date:20051216

Title: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Inciting racial hatred or not (was, question about Maharishi's brothers,)





on 12/16/05 12:22 PM, Jason Spock at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

    An Australian missionary Graham Staines was burnt alive along with his two sons in January 1999. 

By fundamentalist Hindus?






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Headphones

Title: Re: [FairfieldLife] Headphones





on 12/16/05 6:32 PM, Vaj at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Sennheiser HD 215's. Love 'em. 

The reviews on Amazon (http://tinyurl.com/cgr7f) say these don’t have good bass. I like bass. The Sony MDR-V600 Studio Monitor Series Headphones are getting rave reviews (http://tinyurl.com/8fn2t). Is that what you have Barry?

Wife wants some Bose noise cancelling HP's (perhaps to drown me out)--anyone try them?

A friend of mine here in Fairfield got some and didn’t like them at all. Got rid of them. If you want to chat with him about them, email me on the side.

On Dec 16, 2005, at 3:37 PM, Rick Archer wrote:

Can any of you music buffs recommend headphones (not earplugs) in the $100-$150 range?



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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Headphones

on 12/16/05 4:28 PM, braaahmaan at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> 
> Yikes -- I just read your post "carefully". You said "not ear plugs" .

Maybe I would like earplugs, but my wife would be sharing these with me -
she would use them to watch TV and not disturb me while I'm meditating or
practicing tablas; I would use them to listen to music while at my computer
and not disturb her. Do these ear plugs have good bass? I have a nice set of
speakers on my computer with a sub-woofer and I'd miss the bass if they
didn't.

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Announcement of A New Folder: Baseless Claims on FFL

2005-12-16 Thread lurkernomore20002000

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> An new folder in the FILES section (see uper left portion of FFL Home
> Page) has been created to track, and hopefuly reduce, the 
surprisingly
> increasing number of baseless and/or unsubstantiated claims made on 
FFL. 
> 
> Here is the FAQ for that folder.

snip
> 
Does someone have too much time on their hands.?

lurk
>

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Merry Yule !

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> ï¿¼
> 
> 
> --
> "Inner (R)evolution for World Peace"
>--seen on handmade bumpersticker.
>
nice...

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Re: [FairfieldLife] Headphones



Sennheiser HD 215's. Love 'em. Wife wants some Bose noise cancelling HP's (perhaps to drown me out)--anyone try them?On Dec 16, 2005, at 3:37 PM, Rick Archer wrote:Can any of you music buffs recommend headphones (not earplugs) in the $100-$150 range?





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[FairfieldLife] Just when you thought the Arctic Refuge was safe...


Dear NRDC BioGems Defender,

It's the most outrageous scheme yet to open the Arctic National  
Wildlife Refuge
to oil drilling. We have just learned that pro-drilling Senators are  
sneaking
their Arctic drilling measure into the Defense Appropriations bill.

The vote on the Senate floor could come as early as tomorrow!

Call your two Senators right now at the phone numbers below and tell  
them to
get Arctic drilling out of the Defense bill, with a filibuster if  
necessary.
Call them even if it's Friday night or Saturday:

Here's the good news: thanks to a nationwide outcry from millions of  
Americans,
including you, House and Senate leaders have given up on including  
Arctic
drilling in the Budget Reconciliation bill.

But some Senators are so shameless in their quest to boost oil  
company profits
that they're willing to exploit the Defense Appropriations bill,  
which is meant
to fund our troops in Iraq and other military needs.

Your Senators will be under enormous political pressure to vote Yes  
on the
Defense Appropriations bill no matter what's in it. We're counting on  
a last-
ditch effort by a determined group of senators to filibuster this  
bill until
Arctic drilling is removed. In that case, the oil industry and their  
allies
would have to get over 60 votes to keep drilling in -- something they  
have
never been able to do.

Call your Senators right away and tell them you're outraged that Arctic
drilling would be snuck into a bill that is meant to protect our  
troops. Urge
them to get Arctic drilling out of the Defense bill, with a  
filibuster if
necessary. And tell them you will publicly support their No vote if  
they come
under attack for it in your state.

The next 24 hours are critical. Call your Senators right now!

Sincerely,

John H. Adams
NRDC Action Fund

. . .

Note: We appreciate the opportunity to communicate with you and other  
NRDC
BioGems Defenders, but if you would prefer not to receive BioGems  
updates or
hear from BioGems activists in the field, you can send an email  
message to
[EMAIL PROTECTED] with "Please remove my name" in the  
subject
line.

To update your information, including your email or mailing address,  
log in to
your Action Log at http://www.savebiogems.org/actionlog/ and click  
"Update your
info."

The NRDC Action Fund is the 501(c)(4) affiliate of the Natural Resources
Defense Council (NRDC).

1321046



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[FairfieldLife] Re: Headphones

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> wrote:
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> > wrote:
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> > wrote:
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer 
> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Can any of you music buffs recommend headphones (not 
> earplugs) 
> > in the
> > > > > $100-$150 range?
> > > > 
> > > > I've actually always been a fan of the Sony Studio
> > > > line, made for musicians while recording. I know
> > > > that there are 'phones with a better "technical"
> > > > degree of accuracy, but I really *like* the sound
> > > > of the Sony headphones.
> > > > 
> > > > This hearkens back to recent discussions here. Who
> > > > you gonna trust? Some engineer who tells you the
> > > > sound of these 'phones is "best," or the way they
> > > > sound when placed over your own ears?
> > > 
> > > Dude, I am totally going with the TruthMeisters (Barry the
> > > TruthMeister Right) because his intuition is ALWAYS right. He 
> > > even said so himself. What more would you want in proof?
> > 
> > As usual in this sequence of posts, you miss the point
> > entirely. The only thing that matters when assessing
> > headphones is how they sound to *you*. Nothing that 
> > *anyone* says about them is of any relevance whatsover
> > if you really prefer Brand X to Brand Gottagoodname.
> > 
> > Unless. of course, you're too wimpy to make your own
> > decisions in life, and have to rely on the assessments
> > of other people...  :-)
> 
> You caught me in rant mode, after a walk in the Mer
> des rochés under the near-full moon, after a wonderful
> dinner with friends. Your bad luck.  :-)
> 
> I mean, *grow a pair*, people. 
> 
> How many years -- or decades -- have you been doing 
> this spiritual stuff? Isn't it about bloody time you
> got comfortable making your *own* decisions, and not
> apologizing for them, after all this time.
> 
> Do you really *need* the affirmation of a 'guru,' to
> justify your belief in something? Or science?
> 
> Whatever happened to trusting in one's own experience?
> That's what all the saints you revere did. Learn from 
> their example.
>
Yeah! Hey Unc, I didn't know what it was today, but *you* have been 
*the* *mad* *poet*, and I LOVE that shit! 
I'm fired up, and inspired- 
I've put some champagne on ice, and when my beloved returns home in 
awhile, I will pop that cork, and we'll toast each other in the 
sinking golden California light. Right on brother! Have a great 
weekend 






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Headphones

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> You caught me in rant mode, after a walk in the Mer
> des rochés under the near-full moon, after a wonderful
> dinner with friends. Your bad luck.  :-)
> 
> I mean, *grow a pair*, people. 

Are you selling some? Not used ones I hope. Not them rocks you call
balls I hope. Mine are brass now and I will only trade up for diamond
ones, two inches thick.

> How many years -- or decades -- have you been doing 
> this spiritual stuff? Isn't it about bloody time you
> got comfortable making your *own* decisions, and not
> apologizing for them, after all this time.

Why would you -- to quote you -- "give a flying fuck" what we beleive?
I thought that was the oldtimers campfire credo that you don't give a
flying fuck what others believe. Did you fall out of the loft in the
barn and conk your noggin again old timer?

> Do you really *need* the affirmation of a 'guru,' to
> justify your belief in something? Or science?

Ditto. 

And you got my story all wrong. I think maybe you got wax in your
ears, old-timer. Anyway, its my story, misunderstnd it all you want,
but don't sit and try to re-write my story to suit you.! Got it
partner! Else we and de boys will show you something  you will give a
flying fuck about.

> Whatever happened to trusting in one's own experience?

I don't know. Maybe your infallable intuition can help us find out?
Dig it out of your saddle bags, gabby.

> That's what all the saints you revere did. Learn from 
> their example.

But you aren't sellng ay advice are you? So you are just talking to
yourself, making a mental note for something for YOU to follow right? 
Else you would be breaking the old-timers campfire credo. And if you
do that,there will be SHIT to pay at the old coral tomorrow, Dab gumm IT!

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Headphones

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> Dude, I am totally going with the TruthMeisters (Barry the
> TruthMeister Right) because his intuition is ALWAYS right. He even
> said so himself. What more would you want in proof?


Its beyond me that anyone could not take this as satire. Especially by
one whose intuition is almost infallible. Go (flying-fuck) figure! Its
a mystery. A paradox. ... Damn the walls are melting, all is merging
 even the campfire  









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[FairfieldLife] Re: Announcement of A New Folder: Baseless Claims on FFL

2005-12-16 Thread authfriend

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:

> > Some of us don't really give a flying fuck what anyone
> > else believes. 
> 
> Thats cool. You just seem to spend an innordinate amount of time
> telling others that their shit is not true. And seeming to defend 
> your own.

Bingo.

> But thats maybe just my impression.

Mine as well, 10 years' worth.

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Announcement of A New Folder: Baseless Cla

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com,
"tomandcindytraynoratfairfieldlis"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Unc writes: bigest snippereion
> None of the reactions affect those of us who are merely
> Relating Our Stories terribly much. We're just Relating
> Our Stories. They're *ours*, man, not yours. Yours may
> *never* be like ours. Yours may be better. We (and I think
> I speak for a few people here) are content to just tell stories.
> How the audience around the campfire reacts to the stories
> is their business, not ours.
> 
> Tom T Opinion:
> Amen Brother. If you don't like the story go get a different channel.
> Not my job to change your channel, prove it or figure it out. It is
> all just for fun. Stories have never been anything but fun. Enjoy,
> good storytelling and happy trails to you until we meet again.!
> Tom T

Thats cool. I am just wondering when you hear a story you don't like
why you tell people to walk the deep end or suck eggs. If others'
stories anger you so, perhaps  you should change the channel.

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Headphones

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> wrote:
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> > wrote:
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> > wrote:
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer 
> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Can any of you music buffs recommend headphones (not 
> earplugs) 
> > in the
> > > > > $100-$150 range?
> > > > 
> > > > I've actually always been a fan of the Sony Studio
> > > > line, made for musicians while recording. I know
> > > > that there are 'phones with a better "technical"
> > > > degree of accuracy, but I really *like* the sound
> > > > of the Sony headphones.
> > > > 
> > > > This hearkens back to recent discussions here. Who
> > > > you gonna trust? Some engineer who tells you the
> > > > sound of these 'phones is "best," or the way they
> > > > sound when placed over your own ears?
> > > 
> > > Dude, I am totally going with the TruthMeisters (Barry the
> > > TruthMeister Right) because his intuition is ALWAYS right. He 
> > > even said so himself. What more would you want in proof?
> > 
> > As usual in this sequence of posts, you miss the point
> > entirely. The only thing that matters when assessing
> > headphones is how they sound to *you*. Nothing that 
> > *anyone* says about them is of any relevance whatsover
> > if you really prefer Brand X to Brand Gottagoodname.
> > 
> > Unless. of course, you're too wimpy to make your own
> > decisions in life, and have to rely on the assessments
> > of other people...  :-)
> 
> You caught me in rant mode, after a walk in the Mer
> des rochés under the near-full moon, after a wonderful
> dinner with friends. Your bad luck.  :-)
> 
> I mean, *grow a pair*, people. 
> 
> How many years -- or decades -- have you been doing 
> this spiritual stuff? Isn't it about bloody time you
> got comfortable making your *own* decisions, and not
> apologizing for them, after all this time.
> 
> Do you really *need* the affirmation of a 'guru,' to
> justify your belief in something? Or science?
> 
> Whatever happened to trusting in one's own experience?
> That's what all the saints you revere did. Learn from 
> their example.
>

Sounds like more of a drunken rift. But "who gives a flying fuck." You
"aren't selling anything". You "don't give a flying fuck what people
think of what you write". You imply you intuitions is infallible. Hard
to imagine why you even congregate with us mortals. :)

But as I said in my last post, you have missed the point that ("that
you don't give a flying fuck about") entirely. And are ranting on "not
selling" something and "not giving a fuck" about having us buy your
campfire Jack Daniels insights. So maybe just roll up in the blanket,
say "fuck you world" and have a toasty stuporous sleep. :) Sweet
dreams. Happy Trails. 










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[FairfieldLife] Re: Announcement of A New Folder: Baseless Cla

Unc writes: bigest snippereion
None of the reactions affect those of us who are merely
Relating Our Stories terribly much. We're just Relating
Our Stories. They're *ours*, man, not yours. Yours may
*never* be like ours. Yours may be better. We (and I think
I speak for a few people here) are content to just tell stories.
How the audience around the campfire reacts to the stories
is their business, not ours.

Tom T Opinion:
Amen Brother. If you don't like the story go get a different channel.
Not my job to change your channel, prove it or figure it out. It is
all just for fun. Stories have never been anything but fun. Enjoy,
good storytelling and happy trails to you until we meet again.!
Tom T







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Headphones

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
You implied earlier that your intuition was infallible. 

It almost always is. For me. I don't remember asking
you to believe that it was relevant to your life, or 
infallible for you. *You* projected that onto what I 
was saying.

It would seem that you're used to people trying to sell
you something. If you have a background in the TM move-
ment, that feeling is understandable. Expand your hori-
zons. Not *everyone* is trying to sell you something.
When you start to believe they are, you reveal your own
spiritual poverty, not theirs.








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[FairfieldLife] Re: Headphones

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> wrote:
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> wrote:
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer 
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Can any of you music buffs recommend headphones (not 
earplugs) 
> in the
> > > > $100-$150 range?
> > > 
> > > I've actually always been a fan of the Sony Studio
> > > line, made for musicians while recording. I know
> > > that there are 'phones with a better "technical"
> > > degree of accuracy, but I really *like* the sound
> > > of the Sony headphones.
> > > 
> > > This hearkens back to recent discussions here. Who
> > > you gonna trust? Some engineer who tells you the
> > > sound of these 'phones is "best," or the way they
> > > sound when placed over your own ears?
> > 
> > Dude, I am totally going with the TruthMeisters (Barry the
> > TruthMeister Right) because his intuition is ALWAYS right. He 
> > even said so himself. What more would you want in proof?
> 
> As usual in this sequence of posts, you miss the point
> entirely. The only thing that matters when assessing
> headphones is how they sound to *you*. Nothing that 
> *anyone* says about them is of any relevance whatsover
> if you really prefer Brand X to Brand Gottagoodname.
> 
> Unless. of course, you're too wimpy to make your own
> decisions in life, and have to rely on the assessments
> of other people...  :-)

You caught me in rant mode, after a walk in the Mer
des rochés under the near-full moon, after a wonderful
dinner with friends. Your bad luck.  :-)

I mean, *grow a pair*, people. 

How many years -- or decades -- have you been doing 
this spiritual stuff? Isn't it about bloody time you
got comfortable making your *own* decisions, and not
apologizing for them, after all this time.

Do you really *need* the affirmation of a 'guru,' to
justify your belief in something? Or science?

Whatever happened to trusting in one's own experience?
That's what all the saints you revere did. Learn from 
their example.

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Headphones

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> wrote:
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> wrote:
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer 
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Can any of you music buffs recommend headphones (not earplugs) 
> in the
> > > > $100-$150 range?
> > > 
> > > I've actually always been a fan of the Sony Studio
> > > line, made for musicians while recording. I know
> > > that there are 'phones with a better "technical"
> > > degree of accuracy, but I really *like* the sound
> > > of the Sony headphones.
> > > 
> > > This hearkens back to recent discussions here. Who
> > > you gonna trust? Some engineer who tells you the
> > > sound of these 'phones is "best," or the way they
> > > sound when placed over your own ears?
> > 
> > Dude, I am totally going with the TruthMeisters (Barry the
> > TruthMeister Right) because his intuition is ALWAYS right. He even
> > said so himself. What more would you want in proof?
> 
> As usual in this sequence of posts, you miss the point
> entirely. The only thing that matters when assessing
> headphones is how they sound to *you*. Nothing that 
> *anyone* says about them is of any relevance whatsover
> if you really prefer Brand X to Brand Gottagoodname.
> 
> Unless. of course, you're too wimpy to make your own
> decisions in life, and have to rely on the assessments
> of other people...  :-)
>

No you apparently missed the point, but I know you don'"t give a
flying fuck" about that. You implied earlier that your intuition was
infallible. I was having some fun with that. That you find it fun, or
not fun, well IDGAFF.:)







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Announcement of A New Folder: Baseless Claims on FFL

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> wrote:

> > Thank you for invoking clarification. Let me rephrase that.
> > 
> > > > My point has been simply, that when someone makes an assertion 
> of fact "the sky is red" they should provide some substance to back 
> > it up if asked, if they want their point to be take[n] as fact.
> 
> I assume you really meant "taken as fact." Cool. That's
> where I thought you were at, based on your recent posts.
> 
> Some of us don't really give a flying fuck what anyone
> else believes. 

Thats cool. You just seem to spend an innordinate amount of time 
telling others that their shit is not true. And seeming to defend your
own. But thats maybe just my impression. I will look at your posts and
try to see the "don't give a flying fuck who believes this" credo more
clearly. 

> we're not trying to *sell* anything, 

Great. I have vastly misinterpreted your past posts somehow. My
mistake. I will look at your posts in a new light. 

> If someone finds value in that, cool.  If someone finds in
> the same tale only something he or she can react to angrily,
> or with distrust, or with a desire for "proof" to verify it,
> cool. 

Well, when you imply your intuition is infallable, yeah I got to
laugh. Maybe just a bit of skepticism. But anger, no way. 

Maybe you are referring obliquely to others and not me, but I have
never asked for proof of an opinion or subjective experience. I can't
recall anyonbe who has. But this just a bunch of guys spinning
opinions and yarns around the campfire, party on. Why though do some
sem to get so pissed in doing so. Peter and Tom's poss today to be
specific?

> None of the reactions affect those of us who are merely
> Relating Our Stories terribly much. We're just Relating
> Our Stories. 
Cool.

> They're *ours*, man, not yours. 

It never occured to me they weren't, but thanks for the clarification
anyway.

> We (and I think
> I speak for a few people here) are content to just tell stories.

OK. Good to know. Stories can be fun.

> How the audience around the campfire reacts to the stories
> is their business, not ours.

Ok old timer. I didn't mean to offend. I am new to these parts. Its
great to be sitting around the campfire with you old time FFLers. 

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[FairfieldLife] Read along with Tom 2

2005-12-16 Thread Tom Pall






"The universe operates through dynamic 
exchange...giving and receiving are different aspects of the flow of energy in 
the universe.
 
And in our willingness to give that which we seek, 
we keep the abundance of the universe circulating in our lives."
 
--Deepak Chopra, The Seven Spiritual Laws of 
Success





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Headphones

2005-12-16 Thread Alex Stanley

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>
> Can any of you music buffs recommend headphones (not earplugs) in the
> $100-$150 range?

I can't recommend ones to buy, but I *can* recommend ones to *not*
buy: Etymotic Research ER6i. They have no bass at all. The only time I
use them is when I'm running the vacuum cleaner (they block out almost
all room noise.) 

Alex

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Headphones

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > Can any of you music buffs recommend headphones (not earplugs) 
in the
> > > $100-$150 range?
> > 
> > I've actually always been a fan of the Sony Studio
> > line, made for musicians while recording. I know
> > that there are 'phones with a better "technical"
> > degree of accuracy, but I really *like* the sound
> > of the Sony headphones.
> > 
> > This hearkens back to recent discussions here. Who
> > you gonna trust? Some engineer who tells you the
> > sound of these 'phones is "best," or the way they
> > sound when placed over your own ears?
> 
> Dude, I am totally going with the TruthMeisters (Barry the
> TruthMeister Right) because his intuition is ALWAYS right. He even
> said so himself. What more would you want in proof?

As usual in this sequence of posts, you miss the point
entirely. The only thing that matters when assessing
headphones is how they sound to *you*. Nothing that 
*anyone* says about them is of any relevance whatsover
if you really prefer Brand X to Brand Gottagoodname.

Unless. of course, you're too wimpy to make your own
decisions in life, and have to rely on the assessments
of other people...  :-)

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Headphones

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> wrote:
> >
> > Can any of you music buffs recommend headphones (not earplugs) in the
> > $100-$150 range?
> 
> I've actually always been a fan of the Sony Studio
> line, made for musicians while recording. I know
> that there are 'phones with a better "technical"
> degree of accuracy, but I really *like* the sound
> of the Sony headphones.
> 
> This hearkens back to recent discussions here. Who
> you gonna trust? Some engineer who tells you the
> sound of these 'phones is "best," or the way they
> sound when placed over your own ears?

Dude, I am totally going with the TruthMeisters (Barry the
TruthMeister Right) because his intuition is ALWAYS right. He even
said so himself. What more would you want in proof?

>

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Announcement of A New Folder: Baseless Claims on FFL

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
> > >
> > > My point has been simply, that when someone makes an assertion 
of
> > > fact "the sky is red" they should provide some substance to 
back 
> > > it up if asked. 
> > 
> > Why?
> > 
> > Because you want such "substance?" Dream on.
> > 
> > Learn to trust your own intuition, dude. If you can't
> > tell what is true and what is not by reading people's
> > words on an Internet forum, you're never going to 
> > learn to make that distinction.
> 
> Thank you for invoking clarification. Let me rephrase that.
> 
> > > My point has been simply, that when someone makes an assertion 
of
> fact "the sky is red" they should provide some substance to back 
> it up if asked, if they want their point to be take as fact.

I assume you really meant "taken as fact." Cool. That's
where I thought you were at, based on your recent posts.

Some of us don't really give a flying fuck what anyone
else believes. We're not trying to *sell* anything, least
of all one point of view among the millions possible. We
content ourselves with relating our subjective experiences.
If someone finds value in that, cool.  If someone finds in
the same tale only something he or she can react to angrily,
or with distrust, or with a desire for "proof" to verify it,
cool. 

None of the reactions affect those of us who are merely
Relating Our Stories terribly much. We're just Relating
Our Stories. They're *ours*, man, not yours. Yours may
*never* be like ours. Yours may be better. We (and I think
I speak for a few people here) are content to just tell stories.
How the audience around the campfire reacts to the stories
is their business, not ours.

> Otherwise, it is taken as unexplained opinion (logic and experience
> used in coming to such an opinion) which is fine -- for what it 
is --
>  but does not hold much water.  
> 
> 
> 
> > Learn to trust your own intuition, dude. 
> 
> 
> If you are stating your opinion that intuition alone is superior to
> intuition with some facts and logic, my opinion is counter to 
yours.
> Aparently the last 400 years disagrees with you also. But intuit 
and
> party on dude.
> 
> > If you can't
> > tell what is true and what is not by reading people's
> > words on an Internet forum, ..
> 
> And how exactly would you do that? You feel your intuition can 
discern
> fact from fiction without error? jeez then sign that boy up!!!
> Restructure the courts, congress, the press, the UN, all academic
> research,  and just let Barry tell you if its true or not. What a
> DEAL! Can we clone you?
> 
> > you are never going to make that distinction.
> 
> Another unsupported opinion of your with which I disagree. Isn't
> diversity a great thing?
> 
> So tell me mr Truthometer, where is Jimy Hoffa's body? Where is 
Elvis
> living (cuz he clearly is alive), and what is Jimi Hendrix's best
> song, and what did the Sgt Pepper Ablumn really say backwards, Who 
are
> Bevan's babe's, What is McDonalds secret sauce,  and who put the 
Ram
> in the Ramma Doma Ding Dong? ?
> 
> Now remember, stick to FACTS, not opinions.
>

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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Mystery of Mantra

Vaj Posts:
That's real close. Ksemaraja in his comment to Shiva-sutra 2:1  
"Cittam mantrah", gives the derivation of different levels of meaning  
for this word. At one level manana means "reflecting over the highest  
I-consciousness and the other characteristic of trAna, the protection  
by terminating the transmigratory existence which establishes  
differences (between subjects/objects)." In other words it protects  
the mind from dualism and leads us towards unity.

(Swami Lakshmanjoo: 
Second Awakening

1. Here the mind of a yogi becomes mantra.

2. The cause of attaining this mantra is one's own effort.

3. The state of totality of knowledge is the secret of mantra.

4. When a yogi's mind remains satisfied in cosmic powers, his samadhi
is as good as ordinary dreaming.

5. At the rise of natural (pure) supreme knowledge, the state of
Shiva, residing in the ether of God Consciousness, is attained.

6. For such attainment, the means is the Master - the Guru.






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[FairfieldLife] Howard Sterns' Unboundedness

'WE PLAYED DILDO GOLF, WE PLAYED WHEEL OF SEX, WE ARE THE LAST OF A
DYING BREED. THIS IS A BIG MOMENT. WE BROKE EVERY RULE KNOWN TO RADIO
AND MANKIND. THE GOVERNMENT SAYS CLEAN UP YOUR ACT, WE SAY NEVER.'

http://today.reuters.com/news/newsarticle.aspx?type=entertainmentNews&storyid=2005-12-16T193346Z_01_KRA628036_RTRUKOC_0_US-MEDIA-STERN.xml&rpc=22







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Headphones

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> Can any of you music buffs recommend headphones (not earplugs) in the
> $100-$150 range?

I've actually always been a fan of the Sony Studio
line, made for musicians while recording. I know
that there are 'phones with a better "technical"
degree of accuracy, but I really *like* the sound
of the Sony headphones.

This hearkens back to recent discussions here. Who
you gonna trust? Some engineer who tells you the
sound of these 'phones is "best," or the way they
sound when placed over your own ears?

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Headphones

> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> >
> > Can any of you music buffs recommend headphones (not earplugs) in the
> > $100-$150 range?
> 

http://www.shurestore.com/earphones/index.html#eseries

I have te e-2s $100 and for my ear they have great sound. 

The e-5s will set you back $500. It would be fun to try a pair.

IMO in-ear is the only way to go. Unlike ear buds, they are
comfortable and stay in place. And being just little earplug size
pods, they fit in your pocket easily, no head band or apparatus. And
being in your ear, and the design of the bud, the acoustics are better
than any other headphone I have tried. And are not sweaty like studio
phones. And you can walk around with a mp3 player and people can
barely tell you are listening to it. Inobtrusive and great sound.

Yikes -- I just read your post "carefully". You said "not ear plugs" .
OOPs. sorry. 

Just supports my point that often what we read is NOT what is on the
page. Sometimes due to skimming, sometimes due to cognitive quirks.

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Judy and TorquiseB

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anonymousff <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> > [...]
> > > I find their banter delightfully refreshing. Sort of like 
abbott and
> > > costello. Or Laurel and Hardy. Martin and Dean. Perhaps Rocky 
and
> > > Bullwinkle.
> > >
> > 
> > Boris and Natasha fits better, I think...
> 
> 
> But that would be sexist stereotyping. Like saying Tracy and 
Hepburn.
> Or Burns and Allen. Or Bruce Willis and Cybil Shepard.
>

Ideally, Jackie Gleason and Audrey Meadows: "Someday Alice..."

Of course we could go classic vaudville and talk about the Three 
Stooges but one is Unmanifest...

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Inciting racial hatred or not (was, question about Maharishi's brothers,....)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason Spock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
>
>   India had more wealth than the whole of Europe, middle-east 
and China put together.!!  All foreign invaders were attracted only 
by the wealth which was present in India.
>
>   Two centuries of British exploitation, completely ravaged 
India.  By the time the British left in 1947, India had become 
extremely weak and improvished.
>
>   It's a paradox.  Sri. Aurobindo said, "Nature tried 
everything she could to unite the whole of India, but couldn't.  So 
Nature finally resorted to foreign invasions to unite the whole of 
India."
>
>   What he probably meant is that, Nature intended a united 
India, which would be better to spread the message of enlightenment.  
A divided and fragmented India is extremely dangerous and undesirable.
>
>   An Australian missionary Graham Staines was burnt alive along 
with his two sons in January 1999.  It created a huge controversy in 
India.  In fact his wife Gladys Staines still works in India.  It 
doesn't make sense for Maharishi to enter into this messy controversy.
>
>   OriginalMessage-


At the least, MMY isn't entering into the *country* so perhaps he 
agrees with you about the messy part.





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Headphones

2005-12-16 Thread uns_tressor

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>
> Can any of you music buffs recommend headphones (not earplugs) in the
> $100-$150 range?

Give Beyer Dynamics a try out at your local shop. Try
Which? magazine:
http://trial.which.co.uk/audio_visual_equipment.php?p_id=312
Uns.

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Your mind is never going to get MMY. Never, ever.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> 
> 
> --- sparaig <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> 
> > 
> > Since TC isnt' an experience in the usual sense of
> > the word, it seems 
> > plausible that any further state based on TC
> > wouldn't be experiential 
> > in the way that other things we might talk about
> > are.
> > 
> > therefore, trying to talk about similarities and
> > differences makes no 
> > sense -- or at least, may not be appropriate.
> 
> I like the Piaget model here to explain what can't be
> explained! Again, there is such a profound qualitative
> shift in self/world from waking state to Realization
> that it is almost impossible to talk about in anyway
> that'll make sense from a waking state perspective.
> I'm not trying to retreat into a "You gotta be there
> to get it" perspective, but you gotta be there to get
> it. Like Buddha after his realization. Initially, he
> thought that it would be impossible to even talk about
> this to others in waking state.  
> 

Some would say that he never did. The map is not the territory and 
all that.





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Shiva-sutra of the day 3:6

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> On Dec 16, 2005, at 10:26 AM, sparaig wrote:
> 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>  From the anava-upaya, section 3, of the Shiva-sutra:
> >>
> >> "Mohavaranat siddhih"
> >>
> >> (mohAvaraNATh siddhiH)
> >>
> >> "Siddhis are due to a veil (AvaraNa) drawn by ignorance (mohA)."
> >>
> >>
> >
> > Of course. If there was no veil, there would be no outward stroke
> > (performance) and hence no siddhi.
> 
> Well not the point here as there is no mention of the vyutthana 
(the  
> outward stroke). The point is performance of siddhis increases the  
> power of our own delusions (maya-shakti). We begin to believe our 
own  
> delusions.
>

well, if there was no veil, there could be no inward stroke either.





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Your mind is never going to get MMY. Never, ever.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jim_flanegin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jim_flanegin" 
> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Everyone will interpret the same experience of enlightenment 
> > > > differently. Of course. But enlightenment itself remains the 
> same 
> > > > experience as it has for eternity. 
> > > 
> > > And you're completely convinced of that?  I'm not. 
> > > I have no problem with it being different for 
> > > everyone who experiences it.  
> > > 
> > > > I think the confusion may occur when people speak about 
> Oneness 
> > or 
> > > > Unity, and to the unenlightened, this sounds like once we are 
> > > > enlightened, we all become the same, express ourselves the 
> same,  
> > > > act the same, etc. 
> > > 
> > > I think the problem is far more fundamental than
> > > that.  *Anything* you try to say about enlighten-
> > > ment is wrong.
> > > 
> > > > Nothing could be further from the truth. This is just the 
> attempt 
> > > of 
> > > > the ignorant mind to make sense of enlightenment. After 
> > > > enlightenment, individual expression remains consistent, 
> because 
> > > > each person's physiology remains different. Even more 
> individual. 
> > > > But the experience of enlightenment remains the same for us 
> all.
> > > 
> > > I might say that enlightenment itself (as opposed 
> > > to the individual minds that experience it) may
> > > remain the same, but that the *experience* of that
> > > eternal, non-localized state may be (and possibly is) 
> > > completely different for every localized being who 
> > > ever experiences it.
> > >
> > 
> > Since TC isnt' an experience in the usual sense of the word, it 
> seems 
> > plausible that any further state based on TC wouldn't be 
> experiential 
> > in the way that other things we might talk about are.
> > 
> > therefore, trying to talk about similarities and differences 
makes 
> no 
> > sense -- or at least, may not be appropriate.
> >
> It is like that phrase in the Gita speaking about the Absolute, 
> about how you can't burn it, or quench it or really do anything to 
> it at all. And so, yes, it is experienced, but as non-changing, not 
> relative. How we *express* ourselves about it, or explain it, is 
> always going to be different, because the senses, like sound, 
> necessarily operate in the relative area of life.
>

IS there an "experiencer" when experiencer, experience and process of 
experience are merged? MMY and many other people like to say "yes," 
and perhaps that's the easiest way of getting the point across, but 
perhaps "no" is equally valid, and merely cuts short any possibility 
of discussion, no matter how futile.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Judy and TorquiseB

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>
> ?? I must have missed the last one.
> 
> Sal
> 
> 
> On Dec 16, 2005, at 1:34 PM, braaahmaan wrote:
> 
> >  > Boris and Natasha fits better, I think...
> >
> >
> >  But that would be sexist stereotyping. Like saying Tracy and
Hepburn. Or Burns and Allen. Or Bruce Willis and Cybil Shepard.
>

Goes bsck to an old post of Judy's. She made an excellent point.
Debate is gender neutral. Casting debater in gender sterotypes can
create biases -- and is sort of silly.

Casting them as howdie doodie and cowboy bob, which is not gender
specific, is ok though, since neither party is clearly howdie doodie. 

Well you may differon that

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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Judy and TorquiseB

2005-12-16 Thread Sal Sunshine

?? I must have missed the last one.

Sal


On Dec 16, 2005, at 1:34 PM, braaahmaan wrote:

 > Boris and Natasha fits better, I think...


 But that would be sexist stereotyping. Like saying Tracy and Hepburn.
 Or Burns and Allen. Or Bruce Willis and Cybil Shepard.

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The Mystery of Mantra

On Dec 16, 2005, at 2:47 PM, cardemaister wrote:--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hanumanhoffman9 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: It is said, ÒMananaat Traayate iti MantrahaÓÑMantra is that which protects the one who repeats it. That's interesting! The translation doesn't tell us from what mantra protects, namely "manana-at". Well, -at is the indicator of ablative (=from, etc.) singular case form of the word "manana", which can be either an adjective or a noun. In that case it almost certainly is a noun meaning, according to Capeller: manana a. thoughtful, careful; n. *thought, reflection, consideration*. Thus the sentence *might* mean e.g. "mantra protects from thought(s)". That's real close. Ksemaraja in his comment to Shiva-sutra 2:1 "Cittam mantrah", gives the derivation of different levels of meaning for this word. At one level manana means "reflecting over the highest I-consciousness and the other characteristic of trAna, the protection by terminating the transmigratory existence which establishes differences (between subjects/objects)." In other words it protects the mind from dualism and leads us towards unity.

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[FairfieldLife] TMO as a valid employer

2005-12-16 Thread tmforlife108


TMO as a valid employer

It will be interesting to see how things shape up in South Florida with the 
independent TM 
teacher there.  He recently posted here that he is having trouble with 
advertising TM as an 
"unrecertified teacher". The TMO is trying to block that activity.  Goldstein 
with MUM legal 
had written a letter to a magazine there. I just found out Mike Scozzari has 
received the 
standard cease and desist letter from a law firm representing the TMO.  Mike 
said his legal 
counsel is advising him not to respond to threats unless ordered by the courts. 
In addition 
to a legal team, he has a publicist here in San Francisco that wants to do a 
feature on 
independents who teach for less should this go to court.

Back in 1993  here in California one independent TM teacher (a regular to 
fairfieldlife) told 
me he advised  the movement they would only hurt themselves if they took legal 
action 
against him.  The court and publicity could potentially uncover a long list of 
TMO errors 
and embarrassments.  If they threatened trademark infringement in 1993 but 
didn't take 
legal action over all these years,  any judge would question the validity of an 
unprotected 
trademark. The California teacher referred to here teaches TM as an independent 
today 
and has helped many people learn the technique charging much less than the 
national 
average, He is successful because he is a good teacher.  Lets not get lost  
criticizing him 
for not sharing the income with national.  They make that impossible for 
someone who 
wants to make a living at this.  Teachers should be making the majority of the 
course fee 
with a small percentage going to the TMO for a franchise fee.  That wold never 
happen as 
the movement would not have a stronghold on the purse and therefore a 
stronghold on 
the teacher.

With the latest round of TMO stupidity and recertification to teach, and with 
promises for 
salaries not kept, what legitimate U.S. court would accept the TMO as a valid 
employer?  
 I agree in part with an earlier post from spraig@ - The TMO does have the 
right to it's 
trademark protection. L'm not an attorney either but if the owner of the 
trademark fails to 
protect it and misuses it..that could be a very interesting question for 
the courts to look 
at. The TMO has demonstrated itself to be an unreliable employer incapable of 
fulfilling 
it's promises, withdrawing promised salaries with the latest recertification 
project. If 
teachers pay to train to teach and the trademark owner makes that impossible, 
who then 
has the right to use the trademark? The argument could be made in court that 
overwhelming evidence exists to sue the tm org for Fraudulent & Deceptive & 
Exploitative 
employment practices.

I thought the letter to the magazine in south Florida was threatening.  This 
TMO tactic is 
designed to frighten and why go after the magazine. The recertified teachers 
there are 
probably ticked off that someone is competing with them.  Competition is good 
and 
everyone should teach!  I received an e-mail which I think did a good job of 
summing up:

"The national course fee in the US set by the Transcendental Meditation 
Organization is 5 
times what it was in 1993.  Consequently the numbers are way down, people are 
not 
starting. Many experienced/certified teachers throughout the U.S. have had to 
settle the 
problem of runaway prices by privately offering TM instruction at very 
reasonable rates.  
Without compromising the original effective technique, TM can now be learned 
for less.  
It's the same technique. People everywhere, rich or poor, should have the 
opportunity to 
take the course and follow-up lessons."

I wonder how many TM teachers there are who would like to teach if they knew 
they would 
not be threatened.  This latest event could be the rallying point for all of 
them - and don't 
kid yourself, there are many!  Of the 40K trained in the US, and so few 
teaching, there are 
still many who would love to teach and could make a difference.  I know the 
attorneys in 
south Florida have been talking about a fund to help cover the costs if they go 
to trail. If 
all TM teachers could benefit, independence could be for all.  Maybe they are 
already free 
of this and just don't realize it!

Daniel Jeffers

Sent to me from one recertified teacher from California..regarding TMO 
threat to the 
magazine in Florida:

"If anyone should be censored, it is the tm org. For trying to monopolize a 
universally-
beneficial spiritual teaching, and for trying to intimidate & prohibit 
qualified teachers from 
sharing this teaching with the public.  Most publications are natural advocates 
of free 
speech. In our society we celebrate diversity of opinions & teachings & 
lifestyles.  As one  
attorney  stated:  "the tm org. has an illegitimate trademark---they've 
never defended 
it in the past 40 years--and it will certainly fail in court, whenever it 
comes to court" 
 they, th

[FairfieldLife] Re: Headphones

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>
> Can any of you music buffs recommend headphones (not earplugs) in the
> $100-$150 range?

I love my in-ear "Strues" -- I think that's the name, I will look it
up later. They are like earplugs, so they help block out ambient
noise, and have a lotof engineering in their shape to create great
sound in a little space. The low end ones I have a re $100. They make
a series of high end ones up to $600 or so. I have read reviews. This
brand comes ut tops. 

I am waiting for the above with noise cancelation and blue-tooth -- so
no wires. Then for me, theywill be like permanent implants for music,
audio books, phone, and DVDs.

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> wrote:
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> wrote:
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > But my original point is not addressed in your reply.   My 
> point 
> > > > was not about poeple having experiences and reporting them. My 
> > > > concern was about people not having experiences, yet still 
> > > > reporting experiences.
> > > 
> > > That would seem to be your issue, and your problem.
> > > I talked earlier about intuition, and the "feeling"
> > > "behind" the written words. If you can't feel that,
> > > then you are free to react skeptically. But some of
> > > us can.
> > 
> >  To all posts of eperiences?
> > 
> > And i assume that your "feeling" is just that -- an impression -- 
> > akin to an opinion. Which may be right, may be wrong. 
> 
> Exactly.  And the problem with that is?
> 
> Are you afraid of being wrong?
> 
> I don't know about you, but I've learned far more
> from my mistakes than from my certanties.

I have no problem with opinion or being wrong. I am struggling a
little as to why you would ask, since I thought I have made that
pretty clear. Oh well, back to the editing board.

So It looks like we are agreed, rather circuitously. In general, we
may have different opinions as to the validity of some posters their
experiences, and/orthier interpreations of them, and the degree of
advaidaspeak and or dogmatic reflex in their posts, and we may both be
wrong in our opinions, and we both often learn from the corrections of
our mistakes, misperceptions and out-moded concepts and dogma when it
is pointed out to us.

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Announcement of A New Folder: Baseless Claims on FFL

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > My point has been simply, that when someone makes an assertion of
> > fact "the sky is red" they should provide some substance to back 
> > it up if asked. 
> 
> Why?
> 
> Because you want such "substance?" Dream on.
> 
> Learn to trust your own intuition, dude. If you can't
> tell what is true and what is not by reading people's
> words on an Internet forum, you're never going to 
> learn to make that distinction.

Thank you for invoking clarification. Let me rephrase that.

> > My point has been simply, that when someone makes an assertion of
fact "the sky is red" they should provide some substance to back 
it up if asked, if they want their point to be take as fact.
Otherwise, it is taken as unexplained opinion (logic and experience
used in coming to such an opinion) which is fine -- for what it is --
 but does not hold much water.  

> Learn to trust your own intuition, dude. 

If you are stating your opinion that intuition alone is superior to
intuition with some facts and logic, my opinion is counter to yours.
Aparently the last 400 years disagrees with you also. But intuit and
party on dude.

> If you can't
> tell what is true and what is not by reading people's
> words on an Internet forum, ..

And how exactly would you do that? You feel your intuition can discern
fact from fiction without error? jeez then sign that boy up!!!
Restructure the courts, congress, the press, the UN, all academic
research,  and just let Barry tell you if its true or not. What a
DEAL! Can we clone you?

> you are never going to make that distinction.

Another unsupported opinion of your with which I disagree. Isn't
diversity a great thing?

So tell me mr Truthometer, where is Jimy Hoffa's body? Where is Elvis
living (cuz he clearly is alive), and what is Jimi Hendrix's best
song, and what did the Sgt Pepper Ablumn really say backwards, Who are
Bevan's babe's, What is McDonalds secret sauce,  and who put the Ram
in the Ramma Doma Ding Dong? ?

Now remember, stick to FACTS, not opinions.

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[FairfieldLife] Headphones

Title: Headphones





Can any of you music buffs recommend headphones (not earplugs) in the $100-$150 range?







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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your mind is never going to get MMY. Never, ever.

Hey braaahmaan,

Rather than uploading files like the following to the files area, I would
like to suggest that you add links to them to the index I started at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/links/_FairfieldLife_Index_00111
7813309/ (http://tinyurl.com/bq3do) Create new folders if necessary to keep
things categorized nicely. Others are welcome to do likewise whenever you
see a post that you feel should be added to the index (e.g., because it's
noteworthy and memorable).

Thanks,

Rick

Here's what you uploaded, in case people don't know what I'm talking about:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/message/82167

> Peter writes:
> What strikes me as odd in these discussions is the
> degree of hostility. Why do people get so pissed-off
> if someone talks about some sort of Realization
> experience?

Braaahmaan: Seeing this repost of Peter's comment prompted me to go beyond
my
impression that there have been no recent posts of "people get so
pissed-off if someone talks about some sort of Realization
experience?" to actually check the last four days of posts for such.
I can't find any.

Balls in your court Peter. It appears to be an incorrect impression on
your part. But I am certanly open to new insights and changing my view
if you can provide a post or two where "people get so pissed-off if
someone talks about some sort of Realization experience?"

The larger question in my mind, is why you have that impression if
there are no such recent posts?

My angle of interest is the cognitive science contributions that show
that so much of what we "perceive" what we think is "out there" is
actually something happening in the internal cognitive apparatus.
Since you have been trained to recognize such, and to help others do
so [I presume your job invlves some of that - sorry if I presume
incorrectly], I find you a great case study, as in "jeez even if a
professional who is trained in this and deals in it everyday makes
sizable cognitve gaffs, what about the rest of us, we must be doing it
even MORE."

on 12/16/05 1:43 PM, braaahmaan at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "L B Shriver" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>> 
>> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Patrick Gillam"
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>> 
>>> --- jim_flanegin wrote:

 enlightenment does not adhere
 to ANY tradition. It is what it is. Period.
>>> 
>>> I've been given to understand that enlightenment
>>> changes quite a bit from one spiritual tradition to
>>> another. I'm told, for instance, that Buddhists
>>> disagree with Hindus on key points, and when
>>> their adherents attain end states they call awakening
>>> or enlightenment, the attainees describe their
>>> experiences differently from one another but
>>> consistent with their traditions.
>>> 
>>> Native Americans have no such states in their
>>> traditions, suggesting enlightenment is not
>>> something that all traditions recognize.
>>> 
>>> View determines fruit, as Vaj quoted a master
>>> as saying. Or as Dana Sawyer says, precept
>>> determines percept.
>>> 
>>> I'm not sure if I'm disagreeeing with you here, Jim.
>>> I don't know enough about either side of the discussion.
>>> I'm simply expressing some cognitive dissonance with
>>> the statement that enlightenment does not adhere to
>>> any tradition.
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Gee, Patrick, I 'm crushed to see how quickly you've forgotten
> "process and product are
>> one".
>> 
>> L B S
> 
> 
> I think 'process and product" or "process percipitates product" or
> "process produces pupil" or "process pre-determines perception"
> "process predisposes perception"  are all good angles that may account
> for quite different ahcievments and subsequent views by spiritual
> aspirants. The dogmatic, knee-jerk view is "many paths, one mountain",
> while the reality may be "many paths, many moutains" (coined by LBS?)
> 
> Regardless, all such are opinions without some field work, experience
> in various traditions' practices, or at least review of current
> scholarshipint he matter (which I understand is vast).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To subscribe, send a message to:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> Or go to: 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/
> and click 'Join This Group!'
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

--- In 
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "tomandcindytraynoratfairfieldlis" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Peter writes:
> What strikes me as odd in these discussions is the
> degree of hostility. Why do people get so pissed-off
> if someone talks about some sort of Realization
> experience? 
> 
> Tom T opinion:
> It would appear that the self appointed Dogma/thought patrol has to
> have everything posted in the scientific method in triplicate. Any
> personal experience that doesn't follow that self appointed group's
> method is immediately jumped on as insubstantial, self aggrandizing
> and untrue. It appears that one is definitely guilty until one can
> prove ones innocence in triplicate with a fully certified 
scientific
> process that has been read and approved and published in at least
> three peer reviewed journals. Any post that does not follow the 
above
> rules of the self appointed thought/dogma patrol then are fair game
> for slash, burn and dump invective.  From my side they can take a 
long
> walk off a short dock or suck eggs whichever seems most 
appropriate.

Yeah, that's it, exactly. 








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[FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
> > >
> > > But my original point is not addressed in your reply.   My 
point 
> > > was not about poeple having experiences and reporting them. My 
> > > concern was about people not having experiences, yet still 
> > > reporting experiences.
> > 
> > That would seem to be your issue, and your problem.
> > I talked earlier about intuition, and the "feeling"
> > "behind" the written words. If you can't feel that,
> > then you are free to react skeptically. But some of
> > us can.
> 
>  To all posts of eperiences?
> 
> And i assume that your "feeling" is just that -- an impression -- 
> akin to an opinion. Which may be right, may be wrong. 

Exactly.  And the problem with that is?

Are you afraid of being wrong?

I don't know about you, but I've learned far more
from my mistakes than from my certanties.  

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Announcement of A New Folder: Baseless Claims on FFL

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> My point has been simply, that when someone makes an assertion of
> fact "the sky is red" they should provide some substance to back 
> it up if asked. 

Why?

Because you want such "substance?" Dream on.

Learn to trust your own intuition, dude. If you can't
tell what is true and what is not by reading people's
words on an Internet forum, you're never going to 
learn to make that distinction.

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> But ok, so its YOU Barry who is that asshole who I think has rocks
> for brains NOT jim. :)  

See, that just shows you how wrong you can be.
I have rocks for *balls*, not brains. It costs
me more because I have to buy heavy-duty under-
wear, and I've had complaints that they're 
occasionally cold in bed, but they've kept me
happily childless this long, so I'm content
with them.

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[FairfieldLife] Final words

Jaya Guru Datta

Having taken a shotgun approach, I have finished and have learned far more than 
I 
bargained entering this parayana.

What I wish to convey is my appreciation for those kind hearts for the 
forebearance of my 
many posts to this group.

Since that night in Chicago July 7, 2000 when Sri Ganapathi Sachchidananda 
Swamiji 
literally took my hand, this life has progressed beyond anything previously 
imaginable.
Magical to say the least and not without its tests. To be given this name alone 
really puts 
me up against the wall at times; but He is ever present shining the light.
It is a personal relationship felt by everyone of those thousands that come to 
Him.
>From Presidents to the lowest Harijan to the Dalai Llama.
http://www.dattapeetham.com/india/festivals/dalailama_2000/dalailama_2000.html

to Sri Sri Ravi Shankar
http://www.dattapeetham.com/india/latest/latest_news_2004.html

Naturally everyone thinks their guru is the best.

I've sat with that one who started the TMO, I had the loving hugs from Amma (I 
bawled like 
a baby the first time in '89), and am truly grateful for all of it.

But...Datta is the Greatest Guru of the Gurus. Shiva, Vishnu, Brahma.
Of all the Avataras, He is the only referred to as Guru Deva.
The Ashta Siddhis are His children and He gives them to us.
Sat Chid Ananda

I leave you with this...

Sri Swamiji.Chicago - July 25, 2002

First you control and kill ego. Ignore and kill that ego. Teach your Buddhi a 
lesson and 
punish your sense organs. Then they will come under control. In the beginning 
you need a 
Guru. Once you learn driving, you have to drive the car yourself. You have to 
drive your 
Buddhi. This body is a chariot. Lord Krishna is the driver in the beginning. 
See the 
Bhagavad Gita photo. Krishna is the driver and Arjuna the passenger is asking 
many 
questions and troubling the driver. I am your driver. Sadguru will protect your 
body and 
drive your body for some time. There afterwards you have to feel it in the 
heart and drive 
your chariot yourself. SwamijiÕs Dhyana Shloka says ÒMama Hrudaya NivasamÓ 
which 
means Swamiji resides in my heart. Close your eyes and feel Swamiji in your 
heart. Where 
do you have patience to close your eyes? Sit in your Puja room and feel for 
Swamiji. I will 
certainly come. For even silly matters you send email. You have to and can 
control 
yourself. Once you come to SwamijiÕs association and develop strong faith, I 
will protect 
you. No devils can come. Many discuss about black magic. There is no such thing 
once 
you come to me. You think of those things because you are not my devotee. You 
are not 
strong enough. Many still entertain such silly and dirty thinking. You are in 
my association 
and have strong bond with me. Still if bad things happen it is because of your 
bad Karma. 
Not Black magic. Have strong faith. That is all.

Follow the master
Faith in God 
Face the devil
Fight the end
Finish the Game...

May His blessings shower you always.

Jaya Sri Brahmananda Saraswati
Jaya Guru Datta
Sri Guru Datta

If I can be of service
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Hanuman is outta here.

Jai Jai Ram Sita Ram!
Hari Om Tat Sat















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[FairfieldLife] Re: Judy and TorquiseB

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anonymousff <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> > [...]
> > > I find their banter delightfully refreshing. Sort of like abbott and
> > > costello. Or Laurel and Hardy. Martin and Dean. Perhaps Rocky and
> > > Bullwinkle.
> > >
> > 
> > Boris and Natasha fits better, I think...
> 
> 
> But that would be sexist stereotyping.

In that it would cast the participants into male and female roles,
however varied. Which would be a false overlay, since debate of
various issues, has nothing to do with gender. And usch an overlay may
bias the debate and its peanut gallery observers, hecklers and circus
roadies.

> Like saying Tracy and Hepburn.
> Or Burns and Allen. Or Bruce Willis and Cybil Shepard.
>

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Your mind is never going to get MMY. Never, ever.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "L B Shriver" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Patrick Gillam"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > --- jim_flanegin wrote:
> > >
> > > enlightenment does not adhere 
> > > to ANY tradition. It is what it is. Period.
> > 
> > I've been given to understand that enlightenment 
> > changes quite a bit from one spiritual tradition to 
> > another. I'm told, for instance, that Buddhists 
> > disagree with Hindus on key points, and when 
> > their adherents attain end states they call awakening 
> > or enlightenment, the attainees describe their 
> > experiences differently from one another but 
> > consistent with their traditions.
> > 
> > Native Americans have no such states in their 
> > traditions, suggesting enlightenment is not 
> > something that all traditions recognize.
> > 
> > View determines fruit, as Vaj quoted a master 
> > as saying. Or as Dana Sawyer says, precept 
> > determines percept.
> > 
> > I'm not sure if I'm disagreeeing with you here, Jim. 
> > I don't know enough about either side of the discussion. 
> > I'm simply expressing some cognitive dissonance with 
> > the statement that enlightenment does not adhere to 
> > any tradition.
> >
> 
> 
> Gee, Patrick, I 'm crushed to see how quickly you've forgotten
"process and product are 
> one".
> 
> L B S

I think 'process and product" or "process percipitates product" or
"process produces pupil" or "process pre-determines perception"
"process predisposes perception"  are all good angles that may account
for quite different ahcievments and subsequent views by spiritual
aspirants. The dogmatic, knee-jerk view is "many paths, one mountain",
while the reality may be "many paths, many moutains" (coined by LBS?)

Regardless, all such are opinions without some field work, experience
in various traditions' practices, or at least review of current
scholarshipint he matter (which I understand is vast).

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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Mystery of Mantra

2005-12-16 Thread cardemaister

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hanumanhoffman9 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
> 
> It is said, ÒMananaat Traayate iti MantrahaÓÑMantra is that which 
protects the one who 
> repeats it.

That's interesting! The translation doesn't tell us from what 
mantra protects, namely "manana-at". Well, -at is the indicator
of ablative (=from, etc.) singular case form of the word "manana", which
can be either an adjective or a noun. In that case it almost
certainly is a noun meaning, according to Capeller:

manana a. thoughtful, careful; n. *thought, reflection, consideration*.

Thus the sentence *might* mean e.g. "mantra protects from  
thought(s)".

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Judy and TorquiseB

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anonymousff <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> [...]
> > I find their banter delightfully refreshing. Sort of like abbott and
> > costello. Or Laurel and Hardy. Martin and Dean. Perhaps Rocky and
> > Bullwinkle.
> >
> 
> Boris and Natasha fits better, I think...

But that would be sexist stereotyping. Like saying Tracy and Hepburn.
Or Burns and Allen. Or Bruce Willis and Cybil Shepard. 

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Your mind is never going to get MMY. Never, ever.

2005-12-16 Thread L B Shriver

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Patrick Gillam" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> --- jim_flanegin wrote:
> >
> > enlightenment does not adhere 
> > to ANY tradition. It is what it is. Period.
> 
> I've been given to understand that enlightenment 
> changes quite a bit from one spiritual tradition to 
> another. I'm told, for instance, that Buddhists 
> disagree with Hindus on key points, and when 
> their adherents attain end states they call awakening 
> or enlightenment, the attainees describe their 
> experiences differently from one another but 
> consistent with their traditions.
> 
> Native Americans have no such states in their 
> traditions, suggesting enlightenment is not 
> something that all traditions recognize.
> 
> View determines fruit, as Vaj quoted a master 
> as saying. Or as Dana Sawyer says, precept 
> determines percept.
> 
> I'm not sure if I'm disagreeeing with you here, Jim. 
> I don't know enough about either side of the discussion. 
> I'm simply expressing some cognitive dissonance with 
> the statement that enlightenment does not adhere to 
> any tradition.
>


Gee, Patrick, I 'm crushed to see how quickly you've forgotten "process and 
product are 
one".

L B S





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[FairfieldLife] Sri Swamiji on Jesus and the world's religions


http://www.dattapeetham.com/india/bhaktimala/jan2001/jew_christian_jan2001.html

Jewish Congregation at Datta Peetham

A get-together of Jews was arranged on the 24th December. It is noteworthy that 
Sri 
Swamiji has a lot of Jewish devotees. In the evening of Sunday, 24th December, 
the Jews 
from Mysore assembled in the Universal Prayer Hall and offered prayers. Sri 
Swamiji also 
joined them and prayed in their style. Later in His discourse, Sri Swamiji 
explained about 
the greatness of Jewish religion to all the devotees.

Christmas Celebrations at Datta Peetham

The Universal Prayer Hall was decorated like a typical Christmas evening on 
25th. Two 
Christmas trees were placed in the prayer hall and was beautifully decorated 
with 
traditional decorations. The holy cross was placed on an altar between the two 
decorated 
trees. Hundreds of Christians gathered in the prayer hall. The environment 
exuded 
joyousness.

Sri Swamiji was clad in a traditional Christian dress worn by the head of the 
church. 
Important Christian leaders from various churches in Mysore were invited to 
participate as 
chief guests. Rev. Maria Joseph, the Vicar General of Sacred Heart Church, 
Sister John of 
Good Shepard Convent, Rev. Franklin Prabhu and many other dignitaries took part 
in this 
function. 

After the Universal Prayer, Prof. Krishan Kumar welcomed the guests and gave a 
brief 
introduction of Datta Peetham. After this, Sri Swamiji and the guests lighted 
the candles 
placed in front of the image of Jesus Christ. Kalikamba, a devotee from Holland 
accompanied by several angels, sang Christmas Carols. 

Speaking on the occasion, Rev. Fr. P.G. Hans said, "we feel as though Christ is 
born here 
also. Generally, we feel that Christ is our god and belongs to us. But today, 
we are 
convinced that He belongs to all. I am extremely pleased that Sri Swamiji has 
shown so 
much love to us today. We are speechless. We are all the children of the same 
Almighty 
and therefore we should not treat any religion as inferior. By thinking that 
our religion is 
superior to other religions, we are in fact moving away from God."

He said that it was the elders who implant feeling of discrimination in 
children and quoted 
a story. "A Hindu child was standing near a ditch and crying. It had dropped a 
coin into the 
ditch. It was crying ÔO Allah! Help me.Õ A passerby became curious. He said, 
Ôchild, you 
look like a Hindu girl, why are you praying to Allah?Õ To this, the child said, 
Ôhow can I call 
our god and ask him to get down the ditch? It would be a sin to do that. 
Therefore, I am 
calling other god for helpÕ. See! This is how we train children. We should 
never do that. In 
fact, we should teach our children to treat all religions with respect."

Rev. Franklin in his speech said, "we have been struggling to understand the 
Almighty. We 
have seldom succeeded. Therefore, the Almighty Himself took human form and came 
as 
Jesus and simplified the teachings so that the common man could understand and 
practice."

"It would be wrong to say Ôonly the mangoes of my tree are sweet.Õ All mangoes 
are sweet. 
Similarly all religions are good."

Later Sister John spoke and said that she knew Swamiji and the Ashram since 
many years 
and recalled that she was always given a warm welcome here. She said that she 
had taken 
a close look at the activities of the Ashram and said that Sri Swamiji did not 
discriminate 
between religions. "He is a emissary of peace" she said. She wished that Ashram 
should 
forge ahead in the same path.

After this, Rev. Fr. Maria Joseph spoke. He said that he wanted to see Sri 
Swamiji since a 
long time and that he was happy that the occasion had come now. "I have been 
reading 
about the activities of Ashram in newspapers and I must say that I am highly 
impressed at 
the broadmindedness of Sri Swamiji. This happiness should spread to everybody 
in this 
world." He recalled the study he had made in the University of Mysore on the 
ÔComparitive 
study of religionsÕ and remembered a story that he came across during this 
study. "There 
was a person who wanted to know the language of God. He went to many saints and 
could 
not get a satisfactory answer. Not satisfied, he went from one place to 
another, from one 
country to another. Once, while he was wandering near Bethlehem, he was tired 
and was 
resting near a cave. An old woman came there and woke him up and said, Ôchild, 
love is 
the language of the AlmightyÕ. This person was surprised because he had never 
asked the 
old woman about this. He was overjoyed with the answer for which he was looking 
since 
many years. The language of Love is the greatest and the only language. The 
Almighty 
sent His son to this planet to teach this language to the masses. We should 
always try to 
learn and teach others this language Ð the language of Love."
 On this joyous occasion, a cheque for Rs.50,000 was handed over to the Mysore 
Music 
Academy as donatio

[FairfieldLife] The Radium Girls - A Tragedy

2005-12-16 Thread Jason Spock

DevelopmentThe Radium Girls Friday November 25 2005 14:05 IST Nicki Kindersley Underneath the sleepy suburbs of Orange, New Jersey, USA, lies a unique site in the history of labour rights and the understanding of radioactive materials. For it was in a factory here in the 1920s that almost hundred young women were slowly poisoned to death with radium. The ensuing case of the Radium Girls would change perceptions of radioactive materials, forever. Labour laws in many countries also bear the imprint of this case. From 1917 to 1926, the US Radium Corporation produced radium-based products, including luminous paints under the brand name, Undark. Their plant in Orange produced radio-luminescent watch faces, employing around 100
workers mainly women to paint the radium-lit watch faces and instruments. Grace Fryer started working in the spring of 1917 with 70 other women in a large, dusty room filled with long tables. Racks of dials waiting to be painted sat next to each womans chair. The workers mixed glue, water and radium powder together and applied the glowing paint onto the racks of dials with camel hair brushes. The brushes would lose their shape after a few strokes, so the women pointed them with their lips to keep them sharp. The women painted their nails, teeth and faces with the radium paint for entertainment when the lights went out. The factory was so full of radium dust that the womens skin and hair glowed by the time they left work. Not to worry, their bosses said; If you swallow any radium, itll make your cheeks rosy. A lack of concern over radiation was endemic at the time. Discovered in 1898 by French scientists, Pierre and Marie
Curie, the natural radioactive element was the new wonder substance, seen by most people as a miracle drug that could cure anything from arthritis to cancer. The element and its supposed uses were championed by academics, physicians and the US government itself. Radithor, a medical drink sold over the counter until 1931, was said to bathe the user in liquid sunshine if drunk regularly, it contained enough radium to kill. Residues from US Radiums refineries were used to make sand for childrens sand boxes. The companys owner said the sand was more beneficial than the mud of the worlds best curative baths. In 1922, however, the dial painter Irene Rudolf began to complain of toothache. She was suffering from necrosis of the jaw, which proved fatal. Increasingly, the other women suffered from anaemia and bone fractures; almost all had unusual blood conditions. Some had tumours bulging from their jaws and leg bones, where the radium had settled.
US Radium denied that the women were suffering from radium exposure. A campaign of disinformation was started by the company; following pressure by the corporation, doctors attributed workers deaths to other causes. Syphilis was often blamed in an attempt to tarnish the reputations of the women. Meanwhile, the owners and the scientists of US Radium - familiar with the elements effects - carefully avoided any exposure to themselves, using lead screens, masks and tongs around the material. Like other factory workers at that time, the Radium Girls were expendable. Grace Fryer decided to sue US radium in 1925. Grace had quit the factory in 1920 for a better job as a bank teller. But in 1922, her teeth started falling out and her jaw developed a painful abscess. The hazel eyes that had charmed her friends now clouded with pain. She consulted a series of doctors, but none had seen a problem like it.
X-ray photos of her mouth and back showed the development of serious bone decay. Finally, in July 1925, one doctor suggested that the problems might have been caused by her former occupation. It took Grace two years to find a lawyer willing to take on US Radium. Four more workers, Edna Hussman, Katherine Schaub, Quinta McDonald and Albina Larice joined Grace, and were dubbed the Radium Girls by the media. The US Consumers League backed the womens cause after it was brought in to investigate the suspicious deaths of four factory workers between1922 and 1924. The case swiftly grew into a media phenomenon, as results of tests done on the women became public and the real effects of radiation exposure became known. Meanwhile, Harvard University physiology professor Cecil Drinker had begun his own investigations of US radium. Drinker found a heavily contaminated work force, unusual blood conditions in
virtually everyone, and advanced radium necrosis in several workers. During the investigation, Drinker noticed that US Radiums chemist, Edward Lehman, had serious lesions on his hands. When Drinker spoke to him about the danger in the careless and unprotected the way he handled the radium, he scoffed at the possibility of future damage. Drinker said, This attitude was characteristic of those in authorit

[FairfieldLife] The Mystery of Mantra

Jaya Guru Datta

Another repost from years ago.

Please note: The Jana Samrakshana mantra described below is chanted by Sri 
Swamiji in 
the audio folder of this group. It's definition is also posted in these 
archives. Very sweet.


The Mystery of Mantra
Sri Ganapathi Sachchidananda Swamiji

A Mantra is no ordinary combination of letters and syllables, but a living 
force. It is God in 
the form of sound. Mantra has been called the sound-body of God. The Mantra can 
completely transform our inner being. Our inner state is created by the 
thoughts and 
feelings that continually arise in us. Outwardly, we may appear to have fixed 
identitiesÑ
one person may appear to be a lawyer, another an engineer, another a doctor, 
another a 
professor, and so on. But inside, we are a continually changing mass of 
consciousness. 
Inside, there are myriad of thoughts, desires and concerns, each pulling us in 
a different 
direction. When we project the beam of Mantra into this fluctuating and 
disorderly mass, it 
stabilizes it and focuses it in one directionÑthe direction of the divinity 
inside us.  The 
Sages have said that only the Mantra can help us transcend our confusion, our 
fantasies, 
and the constant changes of our mind. Moreover, as we repeat the Mantra, it 
begins to 
permeate all the constituents of the body. Whatever thought or feeling arises 
in the mind 
has an immediate effect on the body; even doctors now recognize that our 
thoughts can 
make us sick or help to cure us. Our thoughts pass from the mind to the prana, 
from the 
prana into the bloodstream, and through the bloodstream to the entire body. The 
Mantra 
flows through our system in the same way, removing all the toxins from the 
blood, 
purifying the prana, freeing the mind from negative emotions, and making joy 
arise in the 
heart.

As the influence of the sound of GodÕs name penetrates the mind, the mind 
itself becomes 
the name; in other words, the mind becomes divine.  Repetition of the name of 
God causes 
a kind of earthquake in our inner consciousness.  Whatever thoughts arise in 
our daily life 
are recorded within us and form impressions, which are difficult to remove.  
But when we 
repeat the name, all these thoughts and impressions are erased, and the name of 
God is 
recorded.  At every moment, what we think is what we become.  If the face of 
anger arises 
in the mind and we identify ourselves with it, we become filled with anger.  In 
the same 
way, if we continually repeat the Mantra with great love and respect, and with 
one-pointed 
focus, we become absorbed in God.  By its very nature the Mantra has the 
ability to 
transform our awareness of ourselves as individuals into an awareness of 
ourselves as 
divine beings.
There are two types of MantraÑJada Mantra and Chaitanya Mantra.  Jada Mantra is 
one 
taken from a book or from a teacher or guru who has not realized its power.  
Such a 
Mantra has no strength; it is merely a dry and ineffective collection of 
letters. But a 
Chaitanya Mantra is obtained from a Sadguru, a Self-Realized being, who has 
experienced 
the power of the Mantra.  Behind it is the full force of the GuruÕs 
realization, and it starts 
its work within a seeker immediately.  As the disciple repeats the mantra, his 
dormant 
shakti is awakened, and a new life is created within.

It is said that a person has two fathersÑthe father of the body, who gives him 
life through 
his semen, and the spiritual father, the Sadguru, who gives him life through 
the Mantra.  
Just as the physical body born of semen is nourished by food, so the spiritual 
body born of 
Mantra is nourished by the repetition of the Mantra.  Therefore, let your life 
become filled 
with Mantra.  Repeat it continually, no matter what you are doing.  If you 
repeat it when 
you are going to sleep, you will have a very deep sleep.  If you repeat it when 
you wake up, 
you will spend your day happily.  Mingle the Mantra with all your activities.  
Repeat the 
mantra when you wash your face.  Repeat it when you eat your breakfast.  Repeat 
it while 
you travel to your office, and repeat it on your way home.  Repeat the Mantra 
while you 
bathe, and repeat it when you drink your tea or coffee.  Anyone who is addicted 
to 
smoking will check his pocket before he leaves home to make sure he has his 
cigarettes.  
In the same way, you should become so hopelessly addicted to the Mantra that 
you are 
always certain that you are carrying it in your heart.

It is said, ÒMananaat Traayate iti MantrahaÓÑMantra is that which protects the 
one who 
repeats it.  The power of the Mantra is beyond our imagination.  We can 
understand the 
meaning of the Mantra, but we cannot know its potency.  We can contemplate the 
Mantra, 
but we cannot measure its strength.  Mantra is the living force of God.  
Therefore, repeat it 
in your worldly life, and your heart will be filled with joy.  Your shakti will 
unfold very 
quickly, so that soon you will begin to exp

[FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com,
"tomandcindytraynoratfairfieldlis"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Peter writes:
> What strikes me as odd in these discussions is the
> degree of hostility. Why do people get so pissed-off
> if someone talks about some sort of Realization
> experience? 
> 
> Tom T opinion:
> It would appear that the self appointed Dogma/thought patrol has to

Seeing this repost of Peter's comment prompted me to go beyond my
impression that there have been no recent posts of "people get so
pissed-off if someone talks about some sort of Realization
experience?" to actually check the last four days of posts for such. 
I can't find any. 

Balls in your court Peter. It appears to be an incorrect impression on
your part. But I am certanly open to new insights and changing my view
if you can provide a post or two where "people get so pissed-off if
someone talks about some sort of Realization experience?" 

The larger question in my mind, is why you have that impression if
there are no such recent posts? 

My angle of interest is the cognitive science contributions that show
that so much of what we "perceive" what we think is "out there" is
actually something happening in the internal cognitive apparatus.
Since you have been trained to recognize such, and to help others do
so [I presume your job invlves some of that - sorry if I presume
incorrectly], I find you a great case study, as in "jeez even if a
professional who is trained in this and deals in it everyday makes
sizable cognitve gaffs, what about the rest of us, we must be doing it
even MORE."

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Nada, Bhakti, Adi Shankara

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jim_flanegin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Interesting stuff. It occurs to me that you are so comfortable with 
> this means of expression that you were probably Indian very recently.

Besides the Sanskrit, Telegu language bhajans hold a particular sweetness.
Many Telegu devotees have said the same.

Sri Swamiji provides a very easy method to learn these bhajans and prayers.



> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hanumanhoffman9 
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Greatness of Nada
> > 
> > Bhakti is the simplest of all the ways for the realisation of the 
> Truth. Saints and sages have 
> > preached the path of Bhakti. Even Adi Shankara advocated this path 
> to the seekers because 
> > He found out that the path of Bhakti is easier than the path of 
> Knowledge.
> > 
> > Bhakti Marga makes use of Nada or Sound. The entire universe is 
> immersed in Nada. There 
> > is Nada in everything around us. The birds, the wind, the rains, 
> and even the buses plying 
> > the roads create Nada. There can be no movement without Nada. 
> There is nothing which is 
> > free form the influence of Nada. The Lord Brahman created the 
> Universe out of Nada. The 
> > supreme destroyer Maheshwara performs the Tandava with Nada. The 
> saints have been 
> > bringing light to the multitudes from time immemorial by singing 
> songs in praise of God. 
> > Tumburu and Narada in ancient times, Meerabai, Surdas, Thyagaraja, 
> Purandaradasa, 
> > Chaitanya, Paramahamsa, Nanak and Kabir in recent times have all 
> carried the Light Divine 
> > on the vehicle of Nada. Their messages have withstood the test of 
> time and the songs 
> > composed by them have been sung from generation to generation. 
> Bhakti and Nada 
> > cannot be separated from each other.
> > 
> > The seven Swaras, the seventy-two Melakartas and the numerous 
> Shrutis are the 
> > component manifestations of Nada. From them are born the Ragas and 
> Raginis. The Ragsa 
> > and Taginis are not mere combinations of notes. Each is a Devata 
> or Devi, endowed with 
> > certain specific gunas and powers.
> > 
> > It is said that Tansen could light the lamps by singing a 
> particular Raga and that it resulted 
> > in the temperature of his body rising as if a fire were burning in 
> him it is also known that 
> > his body fires were quenched by a cloud-burst induced by another 
> Raga. These are not 
> > just cock-and-bull stories. The Ragas have not lost their power.
> > 
> > Once a well known vocalist was to give a public performance. To 
> his utter dismay he found 
> > that his throat had gone hoarse. He came to Swamiji and told Him 
> of his predicament. 
> > Swamiji told him not to worry but to begin his performance with a 
> particular Raga which 
> > has the quality of clearing a sore throat. He followed SwamijiÍs 
> advice and could give his 
> > performance with ease. Singing a particular Raga with full 
> devotion provides all the 
> > accompaniments of various instruments.
> > 
> > Our Ragas and Raginis are endowed with immense power. Sadhana on 
> the right lines 
> > brings about beneficial results, whereas an improper understanding 
> and non-appreciation 
> > of the qualities of the Ragas can lead to disastrous consequences.
> > 
> > There is an intimate relationship between music and God. This 
> relationship is established 
> > only when Nada is approached with reverence and devotion. Pursuit 
> of music in this way is 
> > Nadopasana which is distinct from music for mere enjoyment and 
> recreation. Music 
> > charged with devotion brings one closer to God and that itself is 
> Nadopasana.
> > 
> > Jaya Guru Datta
> >
>






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Fidel Castro and TM / Bob Dylan

2005-12-16 Thread Eustace

Dear faste37, jim, and all others who appreciated my analysis.

In my opinion there can be little doubt that Dylan had the Vietnam war
in mind, whatever he may have said afterwards, he wouldn't have
admitted it if someone had confronted him with this interpretation
anyway. It fits perfectly only with the antiwar theme. Can you think
of any woman who would have asked her lover to close his heart for
her? And do you have any doubt what the prevailing opinion about the
song would have been in the sixties had even one person thought of
this interpretation? Somehow that had to be far beyond the frame of
reference of those living in the United States at the time, and maybe
it's no coincidence that it had to wait to be deciphered by someone
who was not born here.

And a couple of things of secondary I didn't include in the analysis
that I think you may find interesting:

"Someone who will die for you *and more*". What more would a lover
ask? The ultimate ideal of romantic love is the self-sacrifice for
one's lover. But there is something more than a soldier is asked to do
in war: to kill, sometimes even innocent women and children
("collateral damage"). Being asked to risk your life for your country
is one thing; being asked to kill women and children, something done
regularly in a war, is another. Many who wouldn't object to the first
would certainly object to the second.

Another point: "Go melt back in the night". This seems to be a direct  
reference to another song written for the American flag: "Oh, say can
you see, by the dawn's early light...". But then it was the dawn, by
1964 it was dark...

Also: The album came out on May 2, 1964 (I may be a day off). "By
coincidence", on that same day the largest until then antiwar
demonstration took place at the UN 
(http://lists.village.virginia.edu/sixties/HTML_docs/Resources/Primary/Manifestos/PL_M2d_manifesto.html)
So the antiwar sentiment "was in the air" during the previous few
months, and Dylan, who was so much in tune with his times, was
certainly well aware of it; I would even bet that he knew some of the
participants of the demonstration, and no doubt some they were among
his audience.

So, I am happy I helped you appreciate the song in a fresh light, If
only I could decipher more Dylan songs... But that is not something
you pursue, it just comes to you when you least expect it.

Peace,

Eustace

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "feste37" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Excellent analysis. That this was an anti-war song had never 
> occurred to me before, but seems obvious now. 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eustace" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
> 
> 
> > 
> > (From http://www.geocities.com/itaintme_babe/itaintme.html)
> > 
> > _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ 
> > 
> > LITERARY CRITICISM
> > 
> > IT AIN'T ME, BABE
> > 
> > by Bob Dylan
> > 
> > Go 'way from my window,  
> >  Leave at your own chosen speed. 
> > I'm not the one you want, babe,  
> >  I'm not the one you need.   
> > You say you're lookin' for someone   
> >  Who's never weak but always strong, 
> > To protect you an' defend you
> >  Whether you are right or wrong, 
> >   Someone to open each and every door,   
> > 
> > But it ain't me, babe,   
> >  No, no, no, it ain't me, babe,  
> >   It ain't me you're lookin' for, babe.  
> > 
> > Go lightly from the ledge, babe, 
> >  Go lightly on the ground.   
> > I'm not the one you want, babe,  
> >  I will only let you down.   
> > You say you're lookin' for someone   
> >  Who will promise never to part, 
> > Someone to close his eyes for you,   
> >  Someone to close his heart, 
> >   Someone who will die for you an' more, 
> > 
> > But it ain't me, babe,   
> >  No, no, no, it ain't me, babe,  
> >   It ain't me you're lookin' for, babe.  
> > 
> > Go melt back in the night,   
> >  Everything inside is made of stone. 
> > There's nothing in here moving   
> >  An' anyway I'm not alone.   
> > You say you're looking for someone   
> >  Who'll pick you up each time you fall,  
> > To gather flowers constantly 
> >  An' to come each time you call, 
> >   A lover for your life an' nothing more,
> > 
> > But it ain't me, babe,   
> >  No, no, no, it ain't me, babe,  
> >   It ain't me you're lookin' for, babe.  
> > 

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Inciting racial hatred or not (was, question about Maharishi's brothers,....)

2005-12-16 Thread Jason Spock

India had more wealth than the whole of Europe, middle-east and China put together.!! All foreign invaders were attracted only by the wealth which was present in India. Two centuries of British exploitation, completely ravaged India. By the time the British left in 1947, India had become extremely weak and improvished. It's a paradox. Sri. Aurobindo said, "Nature tried everything she could to unite the
whole of India, but couldn't. So Nature finally resorted to foreign invasions to unite the whole of India." What he probably meant is that, Nature intended a united India, which would be better to spread the message of enlightenment. A divided and fragmented India is extremely dangerous and undesirable. An Australian missionary Graham Staines was burnt alive along with his two sons in January 1999. It created a huge controversy in India. In fact his wife Gladys Staines still works in India. It doesn't make sense for Maharishi to enter into this messy controversy. OriginalMessage- From: "mcjrich" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 12:08:20 - Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Inciting racial hatred or not (was, question about Maharishi's brothers,) Your concern is touching and I applaud you for it. I find your postings really interesting. Only, perhaps you are not aware that your comments could be interpreted as insulting towards Indians and are yourself inciting racial hatred. Are you implying Indians are unfamiliar with their own history? Or are not smart enough to have a mind of their
own? That we are easily influenced by who you say is a raving lunatic? In your obvious frustrations towards an Indian guru you should be careful not to offend a whole nation. I recommend you read some good and reliable history books to understand what effects the Râj had and how British measures adopted in the past continue to affect India today. Nâmâsté __Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

2005-12-16 Thread Sal Sunshine

Actually I think it's Bevan.

Sal


On Dec 16, 2005, at 10:29 AM, Peter wrote:

 I always think that above is in operation regardless
 of who says what. You have made a critique of me in
 the past as coming across as an absolutest and I was
 surprised I came across this way, but when I read some
 of my posts, I understood what you were talking about
 (by the way, I assume this is Akasha, yes?).

[FairfieldLife] Re: Nada, Bhakti, Adi Shankara

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hanumanhoffman9 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Interesting stuff. It occurs to me that you are so comfortable with 
this means of expression that you were probably Indian very recently.

> Greatness of Nada
> 
> Bhakti is the simplest of all the ways for the realisation of the 
Truth. Saints and sages have 
> preached the path of Bhakti. Even Adi Shankara advocated this path 
to the seekers because 
> He found out that the path of Bhakti is easier than the path of 
Knowledge.
> 
> Bhakti Marga makes use of Nada or Sound. The entire universe is 
immersed in Nada. There 
> is Nada in everything around us. The birds, the wind, the rains, 
and even the buses plying 
> the roads create Nada. There can be no movement without Nada. 
There is nothing which is 
> free form the influence of Nada. The Lord Brahman created the 
Universe out of Nada. The 
> supreme destroyer Maheshwara performs the Tandava with Nada. The 
saints have been 
> bringing light to the multitudes from time immemorial by singing 
songs in praise of God. 
> Tumburu and Narada in ancient times, Meerabai, Surdas, Thyagaraja, 
Purandaradasa, 
> Chaitanya, Paramahamsa, Nanak and Kabir in recent times have all 
carried the Light Divine 
> on the vehicle of Nada. Their messages have withstood the test of 
time and the songs 
> composed by them have been sung from generation to generation. 
Bhakti and Nada 
> cannot be separated from each other.
> 
> The seven Swaras, the seventy-two Melakartas and the numerous 
Shrutis are the 
> component manifestations of Nada. From them are born the Ragas and 
Raginis. The Ragsa 
> and Taginis are not mere combinations of notes. Each is a Devata 
or Devi, endowed with 
> certain specific gunas and powers.
> 
> It is said that Tansen could light the lamps by singing a 
particular Raga and that it resulted 
> in the temperature of his body rising as if a fire were burning in 
him it is also known that 
> his body fires were quenched by a cloud-burst induced by another 
Raga. These are not 
> just cock-and-bull stories. The Ragas have not lost their power.
> 
> Once a well known vocalist was to give a public performance. To 
his utter dismay he found 
> that his throat had gone hoarse. He came to Swamiji and told Him 
of his predicament. 
> Swamiji told him not to worry but to begin his performance with a 
particular Raga which 
> has the quality of clearing a sore throat. He followed SwamijiÍs 
advice and could give his 
> performance with ease. Singing a particular Raga with full 
devotion provides all the 
> accompaniments of various instruments.
> 
> Our Ragas and Raginis are endowed with immense power. Sadhana on 
the right lines 
> brings about beneficial results, whereas an improper understanding 
and non-appreciation 
> of the qualities of the Ragas can lead to disastrous consequences.
> 
> There is an intimate relationship between music and God. This 
relationship is established 
> only when Nada is approached with reverence and devotion. Pursuit 
of music in this way is 
> Nadopasana which is distinct from music for mere enjoyment and 
recreation. Music 
> charged with devotion brings one closer to God and that itself is 
Nadopasana.
> 
> Jaya Guru Datta
>






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[FairfieldLife] Darshan..Munis and Rishis

Munis & Rishis (Sages & Seers) 
http://www.sadguruseva.org/sss/sssMain.html 

In the Puranaas (Indian mythological scriptures),  we come across stories of 
Rishis and 
Munis. But we do not know who is a Rishi  and who is a Muni. There is a 
difference 
between the two.

All those who meditate are Munis.  But only  those, who are capable of having 
darshana 
(revelation) are Rishis.  What is darshana? Is it the vision of some deity? No. 
The act of  
perceiving (experiencing) in the heart, the vibration of the  mantras  (seed 
letters) 
pervading the whole universe, since time immemorial, is  called darshana. Those 
who 
achieve this are Mantradrastaas.  They alone are called Rishis.

Some have tried to conduct and some are still  conducting research about the 
period of 
Vedas. They are like those who  try to find out when the first wave arose on 
the ocean.  
Veda  mantras  revealed in the hearts of the deserved will remain on earth as 
long as  the 
disciples fit for their grace are there. Later they merge in the sky  and give 
darshan to the 
deserving Maharshi. This is why none of the Vedic Rishis claimed that they were 
the author 
of the Vedas. 
- Sri Swamiji
Jai Guru  Datta!







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[FairfieldLife] Don't Hurry

Do not be in Hurry 

http://www.sadguruseva.org/sss/sssMain.html

There is no shortcut or instant way to invoke  GuruÕs blessings. Some devotees 
are very 
impatient and expect quick  results either at material level or at the 
spiritual evolution 
level.  Though our Guru has everything, being the unlimited reservoir of all  
boons, He 
knows best when to give and what to give.

Guru is like a car garage owner-foreman  (mechanic). Suppose your car is out of 
order, 
what do you do? You would  go to a car-garage and ask the foreman to remove the 
particular  complaints your car is causing. The foreman will register your car 
and  give a 
date by which you could come to collect the car after repairs. If  you say ÒNo 
you must 
repair my car immediately;Ó you will only be  inviting the displeasure of the 
foreman, who 
would then say, ÒPlease  take your car elsewhereÉ. I have no timeÉ. I have so 
many other 
cars  to repairÉ. YourÕs will be repaired as the turn comesÓ.

Sadguru, likewise, has all the command, all the  skills to repair the defects 
of your 
personality. He does not need any  time frame to help you. But he would like 
you to 
undergo some  discipline, some order. If you are impatient and demanding, loss 
is only  
yourÕs. Better wait, after having come into the fold of Sadguru and  have faith 
that your 
turn will also come. 
- Sri Swamiji
Jai Guru  Datta!






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[FairfieldLife] Nada, Bhakti, Adi Shankara

Greatness of Nada

Bhakti is the simplest of all the ways for the realisation of the Truth. Saints 
and sages have 
preached the path of Bhakti. Even Adi Shankara advocated this path to the 
seekers because 
He found out that the path of Bhakti is easier than the path of Knowledge.

Bhakti Marga makes use of Nada or Sound. The entire universe is immersed in 
Nada. There 
is Nada in everything around us. The birds, the wind, the rains, and even the 
buses plying 
the roads create Nada. There can be no movement without Nada. There is nothing 
which is 
free form the influence of Nada. The Lord Brahman created the Universe out of 
Nada. The 
supreme destroyer Maheshwara performs the Tandava with Nada. The saints have 
been 
bringing light to the multitudes from time immemorial by singing songs in 
praise of God. 
Tumburu and Narada in ancient times, Meerabai, Surdas, Thyagaraja, 
Purandaradasa, 
Chaitanya, Paramahamsa, Nanak and Kabir in recent times have all carried the 
Light Divine 
on the vehicle of Nada. Their messages have withstood the test of time and the 
songs 
composed by them have been sung from generation to generation. Bhakti and Nada 
cannot be separated from each other.

The seven Swaras, the seventy-two Melakartas and the numerous Shrutis are the 
component manifestations of Nada. From them are born the Ragas and Raginis. The 
Ragsa 
and Taginis are not mere combinations of notes. Each is a Devata or Devi, 
endowed with 
certain specific gunas and powers.

It is said that Tansen could light the lamps by singing a particular Raga and 
that it resulted 
in the temperature of his body rising as if a fire were burning in him it is 
also known that 
his body fires were quenched by a cloud-burst induced by another Raga. These 
are not 
just cock-and-bull stories. The Ragas have not lost their power.

Once a well known vocalist was to give a public performance. To his utter 
dismay he found 
that his throat had gone hoarse. He came to Swamiji and told Him of his 
predicament. 
Swamiji told him not to worry but to begin his performance with a particular 
Raga which 
has the quality of clearing a sore throat. He followed SwamijiÍs advice and 
could give his 
performance with ease. Singing a particular Raga with full devotion provides 
all the 
accompaniments of various instruments.

Our Ragas and Raginis are endowed with immense power. Sadhana on the right 
lines 
brings about beneficial results, whereas an improper understanding and 
non-appreciation 
of the qualities of the Ragas can lead to disastrous consequences.

There is an intimate relationship between music and God. This relationship is 
established 
only when Nada is approached with reverence and devotion. Pursuit of music in 
this way is 
Nadopasana which is distinct from music for mere enjoyment and recreation. 
Music 
charged with devotion brings one closer to God and that itself is Nadopasana.

Jaya Guru Datta







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "tomandcindytraynoratfairfieldlis" 
>
> Peter writes:
> What strikes me as odd in these discussions is the
> degree of hostility. Why do people get so pissed-off
> if someone talks about some sort of Realization
> experience? 
> 
> Tom T opinion:
> It would appear that the self appointed Dogma/thought patrol 

Does one exist? Or is that simply an impression you have?

> has to
> have everything posted in the scientific method in triplicate.

Ok, now I guess you are just jossing us. haha

> Any
> personal experience that doesn't follow that self appointed group's
> method is immediately jumped on as insubstantial, self aggrandizing
> and untrue. 

That appears to be your impression. My impression is quite the
opposite. Recently I have seen no one jump anyones discussion of a
poster's  personal experience. How odd we can have such different
impression! Well I guess we weill just have to leave it to that --
some difference in perception. 

If on the other hand you are claiming more than an impression, but an
actual fact, then please cite some specific examples for those of us
that appear to be less perceptive than you and did not catch these
recent "slams" on experience posters. Thanks.

> It appears that one is definitely guilty until one can
> prove ones innocence in triplicate with a fully certified scientific
> process that has been read and approved and published in at least
> three peer reviewed journals. 

"Appears" is a great word. The above appears to you. It does not
appear to me. To convince me or I assume most observers, you would
need too actualy cite some examples, not just impressions. One of the
stellar contributions of the cognitive sciences is that much
"impression" is indeed not fact but some bias of quirk in the
observers head. We all have them. The trick is to be aware such can
occure and ask BK style, "Is this true" "Do I really know its true" ... 

> Any post that does not follow the above
> rules of the self appointed thought/dogma patrol then are fair game
> for slash, burn and dump invective.  

Its funny you see destruction, and invective everywhere. I see none.
Perhaps I am wearing pollyannaish rose glasses. I will check my
perceptions. Or perhaps you woke up on the wrong side of the bed and
are a bit cranky this morning. Who knows. Lets both investigate from
our own sides.

> From my side they can take a long
> walk off a short dock or suck eggs whichever seems most appropriate.

Ah, such a refreshing view of compassion and love for ones owe Self
found everywhere in the infinite expanse of Brahaman -- the pure
expression of Bliss. Its so beautiful.

And just a point of clarification, you have stated that everything
from that mind body known socially as Tom is Brahman staring through
"Tom's eyes". Taking your phrase, or I mean Brahman's phrase, "From my
side ..." -- does Brahman have a side?

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[FairfieldLife] Patanjali...Vibhuti Yoga and Siddhis

I had posted this quite sometime ago and based on some recent threads, thought 
to 
repost.

Jaya Guru Datta

Vibhuti Yoga
By Sri Ganapathi Sachchidananda Swamiji

The world exists, doesnÕt it?  To be more precise, it appears as though 
it exists.  
What is this world?  It is the existence or appearance of existence of objects 
with form and 
without form.  Among these objects, some appear very predominant and special.  
These 
are ÒVibhutis.Ó  Visheshena bhavati Vibhuti.

But to whom do these special objects appear?  To answer this question, 
another 
question needs to be answered.  Does this world appear similar to everyone?  A 
fruit that 
is very tasty to someone may be absolutely unpalatable to another.  A child who 
appears 
very beautiful to the mother may look ugly to others.  Can we say then that 
this world 
appears similar to two persons?  No.  We cannot say that.  Therefore, those 
objects that 
appear very special are also innumerable.  They themselves are different 
ÒVibhutisÓ 
(specialties).  If a person has the knowledge of timeÑpast, present and 
futureÑit may 
appear very great to him.  To him it is ÒVibhuti.Ó  But how to achieve this 
knowledge?  If he 
is able to know how and why that knowledge is special to him, then he will come 
to 
understand the means to achieve it.

ÒIf any object becomes dear to a person, then he will fall into the 
vicious wheel of 
sanga-kama-krodha-sammoha-smriti-bhramsha-buddhi nasha and vinasha,Ó declares 
Gitacharya.  Among these, sanga is important.  Sanga is a mental activity, not 
physical.  
Sanga is fickle nature.  It flies from one object to another.

Due to the intensity of moha, sometimes the vagaries of mind reduce on 
their own 
concentration.  A child crying for its mother will become quiet as soon as it 
sees her.  But 
after a while, it starts looking in all directions.  On the other hand, it is 
also possible to 
control the vagaries of mind with the help of the discriminative mind.  Dharana 
and 
dhyana are the names given to different levels of controlling the mind.

Let it be so.  What is your name? Say it is Ramayya.   You are an 
officer.  It is your 
nature to be strict.  You are a very tall person.  Your characteristics can be 
explained in 
various similar ways.  But in reality ÓyouÓ are different from all the 
above-mentioned traits.  
This fact applies to all objects in the world.  Being able to concentrate on 
this inner 
phenomena (and not on the external appearance) is called samadhi.  This is the 
clue to 
vibhuti sadhana.

It is now clear that dharana and dhyana depend on the external 
characteristics of an 
object, while samadhi is concerned with the ÒinternalÓ principle of the object. 
 Therefore, it 
seems that these three aspectsÑdharana, dhyana and samadhiÑcannot coexist.  But 
by 
the power of sadhana these three can be achieved at the same time.  This is 
called 
Òsamyama.Ó

Love or hatred for objects is on account of their external appearance 
and the fruits 
they give.  But once samyama sets in, objects hitherto appearing in different 
forms start 
appearing in their tattvic form (innate principle).  Then the oneness that is 
common to all 
the objects is experienced.  As dharana and dhyana also coexist, the diversity 
of the 
objects is also experienced.  To put it in a nutshell, unity amidst diversity 
will come to be 
experienced.  This state is called Òprajna.Ó  Prajna means Òprahasta jnanaÓ 
(knowledge of 
the superior order).  After achieving prajna, when one looks at the objects 
(through the 
eye of prajna), every object in this creation starts exhibiting an existence of 
a higher order.  
This specialty is not on account of the desire for the object.  Instead, it is 
due to the 
experience of its innate principle.  Hence this is the real specialty.  This 
alone is the 
ÒVibhutiÓ explained in Yoga Shastra.

If samyama is achieved on any specific object (with form or without 
form), a specific 
vibhuti sets in.  Patanjali has listed some of them in his yoga sutras.  If one 
achieves 
samyama on the sun, knowledge of the 14 worlds will be achieved.  By 
concentrating on 
the ÒnabhiÓ (navel), the secret of the body structure will be known.  There are 
more 
examples of samyama on objects with form in PatanjaliÕs yoga sutras.

An object has different names in different languages.  That means 
different sounds 
indicate the same object to different persons.  The same object is 
distinguished as 
different sounds to different people.  It is because of symbolizing an object 
with a sound 
and vice versa that language came into existence.  Due to the diversity of 
samskaras of 
speakers, different languages take birth.  On account of this, confusion is 
created in the 
relation between the sound and the object.  If one achieves samyama on this, 
one will be 
able to understand the speech of all the beings.   This shows how difficult and 
complicated

[FairfieldLife] Re: Announcement of A New Folder: Baseless Claims on FFL

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Premanand Paul Mason"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Are planning a 'balanced' approach and also listing the baseless 
> and/or unsubstantiated claims of MMY and his organisation(s)?

Sure. That would be good. 

And unsubstantiated claims of other orgs, perhaps.

Should we include politicians? It would fill up fast with Bush.

Of course then the queries for substantiation might need to have a
modified protocol. But why not. 

Why didn't we all write Bush in 2002 and say, "Mr President, when you
alluded to the image of a mushroom cloud if we don't invade Iraq, is
that simply a "hunch" something from your "gut", a pesonal opinion
which might be right and might be wrong --  or do we have any real
substantiation for such fears? The aluminum tubes you cite have been
showen to not be applicable for nuclear work. And three intelligence
agencies have renounced as false the yellow cake uranium claims. Do
you have any substantial facts to support your case?"

> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> wrote:
> >
> > An new folder in the FILES section (see uper left portion of FFL 
> Home
> > Page) has been created to track, and hopefuly reduce, the 
> surprisingly
> > increasing number of baseless and/or unsubstantiated claims made on 
> FFL. 
> > 
> > Here is the FAQ for that folder.
> > 
> > 
> > 1) Make one file for each general unsubstantiated claim. 
> > (To reduce clutter, pleas group near similar claims in the same 
> file.)
> > 
> > In each file, provide:
> > 
> > 2) Provide a URL to the post of the alleged bogus claim, and key
> > quotes of the claim.
> > 
> > 3) Politely ask the poster for specific clarification  and back-up 
> of
> > his claim(s). Provide the URL of that post.
> > 
> > 4) Provide URL of original posters response, or citation that after 
> a
> > week, no resposnse of clarification or backup was made.
> > 
> > 5) Cite URLs and summaries of subsequent relevant posts on the 
> issue. 
> > 
> > 6) Provide a summary as to why you feel the claim has not been
> > clarified and substantiated. 
> > 
> > 7) When an adequate response is received, publicly thank the poster
> > for the clarification.
> > 
> > 8) If there is an inadequate response, post to FFL a summary of the
> > file: claim made, the inadequacy of response, etc. , with URL of the
> > claim's file.
> > 
> > 9) As files accumulate, and index and summary file for all claim 
> files
> > will be made. 
> > 
> > 10) Do not make perosnal attacks on persons or motives. Simply state
> > the facts.
> > 
> > 11) This is a moderated folder. Files with inconsequential material
> > and personal disputes will be returned to the "filer" and discarded
> > from this folder.
> >
>

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[FairfieldLife] Datta Jayathi Images

Jaya Guru Datta

This link is the first of three that display the various activities, homas, 
pujas, veda pundit 
exam winners, etc at Dattapeetham in Mysore, India these past three days.
Beautiful.
At the bottom of the first page are the links to the next two days.

Enjoy..

http://www.dattapeetham.com/india/festivals/dattajayanti2005/dec13/dec13.html


Sri Guru Datta

Hanuman
 





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > But my original point is not addressed in your reply.   My point 
> > was not about poeple having experiences and reporting them. My 
> > concern was about people not having experiences, yet still 
> > reporting experiences.
> 
> That would seem to be your issue, and your problem.
> I talked earlier about intuition, and the "feeling"
> "behind" the written words. If you can't feel that,
> then you are free to react skeptically. But some of
> us can.

 To all posts of eperiences?

And i assume that your "feeling" is just that -- an impression -- akin
to an opinion. Which may be right, may be wrong. 

If on the other hand, you are making universal truth claims based on
your intuition, that is another matter all together. 

I will assume its the former until so advised.

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

Peter writes:
What strikes me as odd in these discussions is the
degree of hostility. Why do people get so pissed-off
if someone talks about some sort of Realization
experience? 

Tom T opinion:
It would appear that the self appointed Dogma/thought patrol has to
have everything posted in the scientific method in triplicate. Any
personal experience that doesn't follow that self appointed group's
method is immediately jumped on as insubstantial, self aggrandizing
and untrue. It appears that one is definitely guilty until one can
prove ones innocence in triplicate with a fully certified scientific
process that has been read and approved and published in at least
three peer reviewed journals. Any post that does not follow the above
rules of the self appointed thought/dogma patrol then are fair game
for slash, burn and dump invective.  From my side they can take a long
walk off a short dock or suck eggs whichever seems most appropriate.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Announcement of A New Folder: Baseless Claims on FFL

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> wrote:
> > > 
> > > Alternatively, posters could feel free to say whatever
> > > they want and encourage the skeptics to go suck eggs.  
> > 
> > Thats true. Maybe we could simplify the folder and just make it the
> > "Egg Head" list. Peopelwho make wild claims without any attempt to
> > back it up. Then again, simply stating, "Heres my opinion .. though I
> > know there is not much support for it. Maybe someday there will be.
> > Maybe not. Regardless, thats how I come out on it."
> 
> You've caught me in a brutally honest mood. 
> I'm of the opinion that those who are afraid
> to believe anything until "there is support
> for it" are to be pitied, and don't deserve
> my valuable time.  :-)

"My valable time" is clearly YOUR impression, not a unversal fact of
truth. :)

> 
> The enlightenment process IS subjective, and
> it will always be. If you haven't yet encoun-
> tered some experience that your teacher or
> teachers hadn't previously described to you
> and "prepared you for," IMO you just haven't
> been moving very fast spiritually. When you
> DO encounter such an experience, what are you
> going to trust, the experience itself or some-
> one else's "support" for it?

All good points, but nothing to do with my posts. 

My point has been simply, that when someone makes an assertion of fact
"the sky is red" they should provide some substance to back it up if
asked. 

If on the other hand they say "My opinion is the sky is red, but hey
... I could be wrong" - no substantiation needed.

If someone says "My impression is that the sky is red" - we sign him
to a five year movie, record and art gallery deal.

And if the person says "You a hostile asshole for asking me for
substantiation, end of Discussion! Period!", we know Dr. Pete must
have arrived. :)

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[FairfieldLife] Brahman...Pranava...Creation

Jaya Guru Datta

The following is an explanation of the Sri Ganapathi Sachchidananda Swamiji's 
composition, "Celestial Message" on the cd of the same name. It is the intro to 
the video of 
the same name as well.

I failed to mention that along with the music cd's, Dattapeetham has produced 
some 
beautiful, and mind staggering videos.

Sri Guru Datta

Hanuman

Sri Ganapathi Sachchidananda Swamiji 
Nada Brahma Divine Musician Incarnate

Sound is the source of all Creation. This sound has originated from Brahman and 
is 
indicated by the Pranava. This sound is known by all mantras as OM. It lies 
hidden in the 
worshippers of the indivisible and unparalleled SAT-CHIT-ANANDA.
That energy, which in essence is PARA-BRAHMA devoid of all attributes and as 
AKASHA, is 
considered to be the entrance to Brahman with attributes. As declared by the 
Vedas, 
AKASHAAT VAAYUH, Vaayuh emerges from AKASHA as the vital principle. According 
to the 
Vedic statement AATMA VAI VAAYUH, it can be construed that Vaayuh is Atman. 
Single 
pointedness of mind is also of the nature of Vaayuh. Vaayuh the life of the 
vital energy 
which is of the form of the seven Mystical utterances, kindles the driving NADO 
UPASANA 
and renders nature brilliant with Raagas.
According to the vedic statement VAAYORGH AGNIH, movement of Vaayuh assumes the 
form of fire.
Among the means to attain uninterrupted SAT-CHIT-ANANDA by the entire 
universe of 
moving and non-moving beings, Vedic Smamagana is the foremost. It is by this 
that the 
science of music consisting of the 12 chakras and 72 Melakartas has taken form.
VAM (vum)-  is the seed letter of the Indu Chakra, which is the first, and 
has water as its 
main essence. This letter is nectarean in nature. VAARUNI is its Deity. 
Ratnangi is the 
second melakarta raga belonging to the Indu Chakra. REVATHI is one of the Janya 
ragas 
belonging to this chakra.
RAM (rum)Ð is the seed letter of this raga. Sri Swamiji used to remark, 
that as Fire is 
the deity of this raga, it is fiery in nature.
The present song Kalathreya Bodditham Brahma Brahma is born of the 
indivisible 
SAT-CHIT-ANANDA eulogizing Brahman unconditioned by Time, Space, Matter.
When rendered in the morning tune, this opens the eye of wisdom and 
reveals the 
splendor of the Self, of which fire is the essence. The transcendental 
self-luminous light 
which cannot be split as PRARABDHA-SANCHITA-AAGAMI, as past, present, or 
future, as 
dawn, noon, or dusk, as day or night, or as VATSARA,
PARIVATSARA, IDAVATSARA, VARIVATSARAÑthat is Brahman alone.
 It is sinless and matchless and shines peerlessly and is beyond Doubt. 
The Vedic 
statement, GUHATHRENI NIHITA NENGAYANTI- TURYAM VACHO MANUSHYA VADANTI- 
which is the inner core of the four states of sound namely, PARA, PASHYANTI, 
MADYHAMA, VAIKHARI, indicates the ever full Turya, that is Brahman itself.
That Brahman alone is ISHWARA, that Brahman alone is VISHNU, that 
Brahman alone 
is PARAMESHWARA, the principle transcending Maya.   
It is beyond the knowledge of the perceptible world. That alone is the 
ever-perfect 
Brahman. It is subtler than the subtlest atom. Brahman is greater than the 
endless 
universes containing the planets, the stars and the brilliant galaxies.
It is the self Effulgent Light and cannot be expressed by speech. Mind 
cannot 
conceive it; intellect cannot determine it.
Being of the nature of Light, reveling in itself, having as its inner 
essence the energy 
of Vaayuh, dwelling in the Atman, being the Paramatma beyond the combined power 
that 
aids the UPAASAKA in acquiring unbroken knowledge of the Brahman, the entire 
world of 
Cognized, Expressed, and the Expression is Brahman alone.
It is the sinless and unknowable Brahman, whose characteristic is 
Supreme Bliss, that 
is attained by contemplating on the Mahavakyas constituting the essence of the 
great 
Upanishads.
That alone is true resolve, and true desire. That self perfect 
expansive brilliance alone 
is pure Brahman. That alone is the whole, the all-pervading and the 
unconditioned 
Brahman. That is Hari. That is Pranava. That alone is of the nature of 
Existence Absolute.
Parmapoojya Sri Swamiji, who has been ordained by his mother, Matha 
Shri 
Jayalakshmi to propagate Dharma, sang this composition in a state of Sahaja 
Samadhi in a 
recording studio in Germany.

We now going to witness a somewhat similar situation in this film which has 
been shot at 
Mekadatu, the birthplace of Swamiji, and the place of confluence of three 
rivers- Cauvery, 
Arkavati, Gupta Gamini.

Listening to this raga Revathi, which has its origin in a raga in the Melakarta 
belonging to 
the Indu Chakra relieves diseases caused by fluid imbalance, lung diseases, 
weak gastric 
fire and other chronic ailments. It tones up the heart and thereby regularizes 
blood 
circulation.
It also relieves nervous disorders, vitalizes fourte

[FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> wrote:
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jim_flanegin" 
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > wrote:
> > > > To tell the truth, that's why I replied as I did to
> > > > the recent poster who wants people to jump through
> > > > hoops to "prove" any claim they make here. IMO, life's
> > > > too short to deal with pissants who want "proof" of
> > > > subjective experiences. 
> > 
> > 
> > But of course no one recently asked you for any proof of your
> > subjective experiences. You are rattling at phantom windmills.
> > 
> > What I recall in recent posts is requests for your assertions of 
> that
> >  all religious and spiritual traditions end in the same place. If 
> you
> > want to state that as your personal opinion, fine. But you 
> appeared to
> > be asserting it as some universal truth. What is the problem with
> > asking for some support of such a claim?
> 
> Just to clarify, you seem to be talking to Jim, but
> who you quoted above is me (Barry, TurquoiseB). 
> That doesn't really facilitate communication very
> well.

Opps, sorry. My mistake. My keyboard is acting up this morning -- the
cursor is ending up randomly all over the place. I appear to be
clipping things I don't mean to. Lame excuse, I know, but true.

But its all one Atman shining as samskaras speak among themselves
right? What deos it matter in the large scheme of things if its Barry
or Jim samskaras? :)

But ok, so its YOU Barry who is that asshole who I think has rocks for
brains NOT jim. :)  Just as long as you embrace your asshole(ness)
Like Judy. And if she looks like Natasha (Boris and Natasha) while
doing that ... hmmm. ... I see it now .. a set of DVDs "Learn to
Embrace your Asshole with Boris and Natasha. -- Adults Only"

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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Shiva-sutra of the day 3:6



On Dec 16, 2005, at 12:23 PM, jim_flanegin wrote:Not sure I understand why this is necessarily a bad thing, as long  as we recognize it, as Sparaig said earlier as just the performance  or result of the siddhi. Then, wouldn't it help along the infusion  of Self into Maya, eventually melting the 'veil'? PS This is just  curiosity on my part, as I no longer do the TM-Sidhi Program... The comment says we become deluded thru power-of-delusion (maya-shakti) and no longer perceive Shiva who is the inner-most Self.





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Shiva-sutra of the day 3:6

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> On Dec 16, 2005, at 10:24 AM, jim_flanegin wrote:
> 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>  From the anava-upaya, section 3, of the Shiva-sutra:
> >>
> >> "Mohavaranat siddhih"
> >>
> >> (mohAvaraNATh siddhiH)
> >>
> >> "Siddhis are due to a veil (AvaraNa) drawn by ignorance (mohA)."
> >>
> >>
> > That's interesting. Is the commentary saying that the result of 
the
> > sutra can only be seen in this apparently manifested, though not 
real,
> > world, and so the result by definition is a product of
> > ignorance? ...which of course is true, but not very practical.
> >
> > Or is it more a commentary about getting 'lost in the Siddhi', 
which I
> > have heard before, as an warning?
> 
> What the vimarshini says is that practice of siddhis attenuates 
the  
> innermost self by causing us to be deluded by our own Maya-shakti. 
It  
> draws Self into a veil of Maya.

Not sure I understand why this is necessarily a bad thing, as long 
as we recognize it, as Sparaig said earlier as just the performance 
or result of the siddhi. Then, wouldn't it help along the infusion 
of Self into Maya, eventually melting the 'veil'? PS This is just 
curiosity on my part, as I no longer do the TM-Sidhi Program...
> 
> It goes on to describe how to melt this "veil of ignorance" 
correctly.
>






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> But my original point is not addressed in your reply.   My point 
> was not about poeple having experiences and reporting them. My 
> concern was about people not having experiences, yet still 
> reporting experiences.

That would seem to be your issue, and your problem.
I talked earlier about intuition, and the "feeling"
"behind" the written words. If you can't feel that,
then you are free to react skeptically. But some of
us can.

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Announcement of A New Folder: Baseless Claims on FFL

2005-12-16 Thread Premanand Paul Mason

Are planning a 'balanced' approach and also listing the baseless 
and/or unsubstantiated claims of MMY and his organisation(s)?

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> An new folder in the FILES section (see uper left portion of FFL 
Home
> Page) has been created to track, and hopefuly reduce, the 
surprisingly
> increasing number of baseless and/or unsubstantiated claims made on 
FFL. 
> 
> Here is the FAQ for that folder.
> 
> 
> 1) Make one file for each general unsubstantiated claim. 
> (To reduce clutter, pleas group near similar claims in the same 
file.)
> 
> In each file, provide:
> 
> 2) Provide a URL to the post of the alleged bogus claim, and key
> quotes of the claim.
> 
> 3) Politely ask the poster for specific clarification  and back-up 
of
> his claim(s). Provide the URL of that post.
> 
> 4) Provide URL of original posters response, or citation that after 
a
> week, no resposnse of clarification or backup was made.
> 
> 5) Cite URLs and summaries of subsequent relevant posts on the 
issue. 
> 
> 6) Provide a summary as to why you feel the claim has not been
> clarified and substantiated. 
> 
> 7) When an adequate response is received, publicly thank the poster
> for the clarification.
> 
> 8) If there is an inadequate response, post to FFL a summary of the
> file: claim made, the inadequacy of response, etc. , with URL of the
> claim's file.
> 
> 9) As files accumulate, and index and summary file for all claim 
files
> will be made. 
> 
> 10) Do not make perosnal attacks on persons or motives. Simply state
> the facts.
> 
> 11) This is a moderated folder. Files with inconsequential material
> and personal disputes will be returned to the "filer" and discarded
> from this folder.
>







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[FairfieldLife] Shiva-sutra of the day 3:6

Vaj writes;
 From the anava-upaya, section 3, of the Shiva-sutra:
"Mohavaranat siddhih"
(mohAvaraNATh siddhiH)
"Siddhis are due to a veil (AvaraNa) drawn by ignorance (mohA)."

Slightly different slant:from Swami Lakshmanjoo
6. Such powers appear only when the veil of ignorance falls in the way
of en-tering into pure God Consciousness.

7. By obtaining victory over such an illusion of cosmic powers and by
enjoying the state of limitless being, the pure and supreme knowledge
manifests.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Announcement of A New Folder: Baseless Claims on FFL

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
> > 
> > Alternatively, posters could feel free to say whatever
> > they want and encourage the skeptics to go suck eggs.  
> 
> Thats true. Maybe we could simplify the folder and just make it the
> "Egg Head" list. Peopelwho make wild claims without any attempt to
> back it up. Then again, simply stating, "Heres my opinion .. though I
> know there is not much support for it. Maybe someday there will be.
> Maybe not. Regardless, thats how I come out on it."

You've caught me in a brutally honest mood. 
I'm of the opinion that those who are afraid
to believe anything until "there is support
for it" are to be pitied, and don't deserve
my valuable time.  :-)

The enlightenment process IS subjective, and
it will always be. If you haven't yet encoun-
tered some experience that your teacher or
teachers hadn't previously described to you
and "prepared you for," IMO you just haven't
been moving very fast spiritually. When you
DO encounter such an experience, what are you
going to trust, the experience itself or some-
one else's "support" for it? 

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Shiva-sutra of the day 3:6

2005-12-16 Thread cardemaister

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> On Dec 16, 2005, at 10:26 AM, sparaig wrote:
> 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>  From the anava-upaya, section 3, of the Shiva-sutra:
> >>
> >> "Mohavaranat siddhih"
> >>
> >> (mohAvaraNATh siddhiH)
> >>
> >> "Siddhis are due to a veil (AvaraNa) drawn by ignorance (mohA)."
> >>
> >>
> >
> > Of course. If there was no veil, there would be no outward stroke
> > (performance) and hence no siddhi.
> 
> Well not the point here as there is no mention of the vyutthana 
(the  
> outward stroke). The point is performance of siddhis increases the  
> power of our own delusions (maya-shakti). We begin to believe our 
own  
> delusions.
>

Well, because the word "siddhi" is in singular (nominative plural 
would be "siddhayaH"), it might refer
to perfection in general, not to the siddhi techniques of Patanjali.
This might be a "better" translation:

3-6 Perfection is through the veil of delusion.

http://www.shaivam.org/ssshivasuutra.htm

At least the transliteration seems more accurate than
on a couple of sites I quickly browsed.

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jim_flanegin" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> > > To tell the truth, that's why I replied as I did to
> > > the recent poster who wants people to jump through
> > > hoops to "prove" any claim they make here. IMO, life's
> > > too short to deal with pissants who want "proof" of
> > > subjective experiences. 
> 
> 
> But of course no one recently asked you for any proof of your
> subjective experiences. You are rattling at phantom windmills.
> 
> What I recall in recent posts is requests for your assertions of 
that
>  all religious and spiritual traditions end in the same place. If 
you
> want to state that as your personal opinion, fine. But you 
appeared to
> be asserting it as some universal truth. What is the problem with
> asking for some support of such a claim?

Just to clarify, you seem to be talking to Jim, but
who you quoted above is me (Barry, TurquoiseB). 
That doesn't really facilitate communication very
well.

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> > What strikes me as odd in these discussions is the
> > degree of hostility. Why do people get so pissed-off
> > if someone talks about some sort of Realization
> > experience? 
> 
> Could you be more specific? 
> Who has gotten pissed-off?
> At whose discussion of a Realization experience?
> 
> I have been reading these posts carefully and I have not found that.
> Please be specific. Otherwise I must assume it is something inside
of you that makes you see such.

Peter, taking my own advice to re-read things where there is a
difference of "impression", to see if I  have misinterpreted  or
missed something, I re-read the above post. You said it ended with "a
passive-aggressive slam." For the life of me I can't see it. 

Perhaps I could rephrase to make the same point -- focussing on the
secon paragraph. 

"I have been reading these posts carefully and I have not found
hostility. Perhaps I am missing something you have picked up on. So 
please be specific so I can better understand what you are getting at.
If you are unable to find such specifics, well, thats ok. It may be
similar to what I have found personally in such circumstances when I
"think" or "feel" a certain tone or attitude is in a writer's piece --
but then can't find the exact words to make such a case. Pity. It so
seemed to be there. In such cases I must conclude its something in my
own mind, my own web of cognitive abilites that made me incorectly
assume such a tone or bias.  If you are unable to point to the
specific instances of hostility, I must assume it is something like my
personal expereince --  its a small quirk inside of you that makes you
see such since it cannot be found on paper."

To me the point and general tone are the similar between the two
versions. But the latter takes greater explanatory pains. And seems
like a discussion two upper crusty Brits in a Gentlemans Club during
the Raj. My usual style is more one of greater brevity and directness.
But if the latter style suits you better, I will try to pursue such in
discussion with you.

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Your mind is never going to get MMY. Never, ever.

2005-12-16 Thread Patrick Gillam

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> On Dec 16, 2005, at 8:41 AM, Patrick Gillam wrote:
> 
> > The other thing is -- and this is the more cogent
> > point -- I believe we manifest *whatever* we believe.
> 
> I believe you answered your own question.

Come to think of it, another theme that MMY has 
hammered is just this -- we create our own realities.

After I posted the remark above that "we manifest 
*whatever* we believe," I asked myself, what about 
science? Science does suggest there are natural 
laws that limit the extent to which I can manipulate 
creation, even if I can fool myself into believing what 
science disproves. I may be able to convince myself 
there's ample evidence for a given worldview, but 
good science can determine whether my anecdotal 
evidence is valid.

So, two things: actual physical manifestation, and 
magical thinking.

When Dana Sawyer says "precept determines percept," 
he's suggesting these notions of enlightenment are 
magical thinking -- constructs of the mind.

When you, Vaj, say View determines outcome, you're 
referring more to a concrete outcome, a real thing, 
as opposed to a construct of the mind. Yes?

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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

2005-12-16 Thread Peter

--- braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> 
> Then thats fine. I thought he might be trying to
> make a point of
> substance. But nothing wrong with saying "It seems
> to me that  
> but thats just my opinion. I could be mistaken."

I always think that above is in operation regardless
of who says what. You have made a critique of me in
the past as coming across as an absolutest and I was
surprised I came across this way, but when I read some
of my posts, I understood what you were talking about
(by the way, I assume this is Akasha, yes?). I think
that conviction comes out of the experience. You walk
outside and its raining. You come back in and
proclaim, "IT"S RAINING!" and proceed to yack about
the experience with the absolute conviction of being
wet. Now you can use concepts from other people who
have proclaimed, "IT"S RAINING" to help understand
what this "IT"S RAINING" is all about.

> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> 
> 
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> 
> --- braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> 
> > 
> > So lets try the experiment. No gottcha games here.
> > Just list the 
> > the Experience posts you have in mind, and the
> > hostile response you
> > have in mind. Lets collectively look at the words
> > and see whats there.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > > Some
> > > "new" poster wants examples of what I'm referring
> > to.
> > > I'm not going to engage him because he has decided
> > a
> > > priori that he and others are not hostile.
> > 
> > Not true. Well, I know my own states which have not
> > been hostile. I
> > acknowledge that my writing may come across as
> > hostile to you or
> > perhaps others. I don't see it, but if you can show
> > it, I am a quick
> > study, I am eager to improve my writing skils and
> > curtail unintented
> > tones and tudes.
> > 
> > >  Then he
> > > ends his post with a passive-agressive slam. 
> > 
> > See, that is internal Peter. I did not end my post
> > with a with a
> > passive-agressive slam. I ended my post with
> > something YOU INTERPRETED
> > AS a slam. I ended the post in the way I did because
> > I have seen you
> > repeated ignore requests for clarification when you
> > are called on an
> > issue.
> 
> The next time it occurs I'll point it out. We've done
> this dance many times and it seems useless. You will
> always claim that you aren't hostile. But if you want
> to do this, I will.


Great.

But why not start with this mornings report of "occurances". Your post
 alluded to a lot of hostile posts. Can you cite them and the language
you find hostile? 

Just an aside, many of your comments appear based on the past. Could
it be you have impressions of past posters, disagreements, etc, that
shape or color your PRESENT view of newposts? 





> 
> 
> 
> > 
> > I really think you should try this exercise. I think
> > it may amaze us
> > all. Cite the experience posts you have in mind, and
> > the hostile
> > response you have in mind. Lets collectively look at
> > the words. Why
> > the resistance to taking 10 minutes to do so? 
> > 
> > 
> > > There's
> > > nothing wrong with being pissed-off, it's just
> > that
> > > you can't have a normal conversation with someone
> > > peppering their posts with all this
> > passive-aggressive
> > > nonsense.
> > 
> > If you are referring to my posts, again, just cite
> > what you feel are 
> > "peppering their posts with all this
> > passive-aggressive
> > nonsense." I know the intent of my last post and it
> > was not passive
> > agressive or hostile. If my style of writing is not
> > effective, help me
> > to change. If you are interpreting things on the
> > paper not intended,
> > perhaps you too have room for change.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Shiva-sutra of the day 3:6



On Dec 16, 2005, at 10:26 AM, sparaig wrote:--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:   From the anava-upaya, section 3, of the Shiva-sutra:  "Mohavaranat siddhih"  (mohAvaraNATh siddhiH)  "Siddhis are due to a veil (AvaraNa) drawn by ignorance (mohA)."   Of course. If there was no veil, there would be no outward stroke  (performance) and hence no siddhi. Well not the point here as there is no mention of the vyutthana (the outward stroke). The point is performance of siddhis increases the power of our own delusions (maya-shakti). We begin to believe our own delusions. 





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > I ask the opposite, and inverted, question of Peter's: why not more
> > questioning of experience postings? 
> 
> Ask anything you want, any time you want. But don't
> get all pissy if the person doesn't feel like replying
> to you. Some people like to play word games with their
> experiences, and some prefer just to *have* experiences.

Thats fine. And post about someones experience might generate a
discussion by many -- not including the original poster.

But my original point is not addressed in your reply.   My point was
not about poeple having experiences and reporting them. My concern was
about people not having experiences, yet still reporting experiences.

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> To tell the truth, that's why I replied as I did to
> the recent poster who wants people to jump through
> hoops to "prove" any claim they make here. IMO, life's
> too short to deal with pissants who want "proof" of
> subjective experiences. For me, life's too short to
> deal with pissants who want to quibble endlessly over
> *opinion*.  If they want to quibble over things they
> consider verifiable facts, that's their business, as
> long as they don't expect me to play their ego-gotcha
> games.

Well thats cool. I think the issue boils down to opinion vs. an 
assertion of fact. Perhaps I have mistaken the take on some posts ---
which are merely opinion. Opinions are fine, and need no proof.
Though, in may be of interest as to the thought processes, logic and
understandings the person used to come to that opinion. Seems
reasonable to be able to ask such in a polite way.

On the other hand, some posts appear (it is subjective), to make some
assertions as fact. If indeed that is the case -- and that is the
first thing that should be clarified "Is this your opinion, or do you
suggest its a fact or universally true?" -- then requests for
substantiation are valid. If none are forthcoming, well, the point
then defaults to opinion status. The claims folder has to do with
these claims, not assertions.

A third category, perhaps similar to opinion, is "impression". People
regularly report things they see in posts -- that upon my reading the
actual words don't appear to be there (my impression). Various
impressions by various readers. Thats why if someone asserts an
impression, its useful for them to cite examples from the post, as to
why they have that impression. Maybe its a good "read", maybe not. Its
always good to ask the BK questions (thats my opinion, btw,) "Do I
know thats true", "How do I know thats true" ... etc.

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Announcement of A New Folder: Baseless Claims on FFL

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> Alternatively, posters could feel free to say whatever
> they want and encourage the skeptics to go suck eggs.  

Thats true. Maybe we could simplify the folder and just make it the
"Egg Head" list. Peopelwho make wild claims without any attempt to
back it up. Then again, simply stating, "Heres my opinion .. though I
know there is not much support for it. Maybe someday there will be.
Maybe not. Regardless, thats how I come out on it."

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>

Then thats fine. I thought he might be trying to make a point of
substance. But nothing wrong with saying "It seems to me that  
but thats just my opinion. I could be mistaken."







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jim_flanegin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
> > To tell the truth, that's why I replied as I did to
> > the recent poster who wants people to jump through
> > hoops to "prove" any claim they make here. IMO, life's
> > too short to deal with pissants who want "proof" of
> > subjective experiences. 

But of course no one recently asked you for any proof of your
subjective experiences. You are rattling at phantom windmills.

What I recall in recent posts is requests for your assertions of that
 all religious and spiritual traditions end in the same place. If you
want to state that as your personal opinion, fine. But you appeared to
be asserting it as some universal truth. What is the problem with
asking for some support of such a claim?

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> 
> --- braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> Now this is a nice post that someone can respond to,
> which I'll do
> 
> 
> > 
> > Yes, I tink everyone goes through that process when
> > experiences are
> > discussed. Though, to my memory, few have been
> > discussed recently and
> > none have been criticized. Thus the puzzlement about
> > Peter's and Jim's
> > recent assertions this morning. The assertions seem
> > like old snakes
> > rattling round in the cage, memories of some past
> > scars, not current
> > events.
> 
> I get your point. But I still see some of the recent
> posts as implicitly hostile.

Again the operative words are "I still see".  Can you acknowledge the
possibility that the hostility that you are seeing is in your head not
on the paper. Perhaps you have some old issues with some posters and
you see them -- the old issues -- every time the poster writes. Is
that at least a possibility?

> > 
> > It is a quandry when someone speaks of their
> > Enlightenment Experience,
> > and it doesn't ring true.
> 
> It does present a problem. Where do you start to
> respond! I like Dana Sawyer's post regarding my posts
> regarding enlightenment experiences in another
> newsgroup. He said I was lying. I loved it!
> 
> 
> > Or simply garbles up some
> > apparently
> > internalized advaitaspeak. That does nothing to
> > further knowledge and
> > understanding.
> 
> Agree
> 
> > 
> > Politeness and kindness move one towards no comment,
> > just stone
> > silence. Not wanting to even raise quite polite and
> > civil points
> > because they are often backlashed with chilly
> > responses, not on the
> > point of inquiry, but why the questioner is
> > personally fucked up,
> > angry, resentful and/or hostile.
> 
> I find it difficult to talk to someone who is
> simultaneously being insulting. 

Am I being insuling in this exchange? If so just point to it Peter.

> 
You appear to miss the point. Personal attacks and citing motives of
othes are not adequate, or often even interesting, responses to a
point of "fact" - a quesion about some assertion. 

And stylized example of what often goes on at FFL, IMO:

A: The sky is Red

B: Can you provide some evidence that the sky is red.

A: You only asked becasue you are hostile and angry.

B: ok I am sorry you feel that way, but can you provide some evidence
that the sky is red?

A: Shut up fuck face, you angry, resentful son of a bitch!

A second issue, covered in other posts is that what you INTERPRET as 
hostility and insults are possibly just in your mind, not intended,
not on the paper. When reapeated asked for you to cite examples of
your sightings of hostility, you never do, to my recollection. Just
try it. You may be amazed.

But the main point stands. Even if there is hostility, citing that
does not answer the request for clarificatipon about a point of fact.
For some, its a diversionary tactic. It does not further the flow
knowledge.

> > 
> > And yet, silence can at times, by some, be
> > interpreted as acquiesence,
> > a mild support for what is said. And in cases where
> > blather exists,
> > the blather continues.
> > 
> > I ask the opposite, and inverted, question of
> > Peter's: why not more
> > questioning of experience postings? Not hostility
> > and personal
> > attacks. Those are tedious, immature and silly. But
> > it appears fair,
> > productive, even noble, and certainly part of the
> > spirit of this list
> > to ask for clarification of experiences. And to
> > raise other points of
> > view. To contrast one's own experience or those of
> > others with the
> > Experience poster's. And to discuss how some
> > traditions view such an
> > experience -- which may not always be "the highest
> > of all things" --
> > and may deflate a sensitive and insecure poster a
> > bit.
> 
> Absolutely. There's no problem talking about
> experiences at all. I don't see anyone as getting
> deflated due to sensitivity. I just don't enjoy the
> personal aggression (I know, I know) because another
> agenda is being played out. I'd rather talk about what
> we're talking about!

Yes, lets stick to knowledge and not discussions of what others'
states of mind or motives may or may not be. It is not relevant to
points of fact of points of concept being discussed. Lets all, if we
have a supposition about anothers motives or state of mind, fine. But
just keep it to yourself and contine the discussion on points of
KNOWLEDGE.

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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers

2005-12-16 Thread Peter



--- braaahmaan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:


> 
> So lets try the experiment. No gottcha games here.
> Just list the 
> the Experience posts you have in mind, and the
> hostile response you
> have in mind. Lets collectively look at the words
> and see whats there.
> 
> 
> 
> > Some
> > "new" poster wants examples of what I'm referring
> to.
> > I'm not going to engage him because he has decided
> a
> > priori that he and others are not hostile.
> 
> Not true. Well, I know my own states which have not
> been hostile. I
> acknowledge that my writing may come across as
> hostile to you or
> perhaps others. I don't see it, but if you can show
> it, I am a quick
> study, I am eager to improve my writing skils and
> curtail unintented
> tones and tudes.
> 
> >  Then he
> > ends his post with a passive-agressive slam. 
> 
> See, that is internal Peter. I did not end my post
> with a with a
> passive-agressive slam. I ended my post with
> something YOU INTERPRETED
> AS a slam. I ended the post in the way I did because
> I have seen you
> repeated ignore requests for clarification when you
> are called on an
> issue.

The next time it occurs I'll point it out. We've done
this dance many times and it seems useless. You will
always claim that you aren't hostile. But if you want
to do this, I will.



> 
> I really think you should try this exercise. I think
> it may amaze us
> all. Cite the experience posts you have in mind, and
> the hostile
> response you have in mind. Lets collectively look at
> the words. Why
> the resistance to taking 10 minutes to do so? 
> 
> 
> > There's
> > nothing wrong with being pissed-off, it's just
> that
> > you can't have a normal conversation with someone
> > peppering their posts with all this
> passive-aggressive
> > nonsense.
> 
> If you are referring to my posts, again, just cite
> what you feel are 
> "peppering their posts with all this
> passive-aggressive
> nonsense." I know the intent of my last post and it
> was not passive
> agressive or hostile. If my style of writing is not
> effective, help me
> to change. If you are interpreting things on the
> paper not intended,
> perhaps you too have room for change.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> > 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 
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> 


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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Shiva-sutra of the day 3:6



On Dec 16, 2005, at 10:24 AM, jim_flanegin wrote:--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:   From the anava-upaya, section 3, of the Shiva-sutra:  "Mohavaranat siddhih"  (mohAvaraNATh siddhiH)  "Siddhis are due to a veil (AvaraNa) drawn by ignorance (mohA)."  That's interesting. Is the commentary saying that the result of the  sutra can only be seen in this apparently manifested, though not real,  world, and so the result by definition is a product of  ignorance? ...which of course is true, but not very practical.   Or is it more a commentary about getting 'lost in the Siddhi', which I  have heard before, as an warning? What the vimarshini says is that practice of siddhis attenuates the innermost self by causing us to be deluded by our own Maya-shakti. It draws Self into a veil of Maya.It goes on to describe how to melt this "veil of ignorance" correctly.





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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your mind is never going to get MMY. Never, ever.

2005-12-16 Thread Peter

--- sparaig <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> 
> Since TC isnt' an experience in the usual sense of
> the word, it seems 
> plausible that any further state based on TC
> wouldn't be experiential 
> in the way that other things we might talk about
> are.
> 
> therefore, trying to talk about similarities and
> differences makes no 
> sense -- or at least, may not be appropriate.

I like the Piaget model here to explain what can't be
explained! Again, there is such a profound qualitative
shift in self/world from waking state to Realization
that it is almost impossible to talk about in anyway
that'll make sense from a waking state perspective.
I'm not trying to retreat into a "You gotta be there
to get it" perspective, but you gotta be there to get
it. Like Buddha after his realization. Initially, he
thought that it would be impossible to even talk about
this to others in waking state.  

> 
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Cultism and Free Seekers