Re: Scriptural refutation of the Transhumanist Movement

[John Clark]

On Sun, Jul 10, 2022 at 6:42 PM  wrote:

*> Transhumanism isn't even about real world. It's about speculation about
> the real world*
>

And the New Testament, the Torah, the Quran, the Book of Mormon, the
writings of L Ron Hubbard, and the authors of every other scientific
ignoramus who wrote "Holy Scriptures" are unimaginative speculations about
an unreal world.

John K ClarkSee what's on my new list at  Extropolis

tbb

uzp



> On Sun, Jul 10, 2022 at 12:30 PM spudboy100 via Everything List <
> everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>
> *> I don't see refutation of by scriptures,*
>
>
> I don't see why anybody should care what the scriptures have to say about
> transhumanism given that they were written by members of a bronze age tribe
> who didn't even know where the sun went at night; transhumanism is about
> the physical world, how on Earth could anybody expect wisdom about that from
> them?
>
>
>
>
>

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Are there 10^272,000 Universes?

[John Clark]

Are there 10^272,000 Universes? - Numberphile


John K ClarkSee what's on my new list at  Extropolis

rtu

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Re: Scriptural refutation of the Transhumanist Movement

[Lawrence Crowell]

On Monday, July 11, 2022 at 4:53:42 AM UTC-5 johnk...@gmail.com wrote:

> On Sun, Jul 10, 2022 at 6:42 PM  wrote:
>
> *> Transhumanism isn't even about real world. It's about speculation about 
>> the real world*
>>
>
> And the New Testament, the Torah, the Quran, the Book of Mormon, the 
> writings of L Ron Hubbard, and the authors of every other scientific 
> ignoramus who wrote "Holy Scriptures" are unimaginative speculations about 
> an unreal world.
>
> John K ClarkSee what's on my new list at  Extropolis 
> 
> tbb
>
>

These things are mythic narratives.  As for travels and descriptions of 
places in the world, sure there were travelers who told of these places. 
This mentality is the antithesis of real thought. Bertrand Russel met 
Vladimir Ilyich Lenin and was struck by how Lenin could not talk outside 
the bounds of Marxist thinking. It was as if he was a prisoner of this 
ideology. Religion is similar, it is a "mind forged manacle" the imprisons 
the mind so it can not longer really think.

LC

> uzp
>
>  
>
>> On Sun, Jul 10, 2022 at 12:30 PM spudboy100 via Everything List <
>> everyth...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>>
>> *> I don't see refutation of by scriptures,*
>>
>>
>> I don't see why anybody should care what the scriptures have to say about 
>> transhumanism given that they were written by members of a bronze age tribe 
>> who didn't even know where the sun went at night; transhumanism is about 
>> the physical world, how on Earth could anybody expect wisdom about that from 
>> them? 
>>  
>>
>>
>>
>>

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Re: Are there 10^272,000 Universes?

[Lawrence Crowell]

This is F-theory I presume.

LC

On Monday, July 11, 2022 at 10:09:58 AM UTC-5 johnk...@gmail.com wrote:

> Are there 10^272,000 Universes? - Numberphile 
> 
>
> John K ClarkSee what's on my new list at  Extropolis 
> 
> rtu
>

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FW: [Consciousness-Online] RE: The Supreme Court and the Electoral College

[Philip Benjamin]

general_the...@googlegroups.com 
Subject: RE: [Consciousness-Online] RE: The Supreme Court and the Electoral 
College

[Olaf Stapledon] quoted below.
” The fictitious deities of all races in all worlds once more crowded 
themselves upon me,…”
[Philip Benjamin]
 This is off the thread here. However, I will try to retain the thought. 
Prof Olaf is fundamentally wrong here and logically inconsistent. How can 
fictitious deities really do anything at all? Human life ( for that matter any 
life) is more than a bunch of fundamental particles. That is why even unreal 
and fictitious deities occupy human minds! How could any race or individual 
intrinsically come up with any fictitious notions of a friendly or hostile 
deity? Why can’t any mind be absolutely blank of any such thinking? He looks 
like endorsing one of those Israeli/Jewish women of Jeremiah’s days who said: ” 
As for the word that thou hast spoken unto us in the name of the Lord, we will 
not hearken unto thee.  But we will certainly do whatsoever thing goes forth 
out of our own mouth, to burn incense unto the queen of heaven, and to pour out 
drink offerings unto her, as we have done, we, and our fathers, our kings, and 
our princes, in the cities of Judah, and in the streets of Jerusalem: for then 
had we plenty of victuals, and were well, and saw no evil”.
 The word pagan got into Queen’s English not by the KJV, instead heathen is 
used by KJV for anything outside the domain of Adonai (plural) YHWH (singular) 
Elohim (uni-plural).  See Joshua 24:2. Even Terah, the father of Abraham, and 
the father of Nachor had one of those deities.They were all heathen/pagan. 
Regeneration from old heathenism to new-creation in Adonai is what Apostolic or 
Augustinian transformation is all about. Like it or not, That, not Prof. Olaf 
Stapledon, is what distinguished the nonconformist West in general from the 
rest of the world which conformed to various deities of various races, peoples 
and nations—including Jungian sorceries, occultism of Monk Rasputin, Madame 
Blavatsky etc.
 Philip Benjamin
   From: 'Rosemary Rock-Evans' via Consciousness-Online 
mailto:general_the...@googlegroups.com>> 
Subject: RE: [Consciousness-Online] RE: The Supreme Court and the Electoral 
College
   You know Philip I think it is rather difficult not to love the earth, 
but it is possible to love the earth and trust the God who created it and will 
destroy it. …. There is one writer who seemed to sum up this form of duality – 
Olaf Stapledon, a science fiction writer and University lecturer: Two related 
quotes …… The fictitious deities of all races in all worlds once more crowded 
themselves upon me, symbols of majesty and tenderness, of ruthless power, of 
blind creativity and of all seeing wisdom. And though their images were but the 
fantasies of created minds, it seemed to me that one and all did indeed embody 
some true features of the Star Maker's impact. 
...
Suddenly it was clear to me that virtue in the Creator is not the same as 
virtue in the Creation. For the Creator if he should love his creation would be 
loving only a part of himself, but the creation praising the creator praises an 
infinity beyond himself. The virtue of the creation was to love and to worship. 
The virtue of the Creator was to create and to be infinite, the unrealisable 
and incomprehensible goal of worshipping creatures. ……..  It is enough to have 
been created, to have embodied for a moment the infinite and tumultuously 
creative spirit …. to have been the rough sketch for some perfected creation.
Professor Stapledon was much admired in his day …. “Stapledon was hostile to 
religious institutions, but not to religious yearnings”.

-- Original Message --
From: "Philip Benjamin" 
mailto:medinucl...@hotmail.com>>
To: "general_the...@googlegroups.com" 
mailto:general_the...@googlegroups.com>>
Sent: Sunday, 10 Jul, 22 At 19:26
Subject: RE: [Consciousness-Online] RE: The Supreme Court and the Electoral 
College
John Clark]
“´ Give me an example of something, anything, that is NOT pagan…. “.
[Philip Benjamin]
This is a reasonable question, though the problem was defined for over over 20 
years wherever that was allowed, though the WAMP (often Marxists) despotically 
forbids.
WAMP is generally speaking a self-description, if anybody wants to join, most 
welcome!! The name “John” meaning ”Jah (YHWH) is gracious” is not of pagan 
origin, that does not necessarily mean that anybody with that name is not a 
Gaia centered conformist. Pagan comes from Pan-Gaia-n, i.e. earth centered, 
earth worshippers, by extension the doctrinaire environmentalists and the 
pseudo-climatologists.
A “transformed consciousness” is what the Prophet describes as: “And I will 
give you a new heart, and a new spirit I will put within you. And I will remove 
the heart of stone from y

Re: Are there 10^272,000 Universes?

[spudboy100 via Everything List]

Weepers. I am behind the times. Last I remember it was 10^500 universes as 
informed by Guth, Linde, Vilenkin, and the rest. 
F theory must me when ya hear 10^272K universes, ya yell out F#@CK!!!. Anyone 
willing to wager if some of have better shows than Netflix?


-Original Message-
From: Lawrence Crowell 
To: Everything List 
Sent: Mon, Jul 11, 2022 11:24 am
Subject: Re: Are there 10^272,000 Universes?

This is F-theory I presume.
LC

On Monday, July 11, 2022 at 10:09:58 AM UTC-5 johnk...@gmail.com wrote:

Are there 10^272,000 Universes? - Numberphile

John K Clark    See what's on my new list at  Extropolis
rtu
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Re: Scriptural refutation of the Transhumanist Movement

[spudboy100 via Everything List]

Part of it for some is notion that one cannot offend the Guy upstairs, or 
invoke the wrath of one's fellows, whether a religion or ideology. 
My personal favorite dream after I win the lotto, would be to pay a physicist 
lots of money to come up with a scientifically plausible theory for God, the 
afterlife, & and everything. The writer would be given the option to write on 
the frontispiece: "Look, I believe this is bullshit, but I'm being paid lots of 
money to come up with this, so yeah, I sold out. I am a loyal atheist, and 
don't care much for people who waste their damn time thinking about a fantasy! 
But, I can find a good use for the cash he's paying me, so, sue me!" 
In this manner, the physicist would be insulated from the wrath of his employer 
and colleagues. "So fire me, I could use the vacation time going to AAAS 
meetings, break my heart." 
I mean this would be like a super Templeton Prize, but more profitable. 


-Original Message-
From: Lawrence Crowell 
To: Everything List 
Sent: Mon, Jul 11, 2022 11:23 am
Subject: Re: Scriptural refutation of the Transhumanist Movement



On Monday, July 11, 2022 at 4:53:42 AM UTC-5 johnk...@gmail.com wrote:

On Sun, Jul 10, 2022 at 6:42 PM  wrote:


> Transhumanism isn't even about real world. It's about speculation about the 
> real world

And the New Testament, the Torah, the Quran, the Book of Mormon, the writings 
of L Ron Hubbard, and the authors of every other scientific ignoramus who wrote 
"Holy Scriptures" are unimaginative speculations about an unreal world.
John K Clark    See what's on my new list at  Extropolis
tbb



These things are mythic narratives.  As for travels and descriptions of places 
in the world, sure there were travelers who told of these places. This 
mentality is the antithesis of real thought. Bertrand Russel met Vladimir 
Ilyich Lenin and was struck by how Lenin could not talk outside the bounds of 
Marxist thinking. It was as if he was a prisoner of this ideology. Religion is 
similar, it is a "mind forged manacle" the imprisons the mind so it can not 
longer really think.
LC
uzp
 
On Sun, Jul 10, 2022 at 12:30 PM spudboy100 via Everything List 
 wrote:


> I don't see refutation of by scriptures,

I don't see why anybody should care what the scriptures have to say about 
transhumanism given that they were written by members of a bronze age tribe who 
didn't even know where the sun went at night; transhumanism is about the 
physical world, how on Earth could anybody expect wisdom about that from them?  




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Re: Are there 10^272,000 Universes?

[Lawrence Crowell]

I think it is best to think of these as calculational gadgets. To be honest 
I am not sure about the ontological status of these 10^{272,000} spacetimes 
or cosmogonies.

LC

On Monday, July 11, 2022 at 2:58:37 PM UTC-5 spudb...@aol.com wrote:

> Weepers. I am behind the times. Last I remember it was 10^500 universes as 
> informed by Guth, Linde, Vilenkin, and the rest.  
>
> F theory must me when ya hear 10^272K universes, ya yell out F#@CK!!!. 
> Anyone willing to wager if some of have better shows than Netflix?
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Lawrence Crowell 
> To: Everything List 
> Sent: Mon, Jul 11, 2022 11:24 am
> Subject: Re: Are there 10^272,000 Universes?
>
> This is F-theory I presume. 
>
> LC
>
> On Monday, July 11, 2022 at 10:09:58 AM UTC-5 johnk...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> Are there 10^272,000 Universes? - Numberphile 
> 
>
> John K ClarkSee what's on my new list at  Extropolis 
> 
> rtu
>
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "Everything List" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to everything-li...@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/07cc79c3-0195-4741-9fc7-930dc9bdb497n%40googlegroups.com
>  
> 
>  
> .
>

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Re: FW: [Consciousness-Online] RE: The Supreme Court and the Electoral College

[Lawrence Crowell]

On Monday, July 11, 2022 at 2:31:20 PM UTC-5 medinuclear wrote:

> general...@googlegroups.com *Subject:* RE: [Consciousness-Online] RE: The 
> Supreme Court and the Electoral College
>
>  
>
> [*Olaf Stapledon*] *quoted below.*
>
> ” The fictitious deities of all races in all worlds once more crowded 
> themselves upon me,…”
>
> *[Philip Benjamin]*
>
>  This is off the thread here. However*, *I will try to retain the 
> thought*. *Prof Olaf is fundamentally wrong here and logically 
> inconsistent. How can fictitious deities *really *do anything at all? 
>

Deities operate as brain patterns, memes and thought games. There is no 
reason to think God, Allah or Jesus Christ exist outside of us, but we 
might say that the function as thought-games in the brain and by that way 
affect behavior. 

LC

 [image: bizarro god lives here.jpg]

> Human life ( for that matter any life) is more than a bunch of fundamental 
> particles. That is why even unreal and fictitious deities occupy human 
> minds! How could any race or individual intrinsically come up with any 
> fictitious notions of a friendly or hostile deity? Why can’t any mind be 
> absolutely blank of any such thinking? He looks like endorsing one of those 
> Israeli/Jewish women of Jeremiah’s days who said: ” As for the word that 
> thou hast spoken unto us in the name of the Lord, we will not hearken unto 
> thee.  But we will certainly do whatsoever thing goes forth out of our own 
> mouth, to burn incense unto the queen of heaven, and to pour out drink 
> offerings unto her, as we have done, we, and our fathers, our kings, and 
> our princes, in the cities of Judah, and in the streets of Jerusalem: for 
> then had we plenty of victuals, and were well, and saw no evil”.
>
>  The word pagan got into Queen’s English not by the KJV, instead 
> heathen is used by KJV for anything outside the domain of *Adonai 
> (plural) YHWH (singular) Elohim (uni-plural).*  See *Joshua 24:2. *Even 
> Terah, the father of Abraham, and the father of Nachor had one of those 
> deities.They were all heathen/pagan. Regeneration from old heathenism to 
> new-creation in Adonai is what Apostolic or Augustinian transformation is 
> all about. Like it or not, That, not *Prof.* *Olaf Stapledon,* is what 
> distinguished the nonconformist West in general from the rest of the world 
> which conformed to various deities of various races, peoples and 
> nations—including Jungian sorceries, occultism of Monk Rasputin, Madame 
> Blavatsky etc.
>
>  *Philip Benjamin*
>
> *   From:* 'Rosemary Rock-Evans' via Consciousness-Online <
> general...@googlegroups.com> S*ubject:* RE: [Consciousness-Online] RE: 
> The Supreme Court and the Electoral College   
>
>You know Philip I think it is rather difficult not to love the 
> earth, but it is possible to love the earth and trust the God who created 
> it and will destroy it. …. There is one writer who seemed to sum up this 
> form of duality – Olaf Stapledon, a science fiction writer and University 
> lecturer: Two related quotes …… The fictitious deities of all races in all 
> worlds once more crowded themselves upon me, symbols of majesty and 
> tenderness, of ruthless power, of blind creativity and of all seeing 
> wisdom. And though their images were but the fantasies of created minds, it 
> seemed to me that one and all did indeed embody some true features of the 
> Star Maker's impact. ...  
>
> Suddenly it was clear to me that virtue in the Creator is not the same as 
> virtue in the Creation. For the Creator if he should love his creation 
> would be loving only a part of himself, but the creation praising the 
> creator praises an infinity beyond himself. The virtue of the creation was 
> to love and to worship. The virtue of the Creator was to create and to be 
> infinite, the unrealisable and incomprehensible goal of worshipping 
> creatures. ……..  It is enough to have been created, to have embodied for a 
> moment the infinite and tumultuously creative spirit …. to have been the 
> rough sketch for some perfected creation.
> Professor Stapledon was much admired in his day …. “*Stapledon was 
> hostile to religious institutions, but not to religious yearnings*”. 
>
>
> -- Original Message --
> From: "Philip Benjamin" 
> To: "general...@googlegroups.com" 
>
> Sent: Sunday, 10 Jul, 22 At 19:26
> Subject: RE: [Consciousness-Online] RE: The Supreme Court and the 
> Electoral College
>
> *John Clark]*
>
> “´ Give me an example of something, anything, that is NOT pagan…. “.
>
> *[Philip Benjamin] *
>
> This is a reasonable question, though the problem was defined for over 
> over 20 years wherever that was allowed, though the WAMP (often Marxists) 
> despotically forbids. 
>
> WAMP is generally speaking a self-description, if anybody wants to join, 
> most welcome!! The name “John” meaning ”Jah (YHWH) is gracious” is not of 
> pagan origin, that does not necessarily 

Re: Scriptural refutation of the Transhumanist Movement

[Brent Meeker]

On 7/11/2022 1:10 PM, spudboy100 via Everything List wrote:
Part of it for some is notion that one cannot offend the Guy upstairs, 
or invoke the wrath of one's fellows, whether a religion or ideology.


My personal favorite dream after I win the lotto, would be to pay a 
physicist lots of money to come up with a scientifically plausible 
theory for God, the afterlife, & and everything.


If it's a theory for God it must include miracles, since that's sort of 
the defining power of God.  Once there are miracles the physics of the 
theory is complete.  Of course there's the ethical question of whether 
one should worship a God who's cruel and narcissistic, but that's not a 
question for a physicist, nor a problem for a Trumpist.


Brent

The writer would be given the option to write on the frontispiece: 
"Look, I believe this is bullshit, but I'm being paid lots of money to 
come up with this, so yeah, I sold out. I am a loyal atheist, and 
don't care much for people who waste their damn time thinking about a 
fantasy! But, I can find a good use for the cash he's paying me, 
so, sue me!"


In this manner, the physicist would be insulated from the wrath of his 
employer and colleagues. "So fire me, I could use the vacation time 
going to AAAS meetings, break my heart."


I mean this would be like a super Templeton Prize, but more profitable.



-Original Message-
From: Lawrence Crowell 
To: Everything List 
Sent: Mon, Jul 11, 2022 11:23 am
Subject: Re: Scriptural refutation of the Transhumanist Movement



On Monday, July 11, 2022 at 4:53:42 AM UTC-5 johnk...@gmail.com wrote:

On Sun, Jul 10, 2022 at 6:42 PM  wrote:

/> Transhumanism isn't even about real world. It's about
speculation about the real world/


And the New Testament, the Torah, the Quran, the Book of
Mormon,the writings of L Ron Hubbard, and the authors of every
other scientific ignoramus who wrote "Holy Scriptures" are
unimaginative speculations about an unreal world.

John K Clark    See what's on my new list at Extropolis

tbb



These things are mythic narratives.  As for travels and descriptions 
of places in the world, sure there were travelers who told of these 
places. This mentality is the antithesis of real thought. Bertrand 
Russel met Vladimir Ilyich Lenin and was struck by how Lenin could not 
talk outside the bounds of Marxist thinking. It was as if he was a 
prisoner of this ideology. Religion is similar, it is a "mind forged 
manacle" the imprisons the mind so it can not longer really think.


LC

uzp

On Sun, Jul 10, 2022 at 12:30 PM spudboy100 via Everything
List  wrote:


/> I don't see refutation of by scriptures,/


I don't see why anybody should care what the scriptures have
to say about transhumanism given that they were written by
members of a bronze age tribe who didn't even know where the
sun went at night; transhumanismis about the physical world,
how on Earth could anybody expect wisdom about thatfrom them?



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