Re: [E-devel] HELP WANTED: Distro/platform packaging status of efl and E

2015-04-12 Thread Stefan Schmidt 
Hello.

On 12/04/15 13:22, Leif Middelschulte wrote:
>> Am 09.04.2015 um 12:35 schrieb Stefan Schmidt :
>>
>> Hello.
>>
>> On 09/04/15 12:29, Leif Middelschulte wrote:
 Am 09.04.2015 um 11:22 schrieb Stefan Schmidt :

 Hello.

 On 09/04/15 10:47, Tom Hacohen wrote:
> On 09/04/15 01:14, Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) wrote:
>> On Wed, 08 Apr 2015 12:31:13 +0100 Tom Hacohen  
>> said:
>>
>>> On 08/04/15 11:26, thomasg wrote:
 On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:27 AM, Tom Hacohen 
 wrote:
> On 08/04/15 10:20, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
>> Hello.
>>
>> At the EFL Dev Day US during the talk from Lars he brought up the 
>> point
>> that EFL is heavily outdated in many distros and platforms. While I
>> instantly agree to this I wondered how bad it really is.
>>
>> I think as a developer as well as a user it makes sense for us to 
>> know
>> what versions of EFL and friends are packaged in which distros and
>> platforms. Thus I started to pull together a wiki page for it.
>>
>> https://phab.enlightenment.org/w/packaging_status/
>>
>> Its a tedious work and I only started today. Feel free to jump in and
>> update the links and versions for your beloved distro. Please go with
>> main package repositories first. You can add a line for a 
>> overlay/ppa if
>> it is well maintained. When filling a new field please add the link 
>> as
>> you can already see in existing entries. That way we have a page 
>> where
>> we can easily look for the latest versions and update.
>>
>> My plan is to fill in more items over time (hoping for some
>> crowdsourcing here) and run a quick update of versions numbers once a
>> month (already set a calendar entry for it).
> I wrote "latest" for every package of Arch. It's too crazy to maintain
> it for Arch, and it's always up to date anyway.
 If it's too crazy to update a wiki page, no wonder the maintainers
 might find it crazy to do up-to-date packaging :P
>>> It's too crazy for us to maintain 2000 boxes of a table. :)
>>> Yes btw, we release too often nowadays (the micro releases), and it's
>>> becoming more and more annoying to stay up to date, and I think that's
>>> why Arch has been so slow recently with micro releases for the efl.
>> look at:
>>
>> https://www.enlightenment.org/doku.php?id=download-latest
>>
>> look at the top - it's a bunch of variables for version of that package. 
>> that's
>> it. url and label is generates from the vars. just update those vars at 
>> release
>> of anything (add more vars and table entries when new stuff is being 
>> released
>> that wasn't before).
>>
>>
> I'm talking about two things:
> 1. Maintaining the 2000 cells of the table. You have to check the
> distro's websites (or script it, and then it's fine) in order to update
> those. Your approach doesn't matter there.
 Its easy to make it sounding scarry when using factor 10. Its actually
 231 cells. Not all of them need to be updated.

 If someone wants to script this I would be happy. Given that I do not
 see this happening I will do it manually and see how this goes.
>>> https://phab.enlightenment.org/P116  
>>> > 
>>> php script fetches the current arch linux package version of the efl.
>>> I also wrote a bash script (https://phab.enlightenment.org/P115 
>>>  >> >) that creates a transparent .png 
>>> since that might be easier to include in the wiki.
>> Cool. Are you willing to extend this script to work for all listed
>> distros in the wiki? Arch alone does not bring me much but if we can
>> cover a lot more distros and generate the table for it that would help.
>> Even if I had to do some updates on my own.
> I've changed the script. It's written in python now and currently scraps the 
> version information for: arch, ubuntu, debian, fedora, elive, openSuSE 13.2, 
> gentoo, Tizen: Common
> Others can be easily added. Maybe add a link to the script in the wiki page?

That would be great. Thanks for your work!

I will give it a try next week.

regards
Stefan Schmidt

--
BPM Camp - Free Virtual Workshop May 6th at 10am PDT/1PM EDT
Develop your own process in accordance with the BPMN 2 standard
Learn Process modeling best practices with Bonita BPM through live exercises
http://www.bonitasoft.com/be-part-of-it/events/bpm-camp-virtual- event?utm_
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Re: [E-devel] HELP WANTED: Distro/platform packaging status of efl and E

2015-04-12 Thread Leif Middelschulte 

> Am 09.04.2015 um 12:35 schrieb Stefan Schmidt :
> 
> Hello.
> 
> On 09/04/15 12:29, Leif Middelschulte wrote:
>>> Am 09.04.2015 um 11:22 schrieb Stefan Schmidt :
>>> 
>>> Hello.
>>> 
>>> On 09/04/15 10:47, Tom Hacohen wrote:
 On 09/04/15 01:14, Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) wrote:
> On Wed, 08 Apr 2015 12:31:13 +0100 Tom Hacohen  
> said:
> 
>> On 08/04/15 11:26, thomasg wrote:
>>> On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:27 AM, Tom Hacohen 
>>> wrote:
 On 08/04/15 10:20, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
> Hello.
> 
> At the EFL Dev Day US during the talk from Lars he brought up the 
> point
> that EFL is heavily outdated in many distros and platforms. While I
> instantly agree to this I wondered how bad it really is.
> 
> I think as a developer as well as a user it makes sense for us to know
> what versions of EFL and friends are packaged in which distros and
> platforms. Thus I started to pull together a wiki page for it.
> 
> https://phab.enlightenment.org/w/packaging_status/
> 
> Its a tedious work and I only started today. Feel free to jump in and
> update the links and versions for your beloved distro. Please go with
> main package repositories first. You can add a line for a overlay/ppa 
> if
> it is well maintained. When filling a new field please add the link as
> you can already see in existing entries. That way we have a page where
> we can easily look for the latest versions and update.
> 
> My plan is to fill in more items over time (hoping for some
> crowdsourcing here) and run a quick update of versions numbers once a
> month (already set a calendar entry for it).
 I wrote "latest" for every package of Arch. It's too crazy to maintain
 it for Arch, and it's always up to date anyway.
>>> If it's too crazy to update a wiki page, no wonder the maintainers
>>> might find it crazy to do up-to-date packaging :P
>> It's too crazy for us to maintain 2000 boxes of a table. :)
>> Yes btw, we release too often nowadays (the micro releases), and it's
>> becoming more and more annoying to stay up to date, and I think that's
>> why Arch has been so slow recently with micro releases for the efl.
> look at:
> 
> https://www.enlightenment.org/doku.php?id=download-latest
> 
> look at the top - it's a bunch of variables for version of that package. 
> that's
> it. url and label is generates from the vars. just update those vars at 
> release
> of anything (add more vars and table entries when new stuff is being 
> released
> that wasn't before).
> 
> 
 I'm talking about two things:
 1. Maintaining the 2000 cells of the table. You have to check the
 distro's websites (or script it, and then it's fine) in order to update
 those. Your approach doesn't matter there.
>>> Its easy to make it sounding scarry when using factor 10. Its actually
>>> 231 cells. Not all of them need to be updated.
>>> 
>>> If someone wants to script this I would be happy. Given that I do not
>>> see this happening I will do it manually and see how this goes.
>> https://phab.enlightenment.org/P116  
>> > 
>> php script fetches the current arch linux package version of the efl.
>> I also wrote a bash script (https://phab.enlightenment.org/P115 
>>  > >) that creates a transparent .png 
>> since that might be easier to include in the wiki.
> 
> Cool. Are you willing to extend this script to work for all listed
> distros in the wiki? Arch alone does not bring me much but if we can
> cover a lot more distros and generate the table for it that would help.
> Even if I had to do some updates on my own.
I've changed the script. It's written in python now and currently scraps the 
version information for: arch, ubuntu, debian, fedora, elive, openSuSE 13.2, 
gentoo, Tizen: Common
Others can be easily added. Maybe add a link to the script in the wiki page?

Cheers,

Leif
> 
> regards
> Stefan Schmidt
> 
> --
> BPM Camp - Free Virtual Workshop May 6th at 10am PDT/1PM EDT
> Develop your own process in accordance with the BPMN 2 standard
> Learn Process modeling best practices with Bonita BPM through live exercises
> http://www.bonitasoft.com/be-part-of-it/events/bpm-camp-virtual- event?utm_
> source=Sourceforge_BPM_Camp_5_6_15&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=VA_SF
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> enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment

Re: [E-devel] HELP WANTED: Distro/platform packaging status of efl and E

2015-04-09 Thread Stefan Schmidt 
Hello.

On 08/04/15 11:20, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
> Hello.
>
> At the EFL Dev Day US during the talk from Lars he brought up the point
> that EFL is heavily outdated in many distros and platforms. While I
> instantly agree to this I wondered how bad it really is.
>
> I think as a developer as well as a user it makes sense for us to know
> what versions of EFL and friends are packaged in which distros and
> platforms. Thus I started to pull together a wiki page for it.
>
> https://phab.enlightenment.org/w/packaging_status/
>
> Its a tedious work and I only started today. Feel free to jump in and
> update the links and versions for your beloved distro. Please go with
> main package repositories first. You can add a line for a overlay/ppa if
> it is well maintained. When filling a new field please add the link as
> you can already see in existing entries. That way we have a page where
> we can easily look for the latest versions and update.
>
> My plan is to fill in more items over time (hoping for some
> crowdsourcing here) and run a quick update of versions numbers once a
> month (already set a calendar entry for it).

Thanks to everyone who helped and filled in some rows of the table!

We miss information for: elive, Linux Mint, Mageia, CentOS, RHEL,
Windows and Tizen.

If someone has knowledge about them/uses packages from them please add
it to the wiki. I will try to fill out the blank cells next week.

regards
Stefan Schmidt

--
BPM Camp - Free Virtual Workshop May 6th at 10am PDT/1PM EDT
Develop your own process in accordance with the BPMN 2 standard
Learn Process modeling best practices with Bonita BPM through live exercises
http://www.bonitasoft.com/be-part-of-it/events/bpm-camp-virtual- event?utm_
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Re: [E-devel] HELP WANTED: Distro/platform packaging status of efl and E

2015-04-09 Thread Stefan Schmidt 
Hello.

On 09/04/15 12:29, Leif Middelschulte wrote:
>> Am 09.04.2015 um 11:22 schrieb Stefan Schmidt :
>>
>> Hello.
>>
>> On 09/04/15 10:47, Tom Hacohen wrote:
>>> On 09/04/15 01:14, Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) wrote:
 On Wed, 08 Apr 2015 12:31:13 +0100 Tom Hacohen  
 said:

> On 08/04/15 11:26, thomasg wrote:
>> On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:27 AM, Tom Hacohen 
>> wrote:
>>> On 08/04/15 10:20, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
 Hello.

 At the EFL Dev Day US during the talk from Lars he brought up the point
 that EFL is heavily outdated in many distros and platforms. While I
 instantly agree to this I wondered how bad it really is.

 I think as a developer as well as a user it makes sense for us to know
 what versions of EFL and friends are packaged in which distros and
 platforms. Thus I started to pull together a wiki page for it.

 https://phab.enlightenment.org/w/packaging_status/

 Its a tedious work and I only started today. Feel free to jump in and
 update the links and versions for your beloved distro. Please go with
 main package repositories first. You can add a line for a overlay/ppa 
 if
 it is well maintained. When filling a new field please add the link as
 you can already see in existing entries. That way we have a page where
 we can easily look for the latest versions and update.

 My plan is to fill in more items over time (hoping for some
 crowdsourcing here) and run a quick update of versions numbers once a
 month (already set a calendar entry for it).
>>> I wrote "latest" for every package of Arch. It's too crazy to maintain
>>> it for Arch, and it's always up to date anyway.
>> If it's too crazy to update a wiki page, no wonder the maintainers
>> might find it crazy to do up-to-date packaging :P
> It's too crazy for us to maintain 2000 boxes of a table. :)
> Yes btw, we release too often nowadays (the micro releases), and it's
> becoming more and more annoying to stay up to date, and I think that's
> why Arch has been so slow recently with micro releases for the efl.
 look at:

 https://www.enlightenment.org/doku.php?id=download-latest

 look at the top - it's a bunch of variables for version of that package. 
 that's
 it. url and label is generates from the vars. just update those vars at 
 release
 of anything (add more vars and table entries when new stuff is being 
 released
 that wasn't before).


>>> I'm talking about two things:
>>> 1. Maintaining the 2000 cells of the table. You have to check the
>>> distro's websites (or script it, and then it's fine) in order to update
>>> those. Your approach doesn't matter there.
>> Its easy to make it sounding scarry when using factor 10. Its actually
>> 231 cells. Not all of them need to be updated.
>>
>> If someone wants to script this I would be happy. Given that I do not
>> see this happening I will do it manually and see how this goes.
> https://phab.enlightenment.org/P116  php 
> script fetches the current arch linux package version of the efl.
> I also wrote a bash script (https://phab.enlightenment.org/P115 
> ) that creates a transparent .png since 
> that might be easier to include in the wiki.

Cool. Are you willing to extend this script to work for all listed
distros in the wiki? Arch alone does not bring me much but if we can
cover a lot more distros and generate the table for it that would help.
Even if I had to do some updates on my own.

regards
Stefan Schmidt

--
BPM Camp - Free Virtual Workshop May 6th at 10am PDT/1PM EDT
Develop your own process in accordance with the BPMN 2 standard
Learn Process modeling best practices with Bonita BPM through live exercises
http://www.bonitasoft.com/be-part-of-it/events/bpm-camp-virtual- event?utm_
source=Sourceforge_BPM_Camp_5_6_15&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=VA_SF
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Re: [E-devel] HELP WANTED: Distro/platform packaging status of efl and E

2015-04-09 Thread Leif Middelschulte 

> Am 09.04.2015 um 11:22 schrieb Stefan Schmidt :
> 
> Hello.
> 
> On 09/04/15 10:47, Tom Hacohen wrote:
>> On 09/04/15 01:14, Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) wrote:
>>> On Wed, 08 Apr 2015 12:31:13 +0100 Tom Hacohen  
>>> said:
>>> 
 On 08/04/15 11:26, thomasg wrote:
> On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:27 AM, Tom Hacohen 
> wrote:
>> On 08/04/15 10:20, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
>>> Hello.
>>> 
>>> At the EFL Dev Day US during the talk from Lars he brought up the point
>>> that EFL is heavily outdated in many distros and platforms. While I
>>> instantly agree to this I wondered how bad it really is.
>>> 
>>> I think as a developer as well as a user it makes sense for us to know
>>> what versions of EFL and friends are packaged in which distros and
>>> platforms. Thus I started to pull together a wiki page for it.
>>> 
>>> https://phab.enlightenment.org/w/packaging_status/
>>> 
>>> Its a tedious work and I only started today. Feel free to jump in and
>>> update the links and versions for your beloved distro. Please go with
>>> main package repositories first. You can add a line for a overlay/ppa if
>>> it is well maintained. When filling a new field please add the link as
>>> you can already see in existing entries. That way we have a page where
>>> we can easily look for the latest versions and update.
>>> 
>>> My plan is to fill in more items over time (hoping for some
>>> crowdsourcing here) and run a quick update of versions numbers once a
>>> month (already set a calendar entry for it).
>> I wrote "latest" for every package of Arch. It's too crazy to maintain
>> it for Arch, and it's always up to date anyway.
> If it's too crazy to update a wiki page, no wonder the maintainers
> might find it crazy to do up-to-date packaging :P
 It's too crazy for us to maintain 2000 boxes of a table. :)
 Yes btw, we release too often nowadays (the micro releases), and it's
 becoming more and more annoying to stay up to date, and I think that's
 why Arch has been so slow recently with micro releases for the efl.
>>> look at:
>>> 
>>> https://www.enlightenment.org/doku.php?id=download-latest
>>> 
>>> look at the top - it's a bunch of variables for version of that package. 
>>> that's
>>> it. url and label is generates from the vars. just update those vars at 
>>> release
>>> of anything (add more vars and table entries when new stuff is being 
>>> released
>>> that wasn't before).
>>> 
>>> 
>> I'm talking about two things:
>> 1. Maintaining the 2000 cells of the table. You have to check the
>> distro's websites (or script it, and then it's fine) in order to update
>> those. Your approach doesn't matter there.
> 
> Its easy to make it sounding scarry when using factor 10. Its actually
> 231 cells. Not all of them need to be updated.
> 
> If someone wants to script this I would be happy. Given that I do not
> see this happening I will do it manually and see how this goes.
https://phab.enlightenment.org/P116  php 
script fetches the current arch linux package version of the efl.
I also wrote a bash script (https://phab.enlightenment.org/P115 
) that creates a transparent .png since 
that might be easier to include in the wiki.

cheers,
Leif
> 
>> 2. Building new EFL packages. Building a newer version is easy, that's
>> not the problem. The problem is testing. At our current rate, if
>> maintainers follow our releases they need to build and *test* packages
>> way too often, and testing takes time.
>> 
> 
>> From what current rate do you talk here? We have two stable updates for
> 1.13 which out for two months. That sounds like we are still having one
> stable update per months on average.
> 
> Which is more or less what we had all the time. Around 3-4 stable
> updates per major release. A month is not enough time to update a package?
> 
> I try to not have to many of them (my initial goal has been 4-5 but I
> decreased this over time) but they are essentially bug fixes which we
> should offer our users.
> If you take 1.13.2 as example there was a evas use after free fix which
> was tracked for a long time and it was asked by the user to make a
> stable update with this.
> 
> So in summary it means balancing the needs of updates and reducing the
> amount of updates we do. I think one stable update per month on average
> is good.
> 
> regards
> Stefan Schmidt
> 
> 
> --
> BPM Camp - Free Virtual Workshop May 6th at 10am PDT/1PM EDT
> Develop your own process in accordance with the BPMN 2 standard
> Learn Process modeling best practices with Bonita BPM through live exercises
> http://www.bonitasoft.com/be-part-of-it/events/bpm-camp-virtual- event?utm_
> source=Sourceforge_BPM_Camp_5_6_15&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=VA_SF
> ___

Re: [E-devel] HELP WANTED: Distro/platform packaging status of efl and E

2015-04-09 Thread Tom Hacohen 
On 09/04/15 10:22, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
> Hello.
>
> On 09/04/15 10:47, Tom Hacohen wrote:
>> On 09/04/15 01:14, Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) wrote:
>>> On Wed, 08 Apr 2015 12:31:13 +0100 Tom Hacohen  
>>> said:
>>>
 On 08/04/15 11:26, thomasg wrote:
> On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:27 AM, Tom Hacohen 
> wrote:
>> On 08/04/15 10:20, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
>>> Hello.
>>>
>>> At the EFL Dev Day US during the talk from Lars he brought up the point
>>> that EFL is heavily outdated in many distros and platforms. While I
>>> instantly agree to this I wondered how bad it really is.
>>>
>>> I think as a developer as well as a user it makes sense for us to know
>>> what versions of EFL and friends are packaged in which distros and
>>> platforms. Thus I started to pull together a wiki page for it.
>>>
>>> https://phab.enlightenment.org/w/packaging_status/
>>>
>>> Its a tedious work and I only started today. Feel free to jump in and
>>> update the links and versions for your beloved distro. Please go with
>>> main package repositories first. You can add a line for a overlay/ppa if
>>> it is well maintained. When filling a new field please add the link as
>>> you can already see in existing entries. That way we have a page where
>>> we can easily look for the latest versions and update.
>>>
>>> My plan is to fill in more items over time (hoping for some
>>> crowdsourcing here) and run a quick update of versions numbers once a
>>> month (already set a calendar entry for it).
>> I wrote "latest" for every package of Arch. It's too crazy to maintain
>> it for Arch, and it's always up to date anyway.
> If it's too crazy to update a wiki page, no wonder the maintainers
> might find it crazy to do up-to-date packaging :P
 It's too crazy for us to maintain 2000 boxes of a table. :)
 Yes btw, we release too often nowadays (the micro releases), and it's
 becoming more and more annoying to stay up to date, and I think that's
 why Arch has been so slow recently with micro releases for the efl.
>>> look at:
>>>
>>> https://www.enlightenment.org/doku.php?id=download-latest
>>>
>>> look at the top - it's a bunch of variables for version of that package. 
>>> that's
>>> it. url and label is generates from the vars. just update those vars at 
>>> release
>>> of anything (add more vars and table entries when new stuff is being 
>>> released
>>> that wasn't before).
>>>
>>>
>> I'm talking about two things:
>> 1. Maintaining the 2000 cells of the table. You have to check the
>> distro's websites (or script it, and then it's fine) in order to update
>> those. Your approach doesn't matter there.
>
> Its easy to make it sounding scarry when using factor 10. Its actually
> 231 cells. Not all of them need to be updated.
>
> If someone wants to script this I would be happy. Given that I do not
> see this happening I will do it manually and see how this goes.
>
>> 2. Building new EFL packages. Building a newer version is easy, that's
>> not the problem. The problem is testing. At our current rate, if
>> maintainers follow our releases they need to build and *test* packages
>> way too often, and testing takes time.
>>
>
>>From what current rate do you talk here? We have two stable updates for
> 1.13 which out for two months. That sounds like we are still having one
> stable update per months on average.
>
> Which is more or less what we had all the time. Around 3-4 stable
> updates per major release. A month is not enough time to update a package?
>
> I try to not have to many of them (my initial goal has been 4-5 but I
> decreased this over time) but they are essentially bug fixes which we
> should offer our users.
> If you take 1.13.2 as example there was a evas use after free fix which
> was tracked for a long time and it was asked by the user to make a
> stable update with this.
>
> So in summary it means balancing the needs of updates and reducing the
> amount of updates we do. I think one stable update per month on average
> is good.


The original point has become moot ever since you said you only wanna 
update it once a month, it's OK (I guess) to spend 15minutes a month on 
that, and the value is obviously worth it.

Stable update a month is great. I did the math wrong, I was under the 
impression it was once every two weeks (and I think I mentioned that).

Bottom line: sorry for the noise.

--
Tom.



--
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Develop your own process in accordance with the BPMN 2 standard
Learn Process modeling best practices with Bonita BPM through live exercises
http://www.bonitasoft.com/be-part-of-it/events/bpm-camp-virtual- event?utm_
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Re: [E-devel] HELP WANTED: Distro/platform packaging status of efl and E

2015-04-09 Thread Stefan Schmidt 
Hello.

On 09/04/15 10:47, Tom Hacohen wrote:
> On 09/04/15 01:14, Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) wrote:
>> On Wed, 08 Apr 2015 12:31:13 +0100 Tom Hacohen  
>> said:
>>
>>> On 08/04/15 11:26, thomasg wrote:
 On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:27 AM, Tom Hacohen 
 wrote:
> On 08/04/15 10:20, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
>> Hello.
>>
>> At the EFL Dev Day US during the talk from Lars he brought up the point
>> that EFL is heavily outdated in many distros and platforms. While I
>> instantly agree to this I wondered how bad it really is.
>>
>> I think as a developer as well as a user it makes sense for us to know
>> what versions of EFL and friends are packaged in which distros and
>> platforms. Thus I started to pull together a wiki page for it.
>>
>> https://phab.enlightenment.org/w/packaging_status/
>>
>> Its a tedious work and I only started today. Feel free to jump in and
>> update the links and versions for your beloved distro. Please go with
>> main package repositories first. You can add a line for a overlay/ppa if
>> it is well maintained. When filling a new field please add the link as
>> you can already see in existing entries. That way we have a page where
>> we can easily look for the latest versions and update.
>>
>> My plan is to fill in more items over time (hoping for some
>> crowdsourcing here) and run a quick update of versions numbers once a
>> month (already set a calendar entry for it).
> I wrote "latest" for every package of Arch. It's too crazy to maintain
> it for Arch, and it's always up to date anyway.
 If it's too crazy to update a wiki page, no wonder the maintainers
 might find it crazy to do up-to-date packaging :P
>>> It's too crazy for us to maintain 2000 boxes of a table. :)
>>> Yes btw, we release too often nowadays (the micro releases), and it's
>>> becoming more and more annoying to stay up to date, and I think that's
>>> why Arch has been so slow recently with micro releases for the efl.
>> look at:
>>
>> https://www.enlightenment.org/doku.php?id=download-latest
>>
>> look at the top - it's a bunch of variables for version of that package. 
>> that's
>> it. url and label is generates from the vars. just update those vars at 
>> release
>> of anything (add more vars and table entries when new stuff is being released
>> that wasn't before).
>>
>>
> I'm talking about two things:
> 1. Maintaining the 2000 cells of the table. You have to check the 
> distro's websites (or script it, and then it's fine) in order to update 
> those. Your approach doesn't matter there.

Its easy to make it sounding scarry when using factor 10. Its actually
231 cells. Not all of them need to be updated.

If someone wants to script this I would be happy. Given that I do not
see this happening I will do it manually and see how this goes.

> 2. Building new EFL packages. Building a newer version is easy, that's 
> not the problem. The problem is testing. At our current rate, if 
> maintainers follow our releases they need to build and *test* packages 
> way too often, and testing takes time.
>

>From what current rate do you talk here? We have two stable updates for
1.13 which out for two months. That sounds like we are still having one
stable update per months on average.

Which is more or less what we had all the time. Around 3-4 stable
updates per major release. A month is not enough time to update a package?

I try to not have to many of them (my initial goal has been 4-5 but I
decreased this over time) but they are essentially bug fixes which we
should offer our users.
If you take 1.13.2 as example there was a evas use after free fix which
was tracked for a long time and it was asked by the user to make a
stable update with this.

So in summary it means balancing the needs of updates and reducing the
amount of updates we do. I think one stable update per month on average
is good.

regards
Stefan Schmidt


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Re: [E-devel] HELP WANTED: Distro/platform packaging status of efl and E

2015-04-09 Thread Tom Hacohen 
On 09/04/15 01:14, Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) wrote:
> On Wed, 08 Apr 2015 12:31:13 +0100 Tom Hacohen  said:
>
>> On 08/04/15 11:26, thomasg wrote:
>>> On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:27 AM, Tom Hacohen 
>>> wrote:
 On 08/04/15 10:20, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
> Hello.
>
> At the EFL Dev Day US during the talk from Lars he brought up the point
> that EFL is heavily outdated in many distros and platforms. While I
> instantly agree to this I wondered how bad it really is.
>
> I think as a developer as well as a user it makes sense for us to know
> what versions of EFL and friends are packaged in which distros and
> platforms. Thus I started to pull together a wiki page for it.
>
> https://phab.enlightenment.org/w/packaging_status/
>
> Its a tedious work and I only started today. Feel free to jump in and
> update the links and versions for your beloved distro. Please go with
> main package repositories first. You can add a line for a overlay/ppa if
> it is well maintained. When filling a new field please add the link as
> you can already see in existing entries. That way we have a page where
> we can easily look for the latest versions and update.
>
> My plan is to fill in more items over time (hoping for some
> crowdsourcing here) and run a quick update of versions numbers once a
> month (already set a calendar entry for it).

 I wrote "latest" for every package of Arch. It's too crazy to maintain
 it for Arch, and it's always up to date anyway.
>>>
>>> If it's too crazy to update a wiki page, no wonder the maintainers
>>> might find it crazy to do up-to-date packaging :P
>>
>> It's too crazy for us to maintain 2000 boxes of a table. :)
>> Yes btw, we release too often nowadays (the micro releases), and it's
>> becoming more and more annoying to stay up to date, and I think that's
>> why Arch has been so slow recently with micro releases for the efl.
>
> look at:
>
> https://www.enlightenment.org/doku.php?id=download-latest
>
> look at the top - it's a bunch of variables for version of that package. 
> that's
> it. url and label is generates from the vars. just update those vars at 
> release
> of anything (add more vars and table entries when new stuff is being released
> that wasn't before).
>
>

I'm talking about two things:
1. Maintaining the 2000 cells of the table. You have to check the 
distro's websites (or script it, and then it's fine) in order to update 
those. Your approach doesn't matter there.
2. Building new EFL packages. Building a newer version is easy, that's 
not the problem. The problem is testing. At our current rate, if 
maintainers follow our releases they need to build and *test* packages 
way too often, and testing takes time.

--
Tom.


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Re: [E-devel] HELP WANTED: Distro/platform packaging status of efl and E

2015-04-08 Thread The Rasterman 
On Wed, 08 Apr 2015 12:31:13 +0100 Tom Hacohen  said:

> On 08/04/15 11:26, thomasg wrote:
> > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:27 AM, Tom Hacohen 
> > wrote:
> >> On 08/04/15 10:20, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
> >>> Hello.
> >>>
> >>> At the EFL Dev Day US during the talk from Lars he brought up the point
> >>> that EFL is heavily outdated in many distros and platforms. While I
> >>> instantly agree to this I wondered how bad it really is.
> >>>
> >>> I think as a developer as well as a user it makes sense for us to know
> >>> what versions of EFL and friends are packaged in which distros and
> >>> platforms. Thus I started to pull together a wiki page for it.
> >>>
> >>> https://phab.enlightenment.org/w/packaging_status/
> >>>
> >>> Its a tedious work and I only started today. Feel free to jump in and
> >>> update the links and versions for your beloved distro. Please go with
> >>> main package repositories first. You can add a line for a overlay/ppa if
> >>> it is well maintained. When filling a new field please add the link as
> >>> you can already see in existing entries. That way we have a page where
> >>> we can easily look for the latest versions and update.
> >>>
> >>> My plan is to fill in more items over time (hoping for some
> >>> crowdsourcing here) and run a quick update of versions numbers once a
> >>> month (already set a calendar entry for it).
> >>
> >> I wrote "latest" for every package of Arch. It's too crazy to maintain
> >> it for Arch, and it's always up to date anyway.
> >
> > If it's too crazy to update a wiki page, no wonder the maintainers
> > might find it crazy to do up-to-date packaging :P
> 
> It's too crazy for us to maintain 2000 boxes of a table. :)
> Yes btw, we release too often nowadays (the micro releases), and it's 
> becoming more and more annoying to stay up to date, and I think that's 
> why Arch has been so slow recently with micro releases for the efl.

look at:

https://www.enlightenment.org/doku.php?id=download-latest

look at the top - it's a bunch of variables for version of that package. that's
it. url and label is generates from the vars. just update those vars at release
of anything (add more vars and table entries when new stuff is being released
that wasn't before).


-- 
- Codito, ergo sum - "I code, therefore I am" --
The Rasterman (Carsten Haitzler)ras...@rasterman.com


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Re: [E-devel] HELP WANTED: Distro/platform packaging status of efl and E

2015-04-08 Thread The Rasterman 
On Wed, 08 Apr 2015 10:29:48 +0100 Tom Hacohen  said:

> On 08/04/15 10:27, Tom Hacohen wrote:
> > On 08/04/15 10:20, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
> >> Hello.
> >>
> >> At the EFL Dev Day US during the talk from Lars he brought up the point
> >> that EFL is heavily outdated in many distros and platforms. While I
> >> instantly agree to this I wondered how bad it really is.
> >>
> >> I think as a developer as well as a user it makes sense for us to know
> >> what versions of EFL and friends are packaged in which distros and
> >> platforms. Thus I started to pull together a wiki page for it.
> >>
> >> https://phab.enlightenment.org/w/packaging_status/
> >>
> >> Its a tedious work and I only started today. Feel free to jump in and
> >> update the links and versions for your beloved distro. Please go with
> >> main package repositories first. You can add a line for a overlay/ppa if
> >> it is well maintained. When filling a new field please add the link as
> >> you can already see in existing entries. That way we have a page where
> >> we can easily look for the latest versions and update.
> >>
> >> My plan is to fill in more items over time (hoping for some
> >> crowdsourcing here) and run a quick update of versions numbers once a
> >> month (already set a calendar entry for it).
> >
> > I wrote "latest" for every package of Arch. It's too crazy to maintain
> > it for Arch, and it's always up to date anyway.
> >
> > --
> > Tom.
> >
> 
> 
> Haha, shit, except for now, when it's on 1.13.0. :P What's wrong?! :(
> I guess the maintainer didn't see any important fixes to rush to update, 
> or was just annoyed by our release cycles. To be fair, two micro 
> releases in a month is a lot, and it's not the first time.

that's not a lot of releases. the package updates could be scripted with micros
it's that simple.

-- 
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The Rasterman (Carsten Haitzler)ras...@rasterman.com


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Re: [E-devel] HELP WANTED: Distro/platform packaging status of efl and E

2015-04-08 Thread The Rasterman 
On Wed, 8 Apr 2015 12:26:20 +0200 thomasg  said:

> On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:27 AM, Tom Hacohen  wrote:
> > On 08/04/15 10:20, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
> >> Hello.
> >>
> >> At the EFL Dev Day US during the talk from Lars he brought up the point
> >> that EFL is heavily outdated in many distros and platforms. While I
> >> instantly agree to this I wondered how bad it really is.
> >>
> >> I think as a developer as well as a user it makes sense for us to know
> >> what versions of EFL and friends are packaged in which distros and
> >> platforms. Thus I started to pull together a wiki page for it.
> >>
> >> https://phab.enlightenment.org/w/packaging_status/
> >>
> >> Its a tedious work and I only started today. Feel free to jump in and
> >> update the links and versions for your beloved distro. Please go with
> >> main package repositories first. You can add a line for a overlay/ppa if
> >> it is well maintained. When filling a new field please add the link as
> >> you can already see in existing entries. That way we have a page where
> >> we can easily look for the latest versions and update.
> >>
> >> My plan is to fill in more items over time (hoping for some
> >> crowdsourcing here) and run a quick update of versions numbers once a
> >> month (already set a calendar entry for it).
> >
> > I wrote "latest" for every package of Arch. It's too crazy to maintain
> > it for Arch, and it's always up to date anyway.
> 
> If it's too crazy to update a wiki page, no wonder the maintainers
> might find it crazy to do up-to-date packaging :P

the problem is until just now, the WEBSITE said 0.13.0 was the latest
release .. because no one updated www when doing them. it's now a wiki and i
hope it gets updated better.


-- 
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The Rasterman (Carsten Haitzler)ras...@rasterman.com


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Re: [E-devel] HELP WANTED: Distro/platform packaging status of efl and E

2015-04-08 Thread Jeff Hoogland 
I've added Bodhi's information to that page.

On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 6:31 AM, Tom Hacohen  wrote:

> On 08/04/15 11:26, thomasg wrote:
> > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:27 AM, Tom Hacohen 
> wrote:
> >> On 08/04/15 10:20, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
> >>> Hello.
> >>>
> >>> At the EFL Dev Day US during the talk from Lars he brought up the point
> >>> that EFL is heavily outdated in many distros and platforms. While I
> >>> instantly agree to this I wondered how bad it really is.
> >>>
> >>> I think as a developer as well as a user it makes sense for us to know
> >>> what versions of EFL and friends are packaged in which distros and
> >>> platforms. Thus I started to pull together a wiki page for it.
> >>>
> >>> https://phab.enlightenment.org/w/packaging_status/
> >>>
> >>> Its a tedious work and I only started today. Feel free to jump in and
> >>> update the links and versions for your beloved distro. Please go with
> >>> main package repositories first. You can add a line for a overlay/ppa
> if
> >>> it is well maintained. When filling a new field please add the link as
> >>> you can already see in existing entries. That way we have a page where
> >>> we can easily look for the latest versions and update.
> >>>
> >>> My plan is to fill in more items over time (hoping for some
> >>> crowdsourcing here) and run a quick update of versions numbers once a
> >>> month (already set a calendar entry for it).
> >>
> >> I wrote "latest" for every package of Arch. It's too crazy to maintain
> >> it for Arch, and it's always up to date anyway.
> >
> > If it's too crazy to update a wiki page, no wonder the maintainers
> > might find it crazy to do up-to-date packaging :P
>
> It's too crazy for us to maintain 2000 boxes of a table. :)
> Yes btw, we release too often nowadays (the micro releases), and it's
> becoming more and more annoying to stay up to date, and I think that's
> why Arch has been so slow recently with micro releases for the efl.
>
> --
> Tom.
>
>
>
>
> --
> BPM Camp - Free Virtual Workshop May 6th at 10am PDT/1PM EDT
> Develop your own process in accordance with the BPMN 2 standard
> Learn Process modeling best practices with Bonita BPM through live
> exercises
> http://www.bonitasoft.com/be-part-of-it/events/bpm-camp-virtual-
> event?utm_
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Re: [E-devel] HELP WANTED: Distro/platform packaging status of efl and E

2015-04-08 Thread Tom Hacohen 
On 08/04/15 11:26, thomasg wrote:
> On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:27 AM, Tom Hacohen  wrote:
>> On 08/04/15 10:20, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
>>> Hello.
>>>
>>> At the EFL Dev Day US during the talk from Lars he brought up the point
>>> that EFL is heavily outdated in many distros and platforms. While I
>>> instantly agree to this I wondered how bad it really is.
>>>
>>> I think as a developer as well as a user it makes sense for us to know
>>> what versions of EFL and friends are packaged in which distros and
>>> platforms. Thus I started to pull together a wiki page for it.
>>>
>>> https://phab.enlightenment.org/w/packaging_status/
>>>
>>> Its a tedious work and I only started today. Feel free to jump in and
>>> update the links and versions for your beloved distro. Please go with
>>> main package repositories first. You can add a line for a overlay/ppa if
>>> it is well maintained. When filling a new field please add the link as
>>> you can already see in existing entries. That way we have a page where
>>> we can easily look for the latest versions and update.
>>>
>>> My plan is to fill in more items over time (hoping for some
>>> crowdsourcing here) and run a quick update of versions numbers once a
>>> month (already set a calendar entry for it).
>>
>> I wrote "latest" for every package of Arch. It's too crazy to maintain
>> it for Arch, and it's always up to date anyway.
>
> If it's too crazy to update a wiki page, no wonder the maintainers
> might find it crazy to do up-to-date packaging :P

It's too crazy for us to maintain 2000 boxes of a table. :)
Yes btw, we release too often nowadays (the micro releases), and it's 
becoming more and more annoying to stay up to date, and I think that's 
why Arch has been so slow recently with micro releases for the efl.

--
Tom.



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Re: [E-devel] HELP WANTED: Distro/platform packaging status of efl and E

2015-04-08 Thread thomasg 
On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:27 AM, Tom Hacohen  wrote:
> On 08/04/15 10:20, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
>> Hello.
>>
>> At the EFL Dev Day US during the talk from Lars he brought up the point
>> that EFL is heavily outdated in many distros and platforms. While I
>> instantly agree to this I wondered how bad it really is.
>>
>> I think as a developer as well as a user it makes sense for us to know
>> what versions of EFL and friends are packaged in which distros and
>> platforms. Thus I started to pull together a wiki page for it.
>>
>> https://phab.enlightenment.org/w/packaging_status/
>>
>> Its a tedious work and I only started today. Feel free to jump in and
>> update the links and versions for your beloved distro. Please go with
>> main package repositories first. You can add a line for a overlay/ppa if
>> it is well maintained. When filling a new field please add the link as
>> you can already see in existing entries. That way we have a page where
>> we can easily look for the latest versions and update.
>>
>> My plan is to fill in more items over time (hoping for some
>> crowdsourcing here) and run a quick update of versions numbers once a
>> month (already set a calendar entry for it).
>
> I wrote "latest" for every package of Arch. It's too crazy to maintain
> it for Arch, and it's always up to date anyway.

If it's too crazy to update a wiki page, no wonder the maintainers
might find it crazy to do up-to-date packaging :P

> --
> Tom.
>
>
>
> --
> BPM Camp - Free Virtual Workshop May 6th at 10am PDT/1PM EDT
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> Learn Process modeling best practices with Bonita BPM through live exercises
> http://www.bonitasoft.com/be-part-of-it/events/bpm-camp-virtual- event?utm_
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Re: [E-devel] HELP WANTED: Distro/platform packaging status of efl and E

2015-04-08 Thread Daniel Kolesa 
On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 10:20 AM, Stefan Schmidt 
wrote:

> Hello.
>
> At the EFL Dev Day US during the talk from Lars he brought up the point
> that EFL is heavily outdated in many distros and platforms. While I
> instantly agree to this I wondered how bad it really is.
>
> I think as a developer as well as a user it makes sense for us to know
> what versions of EFL and friends are packaged in which distros and
> platforms. Thus I started to pull together a wiki page for it.
>
> https://phab.enlightenment.org/w/packaging_status/
>
> Its a tedious work and I only started today. Feel free to jump in and
> update the links and versions for your beloved distro. Please go with
> main package repositories first. You can add a line for a overlay/ppa if
> it is well maintained. When filling a new field please add the link as
> you can already see in existing entries. That way we have a page where
> we can easily look for the latest versions and update.
>
> My plan is to fill in more items over time (hoping for some
> crowdsourcing here) and run a quick update of versions numbers once a
> month (already set a calendar entry for it).
>

Added FreeBSD fields.

D5


>
> regards
> Stefan Schmidt
>
>
>
> --
> BPM Camp - Free Virtual Workshop May 6th at 10am PDT/1PM EDT
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Re: [E-devel] HELP WANTED: Distro/platform packaging status of efl and E

2015-04-08 Thread Daniel Kolesa 
On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 10:53 AM, Daniel Kolesa  wrote:

> On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 10:20 AM, Stefan Schmidt  > wrote:
>
>> Hello.
>>
>> At the EFL Dev Day US during the talk from Lars he brought up the point
>> that EFL is heavily outdated in many distros and platforms. While I
>> instantly agree to this I wondered how bad it really is.
>>
>> I think as a developer as well as a user it makes sense for us to know
>> what versions of EFL and friends are packaged in which distros and
>> platforms. Thus I started to pull together a wiki page for it.
>>
>> https://phab.enlightenment.org/w/packaging_status/
>>
>> Its a tedious work and I only started today. Feel free to jump in and
>> update the links and versions for your beloved distro. Please go with
>> main package repositories first. You can add a line for a overlay/ppa if
>> it is well maintained. When filling a new field please add the link as
>> you can already see in existing entries. That way we have a page where
>> we can easily look for the latest versions and update.
>>
>> My plan is to fill in more items over time (hoping for some
>> crowdsourcing here) and run a quick update of versions numbers once a
>> month (already set a calendar entry for it).
>>
>
> Added FreeBSD fields.
>
> D5
>

Also added a column for Terminology...


>
>
>>
>> regards
>> Stefan Schmidt
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> BPM Camp - Free Virtual Workshop May 6th at 10am PDT/1PM EDT
>> Develop your own process in accordance with the BPMN 2 standard
>> Learn Process modeling best practices with Bonita BPM through live
>> exercises
>> http://www.bonitasoft.com/be-part-of-it/events/bpm-camp-virtual-
>> event?utm_
>> source=Sourceforge_BPM_Camp_5_6_15&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=VA_SF
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>>
>
>
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Re: [E-devel] HELP WANTED: Distro/platform packaging status of efl and E

2015-04-08 Thread Tom Hacohen 
On 08/04/15 10:20, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
> Hello.
>
> At the EFL Dev Day US during the talk from Lars he brought up the point
> that EFL is heavily outdated in many distros and platforms. While I
> instantly agree to this I wondered how bad it really is.
>
> I think as a developer as well as a user it makes sense for us to know
> what versions of EFL and friends are packaged in which distros and
> platforms. Thus I started to pull together a wiki page for it.
>
> https://phab.enlightenment.org/w/packaging_status/
>
> Its a tedious work and I only started today. Feel free to jump in and
> update the links and versions for your beloved distro. Please go with
> main package repositories first. You can add a line for a overlay/ppa if
> it is well maintained. When filling a new field please add the link as
> you can already see in existing entries. That way we have a page where
> we can easily look for the latest versions and update.
>
> My plan is to fill in more items over time (hoping for some
> crowdsourcing here) and run a quick update of versions numbers once a
> month (already set a calendar entry for it).
>

One more thing, there's no terminology there.

--
Tom.



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Re: [E-devel] HELP WANTED: Distro/platform packaging status of efl and E

2015-04-08 Thread Tom Hacohen 
On 08/04/15 10:27, Tom Hacohen wrote:
> On 08/04/15 10:20, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
>> Hello.
>>
>> At the EFL Dev Day US during the talk from Lars he brought up the point
>> that EFL is heavily outdated in many distros and platforms. While I
>> instantly agree to this I wondered how bad it really is.
>>
>> I think as a developer as well as a user it makes sense for us to know
>> what versions of EFL and friends are packaged in which distros and
>> platforms. Thus I started to pull together a wiki page for it.
>>
>> https://phab.enlightenment.org/w/packaging_status/
>>
>> Its a tedious work and I only started today. Feel free to jump in and
>> update the links and versions for your beloved distro. Please go with
>> main package repositories first. You can add a line for a overlay/ppa if
>> it is well maintained. When filling a new field please add the link as
>> you can already see in existing entries. That way we have a page where
>> we can easily look for the latest versions and update.
>>
>> My plan is to fill in more items over time (hoping for some
>> crowdsourcing here) and run a quick update of versions numbers once a
>> month (already set a calendar entry for it).
>
> I wrote "latest" for every package of Arch. It's too crazy to maintain
> it for Arch, and it's always up to date anyway.
>
> --
> Tom.
>


Haha, shit, except for now, when it's on 1.13.0. :P What's wrong?! :(
I guess the maintainer didn't see any important fixes to rush to update, 
or was just annoyed by our release cycles. To be fair, two micro 
releases in a month is a lot, and it's not the first time.

--
Tom.


--
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Develop your own process in accordance with the BPMN 2 standard
Learn Process modeling best practices with Bonita BPM through live exercises
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Re: [E-devel] HELP WANTED: Distro/platform packaging status of efl and E

2015-04-08 Thread Tom Hacohen 
On 08/04/15 10:20, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
> Hello.
>
> At the EFL Dev Day US during the talk from Lars he brought up the point
> that EFL is heavily outdated in many distros and platforms. While I
> instantly agree to this I wondered how bad it really is.
>
> I think as a developer as well as a user it makes sense for us to know
> what versions of EFL and friends are packaged in which distros and
> platforms. Thus I started to pull together a wiki page for it.
>
> https://phab.enlightenment.org/w/packaging_status/
>
> Its a tedious work and I only started today. Feel free to jump in and
> update the links and versions for your beloved distro. Please go with
> main package repositories first. You can add a line for a overlay/ppa if
> it is well maintained. When filling a new field please add the link as
> you can already see in existing entries. That way we have a page where
> we can easily look for the latest versions and update.
>
> My plan is to fill in more items over time (hoping for some
> crowdsourcing here) and run a quick update of versions numbers once a
> month (already set a calendar entry for it).

I wrote "latest" for every package of Arch. It's too crazy to maintain 
it for Arch, and it's always up to date anyway.

--
Tom.



--
BPM Camp - Free Virtual Workshop May 6th at 10am PDT/1PM EDT
Develop your own process in accordance with the BPMN 2 standard
Learn Process modeling best practices with Bonita BPM through live exercises
http://www.bonitasoft.com/be-part-of-it/events/bpm-camp-virtual- event?utm_
source=Sourceforge_BPM_Camp_5_6_15&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=VA_SF
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