Re: [Emc-users] 3d PDFs was Re: Engaver Tool Changing
what about the xfiles? --- On Tue, 11/29/11, Fox Mulder wrote: From: Fox Mulder Subject: Re: [Emc-users] 3d PDFs was Re: Engaver Tool Changing To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Date: Tuesday, November 29, 2011, 5:42 AM Am 29.11.2011 01:12, schrieb andy pugh: > On 28 November 2011 23:45, Fox Mulder wrote: > >> With current browsers suporting WebGL it is quite easy to embedd a X3D >> model into a web site without any need for an extra plugin. I tried this >> myself some time ago and it worked very good. > > It sort-of works for me, I had to enable it in the "Developer" menu, > and I did get a range of 3D views flashing up briefly, but not in any > way that seemed to be controllable. > The problem is that WebGL as part of the HTML5 standard is quite new and the grade of implementation varies over different browsers. I think it needs a bit more time to straighten up the standard and implementations in the browsers. For my tests i only use latest firefox which renders the 3D content quite well. WebGL is only a interface to OpenGL for native rendering of 3D content in the browser. My example with a X3D file is displayed over a javascript from x3dom which converts the geometry to WebGL language. There is also another javascript collection which uses COLLADA as source format for displaying the geometry in the browser. And i think in the future there will be more powerfull frameworks for WebGL which can read different kinds of source 3D formats. Ciao, Rainer -- All the data continuously generated in your IT infrastructure contains a definitive record of customers, application performance, security threats, fraudulent activity, and more. Splunk takes this data and makes sense of it. IT sense. And common sense. http://p.sf.net/sfu/splunk-novd2d ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- All the data continuously generated in your IT infrastructure contains a definitive record of customers, application performance, security threats, fraudulent activity, and more. Splunk takes this data and makes sense of it. IT sense. And common sense. http://p.sf.net/sfu/splunk-novd2d ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] 3d PDFs was Re: Engaver Tool Changing
Am 29.11.2011 01:12, schrieb andy pugh: > On 28 November 2011 23:45, Fox Mulder wrote: > >> With current browsers suporting WebGL it is quite easy to embedd a X3D >> model into a web site without any need for an extra plugin. I tried this >> myself some time ago and it worked very good. > > It sort-of works for me, I had to enable it in the "Developer" menu, > and I did get a range of 3D views flashing up briefly, but not in any > way that seemed to be controllable. > The problem is that WebGL as part of the HTML5 standard is quite new and the grade of implementation varies over different browsers. I think it needs a bit more time to straighten up the standard and implementations in the browsers. For my tests i only use latest firefox which renders the 3D content quite well. WebGL is only a interface to OpenGL for native rendering of 3D content in the browser. My example with a X3D file is displayed over a javascript from x3dom which converts the geometry to WebGL language. There is also another javascript collection which uses COLLADA as source format for displaying the geometry in the browser. And i think in the future there will be more powerfull frameworks for WebGL which can read different kinds of source 3D formats. Ciao, Rainer -- All the data continuously generated in your IT infrastructure contains a definitive record of customers, application performance, security threats, fraudulent activity, and more. Splunk takes this data and makes sense of it. IT sense. And common sense. http://p.sf.net/sfu/splunk-novd2d ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] 3d PDFs was Re: Engaver Tool Changing
Kent, Rainer; WebGL does only about 5% of what the X3D spec does; mind you, for most users, that is the most important 5%. ;-) As someone who presented X3DOM to the HTML5 Technical Committee on behalf of Dr. Johannes Behr; I think that his approach is a good one. WebGL has its issues; and some big ones at that. But, if they can somehow give it longevity, cross platform compatibility, speed, and keep it focused on some core functionality, it'll do well. I would not keep models in a WebGL format; keep them in, say, STL, and that way you'll be able to re-render them in a few years, should you wish to. (X3D would work, too, as it is an ISO standard; warts and all) JohnS. >>> the data sets into supporting documentation. This in addition to the >>> VRML/x3d models we were already creating and which the community didn't >>> like (we never overcame the problem of poor browser support of VRML >>> after Silicon Graphics went belly up). >> With current browsers suporting WebGL it is quite easy to embedd a X3D >> model into a web site without any need for an extra plugin. I tried this >> myself some time ago and it worked very good. You can see the test file >> at [1] which i created in blender and exported as X3D. >> The documentation how to do it is from the official x3dom homepage at [2]. >> >> Ciao, >> Rainer >> >> [1] https://quakeman.homelinux.net/files/webgl/lcd.html >> [2] http://www.x3dom.org/?page_id=1101 >> > I'm glad it worked for you, Rainer. > > I confess it's hard for me not to feel this is "déjà vu, all over again" > as the saying goes, but maybe this time the technology will stick. > > The community I served had seen the VRML effort peak and fade away long > before and were very suspicious that X3D would go the same way. The > specs kept getting thicker but the applications didn't grow. At the time > we could only predict that things would get better. Considering that > it's taken more than half a decade to get to where you can do what you > did with X3D, they were right to be suspicious. Even now, X3D seems > popular mostly in open-software ventures. This also helps explain my > community's enthusiasm for 3D PDF. It was being touted by a commercial > software giant they trusted to have staying power, Adobe Systems. (Would > it be mean spirited of me to point out what that trust bought them?) -- All the data continuously generated in your IT infrastructure contains a definitive record of customers, application performance, security threats, fraudulent activity, and more. Splunk takes this data and makes sense of it. IT sense. And common sense. http://p.sf.net/sfu/splunk-novd2d ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] 3d PDFs was Re: Engaver Tool Changing
On 11/28/2011 6:45 PM, Fox Mulder wrote: > Am 29.11.2011 00:29, schrieb Kent A. Reed: >> the data sets into supporting documentation. This in addition to the >> VRML/x3d models we were already creating and which the community didn't >> like (we never overcame the problem of poor browser support of VRML >> after Silicon Graphics went belly up). > With current browsers suporting WebGL it is quite easy to embedd a X3D > model into a web site without any need for an extra plugin. I tried this > myself some time ago and it worked very good. You can see the test file > at [1] which i created in blender and exported as X3D. > The documentation how to do it is from the official x3dom homepage at [2]. > > Ciao, > Rainer > > [1] https://quakeman.homelinux.net/files/webgl/lcd.html > [2] http://www.x3dom.org/?page_id=1101 > I'm glad it worked for you, Rainer. I confess it's hard for me not to feel this is "déjà vu, all over again" as the saying goes, but maybe this time the technology will stick. The community I served had seen the VRML effort peak and fade away long before and were very suspicious that X3D would go the same way. The specs kept getting thicker but the applications didn't grow. At the time we could only predict that things would get better. Considering that it's taken more than half a decade to get to where you can do what you did with X3D, they were right to be suspicious. Even now, X3D seems popular mostly in open-software ventures. This also helps explain my community's enthusiasm for 3D PDF. It was being touted by a commercial software giant they trusted to have staying power, Adobe Systems. (Would it be mean spirited of me to point out what that trust bought them?) Regard, Kent -- All the data continuously generated in your IT infrastructure contains a definitive record of customers, application performance, security threats, fraudulent activity, and more. Splunk takes this data and makes sense of it. IT sense. And common sense. http://p.sf.net/sfu/splunk-novd2d ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] 3d PDFs was Re: Engaver Tool Changing
On Mon, Nov 28, 2011 at 7:12 PM, andy pugh wrote: > On 28 November 2011 23:45, Fox Mulder wrote: > > > With current browsers suporting WebGL it is quite easy to embedd a X3D > > model into a web site without any need for an extra plugin. I tried this > > myself some time ago and it worked very good. > > > Using Firefox 3.6.17 I got all kinds of security alerts about nontrusted sites etc... Once I excepted through those, I got a 3XDOM not supported by my browser notice. Hmmm... perhaps I have an old browser version... -- All the data continuously generated in your IT infrastructure contains a definitive record of customers, application performance, security threats, fraudulent activity, and more. Splunk takes this data and makes sense of it. IT sense. And common sense. http://p.sf.net/sfu/splunk-novd2d ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] 3d PDFs was Re: Engaver Tool Changing
On 28 November 2011 23:45, Fox Mulder wrote: > With current browsers suporting WebGL it is quite easy to embedd a X3D > model into a web site without any need for an extra plugin. I tried this > myself some time ago and it worked very good. It sort-of works for me, I had to enable it in the "Developer" menu, and I did get a range of 3D views flashing up briefly, but not in any way that seemed to be controllable. -- atp The idea that there is no such thing as objective truth is, quite simply, wrong. -- All the data continuously generated in your IT infrastructure contains a definitive record of customers, application performance, security threats, fraudulent activity, and more. Splunk takes this data and makes sense of it. IT sense. And common sense. http://p.sf.net/sfu/splunk-novd2d ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] 3d PDFs was Re: Engaver Tool Changing
Am 29.11.2011 00:29, schrieb Kent A. Reed: > the data sets into supporting documentation. This in addition to the > VRML/x3d models we were already creating and which the community didn't > like (we never overcame the problem of poor browser support of VRML > after Silicon Graphics went belly up). With current browsers suporting WebGL it is quite easy to embedd a X3D model into a web site without any need for an extra plugin. I tried this myself some time ago and it worked very good. You can see the test file at [1] which i created in blender and exported as X3D. The documentation how to do it is from the official x3dom homepage at [2]. Ciao, Rainer [1] https://quakeman.homelinux.net/files/webgl/lcd.html [2] http://www.x3dom.org/?page_id=1101 -- All the data continuously generated in your IT infrastructure contains a definitive record of customers, application performance, security threats, fraudulent activity, and more. Splunk takes this data and makes sense of it. IT sense. And common sense. http://p.sf.net/sfu/splunk-novd2d ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] 3d PDFs was Re: Engaver Tool Changing
On 11/28/2011 3:12 PM, Edward Bernard wrote: > Wow! That is way cool. I had no idea the 3d feature would do sections. But > why in the world would Adobe drop such a great feature? > My guess, hardly anyone uses it in PDF exchanges and Adobe decided it didn't want it hanging around to create legacy-support issues. I remember the architecture/engineering/construction sector getting excited about it when first announced. Bentley quickly built it into its Microstation CAD products to support the exchange of "browsable" 3D models in construction documents. Back in my days at NIST, we created one of the first tool chains to take advantage of Adobe's beta-release in order to take reference data sets we were creating to test AEC CAD data exchange and embed viewable 3D models (e.g., u3d) represented by the data sets into supporting documentation. This in addition to the VRML/x3d models we were already creating and which the community didn't like (we never overcame the problem of poor browser support of VRML after Silicon Graphics went belly up). A quick search in Google on '3d pdf' suggests that it never went much farther. Yet Another Episode in the ongoing soap opera called "The tyranny of the marketplace." Regards, Kent -- All the data continuously generated in your IT infrastructure contains a definitive record of customers, application performance, security threats, fraudulent activity, and more. Splunk takes this data and makes sense of it. IT sense. And common sense. http://p.sf.net/sfu/splunk-novd2d ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] 3d PDFs was Re: Engaver Tool Changing
Wow! That is way cool. I had no idea the 3d feature would do sections. But why in the world would Adobe drop such a great feature? > > From: John Prentice >To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) >Sent: Monday, November 28, 2011 1:05 PM >Subject: [Emc-users] 3d PDFs was Re: Engaver Tool Changing > >Greetings >> >Andy Pugh wrote: >> If you click the "jpg" and have a recent version of Acrobat youshould >> get a 3D-viewable model. >> >> However, I have no idea how widespread the 3D PDF format is, it was >> just what was available on my machine when it was running Windows and >> modelling in Alibre. >> > >This functionality was in Acrobat 9 and, I think Acrobat 8. The standard >free "Adobe Reader" - though not all plugins - will render the 3d views. > >You can rotate, section -based on an offset from any of the principal >planes - and even rotate the cutting plane. > >Most such PDFs include the model tree in which you can hide parts of the >assembly (e.g. a cover). > >Example at www.castlewoodconsultants.com/Misc/Example3DPDF.JPG > > >With Acrobat 9 Professional you open a document with whitespace to place the >3D model, use Tools>Multimedia>3D Tool and drag a rectangle, you are >prompted for the name of a .u3d file to display in it. > >The .u3d file comes from your 3D CAD package. I use Pro|E where it is a >File>Save As a Copy but Google suggests Alibre and Solidworks both export in >this format too. The CAD feature tree becomes the tree in the .u3d file. > >The bad news is that Adobe have dropped the functionality in the latest >version (Acrobat X) > >John Prentice > > >-- >All the data continuously generated in your IT infrastructure >contains a definitive record of customers, application performance, >security threats, fraudulent activity, and more. Splunk takes this >data and makes sense of it. IT sense. And common sense. >http://p.sf.net/sfu/splunk-novd2d >___ >Emc-users mailing list >Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net >https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > > > -- All the data continuously generated in your IT infrastructure contains a definitive record of customers, application performance, security threats, fraudulent activity, and more. Splunk takes this data and makes sense of it. IT sense. And common sense. http://p.sf.net/sfu/splunk-novd2d ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
[Emc-users] 3d PDFs was Re: Engaver Tool Changing
Greetings > Andy Pugh wrote: > If you click the "jpg" and have a recent version of Acrobat youshould > get a 3D-viewable model. > > However, I have no idea how widespread the 3D PDF format is, it was > just what was available on my machine when it was running Windows and > modelling in Alibre. > This functionality was in Acrobat 9 and, I think Acrobat 8. The standard free "Adobe Reader" - though not all plugins - will render the 3d views. You can rotate, section -based on an offset from any of the principal planes - and even rotate the cutting plane. Most such PDFs include the model tree in which you can hide parts of the assembly (e.g. a cover). Example at www.castlewoodconsultants.com/Misc/Example3DPDF.JPG With Acrobat 9 Professional you open a document with whitespace to place the 3D model, use Tools>Multimedia>3D Tool and drag a rectangle, you are prompted for the name of a .u3d file to display in it. The .u3d file comes from your 3D CAD package. I use Pro|E where it is a File>Save As a Copy but Google suggests Alibre and Solidworks both export in this format too. The CAD feature tree becomes the tree in the .u3d file. The bad news is that Adobe have dropped the functionality in the latest version (Acrobat X) John Prentice -- All the data continuously generated in your IT infrastructure contains a definitive record of customers, application performance, security threats, fraudulent activity, and more. Splunk takes this data and makes sense of it. IT sense. And common sense. http://p.sf.net/sfu/splunk-novd2d ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
