Re: [Elecraft] Power Control

2010-08-14 Thread Joe Subich, W4TV

 > I know when turning the power control there is a known dead spot
 > between 8 and 13 watts

That only happens on Six Meters and is documented in the manual.

 > When I turn the Power knob from 8 to 13 in receive mode the
 > receive gain jumps up 1 S unit almost like the preamp was turned on.
 > I tried different setting of the preamp and the ATT but the gain wll
 > always increase 1 S unit over whatever the S meter is reading when
 > the power level indication moves from 8 to 13 watts..

I do not see that here.  It sounds like you may have some issue in
the KPA3 bypass switching (bad bypass contacts in K1 on the KPA3IO
board?).  Were you changing power across the "dead spot" in transmit?

 > Regarding the dead spot 8-13 watts, I use a solid state amp and I
 > can run either down around 400 watts or I can run up near 1 Kw but
 > not in between due to the dead spot.

If 13 watts drive gives you 1 KW output, why not install a 6 dB
attenuator on the input (between the TR relay and the amplifier)
of the amplifier?  That would allow you run between 250 and 1000 W
as the drive was varied from 13 to 53 watts.  Even better, a 9 dB
attenuator would give you a range of 120 to 1000 W.

73,

... Joe, W4TV


On 8/14/2010 11:05 AM, k4pi wrote:
> Just finished installing the DSP board after the return from Aptos and then
> loading the latest program updates.  I know when turning the power control
> there is a known dead spot between 8 and 13 watts which I hope them can
> correct soon, but I noticed that there is an increase in the receive gain at
> this point.  When I turn the Power knob from 8 to 13 in receive mode the
> receive gain jumps up 1 S unit almost like the preamp was turned on.  I
> tried different setting of the preamp and the ATT but the gain wll always
> increase 1 S unit over whatever the S meter is reading when the power level
> indication moves from 8 to 13 watts..  I am looking at it on 6 M and have
> not tried it on other bands but wondered if anyone else notices this?
> Nothing I can't live with..
>
> Regarding the dead spot 8-13 watts, I use a solid state amp and I can run
> either down around 400 watts or I can run up near 1 Kw but not in between
> due to the dead spot.
>
> 73 Mike K4PI
>
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Re: [Elecraft] Power Control

2010-08-19 Thread David M. Elliott
For what it is worth, mine (1740) does the same thing on 6 meters.  For 
example, I can't set the power to 10 watts on 6.  The same does not happen on 
80 meters.
I also notice that the receive gain is lower in the dead band between 8 and 13 
watts.

73 de W6BK

On Aug 14, 2010, at 8:05 AM, k4pi wrote:

> Just finished installing the DSP board after the return from Aptos and then 
> loading the latest program updates.  I know when turning the power control 
> there is a known dead spot between 8 and 13 watts which I hope them can 
> correct soon, but I noticed that there is an increase in the receive gain at 
> this point.  When I turn the Power knob from 8 to 13 in receive mode the 
> receive gain jumps up 1 S unit almost like the preamp was turned on.  I 
> tried different setting of the preamp and the ATT but the gain wll always 
> increase 1 S unit over whatever the S meter is reading when the power level 
> indication moves from 8 to 13 watts..  I am looking at it on 6 M and have 
> not tried it on other bands but wondered if anyone else notices this? 
> Nothing I can't live with..
> 
> Regarding the dead spot 8-13 watts, I use a solid state amp and I can run 
> either down around 400 watts or I can run up near 1 Kw but not in between 
> due to the dead spot.
> 
> 73 Mike K4PI 
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] Power Control Setting Steps

2011-03-12 Thread Mike
Lee -

You can create a macro for each power level, and assign it to a button. I have 
one 
that sets the power at 45 watts for use with the amp (buttton M4), and another 
to set 
it to 100 watts (button M1) when I don't use the amp. And then there is the 
tune setting.

The K3 utility has a very fine help file on creating the macros, and assigning 
to 
buttons.

As the old pasta sauce ad used to say "It's in there!"

73, Mike NF4L

On 3/12/2011 3:28 PM, Lee Buller wrote:
> Maybe a new feature
>
> A way to step through or set power out putsay at 5 - 25 - 50 - 75 - 100.  
> I
> do like to run barefoot as much as possible, but when the dx shows up and I 
> have
> to tune the amp (into a dummy load) I like to be able to switch quickly to 25
> watts without cranking the knob several times to get to 25 watts.  A button 
> that
> could be programed for full or low power or steps in power.  I hope I am 
> getting
> the idea across here.
>
> Now I knowseveral guys have made T-Pads to run the full 100 watts out from
> the K3 reduce the power to the amp, but that does not work for me in my set up
> with my AL-82.  I was just thinking if the programming could be changed or a
> macro could be made to step through different power levels.
>
> Just an idea
>
> Lee - K0WA
>
>
>   In our day and age it seems that Common Sense is in short supply.  If you 
> don't
> have any Common Sense - get some Common Sense and use it.  If you can't find 
> any
> Common Sense, ask for help from somebody who has some Common Sense.  Is Common
> Sense divine?
>
> Common Sense is the image of the Creator expressing revealed truth in my mind.
> -  John W. (Kansas)
> __
> Elecraft mailing list
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Re: [Elecraft] Power Control Setting Steps

2011-03-12 Thread Dick Dievendorff
I think Lee was asking for one "stateful" button.  Press it once, it goes to
the first "stop".  Press it again, it goes to the next "stop".  Maybe after
three or four "stops" it cycles around. 

I am thinking of some sort of mechanism that allows successive button
presses to navigate through user-programmed sequences of settings:

 "14005, CW width 800", then
 "14025, CW, width 400", then
 "14070, RTTY, width 250",
 "14195, USB, width 2400",
 "14250, USB" etc.

It sounds good, but for a setting that isn't clearly on the front panel LCD
display, I think you'd probably forget where you were, so you'd end up
always pushing the one button a number of times

You can now assign different K3 switches for different macros that have no
state. That uses up the limited supply of buttons pretty quickly, though.

Dick, K6KR


-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Mike
Sent: Saturday, March 12, 2011 1:01 PM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Power Control Setting Steps

Lee -

You can create a macro for each power level, and assign it to a button. I
have one that sets the power at 45 watts for use with the amp (buttton M4),
and another to set it to 100 watts (button M1) when I don't use the amp. And
then there is the tune setting.

The K3 utility has a very fine help file on creating the macros, and
assigning to buttons.

As the old pasta sauce ad used to say "It's in there!"

73, Mike NF4L

On 3/12/2011 3:28 PM, Lee Buller wrote:
> Maybe a new feature
>
> A way to step through or set power out putsay at 5 - 25 - 50 - 75 
> - 100.  I do like to run barefoot as much as possible, but when the dx 
> shows up and I have to tune the amp (into a dummy load) I like to be 
> able to switch quickly to 25 watts without cranking the knob several 
> times to get to 25 watts.  A button that could be programed for full 
> or low power or steps in power.  I hope I am getting the idea across here.
>
> Now I knowseveral guys have made T-Pads to run the full 100 watts 
> out from the K3 reduce the power to the amp, but that does not work 
> for me in my set up with my AL-82.  I was just thinking if the 
> programming could be changed or a macro could be made to step through
different power levels.
>
> Just an idea
>
> Lee - K0WA
>
>
>   In our day and age it seems that Common Sense is in short supply.  
> If you don't have any Common Sense - get some Common Sense and use it.  
> If you can't find any Common Sense, ask for help from somebody who has 
> some Common Sense.  Is Common Sense divine?
>
> Common Sense is the image of the Creator expressing revealed truth in my
mind.
> -  John W. (Kansas)
> __
> Elecraft mailing list
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> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
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Re: [Elecraft] Power Control Setting Steps

2011-03-12 Thread Lou Kolb
Perhaps a tone-beep with each step and then a much lower or higher tone when 
you cycle back to the beginning.  Lou WA3MIX
- Original Message - 
From: "Dick Dievendorff" 
To: ; 
Sent: Saturday, March 12, 2011 4:10 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Power Control Setting Steps


>I think Lee was asking for one "stateful" button.  Press it once, it goes 
>to
> the first "stop".  Press it again, it goes to the next "stop".  Maybe 
> after
> three or four "stops" it cycles around.
>
> I am thinking of some sort of mechanism that allows successive button
> presses to navigate through user-programmed sequences of settings:
>
> "14005, CW width 800", then
> "14025, CW, width 400", then
> "14070, RTTY, width 250",
> "14195, USB, width 2400",
> "14250, USB" etc.
>
> It sounds good, but for a setting that isn't clearly on the front panel 
> LCD
> display, I think you'd probably forget where you were, so you'd end up
> always pushing the one button a number of times
>
> You can now assign different K3 switches for different macros that have no
> state. That uses up the limited supply of buttons pretty quickly, though.
>
> Dick, K6KR
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
> [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Mike
> Sent: Saturday, March 12, 2011 1:01 PM
> To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Power Control Setting Steps
>
> Lee -
>
> You can create a macro for each power level, and assign it to a button. I
> have one that sets the power at 45 watts for use with the amp (buttton 
> M4),
> and another to set it to 100 watts (button M1) when I don't use the amp. 
> And
> then there is the tune setting.
>
> The K3 utility has a very fine help file on creating the macros, and
> assigning to buttons.
>
> As the old pasta sauce ad used to say "It's in there!"
>
> 73, Mike NF4L
>
> On 3/12/2011 3:28 PM, Lee Buller wrote:
>> Maybe a new feature
>>
>> A way to step through or set power out putsay at 5 - 25 - 50 - 75
>> - 100.  I do like to run barefoot as much as possible, but when the dx
>> shows up and I have to tune the amp (into a dummy load) I like to be
>> able to switch quickly to 25 watts without cranking the knob several
>> times to get to 25 watts.  A button that could be programed for full
>> or low power or steps in power.  I hope I am getting the idea across 
>> here.
>>
>> Now I knowseveral guys have made T-Pads to run the full 100 watts
>> out from the K3 reduce the power to the amp, but that does not work
>> for me in my set up with my AL-82.  I was just thinking if the
>> programming could be changed or a macro could be made to step through
> different power levels.
>>
>> Just an idea
>>
>> Lee - K0WA
>>
>>
>>   In our day and age it seems that Common Sense is in short supply.
>> If you don't have any Common Sense - get some Common Sense and use it.
>> If you can't find any Common Sense, ask for help from somebody who has
>> some Common Sense.  Is Common Sense divine?
>>
>> Common Sense is the image of the Creator expressing revealed truth in my
> mind.
>> -  John W. (Kansas)
>> __
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>
>
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Re: [Elecraft] Power Control Setting Steps

2011-03-12 Thread Don Wilhelm
  Lee,

If that is your only goal --
There is a built-in key that will drop you power back to some preset 
level - and that is the TUNE button.
Set the CONFIG: TUN PWR menu parameter to the power level you want - no 
macro needed.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 3/12/2011 3:28 PM, Lee Buller wrote:
> Maybe a new feature
>
> A way to step through or set power out putsay at 5 - 25 - 50 - 75 - 100.  
> I
> do like to run barefoot as much as possible, but when the dx shows up and I 
> have
> to tune the amp (into a dummy load) I like to be able to switch quickly to 25
> watts without cranking the knob several times to get to 25 watts.  A button 
> that
> could be programed for full or low power or steps in power.  I hope I am 
> getting
> the idea across here.
>
> Now I knowseveral guys have made T-Pads to run the full 100 watts out from
> the K3 reduce the power to the amp, but that does not work for me in my set up
> with my AL-82.  I was just thinking if the programming could be changed or a
> macro could be made to step through different power levels.
>
> Just an idea
>
> Lee - K0WA
>
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Re: [Elecraft] Power control on 50MHz

2010-06-11 Thread WILLIS COOKE
That characteristic has been discussed here Roger.  The driver generates 
spurious signals between 8 and 13 watts, so the software makes the level skip 
these powers until the 100 watt final kicks in at 13 W.
 Willis 'Cookie' Cooke 
K5EWJ 





From: Roger Dixon 
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Sent: Fri, June 11, 2010 9:59:44 AM
Subject: [Elecraft] Power control on 50MHz

On all other bands, increasing the power level goes in 0.1W steps up 12watts
and then in one watt steps above this.

I'm sure this used to happen on 50MHz as well.  However, now the power
increases in 0.1W steps to 8 watts and then jumps to 13W before increasing
in 1W steps.  So I can't set an output level between 8 and 13 watts, which
is just what I need for the amplifier  

Any ideas as to what I can have done to achieve this "feature" ?

TIA
Roger - G4BVY

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Re: [Elecraft] Power control on 50MHz

2010-06-11 Thread Don Wilhelm
Roger,

That is "the way it is" - at least for the time being.  The Low Power 
amplifier is limited to 8 watts on 6 meters, as I recall  because of IMD 
performance.
Wayne has said he will do something to allow the KPA3 to begin above 8 
watts on 6 meters, but I have no idea about the schedule for that change.

73,
Don W3FPR

Roger Dixon wrote:
> On all other bands, increasing the power level goes in 0.1W steps up 12watts
> and then in one watt steps above this.
>
> I'm sure this used to happen on 50MHz as well.  However, now the power
> increases in 0.1W steps to 8 watts and then jumps to 13W before increasing
> in 1W steps.  So I can't set an output level between 8 and 13 watts, which
> is just what I need for the amplifier  
>
> Any ideas as to what I can have done to achieve this "feature" ?
>
> TIA
> Roger - G4BVY
>
>   
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Re: [Elecraft] Power control on 50MHz

2010-06-11 Thread Julian, G4ILO


Don Wilhelm-4 wrote:
> 
> That is "the way it is" - at least for the time being.  The Low Power 
> amplifier is limited to 8 watts on 6 meters, as I recall  because of IMD 
> performance.
> 

The IMD of my LPA is quite bad on 10m as well, at least if my KK7UQ PSK IMD
meter is to be believed. It's worse at 5W than it is at 13W which leads me
to believe it is the LPA that is at fault. I have no way of measuring it
accurately, unfortunately. Have there been any mods to the LPA since my
early S/N #222 that might improve this?

I would really, really like the option to disable this switching out of the
100W PA altogether. It seems to be an utterly pointless extra complication.
I never use my K3 portable so the extra current draw is nothing to worry
about.

-
Julian, G4ILO. K2 #392  K3 #222.
* G4ILO's Shack - http://www.g4ilo.com
* KComm - http://www.g4ilo.com/kcomm.html
* KTune - http://www.g4ilo.com/ktune.html

-- 
View this message in context: 
http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/SWR-tp5166250p5168657.html
Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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Re: [Elecraft] Power control on 50MHz

2010-06-11 Thread Lance Collister, W7GJ
I also would like to see this option!  As solid state amps become more 
prevalent, 
more folks will be wanting to be able to adjust the power in that range to make 
sure 
they do not overdrive their amplifiers.  VY 73, Lance


On 6/11/2010 4:26 PM, Julian, G4ILO wrote:
> I would really, really like the option to disable this switching out of the
> 100W PA altogether. It seems to be an utterly pointless extra complication.
> I never use my K3 portable so the extra current draw is nothing to worry
> about.
>
> -
> Julian, G4ILO. K2 #392  K3 #222.
> * G4ILO's Shack - http://www.g4ilo.com
> * KComm - http://www.g4ilo.com/kcomm.html
> * KTune - http://www.g4ilo.com/ktune.html
>


-- 
Lance Collister, W7GJ (ex: WN3GPL, WA3GPL, WA1JXN, WA1JXN/C6A, ZF2OC/ZF8, 
E51SIX)
P.O. Box 73
Frenchtown, MT  59834  USA
QTH: DN27UB
TEL: (406) 626-5728
URL: http://www.bigskyspaces.com/w7gj
2m DXCC #11/6m DXCC #815

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Re: [Elecraft] Power control on 50MHz

2010-06-11 Thread Lyle Johnson

> I would really, really like the option to disable this switching out of the
> 100W PA altogether. It seems to be an utterly pointless extra complication.

Part of the point is that the DAC used to create the signal at 15 kHz, 
which is upconverted, is using fewer bits at lower output levels.  While 
the gin scaling is very coarse, switching the HPA out at power levels 
which can be safely handled by the LPA improves the IMD of the signal 
being amplified by the Tx chain.  iI is partly for this reason that 
there is a switchable attenuator in the Tx chain as well.

73,

Lyle KK7P


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Re: [Elecraft] Power control on 50MHz

2010-06-11 Thread Wayne Burdick
Hi Julian,

We switch the KPA3 out at lower power levels to optimize the drive,  
ensuring a high carrier-to-noise ratio at lower-level stages.

In any case, IMD should be quite respectable on 6 m even with the LPA  
by itself. If it isn't, we'd be happy to swap LPAs with you so we can  
see what's up. Just contact support.

73,
Wayne
N6KR


On Jun 11, 2010, at 9:26 AM, Julian, G4ILO wrote:

>
>
> Don Wilhelm-4 wrote:
>>
>> That is "the way it is" - at least for the time being.  The Low Power
>> amplifier is limited to 8 watts on 6 meters, as I recall  because  
>> of IMD
>> performance.
>>


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Re: [Elecraft] Power control on 50MHz

2010-06-12 Thread Ian White GM3SEK
Wayne wrote:
>
>We switch the KPA3 out at lower power levels to optimize the drive, 
>ensuring a high carrier-to-noise ratio at lower-level stages.
>
>In any case, IMD should be quite respectable on 6 m even with the LPA 
>by itself.

Understood; but the simple term "IMD" covers a wide range of issues. It 
isn't all about 3rd order IMD; the overall width of the signal is 
determined by how rapidly the higher orders die away.

Comparing the LPA near its maximum output and the HPA near its minimum 
(say 11W versus 15W) the LPA gives more 3rd-order IMD, but the 
higher-order IMD products taper away more quickly so the signal overall 
is narrower.

There is also the issue of cooling; for example, with intensive RTTY or 
WSJT modes, 10W output would be pushing the passively cooled LPA close 
to its thermal limits. In such a case, it would be better to switch in 
the HPA so that both amplifiers are operating well within their thermal 
limits.

The best solution to meet the wide range of possible user needs would be 
a configurable breakpoint between the LPA and the HPA. If the breakpoint 
could be adjusted between say 6W and 12W (configurable and stored per 
band), that would cover a wide range of practical user needs without 
affecting the SNR of the transmitted signal by more than 3dB.

Then there is W7GJ's point about the gap in available power output on 
50MHz:
>As solid state amps become more prevalent, more folks will be wanting 
>to be able to adjust the power in that range to make sure they do not 
>overdrive their amplifiers.

As well as the wide range of possible power amplifiers, there is also a 
wide range of legal power limits around the world. With my particular 
50MHz PA, the gap in drive level available from the K3 makes it 
impossible to set the PA output to our 400W legal limit - the level 
jumps from 290W to 470W.

It is truly bizarre that output levels between 8W and 13W are not 
available on 50MHz. This issue is as old as the K3 itself, and it really 
does need to be fixed!

However, a complete solution would also include the configurable 
breakpoint between the LPA and the HPA as identified above.



-- 

73 from Ian GM3SEK
http://www.ifwtech.co.uk/g3sek
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Re: [Elecraft] power control indicator phenomena

2004-12-31 Thread Stewart Baker
On Fri, 31 Dec 2004 06:51:20 -0800 (PST), Steve Jackson wrote:
> Stewart G3RXQ wrote:
>
>>> It would be very helpful if someone could check
>>> their K2/KPA100/KAT100 and see
>>> if they get the same results.
>>>
> Yes, my K2/KPA100/KAT100 does the same thing.
>
> Thatr being said:  I never tried the DISPLAY/TUNE
> feature before to see what the rig will do full-bore,
> nor would I normally vary the power control while
> transmitting a full carrier.  In general, I operate
> either at a few watts, or about 50, or about 100.  So
> I never noticed this 'bug' before.  Near as I can
> tell, the anomaly won't affect my operating, but I am
> intertested to know what you are doing that
> precipitated this discovery and the possible effects
> on your station operation.
>>
>> Hi Steve,

>> Thanks for your reply, you are the only one to date who has reported that
>> they have tried this test. Now I know that it is not just my setup.

>> Since my original mail I have found that this anomaly only occurs when on
>> transmit, and is independent of whether RF is being generated or not.
>> It is also strange, because turning the power control ACW switches the LEDS
>> from HIGH to LOW, but after that, turning the power control CW does not
>> change the LEDS.

>> I know that the KPA100 switches correctly depending on the power control 
>> setting on both transmit and receive, so why doesn't the KAT100 ? 
>> It is only by rotating the power control whilst on receive or switching the 
>> rig on/off that the LEDS indicate correctly.

>> I quite often vary my power during a transmission to get signal reports
>> on different station configurations e.g speech processing, antennas,
>> microphones, etc.

>> This does not really effect my station operation, but is a minor
 >> irritant in that I cannot rely on the LEDS always showing the correct status
>> of my K2/100 power out, as the manual says that they should. 
>>
>>I will probably disconnect the LEDS, as at present they are rather confusing.

>> 73
>> Stewart G3RXQ


>
> __
>


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Re: [Elecraft] power control indicator phenomena

2004-12-31 Thread Vic Rosenthal

Stewart Baker wrote,


Since my original mail I have found that this anomaly only occurs when on
transmit, and is independent of whether RF is being generated or not.



I quite often vary my power during a transmission to get signal reports
on different station configurations e.g speech processing, antennas,
microphones, etc.



This does not really effect my station operation, but is a minor
irritant in that I cannot rely on the LEDS always showing the correct status
of my K2/100 power out, as the manual says that they should. 
I will probably disconnect the LEDS, as at present they are rather confusing.


I have a simpler solution: let go of the PTT when changing power output.

--
73,
Vic, K2VCO
Fresno CA
http://www.qsl.net/k2vco

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Re: [Elecraft] power control indicator phenomena

2004-12-31 Thread Stewart Baker
On Fri, 31 Dec 2004 08:42:38 -0800, Vic Rosenthal wrote:
> Stewart Baker wrote,
>
 Since my original mail I have found that this anomaly only occurs when
 on
 transmit, and is independent of whether RF is being generated or not.

 I quite often vary my power during a transmission to get signal reports
 on different station configurations e.g speech processing, antennas,
 microphones, etc.

 This does not really effect my station operation, but is a minor
 irritant in that I cannot rely on the LEDS always showing the correct
 status
 of my K2/100 power out, as the manual says that they should.
 I will probably disconnect the LEDS, as at present they are rather
 confusing.

> I have a simpler solution: let go of the PTT when changing power output.

Yup - that would do it..

73
Stewart G3RXQ

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