Re: [Emc-users] debian locks on boot

[Jon Elson]

On 02/25/2016 09:08 PM, Kirk Wallace wrote:
> My guess is that the driver for the wireless adapter tries 
> to set up the adapter as well as set up PC to work with 
> it. The driver seems to fail at the adapter setup, so the 
> PC bit fails too. It may be that the Windows sets the 
> adapter properly and this carries over to the next Linux 
> boot. I've seen this same behavior with other wireless and 
> video capture and tuner adapters on Linux. I have pretty 
> much given up on wireless adapters with Linux and save 
> time by using a wireless router plugged into the PC's 
> wired Ethernet port. It saves a lot of grief. 
I have a Dell Latitude 630 that runs Linux just fine, with 
either wired ethernet or wireless.  I used to run
a 10.04 Ubuntu (but NOT with rtai kernel).  If I ran the 
rtai kernel, some of the management stuff was interfered 
with, the most noticeable thing was it would not shut off.  
Also, if you suspended or hibernated it, it would not come 
back out of that state.  I then reloaded it with 12.04, and 
everything seems to work fine.  There is still a bit of a 
quirk, if you hibernate or suspend, you have to manually 
brighten the screen after coming back on, and every time it 
blanks the screen you have to bring the brightness back up.

But, no network problems on that PARTICULAR machine.  I've 
even run it with both wired and wireless running at the same 
time, in places that had restricted access on one of those 
networks.
(This probably is no help to your particular problem.)

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] debian locks on boot

[Kirk Wallace]

On 02/25/2016 06:35 PM, Jim Craig wrote:
... snip

> I then booted to windows to see if the wireless adapter was still
> working there. It was. So I rebooted to Debian and low and behold it
> booted fine to Debian without issue and connected to the wireless network.
>
> I worked on the PC and got it configured the way I wanted it. All while
> working on the wireless network. No issues.
>
> I took the PC to my Dad's house. Booted it and it locked up when he was
> logging in.
>
> Rebooted into windows. The wireless adapter worked fine. Rebooted into
> Debian and it booted fine this time also. Connected to my Dad's wireless
> internet and it is working at the moment.
>
> What in the world is causing this weird behavior?

My guess is that the driver for the wireless adapter tries to set up the 
adapter as well as set up PC to work with it. The driver seems to fail 
at the adapter setup, so the PC bit fails too. It may be that the 
Windows sets the adapter properly and this carries over to the next 
Linux boot. I've seen this same behavior with other wireless and video 
capture and tuner adapters on Linux. I have pretty much given up on 
wireless adapters with Linux and save time by using a wireless router 
plugged into the PC's wired Ethernet port. It saves a lot of grief.


-- 
Kirk Wallace
http://www.wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/
http://www.wallacecompany.com/E45/

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Re: [Emc-users] debian locks on boot

[Jim Craig]

Just to follow up with what I have found.

I decided that I would try to reinstall the OS as was mentioned. I put 
in the 2.6.8 disc and started the install process. Once I reached the 
part of the install where it was configuring the network it would lock 
up. I was connecting to my local network with the wireless adapter.

I then tried to boot to the live CD image and it again locked up when it 
started to load the x window interface.

After screwing with it for several attempts I decided to hard wire the 
PC to the network. I did that and it would boot and operate fine. 
Disconnect the wired internet and it would lock up. This narrowed it 
down to the wireless network adapter being the culprit. I decided to 
reinstall with the 2.7 install disc to see if that would help.

I reinstalled and once again if I disconnected from the wired internet 
and it wanted to switch to the wireless it would lock up.

I then booted to windows to see if the wireless adapter was still 
working there. It was. So I rebooted to Debian and low and behold it 
booted fine to Debian without issue and connected to the wireless network.

I worked on the PC and got it configured the way I wanted it. All while 
working on the wireless network. No issues.

I took the PC to my Dad's house. Booted it and it locked up when he was 
logging in.

Rebooted into windows. The wireless adapter worked fine. Rebooted into 
Debian and it booted fine this time also. Connected to my Dad's wireless 
internet and it is working at the moment.

What in the world is causing this weird behavior?

Thanks for the advise so far. Hopefully it continues to work.

Jim


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Re: [Emc-users] debian locks on boot

[bari]

Your APU and chipset should work just fine with Debian and they already 
have.

I'd try a fresh install and see if it works again. Then maybe run 
memtest for a few hours. It could be flaky hardware but I'd reformat and 
reinstall to rule out software being the problem first. Pay attention to 
any updates or changes to drivers after you install to see if they have 
issues.
> Anyway about the computer
>
> CPU AMD E-450 APU with Radeon HD Graphics 1650 MHz
> 4gb RAM


On 02/23/2016 08:38 PM, Jim Craig wrote:
> I installed the iso image from 2.6.8 on my dads laptop. I had everything
> working the way I wanted it last night. I powered it down and then
> tonight when It boots up the system will lock up within 10 to 15 seconds
> of getting to the login screen.
>
> If I am fast I can login to they system and the xwindow shell comes up
> but it will still lock up before the entire system can start.
>
> By lockup I mean the mouse does nothing, and apparently the keyboard
> does nothing.
>
> If I do ctrl+alt+F1 to F6 nothing happens.
>
> I have booted into the recover option (second option in grub) and I can
> use the startx command and it will bring up the xwindow shell and work
> just fine.
>
> Please help me troubleshoot. I have been googling the topic but I have
> not found the solution yet.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jim
>
>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] debian locks on boot

[Eric Keller]

On Wed, Feb 24, 2016 at 7:45 AM, Jim Craig  wrote:
>
> Anyway about the computer
>
> CPU AMD E-450 APU with Radeon HD Graphics 1650 MHz
> 4gb RAM
>

that's interesting, I have an AMD E350 that I just installed 32 bit
Ubuntu 14.04 on and it runs fine so far. My experience with these
kinds of locks is that it's the graphics driver.  I had an earlier AMD
processor that would lock up randomly under Ubuntu 10, but 12 fixed
that.  I never got around to troubleshooting it after the upgrade
worked. I think you can debug over a serial cable, but I never thought
it was worth it.

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Re: [Emc-users] debian locks on boot

[Jim Craig]

On 2/23/2016 10:21 PM, Jon Elson wrote:
> On 02/23/2016 08:38 PM, Jim Craig wrote:
>> I installed the iso image from 2.6.8 on my dads laptop. I had everything
>> working the way I wanted it last night. I powered it down and then
>> tonight when It boots up the system will lock up within 10 to 15 seconds
>> of getting to the login screen.
>>
>> If I am fast I can login to they system and the xwindow shell comes up
>> but it will still lock up before the entire system can start.
>>
>> By lockup I mean the mouse does nothing, and apparently the keyboard
>> does nothing.
>>
>> If I do ctrl+alt+F1 to F6 nothing happens.
>>
>> I have booted into the recover option (second option in grub) and I can
>> use the startx command and it will bring up the xwindow shell and work
>> just fine.
>>
>> Please help me troubleshoot. I have been googling the topic but I have
>> not found the solution yet.
>>
>>
> Hmmm, so this is a LinuxCNC install?  Will you actually be
> running LinuxCNC on this?  (Real time and laptops don't
> coexist all that well, although the trouble USUALLY only
> starts when you try to run actual real time stuff.)
>
> One of the big problems is that laptops do all sorts of
> system management stuff in the machine BIOS, such as battery
> management, thermal management, emergency shutdown upon low
> battery or CPU overheat, etc.
> Running RT OS's can disable part of these features on
> certain machines.
>
> Right now, I'm running Ubuntu 12.04 (without the rtai
> option) on a few laptops, and it seems to work pretty well.
>
> One thing you can do is a Google search on the specific
> version of Debian and the laptop model, and see if there are
> known problems. I'm not clear, but it seems you say that if
> you use the recovery boot and start X manually, then it is
> stable.  So, that may mean that either X is starting at the
> wrong time, before something else is ready for it, or that
> somehow the manual start brings up a different X
> configuration that works better.  Possibly the graphics
> driver that is used is different in the two cases, lots of
> machines are sensitive to which graphics driver is used, and
> there are some different drivers that can use less
> accelerated graphics features and may be more reliable.
>
> If you give me some more specific info that "your dad's
> laptop" I might be able to dig up something pertinent.
>
> Jon
>
OK, Here is some more information on the computer. I thought "Dads 
Laptop" was sufficient! LOL!

I don't need the real time kernel. I thought for my own sanity that I 
had better install the same thing that I am using here. I was going to 
update and pull a standard kernel during the update.

The weird thing about this is that it would boot fine two nights ago. I 
powered it down when I finished with it Monday night and now it won't 
finish booting unless in recovery mode.

I installed several applications using apt-get. Icedove, gedit, 
GpicView, GnuCash, AisleRiot Solitare, Wine. I was trying to use wine 
but in the end I did not need it.

Anyway about the computer

CPU AMD E-450 APU with Radeon HD Graphics 1650 MHz
4gb RAM

using lspci I get the following
00:00.0 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] Family 14h Processor 
Root Complex
00:01.0 VGA compatible controller: Advanced Micro Deices [AMD] nee ATI 
Wrestler [Radeon HD 6320]
00:01.1 Audio device: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI Wrestler HDMI 
Audio [Radeon HD 6250/6310]
00:11.0 SATA Controller: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI 
SB7x0/SB8x0S/B9x0 SATA controller [AHCI mode]
00:12.0 USB Controller: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI 
SB7x0/SB8x0S/B9x0 USB OHCIO controller
00:12.2 USB controller: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI 
SB7x0/SB8x0S/B9x0 USB EHCI controller
00:13.0 USB Controller: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI 
SB7x0/SB8x0S/B9x0 USB OHCIO controller
00:13.2 USB controller: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI 
SB7x0/SB8x0S/B9x0 USB EHCI controller
00:14.0 SMBus: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI SBx00 SMBus 
Conroller (rev 42)
00:14.2 Audio device: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI SBx00 Azalia 
(Intel HDA) (rev 40
00:14.3 ISA bridge: Advancecd Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI 
SB7x0/SB8x0/SB9x0 LPC host controller (rev 40)
00:14.4 PCI bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee SBx00 PCI to PCI 
Bridge (rev 40)
00:14.5 USB controller: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI 
SB7x0/SB8x0/SB9x0 USB OHIC2 Controller
00:15.0 PCI bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI 
SB700/SB800/SB900 PCI to PCI bridge (PCIE port 0)
00:15.1 PCI bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI 
SB700/SB800/SB900 PCI to PCI bridge (PCIE port 1)
00:15.2 PCI bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI 
SB700/SB800/SB900 PCI to PCI bridge (PCIE port 2)
00:16.0 USB controller: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI 
SB7x0/SB8x0/SB9x0 USB OICIO Controller
00:16.2 USB controller: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI 
SB7x0/SB8x0/SB9x0 USB EHCI Controller
00:18.0 Host Bridge: Advanced Micro Devices 

Re: [Emc-users] debian locks on boot

[Todd Zuercher]

- Original Message -
From: "Lawrence Glaister" <ve...@shaw.ca>
To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" <emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net>
Sent: Wednesday, February 24, 2016 1:22:29 AM
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] debian locks on boot


what versions of emc/linuxcnc iso images require PAE cpus to run?

As far as I know no version of Linuxcnc requires a PAE kernel.

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Re: [Emc-users] debian locks on boot

[Lawrence Glaister]

I have a laptop that exhibits similar symptoms.

(Note this is a very nice ruggedized laptop from a police cruiser.)
It was discarded because windows 8 and 10 will not run on the Pentium M 
cpu's.

Installing a modern distribution with a PAE kernel will work sometimes 
long enough to log in and other times it locks up at the login screen.
Booting into recovery mode seems to work, not sure what recovery mode 
does, it may not try and use PAE related instructions.


I tracked it down to the laptop having a Pentium M cpu. These Pentium 
M's are odd ducks. There are 2 versions... 400Mhz FSB and 533Mhz FSB 
(front side bus). The 400Mhz chips do not support PAE and all the modern 
distributions since ubuntu 10.04 seem to assume you have a cpu capable 
of PAE.  The 533MHz fsb version of the chip does not advertise as having 
PAE, but it actually does and you can get it to work by booting with the 
forcepae boot option.

cat /proc/cpuinfo

This will display the CPU model info and the flags available (look for 
the model name and pae in the flags)

Since my laptop only has 2Gb of ram, I dont need PAE kernels. I have 
tried rebuilding the linux mint 17.3 kernel but have not found the magic 
combination of switches to turn off PAE and the highmem stuff.
Rebuilding the kernel is painful... about 6 hours on an old P4 3.2Ghz 
box with 2GB ram.

I found I had an old cdrom with EMC and Ubuntu 10.04. This installed 
successfully and runs nicely. So far, the only software I updated was 
firefox directly from the firefox website ( version 20 to version 44! ).
The archived repositories do provide some upgrades, but 10.04 is 2 years 
past its LTS lifetime.

Question for the group

what versions of emc/linuxcnc iso images require PAE cpus to run?

cheers
Lawrence VE7IT



On 16-02-23 08:21 PM, Jon Elson wrote:
> On 02/23/2016 08:38 PM, Jim Craig wrote:
>> I installed the iso image from 2.6.8 on my dads laptop. I had everything
>> working the way I wanted it last night. I powered it down and then
>> tonight when It boots up the system will lock up within 10 to 15 seconds
>> of getting to the login screen.
>>
>> If I am fast I can login to they system and the xwindow shell comes up
>> but it will still lock up before the entire system can start.
>>
>> By lockup I mean the mouse does nothing, and apparently the keyboard
>> does nothing.
>>
>> If I do ctrl+alt+F1 to F6 nothing happens.
>>
>> I have booted into the recover option (second option in grub) and I can
>> use the startx command and it will bring up the xwindow shell and work
>> just fine.
>>
>> Please help me troubleshoot. I have been googling the topic but I have
>> not found the solution yet.
>>
>>
> Hmmm, so this is a LinuxCNC install?  Will you actually be
> running LinuxCNC on this?  (Real time and laptops don't
> coexist all that well, although the trouble USUALLY only
> starts when you try to run actual real time stuff.)
>
> One of the big problems is that laptops do all sorts of
> system management stuff in the machine BIOS, such as battery
> management, thermal management, emergency shutdown upon low
> battery or CPU overheat, etc.
> Running RT OS's can disable part of these features on
> certain machines.
>
> Right now, I'm running Ubuntu 12.04 (without the rtai
> option) on a few laptops, and it seems to work pretty well.
>
> One thing you can do is a Google search on the specific
> version of Debian and the laptop model, and see if there are
> known problems. I'm not clear, but it seems you say that if
> you use the recovery boot and start X manually, then it is
> stable.  So, that may mean that either X is starting at the
> wrong time, before something else is ready for it, or that
> somehow the manual start brings up a different X
> configuration that works better.  Possibly the graphics
> driver that is used is different in the two cases, lots of
> machines are sensitive to which graphics driver is used, and
> there are some different drivers that can use less
> accelerated graphics features and may be more reliable.
>
> If you give me some more specific info that "your dad's
> laptop" I might be able to dig up something pertinent.
>
> Jon
>
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Re: [Emc-users] debian locks on boot

[Jon Elson]

On 02/23/2016 08:38 PM, Jim Craig wrote:
> I installed the iso image from 2.6.8 on my dads laptop. I had everything
> working the way I wanted it last night. I powered it down and then
> tonight when It boots up the system will lock up within 10 to 15 seconds
> of getting to the login screen.
>
> If I am fast I can login to they system and the xwindow shell comes up
> but it will still lock up before the entire system can start.
>
> By lockup I mean the mouse does nothing, and apparently the keyboard
> does nothing.
>
> If I do ctrl+alt+F1 to F6 nothing happens.
>
> I have booted into the recover option (second option in grub) and I can
> use the startx command and it will bring up the xwindow shell and work
> just fine.
>
> Please help me troubleshoot. I have been googling the topic but I have
> not found the solution yet.
>
>
Hmmm, so this is a LinuxCNC install?  Will you actually be 
running LinuxCNC on this?  (Real time and laptops don't 
coexist all that well, although the trouble USUALLY only 
starts when you try to run actual real time stuff.)

One of the big problems is that laptops do all sorts of 
system management stuff in the machine BIOS, such as battery 
management, thermal management, emergency shutdown upon low 
battery or CPU overheat, etc.
Running RT OS's can disable part of these features on 
certain machines.

Right now, I'm running Ubuntu 12.04 (without the rtai 
option) on a few laptops, and it seems to work pretty well.

One thing you can do is a Google search on the specific 
version of Debian and the laptop model, and see if there are 
known problems. I'm not clear, but it seems you say that if 
you use the recovery boot and start X manually, then it is 
stable.  So, that may mean that either X is starting at the 
wrong time, before something else is ready for it, or that 
somehow the manual start brings up a different X 
configuration that works better.  Possibly the graphics 
driver that is used is different in the two cases, lots of 
machines are sensitive to which graphics driver is used, and 
there are some different drivers that can use less 
accelerated graphics features and may be more reliable.

If you give me some more specific info that "your dad's 
laptop" I might be able to dig up something pertinent.

Jon

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[Emc-users] debian locks on boot

[Jim Craig]

I installed the iso image from 2.6.8 on my dads laptop. I had everything 
working the way I wanted it last night. I powered it down and then 
tonight when It boots up the system will lock up within 10 to 15 seconds 
of getting to the login screen.

If I am fast I can login to they system and the xwindow shell comes up 
but it will still lock up before the entire system can start.

By lockup I mean the mouse does nothing, and apparently the keyboard 
does nothing.

If I do ctrl+alt+F1 to F6 nothing happens.

I have booted into the recover option (second option in grub) and I can 
use the startx command and it will bring up the xwindow shell and work 
just fine.

Please help me troubleshoot. I have been googling the topic but I have 
not found the solution yet.

Thanks,

Jim



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