Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

[Augie "Gus" Hansen]

I don't understand this Joe. The KPA500 has an internal PS. A separate 
Astron PS serves no purpose for the amp. Do you mean both the amp and 
the rig+PS are on the same circuit?


Gus Hansen
KB0YH


On 3/29/2018 6:47 PM, Joe K2UF wrote:

  I have been using my KPA500 for over 7 years using an Astron 35amp supply
on 115v .  I use it mostly for chasing DX and contesting on CW.  I regularly
push it up to 650 to 700 watts.  No problems.


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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

[Bill Johnson]

Never in a flash.  Super quality and operation.  Proof you get Elecraft and 
what you pay for!!! 

73,
Bill
K9YEQ

-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net <elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net> On 
Behalf Of Dennis Haarsager
Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2018 1:18 AM
To: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

I am ready to order a KPA500 and wonder if anyone out there has regretted 
operating one from 115-volt service. 

Thanks and 73,
Dennis, at the moment CT9/N7DH

Sent from my iPhone
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

[Joe K2UF]

 I have been using my KPA500 for over 7 years using an Astron 35amp supply
on 115v .  I use it mostly for chasing DX and contesting on CW.  I regularly
push it up to 650 to 700 watts.  No problems.

Good luck es 73

Joe K2UF

-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Brian F. Wruble
Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2018 8:38 PM
To: Dennis Haarsager
Cc: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

I use 115.  Works fine. It is a very robust device.  73 de Brian W3BW

On Thu, Mar 29, 2018 at 2:19 AM Dennis Haarsager <haarsa...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> I am ready to order a KPA500 and wonder if anyone out there has 
> regretted operating one from 115-volt service.
>
> Thanks and 73,
> Dennis, at the moment CT9/N7DH
>
> Sent from my iPhone
> __
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-- 

   *Brian F. Wruble, C.F.A.
The Conch Republic
"We seceded where others failed."
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

[Brian F. Wruble]

I use 115.  Works fine. It is a very robust device.  73 de Brian W3BW

On Thu, Mar 29, 2018 at 2:19 AM Dennis Haarsager 
wrote:

> I am ready to order a KPA500 and wonder if anyone out there has regretted
> operating one from 115-volt service.
>
> Thanks and 73,
> Dennis, at the moment CT9/N7DH
>
> Sent from my iPhone
> __
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-- 

   *Brian F. Wruble, C.F.A.
The Conch Republic
"We seceded where others failed."
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

[Jim Brown]

On 3/29/2018 5:03 AM, David Bunte wrote:

I have operated mine from my 120 volt service in my shack for years with no
issues at all. Most folks I have talked to about it do as well. One friend
used his on 240 and I could detect no difference in performance.


I run mine on 240V in the shack and on 120V in W6GJB's contesting 
trailer when we're running on a Honda generator.


The only potential issue with 120V operation is excessive voltage drop 
in a long and undersized run from the breaker panel to the outlet where 
the KPA500 is plugged in. This can be partially compensated by changing 
the transformer tap, as detailed in the manual. It's pretty simple -- 
remove the top cover, change the tap, and close the cover.


73, Jim K9YC

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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

[hawley, charles j jr]

I did until I got the 240 vac cord and it worked the same on 240 vac as on 120 
vac regarding PA voltage drop with key down. So I think it's fine on the 120 
vac.

Chuck Hawley
 c-haw...@illinois.edu

 Amateur Radio, KE9UW
 aka Jack, BMW Motorcycles

From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] on 
behalf of Dennis Haarsager [haarsa...@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2018 1:17 AM
To: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

I am ready to order a KPA500 and wonder if anyone out there has regretted 
operating one from 115-volt service.

Thanks and 73,
Dennis, at the moment CT9/N7DH

Sent from my iPhone
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

[donovanf]

U.S. electrical utilities comply with ANSI C84.1-2011 which specifies 
a steady state service voltage of 120/240 volts +/- 5% measured at 
the point (typically the meter) where the electric systems of the 
supplier and the user are connected. 


Excursions of limited extent, frequency and duration to 110-127 
volts are acceptable. Momentary transient under and over voltage 
excursions well outside this range are allowed. 


NEMA -- the National Electrical Manufacturers Association -- 
recommends that all electrical appliances and motors operate at 
120 volts +/- 10% although not necessarily at an optimal condition 
beyond +/- 5% 


73 
Frank 
W3LPL 

- Original Message -

From: "Joe Subich, W4TV" <li...@subich.com> 
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net 
Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2018 1:40:55 PM 
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply 


> (not sure why we call it 220, 'cuz i think it's actually 230v) 

Because the original standard was 110/220V ... as power consumption has 
increased and distribution utilities have attempted to reduce losses it 
crept up to 112/224, then 115/230, 117/234 and now runs 120/240 in many 
locations. 

73, 

... Joe, W4TV 


On 3/29/2018 9:19 AM, Chris Hallinan wrote: 
> As others have commented, the amp works just fine on 110v. In my case, 
> every dit and dah resulted in a slight but noticeable dimming of the lights 
> in my shack and an adjoining room. After putting in a dedicated 220V 
> circuit, (not sure why we call it 220, 'cuz i think it's actually 230v) no 
> dimming at all, and no complaints from the better half! ;) 
> 
> 73 de K1AY 
> Chris 
> 
> On Thu, Mar 29, 2018 at 2:17 AM, Dennis Haarsager <haarsa...@gmail.com> 
> wrote: 
> 
>> I am ready to order a KPA500 and wonder if anyone out there has regretted 
>> operating one from 115-volt service. 
>> 
>> Thanks and 73, 
>> Dennis, at the moment CT9/N7DH 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone 
>> __ 
>> Elecraft mailing list 
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft 
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm 
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>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net 
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html 
>> Message delivered to challi...@gmail.com 
>> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

[Buck]

It depends on what else is on your circuit.  If you  have a 15 amp 
circuit and you are already running two lamps, the rig, a computer and 
monitor, and a bunch of other accessories, you may exceed the circuit 
rating when you key down.  Add up everything that is fed off the same 
circuit (not just the outlet).


Buck, k4ia
Honor Roll
8BDXCC
EasyWayHamBooks.com

On 3/29/2018 9:50 AM, AB4IQ wrote:

No problems here.  I ran out of 110 outlets and had the 230VAC outlet empty and 
just changed the KPA500 to 230VAC from 120VAC and noticed no differences.

Ed.. AB4IQ

-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net 
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Wes Stewart
Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2018 7:41 AM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

Not a problem.

Wes  N7WS

On 3/28/2018 11:17 PM, Dennis Haarsager wrote:

I am ready to order a KPA500 and wonder if anyone out there has regretted 
operating one from 115-volt service.

Thanks and 73,
Dennis, at the moment CT9/N7DH



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[Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

[James F. Boehner MD via Elecraft]

Absolutely no regrets.  The Amp works just fine on 115 V service without so
much as a dimming light on the same circuit.

'73 de JIM N2ZZ


-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Dennis Haarsager
Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2018 2:18 AM
To: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

I am ready to order a KPA500 and wonder if anyone out there has regretted
operating one from 115-volt service. 

Thanks and 73,
Dennis, at the moment CT9/N7DH

Sent from my iPhone
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

[AB4IQ]

No problems here.  I ran out of 110 outlets and had the 230VAC outlet empty and 
just changed the KPA500 to 230VAC from 120VAC and noticed no differences.

Ed.. AB4IQ

-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net 
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Wes Stewart
Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2018 7:41 AM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

Not a problem.

Wes  N7WS

On 3/28/2018 11:17 PM, Dennis Haarsager wrote:
> I am ready to order a KPA500 and wonder if anyone out there has regretted 
> operating one from 115-volt service.
>
> Thanks and 73,
> Dennis, at the moment CT9/N7DH
>

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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

[Joe Subich, W4TV]

> (not sure why we call it 220, 'cuz i think it's actually 230v)

Because the original standard was 110/220V ... as power consumption has
increased and distribution utilities have attempted to reduce losses it
crept up to 112/224, then 115/230, 117/234 and now runs 120/240 in many
locations.

73,

   ... Joe, W4TV


On 3/29/2018 9:19 AM, Chris Hallinan wrote:

As others have commented, the amp works just fine on 110v.  In my case,
every dit and dah resulted in a slight but noticeable dimming of the lights
in my shack and an adjoining room.  After putting in a dedicated 220V
circuit, (not sure why we call it 220, 'cuz i think it's actually 230v) no
dimming at all, and no complaints from the better half! ;)

73 de K1AY
Chris

On Thu, Mar 29, 2018 at 2:17 AM, Dennis Haarsager 
wrote:


I am ready to order a KPA500 and wonder if anyone out there has regretted
operating one from 115-volt service.

Thanks and 73,
Dennis, at the moment CT9/N7DH

Sent from my iPhone
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

[Chris Hallinan]

As others have commented, the amp works just fine on 110v.  In my case,
every dit and dah resulted in a slight but noticeable dimming of the lights
in my shack and an adjoining room.  After putting in a dedicated 220V
circuit, (not sure why we call it 220, 'cuz i think it's actually 230v) no
dimming at all, and no complaints from the better half! ;)

73 de K1AY
Chris

On Thu, Mar 29, 2018 at 2:17 AM, Dennis Haarsager 
wrote:

> I am ready to order a KPA500 and wonder if anyone out there has regretted
> operating one from 115-volt service.
>
> Thanks and 73,
> Dennis, at the moment CT9/N7DH
>
> Sent from my iPhone
> __
> Elecraft mailing list
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

[Wes Stewart]

Not a problem.

Wes  N7WS

On 3/28/2018 11:17 PM, Dennis Haarsager wrote:

I am ready to order a KPA500 and wonder if anyone out there has regretted 
operating one from 115-volt service.

Thanks and 73,
Dennis, at the moment CT9/N7DH



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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

[David Bunte]

Dennis -

I have operated mine from my 120 volt service in my shack for years with no
issues at all. Most folks I have talked to about it do as well. One friend
used his on 240 and I could detect no difference in performance.

I think you will be VERY happy eitherway.

Dave - K9FN

On Thu, Mar 29, 2018 at 2:18 AM Dennis Haarsager 
wrote:

> I am ready to order a KPA500 and wonder if anyone out there has regretted
> operating one from 115-volt service.
>
> Thanks and 73,
> Dennis, at the moment CT9/N7DH
>
> Sent from my iPhone
> __
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[Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

[Dennis Haarsager]

I am ready to order a KPA500 and wonder if anyone out there has regretted 
operating one from 115-volt service. 

Thanks and 73,
Dennis, at the moment CT9/N7DH

Sent from my iPhone
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 Power Supply Environmental/Ergonomic Issue

[Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft]

Hi Everyone - This thread was closed earlier this week.

73
Eric
List moderator etc.
/elecraft.com/

On 2/1/2017 4:25 PM, Kevin wrote:

It's been that way with PC's and Mac's for 15 years.

Your PC is not truly "off" when you hit the power switch. That is the ATX 
specification. To start a PC all that happens is the shorting of two pins on 
the motherboard with the switch. There is power on the motherboard until you 
reach behind and flip the switch on the power supply itself.


Before it gets brought up, the battery on all PC's is to keep the CMOS clock 
settings alive, not to boot the PC.


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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 Power Supply Environmental/Ergonomic Issue

[Don Wilhelm]

John,

Because after power off, the fans are powered by the charge in the 
KPA500 capacitors discharging, I do not think that is a requirement - 
but not a bad idea in any case.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 2/1/2017 7:53 PM, John Marvin wrote:

I know this thread is supposed to be closed now, and hopefully this
would be obvious, but you should also wait for the fans to stop before
"pulling the plug". You should always turn the KPA500 off with the
switch (or the KPA utility) first, wait for the fans to stop, then you
can use the back switch or a power cord switch.

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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 Power Supply Environmental/Ergonomic Issue

[John Marvin]

I know this thread is supposed to be closed now, and hopefully this 
would be obvious, but you should also wait for the fans to stop before 
"pulling the plug". You should always turn the KPA500 off with the 
switch (or the KPA utility) first, wait for the fans to stop, then you 
can use the back switch or a power cord switch.


73,

John
AC0ZG


On 2/1/2017 5:25 PM, Kevin wrote:
Get ye to the local hardware emporium and buy the $10 power strip with 
a switch. Plug the KPA 500 into said switch. When done using the amp 
use the front panel switch to shut it "off" so it saves settings 
properly then hit the switch on the power strip. Viola! You've saved 
six watts and won't end up on some ridiculous website as a planet hater.




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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 Power Supply Environmental/Ergonomic Issue

[Kevin]

It's been that way with PC's and Mac's for 15 years.

Your PC is not truly "off" when you hit the power switch. That is the 
ATX specification. To start a PC all that happens is the shorting of two 
pins on the motherboard with the switch. There is power on the 
motherboard until you reach behind and flip the switch on the power 
supply itself.


Before it gets brought up, the battery on all PC's is to keep the CMOS 
clock settings alive, not to boot the PC.


Get ye to the local hardware emporium and buy the $10 power strip with a 
switch. Plug the KPA 500 into said switch. When done using the amp use 
the front panel switch to shut it "off" so it saves settings properly 
then hit the switch on the power strip. Viola! You've saved six watts 
and won't end up on some ridiculous website as a planet hater.


That little tidbit was taken from chapter one of the environmentalist 
playbook.


My house and garage are 100% led lit now. ALL of my "toys" are on 
switched inputs. I live in Iowa. My HVAC system is set to 67 in the 
winter and 77 in the summer. I have a tank less water heater. All my 
toilets are 1.5 gallon flush.


I didn't do this because I'm some kind of environmentalist, I did this 
because I'm CHEAP.



n 1/31/2017 9:45 PM, Dave AD6A wrote:

I recently added a KPA500 kit for my home station. It went together just
fine, and overall I love it.

There is one thing about the way it works that bugs the engineer and
environmentalist in me.

  


Before I bought the PA, I thought I'd be able to turn it on/off entirely
using the ON button on the front panel.

I thought that maybe there was a supercap or backup battery that kept the
button's electronics alive to perform the ON button function (like TV's have
in them).

However, it doesn't work like this. In order to turn the PA off completely,
you have to turn off the main power switch on the rear panel.

  


The front panel ON button powers up the PA from what looks like a cold
state, however, my measurements are as follows:

  


1.  With the main power switch on the back panel turned OFF, the PA
takes no power at all (0.0W)
2.  When you turn the main power switch on the back panel to ON, the PA
draws 6.9W continuously from the 120V AC power supply
3.  When you press the front panel ON button, the PA turns "ON" and
takes around 13W (measured) in STBY mode

  


My home station line up (K3s, P3, 2x SP3, KPA500, KAT500) sits on a large
operating desk with a shelf unit that I build above the station. My computer
monitors sit on the shelf above the radios.

There is only just enough height clearance (about 2.5") between the top of
the KPA500 and the underside of the shelf to allow me to put my hand over
the top of the PA to reach the main power switch.

It's fiddly but I can do it, it's just that it's a major inconvenience not
being able to turn the KPA500 truly off from the front panel.

  


Why is the KPA500 designed this way?

In all good conscience, I can't live with the PA consuming 7W all day, every
day - that's incredibly wasteful.

I suppose I could put a more-easily-reachable external AC power switch on
the side of my shelf unit to cut power to the whole desk, but that'd be
ugly.

I'd prefer that either a) the KPA500's main power switch was on the front
panel, or b) the power supply system was redesigned so it only takes a few
microwatts when power is applied but the ON button is OFF (not pressed, or
pressed an even number of times).

  


Comments? Ideas?

  


Cheers,
Dave AD6A




--
R. Kevin Stover
AC0H
ARRL
FISTS #11993
SKCC #215
NAQCC #3441


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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 Power Supply Environmental/Ergonomic Issue

[John Marvin]

Dave,

Perhaps you want to turn on your amp manually each time. But what you 
may have missed is that 7 watts is doing more than just detecting 
whether the power switch on the front is used or not. When the KPA500 is 
"off" the RS-232 connection on the back is still live, and there is a 
processor in the KPA500 that is monitoring that connection. You can 
remotely turn on the KPA500 using the KPA utility.  For those whose 
KPA500's are in a remote location, or just in an inconvenient location 
(i.e. not adjacent or within easy reach of your operating position), 
this is a very nice feature. It would be more than just the "power 
supply system" that would need to be redesigned.


73,

John
AC0ZG

On 1/31/2017 8:45 PM, Dave AD6A wrote:

I recently added a KPA500 kit for my home station. It went together just
fine, and overall I love it.

There is one thing about the way it works that bugs the engineer and
environmentalist in me.

  


Before I bought the PA, I thought I'd be able to turn it on/off entirely
using the ON button on the front panel.

I thought that maybe there was a supercap or backup battery that kept the
button's electronics alive to perform the ON button function (like TV's have
in them).

However, it doesn't work like this. In order to turn the PA off completely,
you have to turn off the main power switch on the rear panel.

  


The front panel ON button powers up the PA from what looks like a cold
state, however, my measurements are as follows:

  


1.  With the main power switch on the back panel turned OFF, the PA
takes no power at all (0.0W)
2.  When you turn the main power switch on the back panel to ON, the PA
draws 6.9W continuously from the 120V AC power supply
3.  When you press the front panel ON button, the PA turns "ON" and
takes around 13W (measured) in STBY mode

  


My home station line up (K3s, P3, 2x SP3, KPA500, KAT500) sits on a large
operating desk with a shelf unit that I build above the station. My computer
monitors sit on the shelf above the radios.

There is only just enough height clearance (about 2.5") between the top of
the KPA500 and the underside of the shelf to allow me to put my hand over
the top of the PA to reach the main power switch.

It's fiddly but I can do it, it's just that it's a major inconvenience not
being able to turn the KPA500 truly off from the front panel.

  


Why is the KPA500 designed this way?

In all good conscience, I can't live with the PA consuming 7W all day, every
day - that's incredibly wasteful.

I suppose I could put a more-easily-reachable external AC power switch on
the side of my shelf unit to cut power to the whole desk, but that'd be
ugly.

I'd prefer that either a) the KPA500's main power switch was on the front
panel, or b) the power supply system was redesigned so it only takes a few
microwatts when power is applied but the ON button is OFF (not pressed, or
pressed an even number of times).

  


Comments? Ideas?

  


Cheers,
Dave AD6A




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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 Power Supply Environmental/Ergonomic Issue

[Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft]

Guys - this is getting beat to death and to be honest, a few of the comments 
have strayed outside of our 'keep it respectful' list guidelines.


Let's close the thread at this time.

73,
Eric
/elecraft.com/
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 Power Supply Environmental/Ergonomic Issue

[Clay Autery]

"Incredibly wasteful" - Seems like a little bit of an overstatement.

That's only 4.968 Kilowatt-Hours a month assuming it is idling 24/7 for
30 days.

For me, that'd be about $0.49 in electricity.  At $0.22 a KW-Hr, it'd
still be under a buck per month.

If this is still "incredibly wasteful" then you need to check every
other appliance and electrical device in your house, because most of
them are likely consuming "incredible" amounts of electricity when they
are "OFF".

If you really must avoid consuming this 5 KWHr (it won't be that much
"waste" because you have to subtract the actual usage time), then you
can place an accessible switch like a properly sized multiplug inline
with the KPA500, et al. to switch off the power altogether AFTER you
shut it down at the front panel.

Have a great day...

73,

__
Clay Autery, KY5G
MONTAC Enterprises
(318) 518-1389

> In all good conscience, I can't live with the PA consuming 7W all day, every
> day - that's incredibly wasteful.
>
>

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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 Power Supply Environmental/Ergonomic Issue

[Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT]

AD6A wrote:

I thought that maybe there was a supercap or backup battery that kept the
button's electronics alive to perform the ON button function (like TV's
have in them).

Am I missing something?

Didn't it take power to to charge that supercap or backup battery?

Is there really a difference between drawing a tiny bit of mains power 
when "off" and drawing a tiny bit of mains power to maintain these when 
"on?"


Too often, it's easier to move a problem around than to actually solve it.

73 -- Lynn
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 Power Supply Environmental/Ergonomic Issue

[KENT TRIMBLE]

Leave it to an environmentalist (I'll spare the engineers) to advocate 
the spending of thousands of dollars in redesigning something that can 
be fixed with a quick trip to a local hardware store for a $25 (or less) 
master kill-switch.


Kent, K9ZTV



There is one thing about the way it works that bugs the engineer and
environmentalist in me.


Why is the KPA500 designed this way?

In all good conscience, I can't live with the PA consuming 7W all day,
every day - that's incredibly wasteful.  I suppose I could put a 
more-easily-reachable external AC power switch on
the side of my shelf unit to cut power to the whole desk, but that'd be
ugly.

I'd prefer that either a) the KPA500's main power switch was on the front
panel, or b) the power supply system was redesigned so it only takes a few
microwatts when power is applied but the ON button is OFF (not pressed, or
pressed an even number of times).





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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 Power Supply Environmental/Ergonomic Issue

[Charlie T, K3ICH]

Desk top PC can eat over 400 watts of power just sitting there.
When finished, I always put mine in "standby" or "sleep" mode which drops
the power usage to a few watts.
I verified these readings with one of those handy little "Kill-O-Watt" power
line devices.

73, Charlie k3ICH



-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Guy
Olinger K2AV
Sent: Wednesday, February 01, 2017 7:37 AM
To: Dave AD6A <d...@ad6a.com>; Elecraft Reflector <elecraft@mailman.qth.net>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 Power Supply Environmental/Ergonomic Issue

While without reference to quantities I certainly agree with the sentiment,
but to be focused on a night light level power is kind of like swatting at
gnats while pidgeons are flying around in the kitchen.

Does your attic insulation need replacing. Are all of the light fixtures in
your house converted to LED. Are your refrigerators made in the current
decade. Are all of your windows gas-filled double pane. Are your water
heater and all the hot water piping in your house insulated. The list of
things that would bury that 6 watts by a couple of orders of magnitude is
quite long.

Then there is this other thing specific to CPU based equipment. And that is
maintaining signal states relative to other equipment. They get confused
when things go cold off and aren't brought back on in a particular sequence.

It was always fun when the PC folks at SAS (which is buried in PCs) had to
take down a thousand or so functionally shared PCs for maintenance or
something. They had to be taken off in sequence and brought back in service
with a very complex and specifically ordered startup. Every now and then
that group had to work all hands on deck 48 hour weekends and took naps on
cots put out for the purpose. Those PCs were kept on their own AC mains with
a honking monster UPS that would power my house for weeks off the grid.
Power blips taking down a couple floors of PCs could put a building full of
very high paid advanced programmer types sitting on their hands for a day or
worse. They figured that out early and spent the money.

Your Elecraft gear has some related if not so killer issues on cold starts
that nevertheless result in tech support calls. Think Big E just trying to
keep the noise and confusion down on the TS lines, with a method that has
become pretty much standard practice.

Seems to me it's been a long time since TVs had batteries in them unless it
was a portable intended to be operated off mains. Paying for a service call
to replace a battery gone bad was drummed out long time back.

If you have a PC in the shack, do you do a shutdown when you leave? Or leave
it on to get OS and virus security updates and email?  Check the power draw
on that.

I'm trying to convince the wife to replace our 23 year old kitchen
refrigerator that still works perfectly.

I wish that my KPA's off state power draw was the prime offender at my house
:>).

73, Guy K2AV

On Tue, Jan 31, 2017 at 10:46 PM Dave AD6A <d...@ad6a.com> wrote:

> I recently added a KPA500 kit for my home station. It went together 
> just fine, and overall I love it.
>
> There is one thing about the way it works that bugs the engineer and 
> environmentalist in me.
>
>
>
> Before I bought the PA, I thought I'd be able to turn it on/off 
> entirely using the ON button on the front panel.
>
> I thought that maybe there was a supercap or backup battery that kept 
> the button's electronics alive to perform the ON button function (like 
> TV's have in them).
>
> However, it doesn't work like this. In order to turn the PA off 
> completely, you have to turn off the main power switch on the rear panel.
>
>
>
> The front panel ON button powers up the PA from what looks like a cold 
> state, however, my measurements are as follows:
>
>
>
> 1.  With the main power switch on the back panel turned OFF, the PA
> takes no power at all (0.0W)
> 2.  When you turn the main power switch on the back panel to ON, the
PA
> draws 6.9W continuously from the 120V AC power supply
> 3.  When you press the front panel ON button, the PA turns "ON" and
> takes around 13W (measured) in STBY mode
>
>
>
> My home station line up (K3s, P3, 2x SP3, KPA500, KAT500) sits on a 
> large operating desk with a shelf unit that I build above the station. 
> My computer monitors sit on the shelf above the radios.
>
> There is only just enough height clearance (about 2.5") between the 
> top of the KPA500 and the underside of the shelf to allow me to put my 
> hand over the top of the PA to reach the main power switch.
>
> It's fiddly but I can do it, it's just that it's a major inconvenience 
> not being able to turn the KPA500 truly off from the front panel.
>
>
>
> Why is the KPA500 d

Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 Power Supply Environmental/Ergonomic Issue

[Guy Olinger K2AV]

While without reference to quantities I certainly agree with the sentiment,
but to be focused on a night light level power is kind of like swatting at
gnats while pidgeons are flying around in the kitchen.

Does your attic insulation need replacing. Are all of the light fixtures in
your house converted to LED. Are your refrigerators made in the current
decade. Are all of your windows gas-filled double pane. Are your water
heater and all the hot water piping in your house insulated. The list of
things that would bury that 6 watts by a couple of orders of magnitude is
quite long.

Then there is this other thing specific to CPU based equipment. And that is
maintaining signal states relative to other equipment. They get confused
when things go cold off and aren't brought back on in a particular
sequence.

It was always fun when the PC folks at SAS (which is buried in PCs) had to
take down a thousand or so functionally shared PCs for maintenance or
something. They had to be taken off in sequence and brought back in service
with a very complex and specifically ordered startup. Every now and then
that group had to work all hands on deck 48 hour weekends and took naps on
cots put out for the purpose. Those PCs were kept on their own AC mains
with a honking monster UPS that would power my house for weeks off the
grid. Power blips taking down a couple floors of PCs could put a building
full of very high paid advanced programmer types sitting on their hands for
a day or worse. They figured that out early and spent the money.

Your Elecraft gear has some related if not so killer issues on cold starts
that nevertheless result in tech support calls. Think Big E just trying to
keep the noise and confusion down on the TS lines, with a method that has
become pretty much standard practice.

Seems to me it's been a long time since TVs had batteries in them unless it
was a portable intended to be operated off mains. Paying for a service call
to replace a battery gone bad was drummed out long time back.

If you have a PC in the shack, do you do a shutdown when you leave? Or
leave it on to get OS and virus security updates and email?  Check the
power draw on that.

I'm trying to convince the wife to replace our 23 year old kitchen
refrigerator that still works perfectly.

I wish that my KPA's off state power draw was the prime offender at my
house :>).

73, Guy K2AV

On Tue, Jan 31, 2017 at 10:46 PM Dave AD6A  wrote:

> I recently added a KPA500 kit for my home station. It went together just
> fine, and overall I love it.
>
> There is one thing about the way it works that bugs the engineer and
> environmentalist in me.
>
>
>
> Before I bought the PA, I thought I'd be able to turn it on/off entirely
> using the ON button on the front panel.
>
> I thought that maybe there was a supercap or backup battery that kept the
> button's electronics alive to perform the ON button function (like TV's
> have
> in them).
>
> However, it doesn't work like this. In order to turn the PA off completely,
> you have to turn off the main power switch on the rear panel.
>
>
>
> The front panel ON button powers up the PA from what looks like a cold
> state, however, my measurements are as follows:
>
>
>
> 1.  With the main power switch on the back panel turned OFF, the PA
> takes no power at all (0.0W)
> 2.  When you turn the main power switch on the back panel to ON, the PA
> draws 6.9W continuously from the 120V AC power supply
> 3.  When you press the front panel ON button, the PA turns "ON" and
> takes around 13W (measured) in STBY mode
>
>
>
> My home station line up (K3s, P3, 2x SP3, KPA500, KAT500) sits on a large
> operating desk with a shelf unit that I build above the station. My
> computer
> monitors sit on the shelf above the radios.
>
> There is only just enough height clearance (about 2.5") between the top of
> the KPA500 and the underside of the shelf to allow me to put my hand over
> the top of the PA to reach the main power switch.
>
> It's fiddly but I can do it, it's just that it's a major inconvenience not
> being able to turn the KPA500 truly off from the front panel.
>
>
>
> Why is the KPA500 designed this way?
>
> In all good conscience, I can't live with the PA consuming 7W all day,
> every
> day - that's incredibly wasteful.
>
> I suppose I could put a more-easily-reachable external AC power switch on
> the side of my shelf unit to cut power to the whole desk, but that'd be
> ugly.
>
> I'd prefer that either a) the KPA500's main power switch was on the front
> panel, or b) the power supply system was redesigned so it only takes a few
> microwatts when power is applied but the ON button is OFF (not pressed, or
> pressed an even number of times).
>
>
>
> Comments? Ideas?
>
>
>
> Cheers,
> Dave AD6A
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
> __
> Elecraft 

Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 Power Supply Environmental/Ergonomic Issue

[Nr4c]

Mine has been OFF for a one week vacation once in three or four years since I 
built it. I have a nite light that consumes more power. 

Sent from my iPhone
...nr4c. bill


> On Jan 31, 2017, at 10:45 PM, Dave AD6A  wrote:
> 
> I recently added a KPA500 kit for my home station. It went together just
> fine, and overall I love it.
> 
> There is one thing about the way it works that bugs the engineer and
> environmentalist in me.
> 
> 
> 
> Before I bought the PA, I thought I'd be able to turn it on/off entirely
> using the ON button on the front panel.
> 
> I thought that maybe there was a supercap or backup battery that kept the
> button's electronics alive to perform the ON button function (like TV's have
> in them).
> 
> However, it doesn't work like this. In order to turn the PA off completely,
> you have to turn off the main power switch on the rear panel.
> 
> 
> 
> The front panel ON button powers up the PA from what looks like a cold
> state, however, my measurements are as follows:
> 
> 
> 
> 1.With the main power switch on the back panel turned OFF, the PA
> takes no power at all (0.0W)
> 2.When you turn the main power switch on the back panel to ON, the PA
> draws 6.9W continuously from the 120V AC power supply
> 3.When you press the front panel ON button, the PA turns "ON" and
> takes around 13W (measured) in STBY mode
> 
> 
> 
> My home station line up (K3s, P3, 2x SP3, KPA500, KAT500) sits on a large
> operating desk with a shelf unit that I build above the station. My computer
> monitors sit on the shelf above the radios.
> 
> There is only just enough height clearance (about 2.5") between the top of
> the KPA500 and the underside of the shelf to allow me to put my hand over
> the top of the PA to reach the main power switch.
> 
> It's fiddly but I can do it, it's just that it's a major inconvenience not
> being able to turn the KPA500 truly off from the front panel.
> 
> 
> 
> Why is the KPA500 designed this way?
> 
> In all good conscience, I can't live with the PA consuming 7W all day, every
> day - that's incredibly wasteful.
> 
> I suppose I could put a more-easily-reachable external AC power switch on
> the side of my shelf unit to cut power to the whole desk, but that'd be
> ugly.
> 
> I'd prefer that either a) the KPA500's main power switch was on the front
> panel, or b) the power supply system was redesigned so it only takes a few
> microwatts when power is applied but the ON button is OFF (not pressed, or
> pressed an even number of times).
> 
> 
> 
> Comments? Ideas?
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers,
> Dave AD6A
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 Power Supply Environmental/Ergonomic Issue

[Ron D'Eau Claire]

I agree Dave. It's probably done for the same reason your TV and almost all
other electronics in your household (including things like TVs, modern
dishwashers, washing machines, etc.) in addition to your computer(s) are not
truly "off" unless you unplug them. 

It's the current "fashion" in engineering. Note that your K3/K3S works the
same way but has no rear panel switch.  

The so-called 'parasitic power drain' of all those appliances in their "off"
state adds up costs for the individual and for the community and the nation.

In addition, the soft glow from LED's on the various appliances (thankfully
not the Elecraft gear) can be deleterious to your health if they are allowed
where you sleep. Studies have shown that even though you are not aware of
it, their presence can interfere with normal sleep rhythms. A starry bright
sky can be a pleasure at times but, frankly, us Humans evolved getting our
best rest sleeping in a very dark cave.  

Personally, I have a master switch on my station that removes all power from
everything. I power down individual equipment like the KPA500, K3, etc.,
then pull the "big switch". 

73, Ron AC7AC

-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Dave
AD6A
Sent: Tuesday, January 31, 2017 7:45 PM
To: 'Elecraft Reflector'
Subject: [Elecraft] KPA500 Power Supply Environmental/Ergonomic Issue

I recently added a KPA500 kit for my home station. It went together just
fine, and overall I love it.

There is one thing about the way it works that bugs the engineer and
environmentalist in me.

 

Before I bought the PA, I thought I'd be able to turn it on/off entirely
using the ON button on the front panel.

I thought that maybe there was a supercap or backup battery that kept the
button's electronics alive to perform the ON button function (like TV's have
in them).

However, it doesn't work like this. In order to turn the PA off completely,
you have to turn off the main power switch on the rear panel.

 

The front panel ON button powers up the PA from what looks like a cold
state, however, my measurements are as follows:

 

1.  With the main power switch on the back panel turned OFF, the PA
takes no power at all (0.0W)
2.  When you turn the main power switch on the back panel to ON, the PA
draws 6.9W continuously from the 120V AC power supply
3.  When you press the front panel ON button, the PA turns "ON" and
takes around 13W (measured) in STBY mode

 

My home station line up (K3s, P3, 2x SP3, KPA500, KAT500) sits on a large
operating desk with a shelf unit that I build above the station. My computer
monitors sit on the shelf above the radios.

There is only just enough height clearance (about 2.5") between the top of
the KPA500 and the underside of the shelf to allow me to put my hand over
the top of the PA to reach the main power switch.

It's fiddly but I can do it, it's just that it's a major inconvenience not
being able to turn the KPA500 truly off from the front panel.

 

Why is the KPA500 designed this way?

In all good conscience, I can't live with the PA consuming 7W all day, every
day - that's incredibly wasteful.

I suppose I could put a more-easily-reachable external AC power switch on
the side of my shelf unit to cut power to the whole desk, but that'd be
ugly.

I'd prefer that either a) the KPA500's main power switch was on the front
panel, or b) the power supply system was redesigned so it only takes a few
microwatts when power is applied but the ON button is OFF (not pressed, or
pressed an even number of times).

 

Comments? Ideas?

 

Cheers,
Dave AD6A

 

 



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[Elecraft] KPA500 Power Supply Environmental/Ergonomic Issue

[Dave AD6A]

I recently added a KPA500 kit for my home station. It went together just
fine, and overall I love it.

There is one thing about the way it works that bugs the engineer and
environmentalist in me.

 

Before I bought the PA, I thought I'd be able to turn it on/off entirely
using the ON button on the front panel.

I thought that maybe there was a supercap or backup battery that kept the
button's electronics alive to perform the ON button function (like TV's have
in them).

However, it doesn't work like this. In order to turn the PA off completely,
you have to turn off the main power switch on the rear panel.

 

The front panel ON button powers up the PA from what looks like a cold
state, however, my measurements are as follows:

 

1.  With the main power switch on the back panel turned OFF, the PA
takes no power at all (0.0W)
2.  When you turn the main power switch on the back panel to ON, the PA
draws 6.9W continuously from the 120V AC power supply
3.  When you press the front panel ON button, the PA turns "ON" and
takes around 13W (measured) in STBY mode

 

My home station line up (K3s, P3, 2x SP3, KPA500, KAT500) sits on a large
operating desk with a shelf unit that I build above the station. My computer
monitors sit on the shelf above the radios.

There is only just enough height clearance (about 2.5") between the top of
the KPA500 and the underside of the shelf to allow me to put my hand over
the top of the PA to reach the main power switch.

It's fiddly but I can do it, it's just that it's a major inconvenience not
being able to turn the KPA500 truly off from the front panel.

 

Why is the KPA500 designed this way?

In all good conscience, I can't live with the PA consuming 7W all day, every
day - that's incredibly wasteful.

I suppose I could put a more-easily-reachable external AC power switch on
the side of my shelf unit to cut power to the whole desk, but that'd be
ugly.

I'd prefer that either a) the KPA500's main power switch was on the front
panel, or b) the power supply system was redesigned so it only takes a few
microwatts when power is applied but the ON button is OFF (not pressed, or
pressed an even number of times).

 

Comments? Ideas?

 

Cheers,
Dave AD6A

 

 



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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

[Hank P]

Since we are in monsoon season here in AZ - if any storm is in area or 
predicted - I  disconnect everything - both at tower and at shack wall.


I noticed this morning that when I plug the KPA500 back in -(its on a 240 
circuit all by itself)  I hear what appears to be an initial  transformer 
magnetizing input hum even though the ON switch is OFF .


All seems to be working fine - going  from ON to OFF the fan runs to bleed 
down the PS and amp works  OK - I just never noticed this hum before .And 
the hum is just at the initial  plug in - it does out to inaudible.


It appears even when the KPA500 is OFF  the transformers are still being 
fed from AC line  - TRUE 


Sheet 1 of 2 of the PS shows a switch right at input but that appears to 
be part of the input 120/240  module , KPA500 Front Panel Switches shows the 
ON-OFF sw just as a closure to ground feeding control logic at which point 
I get crosseyed.


Hank K7HP 


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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

[Hank P]

Face is red - Issue resolved - senior moment - yep the transformers are 
energized anytime its plugged in and the
ON-OFF switch on the input voltage /fusing module is ON. Been so long 
since I looked at back of amp
after I finished it and hooked it up , I forgot that was a real switch. Nice 
to have gear so trouble free you
forget what the back looks like  Some part of the PS HAS to be on for 
voltage for the logic.


Thanks to all who responded

Hank K7HP

-Original Message- 
From: Hank P

Sent: Saturday, August 01, 2015 12:49 PM
To: Elecraft Reflector
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 power supply

Since we are in monsoon season here in AZ - if any storm is in area or
predicted - I  disconnect everything - both at tower and at shack wall.

I noticed this morning that when I plug the KPA500 back in -(its on a 240
circuit all by itself)  I hear what appears to be an initial  transformer
magnetizing input hum even though the ON switch is OFF .

All seems to be working fine - going  from ON to OFF the fan runs to bleed
down the PS and amp works  OK - I just never noticed this hum before .And
the hum is just at the initial  plug in - it does out to inaudible.

It appears even when the KPA500 is OFF  the transformers are still being
fed from AC line  - TRUE 

Sheet 1 of 2 of the PS shows a switch right at input but that appears to
be part of the input 120/240  module , KPA500 Front Panel Switches shows the
ON-OFF sw just as a closure to ground feeding control logic at which point
I get crosseyed.

Hank K7HP

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[Elecraft] KPA500 Power Supply Module Issue

[Roy Morris]

FYI

When I received my KPA500 kit, one of the three U3 leads on the Power Supply
Module was very brittle and broke when I tried to reposition the heat
spreader during installation.  I obtained a new U3 and installed it.  The
amplifier did not work when the new U3 was installed, and the heat spreader
became very hot.  I found out the power supply PCB is a double sided board,
and the three U3 leads must complete the path from top to bottom of the
board.  Upon removing (desoldering) the broken U3, I broke the path of one
or more of these solder-through holes.  I corrected the problem by soldering
all three leads on each side of the board.  The heat spreader temperature
returned to normal, and the KPA500 came to life and has worked well since.
Roy Morris  W4WFB

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[Elecraft] KPA500 Power Supply Voltage Test HV = .1

[Brian Linn]

Just finished building the KPA500 kit and ran the Test the power supply
voltage. on page 7 of the owner's manual. The result of the HV test is that
the LCD indicates the voltage to be .1, nowhere near the 65-85 indicated as
required.

I've double checked:
- Fuse Block Voltage Selection is set to 115v
- Correct fuses are installed
- Power supply wires connected to the correct terminals

Any thoughts?

Brian KD0HII

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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 Power Supply Voltage Test HV = .1 - SOLVED

[Ron D'Eau Claire]

Glad you figured it out Brian. Note that at the bottom of page 7 in the
Owner's manual, immediately after you choose the tap and before you test the
tap setting for the correct voltage, the last step says:

Replace the top cover before proceeding. An interlock switch prevents
operating the amplifier with the top cover removed.

73 Ron AC7AC

-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Brian Linn
Sent: Saturday, September 07, 2013 6:39 PM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Cc: supp...@elecraft.com
Subject: [Elecraft] RE: KPA500 Power Supply Voltage Test HV = .1 - SOLVED

Much thanks for the replies . issue solved. 

 

One of the replies suggested checking the Interlock switch, which caused me
to wonder if the top cover had to be on the unit before trying this voltage
test . sure enough it does . and now the test has a good result.

 

The kit instructions (page 43) directed me to the Owner's manual and the
voltage test BEFORE installing the top.

 

The Owner's manual (page 6 top after fuse installation) directs one to the
Test the power supply voltage . section on page 7, still no mention of
installing the top.

 

And . there's no direction to make sure the top is on the amp in the Test
the power supply voltage .  section!  I'm getting a good laugh out of this.

 

But I DO HOPE ELECRAFT WILL UPDATE THE MANUALS or point out to me what I
missed!

 

Brian KD0HII

 

 

 

Just finished building the KPA500 kit and ran the Test the power supply
voltage. on page 7 of the owner's manual. The result of the HV test is that
the LCD indicates the voltage to be .1, nowhere near the 65-85 indicated as
required.

 

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