RE: [expert] Can't install KNEWS, and an opinion
At 11:33 AM 04/12/2000 -0400, you wrote: Sorry, but yet another opinion I find that a good operating system has a reason for everything and when I finally understand the O/S, I agree with the reasons. This has been true of AOS/VS (ok, anybody remember that one?), O/S-9, CPM, RSTS, VM, MVS, Unix/XENIX/Linux and others. The O/S that resembles a Kommitee Kludge and is supposed to be easy to configure is the one I never seem to agree with its conventions. But maybe after all these years I just don't understand NT yet. Huh, what does this have to do with missing libraries. or is this to help me with knews? Jim
Re: [expert] Can't install KNEWS, and an opinion
At 11:17 PM 04/12/2000 -0400, Brian T. Schellenberger wrote: [A reasoned reply to my comments, unlike some others, PLUS help for my problem] MANY THANKS Brian, I will try that tonight. I guess I didn't express myself fully, I think that a minimal and a maximum install should both be provided. That way, if you are not a guru and run into problems installing, and you do want to install THAT program, you could drop back to the full install. I have been to DLL Hell more than once and prefer the Linux solution. What I'm saying that if Linux ever gets to the desktop this problem MUST be addressed. Mr or Mrs DesktopUser is NOT going to put up with installations like this, it will be "To hell with this, I'll use some other program", or "This Linux sucks, back to Windows". I know that including all materials necessary will work, I installed Applix, Star Office, Wordperfect, bluefish, nedit and Igloo FTP Pro without encountering the problem of unresolved dependencies. Jim PS Nedit rocks!!
Re: [expert] Can't install KNEWS, and an opinion
On Wed, 12 Apr 2000, you wrote: And is it no fairly common in the W-nn world to find that a new product has just installed an incompatible version of one of the standard DLLs? VBRUN300.DLL appears with virtually every package you install. And, according to an article about this very issue in the late lamented Byte, MS doesn't even use version numbers in its libraries properly, sometimes chaging the code but not the number, sometimes vice-versa. And you think M$ is bad about it??? Try AOHell. I'm told they make something like 300 registry changes (I'm sure some of those are adding stuff specific to their product, but...) and AOL 5 is generally incompatible with any other internet provider! Makes me VERY glad that AOL isn't available for Linux!!! They make so many changes and put their own proprietary stuff in over the already proprietary M$ stuff that it REALLY screws up Windows worse than it already was! :-) John
Re: [expert] Can't install KNEWS, and an opinion
I can't beleive they actually did have a version of aol for linux a long time ago On Thu, 13 Apr 2000, John Aldrich mewed: On Wed, 12 Apr 2000, you wrote: And is it no fairly common in the W-nn world to find that a new product has just installed an incompatible version of one of the standard DLLs? VBRUN300.DLL appears with virtually every package you install. And, according to an article about this very issue in the late lamented Byte, MS doesn't even use version numbers in its libraries properly, sometimes chaging the code but not the number, sometimes vice-versa. And you think M$ is bad about it??? Try AOHell. I'm told they make something like 300 registry changes (I'm sure some of those are adding stuff specific to their product, but...) and AOL 5 is generally incompatible with any other internet provider! Makes me VERY glad that AOL isn't available for Linux!!! They make so many changes and put their own proprietary stuff in over the already proprietary M$ stuff that it REALLY screws up Windows worse than it already was! :-) John -- Want to make some extra pocket change listening to your realplayer while you surf? http://www.radiofreecash.com/home.asp?ref=kittypuss Sign up for ClickDough and get paid to surf the web. http://secure.clickdough.com/servlets/cr/CRSignup.po?referral_id=kittypuss
Re: [expert] Can't install KNEWS, and an opinion
On Thu, 13 Apr 2000, Vic wrote: I can't beleive they actually did have a version of aol for linux a long time ago They did? -Stephen-
RE: [expert] Can't install KNEWS, and an opinion
Sorry, but yet another opinion I find that a good operating system has a reason for everything and when I finally understand the O/S, I agree with the reasons. This has been true of AOS/VS (ok, anybody remember that one?), O/S-9, CPM, RSTS, VM, MVS, Unix/XENIX/Linux and others. The O/S that resembles a Kommitee Kludge and is supposed to be easy to configure is the one I never seem to agree with its conventions. But maybe after all these years I just don't understand NT yet. -Original Message- From: Jim Hodgers [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2000 2:59 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [expert] Can't install KNEWS, and an opinion Now my opinion I am a programmer writing Accounting software for the Windows platform using Visual Basic. One of my REQUIRED tasks is assuring that the program will load on ANY Windows machine meeting the required hardware, using either Win95 or Win98. ANY required libraries MUST be included to assure this. In the Linux, it is quite common to find that you must go out onto the net and search for and load many required libraries, sometimes even those won't install until other files are obtained. Why not provide a COMPLETE package for those that need it? All the required dependency stuff it GPLed so all you would need to do is acknowledge the sources. This seems to be a matter of some heated feelings with some developers, in fact I was thoroughly chewed out by one developer whose program I still can't install. As long as Linux continues to have these niggling issues it will remain out of the range of most users. PS I know! Visual Basic, ugg, yeck, boo hiss! It gets the job done and pays the bills.
Re: [expert] Can't install KNEWS, and an opinion
Thus spake james.fogg ([EMAIL PROTECTED]): Sorry, but yet another opinion I find that a good operating system has a reason for everything and when I finally understand the O/S, I agree with the reasons. This has been true of AOS/VS (ok, anybody remember that one?), O/S-9, CPM, RSTS, VM, MVS, Unix/XENIX/Linux and others. The O/S that resembles a Kommitee Kludge and is supposed to be easy to configure is the one I never seem to agree with its conventions. But maybe after all these years I just don't understand NT yet. -Original Message- From: Jim Hodgers [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2000 2:59 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [expert] Can't install KNEWS, and an opinion Now my opinion I am a programmer writing Accounting software for the Windows platform using Visual Basic. One of my REQUIRED tasks is assuring that the program will load on ANY Windows machine meeting the required hardware, using either Win95 or Win98. ANY required libraries MUST be included to assure this. In the Linux, it is quite common to find that you must go out onto the net and search for and load many required libraries, sometimes even those won't install until other files are obtained. And is it no fairly common in the W-nn world to find that a new product has just installed an incompatible version of one of the standard DLLs? VBRUN300.DLL appears with virtually every package you install. And, according to an article about this very issue in the late lamented Byte, MS doesn't even use version numbers in its libraries properly, sometimes chaging the code but not the number, sometimes vice-versa. -- |Deryk Barker, Computer Science Dept. | Music does not have to be understood| |Camosun College, Victoria, BC, Canada| It has to be listened to. | |email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | | |phone: +1 250 370 4452 | Hermann Scherchen. |
RE: [expert] Can't install KNEWS, and an opinion
On Wed, 12 Apr 2000, james.fogg wrote, foaming at the mouth: Sorry, but yet another opinion I find that a good operating system has a reason for everything and when I finally understand the O/S, I agree with the reasons. This has been true of AOS/VS (ok, anybody remember that one?), O/S-9, CPM, RSTS, VM, MVS, Unix/XENIX/Linux and others. The O/S that resembles a Kommitee Kludge and is supposed to be easy to configure is the one I never seem to agree with its conventions. But maybe after all these years I just don't understand NT yet. Since this was posted twice I decided to elaborate. 1) Talk about heated feelings, WOW. 2) Nowhere in my opinion statement did I say that LINUX is at fault, it is the convention of incomplete installs I am talking about. 3) My first OS was on a NorthStar floppy in a homebuilt system(1974). I've used DOS(2-6.2), CPM, various Mac systems.VM,VMS,Unix and the OS the Data General Nova used for paper tapes, so my OS lineage is close to as old as yours. 4) I LIKE Linux, that is why I'm trying to do all this stuff! %) I live about 2 hours from the nearest Linux gurus so I depend on you experts for help. Jim "I'm not trolling, but I've hooked something" Hodgers -Original Message- From: Jim Hodgers [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2000 2:59 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [expert] Can't install KNEWS, and an opinion Now my opinion I am a programmer writing Accounting software for the Windows platform using Visual Basic. One of my REQUIRED tasks is assuring that the program will load on ANY Windows machine meeting the required hardware, using either Win95 or Win98. ANY required libraries MUST be included to assure this. In the Linux, it is quite common to find that you must go out onto the net and search for and load many required libraries, sometimes even those won't install until other files are obtained. Why not provide a COMPLETE package for those that need it? All the required dependency stuff it GPLed so all you would need to do is acknowledge the sources. This seems to be a matter of some heated feelings with some developers, in fact I was thoroughly chewed out by one developer whose program I still can't install. As long as Linux continues to have these niggling issues it will remain out of the range of most users. PS I know! Visual Basic, ugg, yeck, boo hiss! It gets the job done and pays the bills.
Re: [expert] Can't install KNEWS, and an opinion
On Wed, 12 Apr 2000, you wrote: included to assure this. In the Linux, it is quite common to find that you must go out onto the net and search for and load many required libraries, sometimes even those won't install until other files are obtained. Why not provide a COMPLETE package for those that need it? Because then everyone who does not need it will be downloading the same stuff over and over. Because then you get into the windows problem of mismatching dlls/libs PS I know! Visual Basic, ugg, yeck, boo hiss! It gets the job done and pays the bills. Could be worse. -- Alex (Go easy on me, I'm a COBOL programmer in real life)
Re: [expert] Can't install KNEWS, and an opinion
PHILOSOHPY:
==
FWIW, I don't think that the problem here is so much that not all
libraries are included; if you are distributing on a CD it's fine to
include all the libs, but as a 28.8 modem user (for only about another
20 hours, but many others aren't that lucky) I certainly don't want the
libraries tossed in willy-nilly; most libraries are already on my
distribution CD and I want to get them from there.
Of course if you have a commercial product that ships on a CD you jolly
well ought to include all libraries and install them as ncessary.
My experience, though, is that they do.
I think that the bigger problem here is that a lot of software checks
for libraries specifically rather than "library of at least this
version." Let's not beat around the bush: this is just plain dumb.
GETTING IT WORKING:
==
You can fix your immediate problem with
cd /usr/lib (or cd /lib, whereever they got installed), and
ln -s libpng.so.2 libpng.so.0
ln -s libjpg.so.6 libjpg.so.4
[verify which version it actually installed for each of these. I have
png so I'm pretty sure it's correct, but I don't have jpg, so that's a
guess.]
Jim Hodgers wrote:
I have been looking for a good KDE news reader and wanted to install KNEWS.
I downloaded knews-1.0b.0-1.i386.rpm from the net and tried to install.
It failed on dependencies for "libpng.so.0" and "libjpeg.so.4" so I downloaded
"libpng-1.0.5-2mdk.i586.rpm" and "libjpeg-6b-12mdk.i586.rpm" and installed
them
both with command rpm -i {filename}. Neither returned errors but rpm -i
{Knews file} still complains about the same dependencies. What am I doing
wrong?
Jim
Now my opinion
I am a programmer writing Accounting software for the Windows platform
using Visual Basic.
One of my REQUIRED tasks is assuring that the program will load on ANY
Windows machine
meeting the required hardware, using either Win95 or Win98. ANY required
libraries MUST be
included to assure this. In the Linux, it is quite common to find that you
must go out onto
the net and search for and load many required libraries, sometimes even
those won't install
until other files are obtained. Why not provide a COMPLETE package for
those that need it?
All the required dependency stuff it GPLed so all you would need to do is
acknowledge the
sources. This seems to be a matter of some heated feelings with some
developers, in fact
I was thoroughly chewed out by one developer whose program I still can't
install.
As long as Linux continues to have these niggling issues it will remain out
of the
range of most users.
PS I know! Visual Basic, ugg, yeck, boo hiss! It gets the job done and pays
the bills.
--
"Brian, the man from babble-on" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Brian T. Schellenberger http://www.babbleon.org
Support http://www.eff.org. Support decss
defendents.
Support http://www.programming-freedom.org. Boycott amazon.com.
