmware - one of the first page of
matches is the announcement of 3.03 firmware, where this feature
was first included, with notes on how to use it.

http://n2.nabble.com/K3-Firmware-rev.-3.03%3A-SUB-RX-band-independence%2C-new-AGC-features%2C-multiple-ATU-settings-per-band%2C-etc.-td2493880.html#a2493880

 ~Iain / N6ML
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Re: [Elecraft] Birdies

[Dick Dievendorff]

The spurious signal removal procedure was introduced in MCU revision 3.03
and is in all later versions.

See http://www.elecraft.com/K3/k3_beta_release_instructions.htm for a
description of how to install beta firmware.

Dick, K6KR


-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of bruce whitney
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2009 5:41 PM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: [Elecraft] Birdies


I have strong birdies at 3.507 and 3.517 - with my factory assembled K3
S#2474 firm#2.78.
Some time ago I heard there is a firmware fix for eliminating them through
some procedure to identify them and put in some sort of IF shift procedure -
they are still there but it makes them go away as far as the operator is
concerned. Any help?
Bruce W8RA
 
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Re: [Elecraft] Birdies

[S55M]

Hello Chris!

I think that birdies are normal behavior of K2 (nonexisting shielding inside
K2 between different modules).
Some of them can be resolved , some of them will stay but You can live with
them and still have nice rig.
When You'll attach the antenna almost all birdies will be coverd by antenna
noise...
It also depends of Your configuration of K2. If You have 100W amp or not,
KIO2 or not ecc...

And for most of the birdies there is no simple solution :(

73's

S55M-Adi

___
Elecraft mailing list
Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
 http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft

Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com

Re: [Elecraft] Birdies

[Vic K2VCO]

Hans-Christoph Scheiblberger wrote:


My rig seems to have quite a few birdies


I have been struggling with them for some time, and have had the able 
help of Geoff, GM4ESD, who has done various experiments and analyses.


The worst ones seem to be related to the bias oscillator in the KPA100 
(note that this oscillator runs at all times when the KPA100 is 
installed, whether or not the power is over 10 watts).  The oscillator 
crystal was originally 16.xxx MHz and in newer KPA100s or those with the 
mod kit installed, 18.xxx MHz.  The birdies are the result of harmonics 
of the oscillator mixing with harmonics of other oscillators in the K2. 
 For example, I have one at 28.018 Mhz which results from (5 x 23.105) 
- (6 x 18.434) = 4.9 Mhz. approximately.   The 18.434 is the bias 
oscillator and the 23.105 Mhz is the VCO when the K2 is tuned to 28.018.


Note that the mixing takes place at VHF, so it's quite hard to get a 
good ground point for bypassing and shielding purposes.  Some of the 
following may help a little with some birdies:


1) Adding additional filtering to the output of the bias oscillator, 
where it feeds the pin diode switch and where it goes to the RS232 chip. 
  I used 10 uh chokes and 0.001 uf capacitors.


2) Putting a the ribbon cable from the amplifier through a ferrite toroid.

3) Replacing the traces that carry the speaker lines across the KPA 
board with a length of RG/174 coax that is grounded only at the K2 RF board.


I was able to reduce my 28 MHz birdie from S7/S8 to S2/S3.  Still loud 
enough to hear quite well with the antenna on.


I went so far as to install a shield over the top of the K2 RF board. 
It didn't seem to help with the 28 MHz birdie.  You can see it as well 
as the toroid on the ribbon cable and the coax to the speaker at
http://www.qsl.net/k2vco/k2shield.jpg.  I left it in place because who 
knows what other spurs it may reduce!


--
73,
Vic, K2VCO
Fresno CA
http://www.qsl.net/k2vco
___
Elecraft mailing list
Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft


Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com

[Elecraft] Birdies

[Randy Johnson]

I have had trouble with annoying “birdies,” notably at 14014 and 14029.  I 
hope my experience in chasing these down helps someone else with a similar 
problem.




I finally traced this to an interaction between the cable modem for my high 
speed cable Internet access and the network card on my computer.  When I cut 
power to the modem, the birdie would stop.  When I unplugged the CAT 5 cable 
at the computer, the birdie stopped.  When plugged in and when I cut power 
to the computer, it was still there because when a computer is “off,” not 
all circuits are off, and whatever the reason the birdies were still there. 
I tried switching to DSL as provided by the local phone company but the 
problem was still there.




It may well be that there are more expensive network cards that would not 
have this interaction but I did not want to fool around with them. I had 
noted that I did not have birdies while using a laptop in the shack.  So I 
tried a cheap wireless card, similar in function to the ones used with 
laptops except that you plug it in to one of the slots on your PC.  The 
birdies went away but the thing was incredibly slow, worse than a 56K modem. 
So I bought a more expensive Linksys wireless card with a “speed 
accelerator.”  No more birdies and the Internet speed is consistent with 
high speed access. I should point out that the literature provided with this 
card says that the accelerator works only with machines running Windows XP.




Randy W6SJ.

___
Elecraft mailing list
Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft


Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com

Re: [Elecraft] Birdies

[Trev - K6ESE]

Randy,

Did you try using shielded twisted pair CAT5E or CAT6 cable? This solved it 
for me. Just an idea...


73 Trev - K6ESE
- Original Message - 
From: Randy Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 3:03 PM
Subject: [Elecraft] Birdies


I have had trouble with annoying “birdies,” notably at 14014 and 14029.  I 
hope my experience in chasing these down helps someone else with a similar 
problem.




I finally traced this to an interaction between the cable modem for my 
high speed cable Internet access and the network card on my computer. 
When I cut power to the modem, the birdie would stop.  When I unplugged 
the CAT 5 cable at the computer, the birdie stopped.  When plugged in and 
when I cut power to the computer, it was still there because when a 
computer is “off,” not all circuits are off, and whatever the reason the 
birdies were still there. I tried switching to DSL as provided by the 
local phone company but the problem was still there.




It may well be that there are more expensive network cards that would not 
have this interaction but I did not want to fool around with them. I had 
noted that I did not have birdies while using a laptop in the shack.  So I 
tried a cheap wireless card, similar in function to the ones used with 
laptops except that you plug it in to one of the slots on your PC.  The 
birdies went away but the thing was incredibly slow, worse than a 56K 
modem. So I bought a more expensive Linksys wireless card with a “speed 
accelerator.”  No more birdies and the Internet speed is consistent with 
high speed access. I should point out that the literature provided with 
this card says that the accelerator works only with machines running 
Windows XP.




Randy W6SJ.

___
Elecraft mailing list
Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com 


___
Elecraft mailing list
Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft


Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com

[Elecraft] Birdies on 20m

[Michael van Hauten]

Hello all,
my new k2 (4691)is ready and i had some qso,s with it. I have some 
birdies on the 20m-band, at 14030, 14151, 14211, 14272 and a very strong 
with s6 at 14363 .

What is to do, to avoid them or to bring them in a range  out of band?
Thanks for your ideas!

Michael, DC0ZO
___
Elecraft mailing list
Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft


Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com

Re: [Elecraft] Birdies on 20m

[Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy]

Hello Michael,

Because the QRN here is very low, I use the preamp most of the time on 40m
when DXing, birdies are important to me, and for some time I have been on
a Birdy Hunt.

If all the oscillators in K2 are working well and on their correct
frequencies, it is not possible to move a birdy (in frequency) because the
IF of the K2's receiver is fixed at say 4915kHz. Although there are others,
the three major causes of a a birdy are when one or several of the
oscillators, fundamentals and / or harmonics combine to produce a signal at
1) The receiver's tuned frequency 2) At a spurious response frequency of the
receiver (the so-called image is only one of these, there are many more) and
3) At the IF.  I shall not complicate things by bringing in the isolation
between mixer ports or re-mixing.

In cases 2 and 3, IF the birdy signal gets in near the antenna connection,
then the selectivity of the RF tuned circuits usually, but not always, helps
to make the birdy weaker. IF the birdy gets in after the tuned circuits, say
near the mixer input, then in most cases the tuned circuits will not help to
make the birdy weaker. And I have found that many birdies ARE getting in
after the tuned circuits, in the area of relays K16 and K17 on the RF board.
Some of these birdies are created by a combination of three oscillators (or
their harmonics) falling on a spurious response. So life is hard!

Although I had started to re-engineer this area, I cannot give you any
cures at this time because of an accident and I am walking like a donkey on
four legs ! And the job will be difficult. And to be sure, when that is
fixed another problem will appear.

It interests me that apart from Grobmutter at 14.363, I can only just hear
your other birdies but have others. I have suspected for some time that the
mechanical construction of K2 might be playing in the birdy game.

My apology for a long story, but I would suggest that you avoid your birdies
for now.

73,
Geoff.
GM4ESD


- Original Message -
From: Michael van Hauten [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Sent: Sunday, February 27, 2005 7:53 PM
Subject: [Elecraft] Birdies on 20m


 Hello all,
 my new k2 (4691)is ready and i had some qso,s with it. I have some
 birdies on the 20m-band, at 14030, 14151, 14211, 14272 and a very strong
 with s6 at 14363 .
 What is to do, to avoid them or to bring them in a range  out of band?
 Thanks for your ideas!

 Michael, DC0ZO


___
Elecraft mailing list
Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
 http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft

Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com

Re: [Elecraft] Birdies on 20m

[Darrell Bellerive]

Geoff,

Are you proposing that some birdies may be caused by construction methods? If 
so, what techniques will reduce or eliminate birdies. Are there specific 
components that should be physically mounted in certain positions, either 
close to or spaced at a specific distance from the circuit board or other 
components? Rather than simply placing a component into the circuit board 
holes and soldering, should we be placing certain components into specific 
positions relative to the circuit board and other adjacent components?

As I am planning on building another K2, and am a perfectionist by nature, I 
would like to be sure that my construction is maximizing performance, and 
minimizing adverse effects such as birdies.

Darrell


On February 27, 2005 10:02 pm, Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy wrote:
I have suspected for some time that the
mechanical construction of K2 might be playing in the birdy game.
 73,
 Geoff.
 GM4ESD

-- 
Darrell Bellerive
Amateur Radio Stations: VA7TO, VE7CLA
Grand Forks, British Columbia, Canada
___
Elecraft mailing list
Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
 http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft

Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com