Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
On 8/8/2020 5:15 AM, Rich NE1EE wrote: I don't need a printed manual with my device. I think that they can look nice and be useful, though. I do appreciate a PDF that is not write protected, so that I can make my own notes and correct mistakes. I also appreciate a manual that is updated regularly. I don't like trolling lists and doing web searches, just to get vital information, and it is not a good use of employee time to be answering such questions repeatedly. I simply save each PDF version with all its notes, and then I can look in each version that I have. Hi Rich, I've also done a lot of tech writing over the years, including manuals for engineering software. Elecraft manuals are all on their website, and in my experience are pretty good. A printed copy is packed with their products. My only complaint about revisions (and there are revisions, mostly due to firmware upgrades) is that online versions should include full change logs. Each product has its own updating program, and last I looked, the only place they publish change logs, and it doesn't reference the manual. This is convenient for Elecraft, but IMO, lousy for the user. 73, Jim K9YC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
On 2020-08-05 03:06:-0700, RICHARD Martin wrote: >A how to video would be a very nice feature, but we must remember the cost >of developing such a thing when our friends at Elecraft have to be in >desperate need of cash. >... >Thru most of my professional life, I have been responsible for the >conception, prototyping, and manufacture of large scientific instruments >($100K to $5M). The cost of the manuals/documentation was typically equal >to the development cost of the product. > >Dick KN6AA I am interested in the KX2, so I am gathering info on the product line to see if that is what I want to buy. I skimmed the KX2 vid, and found that it was not very useful. It was large a sales pitch. I have been involved with the dev of user manuals and operating procedures of complicated equipment, from stuff on the order of HP 15C calculators to 1100 MW generators. The cost to produce manuals has dropped significantly since 1980, largely due to the drop in cost of typesetting. Ironically, I opine, the quality has declined. Companies no longer invest in producing good manuals and training material, as a result, I see most often that the mfg directs questions to user fora. The downside to this is obvious. New users, not knowing what to ask or how to phrase a question, flounder around wasting a tremendous number of person-hours. I offered to help develop some docs for a few popular products, and was told by the developers/companies to simply start using the products, learn them well, and then produce those docs.They would be much appreciated!!! I declined. I don't have the time to waste learning the products using "seek and find" techniques. The cost of an HP-14C in 2020 USD was prolly on the order of $250. I'll bet the manual cost $10K to develop, independent of typesetting. But that cost was offset to some degree by the cost of the 15C and the number of them sold. Elecraft could easily pay attention to these fora, and regularly upgrade the manuals by posting new PDFs. I recently asked Elecraft a technical question that is not addressed in the manuals or on the web, and after 2 passes got a very nice succinct, clear, and complete answer. (Note that it took TWO cycles of emails to get that answer.) I immediately replied with thanks, and a recommendation that they add those comments to the web...and possibly manuals. I don't need a printed manual with my device. I think that they can look nice and be useful, though. I do appreciate a PDF that is not write protected, so that I can make my own notes and correct mistakes. I also appreciate a manual that is updated regularly. I don't like trolling lists and doing web searches, just to get vital information, and it is not a good use of employee time to be answering such questions repeatedly. I simply save each PDF version with all its notes, and then I can look in each version that I have. I think that well-produced videos, which abound on the web along with not-so-good vids, are very useful. I have seen a remark to the effect that someone was familiar with a different model of a radio, and when the newer one came out they were up and running in short order. But for someone not familiar with the product line, or perhaps not even familiar with radios in general, as a new ham, real howto vids can be most useful, I opine. I have been using Canon cameras for many years. I wanted a new point and shoot. So after reading reviews on various cameras (I am not especially brand-loyal) I decided to get a Canon. I had seen comments about how complicated it is for a PaS. I agree. But I found myself on familiar ground because of my years of experience w other Canons, so I was soon up and running. The other comments about it being complicated are valid, especially for one not already familiar with bigger Canon cameras. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
On 2020-08-07 21:21:-0400, Bill Frantz wrote: >With the manual online, and support for jumping to the relevant section, it >will be better than what I have with the K3, where the manual is on my >computer and I have to text search for the relevant section. The neat thing is >that the online manual can be automatically updated with new versions of the >firmware. I agree with the idea that the online manual can be frequently updated, but so can the PDF of the manual. I like both. I have found with other large projects, that the online manual is not well-searchable, and is broken into sections, so if I don't know what I am looking for, I can't find it. I have many frustrating experiences with that. Also, with the PDF, I can make notes on the manual, as long as it is not write-restricted. Some vendors secure their PDFs so that we can't copy from the manuals or make notes, both of which are real handicaps for the me, with the way I like to operate. The online version will not be writable, in the sense that I can't make notes in the relevant sections, but at least I should be able to copy from the web pages. I find that I usually wind up with my own set of notes, because few manuals are close to complete. Being able to copy from the manual makes that much easier. My experiences are also that online manuals tend to be less well-developed than good quality paper manuals. I am still playing with a variety of methods for accumulating notes, including printing occasional pages of online manuals to PDF and adding them to my own PDF. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
Thanks Wayne. With the manual online, and support for jumping to the relevant section, it will be better than what I have with the K3, where the manual is on my computer and I have to text search for the relevant section. The neat thing is that the online manual can be automatically updated with new versions of the firmware. 73 Bill AE6JV On 8/7/20 at 2:10 PM, n...@elecraft.com (Wayne Burdick) wrote: Hi Bill, Yes, the built-in Info System (accessed by tapping the "?" button) is a unique feature of the K4. We're refining it as we go along. It will be available for preview/comment at some point. 73, Wayne N6KR On Aug 7, 2020, at 10:57 AM, Bill Frantz wrote: I have a vague memory that the K4 was supposed to include a built-in help system. I can see it as being just showing the relevant section of the manual, but it might be different. Is it currently available, or is it waiting for the manual. or is something different? 73 Bill AE6JV On 8/7/20 at 11:47 AM, r...@tavan.com (Rick Tavan) wrote: The menu structure is simpler and includes more text. Bill Frantz|"Insofar as the propositions of mathematics refer to 408-348-7900 | reality, they are not certain; and insofar they are www.pwpconsult.com | certain, they do not refer to reality.” -- Einstein __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
Wayne, you think of everything. Buck, k4ia Honor Roll 8BDXCC EasyWayHamBooks.com On 8/7/2020 2:10 PM, Wayne Burdick wrote: Hi Bill, Yes, the built-in Info System (accessed by tapping the "?" button) is a unique feature of the K4. We're refining it as we go along. It will be available for preview/comment at some point. 73, Wayne N6KR On Aug 7, 2020, at 10:57 AM, Bill Frantz wrote: I have a vague memory that the K4 was supposed to include a built-in help system. I can see it as being just showing the relevant section of the manual, but it might be different. Is it currently available, or is it waiting for the manual. or is something different? 73 Bill AE6JV On 8/7/20 at 11:47 AM, r...@tavan.com (Rick Tavan) wrote: The menu structure is simpler and includes more text. --- Bill Frantz| "The only thing we have to | Periwinkle (408)348-7900 | fear is fear itself." - FDR | 150 Rivermead Rd #235 www.pwpconsult.com | Inaugural address, 3/4/1933 | Peterborough, NH 03458 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to n...@elecraft.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to radiok...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
Hi Bill, Yes, the built-in Info System (accessed by tapping the "?" button) is a unique feature of the K4. We're refining it as we go along. It will be available for preview/comment at some point. 73, Wayne N6KR > On Aug 7, 2020, at 10:57 AM, Bill Frantz wrote: > > I have a vague memory that the K4 was supposed to include a built-in help > system. I can see it as being just showing the relevant section of the > manual, but it might be different. > > Is it currently available, or is it waiting for the manual. or is something > different? > > 73 Bill AE6JV > > On 8/7/20 at 11:47 AM, r...@tavan.com (Rick Tavan) wrote: > >> The menu structure is simpler and includes more text. > > --- > Bill Frantz| "The only thing we have to | Periwinkle > (408)348-7900 | fear is fear itself." - FDR | 150 Rivermead Rd #235 > www.pwpconsult.com | Inaugural address, 3/4/1933 | Peterborough, NH 03458 > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to n...@elecraft.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
The "?" Help trigger is there but I think the text is pending completion of the manual on which it will be based. /Rick N6XI On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 10:57 AM Bill Frantz wrote: > I have a vague memory that the K4 was supposed to include a > built-in help system. I can see it as being just showing the > relevant section of the manual, but it might be different. > > Is it currently available, or is it waiting for the manual. or > is something different? > > 73 Bill AE6JV > > On 8/7/20 at 11:47 AM, r...@tavan.com (Rick Tavan) wrote: > > >The menu structure is simpler and includes more text. > > --- > Bill Frantz| "The only thing we have to | Periwinkle > (408)348-7900 | fear is fear itself." - FDR | 150 > Rivermead Rd #235 > www.pwpconsult.com | Inaugural address, 3/4/1933 | > Peterborough, NH 03458 > > -- -- Rick Tavan Truckee and Saratoga, CA __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
I have a vague memory that the K4 was supposed to include a built-in help system. I can see it as being just showing the relevant section of the manual, but it might be different. Is it currently available, or is it waiting for the manual. or is something different? 73 Bill AE6JV On 8/7/20 at 11:47 AM, r...@tavan.com (Rick Tavan) wrote: The menu structure is simpler and includes more text. --- Bill Frantz| "The only thing we have to | Periwinkle (408)348-7900 | fear is fear itself." - FDR | 150 Rivermead Rd #235 www.pwpconsult.com | Inaugural address, 3/4/1933 | Peterborough, NH 03458 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
Video tutorials would be a good idea, Gary. I wouldn't encourage Elecraft to delay K4 shipment until they are available, though. I suspect owner-produced vids will surface quickly and will be helpful for some. For what it's worth, as an experienced K3 user, I felt comfortable with my field test K4 *immediately* and very comfortable after an hour of simply poking around. The connections are plug-compatible. The UI metaphors are consistent.The menu structure is simpler and includes more text. There are, of course, some differences and new features, especially around the gorgeous display. (P3 experience will help there.) Most of the features are easily discoverable. Most Elecraft veterans won't need more than a brief tip sheet/application note explaining new stuff. Owners who are new to Elecraft may find videos helpful. A typically excellent Elecraft Owner's Manual (not yet available) will round out the doc set. It's a great radio and will be well worth the wait! 73, /Rick N6XI On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 11:05 PM Gary Smith wrote: > I would really like it if when the K4 is > released, there were also released on the > same day, training videos showing what to > push, what to enter, a how-to set of > videos covering different topics of > interest. > > Either a bunch of short ones on a web > page, sorted by topic & exactly to the > point so they'd be easy to find and could > be easily replayed till the idea is > understood. That, or a good legend > accompanying a long, more encompassing > presentation with reference time marks to > know where to search for a given > demonstration. > > We all learn differently, I have 11 years > of college under my belt, but in my old > age I still say I learn best by observing > a demonstration than otherwise. > > But that's just me. > > 73, > > Gary > KA1J > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to rta...@gmail.com > -- -- Rick Tavan Truckee and Saratoga, CA __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
I as well have a K4 on deposit and think a "get it working" 5-10 page instruction would be really nice, as well as a searchable complete manual. Guessing youtube videos will come with time just as it did on the K3. Can hardly wait for the K4 - maybe a surprise under the tree. Thank you Ken WB8PKK On Thursday, August 6, 2020, 07:12:14 AM EDT, Gordon LaPoint wrote: I do have a K4 on order, and I agree with Andy, I'd much rather have a searchable pdf manual than a video!!! Thanks Elecraft for the fine radios that I now own, and the coming K4! Gordon - N1MGO On 8/5/2020 20:12 PM, Andy Durbin wrote: > I transitioned, with a 40 year gap, from an AR88D and home brew CW/AM > transmitter with a TT11 final to an TS-590S. No problem at all reading the > manual and getting it working. I even found several firmware defects in the > first few months of ownership. I recognize that not everyone has an > engineering background and it's harder for some than others. When I was > running the local club's extra and general courses I quickly learned the huge > range of experience and ability in the amateur radio world. I also wondered > how some of the students had passed the technician exam. > > I'd far rather have a good searchable pdf manual than a training video. > Don't count my vote though as I have no plans to buy a K4. > > Andy, k3wyc > > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to gordon.lapo...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to backhoe...@yahoo.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
I do have a K4 on order, and I agree with Andy, I'd much rather have a searchable pdf manual than a video!!! Thanks Elecraft for the fine radios that I now own, and the coming K4! Gordon - N1MGO On 8/5/2020 20:12 PM, Andy Durbin wrote: I transitioned, with a 40 year gap, from an AR88D and home brew CW/AM transmitter with a TT11 final to an TS-590S. No problem at all reading the manual and getting it working. I even found several firmware defects in the first few months of ownership.I recognize that not everyone has an engineering background and it's harder for some than others. When I was running the local club's extra and general courses I quickly learned the huge range of experience and ability in the amateur radio world. I also wondered how some of the students had passed the technician exam. I'd far rather have a good searchable pdf manual than a training video. Don't count my vote though as I have no plans to buy a K4. Andy, k3wyc __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to gordon.lapo...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
On 8/5/2020 12:39 PM, Grant Youngman wrote: We agree. But the transition from one essentially modern radio to another, is still mostly a matter of figuring out what each control does, where it is, how to read the display, and where to connect the antenna. The exception I’d make is that if you gave a recently minted ham (or not) a Globe Champion 300 or even a Globe Scout he’d likely be completely mystified, and wonder where the RS-232 interface and keyer speed control was. THAT might take some training videos, or at least an elmer Sure, but RTFM has always worked for me. Thanks for the reminder -- I also had a Globe Scout as a kid. :) 73, Jim K9YC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
We agree. But the transition from one essentially modern radio to another, is still mostly a matter of figuring out what each control does, where it is, how to read the display, and where to connect the antenna. The exception I’d make is that if you gave a recently minted ham (or not) a Globe Champion 300 or even a Globe Scout he’d likely be completely mystified, and wonder where the RS-232 interface and keyer speed control was. THAT might take some training videos, or at least an elmer :-) Grant NQ5T > On Aug 5, 2020, at 2:22 PM, Jim Brown wrote: > > On 8/5/2020 10:40 AM, Grant Youngman wrote: >> It seems to me that if you need training classes or training videos to >> effectively use a radio, then that’s a problem — either with the radio’s >> owner (and I mean no disrespect to anyone) or with the radio. > > I agree, but with this caveat. Each radio mfr has developed their user > interface over decades, and each is different from the other to varying > degrees. In this century, I've owned Ten Tec, Kenwood, ICOM, and Yaesu. > Before that, Hallicrafters, Hammerlund, Heathkit, Drake, and WII surplus gear. > > My first Elecraft rig was a K2, bought used in 2003, and I upgraded to a K3 > in 2008. User interface between those Elecraft radios, and then to the KX3, > has maintained the same logic. In every case, RTFM, combined with > understanding how radios work, has been all I've needed. > > 73, Jim K9YC > __ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
On 8/5/2020 10:40 AM, Grant Youngman wrote: It seems to me that if you need training classes or training videos to effectively use a radio, then that’s a problem — either with the radio’s owner (and I mean no disrespect to anyone) or with the radio. I agree, but with this caveat. Each radio mfr has developed their user interface over decades, and each is different from the other to varying degrees. In this century, I've owned Ten Tec, Kenwood, ICOM, and Yaesu. Before that, Hallicrafters, Hammerlund, Heathkit, Drake, and WII surplus gear. My first Elecraft rig was a K2, bought used in 2003, and I upgraded to a K3 in 2008. User interface between those Elecraft radios, and then to the KX3, has maintained the same logic. In every case, RTFM, combined with understanding how radios work, has been all I've needed. 73, Jim K9YC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
It seems to me that if you need training classes or training videos to effectively use a radio, then that’s a problem — either with the radio’s owner (and I mean no disrespect to anyone) or with the radio. Elecraft will no doubt release some user tips for certain aspects of operation, just like they did for the K3 and other radios. Many questions can be answered on the list, either by field testers, Elecraft, or others that get their hands on one before you do, like they always have been. It isn’t a bad idea to collect these in a single location on the Elecraft website for reference, maybe organized by topic, provided that user submissions are vetted by Elecraft before they become gospel. Oh, and none of the computers in my house have DVD drives any longer. My grandkids have no clue what a CD/DVD even is. Which is why I’d suggest a web reference as a more universal option :-) Grant NQ5T > On Aug 5, 2020, at 8:11 AM, Charlie T wrote: > > What might be an acceptable alternative is to utilize the potential abilities > of the some of the owners. Many in this group have been responsible for > writing, or at least editing, tech manuals for various pieces of high level > equipment. This wouldn't necessarily be to produce a full start-to-finish > course in K4 operation, but a collection of user videos with hints & ideas > etc. (NOT however, ones showing the opening of the box, resulting in simple > "look-at-my-new-toy" videos!). > > I would volunteer to put all these on a single DVD, once they were approved > by the high-command with the obvious dis-claimer statement. > Of course, I'll need a K4 to ah, verify the suggested items, eh? Just > kidding (maybe?). > > 73, Charlie k3ICH > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
What might be an acceptable alternative is to utilize the potential abilities of the some of the owners. Many in this group have been responsible for writing, or at least editing, tech manuals for various pieces of high level equipment. This wouldn't necessarily be to produce a full start-to-finish course in K4 operation, but a collection of user videos with hints & ideas etc. (NOT however, ones showing the opening of the box, resulting in simple "look-at-my-new-toy" videos!). I would volunteer to put all these on a single DVD, once they were approved by the high-command with the obvious dis-claimer statement. Of course, I'll need a K4 to ah, verify the suggested items, eh? Just kidding (maybe?). 73, Charlie k3ICH -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net On Behalf Of turnbull Sent: Wednesday, August 05, 2020 3:21 AM To: g...@ka1j.com; Elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K4 training Gary, This would indeed be an asset.Wonder how much effort this would take.73 Doug EI2CNSent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
A how to video would be a very nice feature, but we must remember the cost of developing such a thing when our friends at Elecraft have to be in desperate need of cash. Due to the Government restrictions their cash flow has essentially stopped because they cannot efficiently manufacture and ship products. Thru most of my professional life, I have been responsible for the conception, prototyping, and manufacture of large scientific instruments ($100K to $5M). The cost of the manuals/documentation was typically equal to the development cost of the product. Dick KN6AA On Wed, Aug 5, 2020, 00:23 turnbull wrote: > > Gary, This would indeed be an asset.Wonder how much effort this would > take.73 Doug EI2CNSent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone. > Original message From: Gary Smith Date: > 05/08/2020 03:07 (GMT+00:00) To: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: > [Elecraft] K4 training Yes, That's the current way of things. What I > suggest would be more like an on-line video operator's manual sanctioned by > Elecraft, with logical menu to find the how-to, exactly, the function you > want being done.I'm not thinking so much where is the Power Switch, but > more like how to determine which thought process to use with the > K4/K4D/K4HD to best accomplish commonly used procedures, and then how to > get that done. Things like the display will be a bugger for awhile & the > picture being worth a thousand words concept is magnified with concise > video.Do-it-yourselfers on youtube will not get to the point & will be > offering opinions which isn't helpful to the direct question. More, you'll > have to use youtube's search engine to hopefully find what you're looking > for, and then be subjected to advertisements before and during the > presentation.It'll all be sorted out, I'm just thinking the official video > how-to would be a real asset to many. Maybe not.73 & stay safe,GaryKA1J> I > AM SURE...> When the first K4 is in the hands of users, that there will be > a> "flurry" of YouTube un-boxing videos. I am sure the how-to videos> will > follow.> > 73, steve WB3LGC> > On 8/4/20 3:47 AM, turnbull wrote:> > > > > Gary makes a good suggestion.TenTec use to have a CD which> > > accompanied the Orion 2. This is going to be a pretty complex> > radio > with all its features. "Are we there yet?"Hang in there> > good ship > Elecraft.73 Doug EI2CNPS Now feel for our friends who do> > not speak > English.That is the majority of mankind.Sent from my> > Samsung Galaxy > smartphone. Original message From:> > Gary Smith < > g...@ka1j.com> Date: 04/08/2020 07:05 (GMT+00:00) To:> > > elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: [Elecraft] K4 training I would> > > really like it if when the K4 is released, there were also released> > on > the same day, training videos showing what to push, what to> > enter, a > how-to set of videos covering different topics of interest.> > Either a > bunch of short ones on a web page, sorted by topic &> > exactly to the > point so they'd be easy to find and could be easily> > replayed till the > idea is understood. That, or a good legend> > accompanying a long, more > encompassing presentation with reference> > time marks to know where to > search for a given demonstration.We all> > learn differently, I have 11 > years of college under my belt, but in> > my old age I still say I learn > best by observing a demonstration> > than otherwise.But that's just> > > me.73,GaryKA1JElecraft > mailing listHome: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraftHelp: > http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htmPost: mailto:elecr...@mailman.qth.netThis > list hosted by: http://www.qsl.netPlease help support this email list: > http://www.qsl.net/donate.htmlMessage delivered to turnb...@net1.ie > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to dick93...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
Gary, This would indeed be an asset. Wonder how much effort this would take.73 Doug EI2CNSent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone. Original message From: Gary Smith Date: 05/08/2020 03:07 (GMT+00:00) To: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K4 training Yes, That's the current way of things. What I suggest would be more like an on-line video operator's manual sanctioned by Elecraft, with logical menu to find the how-to, exactly, the function you want being done.I'm not thinking so much where is the Power Switch, but more like how to determine which thought process to use with the K4/K4D/K4HD to best accomplish commonly used procedures, and then how to get that done. Things like the display will be a bugger for awhile & the picture being worth a thousand words concept is magnified with concise video.Do-it-yourselfers on youtube will not get to the point & will be offering opinions which isn't helpful to the direct question. More, you'll have to use youtube's search engine to hopefully find what you're looking for, and then be subjected to advertisements before and during the presentation.It'll all be sorted out, I'm just thinking the official video how-to would be a real asset to many. Maybe not.73 & stay safe,GaryKA1J> I AM SURE...> When the first K4 is in the hands of users, that there will be a> "flurry" of YouTube un-boxing videos. I am sure the how-to videos> will follow.> > 73, steve WB3LGC> > On 8/4/20 3:47 AM, turnbull wrote:> > > > Gary makes a good suggestion. TenTec use to have a CD which> > accompanied the Orion 2. This is going to be a pretty complex> > radio with all its features. "Are we there yet?"Hang in there> > good ship Elecraft.73 Doug EI2CNPS Now feel for our friends who do> > not speak English. That is the majority of mankind.Sent from my> > Samsung Galaxy smartphone. Original message From:> > Gary Smith Date: 04/08/2020 07:05 (GMT+00:00) To:> > elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: [Elecraft] K4 training I would> > really like it if when the K4 is released, there were also released> > on the same day, training videos showing what to push, what to> > enter, a how-to set of videos covering different topics of interest.> > Either a bunch of short ones on a web page, sorted by topic &> > exactly to the point so they'd be easy to find and could be easily> > replayed till the idea is understood. That, or a good legend> > accompanying a long, more encompassing presentation with reference> > time marks to know where to search for a given demonstration.We all> > learn differently, I have 11 years of college under my belt, but in> > my old age I still say I learn best by observing a demonstration> > than otherwise.But that's just> > me.73,GaryKA1JElecraft mailing listHome: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraftHelp: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htmPost: mailto:elecr...@mailman.qth.netThis list hosted by: http://www.qsl.netPlease help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.htmlMessage delivered to turnb...@net1.ie __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
Yes, That's the current way of things. What I suggest would be more like an on-line video operator's manual sanctioned by Elecraft, with logical menu to find the how-to, exactly, the function you want being done. I'm not thinking so much where is the Power Switch, but more like how to determine which thought process to use with the K4/K4D/K4HD to best accomplish commonly used procedures, and then how to get that done. Things like the display will be a bugger for awhile & the picture being worth a thousand words concept is magnified with concise video. Do-it-yourselfers on youtube will not get to the point & will be offering opinions which isn't helpful to the direct question. More, you'll have to use youtube's search engine to hopefully find what you're looking for, and then be subjected to advertisements before and during the presentation. It'll all be sorted out, I'm just thinking the official video how-to would be a real asset to many. Maybe not. 73 & stay safe, Gary KA1J > I AM SURE... > When the first K4 is in the hands of users, that there will be a > "flurry" of YouTube un-boxing videos. I am sure the how-to videos > will follow. > > 73, steve WB3LGC > > On 8/4/20 3:47 AM, turnbull wrote: > > > > Gary makes a good suggestion. TenTec use to have a CD which > > accompanied the Orion 2. This is going to be a pretty complex > > radio with all its features. "Are we there yet?"Hang in there > > good ship Elecraft.73 Doug EI2CNPS Now feel for our friends who do > > not speak English. That is the majority of mankind.Sent from my > > Samsung Galaxy smartphone. Original message From: > > Gary Smith Date: 04/08/2020 07:05 (GMT+00:00) To: > > elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: [Elecraft] K4 training I would > > really like it if when the K4 is released, there were also released > > on the same day, training videos showing what to push, what to > > enter, a how-to set of videos covering different topics of interest. > > Either a bunch of short ones on a web page, sorted by topic & > > exactly to the point so they'd be easy to find and could be easily > > replayed till the idea is understood. That, or a good legend > > accompanying a long, more encompassing presentation with reference > > time marks to know where to search for a given demonstration.We all > > learn differently, I have 11 years of college under my belt, but in > > my old age I still say I learn best by observing a demonstration > > than otherwise.But that's just > > me.73,GaryKA1J__ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
Good stuff. Grant NQ5T > On Aug 4, 2020, at 1:12 PM, Josh Fiden wrote: > > I see Elecraft has a youtube channel with 3 videos uploaded in the last few > days. If we all subscribe to their channel that will be good incentive for > them to produce content! > > https://m.youtube.com/channel/UCgPCrQYQttH83UWwZi_q4xQ > > 73 > Josh W6XU > > Sent from my mobile device __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
I see Elecraft has a youtube channel with 3 videos uploaded in the last few days. If we all subscribe to their channel that will be good incentive for them to produce content! https://m.youtube.com/channel/UCgPCrQYQttH83UWwZi_q4xQ 73 Josh W6XU Sent from my mobile device __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
I AM SURE... When the first K4 is in the hands of users, that there will be a "flurry" of YouTube un-boxing videos. I am sure the how-to videos will follow. 73, steve WB3LGC On 8/4/20 3:47 AM, turnbull wrote: Gary makes a good suggestion. TenTec use to have a CD which accompanied the Orion 2. This is going to be a pretty complex radio with all its features. "Are we there yet?"Hang in there good ship Elecraft.73 Doug EI2CNPS Now feel for our friends who do not speak English. That is the majority of mankind.Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone. Original message From: Gary Smith Date: 04/08/2020 07:05 (GMT+00:00) To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: [Elecraft] K4 training I would really like it if when the K4 is released, there were also released on the same day, training videos showing what to push, what to enter, a how-to set of videos covering different topics of interest. Either a bunch of short ones on a web page, sorted by topic & exactly to the point so they'd be easy to find and could be easily replayed till the idea is understood. That, or a good legend accompanying a long, more encompassing presentation with reference time marks to know where to search for a given demonstration.We all learn differently, I have 11 years of college under my belt, but in my old age I still say I learn best by observing a demonstration than otherwise.But that's just me.73,GaryKA1J__ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] K4 training
Gary makes a good suggestion. TenTec use to have a CD which accompanied the Orion 2. This is going to be a pretty complex radio with all its features. "Are we there yet?"Hang in there good ship Elecraft.73 Doug EI2CNPS Now feel for our friends who do not speak English. That is the majority of mankind.Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone. Original message From: Gary Smith Date: 04/08/2020 07:05 (GMT+00:00) To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: [Elecraft] K4 training I would really like it if when the K4 is released, there were also released on the same day, training videos showing what to push, what to enter, a how-to set of videos covering different topics of interest. Either a bunch of short ones on a web page, sorted by topic & exactly to the point so they'd be easy to find and could be easily replayed till the idea is understood. That, or a good legend accompanying a long, more encompassing presentation with reference time marks to know where to search for a given demonstration.We all learn differently, I have 11 years of college under my belt, but in my old age I still say I learn best by observing a demonstration than otherwise.But that's just me.73,GaryKA1J__Elecraft mailing listHome: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraftHelp: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htmPost: mailto:elecr...@mailman.qth.netThis list hosted by: http://www.qsl.netPlease help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.htmlMessage delivered to turnb...@net1.ie __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
