Re: [Elecraft] [K3] UTILITY Improvements
Lee Buller wrote: Why not use XML so interchange could be universal? That way people can send each other their set ups. That could be interesting. And, you could change set ups depending on what you want to do XML syntax, on its own, is definitely not sufficient to achieve this and neither is it necessary. My impression is that many people use XML for its buzzword value, when a simpler text based format would be appropriate and easier for humans to read and hand edit. XML has enough gotchas in the syntax that hand editing risks creating invalid syntax. For that reason, it is important that one uses a proper XML parsing library, rather than ad hoc parsing code, otherwise the invalid forms may become the de facto standard. At one stage, the BOINC ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) parser had this problem. More importantly there is a lot of semantics in creating a good XML schema. In particular one needs to use standardised microformats. Microformats are structured parameters or text sections which often don't get their structure from XML markup. One example given here uses two different date and time formats, neither of which conforms with the subset of ISO date format that is the standard for dates in XML schemas. It also manages to represent a single, rather complex microformat, as though it were two different ones. In my view, that second case should have been structured with XML. -- David Woolley The Elecraft list is a forum for the discussion of topics related to Elecraft products and more general topics related ham radio List Guidelines http://www.elecraft.com/elecraft_list_guidelines.htm ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] [K3] UTILITY Improvements
When the memory channel CAT is defined I'll add this and other new features to HRD. I agree 100% that XML is the way to go, would be great for interchange. As soon as Wayne specs the CAT let's define the XML. I'm using XML exclusively in my new software and will convert HRD over to XML when I next attack the innards. Simon Brown, HB9DRV -- From: David Reid [EMAIL PROTECTED] This XML idea is great...I could make a webpage and application ( hosted on my server (or Elecraft's)) where you could go to a webpage, upload your config, mess about with it and download it, then, instead of having loads of programs all over the world - possibly needing updates, if the format or tagging changed, then we can just change one option - (select firmware revision) and automatically implement new features in the XML the idea of being able to edit the memories is really cool and quite easy to achieve... Perhaps Simon also has some ideas... ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] [K3] UTILITY Improvements
I think you guys have to look at some recent history. Even in this day and age ASCII like files are use extensively--even for new applications.. For example ADIF and Cabrillo files (LOTW and contest logging programs) These are not necessarily small files. ADIF files do have the tags people seem to thing are really important. I don't know about other programs, but I have several whose initialization (.INI) files are also ASCII. . They can be read and manipulated with any old text editor. My butt has been saved many times by having the ability to directly read and replace pieces of the above files simply. I can't say the same for other magic file formats. Going to something like XML is shooting many people in the foot. The pencil and paper clip are still alive. Reason: they do the job simply and cheaply. For me, I guess it really won't matter. The maximum number of memories that I'll ever be able to reliable associate with buttons is a few. Scrolling through 99 choices to find what I want just doesn't seem very appealing. 73 de Brian/K3KO Tom Childers, N5GE wrote: On Tue, 1 Jul 2008 19:47:55 -0700, Dick Dievendorff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We can't introduce a dependency on a fee product like Microsoft Excel. However there are a number of free XML editors. And comma-separated variable files can be manipulated with other tools. Dick, K6KR [snip] I agree that fee based products are not a good solution. Delimited files like CSV files would be smaller, but harder to read and understand by humans. XML files require more storage, but the description of each field goes along with the data. In the case where data layout changes rapidly XML would be the better choice, because software that reads the data could be more flexible when fields are added or taken away. Tom, N5GE ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] [K3] UTILITY Improvements
The end user should have no need to look at the XML file, the software you use will do this for you via a fine user-friendly UI irrespective of the platform you are using. An XML file is very easy to edit with Notepad or the editor of your choice. On http://mannindustries.net/hrd/Junk/ I have two examples of XML files used in my satellite tracking software: http://mannindustries.net/hrd/Junk/SatTrackChildWindows.xml which contains the layout of the windows to be opened when the program starts. http://mannindustries.net/hrd/Junk/SatTrackObserverDefinitions.xml which contains a list of satellite observers. The end user never sees these files but anyone who understands XML can read them, they are simple to parse (even with Microsoft's XML classes) and are *very* robust. Simon Brown, HB9DRV -- From: Brian Alsop [EMAIL PROTECTED] Going to something like XML is shooting many people in the foot. The pencil and paper clip are still alive. Reason: they do the job simply and cheaply. For me, I guess it really won't matter. The maximum number of memories that I'll ever be able to reliable associate with buttons is a few. Scrolling through 99 choices to find what I want just doesn't seem very appealing. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] [K3] UTILITY Improvements - XML
The porkiness of XML is only a factor with large volumes of data. It would be entirely appropriate to use in this application. 73, Steve On 7/2/08, John King [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I would vote for XML as well. It's porky, but it's human readable, it's universal and well supported by many applications and frameworks, and one can easily edit it by hand with Notepad or Emacs or whatever. 73, john WA1ABI ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] [K3] UTILITY Improvements
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dick Dievendorff Sent: Monday, June 30, 2008 2:12 AM ... Maybe memory save/restore belongs in that category of program. Dick, K6KR ... -Original Message- Sent: Sunday, June 29, 2008 5:41 PM With all that operating behind us, I found that it would be nice to have an easier way to change the data in the 00-99 Memory locations. I was wondering if the Utility Program can expanded so we can READ, EDIT, ERASE, SAVE and REPLACE key DATA elements such as the text that is entered by hand into each of the 00-99 memories in a similar manner that the Filter Configuration can be managed. I know it can save Configuation Files but they cant be edited. It is a great tool now and it is just begging (?) to be expanded. What do you think? 73's TonyK2ZLS ## Lets do it As a possible starting point: 1 - use excel to manage the memory tables - edit, insert, delete, sort, ... 2 - define an interchange format, which would be usable by any tool in any environment ... - such as config /config memory mem00 frequency value /frequency ... /mem00 ... /memory 3 - write an import/export function for the excel tool 4 - test for possible methods to get this information into the K3 - via frontend commands, like a user would do it - direct modification in the K3-Utility config file - direct modification in the K3 itself Maybe Simon can inform us if he is already working on that... ;o) Any comments are welcome ! = PLEASE USE [K3]UTILITY in your Subject 73 de Thomas, DM7TN ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] [K3] UTILITY Improvements
Why not use XML so interchange could be universal? That way people can send each other their set ups. That could be interesting. And, you could change set ups depending on what you want to do Lee- K0WA In our day and age it seems that Common Sense is in short supply. If you don't have any Common Sense - get some Common Sense and use it. If you can't find any Common Sense, ask for help from somebody who has some Common Sense. Is Common Sense divine? ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] [K3] UTILITY Improvements
On Wed, 2 Jul 2008 01:06:21 +0200, Thomas Norff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dick Dievendorff Sent: Monday, June 30, 2008 2:12 AM ... Maybe memory save/restore belongs in that category of program. Dick, K6KR ... -Original Message- Sent: Sunday, June 29, 2008 5:41 PM With all that operating behind us, I found that it would be nice to have an easier way to change the data in the 00-99 Memory locations. I was wondering if the Utility Program can expanded so we can READ, EDIT, ERASE, SAVE and REPLACE key DATA elements such as the text that is entered by hand into each of the 00-99 memories in a similar manner that the Filter Configuration can be managed. I know it can save Configuation Files but they cant be edited. It is a great tool now and it is just begging (?) to be expanded. What do you think? 73's TonyK2ZLS ## Lets do it As a possible starting point: 1 - use excel to manage the memory tables - edit, insert, delete, sort, ... 2 - define an interchange format, which would be usable by any tool in any environment ... - such as config /config memory mem00 frequency value /frequency ... /mem00 ... /memory 3 - write an import/export function for the excel tool 4 - test for possible methods to get this information into the K3 - via frontend commands, like a user would do it - direct modification in the K3-Utility config file - direct modification in the K3 itself Maybe Simon can inform us if he is already working on that... ;o) Any comments are welcome ! = PLEASE USE [K3]UTILITY in your Subject 73 de Thomas, DM7TN [snip] I'd use that if it were available, but not if it were in an Excel based solution. Excel is too bloated with unused functionality... and not everyone has access to it. Tom, N5GE - SWOT 3537 - Grid EM12jq Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety deserve neither Liberty nor Safety An excerpt from a letter written in 1755 from the Assembly to the Governor of Pennsylvania. Support the entire Constitution, not just the parts you like. http://www.n5ge.com http://www.eQSL.cc/Member.cfm?N5GE ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] [K3] UTILITY Improvements
We can't introduce a dependency on a fee product like Microsoft Excel. However there are a number of free XML editors. And comma-separated variable files can be manipulated with other tools. Dick, K6KR -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tom Childers, N5GE Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2008 5:46 PM To: Thomas Norff Cc: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [K3] UTILITY Improvements On Wed, 2 Jul 2008 01:06:21 +0200, Thomas Norff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dick Dievendorff Sent: Monday, June 30, 2008 2:12 AM ... Maybe memory save/restore belongs in that category of program. Dick, K6KR ... -Original Message- Sent: Sunday, June 29, 2008 5:41 PM With all that operating behind us, I found that it would be nice to have an easier way to change the data in the 00-99 Memory locations. I was wondering if the Utility Program can expanded so we can READ, EDIT, ERASE, SAVE and REPLACE key DATA elements such as the text that is entered by hand into each of the 00-99 memories in a similar manner that the Filter Configuration can be managed. I know it can save Configuation Files but they cant be edited. It is a great tool now and it is just begging (?) to be expanded. What do you think? 73's TonyK2ZLS ## Lets do it As a possible starting point: 1 - use excel to manage the memory tables - edit, insert, delete, sort, ... 2 - define an interchange format, which would be usable by any tool in any environment ... - such as config /config memory mem00 frequency value /frequency ... /mem00 ... /memory 3 - write an import/export function for the excel tool 4 - test for possible methods to get this information into the K3 - via frontend commands, like a user would do it - direct modification in the K3-Utility config file - direct modification in the K3 itself Maybe Simon can inform us if he is already working on that... ;o) Any comments are welcome ! = PLEASE USE [K3]UTILITY in your Subject 73 de Thomas, DM7TN [snip] I'd use that if it were available, but not if it were in an Excel based solution. Excel is too bloated with unused functionality... and not everyone has access to it. Tom, N5GE - SWOT 3537 - Grid EM12jq Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety deserve neither Liberty nor Safety An excerpt from a letter written in 1755 from the Assembly to the Governor of Pennsylvania. Support the entire Constitution, not just the parts you like. http://www.n5ge.com http://www.eQSL.cc/Member.cfm?N5GE ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] [K3] UTILITY Improvements
On Tue, 1 Jul 2008 19:47:55 -0700, Dick Dievendorff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We can't introduce a dependency on a fee product like Microsoft Excel. However there are a number of free XML editors. And comma-separated variable files can be manipulated with other tools. Dick, K6KR [snip] I agree that fee based products are not a good solution. Delimited files like CSV files would be smaller, but harder to read and understand by humans. XML files require more storage, but the description of each field goes along with the data. In the case where data layout changes rapidly XML would be the better choice, because software that reads the data could be more flexible when fields are added or taken away. Tom, N5GE ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] [K3] UTILITY Improvements
Agreed XML could be a good way to set things up. As well it would be helpful for Elecraft in the future as if you're having trouble they can ask you to send in your config and they can quickly open it and find problems if they're in there. I was kinda hoping that when I read the config out of my radio before FD that when I loaded stuff back in that all my CW memories would be back to the way they were and all the memories. Thankfully it sounds like the ability to erase memories is coming soon. I'm sure there still won't be a way to erase a CW memory but man it would be great to be able to suck out the whole radio and then mess with things for FD or whatever and then poof blow it all back in after the fact. On Tue, 2008-07-01 at 17:05 -0700, Lee Buller wrote: Why not use XML so interchange could be universal? That way people can send each other their set ups. That could be interesting. And, you could change set ups depending on what you want to do Lee- K0WA In our day and age it seems that Common Sense is in short supply. If you don't have any Common Sense - get some Common Sense and use it. If you can't find any Common Sense, ask for help from somebody who has some Common Sense. Is Common Sense divine? ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] [K3] UTILITY Improvements
What is XML? I looked it up it is Extensible Markup Language (XML) I still do not know what to do with it. Oh well, another language to learn. It does keep the mind working. 73, Ty, W1TF ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] [K3] UTILITY Improvements - XML
I would vote for XML as well. It's porky, but it's human readable, it's universal and well supported by many applications and frameworks, and one can easily edit it by hand with Notepad or Emacs or whatever. 73, john WA1ABI ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] [K3] UTILITY Improvements
If you've seen HTML its somewhat similar. XML is like HTML but with more stringent rules. Its VERY human readable and quite simple to work with. As far as the argument that it results in large files people are living in the past. Broadband is becoming more and more common place and USB sticks are going to be able to hold them no problem. If people really want to live in the stone age I'm certain that they'll still fit on a 3.5 floppy. On Tue, 2008-07-01 at 21:10 -0700, Ralph Tyrrell wrote: What is XML? I looked it up it is Extensible Markup Language (XML) I still do not know what to do with it. Oh well, another language to learn. It does keep the mind working. 73, Ty, W1TF ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] [K3] UTILITY Improvements
I've heard this request before. It's being considered. It requires support work in the MCU firmware as well as the K3 Utility. I'm not sure whether this should be part of the K3 Utility (whose function is firmware loading and initial setup configuration) and a more general program like Ham Radio Deluxe that is an operational support - connected all the time sort of program. Maybe memory save/restore belongs in that category of program. Dick, K6KR -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of K2ZLS Sent: Sunday, June 29, 2008 5:41 PM To: ELECRAFT@mailman.qth.net Subject: [Elecraft] [K3] UTILITY Improvements Hi All...I Guess we are all worn out from FD , but as others said, the K3 worked wonders. With all that operating behind us, I found that it would be nice to have an easier way to change the data in the 00-99 Memory locations. I was wondering if the Utility Program can expanded so we can READ, EDIT, ERASE, SAVE and REPLACE key DATA elements such as the text that is entered by hand into each of the 00-99 memories in a similar manner that the Filter Configuration can be managed. I know it can save Configuation Files but they cant be edited. It is a great tool now and it is just begging (?) to be expanded. What do you think? 73's TonyK2ZLS ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] [K3] UTILITY Improvements
And a good request it is . There are functions in the K3 Utility program to copy CW and RTTY that other programs can handle. Then there is the the function to send commands to the K3. And you can back up the configuration (but not the memories).And set the filters. I guess I'd like to be able to back up the configuration, memories and filter setup to the logging PC, a network drive, a CD or a USB memory. Now that would be great! 73HankK8DD - Original Message - From: Dick Dievendorff [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'K2ZLS' [EMAIL PROTECTED]; ELECRAFT@mailman.qth.net Sent: Sunday, June 29, 2008 8:11 PM Subject: RE: [Elecraft] [K3] UTILITY Improvements I've heard this request before. It's being considered. It requires support work in the MCU firmware as well as the K3 Utility. I'm not sure whether this should be part of the K3 Utility (whose function is firmware loading and initial setup configuration) and a more general program like Ham Radio Deluxe that is an operational support - connected all the time sort of program. Maybe memory save/restore belongs in that category of program. Dick, K6KR Receive Notifications of Incoming Messages Easily monitor multiple email accounts access them with a click. Visit http://www.inbox.com/notifier and check it out! ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] [K3] UTILITY Improvements
I'd also like to see the CW memories and things like that that all get changed for events like that be things that are able to be backed up in the configuration. Also is there any way to REALLY clear the radio. Holding down shift/low and powering up does a reset of the parameters but things like CW memories are still there. I've been trying to completely reset it back to time zero to see if that can fix my ERR TXG problems that came up during FD. ~Brett On Sun, 2008-06-29 at 19:40 -0500, K2ZLS wrote: Hi All...I Guess we are all worn out from FD , but as others said, the K3 worked wonders. With all that operating behind us, I found that it would be nice to have an easier way to change the data in the 00-99 Memory locations. I was wondering if the Utility Program can expanded so we can READ, EDIT, ERASE, SAVE and REPLACE key DATA elements such as the text that is entered by hand into each of the 00-99 memories in a similar manner that the Filter Configuration can be managed. I know it can save Configuation Files but they cant be edited. It is a great tool now and it is just begging (?) to be expanded. What do you think? 73's TonyK2ZLS ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
