Re: [Elecraft] AADE LC meter for ham radio
I 've also got an AADE LC meter (our club's Project Day from last spring, a dozen of us built them) and I can also vouch for it. It's a fine meter, was fairly easy to build, and is very easy to use. I used it quite a bit while building my K1 and K2, to verify the values of some of the hard-to-read caps, and verify the values of the toroids I was winding. No relation or interest in AADE, just a satisfied customer. 73 de Stephanie va3uxb K2#5311 - K1#2132 On 27-Jan-2006, at 07.52.42, Alexandra Carter wrote: I just built the AADE (Almost All Digital Electronics) LC meter kit, it's a very nice little unit and biased towards ham radio, being very good at the smaller values of L and C that we encounter in antenna/RF work. It took me about an hour to build, and I'd say it's worth the $99 or so it cost - I think it was $105 or so with the shipping. The documentation is not up to Elecraft standard! But, the parts are so few it's not so bad, just read the instructions and notes through first and you'll be OK. You can get it factory built for $30 more. I hope this message isn't too SPAMish but if you need an LC meter in a hurry you may be tempted to get the BK 878 which costs over 2x as much and you won't have that hands-on understanding. This is a very solid and easy to use unit. 73 de Alex NS6Y. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] AADE LC meter for ham radio
Hi Alex: Gotta agree with you... the AADE LC meter is a FINE addition to any ham tool box. Though I don't use mine extensively, it do manage to find sues for it on a fairly regular basis and it never ceases to come thru for me. For the price, it'd be difficult to beat. Another device you might want to look at is the M3 Semiconductor Analyzer. http://www.m3electronix.com/features.html A number of us built this kit at the 2005 FDIM Buildathon at the Dayton HamVention last year. It's a really neat device and works amazingly well... esp. for devices you can't fully identify. Saved my bacon a couple times already. 73, At 06:52 AM 1/27/2006, Alex, NS6Y wrote: I just built the AADE (Almost All Digital Electronics) LC meter kit, it's a very nice little unit and biased towards ham radio, being very good at the smaller values of L and C that we encounter in antenna/RF work. It took me about an hour to build, and I'd say it's worth the $99 or so it cost - I think it was $105 or so with the shipping. The documentation is not up to Elecraft standard! But, the parts are so few it's not so bad, just read the instructions and notes through first and you'll be OK. You can get it factory built for $30 more. I hope this message isn't too SPAMish but if you need an LC meter in a hurry you may be tempted to get the BK 878 which costs over 2x as much and you won't have that hands-on understanding. This is a very solid and easy to use unit. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] AADE LC meter for ham radio
I write a blog covering automotive test (www.autotestnews.com), so I'm on the mailing lists for a bunch of test instrument companies. With all this talk about the $100 AADE LC Meter, I thought you'd get a kick out of this. It's only $13,000! btw, Agilent is the company that was formed to take over all the Hewlett Packard test equipment lines when HP decided it just wanted to be a computer maker. 73! Dan KB6NU -- CW Geek: Fists #9342, FP #1171 Affiliated Club Coordinator, MI Section Read my ham radio blog at www.kb6nu.com TRADE NEWS: Agilent Technologies Introduces High-Performance Low- Frequency Precision LCR Meter Unit Delivers Best Accuracy, Speed and Versatility in Frequency Range PALO ALTO, Calif., Jan. 10, 2006 -- Agilent Technologies Inc. (NYSE: A) today introduced a high-performance precision LCR (inductance, capacitance, resistance) meter for component RD and manufacturing engineers. The Agilent E4980A offers the industry's highest accuracy and repeatability from 20 Hz to 2 MHz, fast measurement speed, and outstanding performance at both low and high impedance. As a follow- up to Agilent's market-leading 4284A, the compact E4980A includes a modern PC interface and is five times faster, resulting in enhanced productivity and a lower cost of test. Component, semiconductor and equipment manufacturers are driven today by the mobile, PC, consumer electronics and automotive component markets. To accurately evaluate high-quality capacitors, inductors, transformers, semiconductors, and electromechanical devices for those markets, manufacturers require an LCR meter that offers both fast and highly accurate measurements. The E4980A offers high accuracy (0.05% basic accuracy) and features outstanding performance at both low and high impedance. This translates into improved test efficiency and measurement reliability. The unit's high speed (5.6 ms at 1 MHz) improves test throughput and increases production yields, allowing manufacturers to make lower- cost devices. And the meter's support for LAN, USB, and GPIB, as well as powerful test signal support (20 Vrms signal, 40 V DC bais), makes it easier to manage multiple instrument setups and improves data collection time. The three words that best describe the E4980A are accuracy, speed and versatility, said Makoto Honda, vice president and general manager of Agilent's Japan field operations. It's a compact and versatile LCR that enables component, semiconductor and equipment manufacturers to test smaller, lower-cost and higher-performance devices while improving test efficiency and lowering the overall cost of test. Additional features built into the E4980A include support for 40 A DC bias current source for conducting highly accurate and efficient DC current-biased inductance measurements, a DC resistance/voltage/ current measurement readout for performing simultaneous evaluations of DC characteristics, and 10 V DC source output port for evaluating three-terminal devices. Further Information Additional information about the Agilent E4980A LCR meter is available at www.agilent.com/find/E4980A. Images are available at www.agilent.com/find/E4980A_image. U.S. Pricing and Availability Pricing for the Agilent E4980A LCR meter starts at $13,000. The product is available to order Feb. 1, 2006. About Agilent Technologies Agilent Technologies Inc. (NYSE: A) is the world's premier measurement company and a technology leader in communications, electronics, life sciences and chemical analysis. The company's 21,000 employees serve customers in more than 110 countries. Agilent had net revenue of $5.1 billion in fiscal 2005. Information about Agilent is available on the Web at www.agilent.com. On Jan 27, 2006, at 7:52 AM, Alexandra Carter wrote: I just built the AADE (Almost All Digital Electronics) LC meter kit, it's a very nice little unit and biased towards ham radio, being very good at the smaller values of L and C that we encounter in antenna/RF work. It took me about an hour to build, and I'd say it's worth the $99 or so it cost - I think it was $105 or so with the shipping. The documentation is not up to Elecraft standard! But, the parts are so few it's not so bad, just read the instructions and notes through first and you'll be OK. You can get it factory built for $30 more. I hope this message isn't too SPAMish but if you need an LC meter in a hurry you may be tempted to get the BK 878 which costs over 2x as much and you won't have that hands-on understanding. This is a very solid and easy to use unit. 73 de Alex NS6Y. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Re: [Elecraft] AADE LC meter for ham radio
Stephanie Maks wrote: I used it quite a bit while building my K1 and K2, to verify the values of some of the hard-to-read caps, and verify the values of the toroids I was winding. This comes up once in a while, and for the benefit of those (like Stephanie) who may not have seen it before: The measured inductance of a toroid depends on the frequency at which it's measured because of the characteristics of the toroid material. I don't know the frequency used by the AADE unit, but if it's far from the operating frequency of a particular toroid, the results might be misleading. Elecraft has said that they do *not* recommend meauring toroid inductance, just winding the specified number of turns. If you must measure the inductance of a toroid, it would be better to use something like an antenna analyzer which will allow you to select the frequency at which the measurement is made. -- 73, Vic, K2VCO Fresno CA http://www.qsl.net/k2vco ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] AADE LC meter for ham radio
Thanks for mentioning that Vic, I have seen that in the Elecraft manuals and I don't expect the inductance I measure to be exact to what the schematics call for. It's just nice to see that it's close. Especially when there might be some confusion about the cores, when they look similar. For instance, the K1 Noise Blanker, the two cores are very similar in appearance. But almost the same number of turns on both of them, will produce two values that are different by a huge margin. So I should have mentioned in my original post, that I used the LC meter to just 'ball-park' the toroids. When the measurements were off, I wouldn't change the windings but would rather, double-check that the number of turns was correct and that I used the right core. 73 de Stephanie va3uxb K2#5311 - K1#2132 On 27-Jan-06, at 11.22 .22, Vic K2VCO wrote: This comes up once in a while, and for the benefit of those (like Stephanie) who may not have seen it before: The measured inductance of a toroid depends on the frequency at which it's measured because of the characteristics of the toroid material. I don't know the frequency used by the AADE unit, but if it's far from the operating frequency of a particular toroid, the results might be misleading. Elecraft has said that they do *not* recommend meauring toroid inductance, just winding the specified number of turns. If you must measure the inductance of a toroid, it would be better to use something like an antenna analyzer which will allow you to select the frequency at which the measurement is made. -- 73, Vic, K2VCO Fresno CA http://www.qsl.net/k2vco ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] AADE LC meter for ham radio
Stephanie, et al: VA3UXB wrote: I used it quite a bit while building my K1 and K2, to verify the values of some of the hard-to-read caps, and verify the values of the toroids I was winding. K2VCO wrote: The measured inductance of a toroid depends on the frequency at which it's measured because of the characteristics of the toroid material. I don't know the frequency used by the AADE unit, but if it's far from the operating frequency of a particular toroid, the results might be misleading. Elecraft has said that they do *not* recommend meauring toroid inductance, just winding the specified number of turns. If you must measure the inductance of a toroid, it would be better to use something like an antenna analyzer which will allow you to select the frequency at which the measurement is made. HEED Vic's comments here. It's all too easy to become MUCH too wrapped up in the 'accuracy' of being able to measure component values, esp. those of the toroidal inductors you wind, and to become MUCH too anal about winding 'for' the published value. Checking the values of FIXED components (resistances and capacitances) is not a bad thing, to confirm that the fixed-value component you hold in your hand is within the expected tolerance for THAT component... and the confirm that you actually picked up the component you think you did. With hand-wound inductors for Elecraft rigs, FOLLOW THE MANUAL! 1) Ensure you're using the specified SIZE and COLOR toroid 2) Ensure you're using the specified wire color and size 3) COUNT your turns! Each time the wire goes thru the core, that's ONE TURN 4) Spread the turns out around the core, generally to occupy 80% to 85% of the available core. 5) Ensure that you have the leads well stripped and tinned, and 6) Ensure that the leads are installed into the proper holes in the PC board. If you feel the absolutely overwhelming 'need' to measure the inductance of the toroidal inductor you just wound, do so with the intent or at least confirming that the value is 'within the ballpark', rather than being right on the money! IT'S NOT THAT CRITICAL, and you'll drive yourself nutz trying to 'hit' the published value... and for no significant benefit. 73, Tom N0SS Fresno CA http://www.qsl.net/k2vco ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] AADE LC meter for ham radio
This is very true! The AADE unit measures at something like 50kHz ranging to 600 or so kHz, and the characteristics of the toroid material matters a lot getting up into the HF range. I didn't get my AADE to measure toroids at all, but rather to check other components and well, fool around with loop antennas, goofy homemade capacitor ideas, that kind of thing. And of course it's good to be able to check fixed components to make sure I've picked up the right one.. 73 de Alex NS6Y On Jan 27, 2006, at 8:22 AM, Vic K2VCO wrote: The measured inductance of a toroid depends on the frequency at which it's measured because of the characteristics of the toroid material. I don't know the frequency used by the AADE unit, but if it's far from the operating frequency of a particular toroid, the results might be misleading. Elecraft has said that they do *not* recommend meauring toroid inductance, just winding the specified number of turns. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] AADE LC meter for ham radio
I don't use the AADE meter (my inductance meter was scratch-built from the ARRL handbook) but the fundamental frequency of the signal is not what the inductor is reacting to in most modern designs The one I use, which I believe is similar to the AADE in measurement methodology, applies a square wave to the inductance and measures the effect of the inductance on the waveform. What is of importance is the frequency of the leading and trailing edges of that square wave, which is many many times the fundamental frequency of the waveform. The steeper the edges, the higher their frequency. Graphically, consider the leading (or trailing) edge of the square wave a part of a sine wave of some frequency. Following the steep slope of the edge waveform, continue with it to draw a perfect sine wave. You will see that the actual frequency of that sine wave may be somewhere between 10 and 100 times the fundamental frequency of the square wave if it's a decent square waveform. That's the test frequency that the inductor is reacting to: the frequency of the leading or trailing edge. Now, the fundamental frequency of the square wave can be of importance because the measurement circuit often uses what happens to the waveform during the time when the square wave is at peak or zero voltage to calculate the inductance. The length of that time can affect the inductance value reported, depending upon the design of the circuit, but that frequency is NOT the test frequency the inductor is subjected to in the circuits that I've worked with. Ron AC7AC ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
