[FairfieldLife] Was Voldemort a rapist like Freddy? [was Re: A Real Fairfield Life Post]

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, doctordumbass@...  wrote:
>
> Yeah, too bad Maharishi only had sex with those whom he loved. He probably 
> should have just raped the women at gunpoint, like Freddy Lenz, your Guru, 
> did. Great suggestion, Voldemort! 
> 
> "Yes, if a woman won't have sex with me, I'll play with a gun to convince 
> her."
> 
> If only you could have shared this priceless wisdom with Maharishi before he 
> passed away. Do you ever follow Freddy's example with women, now? Just 
> curious as you hung around with him quite a bit, even sitting in the coveted 
> front seat of his car, whether or not you have also raped women like he did? 
> No worries, I am not expecting an honest response, least of all from you.

Dr D, what is going on here? Barry is not responsible for Freddie's behavior. 
Get a grip.
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung  wrote:
> > >
> > > We were all born in Kali Yuga, which means none of us 
> > > had what it took to get enlightened for the three 
> > > previous yugas.  
> > >
> > > Yep, toads.  All of us.
> > > 
> > > Seriously, is it any wonder that we ended up HOPPING 
> > > as our spiritual practice?
> > 
> > OK, I get that all of this is a joke, but it is
> > important IMO to remember that "Kali Yuga" does
> > not exist. It's a made-up human term for a made-
> > up division of time that does not and has never
> > existed. 
> > 
> > That said, and to continue with your joke, I 
> > noticed that no one ever really dealt with the
> > actual *issue* I brought up about whether the
> > Rish actually had any sexual charisma or even
> > attractiveness to explain how he managed to get
> > a few women to have sex with him. People avoided 
> > that issue like the plague, playing "shoot the 
> > messenger" instead, like always. 
> > 
> > So I'll piggyback (or frogback) off Edg's joke
> > to pass along the words of at least three TM
> > women who, even though still part of the TMO,
> > *weren't* afraid to deal with the issue. All
> > three described the idea of having sex with
> > Maharishi using the exact same same words:
> > 
> > "Have sex with that squat little toad? E."
> > 
> > Appropriate somehow that the spiritual practice
> > he brought to the world was hopping like a frog. :-)
> > 
> > As for the issue of his attractiveness or non-,
> > any women here who had sexual fantasies about
> > Maharishi (requited or unrequited) are invited
> > to share them with us to provide a counterpoint.
> >
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Question re jyotish

[Susan]

thanks to share, obba and john.  I have lots of choices from you all and will 
get going on this tomorrow.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "John"  wrote:
>
> Susan,
> 
> I can recommend jyotishis whom I've met and learned from.  You can choose the 
> one who is the closest to you.
> 
> 1.  Dennis Flaherty in Seattle, WA.
> 
> 2.  Robert Koch in Bend, Oregon.
> 
> 3.  Chakrapani Ullal in Los Angeles, CA.  His clients include the celebrities 
> in Hollywood.
> 
> 4.  Dr. Dennis Harness in Sedona, Arizona.
> 
> 5.  Dr. David Frawley in Santa Fe, New Mexico.
> 
> 6.  Dr. Brendan Feeley in Washington, DC area.
> 
> 7.  Shri K.N. Rao in New Delhi, India.
> 
> 8.  Sanjay Rath in Orissa, India.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> >
> > Bhairitu and anyone else
> > Who do you recommend for a natal chart reading?   For one of my sons who is 
> > soon to be married.
> > 
> > Thanks
> >
>

[FairfieldLife] Question re jyotish

[Susan]

Bhairitu and anyone else
Who do you recommend for a natal chart reading?   For one of my sons who is 
soon to be married.

Thanks

[FairfieldLife] Re: A Real Fairfield Life Post

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, iranitea  wrote:
>
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Jason"  wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > ---  "bobpriced" bobpriced@ wrote:
> > >
> > > As I'm sure he knows, I'm a huge fan of Turq's posts; so I'm
> wondering
> > > if anyone
> > > would be kind enough to translate this one for me, particularly the
> last
> > > paragraph.
> > >
> > >
> > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HhSjwU8gEsI
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > Hey Bob, it's so nice to have you here.  You add color and
> > an extra dimension to this group.
> >
> > I think you scared Barry which is why he doesn't reply to
> > you.
> >
> > We are geneticaly hardwired to see symmetrical faces and
> > clear skin as attractive.  It indicates the genetic health
> > of the individual, resistance to infections etc.  Perhaps it
> > does irk him a bit when a woman gets attrracted to a baldy
> > like MMY.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
iranitea wrote: 
> Jason, Maharishi wasn't always bald. I'm not female, so I can't really
> say if he was attractive to ladies, but as a devotee, there were
> certainly photos of him I liked, and I still like, this one for example.
> He doesn't look like a sex god there, but I certainly thought his
> demeanor was beautiful, the way he walked into the hall had something
> royal.
> 
> But I guess, much of that, what we see, and the way we see it, is also a
> conditioning. There were also people who were attracted to Rajneesh, he
> was also bald, so...
>

That is such a lovely photo - the classic one of MMY.  As a woman who spent 
months and months and months around Maharishi in the 1970's, I can tell you it 
never even crossed my mind to consider him as someone to have sex with.  He was 
radiant, he was fun and funny, smart. The air around him pulsed with energy. 
And, as iranitea says, his carriage as he entered the lecture hall, or anytime 
I saw him walking, was just regal and flowing.  He was relaxed and yet 
completely upright and balanced, he glided as he walked.

[FairfieldLife] Re: A Real Fairfield Life Post

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> >
> > Sorry for the late reply. Been driving half way across 
> > the country for the last 2 days.
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
> > >
> > > Very nice post. THIS is what Fairfield Life could be if so many
> > > weren't so committed to lowering it to their level.
> > > 
> > > That said, I only have one comment, and I hope you understand
> > > that this is for fun, since we've discussed our differences 
> > > of opinion on the subject of free will in the past...
> > > 
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > So, being able to enlighten someone or teach them about it is a
> > > > pretty big gift, and so I do respect MMY - warts and all.
> > > 
> > > IF, as you suggest, there is no free will, and we're just 
> > > flowing along with Nature, circling the drain of ITS 
> > > intention, not ours, why would an ostensible teacher of 
> > > enlightenment be any more special than any
> > > other being, or what they "teach" a "gift?"
> > > 
> > > I mean, if there is no free will, and we're all just doing 
> > > what Nature
> > > intends, then how could anything such a "teacher of enlightenment"
> > > do or say *affect* us in any way? According to the No Free Will
> > > theory, someone or something ELSE is running things. Nothing that
> > > *anyone* we ever meet should be able to change that Plan, or Flow,
> > > or whatever you choose to call it.
> > > 
> > > Enlightened, schmightened. If there is No Free Will, and no one 
> > > has the ABILITY to change what is going to happen to them 
> > > (because Nature is "running" all of that shit), then how can 
> > > any "teaching" by any supposed "teacher of enlightenment" be 
> > > seen as having been instrumental in any of his/her students 
> > > realizing enlightenment?
> > > 
> > > Nature handles that shit, according to your theory. Not the 
> > > seeker, and not the teacher. IF your theory is correct, and 
> > > there is No Free Will, there is simply no possible way to 
> > > affect one's own future. It wouldn't matter how many 
> > > "teachers of enlightenment" you met; Nature controls whether 
> > > you're going to realize your own enlightenment...not 
> > > the teachers, and not you.
> > > 
> > > :-)
> > 
> > Just got back from 2 days of road trip driving, so apologe 
> > for not responding earlier.  
> 
> No apologies necessary. I've been on a bit of a Road
> Trip myself. Sometimes it clarifies the mind. Heck,
> I once wrote a whole book called "Road Trip Mind." :-)
> 
> > Yes we have had this discussion. As you probaby know, Sam 
> > Harris can explain it all rather well.
> 
> I have no doubt that he can. I, however, am not looking
> for "explanations." I get off more on just groovin'
> behind the mystery of it all. 
> 
> > I don't really have an answer to your points.  
> 
> See above. Good.  :-)
> 
> > When I have had those Experiences, I get that it all just 
> > happens. I cannot explain what that means for the times 
> > I am not in That Experience, except to say we think we are 
> > controlling things, but our thoughts are due to seeing 
> > only a small part of the picture. 
> 
> Your experience -- and your interpretation of it -- are
> your own, and I would not for a moment dispute either.
> Please don't get me wrong...it is NOT that I argue with
> such "It all seems to be happening" moments, because 
> I've had them myself. It's just that 1) I dispute that
> these moments "mean" anything in particular about the
> nature of the universe we live in, 2) I do not assign
> these experiences any position in a "hierarchy" of 
> better/best or higher/lower, and 3) I have an alter-
> nate view of my own similar experiences. 

I am kind of with you on your 3 points.  I am not sure what those experiences 
really Mean - are they windows to a more real reality? To The Reality? Or maybe 
just another in the many types of states of awareness we have available to us.  
I also sometimes wonder if this Enlightenment is really any better than having 
a nice, secure strong ego.  You know, the kind of comfortable in your o

[FairfieldLife] Re: A Real Fairfield Life Post

[Susan]

Sorry for the late reply. Been driving half way across the country for the last 
2 days.


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
>
> Very nice post. THIS is what Fairfield Life could be if so many
> weren't so committed to lowering it to their level.
> 
> That said, I only have one comment, and I hope you understand
> that this is for fun, since we've discussed our differences of opinion
> on the subject of free will in the past...
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> >
> > So, being able to enlighten someone or teach them about it is a
> > pretty big gift, and so I do respect MMY - warts and all.
> 
> IF, as you suggest, there is no free will, and we're just flowing along
> with Nature, circling the drain of ITS intention, not ours, why would
> an ostensible teacher of enlightenment be any more special than any
> other being, or what they "teach" a "gift?"
> 
> I mean, if there is no free will, and we're all just doing what Nature
> intends, then how could anything such a "teacher of enlightenment"
> do or say *affect* us in any way? According to the No Free Will
> theory, someone or something ELSE is running things. Nothing that
> *anyone* we ever meet should be able to change that Plan, or Flow,
> or whatever you choose to call it.
> 
> Enlightened, schmightened. If there is No Free Will, and no one has
> the ABILITY to change what is going to happen to them (because
> Nature is "running" all of that shit), then how can any "teaching" by
> any supposed "teacher of enlightenment" be seen as having been
> instrumental in any of his/her students realizing enlightenment?
> 
> Nature handles that shit, according to your theory. Not the seeker,
> and not the teacher. IF your theory is correct, and there is No Free
> Will, there is simply no possibile way to affect one's own future. It
> wouldn't matter how many "teachers of enlightenment" you met;
> Nature controls whether you're going to realize your own enlight-
> enment...not the teachers, and not you.
> 
> :-)
>
Just got back from 2 days of road trip driving, so apologe for not responding 
earlier.  Yes we have had this discussion.  As you probaby know, Sam Harris can 
explain it all rather well.


I don't really have an answer to your points.  When I have had those 
Experiences, I get that it all just happens.  I cannot explain what that means 
for the times I am not in That Experience, except to say we think we are 
controlling things, but our thoughts are due to seeing only a small part of the 
picture. As far as teachers and enlightenment, it all happens. The teacher 
could affect your state of consciousness if that is the inevitable unfolding of 
action.  If not, they won't affect you.  Nature does it all.  I don't think of 
Nature as a thinking and planning entity.  Just the principles that direct the 
flow of events.  Once things in the cosmos get started (big bang?) then my 
guess is that the Unfolding begins, and each event sets up the next event, like 
dominoes.  From the unenlightened individual's perspective, they are standing a 
few feet in front of the line of dominoes as they fall, and waving their arms 
about and thinking that they are causing the toppling. But really it is all 
going to happen anyway.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Post Count Sat 24-Aug-13 00:15:10 UTC

[Susan]

Judy, I am aware of Barry's ad hom posts and I don't like them and instantly 
stop reading when I get that whiff.  I do like some of his other types.  I 
understand your position on that and do see what you see, at least to some 
extent.  I think that I am not so bothered by it - not sure why it does not get 
to me.  But you yourself are in that group that, to me at least, seem to be 
doing lots of ad h posting, attacks on others. Obviously you are extremely 
bright and are a terrific source of information and are good at detail and 
analysis. And you are very sure of your opinions.  But I find many (not all 
some are excellent to me) of your posts to be confrontational and others to be 
about details and distracting from the main point. Those are the ones of yours 
that I move on from.  

Just go thru the postings with an open mind, as if you were a newbie here.  
Notice how may are attacking other people (not just Barry's, but several the 
others).  Name Calling, bringing up old old posts and creating arguments about 
people's past positions on something or someone.  It is pretty odd, and for me 
with not much free time due to a job and other responsibilities, really 
repetitious.

I just limit my time and read things that speak to me, so I am not advocating 
posting limits.  It is more the tone of the place and all the personal stuff 
that goes on and on and is not resolved.  I mean, if you don't like someone, 
why bother to read what they write?  Unless you enjoy arguing, which might be 
the case.  But I can't see that anyone here has changed anyone else in any way 
by criticizing.  Or pointing things out.  Maybe this post is just another one 
of those.So, for me being selective and opting out once I get that 
Ad H whiff is my solution.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> >
> > Actually, i meant pretty much what Barry said, and I was
> > not including Barry in the posts that I don't read.  I do
> > skip his posts where he generalizes about TB's at FFL. I
> > also skip most of the posts of several other people for
> > the reasons I stated. I find many of Barry's posts really 
> > interesting.
> 
> What I've never understood, Susan, is how you've missed
> the fact that Barry's posts, more than anyone else's on
> FFL, *depend* on ad hominem.
> 
> If you are trying to avoid reading ad hominem, you'd have
> to skip reading *most* of his posts. It's not just those
> that "generalize about TBs at FFL." It's vicious,
> sadistic personal attacks on specific individuals, attacks
> on *TMers* in general (not just those on FFL, and not just
> TBs), attacks on Americans in general, and on and on.
> 
> And for the most part these are *gratuitous* attacks, not
> responses to attacks by others on himself.
> 
> I'm far from the only person here who is aware of all
> this. Barry's posts emit a sort of miasma of hatred that
> permeates the group, and you have somehow managed to
> close your perception to it--while at the same time
> self-righteously holding your nose at the ad hominem of
> *other* people.
> 
> It's just very, very strange, Susan.
> 
> 
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > I'm sure the Reverend Turq will have something to say 
> > > > > in his morning sermon about this weeks winners. ;-)
> > > > 
> > > > Not really. I think wayback covered it sufficiently
> > > > with her suggestion that people learn from their 
> > > > previous experience and just not bother reading any
> > > > of the posts by people who you already know won't
> > > > have anything to say.
> > > 
> > > Ah, but that wasn't what she said, now, was it, Barry?
> > > 
> > > Here's what she said:
> > > 
> > > "Agreed that a huge percentage of posts here are ad hominum,
> > > and usually made by the same people over and over and over.
> > > I think they enjoy that type of interaction, thrive on it
> > > even. Not my style, though. And not at all the way things
> > > used to be here, as you know. One solution is not to read
> > > them. At all. Works for me."
> > > 
> > > Which means she doesn't read *your* posts, Barry, and
> > > that you've just suggested to FFLers that *they* not
> > > read your posts.
> > > 
> > > OOOopsie.
> > >
> >
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: A Real Fairfield Life Post

[Susan]

I believe that MMY did have sex and that he was also enlightened.  I think the 
technique he taught and the "story" around it (7 states of consciousness, etc) 
is a pretty good teaching and can provide some guideposts for experiences for 
many people as well as relieve stress. At the least it is a fine introduction 
to the concept of the evolution of the human nervous system. 

 I don't feel that if MMY had sex that those actions invalidate the TM 
technique or teachings, anymore than a Christian minister's sexual escapes 
invalidate Christianity or the teachings of Jesus. The mistake in many people's 
view is that MMY was TM and those teachings, that he is the only person to have 
this knowledge. MMY did not invent TM or create the whole system of belief, the 
cosmology, around it.  He simplified fairly universal belief systems 
beautifully, made it all clearer and more acceccable, but the teachings of TM 
are fairly universal and certainly the and states of consciousness are 
universal (even if not separated into 7 in other traditions).  I think MMY did 
an incredible and wonderful job of that.

Like Barry, I don't think MMY was a charlatan or had a planned program to 
deceive others.  IMO he was a true believer in most of what he said  - it was 
his entire background and culture.   I think he did want humanity to benefit 
from TM.  I think he truly believed he had crafted a program that was wonderful 
for people and that he was helping people not to waste time by insisting that 
they follow his way and not try others.

I can't recall for sure but I think Rick mentioned in the past that MMY was, 
based on some specific behaviors, very upset with his own sexual behavior at 
some point in the 70's.  Who knows, he might have carried that guilt or 
disappointment for the rest of his life.  Being in that position of guru with 
all these lovely young things around, and being a male with tons of pent up 
libido, well...he is human.  So, I think humans can still retain the 
"flaws" or nature of humanity and also have a nervous system that is 
enlightened.  

The whole thing about obeying all the Laws of Nature - I never took it all that 
literally.  It seemed to me, and still does, almost a fairy tale or an ideal, 
or else what we all do unawares.  Another way to look at this is to consider 
that all of Nature and the cosmos is part of the Divine - and yet there is a 
ton of suffering around, death, grief - just from natural acts alone.  So  
Nature incorporates the light and the dark.  And so do humans since we are part 
of it.  In the end, my take is that whether someone is enlightened or not, I 
don't want to hang out with them nor do I admire them, if they don't resonate 
with my own set of values.  But they could stlll be enlightened.  Whatever was 
going on with Maharishi, he had incredible darshan, it was physically palpable. 
 He promoted a good technique, imo and he clarified the whole concept of 
evolution, stress, and human functioning.  
 
>From a different angle, it really seems as if there is no free will in the 
>traditional sense (and the sense of I is an illusion). Things happen and 
>unfold.  If you accept that, then things really can't be other than they are.  
>So if a Master does something someone else considers "bad" or immoral, then 
>that too is part of the unfolding of life. This is basically that old argument 
>that a Master or enlightened person can do no wrong.  In a sense, no one can 
>do anything other than what happens. We are all flowing with Nature  I am 
>guessing that being enlightened reduces the sense of tension that comes with 
>an ego, but things stay pretty much the same in terms of actions.

So, being able to enlighten someone or teach them about it is a pretty big 
gift, and so I do respect MMY - warts and all.   I imagine that most leaders 
had lots of warts too.  I still like to believe that there are some saints and 
Masters (these folks are somehow always in the past and so we can't check up on 
them!) who are perfect and loving and Enlightened. That those stories are all 
true.  Probably that is a human need, maybe a belief we begin to question as we 
grow up.  That questioning process, which your friend is in the midst of, can 
be hard and sad.  Believing fully is a nice state and for me, gave a magical 
spin to everything.  Enough. 



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson  wrote:
>
> OK, in keeping with Buck's theory of FFL posts being in some way about FFL, I 
> have an offering, based on the tenuous fact of past habitation in FF and at 
> the mighty Maharishi U.
> 
> I have a friend who is a dedicated TM meditator (sidha actually) whom I met 
> at my local TM center here almost 40 years ago. We worked together on staff 
> for the team of governors who taught the sidhis here in both North and South 
> Carolina yea those many years ago. 
> 
> 
> This friend is not only a devout TM meditator, but a devout Christian with 
> strong Christian valu

[FairfieldLife] Re: Post Count Sat 24-Aug-13 00:15:10 UTC

[Susan]

Actually, i meant pretty much what Barry said, and I was not including Barry in 
the posts that I don't read.  I do skip his posts where he generalizes about 
TB's at FFL. I also skip most of the posts of several other people for the 
reasons I stated. I find many of Barry's posts really interesting.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
> > >
> > > I'm sure the Reverend Turq will have something to say 
> > > in his morning sermon about this weeks winners. ;-)
> > 
> > Not really. I think wayback covered it sufficiently
> > with her suggestion that people learn from their 
> > previous experience and just not bother reading any
> > of the posts by people who you already know won't
> > have anything to say.
> 
> Ah, but that wasn't what she said, now, was it, Barry?
> 
> Here's what she said:
> 
> "Agreed that a huge percentage of posts here are ad hominum,
> and usually made by the same people over and over and over.
> I think they enjoy that type of interaction, thrive on it
> even. Not my style, though. And not at all the way things
> used to be here, as you know. One solution is not to read
> them. At all. Works for me."
> 
> Which means she doesn't read *your* posts, Barry, and
> that you've just suggested to FFLers that *they* not
> read your posts.
> 
> OOOopsie.
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Eliminating the Ad hominem Post-count on FFL.

[Susan]

Also, how is the weather out there this summer?  Las  Was this summer more 
typical weather, hotter than normal, what?

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson  wrote:
>
> Buck, how is the lambing and calving and plowing and so forth going?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  From: Buck 
> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> Sent: Friday, August 23, 2013 11:06 AM
> Subject: [FairfieldLife] Eliminating the Ad hominem Post-count on FFL.
>  
> 
> 
>   
> Dear Rick, the post-count experiment as a noble hope is clearly failing.  The 
> lowest form of writing and argument evidently dominates FFL with their 
> diluting flood of the post-count of FFL.  As an elder of the FFL community 
> here I implore you Rick, please save our FFL from the lowest form of argument 
> on FFL, the Ad hominem .  These people's abuse of the list and community here 
> with the Ad hominem is too much.  Something radical, something different 
> needs to be done to save FFL as a spiritual and free place.
> Sincerely,
> -Buck
>

[FairfieldLife] HAPPINESS: hedonic and higher purpose types and our genes

[Susan]

Interesting article on the biology of how different types of happiness affect 
us physically.

http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/08/23/what-our-genes-reveal-about-true-happiness/?ref=health

[FairfieldLife] Re: Eliminating the Ad hominem Post-count on FFL.

[Susan]

Agreed that a huge percentage of posts here are ad hominum, and usually made by 
the same people over and over and over.  I think they enjoy that type of 
interaction, thrive on it even.  Not my style, though.  And not at all the way 
things used to be here, as you know.  One solution is not to read them.  At 
all.  Works for me.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
>
> Dear Rick, the post-count experiment as a noble hope is clearly failing.  The 
> lowest form of writing and argument evidently dominates FFL with their 
> diluting flood of the post-count of FFL.  As an elder of the FFL community 
> here I implore you Rick, please save our FFL from the lowest form of argument 
> on FFL, the Ad hominem .  These people's abuse of the list and community here 
> with the Ad hominem is too much.  Something radical, something different 
> needs to be done to save FFL as a spiritual and free place.
> Sincerely,
> -Buck
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Perceptive film review

[Susan]

Should you need a place to stayI have not stayed there, but friends 
have stayed at the the Kimberly Hotel in Manhattan.  Reasonable (for NYC) rates 
and a top of the building that has spectacular views.  I think you can eat or 
have drinks up there.

The Indian food area is at about Lexington Avenue and say 24-28th Streets.  I 
doubt you will get anything as good as your local spot.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "seventhray27"  wrote:
>
> 
> Thank you so much!
> 
> And yes to the Indian Food.
> 
> Speaking of Indian Food, we are fortunate to have the most fabulous
> Indian/Nepalese restaurant close by.  Usually once a week my wife will
> pick up some Matar Panir for the family.  It is always perfectly spiced.
> 
> And how can it be that naan from one place can seem so much better than
> from another place?
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan" wrote:
> >
> > At Grand Central, be sure to look up at the huge vaulted ceiling with
> constellations painted on it. Lots of shops and small restauntsts right
> there, too. Another interesting place, if you like Italian food, is
> called Eataly. Near Macy's and Herald Square. It is a huge indoor space
> filled with various vendors of Italian food items: olive oil, sauces,
> fresh made pastas, cookbooks, and several types of Italian restaurants
> (one if all vegetarian and lots of greens and salads, one has terrificf
> resh pizza, etc)
> > There is a section on Manhattan that has many Indian restaurants if
> you like that.
> >
> > Lincoln Center is a good place to attend a concert if anything good is
> in town then.
> > Himalayan Art: The Rubin Museum
> > Old Masters: The Frick (in gorgeous old palazzo style building) or Met
> Museum of Art
> > Some museums are pricey, including the Museum of Nat History and
> Frick.
> >
> > Dance: The Joyce theater has reasonable prices for modern dance
> troupes from around the world.
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@ wrote:
> > >
> > > Even if your travel plans don't require you to go there, don't miss
> > > Grand Central Terminal. I *love* that place. You can just find a
> > > bench or a bar seat overlooking the main plaza and just *watch*
> > > people, and it's one of the best zoos on earth.
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "seventhray27" wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Couple things come to mind.
> > > > I read an article recently that described excessive noise
> pollution in
> > > > NYC, almost at all hours. I mean, I know that has been an issue,
> even
> > > > 35 years ago when I was stranded there one night, and a woman took
> me
> > > > in. I remember hearing all the noise some 12 stories below.
> > > > But it must have gotten quite a bit worse, which was the gist of
> this
> > > > article. It wasn't so much the noise during normal hours, but
> rather
> > > > the early morning and late night noise.
> > > > On another note, I am going to Boston for a business vendor show
> in a
> > > > week or so, and then meeting my daughter, and we are going to
> visit
> > > NYC
> > > > for late afternoon, evening one day and a full day following.
> > > > I didn't know if anyone had any suggestions on how to maximize the
> > > > "feel" on a short visit like this.
> > > > On the full day, I was thinking we might take a 40 minute boat
> ride to
> > > > see the Statue of Liberty and make our way up, via walking, to the
> > > World
> > > > Trade Center sight, walk through China Town up to Times Square and
> > > then
> > > > taxi up to Rockefeller Center and Central Park and take in a few
> of
> > > the
> > > > shopping avenues.
> > > > But I'd love to hear any suggestions if anyone has any.
> > > > Thanks.
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Share Long wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > I only visited NYC once, with some friends when I was 16. We
> really
> > > > wanted to visit Greenwich Village and pretend to be like Mary. No,
> not
> > > > the Virgin Mary though we were a bunch of good Catholic girls!
> Mary as
> > > > in Peter, Paul and Mary. That was almost 50 years ago and I
> remember
> > > > loving the vibe there. Not sure how it would feel to me now.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > &

[FairfieldLife] Re: Perceptive film review

[Susan]

At Grand Central, be sure to look up at the huge vaulted ceiling with 
constellations painted on it. Lots of shops and small restauntsts right there, 
too. Another interesting place, if you like Italian food, is called Eataly.  
Near Macy's and Herald Square.  It is a huge indoor space filled with various 
vendors of Italian food items: olive oil, sauces, fresh made pastas, cookbooks, 
and several types of Italian restaurants (one if all vegetarian and lots of 
greens and salads, one has terrificf resh pizza, etc)
There is a section on Manhattan that has many Indian restaurants if you like 
that.

Lincoln Center is a good place to attend a concert if anything good is in town 
then.
Himalayan Art: The Rubin Museum
Old Masters:  The Frick (in gorgeous old palazzo style building) or Met Museum 
of Art
Some museums are pricey, including the Museum of Nat History and Frick.

Dance: The Joyce theater has reasonable prices for modern dance troupes from 
around the world.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
>
> Even if your travel plans don't require you to go there, don't miss
> Grand Central Terminal. I *love* that place. You can just find a
> bench or a bar seat overlooking the main plaza and just *watch*
> people, and it's one of the best zoos on earth.
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "seventhray27"  wrote:
> >
> > Couple things come to mind.
> > I read an article recently that described excessive noise pollution in
> > NYC, almost at all hours.  I mean, I know that has been an issue, even
> > 35 years ago when I was stranded there one night, and a woman took me
> > in.  I remember hearing all the noise some 12 stories below.
> > But it must have gotten quite a bit worse, which was the gist of this
> > article.  It wasn't so much the noise during normal hours, but rather
> > the early morning and late night noise.
> > On another note, I am going to Boston for a business vendor show in a
> > week or so, and then meeting my daughter, and we are going to visit
> NYC
> > for late afternoon, evening one day and a full day following.
> > I didn't know if anyone had any suggestions on how to maximize the
> > "feel" on a short visit like this.
> > On the full day, I was thinking we might take a 40 minute boat ride to
> > see the Statue of Liberty and make our way up, via walking, to the
> World
> > Trade Center sight, walk through China Town up to Times Square and
> then
> > taxi up to  Rockefeller Center and Central Park and take in a few of
> the
> > shopping avenues.
> > But I'd love to hear any suggestions if anyone has any.
> > Thanks.
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Share Long  wrote:
> > >
> > > I only visited NYC once, with some friends when I was 16. We really
> > wanted to visit Greenwich Village and pretend to be like Mary. No, not
> > the Virgin Mary though we were a bunch of good Catholic girls! Mary as
> > in Peter, Paul and Mary. That was almost 50 years ago and I remember
> > loving the vibe there. Not sure how it would feel to me now.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > 
> > >  From: turquoiseb no_re...@yahoogroups.com
> > > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> > > Sent: Sunday, August 11, 2013 6:55 AM
> > > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Perceptive film review
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Â
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Share Long sharelong60@ wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Thanks, turq, looks thought provoking and yes, revolutionary.
> > > > Reminds me of a Star Trek episode wherein the wealthy lived
> > > > on a cloud that floated above the planet where the poor
> > > > worked in mines whose toxic fumes lowered their intelligence.
> > >
> > > You mean Manhattan? Where the rich live in penthouses
> > > far above the rabble, and feed them lies that keep them
> > > pacified, like "Americans have the best lifestyle
> > > in the world" or "You live in a democracy?"  :-)
> > >
> > > > 
> > > >  From: turquoiseb no_re...@yahoogroups.com
> > > > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> > > > Sent: Sunday, August 11, 2013 5:18 AM
> > > > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Perceptive film review
> > > >
> > > > Very. Hollywood, which despite the claims of conservatives
> > > > shies away from overtly liberal movies, has poured $100 million
> > > > into the production of a film that has been called by those who
> > > > have seen it "a futuristic version of Occupy Wall Street."
> > > >
> > > >
> >
> http://motherboard.vice.com/blog/elysium-science-fiction-tricked-hollywo\
> \
> > od-into-making-the-years-most-radical-film Reply to sender  Reply to
> > group  Start a New Topic Messages in this topic (1)
> > > > Recent Activity:  * New Members 1
> > > > Visit Your Group
> > > > To subscribe, send a message to:
> > > > fairfieldlife-subscr...@yahoogroups.com
> > > >
> > > > Or go to:
> > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/
> > > > and click 'Join This Group!'
> > > >
> > > > Switch to: Text-Only, Daily Digest • 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Post Count Fri 09-Aug-13 00:15:05 UTC

[Susan]

Hey Buck,
Sweet meditations to you.  I have not checked in to FFL for the last month or 
so. It became clear and amazing just how much time can get gobbled up here. I 
checked back in a few days ago and found it helps to be very selective about 
not only who you read but how often you scan the posts. Try that approach when 
you return.
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
>
> I'll be leaving soon once the whole mob is back and takes over FFL in only a 
> few hours now.  Send me e-mail notice if any more good first hand 
> reminiscence accounts of TM history get posted.  You know, like from someone 
> who was actually there when something happened.  
> 
> It was FFL,  "And, I don't care to stay here long".  
> -Buck in the Dome
>   
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, obbajeeba  wrote:
> >
> > Ravi!  They are on to us  but, in due time, we will have the full
> > use of FFL Yahoo Groups, soon, if I don't post out tonight.
> > 
> >   If I do, and can't continue for another week,  I sent you the ammo;
> >   You know, ;)  all those burlesque costume, Victoria's Secret style
> > pictures without the facial recognition.
> > Stop blushing.  I am serious!   These FFLer's have no clue if I am
> > bullshitting or not. Hee hee. Shhh. (I'll bet you get at least 4 private
> > emails asking about the "pictures.")
> > 
> > Hmm. Maybe we could work  an auction to get the FFL Yahoo Group moved to
> > a proper forum? Then we wouldn't be asked to cut and snip, snip, snip
> > all the time.
> >   There could be a "locked," section for those wishing to divulge in
> > Tantric sex and stuff.  Maybe even a Tequilla sponsored section for Dr.
> > Dumbass?
> > Buck could have his own bucking the system of the downed. Poor fellow.
> > He really means well.  WE NEED BUCK!
> > Turq could have his very own Amsterdam window shop. Full figure view of
> > him typing in the nude (I don't see why not? He is a silly little 
> > Euro-peon.) from a three legged wood stool. ;)
> > 
> > In the movie, "Idiocracy," Upgrayedd is a pimp. Yeah. We could Upgrayedd
> > this board, Kali Pimp's style.  Some naysayer's may nay at the idea and
> > scuff their feet and some other reactions too.
> > 
> >   This sweet salty lassi, may have just the plan to really get this ball
> > rolling. It is our chance to hijack the hole and nip it in the bud, Bud.
> > ET COME HOME, NOW!
> > 
> >   If anyone degrades this most brilliant diabolic plan, ask them, "Oh
> > Yeah?  Which part of  the Sama Veda
> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1ODd0UB6bY
> > <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1ODd0UB6bY>   talks about HIM HIM HIM
> > HO HO HO HUNG HUNG HUNG? "   And see if they can continue to distrust
> > this SuperKalifragilelickstick coming to the age of enlightenment?
> > Darn, the link's content did not have the, "HIM, HIM, HIM, HO, HO, HO,
> > HUNG, HUNG, HUNG on it. But my husband would get tugged on when that
> > part wood play in the resting time of that particular part of the Sama
> > Veda. :)
> > 
> > We have no time to waste, Ravi. Line them babies up and ready to roll,
> > one at a time, all day long. Jerry Lewis Telethon Style!
> > 
> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cnPlJxet_ac
> > <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cnPlJxet_ac>
> > 
> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqffk_pxGKQ
> > <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqffk_pxGKQ>
> > 
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > I had so much more that I wanted to share with you.
> > >
> > > Right up yonder, Meditators away up yonder;
> > > Om, yes, my Lord, for I don't care to stay here long.
> > > "I'm glad that I am born to die,
> > > From grief and woe my soul shall fly,
> > > And I don't care to stay here long!"
> > > -Buck
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Om, comes The dilution; It is now less than 24 hours before our
> > civil leadership fails and mob rule on FFL.  It is a sad ending.
> > > > -Buck
> > > >
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, FFL PostCount  wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Fairfield Life Post Counter
> > > > > ===
> > > > > Start Date (UTC): 08/03/13 00:00:00
> > > > > End Date (UTC): 08/10/13 00:00:00
> > > > > 693 messages as of (UTC) 08/09/13 00:0

[FairfieldLife] Re: The TV Sutras

[Susan]

Barry W, I found the third season of The Killing to be really excellent.   A 
terrific performance by Peter Saarsgard. Two movies you might like:  The Sound 
of My Voice with Britt Marling and also I am Love with Tilda Swinton.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
>
> 
> On 08/06/2013 12:24 PM, RoryGoff wrote:
> > Sorry to hear that about Mad Men; I have been enjoying it hugely thus 
> > far... I LOVE how beautifully it illuminates the dysfunctional 60's -- all 
> > this time I thought it was only my Dad who pulled that kind of stuff! :-) A 
> > very healing show for me.
> 
> My brother was from that era and I've been amused with the show and how 
> true to the period it is.  This last season started showing how some 
> corporations that were actually family owned and run businesses started 
> becoming publicly held ones.  And of course this last season the agency 
> was considering going public which is a game changer and was actually 
> discussed on one of the ad agency blogs.
> 
> FYI, the 3rd season of "The Killing" finished Sunday and it will be 
> available on Netflix streaming shortly because Netflix partially 
> financed the third season.
> 
> The second season of "Continuum" has been very good and this last 
> episode very revealing.  It too may show up after completion on Netflix 
> as did the first season.
> 
> 
> >
> > As to Copper, yeah, I confess to being a total sucker for 
> > relatively-well-done historical pieces. The Borgia shows (both versions) 
> > were a lot of fun, too. My all-time favorite TV show is still probably 
> > Deadwood.
> 
> The first season of Copper seemed to be more relevant historically but I 
> lost interest in the second season.  Ripper Street had more fun with 
> it's historical perspective mainly because it takes in a period a great 
> change.  Broadchurch is another BBC drama which debuts tomorrow night on 
> BBC American though the first episode is free without commercials from 
> their website:
> http://www.bbcamerica.com/broadchurch/videos/s1-premiere-episode/
> 
> Turq is a fan of  Stephen King and this years Kingfest is "The Dome" on 
> CBS.  It's been a good show so far.  Folks in Los Angeles and other 
> cities with Time Warner Cable are a little miffed with the spat between 
> CBS and TWC as CBS and Showtime are now missing from the lineup.  No 
> "Dexter" or "The Dome" for them.  And I have been enjoying Showtime's 
> "Ray Donovan" too which got better after the pilot episode.  Paula 
> Malcomson, who played Trixie in Deadwood, plays the wife of Ray Donovan 
> who is played by Liev Schreiber.  The cast also include Jon Voigt, 
> Elliot Gould and James Woods.
> 
> Netflix streaming is a bit iffy around here lately.  I have 12 mbps 
> broadband but last night trying to finish an episode of "Orange is the 
> New Black" I got about 10 minutes in and then it would start rebuffering 
> and give me an SD version for about 30 seconds then back to HD.  It did 
> that  several times more but towards the end I had to give up because it 
> would rebuffer every 30 seconds only give a low quality SD stream.
> 
> Apparently the problem is that many of the telecoms are dragging their 
> feet with upgrades to a kinda service link so more customers can have 
> high bandwidth service.  But we paid for our Netflix and we paid for our 
> broadband and we want it.  If this doesn't get resolved we want Congress 
> to look into it.  Some of this problem will go away come September when 
> kids are back in school and going to Friday night football etc instead 
> of staying home and watching Netflix.
> 
> 
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
> >> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "RoryGoff"  wrote:
> >>> Hey, Barry! Rena and I watch only Netflix now, no TV,
> >>> so we are a year or more behind on all shows. True
> >>> Blood and Dexter are among our favorites; I am also
> >>> quite fond of Breaking Bad, Mad Men, and Copper.
> >> I skipped "Mad Men" this season, because I just
> >> couldn't work up any honest *caring* about any
> >> of the characters. But I'm glad you mentioned
> >> "Copper," because I forgot that one. I watched
> >> the first three episodes of the second season,
> >> but then forgot to download the rest. I'll
> >> rectify that situation.
> >>
> >>> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
>  One of the things that has suffered because of this Paris
>  gig has been my ability to keep up with TV series I once
>  watched near-religiously. I purposefully haven't even
>  bothered to start watching "Continuum" or the US versions
>  of "The Killing" (season 3) or "The Bridge," because I
>  knew I wouldn't have time for them.
> 
>  I did watch season three of the excellent UK series "Luther,"
>  and found it as good as the previous two. In my household,
>  a mighty cheer went up when one favorite character from the
>  previous two seasons reappeared. :-)
> 

[FairfieldLife] Re: For Rick and others: Pro nuclear power documentary

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
>
> On 08/05/2013 01:33 PM, Susan wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
> >>>> On 08/04/2013 08:18 PM, Susan wrote:
> >>>>> I just saw Pandora's Promise, by Robert Stone, an environmentalist who 
> >>>>> has in the past been active in anti-nuclear energy protests.  He got 
> >>>>> convinced otherwise and has made this docu.  It features info and also 
> >>>>> interviews with several environmentalists who have educated themselves 
> >>>>> and changed their minds about nuclear energy.  Stuart Brand (Whole 
> >>>>> Earth catalogue) is one and so is Mark Lynas, who wrote the book Six 
> >>>>> Degrees in 2007.  I have mentioned that book here several times - 
> >>>>> terrific and accessible read about climate change.  Lynas was anti 
> >>>>> nuclear for years - and now changed his mind.  A worthwhile movie to 
> >>>>> see - and while I am not at all an expert on nuclear power, it made a 
> >>>>> really good case for the positives.  It also seems that there is a type 
> >>>>> of nuclear power (IFR) that produces waste that is recyclable by the 
> >>>>> nuclear plant itself. The safeguards on these are also incredible.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>> I grew up near the Hanford Nuclear Reservation which is now having a
> >>>> terrible time with all the waste that facility generated. Nuclear energy
> >>>> is NOT a very good idea.  And when you let profit hungry big
> >>>> corporations run the show the problem gets worse.
> >>>>
> >>>> Right now the problems facing this world are from one thing: too large a
> >>>> human population.  This needs to be addressed humanly through one child
> >>>> programs etc.  We could probably survive and enjoy life with a much
> >>>> lower supply of electrical energy and still keep a lot of the technology
> >>>> we have today.  The problem is the every man for himself atmosphere that
> >>>> laissez faire capitalism promotes.  That keeps excessive consumption
> >>>> alive just so some bunch can keep making money.  How insane!
> >>>>
> >>> And can you actually imagine western nations enforcing a one child 
> >>> policy? This is wishful thinking, even if a terrific solution.  On a long 
> >>> drive recently I listened to Dan Brown's new novel, Inferno. Not a very 
> >>> well written book. But..Plot spoiler alert from this point on:  The 
> >>> plot is about a scientist and others who feel that they must do something 
> >>> drastic to reduce earth's population or else we are going to be extinct 
> >>> due to damage to the planet.  Via terrorist means, they plan to introduce 
> >>> into the atmosphere a virus that renders about 1/3 of the people who 
> >>> breathe it infertile.
> >>> In real life, there are apparently groups out there who are hoping for 
> >>> some event or epidemic or something to reduce our numbers and save us 
> >>> from ourselves.
> >> OK, spoiler here
> >

> >> And I have other friends who have chosen not  to have children at all in
> >> spite of the fact that they are very bright people.  It's the religious
> >> fundamentalists who have still having large families obviously because
> >> their emotions drive them more than reason.
> > And also the billions of people in other countries who have many children.
> 
> And they do that because they want at least one child to survive to take 
> care of them in old life.  Do some kind of program like Social Security 
> for the and the problem goes away.  Also more education for women in 
> developing countries is essential for keeping the birth rate down.
> 
> >
> > My soon to be married son is seriously considering not having children due 
> > to what he expects the future to be like. I would love grandchildren and we 
> > humans seem to be pack animals, but I can understand his concerns. This is 
> > not something we thought of back in the 70's and 80's.
> >> BTW, a few months back I found a copy of a Chinese newspaper delivered
> >> here and to all houses in the neighborhood.   The ad on the front page
> >> celebrated the single child policy.  Of course folks from China are
> >> coming over on tours to buy houses in the US.
> 

[FairfieldLife] Re: For Rick and others: Pro nuclear power documentary

[Susan]

I forgot to mention that thorium was mentioned, briefly, in Pandora's Promise.  
The docu needs a followup with pros and cons of various approaches and what we 
can realistically do going forward and how much various technologies could 
contribute to energy needs..

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
>
> Thorium - interesting - will follow this.
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, obbajeeba  wrote:
> >
> > http://www.smartplanet.com/blog/intelligent-energy/safe-nuclear-indias-thorium-reactor/15707
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Archer"  wrote:
> > >
> > > Has anyone mentioned this?:
> > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liquid_fluoride_thorium_reactor
> > > 
> > >  
> > > 
> > >  
> > > 
> > >  
> > > 
> > > From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com]
> > > On Behalf Of Susan
> > > Sent: Monday, August 05, 2013 10:09 AM
> > > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> > > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: For Rick and others: Pro nuclear power
> > > documentary
> > > 
> > >  
> > > 
> > >   
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> > > <mailto:FairfieldLife%40yahoogroups.com> , "salyavin808"
> > > mailto:fintlewoodlewix@> > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> > > <mailto:FairfieldLife%40yahoogroups.com> , "Susan"  wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > I just saw Pandora's Promise, by Robert Stone, an environmentalist who
> > > has in the past been active in anti-nuclear energy protests. He got
> > > convinced otherwise and has made this docu. It features info and also
> > > interviews with several environmentalists who have educated themselves and
> > > changed their minds about nuclear energy. Stuart Brand (Whole Earth
> > > catalogue) is one and so is Mark Lynas, who wrote the book Six Degrees in
> > > 2007. I have mentioned that book here several times - terrific and
> > > accessible read about climate change. Lynas was anti nuclear for years - 
> > > and
> > > now changed his mind. A worthwhile movie to see - and while I am not at 
> > > all
> > > an expert on nuclear power, it made a really good case for the positives. 
> > > It
> > > also seems that there is a type of nuclear power (IFR) that produces waste
> > > that is recyclable by the nuclear plant itself. The safeguards on these 
> > > are
> > > also incredible.
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > These pro nuclear environmentalists make me laugh, I think they
> > > > come from a place where we absolutely *have* to keep consuming
> > > > power at the insane rate we have for the last hundred years and
> > > > that cutting back on consumption isn't a plausible option.
> > > 
> > > The docu mentions this problem. It seems that the pro-nuclear
> > > environmentalists have become rather practical. First, they don't believe
> > > that cutting back is an option - that to think that our own Western
> > > populations will cut back is a pipe dream. It might be smart and the right
> > > thing to do, but it won't happen. And seond, for us to expect the 
> > > developing
> > > nations to not have what we have - cars, unlimited energy - it not "fair"
> > > and also is not happening. China and India and Brazil are moving full 
> > > steam
> > > ahead and will use whatever energy source is around. Second, they feel 
> > > that
> > > given that our demands for energy will not be dropping, we cannot just 
> > > count
> > > on water, wind and solar sources. Anything that helps is good, but those
> > > systems simply will not solve the problem anytime soon. We are running out
> > > of time, and to wait for other types of energy is wishful thinking for 
> > > now.
> > > > 
> > > > The sad fact about nuclear power is that we don't have enough
> > > > uranium on this planet to outlast the coal supply should we
> > > > switch wholesale and build more reactors. 
> > > > 
> > > > Then there's terrorism, if al queda had been smart they would have
> > > > flown the 9/11 planes into a nuclear reactor (but don't give them
> > > > ideas) and 

[FairfieldLife] Re: For Rick and others: Pro nuclear power documentary

[Susan]

Thorium - interesting - will follow this.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, obbajeeba  wrote:
>
> http://www.smartplanet.com/blog/intelligent-energy/safe-nuclear-indias-thorium-reactor/15707
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Archer"  wrote:
> >
> > Has anyone mentioned this?:
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liquid_fluoride_thorium_reactor
> > 
> >  
> > 
> >  
> > 
> >  
> > 
> > From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com]
> > On Behalf Of Susan
> > Sent: Monday, August 05, 2013 10:09 AM
> > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: For Rick and others: Pro nuclear power
> > documentary
> > 
> >  
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> > <mailto:FairfieldLife%40yahoogroups.com> , "salyavin808"
> > mailto:fintlewoodlewix@> > wrote:
> > >
> > > 
> > > 
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> > <mailto:FairfieldLife%40yahoogroups.com> , "Susan"  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > I just saw Pandora's Promise, by Robert Stone, an environmentalist who
> > has in the past been active in anti-nuclear energy protests. He got
> > convinced otherwise and has made this docu. It features info and also
> > interviews with several environmentalists who have educated themselves and
> > changed their minds about nuclear energy. Stuart Brand (Whole Earth
> > catalogue) is one and so is Mark Lynas, who wrote the book Six Degrees in
> > 2007. I have mentioned that book here several times - terrific and
> > accessible read about climate change. Lynas was anti nuclear for years - and
> > now changed his mind. A worthwhile movie to see - and while I am not at all
> > an expert on nuclear power, it made a really good case for the positives. It
> > also seems that there is a type of nuclear power (IFR) that produces waste
> > that is recyclable by the nuclear plant itself. The safeguards on these are
> > also incredible.
> > > 
> > > 
> > > These pro nuclear environmentalists make me laugh, I think they
> > > come from a place where we absolutely *have* to keep consuming
> > > power at the insane rate we have for the last hundred years and
> > > that cutting back on consumption isn't a plausible option.
> > 
> > The docu mentions this problem. It seems that the pro-nuclear
> > environmentalists have become rather practical. First, they don't believe
> > that cutting back is an option - that to think that our own Western
> > populations will cut back is a pipe dream. It might be smart and the right
> > thing to do, but it won't happen. And seond, for us to expect the developing
> > nations to not have what we have - cars, unlimited energy - it not "fair"
> > and also is not happening. China and India and Brazil are moving full steam
> > ahead and will use whatever energy source is around. Second, they feel that
> > given that our demands for energy will not be dropping, we cannot just count
> > on water, wind and solar sources. Anything that helps is good, but those
> > systems simply will not solve the problem anytime soon. We are running out
> > of time, and to wait for other types of energy is wishful thinking for now.
> > > 
> > > The sad fact about nuclear power is that we don't have enough
> > > uranium on this planet to outlast the coal supply should we
> > > switch wholesale and build more reactors. 
> > > 
> > > Then there's terrorism, if al queda had been smart they would have
> > > flown the 9/11 planes into a nuclear reactor (but don't give them
> > > ideas) and then there is the black market in dirty plutonium, so
> > > simple to make a dirty bomb, drive it into a major city and
> > > It's just bound to happen sooner or later.
> > > 
> > > But the real disaster is waste, I have heard of these fast breeder
> > > reactors but I'm not even sure they have been demonstrated to work very
> > well and they do still create a small amount of waste and it
> > > becomes much more toxic than the 11,000,000 barrels of stuff we
> > > have lying around the UK waiting to be buried. 
> > 
> > I don't know, but in the docu they said that these reactors had been around
> > since the late 40's. A decision was made at that time by Rickover (sp?) to
> > go with the other incredibly more polluting systems in building power pla

[FairfieldLife] Re: For Rick and others: Pro nuclear power documentary

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
>

> >> On 08/04/2013 08:18 PM, Susan wrote:
> >>> I just saw Pandora's Promise, by Robert Stone, an environmentalist who 
> >>> has in the past been active in anti-nuclear energy protests.  He got 
> >>> convinced otherwise and has made this docu.  It features info and also 
> >>> interviews with several environmentalists who have educated themselves 
> >>> and changed their minds about nuclear energy.  Stuart Brand (Whole Earth 
> >>> catalogue) is one and so is Mark Lynas, who wrote the book Six Degrees in 
> >>> 2007.  I have mentioned that book here several times - terrific and 
> >>> accessible read about climate change.  Lynas was anti nuclear for years - 
> >>> and now changed his mind.  A worthwhile movie to see - and while I am not 
> >>> at all an expert on nuclear power, it made a really good case for the 
> >>> positives.  It also seems that there is a type of nuclear power (IFR) 
> >>> that produces waste that is recyclable by the nuclear plant itself. The 
> >>> safeguards on these are also incredible.
> >>>
> >>>
> >> I grew up near the Hanford Nuclear Reservation which is now having a
> >> terrible time with all the waste that facility generated. Nuclear energy
> >> is NOT a very good idea.  And when you let profit hungry big
> >> corporations run the show the problem gets worse.
> >>
> >> Right now the problems facing this world are from one thing: too large a
> >> human population.  This needs to be addressed humanly through one child
> >> programs etc.  We could probably survive and enjoy life with a much
> >> lower supply of electrical energy and still keep a lot of the technology
> >> we have today.  The problem is the every man for himself atmosphere that
> >> laissez faire capitalism promotes.  That keeps excessive consumption
> >> alive just so some bunch can keep making money.  How insane!
> >>
> > And can you actually imagine western nations enforcing a one child policy? 
> > This is wishful thinking, even if a terrific solution.  On a long drive 
> > recently I listened to Dan Brown's new novel, Inferno. Not a very well 
> > written book. But..Plot spoiler alert from this point on:  The plot is 
> > about a scientist and others who feel that they must do something drastic 
> > to reduce earth's population or else we are going to be extinct due to 
> > damage to the planet.  Via terrorist means, they plan to introduce into the 
> > atmosphere a virus that renders about 1/3 of the people who breathe it 
> > infertile.
> > In real life, there are apparently groups out there who are hoping for some 
> > event or epidemic or something to reduce our numbers and save us from 
> > ourselves.
> 
> OK, spoiler here
> 
> but the UK Channel 4 TV series we chatted about here, "Utopia" was about 
> that.  I even told some folks I was playing the first episode for to pay 
> attention to the opening newscast, it lays out the whole thing.  Most 
> people wouldn't pay that strict attention as they think that the 
> newscast is just background sound.  BTW, HBO bought the rights to that 
> series and is producing a US version which may well be watered down and 
> probably not it the nice "scope" aspect ratio that the UK versions was 
> shown.

I missed this show and the discussion here.  Will check it out.
> 
> I've wondered if a virus were produced to stop pregnancy and then 5 
> years later an antidote found if people would still want to have 
> children?  Let's face it, having children is more of a romantic or 
> emotional thing except of course for "mistakes."   A friend and his wife 
> just had their first child and probably only child.  He is in his 40s 
> and was an only child.  I did the horoscope which showed nothing but 
> weak planets (oh well, my horoscope is like that too). But I kept 
> thinking, "poor kid, I sure wouldn't want to be born into this world the 
> state it is in."
> 
> And I have other friends who have chosen not  to have children at all in 
> spite of the fact that they are very bright people.  It's the religious 
> fundamentalists who have still having large families obviously because 
> their emotions drive them more than reason.

And also the billions of people in other countries who have many children.

My soon to be married son is seriously considering not having children due to 
what he expects the future to be like. I would love grandchildren and we humans 
seem to be 

[FairfieldLife] Re: For Rick and others: Pro nuclear power documentary

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson  wrote:
>
> We have 4 nucler (NOO-kyuh-luhr) power plants here in SC with a total of 7 
> reactors.
> 
> They have been around so long we don't take much notice of them. 
> 
> Every now and then you might have to swerve your car real fast to avoid 
> hitting an eight legged cow sized frog that comes out of the swamps nearby 
> the reactor, but the nucler place generally pays your damages, so its no big 
> deal.
> 
> Barnwell Nuclear facility here in SC used to store waste for the entire 
> country, now only for connecticut, new jersy, and SC itself. Most of the rest 
> goes to Hanford. 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  From: Bhairitu 
> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> Sent: Monday, August 5, 2013 12:14 PM
> Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] For Rick and others: Pro nuclear power 
> documentary
>  
> 
> 
>   
> On 08/04/2013 08:18 PM, Susan wrote:
> > I just saw Pandora's Promise, by Robert Stone, an environmentalist who has 
> > in the past been active in anti-nuclear energy protests.  He got convinced 
> > otherwise and has made this docu.  It features info and also interviews 
> > with several environmentalists who have educated themselves and changed 
> > their minds about nuclear energy.  Stuart Brand (Whole Earth catalogue) is 
> > one and so is Mark Lynas, who wrote the book Six Degrees in 2007.  I have 
> > mentioned that book here several times - terrific and accessible read about 
> > climate change.  Lynas was anti nuclear for years - and now changed his 
> > mind.  A worthwhile movie to see - and while I am not at all an expert on 
> > nuclear power, it made a really good case for the positives.  It also seems 
> > that there is a type of nuclear power (IFR) that produces waste that is 
> > recyclable by the nuclear plant itself. The safeguards on these are also 
> > incredible.
> >
> >
> 
> I grew up near the Hanford Nuclear Reservation which is now having a 
> terrible time with all the waste that facility generated. Nuclear energy 
> is NOT a very good idea.  And when you let profit hungry big 
> corporations run the show the problem gets worse.
> 
> Right now the problems facing this world are from one thing: too large a 
> human population.  This needs to be addressed humanly through one child 
> programs etc.  We could probably survive and enjoy life with a much 
> lower supply of electrical energy and still keep a lot of the technology 
> we have today.  The problem is the every man for himself atmosphere that 
> laissez faire capitalism promotes.  That keeps excessive consumption 
> alive just so some bunch can keep making money.  How insane!
>

And can you actually imagine western nations enforcing a one child policy? This 
is wishful thinking, even if a terrific solution.  On a long drive recently I 
listened to Dan Brown's new novel, Inferno. Not a very well written book. 
But..Plot spoiler alert from this point on:  The plot is about a scientist 
and others who feel that they must do something drastic to reduce earth's 
population or else we are going to be extinct due to damage to the planet.  Via 
terrorist means, they plan to introduce into the atmosphere a virus that 
renders about 1/3 of the people who breathe it infertile.  
In real life, there are apparently groups out there who are hoping for some 
event or epidemic or something to reduce our numbers and save us from ourselves.

[FairfieldLife] Re: For Rick and others: Pro nuclear power documentary

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "salyavin808"  wrote:
>
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> >
> > I just saw Pandora's Promise, by Robert Stone, an environmentalist who has 
> > in the past been active in anti-nuclear energy protests.  He got convinced 
> > otherwise and has made this docu.  It features info and also interviews 
> > with several environmentalists who have educated themselves and changed 
> > their minds about nuclear energy.  Stuart Brand (Whole Earth catalogue) is 
> > one and so is Mark Lynas, who wrote the book Six Degrees in 2007.  I have 
> > mentioned that book here several times - terrific and accessible read about 
> > climate change.  Lynas was anti nuclear for years - and now changed his 
> > mind.  A worthwhile movie to see - and while I am not at all an expert on 
> > nuclear power, it made a really good case for the positives.  It also seems 
> > that there is a type of nuclear power (IFR) that produces waste that is 
> > recyclable by the nuclear plant itself. The safeguards on these are also 
> > incredible.
> 
> 
> These pro nuclear environmentalists make me laugh, I think they
> come from a place where we absolutely *have* to keep consuming
> power at the insane rate we have for the last hundred years and
> that cutting back on consumption isn't a plausible option.

The docu mentions this problem.  It seems that the pro-nuclear 
environmentalists have become rather practical. First, they don't believe that 
cutting back is an option - that to think that our own Western populations will 
cut back is a pipe dream.  It might be smart and the right thing to do, but it 
won't happen.  And seond, for us to expect the developing nations to not have 
what we have - cars, unlimited energy - it not "fair" and also is not 
happening.  China and India and Brazil are moving full steam ahead and will use 
whatever energy source is around. Second, they feel that given that our demands 
for energy will not be dropping, we cannot just count on water, wind and solar 
sources. Anything that  helps is good, but those systems simply will not solve 
the problem anytime soon. We are running out of time, and to wait for other 
types of energy is wishful thinking for now.
> 
> The sad fact about nuclear power is that we don't have enough
> uranium on this planet to outlast the coal supply should we
> switch wholesale and build more reactors. 
> 
> Then there's terrorism, if al queda had been smart they would have
> flown the 9/11 planes into a nuclear reactor (but don't give them
> ideas) and then there is the black market in dirty plutonium, so
> simple to make a dirty bomb, drive it into a major city and
> It's just bound to happen sooner or later.
> 
> But the real disaster is waste, I have heard of these fast breeder
> reactors but I'm not even sure they have been demonstrated to work very well 
> and they do still create a small amount of waste and it
> becomes much more toxic than the 11,000,000 barrels of stuff we
> have lying around the UK waiting to be buried. 

I don't know, but in the docu they said that these reactors had been around 
since the late 40's.  A decision was made at that time by Rickover (sp?) to go 
with the other incredibly more polluting systems in building power plants (and 
submarines).  Scientists of today seem pretty certain that the waste is mostly 
recyclable and the plants are very very safe compared to the current style.  
Whether that waste is more polluting, I have no idea and it was not addressed 
in the film.At the end of this movie, there were questions and answers with 
Robert Stone.  As he was walking out, a 60ish year old man came up and 
congratulated him on a good job, mentioned that he himself had spent 40 years 
in the nuclear power industry (I think an engineer), and that there were risks 
not mentioned in the film.  He felt that nuclear (the fast breeder) was our 
only option at this time in history and given the pace of global climate change 
and the energy demands of our planet.  However, he did feel we should also be 
having a more thorough conversation about the risks (he did not elaborate on 
them - wish he had).
> 
> And that is what will happen, just brush it all under the carpet
> and let mankind of the future deal with it. I read that British Nuclear Fuels 
> put a few million in the bank hoping that some bright
> spark in some wiser future will know how to deal with it. Until
> then it's being buried in places like this:
> 
> http://www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/2011/apr/24/nuclear-waste-storage
> 
> Saw a chilling documentary about this place. Just what do you put
> on the door? Imagine if our Neanderthal 

[FairfieldLife] For Rick and others: Pro nuclear power documentary

[Susan]

I just saw Pandora's Promise, by Robert Stone, an environmentalist who has in 
the past been active in anti-nuclear energy protests.  He got convinced 
otherwise and has made this docu.  It features info and also interviews with 
several environmentalists who have educated themselves and changed their minds 
about nuclear energy.  Stuart Brand (Whole Earth catalogue) is one and so is 
Mark Lynas, who wrote the book Six Degrees in 2007.  I have mentioned that book 
here several times - terrific and accessible read about climate change.  Lynas 
was anti nuclear for years - and now changed his mind.  A worthwhile movie to 
see - and while I am not at all an expert on nuclear power, it made a really 
good case for the positives.  It also seems that there is a type of nuclear 
power (IFR) that produces waste that is recyclable by the nuclear plant itself. 
The safeguards on these are also incredible. 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Four for Share

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
>
> Thanks for doing this, Xeno. See my comments below.
> 
> I hope Susan can overcome her resistance to realizing
> what Barry's done and how she unthinkingly bought
> into it, which she'll discover if she reads your post.

You are wrong Judy. Go and read my post number 349865.  I am not resistant at 
all. 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Xenophaneros Anartaxius"  
> wrote:
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
> > > (snip)
> > >> Curtis last posted to this forum on May 7, 2013. 
> > >> Since that time, he has been mentioned -- almost
> > >> always negatively -- in the following number of
> > >> posts by the following people:
> > >>
> > >> Judy - 35
> > > 
> > > Barry never looked at the actual list of hits he
> > > got from the archives, so when he says Curtis was
> > > mentioned "almost always negatively," he actually
> > > had no idea whether that was true.
> > > 
> > > Folks will not be surprised to learn that not only
> > > NOT was it not true, but all but a handful of the 35
> > > mentions were in *quotes from someone else's post*--
> > > most often Barry's--not mentions by me at all.
> > > 
> > > Plus which, even that handful of mentions of Curtis
> > > by me weren't "always negative." Most were in passing.
> > > None was "unfair," let alone false.
> > > 
> > > Compare that to Barry's many long screeds against
> > > Robin that are stuffed full of malicious falsehoods
> > > and distortions and thoroughly unfair accusations.
> > > 
> > > (snip)
> > >> In other words, it's *OK* for Judy and her friends
> > >> to obsess on the people *they* don't like, long after
> > >> they've left this forum, but if others do it to Robin,
> > >> that's bad.
> > >> 
> > >> Can you spell  H Y P O C R I T E ?  I think you can...
> > > 
> > > Given what I just explained, I'm going to leave this here
> > > for folks to contemplate.
> > > 
> > > (Susan, if you had any integrity... Naaah, never mind,
> > > silly to even suggest that.)
> > 
> > Out of 37 mentions of the word 'Curtis' in Judy's posts since
> > May 8, only in 13 does she write 'Curtis' originally, all other
> > occurrences are requotes from other posts. In general I do not
> > think the material below supports Barry's contention with
> > regard to this series of posts. 
> 
> You bet it doesn't. Thank you for going to the trouble.
> 
> Quoting just me, however, obscures the fact that in many
> if not most of these cases, I was responding to someone
> else (usually Barry) who had made comments about Curtis;
> I hadn't brought him up.
> 
> And the last one was made the day after Curtis left, before
> it was clear he had done so, so I don't think we can count
> that as a mention of Curtis "long after he'd left the forum,"
> which was what Barry had stipulated.
> 
> More importantly, *none* of these is anything like Barry's
> lengthy, obsessive, viciously insulting posts about Robin.
> He has made *75* posts mentioning Robin since Robin's last
> post here on April 6. As I said in another post, I did a
> spot-check, and almost all of them seemed to be an original
> mention of Robin by Barry, not a quote from someone else's
> post. And *all* of them I checked were negative. Quite a
> few were Barry's patented long tirades.
> 
> It would be interesting, Xeno, if you wanted to go through
> those posts and quote them here the way you've done with
> mine. Then the difference would be crystal clear.
> 
> > It is mostly all about who said what when,
> 
> Right, in many cases correcting Barry's misrepresentations.
> 
> > and Judy's insight
> > into others and their motives, which is always more accurate
> > than they themselves, or anyone else could ever muster.
> 
> I believe there's only one or two like that in what you've
> compiled, Xeno, so not "mostly" at all.
> 
> Almost certainly Barry's "counts" of my mentions of Val
> and Stupid Sal, and those of Ann and Ravi and DrD, are of
> the same nature--i.e., they do not support Barry's
> accusation that we "obse

[FairfieldLife] Re: Four for Share

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ann"  wrote:
>
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> >
> > 
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ann"  wrote:
> > >
> > > 
> > > 
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I too have cyber friends,
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > I'm sure you do.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > > but I don't spend hours and hours for many many months
> > > > > > > "defending" them.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > How many cyber friends do you have who have been the focus
> > > > > > for months and months, mostly in their absence, of all kinds
> > > > > > of false and unfair attacks and comments from a bunch of
> > > > > > people on an electronic forum seemingly bent on portraying
> > > > > > them as a monster?
> > > > > 
> > > > > To help answer these questions, as a "learning aid"
> > > > > for wayback and Steve on how to "act morally" and
> > > > > "stick to the facts", Judy-style here are some facts:
> > > > > 
> > > > > Curtis last posted to this forum on May 7, 2013. 
> > > > > Since that time, he has been mentioned -- almost
> > > > > always negatively -- in the following number of
> > > > > posts by the following people:
> > > > > Judy - 35
> > > > > Ann - 44
> > > > > Doctordumbass - 52
> > > > > Ravi - 60
> > > > > Willytex - 8
> > > > > 
> > > > > Vaj last posted to this forum on Aug 25, 2012. 
> > > > > Since that time, he has been mentioned -- almost
> > > > > always negatively -- in the following number of
> > > > > posts by the following people:
> > > > > Judy - 54
> > > > > Ann - 17
> > > > > Doctordumbass - 33
> > > > > Ravi - 66
> > > > > Willytex - 27
> > > > > 
> > > > > Sal Sunshine last posted to this forum on Aug 25, 2012. 
> > > > > Since that time, she (tracked by Judy's insulting pet
> > > > > name for her "Stupid Sal" to avoid confusion with 
> > > > > "Sal/Salyavin") has been mentioned -- almost always 
> > > > > negatively -- in the following number of posts by 
> > > > > the following people:
> > > > > Judy - 18
> > > > > Ann - 2
> > > > > Doctordumbass - 1
> > > > > Ravi - 14
> > > > > Willytex - 1
> > > > > 
> > > > > In other words, it's *OK* for Judy and her friends
> > > > > to obsess on the people *they* don't like, long after
> > > > > they've left this forum, but if others do it to Robin,
> > > > > that's bad.
> > > > > 
> > > > > Can you spell  H Y P O C R I T E ?  I think you can...
> > > > >
> > > > 
> > > > Excellent summary, Barry. Thank you.
> > > 
> > > Do you take everything you read without questioning or even taking 60 
> > > seconds to check if this is true? Surely, you who are one of Barry's 
> > > loyal friends, must know he, er, stretches the bounds of what is real and 
> > > true. And in this case it is no exception. "Excellent summary" is one of 
> > > the funniest lines ever typed here at FFL, especially in this context. 
> > > >
> > >
> > Ann, it is not that I don't read or question. 
> 
> I am sure that you question things in your life but in this instance, you 
> simply took what Barry claimed and pronounced it "excellent". There is a 
> difference between liking something because you hope it to be true and liking 
> something because it is true. Unless you did more than simply read his 
> assertion there you have fall

[FairfieldLife] Re: Four for Share

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ann"  wrote:
>
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> >
> > 
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > I too have cyber friends,
> > > > 
> > > > I'm sure you do.
> > > > 
> > > > > but I don't spend hours and hours for many many months
> > > > > "defending" them.
> > > > 
> > > > How many cyber friends do you have who have been the focus
> > > > for months and months, mostly in their absence, of all kinds
> > > > of false and unfair attacks and comments from a bunch of
> > > > people on an electronic forum seemingly bent on portraying
> > > > them as a monster?
> > > 
> > > To help answer these questions, as a "learning aid"
> > > for wayback and Steve on how to "act morally" and
> > > "stick to the facts", Judy-style here are some facts:
> > > 
> > > Curtis last posted to this forum on May 7, 2013. 
> > > Since that time, he has been mentioned -- almost
> > > always negatively -- in the following number of
> > > posts by the following people:
> > > Judy - 35
> > > Ann - 44
> > > Doctordumbass - 52
> > > Ravi - 60
> > > Willytex - 8
> > > 
> > > Vaj last posted to this forum on Aug 25, 2012. 
> > > Since that time, he has been mentioned -- almost
> > > always negatively -- in the following number of
> > > posts by the following people:
> > > Judy - 54
> > > Ann - 17
> > > Doctordumbass - 33
> > > Ravi - 66
> > > Willytex - 27
> > > 
> > > Sal Sunshine last posted to this forum on Aug 25, 2012. 
> > > Since that time, she (tracked by Judy's insulting pet
> > > name for her "Stupid Sal" to avoid confusion with 
> > > "Sal/Salyavin") has been mentioned -- almost always 
> > > negatively -- in the following number of posts by 
> > > the following people:
> > > Judy - 18
> > > Ann - 2
> > > Doctordumbass - 1
> > > Ravi - 14
> > > Willytex - 1
> > > 
> > > In other words, it's *OK* for Judy and her friends
> > > to obsess on the people *they* don't like, long after
> > > they've left this forum, but if others do it to Robin,
> > > that's bad.
> > > 
> > > Can you spell  H Y P O C R I T E ?  I think you can...
> > >
> > 
> > Excellent summary, Barry. Thank you.
> 
> Do you take everything you read without questioning or even taking 60 seconds 
> to check if this is true? Surely, you who are one of Barry's loyal friends, 
> must know he, er, stretches the bounds of what is real and true. And in this 
> case it is no exception. "Excellent summary" is one of the funniest lines 
> ever typed here at FFL, especially in this context. 
> >
>
Ann, it is not that I don't read or question.  I have different opinions about 
some things and some people than you do. And that is fine for us all.  Judy and 
her way of interacting with people seems to be one of the differences between 
us.  In the only 2 posts of hers I saw a few minutes ago  (not read, just saw 
the opening lines today and quickly skipped them as angry garbage) she called 
me "Stoopid" and someone else a "prick."  Really great style of interacting, 
huh?

I guess I could turn tables and ask you, do you ever look at what Judy writes 
and check if it is true?  As one of her loyal friends, surely you must know 
that she stretches the bounds of what is real and true. And she insults others 
routinely. She is known here for that nasty style.

And one more thing - I am not a "loyal friend" of Barry's.  I am not taking 
sides.  I like many of his posts - a lot.  I can see the times he exaggerates 
or lumps people together as TB's.  I move on and continue to enjoy much of what 
he writes.  If you don't, that is fine, too

[FairfieldLife] Re: Four for Share

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> > >
> > > I too have cyber friends,
> > 
> > I'm sure you do.
> > 
> > > but I don't spend hours and hours for many many months
> > > "defending" them.
> > 
> > How many cyber friends do you have who have been the focus
> > for months and months, mostly in their absence, of all kinds
> > of false and unfair attacks and comments from a bunch of
> > people on an electronic forum seemingly bent on portraying
> > them as a monster?
> 
> To help answer these questions, as a "learning aid"
> for wayback and Steve on how to "act morally" and
> "stick to the facts", Judy-style here are some facts:
> 
> Curtis last posted to this forum on May 7, 2013. 
> Since that time, he has been mentioned -- almost
> always negatively -- in the following number of
> posts by the following people:
> Judy - 35
> Ann - 44
> Doctordumbass - 52
> Ravi - 60
> Willytex - 8
> 
> Vaj last posted to this forum on Aug 25, 2012. 
> Since that time, he has been mentioned -- almost
> always negatively -- in the following number of
> posts by the following people:
> Judy - 54
> Ann - 17
> Doctordumbass - 33
> Ravi - 66
> Willytex - 27
> 
> Sal Sunshine last posted to this forum on Aug 25, 2012. 
> Since that time, she (tracked by Judy's insulting pet
> name for her "Stupid Sal" to avoid confusion with 
> "Sal/Salyavin") has been mentioned -- almost always 
> negatively -- in the following number of posts by 
> the following people:
> Judy - 18
> Ann - 2
> Doctordumbass - 1
> Ravi - 14
> Willytex - 1
> 
> In other words, it's *OK* for Judy and her friends
> to obsess on the people *they* don't like, long after
> they've left this forum, but if others do it to Robin,
> that's bad.
> 
> Can you spell  H Y P O C R I T E ?  I think you can...
>

Excellent summary, Barry. Thank you.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Four for Share

[Susan]

Well, Judy you make a lot of assumptions yourself. And if I were you, I would 
not be so confident of them either. I too have cyber friends, but I don't spend 
hours and hours for many many months "defending" them.  Obviously Robin is very 
very  important to you.   Personally, I don't think he needs defending.  But as 
you say, YMMV, and we all make choices about how to spend our time.  

You wrote about how important the biblical concept of "being your brother's 
keeper" is to you.  I wonder sometimes if, given your energy and one 
pointedness, you might not make a difference in another person's life by doing 
something for them off line - you know, volunteering, helping others in some 
way in person, helping others in real life, rather than in your head.  Maybe 
you do this already.  I should not assume that you don't.  but I don't, 
frankly, consider your defense of Robin as "being your brother's keeper," at 
least not in a significant way. 

One thing we do share is loyalty to friends. I am about as loyal as they come.  
I guess you assumed I wasn't?  Wrong. But I think we do agree that in many ways 
we are very different.  Which is good news to me, not sad as you wrote below.   
  

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> (snip) 
> > Bingo  and well said - that is exactly the weirdness of 
> > the situation: expecting apologies on behalf of someone
> > else - someone you never met or talked to on the phone,
> > no less.  Someone who is not your friend, someone who
> > has been created out of the compilation of posts at FFL.
> 
> Wayback, you have a tendency to make a whole lot of
> assumptions. You might want to think about not making
> them quite so confidently.
> 
> Just for one thing, I have a number of friends on FFL,
> including Robin (but not, obviously, you). I think it's
> peculiar, to say the least, to rule out the possibility
> of friendship via cyberspace. (And let's also note that
> human beings aren't created via compilations of posts;
> rather, the posts and their compilations are created by
> human beings. Perhaps that's what's confusing you.)
> 
> More importantly, I'm fascinated that anybody would
> think there's anything "weird" about standing up for
> your friends (or even those who are *not* your friends,
> for that matter) when they've been falsely accused or
> otherwise unfairly treated. It seems to denigrate the
> biblical principle of being one's brother's keeper.
> 
> Me, I'll stand behind that principle and do my best
> to uphold it for as long as I draw breath.
> 
> YMOV. Sad.
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Four for Share

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "seventhray27"  wrote:
>
> 
> Hey Share,
> 
> Wonderful point.  My God, do these people worship this woman.  Now
> you've got Raunchy coming to the fore.
> 
> I had a chance to skim over some the posts.
> 
> I especially enjoyed the exchange between Edg and turqb on the cult
> article, and the point Xeno made about what must be the emotional make
> up of someone who demands an apology from someone, (for a percevied
> infraction against someone else -for God's sake!)

Bingo  and well said - that is exactly the weirdness of the situation: 
expecting apologies on behalf of someone else - someone you never met or talked 
to on the phone, no less.  Someone who is not your friend, someone who has been 
created out of the compilation of posts at FFL.
> 
> That must have hit the target pretty well, because it elicited a "Fuck
> Off" from Judy.  We don't see that very often.  Still not a "Fuck Off
> and Die".  That's most been reserved mostly for Curtis when Judy has
> exhausted most every other argument she can put forth, and still fallen
> way short.
> 
> Seeing alot of the "f" word from Judy lately.  Talk about psychological
> stress, I guess.
> 
> Anyway, returning tomorrow.  Been a fun vacation, but a lot of staying
> in touch with work, and handling other issues back home.
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Share Long wrote:
> >
> > For the record Ravi, Judy's opinions are not facts much less the
> truth. Nor are her distortions whether they be deliberate or merely out
> of habit due to lack of whole brain development eg mirror neurons. Nor
> are her untrained attempts to understand the emotional conditions within
> or between others, much less her attempts to write beneficially or even
> usefully about them.
> >
> >
> > As for shooting the messenger, this is not that. This is recognizing
> that the messenger has distorted messages many times in the past and
> thus wisely taking the incompetent messenger's messages with a huge
> grain of salt.
> >
> >
> > 
> > From: Ravi Chivukula chivukula.ravi@
> > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Friday, July 12, 2013 6:18 PM
> > Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Four for Share
> >
> >
> >
> > Â
> > On 7/12/13 4:08 PM, Ravi Chivukula wrote:
> >
> > Dear Share - I think this is a brilliant move. This new strategy is
> the right way to avoid Judy's perverse, obsessive, pathological need to
> stick to facts, stick to truth. Clearly she lacks emotional
> intelligence, or why would she continually insist on presenting the
> gory, cruel, torturous facts with links to your posts over and over
> again. Why can't she just let you rest in peace, why does she trigger
> you and your attachment disorder?
> > >
> > >Your new strategy is sure to perplex and thwart Judy. Yep -
> > where is her moral authority, what are her credentials - is
> > she a fucking therapist, does she like have a Ph. D? Or is she
> > even a pastoral counsellor even? Ha.
> > >
> > So - yes,  to reiterate dear Share, presenting facts is not good
> enough unless someone has moral or professional authority. Let her
> produce evidence of her training and/or authority.
> >
> > The gall of this vengeful woman that we will just accept the truth in
> the absence of any credentials. She must think we are naive and
> gullible.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > >This is a sickness dear Share. People like Judy who insist on
> > truth, insist on facts should be fucking institutionalized,
> > they need to be fucking medicated - yeah that's we need and
> > your efforts are very admirable, brave and courageous my dear.
> > >
> > >On 7/12/13 7:29 AM, Share Long wrote:
> > >
> > >Â
> > >>Judy, in order of importance: IMO you do not have the moral
> authority to comment beneficially on the upsets bt me and Robin; you do
> not have the emotional good health to comment beneficially on them; you
> do not have the emotional intelligence to comment usefully on them; you
> do not have the professional training to comment usefully or
> beneficially on them. IMO this is a matter bt me and Robin so lastly, I
> don't think it is useful or appropriate for you to comment on these
> matters bt him and me.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> From: authfriend authfriend@
> > >>To: FairfieldLif

[FairfieldLife] Re: Come to Meditation

[Susan]

Very nice and thanks
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
>
> 71. 
> 
> By forgetting your nature, you get submerged in the sea of sorrow.
> 
> "Just once take a look and ask "who am I?"
>  What ever you have experienced in samsara (human life), all that is 
> different from you.  Body, mind, breath, and so on -all these things you see 
> as your own.  It is said, "my body, my mind, my intellect, my breath."  
> Clearly, you are master of these things you consider as your self, but your 
> existence is different from them, like your house, or your temple.  The 
> temple is yours; but you are not the temple.  Similarly, body, mind, 
> intellect, breath, and so on- all these things belong to you, but they are 
> not you.  You are different from them.  You are Sat, Chit, Ananda -being, 
> consciousness, bliss- a ray of Paramatma.  But due to lack of discrimination, 
> due to ignorance, you have built up such a strong association with the 
> body-mind-intellect and so forth that you have started thinking these things 
> to be your true form.  
> Swami Brahmananda Saraswati,
>

[FairfieldLife] NY Times: The Morality of Meditation

[Susan]

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/07/opinion/sunday/the-morality-of-meditation.html?ref=opinion&_r=0

[FairfieldLife] Re: Movie: I am Love

[Susan]

thanks, Emily.  Accurate review.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "emilymae.reyn"  wrote:
>
> Here's a review from the New Yorker
> http://www.newyorker.com/arts/critics/cinema/2010/06/28/100628crci_cinem\
> a_lane
> <http://www.newyorker.com/arts/critics/cinema/2010/06/28/100628crci_cine\
> ma_lane
> >
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> >
> > I found this movie remarkable -saw it last night via Netflix.  It
> stars Tilda Swinton, takes place in and around Milan, and is unlike any
> film I have seen.  The photography is just beautiful, with images that
> are slowly filmed and that bring out the beauty of a plate of food,
> skin, a person's neck, a stairway, a stone carving detail.  The movie is
> fairly slow-paced but exquisite.
> >
>

[FairfieldLife] Movie: I am Love

[Susan]

I found this movie remarkable -saw it last night via Netflix.  It stars Tilda 
Swinton, takes place in and around Milan, and is unlike any film I have seen.  
The photography is just beautiful, with images that are slowly filmed and that 
bring out the beauty of a plate of food, skin, a person's neck, a stairway, a 
stone carving detail.  The movie is fairly slow-paced but exquisite.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Two for Xeno, one for Susan

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
>
> First, Xeno's intellectual dishonesty in defense of Barry's
> shitting on Robin.
> 
> Second, some comments on explaining Robin to those with a
> 15-year-old mentality.
> 
> Finally, Susan's reading comprehension problems (among other 
> difficulties).
> 
snips of Judy to Xeno


> 348894
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> >
> > 
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "seventhray27"  
> 
> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > wow! what a reaction. is this an extreme example of 
> > > > shooting the messenger? don't even need a show of 
> > > > hands for that.
> > > 
> > > Now you understand why the person who sent the 
> > > link to me in email didn't want to post it them-
> > > selves. 
> > > 
> > > Sure is good to see that the "enlightened" don't
> > > throw balls of shit like chimpanzees, eh?  :-)
> > > 
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, doctordumbass@ wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Sorry, no street cred for you, little guy. Any student 
> > > > > of human nature knows that you cannot first shit all 
> > > > > over someone, as you have Robin, and then trot out some 
> > > > > third party excerpt, trying to show your objectivity.
> > 
> > Doc, are you kidding?  I mean think about it - is Barry the
> > only person here on FFL that has "shit all over someone"?
> 
> Susan, you need to think about it. DrD never said Barry
> was the only person here on FFL who has done that.

Judy, you missed the point.  You need to think about that.  Of course I know Dr 
D did not think Barry was the only person on FFL to shit all over someone. That 
was my point and I knew DR had that awareness.  I was merely pointing it out to 
him.  You missed the main oint, the gist, and focused on a detail with no 
relevance to what we were talking about.
> 
> > Several other people here seem to feel quite free and expert
> > in putting down other people and calling them names (I would
> > say Judy and Ravi are probably most skilled at name calling
> > and putdowns, and they do so frequently)
> 
> Bit of a difference, Susan. I never do so *gratuitously*,
> and I never do it *dishonestly*. Plus which, I'll respond
> if someone wants to engage with what I say. I don't do hit-
> and-runs. Nor do I diagnose mental disorders in people I'm
> not on good terms with.

However you want to characterize, or rather talk about the bad" things you 
don't do, you ourself Judy manage to put down others frequently here.  It may 
be a bit of a difference in how you go about doing so, but you do, as you know.
> 
> > Barry certainly seems to think Robin was and probably is a
> > strange guy.  No argument there.
> 
> Nor is that the problem, as you know--or should.

Of course, I did not say it was the problem and of course I know it is not.  I 
was summarizing the past relationship.  You should know that.
> 
> > Now, Barry posted something written by other people.   My
> > take was that it was not  focusing on Robin and his
> > personality and his diagnoses or problems; it was about
> > the events of that time as seen thru the theme of
> > spiritual movements and how they grow or split in factions
> > or dissolve.
> 
> You apparently didn't bother to read Barry's post with
> any attention. The big deal for Barry was that the book
> excerpt appeared to contradict what Robin has said about
> his devotion to Maharishi. (There are problems with that
> conclusion, but I've addressed them briefly in another
> post.)
> 
> > Robin, Shri Shri and Deepak were the players, along with MMY
> > and the TMO.  Personally I thought it was interesting to get
> > an objective view of those years in the TMO. There were some
> > details about Robin's activities that I did not know about,
> > and it presented his concerns witht he TMO and how it had
> > changed for the worse.  It was a rather clear summary from
> > one point of view.
> 
> I have no problem with this precis. But then you go on
> to say:
> 
> > I hardly consider that "shitting all over Robin."
> 
> Susan, your reading comprehension ain't so good these
> days. DrD didn't say it was. Go read the quote from his
> post at the top, see if you can figure out where you
> went wrong. If not, I'll be

[FairfieldLife] Re: Barry Wright's psychological fingerprint and his enablers on FFL

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Richard J. Williams"  wrote:
>
> 
> 
> So, you had a nice job, a cozy place to live, and good 
> free food and your teacher was Mahesh Varma who got you
> off the sauce, but NOW you're complaining? Go figure.
> 

Richard,  you do well when posting about things.  But why don't You go figure 
why you write such unkind and odd posts to other human beings.

> mjackson74:
> > you do jump to conclusions Ann - I was in no way 
> > close to being an alkee
> > 
> > > I have not drunk al-kee-hall in years. When I did 
> > > drink, I did so to get drunk, not because of how 
> > > anything tasted with or without food - I was mighty 
> > > partial to tequila and lots of it - if there was 
> > > none of that, then bourbon. I never cared for beer 
> > > but drank plenty of it. Slacked off on the drinking 
> > > somewhat when I discovered pot, although pot and 
> > > wine seemed a good fit - stopped it all to do TM 
> > > - should-a stuck with whiskey.
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Interesting third party view of the Robin thang

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
>
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "seventhray27"  wrote:
> > >
> > > wow! what a reaction. is this an extreme example of 
> > > shooting the messenger? don't even need a show of 
> > > hands for that.
> > 
> > Now you understand why the person who sent the 
> > link to me in email didn't want to post it them-
> > selves. 
> > 
> > Sure is good to see that the "enlightened" don't
> > throw balls of shit like chimpanzees, eh?  :-)
> > 
> > 
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, doctordumbass@ wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Sorry, no street cred for you, little guy. Any student 
> > > > of human nature knows that you cannot first shit all 
> > > > over someone, as you have Robin, and then trot out some 
> > > > third party excerpt, trying to show your objectivity.
> 
> Doc, are you kidding?  I mean think about it - is Barry the only person here 
> on FFL that has "shit all over someone"?  Several other people here seem to 
> feel quite free and expert in putting down other people and calling them 
> names (I would say Judy and Ravi are probably most skilled at name calling 
> and putdowns, and they do so frequently)
> 
> Barry certainly seems to think Robin was and probably is a strange guy.  No 
> argument there.  Now, Barry posted something written by other people.   My 
> take was that it was not  focusing on Robin and his personality and his 
> diagnoses or problems; it was about the events of that time as seen thru the 
> theme of spiritual movements and how they grow or split in factions or 
> dissolve. Robin, Shri Shri and Deepak were the players, along with MMY and 
> the TMO.  Personally I thought it was interesting to get an objective view of 
> those years in the TMO. There were some details about Robin's activities that 
> I did not know about, and it presented his concerns witht he TMO and how it 
> had changed for the worse.  It was a rather clear summary from one point of 
> view.   I hardly consider that "shitting all over Robin."

And I meant to add, neither do I consider Barry's past posts about Robin to be 
"shitting all over him." But then I too found Robin's writings odd and 
uncomfortable to follow.  He appears to be extremely intelligent.  And it is 
not that his posts were intellectually impossible to get, but that his whole 
style and switching of topics and use of words made me feel as if I was being 
manipulated (that is the best I can put it, and I did so directly to Robin from 
day 1).
> 
> > > >
> > > > Who does that?? Only an idiot would operate that way, 
> > > > or someone so bent on denigrating someone, that they 
> > > > fail to see their own transparency (in other words, 
> > > > an idiot).
> > > >
> > > > Personally, I rate your post, "CI", for Completely Impotent.
> > > >

[FairfieldLife] Re: Interesting third party view of the Robin thang

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "seventhray27"  wrote:
> >
> > wow! what a reaction. is this an extreme example of 
> > shooting the messenger? don't even need a show of 
> > hands for that.
> 
> Now you understand why the person who sent the 
> link to me in email didn't want to post it them-
> selves. 
> 
> Sure is good to see that the "enlightened" don't
> throw balls of shit like chimpanzees, eh?  :-)
> 
> 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, doctordumbass@ wrote:
> > >
> > > Sorry, no street cred for you, little guy. Any student 
> > > of human nature knows that you cannot first shit all 
> > > over someone, as you have Robin, and then trot out some 
> > > third party excerpt, trying to show your objectivity.

Doc, are you kidding?  I mean think about it - is Barry the only person here on 
FFL that has "shit all over someone"?  Several other people here seem to feel 
quite free and expert in putting down other people and calling them names (I 
would say Judy and Ravi are probably most skilled at name calling and putdowns, 
and they do so frequently)

Barry certainly seems to think Robin was and probably is a strange guy.  No 
argument there.  Now, Barry posted something written by other people.   My take 
was that it was not  focusing on Robin and his personality and his diagnoses or 
problems; it was about the events of that time as seen thru the theme of 
spiritual movements and how they grow or split in factions or dissolve. Robin, 
Shri Shri and Deepak were the players, along with MMY and the TMO.  Personally 
I thought it was interesting to get an objective view of those years in the 
TMO. There were some details about Robin's activities that I did not know 
about, and it presented his concerns witht he TMO and how it had changed for 
the worse.  It was a rather clear summary from one point of view.   I hardly 
consider that "shitting all over Robin."

> > >
> > > Who does that?? Only an idiot would operate that way, 
> > > or someone so bent on denigrating someone, that they 
> > > fail to see their own transparency (in other words, 
> > > an idiot).
> > >
> > > Personally, I rate your post, "CI", for Completely Impotent.
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@ wrote:
> > > >
> > > > I pass along here something sent to me by a lurker who preferred to
> > have
> > > > someone else post it so as not to become a target for the "Robin
> > > > supporters." It is an excerpt from a book called "Sacred Schisms:
> > How
> > > > Religions Divide," edited by James R. Lewis and Sarah M. Lewis.
> > > >
> > > > I cannot confess to having done all my Steinian Due Diligence on the
> > > > editors, but a quick glance at their other works seems to indicate
> > that
> > > > they are scholars with an interest in religions, as opposed to
> > someone
> > > > with an axe to grind. I pass it along because it seems to be
> > something
> > > > we don't get much of around here, a view of the whole Robin
> > phenomenon
> > > > presented without emotion or allegiance to one "side" of the story
> > or
> > > > another. It seems to present some contradictions to claims here
> > about
> > > > how much Robin continued to "revere" Maharishi and his teachings
> > during
> > > > his 15 minutes of fame.
> > > >
> > > > The Amazon link to their book is the first link below, and a Google
> > > > Reader "Look Inside This Book" is provided at the second (and third)
> > > > links. Google Reader does not seem to allow cut-and-paste, so I
> > cannot
> > > > duplicate it here. The link pointed for me to page 292, but the
> > > > information about Robin and his relationship with Maharishi starts
> > at
> > > > the bottom of page 289. It is missing page 294 for some reason.
> > > >
> > > >
> > http://www.amazon.com/Sacred-Schisms-How-Religions-Divide/dp/0521881471
> > > > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > http://books.google.com/books?id=2ama0nYRlB8C&pg=PA292&lpg=PA292&dq=%22R\
> > \
> > > >
> > obin+Carlsen%22&source=bl&ots=T2I4atqqNl&sig=eRRuklROm7gPtmTdS7FEHPvCU8M\
> > \
> > > >
> > &hl=en&sa=X&ei=GODTUc2-B9P20gXaioDIAw&ved=0CGUQ6AEwCDge#v=onepage&q=%22R\
> > \
> > > > obin%20Carlsen%22&f=false
> > > > > >
> > Robin+Carlsen%22&source=bl&ots=T2I4atqqNl&sig=eRRuklROm7gPtmTdS7FEHPvCU8\
> > \
> > > >
> > M&hl=en&sa=X&ei=GODTUc2-B9P20gXaioDIAw&ved=0CGUQ6AEwCDge#v=onepage&q=%22\
> > \
> > > > Robin%20Carlsen%22&f=false>
> > > >
> > > > http://tinyurl.com/nwpvnuc
> > > >
> > >
> >
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Barry and the Mystery Cultist

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Xenophaneros Anartaxius" 
 wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Xenophaneros Anartaxius" 
> >  wrote:
> > (snip)
> >> Well then, why don't we just forgive Robin for his past
> > 
> > Why don't we hope that Robin can forgive *himself* for
> > his past?
> 
> I do not think that is necessary. The past is past. We ARE ourselves, it is 
> redundant to think of ourselves as something we can converse with as if we 
> were something else; the more one meditates, the less something else exists 
> anyway. To me forgiveness is the final relaxing of that clenched heart that 
> one has when one supposes one has been wronged in some way. You become free 
> of the entanglement of the fallout from that event. Whatever might be up with 
> Robin, those whom he harmed would give him more space to heal, if that is 
> necessary, if they forgave him, that is they let go of that clenched heart. 
> Letting go is much harder than it seems because it is not a willful act, it 
> is a spontaneous letting go, and so one never knows when it will happen, if 
> ever. 

I find your description of forgiveness really lovely. Simple and clear.
> 
> Personal self-directed recrimination is of no real value, more important is 
> that whatever happened, that it never happen again. If one has some dark 
> thread weaving though one's life, softening that and hopefully having it 
> disappear is what spirituality is for, otherwise that dark thread has to be 
> restrained with forces external to it, like being put in prison or being 
> isolated from society in some way. But it is always best if one takes that 
> transformation as a personal project; it always seems as if there is some 
> threshold of perception that one must pass over before the transformation 
> becomes feasible.
> 
> >> and then shoot him.
> > 
> > And then, since we don't have any evidence to the contrary,
> > treat him like a normal human being, mental-health-wise?
> > 
> > You are right about no evidence. These
> >> are surmises on my part. Whether he has what would be
> >> termed a psychiatric illness or not, if we take an average
> >> human being in the centre of the Bell curve, no matter what
> >> Robin is, I do not think he would be near the center of
> >> that graph.
> > 
> > I'm not sure "average human being" really means anything.
> > But I agreed with you several posts back that Robin wasn't
> > "average" in many specific respects. Why that would suggest
> > to you some kind of personality disorder, in the absence
> > of any evidence of same, is peculiar, to say the least.
> 
> What evidence do we have that anyone is normal or does not have a personality 
> disorder, how does one gauge this? If a typical example cannot be created 
> ('average human being'), or even if it can and is meaningless, then any 
> metric that describes or shows a person's deviation from that also has no 
> meaning, no utility. I think we all have some largely unconscious benchmark 
> in our minds by which we measure the behaviour of others in relation to what 
> we already think we know. It is largely unconscious because we are not aware 
> of how we do it, much like riding a bicycle - how do we know we are staying 
> in balance? - the process is silent and hidden. 
> 
> By your benchmark, if I were an average human being, then average human 
> beings would be pure malicious vengefulness. Our benchmarks about others are 
> floating benchmarks because they are influenced by what we like and dislike, 
> they are generally not free of those feelings and perceptions, or our current 
> situation; on a day we are feeling good our benchmarks may be more tolerant 
> than when we are feeling rotten. None of these senses we have about others is 
> based on factual evidence, it is based on our interpretation of our 
> interactions, and if there is some kind of factual evidence, such as an 
> e-mail, a document, a letter, a video, even then we fall back on our 
> interpretation of that evidence. When we use our mind for interpretation, we 
> are always dealing with second-hand knowledge or second-hand hypotheses that 
> depend on our pool of previous experience; and that pool might be relatively 
> clear water, or a sewer, or a mix thereof.
> 
> If you feel free to say I am pure malicious vengefulness, why should I not 
> have the same freedom to say Robin, you, or anyone, is a psycho? I just think 
> there is something very peculiar about Robin compared to what I am used to in 
> human interaction, and am trying to find a way to describe it in terms of 
> what I know, or think I know. Psychology, and particularly psychiatry, is 
> hardly a mature science. As laymen, we sometimes use these benchmarks 
> developed in these disciplines, probably rather inexactly, to attempt to 
> figure out our fellow human beings.
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: someone who understands M.E.

[Susan]

My own guesses at this is that women might have more pitocin, oxytocin/hormones 
circulating in their systems than males.  I was given large doses of pitocin to 
intensify labor contractions years ago when delivering my children.  WOw, it 
was amazing.  I believe the effect was to create an even more intense than 
usual flood of birth hormones, which increase feelings of protectiveness, 
emotion, empathy and the need to nurture.  For a few months after delivering, I 
actually cried each evening when watching the news - cause the criminals 
paraded on TV were all someone's child at one point, and how sad was that!  I 
found myself growling like an animal from deep in my throat for a few times 
when out walking my child and feeling that a stranger might not be safe.  So if 
women just start out with more of these hormones floating about, they will feel 
and behave differently.  And maybe the effects of giving birth permanently 
enhance those emotions, I don't know.

And maybe the real starting point for the differences is in the brain, which 
produces those hormones.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Xenophaneros Anartaxius" 
 wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Xenophaneros Anartaxius" 
> >  wrote:
> >> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> >>> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Xenophaneros Anartaxius" 
> >>>  wrote:
>  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> > There's no basis for you to have such suspicions. As I
> > said, they're born of personal hostility.
>  
>  Robin's past history is no basis for having a suspicion?
> >>> 
> >>> Let's restore what I was responding to from you so
> >>> we know what the context was:
> >>> 
> >>> "Now, some think he is better, and others think his
> >>> recriminations concerning his past are a ruse. Based
> >>> on his last appearance here, I still have suspicions.
> >>> What else could I say if I think this?"
> >>> 
> >>> Now, did you have a comment you wanted to make on my
> >>> response that sticks with the actual context?
> >> 
> >> I have no personal animosity toward Robin. Your surmise in this
> >> instance is incorrect.
> > 
> > And this assertion of yours in no way removes my suspicions
> > about your motives, which I cannot know directly but only
> > infer from the way you write. What else could I say if I
> > think this?
> > 
> >> I wish him well in his quest to become a better human being
> >> than he apparently was. This in no way removes my suspicions
> >> about his motives. Your attempt to inject malice into this
> >> discussion (post #347412) is an attempt to characterise the 
> >> discussion on the basis of an emotional characteristic which
> >> I assure you I do not posses in this post or the previous
> >> ones in this thread.
> > 
> > I don't believe you, sorry. I think you possess *exactly*
> > those emotional characteristics.
> > 
> > (snip)
> >> 10.He is very intelligent. My question is will 
> >>he use that intelligence well in relation 
> >>to others, for he did have adverse reactions 
> >>from some on FFL who had online discussions 
> >>with him.
> > 
> > Your "adverse reactions" to his discussions with you
> > among them. I would find your claim not to possess a
> > malicious intent toward Robin more credible if you
> > didn't keep making unpleasant comments about him
> > long after your discussions with him were over, even
> > when he's no longer around.
> > 
> > I don't think you could make a solid case for his
> > "recriminations" (wrong word, BTW) being a "ruse" if
> > your life depended on it. I think your "suspicions"
> > are inspired by the fact that he was not impressed by
> > your "philosophy" or your claims about your
> > experience of consciousness.
> >
> Some news snippets concerning emotion in men and women:
> 
> 'The real difference in emotion between the sexes might lie in emotional 
> intelligence rather than feelings of anger, sadness or depression. Scientists 
> consistently find that women possess higher levels of emotional intelligence 
> than men, characterized by a sense of empathy and understanding of others' 
> emotions.'
> 
> 'Instead of experiencing the emotions of others, the men in these studies 
> simply recognized these emotions, and then started searching for solutions. 
> The rational parts of their brains trumped emotion, with men switching into 
> problem-solving mode as the women empathized.'
> 
> Ravi, for example, thinks I am pretty much of a robot, if I interpret what he 
> says correctly. Your writing is filled with emotional words, which to me 
> simply seem like projection, for I see the situations we 'discuss' usually as 
> not a matter of emotion or of feelings, except perhaps classical music. It is 
> just the relationship of certain data, how it fits or does not fit together. 
> Empathy has no part in it. I am told I am loving but not e

[FairfieldLife] Re: Repealing TM's Anti-Saint Policies

[Susan]

What are the Dome numbers lately?  What is the goal in terms of numbers?

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
>
> 
> 
> The TM communal antagonisms evidently run deep as insurmountably low ME 
> numbers unless the Prime Minister comes around himself and repeals the TM 
> anti-saint policy for everybody.  That day would be emancipation day for the 
> Meissner Effect of consciousness in Fairfield and everywhere.
> > 
> > 
> > > 
> > > >
> > > > Dr. that is true but that just does not exactly match reality here.  
> > > > Doc., from a distance you would think so.  But you don't live here.  
> > > > However, there is a much larger meditating community here that has long 
> > > > been spurned and disenfranchised from the Domes by a very few 
> > > > extremists in the middle who have their own faith-based ideology that 
> > > > has held the group meditation of the community hostage.  
> > > >
> > 
> > Look, this is about getting a large group meditation and and proper [ME] 
> > Meissner Effect.  Our larger communal resistance to getting a proper ME 
> > seemingly is impossible now to overcome here without a substantial change; 
> > it's insurmountable, these are insuperable odds with the long antagonisms 
> > this TM administration has led with the meditating community using the TM 
> > anti-saint guideline to judge, whip and hang people with.
> >
> > > > 
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter Sutphen  wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Well, if you really want to resolve this you simply build your own 
> > > > > dome or flying hall. A master never releases his slave. The slave 
> > > > > decides to no longer be a slave. To think that the TMO is ever going 
> > > > > to change its position is a waste of time. Those people are simply 
> > > > > lost in their own minds. If they ever experienced the fruit of 
> > > > > TM/TMSP they would be free. But they very clearly don't , so they 
> > > > > continue to rule in their fiefdom of thought.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > 
> > > The fact is that the larger community built the Domes to meditate in.  
> > > The community should not have to build another set of Domes because a few 
> > > people have locked the community out.  That [build another] thinking is 
> > > wrong and in fact they need to change their thinking for there to be a 
> > > proper ME again in the Domes.  If they cannot return a proper ME now, 
> > > right now,  then it is time for regime change if they can not rescind the 
> > > TM Anti-saint policies that use the Domes in extortion.  Something has to 
> > > change for the benefit of a proper ME .
> > > -Buck   
> > > 
> > > 
> > > > > In order to reach a just solution to the anti-saint policies of TM 
> > > > > and the Dome meditation ME that is accepted by all parties, goodwill 
> > > > > can play the role of mediator between the TM.government and its 
> > > > > meditator community in opposition that is working hard to achieve a 
> > > > > democracy and good governance.   I do hope for the best ME we can 
> > > > > facilitate. 
> > > > > -Buck 
> > > > > 
> > > > > >
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > The gravest threat to the Maharishi Effect here and its protection 
> > > > > > of America in its support of Natural Law is our tyrannic TM 
> > > > > > anti-saint policy over meditators in the Domes.  It is time to 
> > > > > > repeal the anti-saint policy for all our safety. 
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Yep, using the Dome badge as punishment in fealty test over 
> > > > > > > people while hoping to git a large and proper Meissner Effect out 
> > > > > > > of the Domes is insurmountably impossible without a change in the 
> > > > > > > leadership and/or the TM-anti-saint guidelines.  A large change 
> > > > > > > is needed right now from within TM.   
> > > > > > > -Buck
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > >

[FairfieldLife] Re: Repealing TM's Anti-Saint Policies

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> > > (snip)
> > > > From what I recall, there were 4 reasons MMY forbid looking 
> > > > elsewhere:  First, to protect people from getting sidetracked
> > > > from the TM path and onto a flashier but less evolutionary
> > > > method. The assumption here was that TMers were in many cases
> > > > unable to discern the difference between the Real Deal and
> > > > lesser and possibly harmful crap (ie Robin Carlson, etc).
> > > 
> > > (Carlsen.)
> > > 
> > > Wayback, since you are obviously not that familiar with
> > > Robin's "deal," you probably shouldn't use him as an
> > > example.
> > > 
> > > Without going into a long dissertation, possibly the most
> > > important thing to know in this context is that according
> > > to Peter Sutphen, Bevan said Maharishi had ordered him,
> > > Bevan, to leave Robin alone when Robin showed up at MIU
> > > with his group. Bevan ignored Maharishi's instruction,
> > > and a big public mess was the result.
> > > 
> > > Robin and his followers were completely dedicated to
> > > Maharishi. Maharishi had kept his eye on Robin when he
> > > was teaching in Canada (at that point most of his
> > > group were TM initiators) but never interfered.
> > > 
> > > Bottom line, Robin was an anomaly, not an example of
> > > the "lesser and possibly harmful crap" Maharishi wanted
> > > to "protect" TMers from.
> > >
> > I disagree.  I was around exactly when Robin was in full cry
> > and while I never went to hear him (and would not have bothered
> > to being at the time a fairly loyal Tm teacher) I heard from
> > others I trusted how odd the whole thing was. Whatever we have 
> > heard that MMY supposedly told Bevan, there is more to the
> > story.
> 
> Well, when you find out what more there was, do let us
> know. I'm just telling you what Peter said here that
> Bevan told him, and Peter is pretty reliable. Perhaps you
> can straighten it out with him.
> 
> And as I mentioned, there's also the fact that while
> Maharishi kept tabs on Robin and his group of TM
> initiators in Canada, Maharishi never interfered, so it
> appears Maharishi didn't think any "protection" was
> required.

The fact that MMY did not interfere says nothing about whether he felt Robin's 
followers needed "protecting." 
> 
> > It was not benign from what I heard from friends at that very
> > time.  People OTP or even somewhat devoted to MMY did NOT go
> > and see or follow Robin.  (Whether it is good to be OTP is a
> > whole other discussion). Robin and his group were not
> > considered at all to be devoted to MMY.
> 
> That may be, but those doing the considering were simply
> uninformed (or misinformed) on that point. Even after
> Maharishi had to disown Robin in the court case Bevan
> instigated, and Robin and his group had to leave town,
> Robin remained loyal to Maharishi for at least a couple
> of years (not sure of the exact time frame).
> 
> What's so ironic about your stance is that Robin came
> to MIU with the *very same beef* you and others have with
> its unreasonable rigidity and blacklisting and 
> gatekeeping. He felt MIU was stifling and even distorting
> Maharishi's teaching. There's a case to be made that
> Robin was way ahead of the game, having recognized
> earlier than most others that MIU was shooting itself in
> the foot.
> 
> (In fact, one might even make a case that Maharishi
> thought the powers-that-be at MIU needed to be shaken up
> and that Robin was just the person to do it--which could
> be why Maharishi told Bevan to leave Robin alone.)
> 
> There are several pieces in the Files section that confirm
> what Robin had in mind. Here's a quote from one of them,
> the text of an ad Robin placed in the Fairfield Ledger
> (it's in the Miscellaneous Writings folder):
> 
> "...For the sake of the immaculate wisdom that does flow from the 
> transcendent, and from the heart of Maharishi Mahesh Yogi, we challenge 
> faculty members at MIU to a public debate on the following topic: 'Be it 
> resolved that Maharishi International University has begun to define the 
> Science of C

[FairfieldLife] Re: Repealing TM's Anti-Saint Policies

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> (snip)
> > From what I recall, there were 4 reasons MMY forbid looking 
> > elsewhere:  First, to protect people from getting sidetracked
> > from the TM path and onto a flashier but less evolutionary
> > method. The assumption here was that TMers were in many cases
> > unable to discern the difference between the Real Deal and
> > lesser and possibly harmful crap (ie Robin Carlson, etc).
> 
> (Carlsen.)
> 
> Wayback, since you are obviously not that familiar with
> Robin's "deal," you probably shouldn't use him as an
> example.
> 
> Without going into a long dissertation, possibly the most
> important thing to know in this context is that according
> to Peter Sutphen, Bevan said Maharishi had ordered him,
> Bevan, to leave Robin alone when Robin showed up at MIU
> with his group. Bevan ignored Maharishi's instruction,
> and a big public mess was the result.
> 
> Robin and his followers were completely dedicated to
> Maharishi. Maharishi had kept his eye on Robin when he
> was teaching in Canada (at that point most of his
> group were TM initiators) but never interfered.
> 
> Bottom line, Robin was an anomaly, not an example of
> the "lesser and possibly harmful crap" Maharishi wanted
> to "protect" TMers from.
>
I disagree.  I was around exactly when Robin was in full cry and while I never 
went to hear him (and would not have bothered to being at the time a fairly 
loyal Tm teacher) I heard from others I trusted how odd the whole thing was. 
Whatever we have heard that MMY supposedly told Bevan, there is more to the 
story.  It was not benign from what I heard from friends at that very time.  
People OTP or even somewhat devoted to MMY did NOT go and see or follow Robin.  
(Whether it is good to be OTP is a whole other discussion). Robin and his group 
were not considered at all to be devoted to MMY.  In the end, it turned out 
that Robin's group was pretty dysfunctional, at least in how they related to 
him.  So, I stand by my opinion, that Robin's group was a good example of 
something other than TM that was not a healthy experience, at least for most 
people.  People have a right to choose to be involved in anything, but let's 
not sugar coat that particular example.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Repealing TM's Anti-Saint Policies

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
>
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson  wrote:
> >
> > As the Global Country of World Peace exists only in the minds of those too 
> > blind to see Marshy's legacy for what it was, a scam, you are in danger of 
> > losing nothing and the extremism you speak of has existed for decades - it 
> > ain't gonna change now, Pappy.
> > 
> >
> 
> It seems that extremists on both sides are determined to maintain the state 
> of hostility and hatred between the two positions, but logic says that there 
> should be a change of direction in order to turn a new page in this unstable 
> relationship and minimize the state of hostility and mistrust between the two 
> positions. 

>From what I recall, there were 4 reasons MMY forbid looking elsewhere:  First, 
>to protect people from getting sidetracked from the TM path and onto a 
>flashier but less evolutionary method. The assumption here was that TMers were 
>in many cases unable to discern the difference between the Real Deal and 
>lesser and possibly harmful crap (ie Robin Carlson, etc). Second, there is 
>value in sticking with a single path and not "diluting" it with other ways and 
>creating a mishmash of approaches. Third, the TMO and MMY would suffer if the 
>public noticed that TM'ers were still looking for help to solve their own 
>issues or to find a better Master.  Fourth, a belief that TM was the best way 
>and pretty much the only way to enlightenment.

Now, whatever of the above points might be true, or not,  things are different 
in  this day and age it is a fact that people will easily be able to look at 
other methods to meditate, calm themselves, or evolve.  To assume that once a 
person learns TM they will never be curious about another program or teacher or 
saint is ludicrous. And so is the assumption that they should be excluded from 
the good graces of the TMO if they do widen their horizons.The TMO has to make 
a decision soon: to continue to strictly follow MMY"s policy from about 1970, 
or to soften up and realize how different our world is now and how 
infantalizing the old policy is. 

 How simple it would be to just scrap the whole department that deals with the 
blacklisting and gatekeeping.  Just say the Domes are only for the practice of 
TM and TMSP, but all who agree to do this are welcome. Welcome back.

Everyone around the Prime Minister is saying they are only waiting for the guy 
to die to resolve the conflict.  However in mediation let us hope for a 
communal peace and reconciliation in a large group meditation before then.  
> -Buck
> 
> >  
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson  wrote:
> > >
> > > what you fail to take into consideration is that your Taliban-like 
> > > leaders took their cue from Marshy himself and that YEARS of TM, TMSP, 
> > > rounding, and being around Marshy has led them to this pass - draw - my 
> > > suggestion is get out before you waste anymore time, effort, energy and 
> > > money. 
> > > 
> > >
> > 
> > Son, what I truly wish is for moderation to return to the Country of Global 
> > Peace. This is my only wish. Extremism pains me greatly. We have suffered 
> > many blows as a result of extremism.
> > -Buck
> > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Repealing TM's  Anti-Saint Policies
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > >   
> > > 
> > > Repealing TM's  Anti-Saint Policies
> > > 
> > > Urgently "A  'repeal movement' is clearly needed now to save the TM 
> > > movement.  A repeal of the anti-saint policies if only to sustain a 
> > > meditation group for the Dome meditation numbers.  A meditation without 
> > > fear.  The TM movement's anti-saint policies have long bred hypocrisy and 
> > > contempt for the movement and its leadership inside and outside the 
> > > meditating community.  We need only look at the decades  long slide in 
> > > numbers meditating or the Dome meditation numbers.  They are down and it 
> > > is an uphill fight to get numbers back against the hard-heads on top.  
> > > Simply to save the Dome numbers meditating there needs to come along a 
> > > flat out repeal movement against these Dome policies.  The Dome policies 
> > > and guidelines have clearly failed to sustain our numbers and it is time 
> > > and has become our larger responsibility to change those guidelines with 
> > > repeal.  The Taliban-like leaders of the movement with their anti-saint 
> > > policies have made for a TM movement of
> > >  corruption, liars and hypocrites.  More than reforming, the time is come 
> > > for the repeal of the anti-saint polices to save the Dome meditating 
> > > program; Repeal now the anti-saint guidelines to save the Dome numbers.  
> > > The saints are returning soon again.  It is a fact of life.  Repeal the 
> > > TM-Anti-Saint policies now to save the Domes before it is too late..  The 
> > > time has come to make your voice heard and join the Anti-Saint repeal 
> > > movem

[FairfieldLife] Re: someone who understands M.E.

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008  wrote:
>
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> >
> > MMY was asked (I've seen the video) what his lifestyle was, and he looked 
> > very surprised as he slowly said that he was a householder.

bug I also heard him say, when asked questions about marriage, that he was not 
a householder and therefore could not comment.  I heard him say he was a monk.
> 
> That's interesting, you don't happen to remember where "in the sea of tapes" 
> this might be ?
> It certainly gives meaning. A householder has responsibilities, unlike a monk 
> who is free. And since Maharishi has resposebility not only for his own 
> students, but according to Muktananda "the whole world consciousness" the 
> word "householder" in this case certainly makes sense.
> 
> 
> > 
> > L
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Mike Dixon  wrote:
> > >
> > > I have to admit, he did run the TMO like a business, not sure what 
> > > business model that was.LOL! Buddha wasn't a Brahmin either, just another 
> > > Kshatriya, Jesus, a carpenter, not a Levite. I think once you've 
> > > fulfilled your dharma, you are obligated to help others. I've never seen 
> > > M as a priest but a monk and anybody can be a monk, even a poor one.Being 
> > > a monk is it's own dharma.
> > >  Don't know if he ever took formal vows. I take it that he didn't.He 
> > > said to take them before one is ready is not good and it puts limitations 
> > > on what one can do.
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: someone who understands M.E.

[Susan]

Mike, the words about Abrahmic religions were written by Xeno, not me.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Mike Dixon  wrote:
>
> Susan, to be a Jew, a male must be circumcised, an obligation but one can 
> convert. In Hinduism, one must be born a Hindu, no conversions accepted, so 
> I'm told by the Brahman priests of the Shri Meenakshi Temple of Pearland 
> Texas. Do all the yoga and yagyas you want, you'll never be a Hindu in this 
> life if you weren't born one. Who knows, neglecting your dharma, trying to 
> adopt another, could backfire. Damn girl, what if you took birth at the 
> bottom of the barrel in Hinduism, a Harijan?
> 
> From: Susan 
> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> Sent: Friday, June 14, 2013 2:56 PM
> Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: someone who understands M.E.
> 
>   In Abrahamic religions only the belief in certain teachings is sufficient 
> to allow a follower to be enlisted as a member of that religion. Whereas in 
> Dharmic religions certain obligations must be fulfilled to be considered part 
> of the religion.>
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: someone who understands M.E.

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Xenophaneros Anartaxius" 
 wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
> >
> > Just as a question, what exactly is it that makes
> > either Maharishi or the Bhagavad-Gita an "authority,"
> > one whose opinion should be valued or followed as
> > if it were "truth?"
> > 
> > While we're at it, since both of you are talking 
> > about "dharma" as if it were a Done Deal, and you
> > understand what it is, what is it? Define "dharma" 
> > for us. 
> > 
> > If you can't, please tell us who or what you believe
> > IS capable of defining "dharma," and telling someone
> > whether their actions are either in accord with it 
> > or not in accord with it. And follow up by telling 
> > us why you believe this "who" or "what" should be
> > regarded as an "authority." 
> > 
> > Thanks in advance...
> 
> WIKIPEDIA
> Dharma is the Law that "upholds, supports or maintains the regulatory order 
> of the universe". Dharma has the Sanskrit root -dhri, which means "that 
> without which nothing can stand" or "that which maintains the stability and 
> harmony of the universe." 


FWIW:  James Kelleher, a Vedic astrologer, has for many years said that 
according to what he sees in the charts, Dharma will be leaving planet earth 
for a while starting about 2019.  This would mean a time when law and order and 
traditions just don't work any more, and humans would have a very rough time of 
it.  

In Abrahamic religions only the belief in certain teachings is sufficient to 
allow a follower to be enlisted as a member of that religion. Whereas in 
Dharmic religions certain obligations must be fulfilled to be considered part 
of the religion.
> 
> My take on this is rather simplistic. Dharma is what happens. Only what 
> happens is what actually happens in the universe. Nothing but this happens. 
> This is dharma. You do not have to do or believe anything to be in your 
> dharma. Try and stop it.
> 
> Your are welcome, post hoc ergo propter hoc.
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Invitation: July 7-21 Governors Assembly at MUM Fairfield

[Susan]

Sunds like a great trip and going with the flow.  Maybe you will be inspired to 
give us some reports.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, laughinggull108  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> >
> > Which saints in India, LaughingG?
> 
> Hi Susan,
> 
> As far as living saints are concerned, I'm leaving that completely up to 
> nature. I'll be traveling to some prime saint areas for several weeks at 
> least, and will definitely be out and about among the natives so we will see 
> what is revealed. If and when the time is ripe, we're sure to run into each 
> other and I'll get what I need.
> 
> As far as dead saints are concerned, I'll be visiting the mahasamadhi mandirs 
> of several just to participate in the daily pujas. Very powerful and really 
> sweet.
> 
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, laughinggull108  wrote:
> > >
> > > 
> > > 
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Buck, just how does the TMO define 'a Saint'?
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do they define the lines that are crossed?
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > 
> > > > > Crossing over?  A line for the Dome badge, saints as spiritual 
> > > > > teachers who teach spiritual practices too.  They [The Bevan element] 
> > > > > have a line between saints who are spiritual teachers and saints who 
> > > > > are healers.  In their minds that sorts out a Master John Douglas [or 
> > > > > the Chinese medicine man who Bevan might well use] who they see as 
> > > > > just healers,  out  from an Ammachi or other saints and Sat Gurus.  
> > > > >
> > > > 
> > > > That of course is because an upper echelon of the movement does see, 
> > > > hosts and use Master John Douglas as a healer and the local TM 
> > > > administration conveniently ignores the dissonant fact that Master John 
> > > > Douglas teaches spiritual techniques as spiritual practices thus allow 
> > > > those people to keep their own badges.  Their healer spiritual teacher 
> > > > is a saint if anyone is.  
> > > >  
> > > > > =Keeping the company of saints, mahatmas, wise people:
> > > > > At incredible risk to their Dome badges.
> > > > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kiKZjq0vTWg 
> > > > > 
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Really nice pictures of the Domes on the [IA  Assembly] page.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > http://www.mum.edu/public-service/invincible-america
> > > > > > <http://www.mum.edu/public-service/invincible-america>
> > > > >
> > > > > > >  > The Domes are an incredibly real nice place to meditate.  We 
> > > > > > > could
> > > > > > sure use the re-enforcements if we could just bring back some 
> > > > > > fugitive
> > > > > > meditators again.  Something's got to change.
> > > > > > > -Buck in the Dome
> > > > > > > >
> > > 
> > > Hey Buck,
> > > 
> > > I'll be coming to FF and will be in the men's dome for at least a couple 
> > > of days. Maybe I'll see you around. Just between you and me, I'm on my 
> > > way to India to see all the saints. And I'm recertified! Oh, the shame! 
> > > Let's meet for lunch.
> > > 
> > > [snip]
> > >
> >
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Invitation: July 7-21 Governors Assembly at MUM Fairfield

[Susan]

Which saints in India, LaughingG?

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, laughinggull108  wrote:
>
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
> > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Buck, just how does the TMO define 'a Saint'?
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do they define the lines that are crossed?
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > 
> > > Crossing over?  A line for the Dome badge, saints as spiritual teachers 
> > > who teach spiritual practices too.  They [The Bevan element] have a line 
> > > between saints who are spiritual teachers and saints who are healers.  In 
> > > their minds that sorts out a Master John Douglas [or the Chinese medicine 
> > > man who Bevan might well use] who they see as just healers,  out  from an 
> > > Ammachi or other saints and Sat Gurus.  
> > >
> > 
> > That of course is because an upper echelon of the movement does see, hosts 
> > and use Master John Douglas as a healer and the local TM administration 
> > conveniently ignores the dissonant fact that Master John Douglas teaches 
> > spiritual techniques as spiritual practices thus allow those people to keep 
> > their own badges.  Their healer spiritual teacher is a saint if anyone is.  
> >  
> > > =Keeping the company of saints, mahatmas, wise people:
> > > At incredible risk to their Dome badges.
> > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kiKZjq0vTWg 
> > > 
> > > >
> > > > Really nice pictures of the Domes on the [IA  Assembly] page.
> > > > 
> > > > http://www.mum.edu/public-service/invincible-america
> > > > 
> > >
> > > > >  > The Domes are an incredibly real nice place to meditate.  We could
> > > > sure use the re-enforcements if we could just bring back some fugitive
> > > > meditators again.  Something's got to change.
> > > > > -Buck in the Dome
> > > > > >
> 
> Hey Buck,
> 
> I'll be coming to FF and will be in the men's dome for at least a couple of 
> days. Maybe I'll see you around. Just between you and me, I'm on my way to 
> India to see all the saints. And I'm recertified! Oh, the shame! Let's meet 
> for lunch.
> 
> [snip]
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Fwd: Invitation: July 7-21 Governors Assembly at MUM Fairfield

[Susan]

I think Barry became a teacher about when I did. And from the very early70's 
MMY made it clear that you could not be a teacher of TM in good standing and go 
and see or visit another saint or teacher.  HE did bring one or 2 to Switerland 
in the mid or early 70's, and everyone was rather surprised,  But it a TM 
teacher was seen at another teacher's ashram or lecture, it was likely to 
result in being black balled from future courses. The visitng saints when TTC 
was eld in India in the 1960's are a different time. Iw as not there and have 
no idea what MMYs attitude was then. But by 1970 or so, it was as I have 
stated, and Barry too. The siddhis came out in 1976 and 1977. the no saints 
policy was written in stone by that time.
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson  wrote:
> >
> > It is true he did have his followers rub elbows with a few
> > other "saints" but that was early in the Movement - by the
> > time the sidhis came out in the 70's that was all over with.
> 
> Ah. But Barry was already a teacher by the time the
> TM-Sidhis came out. Yet he says:
> 
> "From Day One of meeting him [Maharishi]...created a
> sense of 'sin' or 'wrongdoing' in anyone who wanted
> *to* meet them."
> 
> 
> 
> >  From: authfriend 
> > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> > Sent: Tuesday, June 11, 2013 2:12 AM
> > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Fwd: Invitation: July 7-21 Governors Assembly 
> > at MUM Fairfield
> >  
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "emptybill"  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > The reality outside of the incestuous guru-groupie ashrams of
> > > > US/Europe/pseudo-India is far from the reality. MMY's edicts to 
> > > > prevent his psychophants from "contamination" by other truths 
> > > > was a control move to guarantee kowtowing fidelity.
> > > 
> > > I like "psychophants." :-) And while I may disagree with
> > > your use of the word "truths" to describe that which they
> > > might have found by meeting other teachers, I completely
> > > agree that it was Maharishi who tried desperately to keep
> > > them from ever meeting them. From Day One of meeting him
> > > he put down other teachers and traditions, and created
> > > a sense of "sin" or "wrongdoing" in anyone who wanted
> > > *to* meet them. It was *very* much the same vibe as 
> > > women who go berserk if their boyfriend or husband even
> > > *looks* at another woman -- jealousy.
> > 
> > (Of course, no *man* ever goes berserk with jealousy
> > if his girlfriend or wife looks at another man.)
> > 
> > From what I understand, it isn't true that Maharishi
> > kept people from seeing other teachers. There are any
> > number of stories, some of which have been told here,
> > about Maharishi *arranging* meetings with various saints,
> > including Muktananda, Tat Walla Baba, Anandamayi Ma, and
> > others. There are even group photographs of the
> > gatherings.
> >
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Fwd: Invitation: July 7-21 Governors Assembly at MUM Fairfield

[Susan]

Nabby, the truth is that the no saint policy came directly from MMY.  It was 
his very own and clear directive all along. It may be that a decision will be 
made to loosen up on that policy. But as far as I know, the entire movement is 
functioning under that same rule.  Anything otherwise is considered OTP, altho 
no one in other countries may know about other saints or care so much as in the 
US. 
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008  wrote:
>
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
> 
> > The Prime Minister in this problem with the saints has created the movement 
> > culture of an underground of meditators.  He makes it very difficult for 
> > there to be success in the ME of meditation.   
> 
> Buck, are you on Facebook ? Seek out Anamay Ashram, all Vedic, run by 
> Governors. They just had a visit from a Saint. Very cosy and private. He was 
> very pleased with the progress there and gave his blessings. 
> 
> You must understand that the no-saint-policy is stritcly an american policy 
> and is hardly observed anywhere else, if at all. Just go with the flow or 
> emigrate.
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Fwd: Invitation: July 7-21 Governors Assembly at MUM Fairfield

[Susan]

Nabby, the only way to know for sure is for you to call the course office in 
FAirfield and ask if they would let you in the Dome if you follow and see Benj 
Creme.  My bet is that they would say No, you cannot do program in the Domes.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008  wrote:
>
> 
> 
> >  From: Alex Stanley 
> > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> > Sent: Thursday, June 6, 2013 3:48 PM
> > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Fwd: Invitation: July 7-21 Governors Assembly 
> > at MUM Fairfield
> 
>   
> They only seem to have a problem with competing Indian woo. 
> Euro-Anglo-Australo-woo is apparently not on their radar.
> 
> I'm not a woo-specialist, but if there is any woo going on with Mr. Benjamin 
> Creme it is most probably Euro-Anglo-Tibetan. What categhory would that fall 
> into ?
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: TM movement is doing great

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> >
> > That happened as soon as the Taliban took over, I believe, 
> > which was more than a decade ago.
> 
> And the world-saving, all-positive "Maharishi Effect"
> has been being practiced for how long now? 
> 
> You can't have it both ways. You can't claim "credit"
> for the good things that have happened in the world 
> without taking responsibility for the bad things that
> have happened in the same period. 

MMM, actually any org like the TMO could try to take credit for making things 
better than they would have been without the technique they have promoted.  But 
then the research would need to be objective and well done. But the fact that 
problems continue does not  necessarily mean that something like TM is 
ineffective - just not a cure all, or immediate.

In general, major global climate change seems like a the ultimate disaster 
taking place, regardless of small pockets of benevolent weather. Weatherwise, 
this ain't no Age of E.  It is the opposite.  It will be interesting to see how 
the weather in Fairfield and Skelmersdale (sp?) change or not. 
> 
> Similarly, if anyone in the TMO *dares* to "take credit"
> for benevolent weather in some area, they should take
> similar "credit" for the hurricanes and tornadoes of
> recent years, n'est-ce pas?
> 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, srijau@  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > there seems to be some people here who would imagine the
> > > > movement is not doing too well. I can tell you that the movement
> > > > is not even talking about some of the developments as they are
> > > > so stunning as to possibly provoke unnecessary controversy if
> > > > more widely known right now. Things might not be as you
> > > > imagine they should be based on how thing were in the past or
> > > > how you might imagine they should be or you might be attached
> > > > to your country being in the lead.
> > > 
> > > One of those things that was worse in the past and is "better now"
> > > that the movement isn't taking credit for because they're afraid
> > > it might provoke controversy:
> > > 
> > > [https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/941729_414697431971017_556360647_n.jpg]
> > >
> >
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: TM movement is doing great

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> >
> > That happened as soon as the Taliban took over, I believe, 
> > which was more than a decade ago.
> 
> And the world-saving, all-positive "Maharishi Effect"
> has been being practiced for how long now? 
> 
> You can't have it both ways. You can't claim "credit"
> for the good things that have happened in the world 
> without taking responsibility for the bad things that
> have happened in the same period. 

MMM, actually any org like the TMO could try to take credit for making things 
better than they would have been without the technique they have promoted.  But 
then the research would need to be objective and well done. But the fact that 
problems continue does not  necessarily mean that something like TM is 
ineffective - just not a cure all, or immediate.

In general, major global climate change seems like a the ultimate disaster 
taking place, regardless of small pockets of benevolent weather. Weatherwise, 
this ain't no Age of E.  It is the opposite.  It will be interesting to see how 
the weather in Fairfield and Skelmersdale (sp?) change or not. 
> 
> Similarly, if anyone in the TMO *dares* to "take credit"
> for benevolent weather in some area, they should take
> similar "credit" for the hurricanes and tornadoes of
> recent years, n'est-ce pas?
> 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, srijau@  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > there seems to be some people here who would imagine the
> > > > movement is not doing too well. I can tell you that the movement
> > > > is not even talking about some of the developments as they are
> > > > so stunning as to possibly provoke unnecessary controversy if
> > > > more widely known right now. Things might not be as you
> > > > imagine they should be based on how thing were in the past or
> > > > how you might imagine they should be or you might be attached
> > > > to your country being in the lead.
> > > 
> > > One of those things that was worse in the past and is "better now"
> > > that the movement isn't taking credit for because they're afraid
> > > it might provoke controversy:
> > > 
> > > [https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/941729_414697431971017_556360647_n.jpg]
> > >
> >
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Let your brain live forever in an artificial body

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Xenophaneros Anartaxius" 
 wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung  wrote:
> >
> > If it ain't a human body, it can't be a human consciousness.
> > 
> > Knowing myself the little I do, I can tell you, ain't no way I want to be 
> > me forever.  Finding myself in a robot nervous system would be, yep, 
> > torture, and so, yep. let's do Cheney.  
> > 
> > I think anyone would go insane almost instantly if this were possible.  I 
> > can't hardly stand waiting for a paper cut to heal, ya know?
> > 
> > And talk about your phantom limb syndrome then!  
> > 
> > Nuts.
> > 
> > Edg
> > 
> You can lose parts of the body, and it does not affect human consciousness. 
> Remember Christopher Reeve? As long as a living head, or even a living brain 
> is intact, the consciousness will have all the attributes of having had a 
> prior body. It might not be pleasant. A science fiction story by Harlan 
> Ellison has a great title that might represent your experience here: 'I Have 
> No Mouth and I Must Scream'.
> 
> This story, and a few others provided the story idea for the Terminator 
> series of films (Ellison sued the producers and the settlement was out of 
> court for infringement).
> 
> You would need sensory input. Without that the brain begins to hallucinate in 
> a fairly short time.
>

Here's a movei idea:  film the first person to go thru with this transfer of 
brain to artificial body.  It would be really interesting to watch the 
adjustment and reactions.What if after the brain installation the person hated 
it, asked to die?  Kind of creepy.  

[FairfieldLife] Re: Let your brain live forever in an artificial body

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
>
> Article on the idea of putting the contents of a human brain into an 
> artificial body. From Sunday's NY Times
> 
> http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/02/business/dmitry-itskov-and-the-avatar-quest.html?hpw
>
Questions this brings up, if it ever comes to be:

How much will it cost? I assume the wealthy will be able to do this while most 
others die.

Can we engineer the brain to be enlightened if the person wants that?  What 
about kundalini?

By the time this is possible, the effects of climate change will be in full 
swing. Who will want to live on a baked and burnt planet ravaged by climate 
change?  Although, not needing to eat will definitely change things.

[FairfieldLife] Let your brain live forever in an artificial body

[Susan]

Article on the idea of putting the contents of a human brain into an artificial 
body. From Sunday's NY Times

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/02/business/dmitry-itskov-and-the-avatar-quest.html?hpw

[FairfieldLife] Re: Another Voice in the Argument about Consciousness

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Xenophaneros Anartaxius"  
> wrote:
> (snip)
> > Now if we suppose this is what happens, and the 'rich inner
> > life' of experience goes by the wayside, what does this mean
> > in terms of the hard problem?
> 
> Nothing, because it doesn't "go by the wayside"--it can't,
> or you'd be a zombie. Your "rich inner life" may well
> become *poverty-stricken*, but it doesn't disappear. So
> the "hard problem" doesn't go away either.
> 
> (snip)
> > If I understand [Dennett's] view, then it is impossible to
> > discover there is such a thing as consciousness objectively.
> > Subjectively, it is an illusion created by the mind's 
> > interpretation of experience.
> 
> For there to be an illusion, there has to be something
> being deceived by it, so you can't dispense with
> consciousness (or the hard problem) that way either.
>

Judy, this last sentence made me think (and forgive me if you all already went 
over this, I am only now tuning in to a long running discussion).  Isn't it 
possible that the brain is like a machine, and so the illusion is merely 
deceiving a sensory machine, not a consciousness.  It could be that it is the 
sense of conscious I-ness that is the deception, the illusion. Underneath that, 
there is functioning but not an I or a witness or Consciousness to be deceived. 
 So it is the illusion itself that deceives itself, in a way.  Once that goes, 
there is nothing to be deceived.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Fwd: Invitation: July 7-21 Governors Assembly at MUM Fairfield

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> > >
> > > Here's an idea, an experiment:  Have a 4 week period 
> > > where anyone who ever got the siddhis can come and 
> > > fly in the Domes. The TMO could give out special 
> > > colored badges in advance. No background checks or 
> > > eliminating a person because they saw another saint 
> > > etc. Just anyone can come, everyone very welcome, 
> > > fly in to town for this, if need be. A really 
> > > welcoming, genuine atmosphere.
> > > 
> > > Then, see how it goes for those 4 weeks - Maybe 
> > > things would improve in some way: more people would 
> > > attend, the energy in the Domes would be more powerful.
> 
> While Susan's idea is noble, I doubt that many would
> take advantage of it. Most have moved on, and wouldn't
> really want to participate. If you couldn't get people
> to go there to bounce on their butts by paying them,
> you're not going to be able to do it by saying, "Come
> back to the dome, Little Sheba...all is forgiven."

True, but if people looked at it as a reunion, a revisiting of old times, old 
friends it might get some to come.  In truth, I doubt that the idea will work - 
as you say people did not appear even when paid to do so.  . But if they want 
to try and fill the Domes, it is all I can think of - other than taking some of 
the funds stashed in India and paying more Indians to do this.  There was once 
a lot of good will, but it drained away.
 
> Most people know that there is absolutely nothing that
> they need to be forgiven *for*. 
> 
> > With all due respect Susan, how can you be so sure 
> > about that? If you invite anyone who wants to come 
> > just because they learned the TMSP at some point 
> > you could get a lot of people in the Domes doing 
> > all sorts of woo-woo. Do you really want to be part 
> > of such an experiment ?
> 
> But here's one half of the real problem. Asshole
> elitists like Nabby and the other TBs who are so
> terrified of picking up Off The Program Cooties
> that they'd be afraid to be in the same room with
> someone who has done nothing more than visit the
> *same* saints they've visited, but kept hidden.
> 
> The other half -- not to be forgotten IMO -- is
> that there is and has always been an subconscious
> desire to *sabotague* the "dome numbers" to make
> sure that no real test of the ME theory was ever
> possible. As long as the TBs can claim that "We
> didn't make the numbers...no wonder nothing 
> happened," they can continue to believe that
> if they *had* "made the numbers" something would
> have. I think most of us here know that nothing
> would. 
> 
> If the TMO had *ever* really wanted to actually
> "prove" their ME theory, they had the money 100X
> over to make it happen. They could have spent a 
> mere fraction of their wealth, sponsored a huge 
> FREE course, and tried to get everyone to come. 
> Then they could have opened up the "science" to
> independent, non-biased researchers and offered
> them a chance to do parallel experiments to the
> biased, foregone-conclusion TM researchers' 
> experiments. 
> 
> This never happened, and I believe that a huge
> reason why it never did is that no one WANTED
> it to happen. Maharishi certainly didn't, accord-
> to the Kaplans and others who reported what he
> said in private. And the TMO honchos don't want
> it to happen, because if it "goes wrong" and
> absolutely NOTHING happens to crime statistics
> or weather or all the other things they'd claim
> "should" be affected, the last hangers-on in
> the TM movement would finally beat feet, the
> movement would dissolve, and they'd actually
> have to work for a living. 
> 
> "Achieving the dome numbers" is never going to
> happen. It won't happen because a small cadre of
> TM TBs wants to keep things all to themselves,
> without any Cooties around, and because the 
> people in charge don't want the ME ever really
> put to the test.
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Fwd: Invitation: July 7-21 Governors Assembly at MUM Fairfield

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008  wrote:
>
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> >
> > Here's an idea, an experiment:  Have a 4 week period where anyone who ever 
> > got the siddhis can come and fly in the Domes. The TMO could give out 
> > special colored badges in advance.  No background checks or eliminating a 
> > person because they saw another saint etc.  Just anyone can come, everyone 
> > very welcome, fly in to town for this, if need be.  A really welcoming, 
> > genuine atmosphere.
> > 
> >  Then, see how it goes for those 4 weeks - Maybe things would improve in 
> > some way:  more people would attend, the energy in the Domes would be more 
> > powerful.
> 
> With all due respect Susan, how can you be so sure about that ? If you invite 
> anyone who wants to come just because they learned the TMSP at some point you 
> could get a lot of people in the Domes doing all sorts of woo-woo. Do you 
> really want to be part of such an experiment ?
>

I am not sure about it.  I said "maybe"  things would improve in some way.  And 
the deal could be that you agree to just do TM and TMSP in the Domes.  But come 
on in and see how it feels.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Fwd: Invitation: July 7-21 Governors Assembly at MUM Fairfield

[Susan]

Share, yes feel free to get the idea to Bevan!

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Archer"  wrote:
>
> Without the mention of “Rick” because I wouldn’t go.
> 
>  
> 
> From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com] On 
> Behalf Of Share Long
> Sent: Thursday, May 30, 2013 7:07 AM
> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Fwd: Invitation: July 7-21 Governors 
> Assembly at MUM Fairfield
> 
>  
> 
>   
> 
> Susan, would it be ok with you if I were to send this suggestion to Bevan?  I 
> think it's a great idea.  Share
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>   _  
> 
> From: Susan mailto:wayback71@...> >
> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com <mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com>  
> Sent: Thursday, May 30, 2013 6:44 AM
> Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Fwd: Invitation: July 7-21 Governors Assembly at 
> MUM Fairfield
> 
>  
> 
>   
> 
> Here's an idea, an experiment: Have a 4 week period where anyone who ever got 
> the siddhis can come and fly in the Domes. The TMO could give out special 
> colored badges in advance. No background checks or eliminating a person 
> because they saw another saint etc. Just anyone can come, everyone very 
> welcome, fly in to town for this, if need be. A really welcoming, genuine 
> atmosphere.
> 
> Then, see how it goes for those 4 weeks - Maybe things would improve in some 
> way: more people would attend, the energy in the Domes would be more 
> powerful. Even maybe it would inspire those attending to come regularly 
> again. And Maybe the TMO would see it was all so wonderful and created such 
> goodwill that they would drop the restrictions in the future. It would be an 
> experiment. And it is a way to see, really, if there are "enough" people 
> around still wanting to do program in the Domes in Fairfield, Iowa. Heck, 
> even Rick would be admitted. At the least, it would be a fun social time, and 
> at best a real motivator for people to do program in the Domes. I like to 
> think that MMY himself would go for this. 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com <mailto:FairfieldLife%40yahoogroups.com> 
> , "Buck" mailto:dhamiltony2k5@> > wrote:
> >
> > Son, you were not here so don't just assume things but yes your advice 
> > below is good and true about the fourth estate below. That is also how 
> > things get done around here. Obviously they read this page and others about 
> > themselves and can move in ways accordingly. The meeting was a TM movement 
> > style public meeting where they control the stage seats and microphones in 
> > their way of decorum. Very top-down with the authority up front in the 
> > stuffed chairs with the mics. We're an extremely verbal group, but. When 
> > the mics were opened up a bunch of people lined up for the floor mics and 
> > the line got worked through. Mostly sincere people and some aggravated 
> > people too get up thinking to solve the problem in little ways. A couple 
> > good new ideas come but nothing of fundamental change offered. Not many 
> > people from in the town. Mostly concerned earnest faith-based kind of 
> > movement people who are not really going to jeopardize their access to 
> > everything by speaking out much truth to power. Though as soon as the 
> > meeting is over folks are talking to one another about real things. The 
> > enforced steady decorum of the moderated mic was not really about 
> > discussion. Just quick consideration of one point per and the point would 
> > be referred to further consideration in some groups. Mayor Malloy as a 
> > meditator did do an excellent job of moderating the usual community crazies 
> > too who get up to any open mics in any public meeting. After a while they 
> > announced the last comment as the mic went to a guy that it was getting 
> > late and the meeting was to end. So it went. Nothing really substantial 
> > related to our community deficit in the Dome numbers and who was 
> > responsible.
> > -Buck
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> > <mailto:FairfieldLife%40yahoogroups.com> , turquoiseb  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> > > <mailto:FairfieldLife%40yahoogroups.com> , turquoiseb  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> > > > <mailto:FairfieldLife%40yahoogroups.com> , "Buck"  
> > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Actually there was only one person tonite at the landmark 
> > > > > meeting who brushed 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Fwd: Invitation: July 7-21 Governors Assembly at MUM Fairfield

[Susan]

Here's an idea, an experiment:  Have a 4 week period where anyone who ever got 
the siddhis can come and fly in the Domes. The TMO could give out special 
colored badges in advance.  No background checks or eliminating a person 
because they saw another saint etc.  Just anyone can come, everyone very 
welcome, fly in to town for this, if need be.  A really welcoming, genuine 
atmosphere.

 Then, see how it goes for those 4 weeks - Maybe things would improve in some 
way:  more people would attend, the energy in the Domes would be more powerful. 
 Even maybe it would inspire those attending to come regularly again.  And 
Maybe the TMO would see it was all so wonderful and created such goodwill that 
they would drop the restrictions in the future.  It would be an experiment.  
And it is a way to see, really, if there are "enough" people around still 
wanting to do program in the Domes in Fairfield, Iowa.  Heck, even Rick would 
be admitted.  At the least, it would be a fun social time, and at best a real 
motivator for people to do program in the Domes.  I like to think that MMY 
himself would go for this. 

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
>
> Son, you were not here so don't just assume things but yes your advice below 
> is good and true about the fourth estate below.  That is also how things get 
> done around here.  Obviously they read this page and others about themselves 
> and can move in ways accordingly.  The meeting was a TM movement style public 
> meeting where they control the stage seats and microphones in their way of 
> decorum. Very top-down with the authority up front in the stuffed chairs with 
> the mics.  We're an extremely verbal group, but.  When the mics were opened 
> up a bunch of people lined up for the floor mics and the line got worked 
> through.  Mostly sincere people and some aggravated people too get up 
> thinking to solve the problem in little ways.  A couple good new ideas come 
> but nothing of fundamental change offered.  Not many people from in the town. 
>  Mostly concerned earnest faith-based kind of movement people who are not 
> really going to jeopardize their access to everything by speaking out much 
> truth to power.  Though as soon as the meeting is over folks are talking to 
> one another about real things.  The enforced steady decorum of the moderated 
> mic was not really about discussion.  Just quick consideration of one point 
> per and the point would be referred to further consideration in some groups.  
> Mayor Malloy as a meditator did do an excellent job of moderating the usual 
> community crazies too who get up to any open mics in any public meeting.  
> After a while they announced the last comment as the mic went to a guy that 
> it was getting late and the meeting was to end.  So it went.  Nothing really 
> substantial related to our community deficit in the Dome numbers and who was 
> responsible.
> -Buck
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Actually there was only one person tonite at the landmark 
> > > > meeting who brushed up against this talking about how 
> > > > experiences have been compromised in people because of 
> > > > an underlying problem. She spoke in code of course with 
> > > > the big guy up there in front of the room. Otherwise the 
> > > > suggestions were trivial, as if people did not know the 
> > > > antipathy old meditators have with the movement with the 
> > > > elephant sitting in the room. Two elephants actually.
> > > 
> > > Buck, I'm going to have to call you on this one. 
> > > 
> > > If YOU were there, why didn't YOU speak up?
> > > 
> > > The problems with the "dome program" are NOT because
> > > of the people administrating them. They're caused by
> > > the roomful of pussies to timid or too intimidated
> > > to say something about the policies. 
> > > 
> > > Don't you DARE keep ranting about Bevan and his gang
> > > if YOU didn't have the balls to say something when
> > > offered the opportunity to do so.
> > 
> > I'm mentioning this partly because of the chorus of
> > laudations for the late LB Shriver. I never knew him,
> > and his contributions to FFL were before my time. But
> > I've noticed a tendency in some people checking in 
> > here to admire him for standing up to the "powers that 
> > be" and actually making some of his comments and 
> > criticisms in public.
> > 
> > Which is admirable, except that the people applauding
> > him for doing this don't seem to do this themselves. 
> > They bend over and take in the ass from the TMO 
> > policies, then grumble safely from behind pseudonyms 
> > about the perps not having used any K-Y, if they
> > grumble at all. 
> > 
> > NOTHING will change about the TM movement until this
> > codependent enabling stops. I've said it before and 
> > I'll probably say it again -- i

[FairfieldLife] Re: A rap about Cognitive Dissonance

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
>
> Share will have to forgive me for not answering her questions "in line,"
> but I have been pondering them, so I will try to explain what I mean by
> "cognitive dissonance," and why I don't think it's in the least
> upsetting or uncomfortable. As defined, CD is holding two or more
> conflicting and in many cases opposite ideas in one's mind at the same
> time." For many people, this causes them some upset, confusion, or
> distress. Many react *to* CD by "stuffing" the opposite idea or concept
> they don't want to deal with, and pretending it isn't there.
> 
> Me, I prefer to bring it into the foreground of my thinking and deal
> with it, "juggling" it alongside any other ideas I might hold that it
> might seem to be the opposite of. For me, CD is FUN.
> 
> One of the reasons for this is that I owe no allegiance to any
> particular philosophy, school of thought, religion, or tradition. I am a
> member of no spiritual group or cult or religion or lineage, and hold no
> teacher or guru or saint as an "authority." For me, they were all Just
> Human Beings, doing their best to suss out the nature of life, given
> their own experiences and what they had been told by other people.
> 
> This FREES me to some extent from the *attachment* that causes so many
> people distress when encountering CD. For example, if you have spent a
> long time in the TM movement, you might have come to believe that MMY
> was an "authority," knowledgeable about many things, and thus To Be
> Believed when he talked about them. I hold no such belief. I also hold
> no such belief with regard to the original Buddha, or any other
> spiritual teacher in history, living or dead. I consider them ALL just
> fellow human beings, spouting their opinions.
> 
> But if I *did* believe what I've suggested about MMY, I might be tempted
> to *resist* examining certain ideas that run counter to his beliefs and
> teachings. When these ideas come up, a MMY TB might be tempted to think,
> "Well, that is completely contrary to what MMY said, so of course it
> can't be true. Therefore I shouldn't even waste time thinking about it."
> Doing this, they avoid the potential distress of CD.
> 
> Me, I examine the ideas. I don't owe MMY or his ideas or teachings any
> loyalty, and I don't owe them belief in these ideas of teachings. I make
> my own decisions. Thus, for me, seemingly contradictory ideas are an
> opportunity to PLAY, to examine seemingly contradictory ideas from many
> different viewpoints, and see which of these POVs strike a resonance
> with me. I'm not trying to determine "Truth" because I don't believe in
> the concept. I'm only playing with the ideas to see which seem most
> reasonable to me, based on my life experience and the general guidelines
> provided by Occam's Razor.
> 
> Let me give you a couple of examples. They are both questions that some
> people feel are "weighty," and that many of them have *very* strong
> opinions about, and thus attachments to. They are: 1) "Is there life
> after death?," and 2) "Is enlightenment real, and worth pursuing?"
> 
> For the first, I get to deal with everything I've ever heard or read on
> the subject, plus my own subjective experiences. I tend to believe that
> there *is* life after death, and it pretty much follows the Tibetan
> model -- dying, followed by a period in the Bardo. The Bardo period
> includes ALL of other religions' or other belief systems' ideas about
> both Heaven and Hell, but then opens up into a new life in another body.
> I tend to believe that this is what happens.
> 
> At the same time, I have NO PROBLEM examining and thinking about the
> more materialist view, that when one dies there is a big CLICK, followed
> by eternal darkness, and no more existence. I don't have any problem
> with this, because 1) neither I nor anyone else will ever know which is
> more correct until we actually die, and 2) if the latter scenario
> happens, there won't even be any "I" or "me" there to be disappointed
> that there is no Next Life. :-)
> 
> So I can juggle these two ideas simultaneously in my mind, without being
> either repulsed by or attached to either. The CD is there -- holding and
> appreciating opposite concepts -- but there is no distress because I am
> attached to neither one of them.
> 
> Take the second issue, whether enlightenment is worth pursuing as a
> goal. Now here I have somewhat of an advantage, in that I don't have to
> deal with the question of "Does enlightenment exist?" I've had
> experiences for weeks or months at a time that convince me it does. BUT,
> is it worth pursuing as a goal?
> 
> Many teachers say it is. Bzt. I consider none of them "authorities."
> Many people who claim to be enlightened say it is. Bzt. I don't
> consider them authorities, either. I've been there, done that with some
> of the states of mind they talk about and I don't consider them any
> "better" than other states of min

[FairfieldLife] Re: Arctic melting? Don't worry Avatars will save the world.

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
>
> Arctic temperatures are rising fast than expected:
> http://arctic-news.blogspot.nl/2013/03/huge-patches-of-warm-air-over-the-arctic.html

These climate changes and what will happen to earth and people is my major 
non-people related worry in life  and I am trying to just not think about it 
any more.  It really is the fundamental, root issue for all of us - other than 
enlightenment, for some.  Is there any genuine good news about this or 
scientists who think we can actually save things?  Folks, listen up:  humanity 
will be gone, gone destroyed.  It will be ugly and is happening way faster than 
even the pessimists expected back in the early 2000's. We are in serious 
trouble here and have no where to escape.  In a decade things are going to be a 
mess - we won't be here for the end days, but will witness some ugliness and  
fear coming very soon.

As I say, I make an effort to avoid reading about it anymore - way too 
depressing.   I just spent a weekend at a huge and famous garden (Longwood 
Gardens) while visiting mother in Pennsylvania.  I got there early when the 
doors opened, and soaked up the quiet and green smells. The wind was blowing in 
the tops of huge trees and the sounds were amazing.  I was all green and 
growing and thriving.  Consciousness seemed conscious everywhere there. If I 
were retired, I would spend more time outside, away from big cities (which I 
also love).  I don't want all this to be ruined.

So, Bhairitu, send me some good news on this topic if you come across it.   
Humanity needs to focus on this pronto and make it our primary cause and 
support people working to save the earth. Scientists are my superheroes.
> 
> But don't worry, super heroes will save the day:
> http://gf2045.com
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Seekers and Finders

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
> >
> > I recall that Maharishi once said that TM'ers (both practitioners 
> > and teachers) shouldn't be looking at other paths because it 
> > looked like you were still "seeking" an answer and had not 
> > "found" it in TM. IOW, bad PR. It's not unusual in India if 
> > a certain path or teacher doesn't work out that you move on 
> > to something else.  Of course westerners were "noobs" at 
> > all this yoga stuff and didn't know that.
> > 
> > To me it is interesting that here on FFL there are still after 
> > all these years a lot of "seekers" and a few "finders" whether 
> > the latter feel they've found it through TM or some other path. 
> >  Which are you?
> 
> Neither. 
> 
> I feel that "seeking" is a way of saying that one is 
> trying to bend the universe to your will and make it
> supply something limited to your feeble expectations.
> Fortunately, the universe rarely complies. How sad
> if it did, and people got stuck with their limited
> *ideas* of what enlightenment is. I suspect that the
> majority of people who claim to have "found" are in
> that situation, having settled for their own precon-
> ceptions, and thus their limitations.
>

You were a seeker for many years and, based on what you have written here over 
the years, had some amazing times, learned some valuable concepts, had some 
fine and also odd experiences, and then arrived at a point at which you no 
longer seek.  I assume this is a good thing for you.  Being a seeker was part 
of the process.

Lately I feel a bit "jaded" or perhaps "been there done that" when it comes to 
spiritual paths and seeking.  I look back fondly, and even with nostalgia, at 
the years I spent so excited about evolution, the way the universe seemed 
ordered, that there were answers to questions about humans and the cosmos and 
the mind and experiences.  There was a sense that life was always progressing 
in some planned manner.  That, for me, brought a sense of knowingness and 
especially security. And it was fun!  Devotion and new spiritual values feel 
terrific for a while.  Mostly it is a function of youth, I think. Novelty, too. 
 But seeking - wanting to know more or to recapture some expansive experience 
-gets that whole thing started, and I think that is a good thing for many (I 
know the TB types are upsetting).

I have seen a few other saints - and been impressed by them (Adyashanti) but 
find I have no sense of urgency about being with them. And no expectations.  I 
just enjoy being in their presence, hearing their words from time to time, and 
of course end up mentally measuring them against my own set of 
Maharishi-inspired concepts. Can't really help that, and since I am not a TM 
fundie, I think MMY's teachings serve me well.  I look forward to the day those 
concepts support letting them go and just being.  Meanwhile, I would stand in 
line for a while to get someone to enlighten me about my enlightenment!!  Know 
anyone?

[FairfieldLife] Re: Food Replicator

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
>
> On 05/22/2013 01:19 PM, Ann wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
> >> On 05/22/2013 09:56 AM, John wrote:
> >>> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
>  On 05/22/2013 06:58 AM, raunchydog wrote:
> > A Star Trek food replicator that can feed astronauts on a mission to 
> > Mars is in the works. I can't wait for this technology to hit the 
> > retail market. We won't shop for food. We'll just order powders for our 
> > replicating printers from Amazon.com and Voilà, duck a l'orange! 
> > Hmm...What do you think will be the powder? I'm guessing Soylent Green.
> > http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/technology/nasa-asks-could-3-d-printed-food-fuel-a-mission-to-mars/2013/05/21/76fc3668-c224-11e2-914f-a7aba60512a7_story.html
> >
> >
>  Enjoy variety in food now.  It's probably not a sustainable in a world
>  of more than 7 billion.  In the future you'll be eating "science diet
>  for humans."  But I'm sure they'll have "taco flavored", "italian
>  flavored", "beef flavored", etc.  The future's so bright you'll need to
>  wear shades.
> 
> >>> Srila Prabhupada stated that the world can be adequately fed by eating 
> >>> healthy foods, such as grains, beans, milk, and vegetables.
> >> So Prabhupada was a nutritionist?  Indians might be able to live on that
> >> diet but not people who have had generations of ancestors living on
> >> animal protein.  Nutrition is NOT an ideology.  You HAVE to eat what
> >> your body needs.  Otherwise that might be like putting water in your gas
> >> tank and hoping your car will run.
> >>
> > I guarantee you that there is not a soul on this planet who would die of 
> > starvation eating "just" grains, beans, milk and vegetables. After all, 
> > most of America exists on non foods already. In fact, leaving out animal 
> > proteins and dairy would greatly enhance the average person's diet as well 
> > as that coupled with the reduction of processed and fast food most of the 
> > population scarfs down daily. How do you explain the ability of thousands 
> > of people choosing a strictly vegetarian diet after eating a lifetime of 
> > meat and dairy to do so as successfully and healthily as they do? I believe 
> > the human body capable of great adaptation; just look at how we have been 
> > able to survive the extinction of the Twinkie - and live.
> 
> I don't think you can guarantee that  at all.  They wouldn't die of 
> starvation but  they might not be healthy.  They might lack the strength 
> and endurance.   I know people who claim they are doing great on an all 
> veg diet but need 10 hours of sleep a day.  And I bet they would fail 
> standard strength and endurance tests.
> 
> So I think you are being idealistic.  But I regularly piss off 
> nutritional idealists with information on biochemical individuality.  Of 
> course that's been around for centuries with Asian medicine but also 
> over the last century with western medicine.  It's like people who live 
> nearer the equator where a meat eating diet might make them more acid 
> have genes for a vegetarian diet and can maintain a strong endocrine 
> system especially thyroid and adrenals on that diet.
> 
> Back in the 1970s I knew a lot  of meditators and TM teachers who tried 
> to survive on a vegetarian diet.  Many suffered from hypoglycemia.  Many 
> gave up the vegetarian diet and didn't look back and went on to live 
> healthy lives.

That's me.  All veg diet due to TM influence and then really awful 
hypoglycemia. Anxiety, fatigue, even odd thinking.  I did not feel myself.  It 
took me 2 years to figure out that was what was going on.  And when I went back 
to protein, chicken, fish, no or low carbs, the difference was incredible in 
just 4 days.After that experience, I know how important it is to eat what your 
own body needs, not follow some generic plan.
> 
> Now please write on the blackboard 300 times:
> Nutrition is not  an ideology.  It is individual and you have to eat 
> what your body needs. :-D
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: A Changed Land in Iowa

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
>
> On 05/22/2013 09:32 AM, Buck wrote:
> > What is going on?  The cash payments along with accelerated depreciation 
> > schedules in the farm program.  Extra cash to the guys that 'farm' the farm 
> > program allows them downpayment to buy more land and also get more 
> > equipment to shield the added tax burden [depreciation against income] of 
> > the free cash payment.  Also the incredible benefit of Federal (free) 
> > subsidized crop insurance.  This has gone on for decades and allowed for a 
> > class of farmers to get bigger all the time to the point where there are 
> > very few people in farming anymore. Yes, Has kept heavy industry (pick-up 
> > trucks and tractors) in business during hard times too.  The problem is the 
> > free cash coming in to the system.
> > Fewer landholders now and now a class of equipment owners looking for land 
> > to farm at the margin.  That right there is driving rents crazy.  Perceived 
> > tight rents related to supposed commodity prices are driving land prices.  
> > In the mean time there is an incredible amount of land that has been 
> > brought in to row crop right now that new acres added to row cropping.  
> > Planted with the new high tech incredibly high yielding seed that is way 
> > more productive in crop yields than just a few years ago.  Average yield is 
> > up even in drought times of the last summers.  If they get a decent year 
> > they will be way over-produced.  Loan Payments will stumble on land, 
> > equipment and inputs.  Land will consolidate further in to the hands of 
> > holding companies from outside of farming.  Banks and insurance companies 
> > hold title to a lot of ground already and this class of equipment owning 
> > tenants is running around frantically trying to rent it. Even the younger 
> > generation X members of the Adam family hunt ground and scwabble over land 
> > rents to farm.  It is extremely competitive.
> >
> > This is what is going on.  It is a big deal that is a fast re-shaping in 
> > the landscape.  Huge loss of private land owners has already happened.  
> > Serfs and landowners.  Very few people own the land they farm in a typical 
> > Iowa county anymore.  It is shocking and will never go back without some 
> > kind of revolution to allow for access to own land by people.  The time of 
> > the corporation has come and is here now.  Private ownership is really not 
> > possible now.  The soil erosion of this big row-cropping is huge as an 
> > added consequent of this farming.  Really a lot of soil has gone downhill.  
> > Most anything with slope has really thinned to clay in the last few years 
> > of these rains visible even to the naked eye.  These land holding entities 
> > are sitting on thinning assets that way.  It is stunning.  Drive any 
> > direction right now and you can see it.  We are getting repeated 
> > rain-events and have been since late winter.  There is nothing on the 
> > landscape holding the soil right now from this kind of large scale 
> > mono-cropping row crop farming.  Welcome to the future,
> > -Buck out standing in his field
> >
> >
> 
> Sounds like the future is the past.  After a brief reprise of a couple 
> centuries the landed gentry is taking back the land from the serfs.  
> After all weren't they deemed by God to rule over other humans.  
> Obviously because they were able to accrue lots of money which God wants 
> them to have.
> 
> But probably with the observed increase of CO2 the party is over for 
> life on earth.  The future's so bright you're gonna need shades...
>

Yep, and this is coming much sooner than most experts expected.  We are seeing 
the beginnings of the changes.  Do you have any dates from jyotish that seem 
likely for major shifts or events?

[FairfieldLife] Re: It is over. Our Largesse is Come to an end.

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, doctordumbass@...  wrote:
>
> Susan, Perhaps just keeping TM in the news is enough. Also the bar is set 
> pretty low for spiritual organizations, so by keeping their noses relatively 
> clean, there is a big advantage for the TMO being mentioned in the news. They 
> don't have to do anything particularly impressive, just have TM available as 
> a product, for those interested. 

True.  I was thinking mainly of the people already doing TM for years and years 
and having some knowledge of the inside stuff - with them, credibility is 
nearly nil.  For the public, just getting the TM name out there is quite 
effective.  People are starved for relief from stress, for quiet.
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> >
> > 
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > This is not the end of the Assembly in Fairfield, only 
> > > > that the Grant money is come to an end. The Fairfield 
> > > > Assembly will become something else. The donors felt 
> > > > there was more bang for the dollar funding going where 
> > > > there are already much larger group meditations. Their 
> > > > money is going to go where they can support the really 
> > > > large groups of meditators in Latin America and Asia
> >   
> > > 
> > > The existence of which they have possibly only been
> > > told about. Let us hope that they actually demand to
> > > *go* there and be *shown* these supposedly large 
> > > groups of meditators before donating any money. 
> > > 
> > 
> > Exactly.  And I am sure they will go and look it over.  But really, the TMO 
> > is now in a position where no one takes the news or info or pr seriously at 
> > all. People just discount it and move on.   So now if something 
> > legitimately great is going on, no one responds.  Too many years of hype, 
> > exaggeration.
> > 
> > 
> > > Or has everyone forgotten the photographs of the
> > > supposed group of "10,000 Mayans" that showed that
> > > the group consisted of at most 300 people. 
> > > 
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > I think it was a pretty nice offer to pay people to meditate.  Very 
> > > > > generous, actually, on the donor's part.  And Michael, while I agree 
> > > > > with you on many things, not this. The people who chose to get paid 
> > > > > to meditate in the Domes are adults (not serfs) - and I think most 
> > > > > are well over 25.  Perhaps this was a really good thing for them.  
> > > > > And I don't think it was 8 hrs per day, either.  Maybe they had 
> > > > > nothing else to do anyway, and so this was good.  Buck would know for 
> > > > > sure, but I think this offer was around for about 5 years?  So these 
> > > > > people did not spend 30 years doing this.  If by their 50's or so 
> > > > > these people had nothing else going and are living in Fairfield and 
> > > > > have tons of free time, well then that is a problem (or maybe just a 
> > > > > situation) you can't really blame on the TMO.  At some point they are 
> > > > > responsible for their own choices.  My guess is that for some, this 
> > > > > was about all they could manage and meant alot. Good for them, they 
> > > > > got lucky for a while.
> > > > > 
> > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > TMO Serfs.  Now they can join the other growing number of serfs in 
> > > > > > the US.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > On 05/17/2013 06:45 AM, Michael Jackson wrote:
> > > > > > > The deal was 800 bucks a month if you qualify. As usual the 
> > > > > > > Movement leave you in the lurch in the end. More to the point, it 
> > > > > > > encourages people to lead a very dysfunctional and impractical 
> > > > > > > lifestyle - to be sitting with the eyes closed 8 hours a day and 
> > > > > > > earning no money so that when the Movement donors jerk the rug 
> > > > > > > out from under, you are left with no job, no job skills and no 
> > > > > > > place to go.
> > &

[FairfieldLife] Re: It is over. Our Largesse is Come to an end.

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
> >
> > This is not the end of the Assembly in Fairfield, only 
> > that the Grant money is come to an end. The Fairfield 
> > Assembly will become something else. The donors felt 
> > there was more bang for the dollar funding going where 
> > there are already much larger group meditations. Their 
> > money is going to go where they can support the really 
> > large groups of meditators in Latin America and Asia
  
> 
> The existence of which they have possibly only been
> told about. Let us hope that they actually demand to
> *go* there and be *shown* these supposedly large 
> groups of meditators before donating any money. 
> 

Exactly.  And I am sure they will go and look it over.  But really, the TMO is 
now in a position where no one takes the news or info or pr seriously at all. 
People just discount it and move on.   So now if something legitimately great 
is going on, no one responds.  Too many years of hype, exaggeration.


> Or has everyone forgotten the photographs of the
> supposed group of "10,000 Mayans" that showed that
> the group consisted of at most 300 people. 
> 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> > >
> > > I think it was a pretty nice offer to pay people to meditate.  Very 
> > > generous, actually, on the donor's part.  And Michael, while I agree with 
> > > you on many things, not this. The people who chose to get paid to 
> > > meditate in the Domes are adults (not serfs) - and I think most are well 
> > > over 25.  Perhaps this was a really good thing for them.  And I don't 
> > > think it was 8 hrs per day, either.  Maybe they had nothing else to do 
> > > anyway, and so this was good.  Buck would know for sure, but I think this 
> > > offer was around for about 5 years?  So these people did not spend 30 
> > > years doing this.  If by their 50's or so these people had nothing else 
> > > going and are living in Fairfield and have tons of free time, well then 
> > > that is a problem (or maybe just a situation) you can't really blame on 
> > > the TMO.  At some point they are responsible for their own choices.  My 
> > > guess is that for some, this was about all they could manage and meant 
> > > alot. Good for them, they got lucky for a while.
> > > 
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > TMO Serfs.  Now they can join the other growing number of serfs in the 
> > > > US.
> > > > 
> > > > On 05/17/2013 06:45 AM, Michael Jackson wrote:
> > > > > The deal was 800 bucks a month if you qualify. As usual the Movement 
> > > > > leave you in the lurch in the end. More to the point, it encourages 
> > > > > people to lead a very dysfunctional and impractical lifestyle - to be 
> > > > > sitting with the eyes closed 8 hours a day and earning no money so 
> > > > > that when the Movement donors jerk the rug out from under, you are 
> > > > > left with no job, no job skills and no place to go.
> > > > >
> > > > > What a bunch of asses. They think only of themselves.
> > > > >
> > > > > And that should be 50 for me. But believe me, I will weigh in come 
> > > > > tomorrow.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > 
> > > > >   From: Ann 
> > > > > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> > > > > Sent: Friday, May 17, 2013 9:35 AM
> > > > > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: It is over.  Our Largesse is Come to an 
> > > > > end.
> > > > >   
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "feste37"  wrote:
> > > > >> That's going to hit some people hard. They've come to depend on that 
> > > > >> stipend.
> > > > > I saw this end to the grant thing on, of all places, FB a few days 
> > > > > ago. There it said people were paid $3.80 per hour to meditate in the 
> > > > > Domes. Is that correct? Were there other monies paid for living 
> > > > > expenses and travel to FF?
> > 
> > > > >> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck" wrote:
> > > > >>> Yep, Dr. Bevan Morris, Prime Minister of the Global Country of 
> > > > >>> World Peace and President of Maharishi University of Management 
> > > > >>> yesterday morning announced to the Invincible America Assembly the 
> > > > >>> end of the Invincible America grant program.  The incredibly 
> > > > >>> high-minded program of subsidizing large group meditations by 
> > > > >>> granting stipends to people to facilitate larger numbers of people 
> > > > >>> being able to meditate together will wind down over the next three 
> > > > >>> months.  It was an incredibly generous gift of large civic thinking 
> > > > >>> to try to make a noble experiment work.  I am grateful to those who 
> > > > >>> gave to make it work, those who worked to administrate it and those 
> > > > >>> few who did come join to make it happen.
> > > > >>> -Buck in the Dome
> > > > >>>
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: It is over. Our Largesse is Come to an end.

[Susan]

I think it was a pretty nice offer to pay people to meditate.  Very generous, 
actually, on the donor's part.  And Michael, while I agree with you on many 
things, not this. The people who chose to get paid to meditate in the Domes are 
adults (not serfs) - and I think most are well over 25.  Perhaps this was a 
really good thing for them.  And I don't think it was 8 hrs per day, either.  
Maybe they had nothing else to do anyway, and so this was good.  Buck would 
know for sure, but I think this offer was around for about 5 years?  So these 
people did not spend 30 years doing this.  If by their 50's or so these people 
had nothing else going and are living in Fairfield and have tons of free time, 
well then that is a problem (or maybe just a situation) you can't really blame 
on the TMO.  At some point they are responsible for their own choices.  My 
guess is that for some, this was about all they could manage and meant alot. 
Good for them, they got lucky for a while.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
>
> TMO Serfs.  Now they can join the other growing number of serfs in the US.
> 
> On 05/17/2013 06:45 AM, Michael Jackson wrote:
> > The deal was 800 bucks a month if you qualify. As usual the Movement leave 
> > you in the lurch in the end. More to the point, it encourages people to 
> > lead a very dysfunctional and impractical lifestyle - to be sitting with 
> > the eyes closed 8 hours a day and earning no money so that when the 
> > Movement donors jerk the rug out from under, you are left with no job, no 
> > job skills and no place to go.
> >
> > What a bunch of asses. They think only of themselves.
> >
> > And that should be 50 for me. But believe me, I will weigh in come tomorrow.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > 
> >   From: Ann 
> > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Friday, May 17, 2013 9:35 AM
> > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: It is over.  Our Largesse is Come to an end.
> >   
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "feste37"  wrote:
> >> That's going to hit some people hard. They've come to depend on that 
> >> stipend.
> > I saw this end to the grant thing on, of all places, FB a few days ago. 
> > There it said people were paid $3.80 per hour to meditate in the Domes. Is 
> > that correct? Were there other monies paid for living expenses and travel 
> > to FF?
> >> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
> >>> Yep, Dr. Bevan Morris, Prime Minister of the Global Country of World 
> >>> Peace and President of Maharishi University of Management yesterday 
> >>> morning announced to the Invincible America Assembly the end of the 
> >>> Invincible America grant program.  The incredibly high-minded program of 
> >>> subsidizing large group meditations by granting stipends to people to 
> >>> facilitate larger numbers of people being able to meditate together will 
> >>> wind down over the next three months.  It was an incredibly generous gift 
> >>> of large civic thinking to try to make a noble experiment work.  I am 
> >>> grateful to those who gave to make it work, those who worked to 
> >>> administrate it and those few who did come join to make it happen.
> >>> -Buck in the Dome
> >>>
> >
> >
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: A Little advice

[Susan]

According to Steven Brill, Medicare payouts for medications, hospital 
procedures and dr visits are just about what is "fair."  This is because 
Medicare has such a huge database and they have shopped intensively for info 
and have come up with fair fees for services.  Drs and hospitals accept those 
fees and still do well enough.  Medicare reimbursement fees are Fair in the 
sense that they cover the cost of the service and then some for labor, profit 
etc.  Anything above the fee that Medicare pays is total profit.  Medicare 
reimbursements for most everything you can think of are at least 1/10 (AT 
LEAST) of the going rate.  Insurance companies have deals negotiated with 
providers and hospitals and they pay about 50% of the charges that people 
without insurance have.  So, you can get a good idea of a fair price by finding 
out what Medicare reimburses for a particular service or shot or visit.
Hospitals use what is called a "chargemaster" list to give them a price for a 
service (even an alcohol swab which is often about $7). The chargemaster is 
kept very confidential and was developed by each hospital, has no real rhyme or 
reason, and varies drastically from hospital to hospital.  It is just 
computerized and when anyone questions the bill, no one can really say anything 
other than that this is what it costs here.  Your local hospital might charge 
$5,000 for an MRI, Medicare might pay $250 for the same, and a hospital 8 
blocks away might charge $2,500 for it.  It is that crazy.


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
>
> On 05/16/2013 06:58 AM, Mike Dixon wrote:
> > I strongly recommend anybody who has not received a Shingles vaccination 
> > get one. I know they are expensive, about $300 and most insurance won't 
> > cover it, yet. I started having intense pain in my neck, left shoulder and 
> > left arm yesterday, a classic sign of a heart attack. I live across the 
> > street from my regional hospital and drove myself to the emergency room and 
> > told them of my pain. They began  the diagnostics and applied a 
> > nitroglycerin patch. Two hours later the doctor said he wasn't seeing any 
> > signs of a heart attack and then pointed to blistery patch on my left arm, 
> > about where you would get a vaccination, and asked when i first noticed it 
> > and I told him this morning. He told me it looks like Shingles and that 
> > would cause the pain I was having. Anyway after a second round of blood 
> > tests and a couple more hours of observation they sent me home with anti- 
> > viral medication and Tramadol. Anyway, Shingles is not fun and I would 
> > recommend everybody
> >   get vaccinated. Now my insurance can pay for an emergency room visit and 
> > heart attack diagnosis,plus a follow-up visit to my Cardiologist, I'm sure, 
> > a lot more than a Shingles vaccination. Avoid the suffering before it 
> > comes, dudes!
> 
> Merck charges the doctor only $150 for the vaccine.  The doctors mark it 
> up.  Those interested might want to check into pricing.  I think some of 
> the drug chains that have shots charge less.
> 
> We have don't have Obamacare in this country we have Banditocare. There 
> was an article last week comparing the prices of different medical 
> procedures some costing 20 times more in one location that in another.  
> We're being ripped off.
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Coping

[Susan]

Wow, Barry.  NOt my area of expertise at all, but sounds as if the people who 
understand what you are all doing think it is really good.  Congrats.  Nice to 
be part of a field at its inception and then as it grows (computers etc)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Share Long  wrote:
>
> turq, if this is what you've been working on, congratulations!  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  From: turquoiseb 
> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2013 10:21 AM
> Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Coping
>  
> 
> 
>   
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "seventhray27"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb wrote:
> > > These days, Steve, you're pretty much "It" for the Hate
> > > Brigade, since you're one of the only people who will
> > > bother even trying to interact with them as if they
> > > might have something to say. I think that's magnanimous
> > > and compassionate of you, but to them it just makes you
> > > a target.
> > 
> > I admit Barry, I find FFL rather dull without those interactions.  So I
> > guess I'm a pretty guilty party.
> 
> You've definitely got a point there about FFL as a whole. :-) 
> If you're having fun interacting with these folks, by all means 
> continue. It stopped being even interesting for me some time ago.
> 
> > BTW, neat story about your current working assignment.
> 
> It's an interesting project. News about it arrived today, for
> those (few) who might be interested:
> 
> IBM Worklight Wins SIIA CODiE Award
> 
> IBM Worklight was just announced as the winner of the 2013 CODiE Award for 
> Best Mobile Development Solution by the Software and Information Industry 
> Association (SIIA), the principal trade association for the software and 
> digital content industries. The SIIA CODiE Award win is a prestigious honor 
> as winners are reviewed and chosen by software industry executives and SIIA 
> member votes.  
> 
> http://www.siia.net/codies/2013/winners_detail.asp?nID=480 
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Free Feast and Flight, Saturday, May 11th

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley"  
wrote:
>
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
> >
> > On 05/12/2013 09:58 AM, Alex Stanley wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Jason"  wrote:
> > >>
> > >
> > > ---  "Ann"  wrote:
> > >> If I were in FF I would be sure to be there today - no lie.
> >  ---  "Alex Stanley"  wrote:
> > > Ugh... I am in FF, and you couldn't pay me to go.
> > >
> > >
> > >>> ---  "salyavin808"  wrote:
> >  Are you more of a steak and chips man Alex?
> > 
> > 
> > >> ---  "Alex Stanley"  wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> Grass-fed steak, and replace the chips with something non-starchy. And, 
> > >>> ditch the life-abnegating, fundie Hindu dogma as well.
> > >>>
> > >> Replace the steak with fish, it's better for you.
> > > I eat only one meat/poultry/fish/eggs meal per day, eaten between mid 
> > > morning and early afternoon, and I alternate with two days of 
> > > fish/eggs/poultry followed by one day pastured beef or lamb. The dairy in 
> > > my diet is Radiance Dairy cream in my coffee, one little cup of full fat 
> > > fruit yogurt 5-6 days a week, and a little butter. The bulk of my diet is 
> > > non-starchy plant foods, much of it raw. I eat my last meal of the day, 
> > > usually carrot sticks and guacamole, at 5pm, so that I sleep on an empty 
> > > stomach and basically fast for 12 hours every day.
> > >
> > > Personally, I don't care what any mainstream dietary dogma or 
> > > "conventional wisdom" says is healthy. I spent decades believing that 
> > > kind of stuff while completely ignoring my body telling me that it was 
> > > all wrong for my physiology. With all my experience from eating wrong to 
> > > eating right, I am now acutely aware of my metabolism and how it is 
> > > affected by diet. I experience two types of hunger: caloric hunger and 
> > > nutrient hunger. I eat the red meat that I do because it provides a deep 
> > > sense of nutrient satiety that no other food provides. I avoid starch 
> > > because I'm carbohydrate sensitive, and the glucose load spikes and 
> > > crashes my blood sugar, making me tired and lethargic and ramping up 
> > > caloric hunger to a level that drives overeating. My diet is all about 
> > > high quality, nutrient dense foods that give the body what it needs while 
> > > maintaining a state of endocrine serenity.
> > >
> > >
> > 
> > Are you a "brittle diabetic?"  My aunt who was my mother's twin sister 
> > and an RN always thought my mother was.  In fact my mother had a GTT and 
> > it had the curve and she also suffered from hypoglycemia.  Same with 
> > me.  I thought the term "brittle diabetic" was something my aunt made up 
> > but it is a real medical term. Brittle diabetics are like type 1 but the 
> > condition is too unstable to diagnose as type 1.   And yes, chasing your 
> > blood sugar can really put the weight on.
> >
> 
> I've never gotten any kind of diagnosis, but I've had blood sugar issues my 
> entire life. For the most part, I grew out of the worst of it, which then 
> allowed me to spend the first two decades of my adulthood believing Ayurvedic 
> and new age dietary dogmas and eating a diet largely based on grains and 
> beans. Thankfully, an ugly descent into middle age put an end to that. A few 
> years ago, my HbA1c tested normal, so I don't think I have diabetes.
>

Alex, I find an egg or 2 for breakfast keeps me steady for a long period of 
time.  And I feel really satisfied.  A great food, for me.

[FairfieldLife] Re: The Economy Needs You to Work Past 70

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
>
> Studies show that the millennial generation would rather not work as 
> much, have less money but have more free time.  They're also learning 
> that "everyone wins" is a myth.
> 
> Before healthcare was being legislated companies like Toyota and 
> Starbucks were saying their biggest expense was healthcare insurance.  
> Seems to me they and other corporations (most all would have said the 
> same thing) would have been for single payer? Ah, but their buddies who 
> ran the insurance companies got them to support that windfall for them 
> or the joke of a healthcare bill that was passed.

Exactly.  But I think they will change their tune over time.  It is 
unsustainable for anyone or any  company to pay these rates we are charged.

  In reality single 
> payer, something like Medicare for all, would have still kept the 
> insurance companies in business.  I'm on Medicare and I get sales 
> pitches all the time from the health insurance companies for their 
> supplemental policies.

In business, but less so.
> 
> On 05/10/2013 05:41 AM, Susan wrote:
> > I think that we need to be able to work 1/2 time or 3/4 time at any point 
> > in our lives.  I think most people would love this option and could have 
> > more free time to do lots of the other fun things in life.  An added bonus 
> > - it would allow more people to have jobs, which we need, especially the 
> > younger generation graduating from college and struggling to find jobs.. 
> > There just are not enough jobs and needs to have full employment, full 
> > time, for all those that want it.  So let's have partial employment/job 
> > sharing for anyone who wants to work.
> >
> > The reason this is not happening here? The big problem is that once you 
> > don't work full time, here in the USA, you don't get health insurance.  So 
> > the whole idea falls apart unless we can get single payer Medicare-like 
> > coverage for all..  Then people would feel freer to make work and life 
> > choices and be flexible and could change up their options at different 
> > points in their lives. The whole Obamacare thing is not going to work, nice 
> > as it sounds.   It is just a modification of the current complicated 
> > system.  Steven Brill's article in TIme nailed it - we are way way 
> > overcharged by hospitals (especially nonprofits) and that is what is 
> > driving the whole medical fee disaster here.  Medicare pays for services at 
> > an appropriate rate (about one tenth of what the younger public is 
> > charged).  Yes 1/10th!  Amazing.  Theprofit for nonprofit hospitalas is 
> > humongous.  This then drives everythiing else, including the reason people 
> > here try to work fulltime no matter...
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
> >> On 05/09/2013 12:36 PM, John wrote:
> >>> How many here agree with this proposal?
> >>>
> >>> http://www.cnbc.com/id/100724186?__source=yahoo%7Cfinance%7Cheadline%7Cheadline%7Cstory&par=yahoo&doc=100724186%7CAttention%20Boomers:%20US%20Nee
> >>>
> >>>
> >> 1) Work is not the purpose of life.  The wealthy landowners tried to
> >> sell that idea to their serfs so they could lounge around while their
> >> serfs did all the work for little money.
> >> 2) Work is not holy.  That's something the kings wanted to convey so you
> >> stayed busy and didn't cook up a coup d'etat against him.
> >> 3) Work is a means to an end and not an end in itself.   It's supposed
> >> to be a way to exchanges your services for products or someone else's
> >> services.
> >> 4) There are fewer jobs because less needs to be done.  We've automated
> >> a lot of boring jobs that no human should be doing and should automate
> >> more.  For instance, except for custom clothing which would be
> >> interesting for someone who likes to do that and not repetitive you
> >> might as well design clothes that can be made entirely by machine. IOW,
> >> do away with those slave labor sweat shops in other countries.
> >> 5) People who love what they could might not mind doing that line of
> >> work until they drop dead.  Creative people make up a lot of that group
> >> but society doesn't seem to like people who enjoy their work. They'd
> >> rather hire you for something you hate doing.
> >> 6) Scrap the Christian-Judeo work ethic.  It's bullshit anyway according
> >> to what I've already stated.
> >> 7) In a world of 7 billion people there won't be enough work.  Stop
> >> adding to the population.  We don't need more people and need over the
> >> coming decades and centuries to reduce the population humanely to around
> >> 1 billion.  But try to sell that to the folks who hold the purse
> >> strings.  Either they want to reduce the population through genocide or
> >> wars.  Most of the rich are mentally ill anyway.  Who needs a billion
> >> dollars?
> >> 8) Instead begin a leisure society.  Reduced hours more leisure. Enjoy
> >> life not work. Stipends for everyone.
> >>
> >
> >
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: The Economy Needs You to Work Past 70

[Susan]

I think that we need to be able to work 1/2 time or 3/4 time at any point in 
our lives.  I think most people would love this option and could have more free 
time to do lots of the other fun things in life.  An added bonus - it would 
allow more people to have jobs, which we need, especially the younger 
generation graduating from college and struggling to find jobs.. There just are 
not enough jobs and needs to have full employment, full time, for all those 
that want it.  So let's have partial employment/job sharing for anyone who 
wants to work. 

The reason this is not happening here? The big problem is that once you don't 
work full time, here in the USA, you don't get health insurance.  So the whole 
idea falls apart unless we can get single payer Medicare-like coverage for 
all..  Then people would feel freer to make work and life choices and be 
flexible and could change up their options at different points in their lives. 
The whole Obamacare thing is not going to work, nice as it sounds.   It is just 
a modification of the current complicated system.  Steven Brill's article in 
TIme nailed it - we are way way overcharged by hospitals (especially 
nonprofits) and that is what is driving the whole medical fee disaster here.  
Medicare pays for services at an appropriate rate (about one tenth of what the 
younger public is charged).  Yes 1/10th!  Amazing.  Theprofit for nonprofit 
hospitalas is humongous.  This then drives everythiing else, including the 
reason people here try to work fulltime no matter...  
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
>
> On 05/09/2013 12:36 PM, John wrote:
> > How many here agree with this proposal?
> >
> > http://www.cnbc.com/id/100724186?__source=yahoo%7Cfinance%7Cheadline%7Cheadline%7Cstory&par=yahoo&doc=100724186%7CAttention%20Boomers:%20US%20Nee
> >
> >
> 
> 1) Work is not the purpose of life.  The wealthy landowners tried to 
> sell that idea to their serfs so they could lounge around while their 
> serfs did all the work for little money.
> 2) Work is not holy.  That's something the kings wanted to convey so you 
> stayed busy and didn't cook up a coup d'etat against him.
> 3) Work is a means to an end and not an end in itself.   It's supposed 
> to be a way to exchanges your services for products or someone else's 
> services.
> 4) There are fewer jobs because less needs to be done.  We've automated 
> a lot of boring jobs that no human should be doing and should automate 
> more.  For instance, except for custom clothing which would be 
> interesting for someone who likes to do that and not repetitive you 
> might as well design clothes that can be made entirely by machine. IOW, 
> do away with those slave labor sweat shops in other countries.
> 5) People who love what they could might not mind doing that line of 
> work until they drop dead.  Creative people make up a lot of that group 
> but society doesn't seem to like people who enjoy their work. They'd 
> rather hire you for something you hate doing.
> 6) Scrap the Christian-Judeo work ethic.  It's bullshit anyway according 
> to what I've already stated.
> 7) In a world of 7 billion people there won't be enough work.  Stop 
> adding to the population.  We don't need more people and need over the 
> coming decades and centuries to reduce the population humanely to around 
> 1 billion.  But try to sell that to the folks who hold the purse 
> strings.  Either they want to reduce the population through genocide or 
> wars.  Most of the rich are mentally ill anyway.  Who needs a billion 
> dollars?
> 8) Instead begin a leisure society.  Reduced hours more leisure. Enjoy 
> life not work. Stipends for everyone.
>

[FairfieldLife] Curtis, Ann (was Re: CyberPanic, the update, f)

[Susan]

Fair enough, Judy.  The truth is I cannot read all the references to older 
posts, and I don't follow it all that closely, despite your careful efforts to 
lay it all out.  I don't have the dissecting skills to respond to all your 
points, or the patience.  And I especially don't have  the time it would take 
me if I did decide to do so.  I work fulltime plus.  Even if I found the time, 
I don't think my mind works that way.  I do know you made a good effort to meet 
me half way.  And I realize that there are facts involved as well as overlaid 
stories. I just don't function in a way that can meet you - I have no interest 
in reviewing older posts, in getting to the details/facts/history of what 
someone else might have meant.  You are good at that and enjoy it.  I don't and 
so cannot really match you in that area.  Maybe you can function in both ways.  
Let's leave it at that.  It is not worth spending the few posts you have left.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> (snip)
> > You call Judy the Truth-o-Meter.  And she is very smart.  But I
> > look at things as more fluid and as stories we impose on what 
> > happens.  These are very different styles.  It is hard to mix
> > them. And we frustrate each other in the trying.  Each style
> > has its strengths and weaknesses.
> 
> Another funny thing, Susan. I have no difficulty "mixing
> styles." You were apparently unable or unwilling to "hear"
> the many qualifiers I used in my response to you for the
> elements that are "more fluid" and "stories we impose
> [tentatively] on what happens."
> 
> As long as one uses the appropriate style for each element
> one is considering, making the disinction between the two
> styles clear, there should be no frustration in using both.
> 
> The frustration arises when one or both parties to a
> discussion insist on using one style exclusively--refusing
> to accept that there are such elements as facts, on the
> one hand, or on the other asserting that every element is
> a fact.
> 
> (Reasonable discussion, however, becomes not just
> frustrating but impossible when one party falsely accuses
> the other of using one style exclusively, as you did with
> me.)
> 
> Granted, in some cases there may be disagreements about
> which style applies most appropriately to which element,
> but that's a good issue for the parties to negotiate and
> either resolve or agree to disagree about.
> 
> (I have only two posts left, so I won't be continuing this
> unless you want to resume on Friday.)
>

[FairfieldLife] Curtis, Ann (was Re: CyberPanic, the update, f)

[Susan]

Ah, I forgive you, Ravi! 



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ravi Chivukula  wrote:
>
> OMG you made me feel bad for not including your coping style dear Susan. I 
> have failed, you have humbled me dear - I will do a better job trying to 
> understand you.
> 
> Here's #15 revised
> 
> 15) Truth, facts are inventions of the mind, stories we impose (Guru Xeno, 
> Susan)
> 
> 
> On May 8, 2013, at 2:49 PM, Ravi Chivukula  wrote:
> 
> > "But I look at things as more fluid and as stories we impose on what 
> > happens."
> > 
> > So you would like me to move you to #14 & #15 dear Susan? I'm a nice guy 
> > too - very fluid and flexible like your kind self.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > On May 8, 2013, at 2:36 PM, "Susan"  wrote:
> > 
> >> Communication outside of a courtroom is usually about more than facts and 
> >> parsing them. I am not out to beat Judy or debate what someone else (like 
> >> Robin) wrote (and meant) long ago. It does not interest me. I think it 
> >> does not even interest Robin. You call Judy the Truth-o-Meter. And she is 
> >> very smart. But I look at things as more fluid and as stories we impose on 
> >> what happens. These are very different styles. It is hard to mix them. And 
> >> we frustrate each other in the trying. Each style has its strengths and 
> >> weaknesses. Who would not want Judy to represent them in a legal case - 
> >> doing great research, speaking in court and having so much knowledge at 
> >> her fingertips. And in person she may be great. Perhaps the fallout from 
> >> Judy's style here, for some but not all, is what you listed below? 
> >> 
> >> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ravi Chivukula  
> >> wrote:
> >> >
> >> > Right - when faced with the brutal efficiency of the mean machine that 
> >> > is the Judy Truth-O-meter, here are the following ways to cope up with 
> >> > the discomfort, stress it causes.
> >> > 
> >> > 1) Judy is a cyber-stalker (Barry)
> >> > 2) Judy is bat-shit crazy (Barry)
> >> > 3) Judy is an attention-vampire (Barry)
> >> > 4) Judy is a malicious troll (Curtis)
> >> > 5) Judy directs toxic energy towards strangers on Internet forums 
> >> > (Curtis)
> >> > 6) Judy has an unfriendly agenda (Curtis)
> >> > 7) Judy doesn't have a personal life (Barry, Steve)
> >> > 8) Judy micro parses everything (Steve, Curtis)
> >> > 9) Judy doesn't share her personal details (Steve)
> >> > 10) Judy is part of Robin's cult (Share)
> >> > 11) Judy is mean (Share)
> >> > 12) Judy starts fights (Susan)
> >> > 13) It's just Judy's opinion (Barry, Curtis, Steve, Share, Susan)
> >> > 14) Facts and truth don't matter in Unity - Guru Xeno
> >> > 15) Facts, truth are all inventions of the mind - Guru Xeno.
> >> > 
> >> > Anyone else has any more?
> >> > 
> >> > 
> >> > 
> >> > 
> >> > On May 8, 2013, at 1:49 PM, "authfriend"  wrote:
> >> > 
> >> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> >> > > > 
> >> > > > Judy, It sounds as if you think your opinions - oops I mean
> >> > > > Facts - are Right. About everything. And you are fighting me.
> >> > > > Carry on and enjoy yourself.
> >> > > 
> >> > > You know, Susan, it's a funny thing, but when I cite what
> >> > > appears to me to be a fact, and nobody seems to be able to
> >> > > come up with evidence to refute it, or even a good reason
> >> > > to call it in question, I tend to assume that, by George,
> >> > > it *is* a fact.
> >> > > 
> >> > > If you do (or anyone else does) ever come up with solid
> >> > > evidence or a good argument against anything I've said, by
> >> > > all means let me know. I'm happy to hear whatever you've
> >> > > got, and if I turn out to be wrong, I'll acknowledge it. 
> >> > > 
> >> > > Snide remarks in the absence of evidence or argument,
> >> > > however, I'm not inclined to take very seriously.
> >> > > 
> >> > >
> >> >
> >> 
> >>
>

[FairfieldLife] Curtis, Ann (was Re: CyberPanic, the update, f)

[Susan]

Communication outside of a courtroom is usually about more than facts and 
parsing them.  I am not out to beat Judy or debate what someone else (like 
Robin) wrote  (and meant) long ago.  It does not interest me. I think it does 
not even interest Robin.  You call Judy the Truth-o-Meter.  And she is very 
smart.  But I look at things as more fluid and as stories we impose on what 
happens.  These are very different styles.  It is hard to mix them. And we 
frustrate each other in the trying.  Each style has its strengths and 
weaknesses. Who would not want Judy to represent them in a legal case - doing 
great research, speaking in court and having so much knowledge at her 
fingertips. And in person she may be great.  Perhaps the fallout from Judy's 
style here, for some but not all, is what you listed below? 

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ravi Chivukula  wrote:
>
> Right - when faced with the brutal efficiency of the mean machine that is the 
> Judy Truth-O-meter, here are the following ways to cope up with the 
> discomfort, stress it causes.
> 
> 1) Judy is a cyber-stalker (Barry)
> 2) Judy is bat-shit crazy (Barry)
> 3) Judy is an attention-vampire (Barry)
> 4) Judy is a malicious troll (Curtis)
> 5) Judy directs toxic energy towards strangers on Internet forums (Curtis)
> 6) Judy has an unfriendly agenda (Curtis)
> 7) Judy doesn't have a personal life (Barry, Steve)
> 8) Judy micro parses everything (Steve, Curtis)
> 9) Judy doesn't share her personal details (Steve)
> 10) Judy is part of Robin's cult (Share)
> 11) Judy is mean (Share)
> 12) Judy starts fights (Susan)
> 13) It's just Judy's opinion (Barry, Curtis, Steve, Share, Susan)
> 14) Facts and truth don't matter in Unity - Guru Xeno
> 15) Facts, truth are all inventions of the mind - Guru Xeno.
> 
> Anyone else has any more?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On May 8, 2013, at 1:49 PM, "authfriend"  wrote:
> 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> > > 
> > > Judy, It sounds as if you think your opinions - oops I mean
> > > Facts - are Right. About everything. And you are fighting me.
> > > Carry on and enjoy yourself.
> > 
> > You know, Susan, it's a funny thing, but when I cite what
> > appears to me to be a fact, and nobody seems to be able to
> > come up with evidence to refute it, or even a good reason
> > to call it in question, I tend to assume that, by George,
> > it *is* a fact.
> > 
> > If you do (or anyone else does) ever come up with solid
> > evidence or a good argument against anything I've said, by
> > all means let me know. I'm happy to hear whatever you've
> > got, and if I turn out to be wrong, I'll acknowledge it. 
> > 
> > Snide remarks in the absence of evidence or argument,
> > however, I'm not inclined to take very seriously.
> > 
> >
>

[FairfieldLife] Curtis, Ann (was Re: CyberPanic, the update, f)

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> >
> > Glad you gave the post number.
> 
> Funny thing, I've reposted it four times in the last week 
> or so:
> 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/message/342364
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/message/342376
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/message/342440
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/message/342520
> 
> But none of Share's supporters appear to have seen it or
> been able to find it (including Xeno) until Share gave the
> post number.
> 
> Isn't that fascinating?

Not really, I don't follow these types of discussions.  I am guessing that 
neither do most people. There was no intent to be malicious or lazy.

> 
> Susan, I don't expect you to read what follows, because
> you're clearly set on supporting Share no matter what,
> so you don't want to know about anything that might make
> that support appear to be anything less than utterly
> reasonable.

You have made a false assumption. I am not "set on supporting Share no matter 
what." Why would you say that?  I have not chosen sides. Your statement is just 
inflammatory and inaccurate.  I supported her response to one post alone.  I 
might have misinterpreted her reason for backing away, but I certainly would 
have backed off too even if for my own reasons.
> 
> But I'm posting it for the record anyway.
> 
> I can't help reading your reaction here as a recap--
> perhaps unconsciously--of what you've seen Share and her
> supporters say. IOW, I doubt you would have had this
> reaction if you didn't know Share had characterized
> Robin's comments as some kind of terrible violation.
> 
> You did read her initial response, right, in which she
> simply declined to discuss what Robin had said and
> apologized to him for her "grumpiness," which she
> attributed to having eaten too much sugar?
> 
> How about Robin's response to that, in which *he*
> apologized for having made her uncomfortable and
> essentially took back everything he'd said? Did you read
> that as well, the part that begins "Robin2"?

Yes I did read it, and Robin was apologetic. I think he had temporarily slipped 
into old habits and was tentative about that old approach, and then apologized 
when it was pointed out.  I think he was right to apologize.
.  
> 
> And you are aware that this post from Robin was the
> latest in a long series of extremely warm and friendly
> exchanges he and Share had been having with each other,
> right?

Yes, to some extent, altho I don't follow the details.
> 
> I mean, you say what Robin wrote sounds like something
> that would be appropriate for a therapist or a "dear,
> dear friend" to say, but that it seems inappropriate for
> an "online chat." For sure, unusual for an online chat,
> but their conversations had had this unusually intimate
> quality almost from the beginning, and Share had
> obviously been enjoying them very much.
> 
> "Hurtful, demeaning and offensive"?? "Creepy"?? That is
> just mind-boggling to me. It seems to me to reflect a
> sort of neurotic hyper-super-sensitivity, not a normal
> adult reaction, to an essentially innocuous--and quite
> affectionate--comment from Robin, with whom Share had
> developed a significant degree of mutual fondness over
> their extended, intimate exchanges of the previous
> month or two. And it was certainly not Share's reaction
> at the time.

i stand by my reaction to the way he said it and what he said. I think your 
reaction to someone speaking to you that way would be much different - 
Healthier, maybe, I am not sure.  But to me, Robin came across as someone 
thinking he knew Share better than she herself did, he had glimpsed some truer 
self there, and her usual self just wasn't as good.  He judged her and did so 
in his old "I know you better than you do and I can help you by pointing it all 
out" mode from years ago. Whenever Robin gets like (and he has on several 
occasions) that my radar seem to go up on alert.  I feel manipulation is in the 
air. I expressed that years ago when Robin first came to FFL.  That's my take.  
Yours is very different.  As I said, I think Robin can slip back into that 
style of interaction from years ago. He was starting to do so again. Share 
quickly backed out of the conversation.

> 
> However, all the above turns out to be irrelevant.
> 
> You noted that Robin had used "qualifiers." You are
> apparently not aware that it was his parenthetical
> qualifier that he was "very likely...w

[FairfieldLife] Curtis, Ann (was Re: CyberPanic, the update, f)

[Susan]

Glad you gave the post number. I read it.  My take is that Robin started to act 
as if he is the Authority about you.  ON one level it comes across as if he is 
"complimenting" you on being "real" rather than than your usual positive self 
or your self that is covered by a spiritual belief system.  But the other 
message is that this is an amazing insight he has about you that you really 
just need to hear, for your own benefit and o the sake of being really honest. 

If someone had written that to me, I would feel 1) as if a boundary had been 
crossed and that the subject had suddenly shifted, without my consent or 
desire, to a discussion about my behaviors  2) that Robin feels he has some 
sort of enhanced "insight" into my psyche and 3) that a judgement had been made 
about how I behave usually.  This might be a conversation to have with a 
therapist or a dear dear friend, but not in an online chat.  It smells like 
what I have hears was the Robin of years ago, trying to dissect people, 
supposedly for their own benefit, without their permission or asking for that 
sort of "help."  Robin did lace his posts with qualifiers (ie maybe he is 
wrong) but nevertheless he said what he said about you. Whether he meant it or 
not, it was hurtful, demeaning and offensive. It feels creepy to me.  I would 
back out of the conversation too.  I thought you did so rather gracefully.

Of course, I am not an expert on Robin or you or your history on FFL, so maybe 
there is something I am missing.  If there is, fine.  I am just responding to 
this post.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Share Long  wrote:
>
> Xeno the post # 319335 is when I first got upset with Robin but it contains 
> what had gone before.  Share
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  From: Xenophaneros Anartaxius 
> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> Sent: Monday, May 6, 2013 10:48 PM
> Subject: [FairfieldLife] Curtis, Ann (was Re: CyberPanic, the update, f)
>  
> 
> 
>   
> I couldn't find it. That is the original post from Robin to Share the one '8 
> weeks before' the one where she mentioned 'psychologically raped'. I did not 
> find a direct reference to the post number or a link to it. It's late, 
> bedtime for me. 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Xenophaneros Anartaxius" 
> >  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Say, Curtis, did you ever read the original post from
> > > > Robin that Share decided eight weeks later constituted
> > > > "psychological rape"?
> > > > 
> > > > No?
> > > 
> > > What is the number of that post?
> > 
> > It's the one I already sent you, Xeno--you know, in
> > the post of mine you didn't read. I've actually
> > reposted it several times recently, complete with
> > link. I'm sure you can find it yourself without too
> > much trouble.
> > 
> > 
> > > > And yet you say her characterization was "apt"--
> > > > without ever having read the post it referred to.
> > > > 
> > > > Yes, Curtis, you *are* done. But you stuck the fork
> > > > in yourself.
> > > > 
> > > > Forget about giving us that lecture on integrity, OK?
> > > > We at least have a pretty good idea what it *isn't*.
> >
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: SLP - Updated

[Susan]

Thanks, I put it in my Netflix Que.  

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Share Long  wrote:
>
> dear Susan, thank you and obviously you are a very wise and most fortunate 
> woman (-:
> 
> Might I recommend instead merudanda's latest offering which includes the film 
> The Nature of Existence.  Both fun and thought provoking, but provoking in 
> the good way.
> 
> 
> 
> ____
>  From: Susan 
> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> Sent: Friday, May 3, 2013 3:43 PM
> Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: SLP - Updated
>  
> 
> 
>   
> Share, I would/might rally round except that I have not followed the 
> dialogue, not at all. 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues"  
> wrote:
> >
> > - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Share Long  wrote:
> > >
> > > For God's sake, what is your PROBLEM pRavi?  I happen to be a very 
> > > PUNCTUAL person.  And you keep ignoring that.  What's that 
> > > about?  
> > 
> > I'm gunna have to throw in patient.
> > 
> > When you have Ravi claiming you are avoiding "reality" you must be 
> > thinking: Is this the issue where Superman has to fight the inhabitants of 
> > Reverso World?
> > 
> > L'll gem caught my eye:
> > 
> > Ravi speaking through grinding clenched teeth that somehow still spray 
> > spittle when he spits this out:
> > 
> > " some phony shit or expressing some titillation at some platitudes that 
> > make her come"
> > 
> > This is dark Ravi emerging.  Creepy.  And, I suspect, only the beginning...
> > 
> > But don't worry Share, I'm sure the FFL sisterhood will rally around and 
> > object to you being addressed this way...
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > >  From: Ravi Chivukula 
> > > To: "FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com"  
> > > Sent: Friday, May 3, 2013 12:54 AM
> > > Subject: [FairfieldLife] SLP - Updated
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > >   
> > > "How vicious and violent of her to suggest that you, along with the rest 
> > > of us, aren't guaranteed another *hour*, let alone 30 years."
> > > 
> > > Hilarious - how Miss Sadie completely ignores the rest of Emily's message.
> > > 
> > > If she was going to address anything from Emily's message it would have 
> > > been references to her being the psychological sadist/rapist. Or Emily's 
> > > valid points of how Miss Sadie, being a woman grossly misused the word 
> > > "rape". Of course she could have ignored it and as is her pattern she did.
> > > 
> > > Her pattern when someone really goes after her is she sits on it for a 
> > > couple of days. Day 1, make a few posts - some phony shit or expressing 
> > > some titillation at some platitudes that make her come or her interest in 
> > > some latest fad or innocent questions on astrology, ayurveda or even if 
> > > it's something dumb - gotta keep the innocent, damsel-in-distress routine 
> > > going.
> > > 
> > > Anyway if she was going to address it I would have expected, from a 
> > > normal, sane person - a sincere yet strong rebuttal. Or hitting her back 
> > > with irony or even some phony behavior of hers where she thinks she has 
> > > come up with some cute joke.
> > > 
> > > Pathetic Sadie or was it passive-aggressiveness of yours - one of your 
> > > 5P's of the Share Long Paradigm? Or is this a new P - 
> > > Psychological-sadism?
> > > 
> > > OMG - brilliant I may be but I think I missed this critical P. Here then 
> > > is the updated SLP of the SIX P's
> > > 
> > > The Share Long Paradigm to avoid Reality
> > > 
> > > 1) PHONY behavior
> > > 2) PARANOID delusional fantasies around cults, religion
> > > 3) Love of PLATITUDES - platitudes the prescription to avoid reality
> > > 4) When stressed -  PASSIVE-AGGRESSIVENESS
> > > 5) When highly stressed - PSYCHOLOGICAL-SADISM
> > > 6) PITTA-DERANGMENTS - blame #4, #5 on Pitta and/or related things like 
> > > sugar
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > On Thu, May 2, 2013 at 11:09 AM, authfriend  wrote:
> > > 
> > > 
> > > >  
> > > >--- 

[FairfieldLife] Curtis the Compassionate (was Re: J gets another fact wrong and S apologizes to)

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> >
> > That's my 50th. I'll be back this evening.
> 
> With *another* 50 posts vilifying Share, Curtis, Steve,
> and your other enemies? Wow, what a surprise.
> 
> Do you even *realize* that this is what you did this
> last week, and that you didn't post about anything 
> *else* THAN trying to "get* the people you don't like?
> 
> And do you realize that you did all of this under the 
> pretense that you care about and are trying to "protect* 
> a person who 1) never asked for your "protection," 2) 
> doesn't need "protecting," 3) is probably embarrassed 
> by your horseshit and wishes you'd shut up, and 4) knows 
> better than anyone else that he has *nothing* to do 
> with why you're doing it?
> 
> You're acting like an insane, vindictive bitch because
> you ARE an insane, vindictive bitch. 
> 
> This is just what you DO -- stalk and torment the folks
> you don't like. And WHY? Because they won't bow to your
> supposed "authority" and your tendency to claim that you
> "know" things they do not, and that your "knowing" is
> always correct. 
> 
> There's a term for this. It's called narcissism. When
> this kind of behavior goes on for as long as it has
> in you (18+ YEARS), there's a term for what this means,
> psychologically speaking -- Narcissistic Personality
> Disorder, with a soupçon of malevolent Sociopathic
> Disorder thrown in to make it taste even worse. 
> 
> There is nothing anyone can do to stop you acting
> out your pathologies on this forum, but there IS
> something we can do to be affected by them as little
> as possible, and to reduce the signal-to-noise ratio. 
> 
> DON'T PARTICIPATE.
> 
> By doing so -- by taking the bait and "defending
> yourself" when Judy tries to get you to do just that,
> you're becoming a co-dependent to her psychoses. You
> are, in fact, facilitating them and perpetuating them.
> 
> For the love of God (if you believe in such silliness),
> STOP. 

This is, imo, a brilliant idea :-) From just scanning things, there seems to be 
an awful lot of "he said, no no  he meant,  you are   a dishonest person if you 
don't agree with me, that word really means, she said, what I really really 
said,  take an hour and review those posts of 2 years ago, I have proof, blah 
blah blah."  These people have never met each other!!!  Still, if you like this 
sort of interaction, I guess you continue on. 
> 
> This advice will be wasted on Ravi and Ann and possibly
> Emily, who are all heavily invested IN perpetuating 
> this psychosis. DrD is a non-entity, having taken him-
> self out of the equation in his usual...ahem...
> enlightened fashion. 
> 
> But Curtis? You know better than to allow this shit to
> perpetuate itself. Steve? You do, too. And above all,
> SHARE? *You* are as guilty as anyone else here of 
> bringing up this tired old shit again every time it
> dies down. 
> 
> Ferchrissakes, STOP. 
> 
> Let Judy and her few remaining minions be the only ones
> who post about this non-issue next week. Let them embar-
> rass themselves BY continuing to beat this very dead,
> very smelly horse carcass again next week. They are 
> beyond hope. 
> 
> But there's still hope for the co-dependent participants
> in this embarrassing, seemingly eternal soap opera. You
> don't have to participate unless you actually enjoy it.
> 
> If you DO participate, I for one have to assume that
> you are making a statement that you DO enjoy it, and that
> you hope it continues.
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: SLP - Updated

[Susan]

Share, I would/might rally round except that I have not followed the dialogue, 
not at all.  

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues"  
wrote:
>
> - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Share Long  wrote:
> >
> > For God's sake, what is your PROBLEM pRavi?  I happen to be a very 
> > PUNCTUAL person.  And you keep ignoring that.  What's that about?  
> 
> I'm gunna have to throw in patient.
> 
> When you have Ravi claiming you are avoiding "reality" you must be thinking: 
> Is this the issue where Superman has to fight the inhabitants of Reverso 
> World?
> 
> L'll gem caught my eye:
> 
> Ravi speaking through grinding clenched teeth that somehow still spray 
> spittle when he spits this out:
> 
> " some phony shit or expressing some titillation at some platitudes that make 
> her come"
> 
> This is dark Ravi emerging.  Creepy.  And, I suspect, only the beginning...
> 
> But don't worry Share, I'm sure the FFL sisterhood will rally around and 
> object to you being addressed this way...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >  From: Ravi Chivukula 
> > To: "FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com"  
> > Sent: Friday, May 3, 2013 12:54 AM
> > Subject: [FairfieldLife] SLP - Updated
> >  
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > "How vicious and violent of her to suggest that you, along with the rest of 
> > us, aren't guaranteed another *hour*, let alone 30 years."
> > 
> > Hilarious - how Miss Sadie completely ignores the rest of Emily's message.
> > 
> > If she was going to address anything from Emily's message it would have 
> > been references to her being the psychological sadist/rapist. Or Emily's 
> > valid points of how Miss Sadie, being a woman grossly misused the word 
> > "rape". Of course she could have ignored it and as is her pattern she did.
> > 
> > Her pattern when someone really goes after her is she sits on it for a 
> > couple of days. Day 1, make a few posts - some phony shit or expressing 
> > some titillation at some platitudes that make her come or her interest in 
> > some latest fad or innocent questions on astrology, ayurveda or even if 
> > it's something dumb - gotta keep the innocent, damsel-in-distress routine 
> > going.
> > 
> > Anyway if she was going to address it I would have expected, from a normal, 
> > sane person - a sincere yet strong rebuttal. Or hitting her back with irony 
> > or even some phony behavior of hers where she thinks she has come up with 
> > some cute joke.
> > 
> > Pathetic Sadie or was it passive-aggressiveness of yours - one of your 5P's 
> > of the Share Long Paradigm? Or is this a new P - Psychological-sadism?
> > 
> > OMG - brilliant I may be but I think I missed this critical P. Here then is 
> > the updated SLP of the SIX P's
> > 
> > The Share Long Paradigm to avoid Reality
> > 
> > 1) PHONY behavior
> > 2) PARANOID delusional fantasies around cults, religion
> > 3) Love of PLATITUDES - platitudes the prescription to avoid reality
> > 4) When stressed -  PASSIVE-AGGRESSIVENESS
> > 5) When highly stressed - PSYCHOLOGICAL-SADISM
> > 6) PITTA-DERANGMENTS - blame #4, #5 on Pitta and/or related things like 
> > sugar
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > On Thu, May 2, 2013 at 11:09 AM, authfriend  wrote:
> > 
> >  
> > >  
> > >--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Share Long  wrote:
> > >>
> > >> As for my intentions and heart, I'll let my words from
> > >> Sept 6 and 9 speak for themselves.
> > >
> > >
> > They already have, unfortunately for you.
> > >
> > >
> > >> That Robin then chose to bring our upset back onto FFL 
> > >> still baffles me.
> > >
> > >
> > It shouldn't have, given that he explained it to you
> > >very thoroughly. Tomorrow I'll post what he said. Then
> > >I'll post your response, and everyone will see yet
> > >another demonstration of how well you deal with reality.
> > >
> > >That OK with you, Share? Think that'll be fun?
> > >
> > >
> > >> Perhaps little fish enjoys, a bit too indulgently, 
> > >> flapping his gills and watching 
> > >> the resultant waves crashing.
> > >
> > >
> > Or perhaps the piranha likes to project her own
> > >unpleasant tendencies on her intended victims.
> > >
> > >
> > >> As for Emily's posts, I don't see a lot of heart in
> > >> them, especially when she wrote within a very
> > >> belligerent post: you think you have 30 good years
> > >> left? Think again. You might not have tomorrow...
> > >
> > >
> > Oh, she's a-comin' to getcha, Share! Lock your
> > >door, keep your head down and your cell phone charged
> > >so you can call 911 when she shows up. How vicious and
> > >violent of her to suggest that you, along with the rest
> > >of us, aren't guaranteed another *hour*, let alone 30
> > >years.
> > >
> > >What we keep forgetting is that nobody on FFL has
> > >*legitimate* feelings but Share.
> > >
> > >
> > >> And also still mired in Robin Fundamentalism, of course
> > >> Judy's not buying it.  But what she's really afraid to
> > >> even go into the store about, is the possib

[FairfieldLife] Re: A Tidy Sum!

[Susan]

Are Board members like Bevan and John legally liable for the financial misdeeds 
of the entire organization, especially the Indian contingent?

I wonder if they knew all along that things were not "right" and yet felt 
helpless to confront MMY's relatives and so just looked the other way?


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Jason"  wrote:
>
> 
> 
> > 
> > ---  "Buck"  wrote:
> > >
> > > Dear FFL, That dredged up old copy is such a piece of demoralizing and 
> > > terrifying propaganda whether it is true or not. In fact I feel it is 
> > > hateful to be posting crap like that here while like the phoenix the TM 
> > > movement is rising again teaching transcendence once again.  A large 
> > > meditation movement is coming right now out of a few people doing good 
> > > work.  It is once again like the times of old TM, a movement where a few 
> > > people have fanned out and are connecting the message of spiritual 
> > > regeneration in to a rudderless culture ready to hear it new at a time of 
> > > great transition.  Dredging up an old dateline proves nothing.  That 
> > > journalism is nearly a year old.  Those of us who know better are moving 
> > > forward with meditation and leaving the rest behind.  The past is a 
> > > lesser state of evolution, look now to the youth of the future and a 
> > > better world.  It is time to step forward.
> > > -Buck in the Dome 
> > 
> > 
> ---  "salyavin808"  wrote:
> >
> > Erm, it's a year old. Which means the lawyers are preparing their
> > briefs and booking court time for the showdown. All of which will
> > get posted here because this is what the TMO has been about - huge
> > amounts of money being raised under false pretences and invested
> > without any of the original projects coming to fruition. 
> > 
> > Like it or not, people care about what gets done with their money
> > and to call it propaganda is as devious as raising cash for
> > "global world towers of world peace" and then buying some office
> > block in Dheli and forgetting about it until the next fundraising
> > drive which, if memory serves, was the "give me a billion dollars
> > and I'll save the world" panhandle. And all the people I know who
> > would shake their heads and say; if *only* we had the money we
> > could save the world, would then reach into their wallets for their
> > well worn credit cards one more time all while not knowing that 
> > there is billions just sitting in a land bank. 
> > 
> > Every couple of years a new project, another new reason to give.
> > And everyone thinks they failed because there wasn't enough money! 
> > 
> > J'accuse *you* of propaganda in trying to suppress the ugly facts.
> > I'm all for truth and reconcilliation myself.
> > 
> >  
> 
> 
> That's the whole point, isn't it?
> 
> 10 Lakhs is = One million
> 
> 10 million is = One Crore
> 
> 100 Crores is = One billion
> 
> Considering the vast amount on money locked up in land 
> assets and nothing productive came out of it, it's not a 
> surprise that donations are dwindling and the goodwill is 
> diminishing.
> 
> All movements tend to shrink after it's founders time. 
> Yogananda, Ramana, Ramakrishna math, Hare Krishna and even 
> the Rama Lenz guy.
> 
> 
> 
> > > ---  "salyavin808"  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > I was checking up on the *real* big story in TM just to see if there
> > > > were any developments in the argument over Marshy's alleged 60,000
> > > > crore fortune:
> > > > 
> > > > http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/maharishi-mahesh-yogi-rs-6-crore-fortune/1/201925.html
> > > > 
> > > > Turns out there isn't but I thought I would work out what 60,000 Crore
> > > > actually was in proper money.
> > > > 
> > > > 1 crore = 10,000,000 rupees.
> > > > 
> > > > 1000 rupees = 12.9 British pounds.
> > > > 
> > > > 1 crore = 112,885 British pounds.
> > > > 
> > > > 60,000 crore  = 6,833,100,000 British pounds.
> > > > 
> > > > This is a quite extraordinary amount of money and completely
> > > > give the lie to Marshy's plea for a billion dollars to save the 
> > > > world. They already had it many times over! But still the call goes
> > > > out to support the pundit programme. Still, my friends give money 
> > > > every month - thinking that the movement actually needs support.
> > > > 
> > > > People I know working for the TMO *still* don't get paid a penny
> > > > for their efforts, but more money is going to be needed to pay
> > > > lawyers to get back the money people have already given.
> > > > 
> > > > The rajas presumably know all this and have acquired Marshy's 
> > > > gift of compartmentalising the TMO so that one section (the mug 
> > > > punters) think it's in a state of poverty and spend their lives working 
> > > > to donate and keep it afloat. While the other section 
> > > > spends its time investing in land and managing the ever growing fortune.
> > > > 
> > > > When I learned TM I was put on the "very keen" database which
> > > > meant I got begging letters for

[FairfieldLife] Re: A Tidy Sum!

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson  wrote:
>
> I worked it out one time in US dollars - came to one billion, one hundred 
> fourteen million and some change, but I might have calculated incorrectly - 
> either way Girish and the Srivastavas brothers are not hurting.
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  From: salyavin808 
> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> Sent: Tuesday, April 30, 2013 3:05 AM
> Subject: [FairfieldLife] A Tidy Sum!
>  
> 
> 
>   
> 
> 
> I was checking up on the *real* big story in TM just to see if there
> were any developments in the argument over Marshy's alleged 60,000
> crore fortune:
> 
> http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/maharishi-mahesh-yogi-rs-6-crore-fortune/1/201925.html
> 
> Turns out there isn't but I thought I would work out what 60,000 Crore
> actually was in proper money.
> 
> 1 crore = 10,000,000 rupees.
> 
> 1000 rupees = 12.9 British pounds.
> 
> 1 crore = 112,885 British pounds.
> 
> 60,000 crore  = 6,833,100,000 British pounds.
> 
> This is a quite extraordinary amount of money and completely
> give the lie to Marshy's plea for a billion dollars to save the 
> world. They already had it many times over! But still the call goes
> out to support the pundit programme. Still, my friends give money 
> every month - thinking that the movement actually needs support.
> 
> People I know working for the TMO *still* don't get paid a penny
> for their efforts, but more money is going to be needed to pay
> lawyers to get back the money people have already given.
> 
> The rajas presumably know all this and have acquired Marshy's 
> gift of compartmentalising the TMO so that one section (the mug punters) 
> think it's in a state of poverty and spend their lives working to donate and 
> keep it afloat. While the other section 
> spends its time investing in land and managing the ever growing fortune.

Sadly this is the nub of the money issue


> When I learned TM I was put on the "very keen" database which
> meant I got begging letters for every project the TMO claimed
> to be working on. But I decided not to give them anything until
> I knew a bit more about them - like where the money actually went.
> 
> Now I know and feel happy that I was never a donor. What a rip-off.
> What a con. But I do almost admire a mind capable of pulling off
> such a stunt over so many decades.
> 
> PS. This all assuming the Indian paper has its facts right. I've checked the 
> conversion rates and used two calculators to make 
> sure of my figures and it looks like £7 billion. If my maths are completely 
> askew don't blame me, blame my maths teacher. She was
> rubbish, it wasn't me.
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Our little Dutch girl

[Susan]

She is lovely.  Rosy cheeks and all.  I also like the painted red floors - very 
cool.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
>
> Already dressed in orange for the upcoming Queen's Day festivities.
> 
>  
> [https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/381411_101515592\
> 74676743_324462293_n.jpg]
> 
> Vermeer would have killed to be able to paint her.
> 
>  
> [http://en.wahooart.com/Art.nsf/O/8Y2V7U/$File/Jan-Vermeer-Girl-with-a-P\
> earl-Earring.JPG]
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: A feeling about the TMO

[Susan]

Most of the people teaching TM outside of Fairfield have income or support from 
parents or inheritances.  The TMO does provide some of them with a real salary 
and sometimes housing, but not really enough to live on and certainly not 
enough to save a dime for the soon to be here golden years.
In the MUM realm, I am not sure what those people have coming to them for 
retirement.  I think the top people are doing just fine and will be taken care 
of or have already had accounts set up.  As for professors and long time 
staff.not sure.

And wahtever happened to Girish and all that and the TMO finances of India?

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Mike Dixon  wrote:
>
> You would have to have an enormous amount of faith to devote your life to the 
> TM movement. Very low pay, if any and no retirement. The TMO doesn't make 
> contributions towards SS or any other federal benefit program so when you're 
> too old to benefit them, what do you do? Hope they have some little closet 
> for you to stay in, a bowl of rice to eat, perfect health and you're 
> enlightened?
> 
>  
> 
> 
>  From: Michael Jackson 
> To: "FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com"  
> Sent: Saturday, April 27, 2013 2:30 AM
> Subject: [FairfieldLife] A feeling about the TMO
>   
>    
>  
> This is something I posted on MUM Secrets in response to another post:
> 
> 
> I agree with a lot of what Taylor says, but on the issue of staff not 
> being paid, that is a blanket policy that I admit I willingly accepted 
> when I was on staff cuz I wanted to be in the Dome, but it is not too 
> good for the workers and especially for someone who spends years on faculty 
> with no retirement etc. I admit I am about 
> to make a blanket statement but the Movement seems to function from a 
> "what can you do for us" attitude rather than what can we do for the 
> people who support us. They seem to feel that teaching us to do TM is 
> the only thing they needed to do and all else is given to them. If they 
> had put as much time, effort, energy and thought to serving the needs of 
> people in a concrete way through the years as they did to trying to get us to 
> give them all our money and allegiance, I would still be with them.
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: parsing a la Descartes was HITLER'S VALENTINE

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Xenophaneros Anartaxius" 
 wrote:
>
> - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ann"  wrote:
> 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" 
> >  wrote:
> > >
> > > Barry,looking back at our history of interacting with Judy,in the 
> > > beginning, it was about different perspectives on Maharishi or 
> > > spirituality in general.  As that topic got beaten to death or perhaps 
> > > the murkiness of years of Maharishi and movement revelations, I have 
> > > noticed a content-independent "Judy process" at work here. What used to 
> > > be a misguided but more understandable support FOR something, has 
> > > devolved into pure contentiousness and ill will, attaching itself to the 
> > > feeblest, contrived premises.  And separated from the great causes of the 
> > > past, I am seeing the person more clearly.
> > > 
> > > It never WAS about Maharishi and TM was it?
> > 
> > Curtis, it appears to be about 'now'. What is happening right at this very 
> > moment and those moments of the last few days. This is what has surfaced as 
> > the result of a very small comment on my part being blown and pumped so out 
> > of proportion and context. Sometimes these things happen. So far you and 
> > Barry (why is it always 'you and Barry'?) aren't dealing with it very well. 
> > But there is still time! Every minute provides an opportunity to figure it 
> > out better and to make better decisions. That's what I like about life - 
> > there is often a second and even third chance to get it right. Can you see 
> > what I just wrote as other than a personal attack? Try.
> 
> Human beings seem to have a great capacity for misunderstanding that is never 
> resolved. People whose inner worlds are delusional, and this is most of the 
> people on the planet, can never agree about what is true or right. I do not 
> think life is about getting it right. Right and wrong is our delusion. Life 
> does not care, it just goes on, like a roller coaster; you can hang on for 
> dear life, or relax and enjoy the view, as much as that is feasible. Our 
> concern might be best served by not attempting to adjust our life in relation 
> to other persons or views, but in attempting to discover the source of our 
> own discontent, which exists in our mind only.
>

Nice.  This is our lives in a pithy little nutshell  Making up a narrative to 
fit the events that happen, sticking to that story and using it to organize the 
future experiences.   You could take the very same facts, the same words and 
experiences, and make up a story with an entirely different feel and type of 
drama.Lots of options.  Fascinating.

[FairfieldLife] Re: New Terrence Malick film: To the Wonder

[Susan]

This is reported to be not as "good" as Tree of Life.  And the females in this 
one apparently do alot of that twirling about and looking at the sky that 
Jessica Chastain did in Tree of Life.  So that makes me a bit uneasy.  For me, 
Tree of Life had tons of content (loss of innocence, coming of age, father/sons 
especially in the 50's, how a person feels when they give up dreams of work, 
dealing with the loss of a child or sibling, seeing death or scarring of a 
playmate - a peer, how psiritual views change as one matures). There was a good 
deal of extraneous stuff in the movie, too.  Malick takes his time, which can 
be annoying, but somehow that slow pace seems right for the issues he deals 
with.  But Tree of Life was one of those movies that felt really different for 
different people.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> >
> > Barry,
> > Have you seen it yet?  I adored Tree of Life and am waiting 
> > for a theater to get this one in.
> 
> Zooming along on the train at 300+ kilometers per hour,
> on my way back to the Netherlands, connected to Wifi
> and chatting with one of my housemates real-time in
> another window (ah, the wonders of the modern world),
> I have to say that I am *not* one of the people waiting
> with 'bated breath for the next Terrence Malick epic.
> 
> I *loathed* Tree Of Life. All hat, no cattle. That is
> (IMO, of course...all appreciation or non-appreciation
> of a film is opinion), it was all visuals, no content. 
> I won't willingly go out of my way to subject myself 
> to another of his films again unless Roger Ebert gives
> it a thumbs-up. Oooops. Guess I'm gonna miss this one. :-)
>

[FairfieldLife] New Terrence Malick film: To the Wonder

[Susan]

Barry,
Have you seen it yet?  I adored Tree of Life and am waiting for a theater to 
get this one in.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Indiana Jones and the Search for the Paris Apartment

[Susan]

In major cities in the US, the typical procedure is to require 3 months of rent 
up front - one for the first month, one for the last month, and possibly one 
(security deposit) for any damages if they occur. Then you can add in the 15% 
agent's fee (a bit less than a month's rent).

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "salyavin808"  wrote:
>
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
> >
> > So, not having heard whether I have been accepted for the first
> > apartment I applied to rent, I've been continuing my search. It has
> > provided me with a number of insights into a particular type of
> > uberarrogant French person, and thus much laughter. I found a link to
> > this apartment yesterday...looks nice, doesn't it?
> 
> Sure does, I particularly like the proximity of the bed to the
> kitchen. Handy for those late night peanut butter fests.
> 
> > 
> > http://www.book-a-flat.com/en/apartment-paris-3080.html
> > 
> > 
> > I called the agency today at lunch. A woman answered, and spoke English,
> > so I didn't even have to use my still-struggling-to-be-remembered
> > French. This is the conversation, verbatim:
> > 
> > Moi: I'm calling about one of your properties, reference number 2844.
> > I'd like to view the apartment.
> > 
> > Her: How long would you be renting the apartment for?
> > 
> > Moi: At least 9 months, possibly longer. I am here in Paris working for
> >  for that long.
> > 
> > Her: Do you pay taxes in France?
> > 
> > Moi: No, I pay taxes in the Netherlands.
> > 
> > Her: I see.  So how will you be guaranteeing the apartment?
> > 
> > Moi: Excuse me?
> > 
> > Her: How will you provide us a guarantee that you will pay the rent.
> > Either you will have to pay the full 9 months in advance, or have a
> > French citizen provide a guarantee for you.
> > 
> > Moi:  You're joking, right?
> > 
> > Her: No, this is just how it's done.  > irony> Otherwise, how could we expect you to pay the rent? You are not
> > French.
> > 
> > Moi: And this is your policy for all of the properties you represent?
> 
> > 
> > Her: Of course. Would you like me to arrange a viewing of the apartment?
> > 
> > Moi: I don't think so.
> > 
> > Her: May I ask why?
> > 
> > Moi: How could I expect you to keep the appointment? You're French.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Paris is nothing if not amusing
> 
> Looks like it's a sellers market, but the UK is similarly tough.
> I've had to cough up for 6 months in advance before now but managed
> to negotiate a discount for the "priviledge". Depends how many other
> offers they get for the same place. Happy hunting.
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Feedback to the TM Movement

[Susan]

I too really enjoyed your post, Mr Trowbridge.  It was genuine and so right on. 
Loved your points about conflict. In the name of being "positive," so much has 
been overlooked, not dealt with, and repressed.  At every level. And for those 
whose very livelihood revolved around all this for some years, it took a real 
toll. The frustration of trying to get a "problem" dealt with was incredible - 
because the person was considered to be unstressing or negative. A really 
unhealthy system evolved. Anyway, you said it all so well and I thank you for 
that.
  I suspect that in posting it here on FFL, it will be read by the people you 
are talking to.  My guess is that the big issue on the inside is whether to try 
and mimic exactly how MMY ran the TMO or whether to modify that so as to appeal 
to more people.  Not modify the teaching, but the organization, how it is run, 
the way rules are "enforced,"  how to handle conflict. I think a lot will 
depend on how that unfolds now and in the next decade as Bevan and John and the 
rajas begin to retire.   Not that the TMO needs to become a corporate place, 
but it is all so very fuzzy and odd and seemingly going to end with our 
generation unless things change. Too much garbage being dragged along to 
interest the younger generation. 
 But TM is pure gold for you?   Lucky guy.  

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jwtrowbridge"  
wrote:
>
> Thank you, a beautiful response, and I will carry on. I go by my own 
> experiences. This has always been my guide, and my experiences daily have 
> been magnificent. The program is pure gold. Thanks,
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008  wrote:
> >
> > 
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008  wrote:
> > >
> > > Thanks John, beautiful post in it's positivity. And unique on this forum 
> > > because you are one of perhaps only 5 posters here altogether that does 
> > > TM regularily and have a non-agressive take on the TMO. So your idea of 
> > > sending it here was perhaps a bit too enthusiastic, it will unfortunately 
> > > only fuel more vile attacs on the TMO from the regulars here, most of 
> > > whom have not done TM in decades.
> > > 
> > > Aside from that it is impossible to disagree with you on any point, 
> > > except for perhaps the most important; your idea that the
> > > 
> > > "The goal of this organization is not to appeal to a particular leader or 
> > > person, but to the widest possible audience who will appreciate and 
> > > practice the TM program in its purity."
> > > and
> > > "reach the widest possible audience who will appreciate and practice 
> > > the TM program in its purity. This is the goal. This is what the TM 
> > > organization is about." 
> > > 
> > > This is a widespread misunderstanding due largely to being stuck in 
> > > Maharishi's old thinking or having been exposed only to this timeframe of 
> > > Maharishi's philosophy on video, strategies that were perfect until about 
> > > 1985. As the Age of Enlightenment grew and became an irreversible process 
> > > the old thinking based on the individual was replaced with the concern 
> > > for groups, and ultimately the whole world. Already in 1980, after having 
> > > prevented the WWII during the winther of 1979, Maharishi said "From today 
> > > no more meditators are necessary". Thus Maharishi's focus shifted and the 
> > > TMO as we know it became in many ways obsolete, left unattended also by 
> > > it's own Founder simply because it had no more function other than being 
> > > the safekeeper of the purity of the teaching. No small task, but the real 
> > > job of securing permanent world peace was given to the Rajas and the 
> > > Vedic Pundits, a responsebility that remains theirs to this day.
> > > 
> > > So my advice to you would be to "stay calm and carry on". Continue with 
> > > your beautiful programme, knowing that some obstacles like bad smell or 
> > > bad food or whatever will be thown into the mix at regular intervals, 
> > > they don't matter much. Forget about the mismanagement of the TMO, it is 
> > > irrelevant for you. Forget that the TMO must become in better shape to 
> > > save the world, they won't and their task isn't. Let them do their bit as 
> > > you do yours, life is too short to waste on such small things. 
> > > One last thing; please see as many as possible of Maharishi's newest 
> > > tapes that are available on youtube and are available here:
> > 
> > http://www.youtube.com/user/maharishichannel
> > 
> > Perhaps what I've stated above will be clearer. Thank you again for your 
> > well-meaning post.
> > > Jai Guru Dev
> > >
> >
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Free Man In Paris, v2.05

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb  wrote:
>
> As much as I love the Netherlands, and spending time with my extended
> family there, it is *also* an utter delight to be back in Paris, and to
> be having dinner in a sidewalk cafe (covered and heated, of course,
> because it's still almost as cold here as it was there -- global
> colding, and all that), and enjoying both the food and the ambiance.
> 
> The highlight of my time "back home" revolves around the time I get to
> spend with young 4-year-old Maya. We have a weekend routine, in which
> she comes downstairs in the mornings while the rest of the family gets
> to sleep in, and we watch "Mayamovies" together on my computer. This
> morning we watched the classic Disney "Cinderella" and a "Winnie The
> Pooh" movie, and the morning before we watched "Despicable Me" (always a
> delight) and a bunch of Nick Park's wonderful Wallace & Gromit movies.
> We chat and do "film crit" all the way through them, which the other
> members of my family don't appreciate as much as Maya and I do, as they
> fear they'll never be able to take her to an actual movie theater
> because she'll want to talk about the movie all the way through it. My
> bad. :-)

It seems really fine, Barry, that at your stage in life you  have the chance to 
love and help care for a young child.  Nothing  like it  - you get to relive 
the wonder of childhood all over again!  You have the time to do this and that 
is great.  Maya is a lucky girl.  BTW, I also love all the Wallace and Grommit 
movies, and especially the shorts that were done years ago.  Did you see the 
one where the animals in a zoo talk about what their lives are like?

Also, just a comment - and you know this is not antagonistic. I wonder why you 
wrote the last paragraph?  Who cares if others are interested or not in your 
travels or in only posting spiritual things?  It came across to me as if you 
are fishing around to push some buttons. What you wrote before was really of a 
different flavor altogether and stood on its own quite nicely.
> 
> But anyway, back to here and now, and Paris. It's "happy hour" in this
> cafe/restaurant, and the crowd reflects this. At a table next to mine,
> there are three French women -- two from the traditional French gene
> pool, one clearly from a more Moroccan gene pool, and they are drinking
> coffees (2-for-the-price-of-one) and chatting amongst themselves quietly
> and with admirable French restraint. Across the terrace, however, sit a
> group of seven clearly American Girls. They're all in their early
> twenties, and my bet is that their daddies have paid for them to "study
> abroad" and they have just returned from their "Easter vacations," and
> have gotten together here tonight to compare notes on their respective
> adventures, or the lack thereof. They are all taking advantage of the
> "twofer" happy hour discount to get tanked on cocktails, while smoking
> cigarettes the way that people in their early twenties smoke them, as if
> cigarettes are 'way cool and 'way French, and as if they won't kill
> them.
> 
> In contrast to the French women, all of the American girls are talking
> FAR TOO LOUDLY, and far too animatedly. They've clearly been here in
> Paris long enough to have picked up the French habit of gesticulating
> madly while talking, but somehow when the French do it, it's cool and
> sexy, and when the American Girls do it, it...uh...isn't. Their
> conversations, which I cannot help but eavesdrop on even across the cafe
> because they're talking SO FUCKING LOUDLY, all seem to have to do with
> the guys they hooked up with while on vacation, and why none of them
> measured up to their fantasies. The French girls much nearer to me, whom
> I have to go out of my way to eavesdrop on because they're talking
> quietly, more like actual human beings talk, seem to be talking
> philosophy. Then again, they're just on their second cuppa coffee, not
> on their fourth or sixth set of happy hour cocktails. If there is a
> lesson to be drawn here in the difference between two cultures, I leave
> it to you to draw it...I'm just reporting on what I see and hear.
> 
> Finally the END OF HAPPY HOUR arrives, and the American girls are out of
> here like shit through a goose. The French women remain, still talking
> (as far as I can tell) about Sartre and l'existentialisme. Go figure.
> 
> Meanwhile the Moroccan cafe owner collects the glasses (many) and the
> tips (few) from the American Girls' table, and shrugs. He's clearly been
> in the biz for some time, and knows that some people are drawn to his
> cafe/restaurant only for the happy hour. Me, I was drawn back here
> because they serve an admirable magret de canard (duck breast) with
> gratin dauphinois et salade, and for a quite reasonable price. I also
> like the place because their house wine is good and their coffee is even
> better. Does that make me "easy to please" and possessed of "low
> standards?" Perhaps. Your cal

[FairfieldLife] Re: Girish Varma accused of sexual harassment

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
>
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "salyavin808"
>  wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > In a modern world the TM-movement still does not have sexual
> harassment guideline for its employees and officers?
> > > >
> > > > Probably not, I imagine they still hope that the stuff they
> > > > teach about spontaneous right action and coherent behaviour
> > > > is actually true and they therefore don't need a legal fall
> > > > back.
> > > >
> > > > But if this story is true, it isn't an employee it's the guy
> > > > at the top and he isn't going to want harassment guidelines
> > > > is he?
> > > >
> > > > Still, at least he hasn't claimed he was "helping her with
> > > > her karma". I look forward to a full report in TM News
> > > > magazine.
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > What is the TM administration going to do about him? [?] The Girish
> story seems to broaden everyday.  Do a google 'news' search for "Girish
> Varma".  He comes right up now,  Times of India every day:  Molestation,
> extortion, attemped murder,  Sex in the back seat of an Audi.  Five-Star
> Hotels. Other women come forward.  It's very unfortunate.  Jeeesus.
> > >
> > > The guy could take the whole Indian TM sub-continent down with him
> and TM Europe and the Americas too.  Who would want to be associated
> with him?
> > >
> http://globalpeaceproject.net/about-us/the-foundation/brahmananda-sarasw\
> ati-foundatio-board-of-directors/
> > >
> > Agreed, he could take the entire TMO down.  At the very least, there
> will need to be major restructuring, looking over finances (that is if
> there is anything left for the TMO as opposed to the family members!). 
> Girish could be the legacy that gets remembered. Starts with MMY and the
> Beatles and the finale is 50 years later with Girish. Somewhere here are
> lessons to be learned.  It could be that TM-USA will separate from
> India. Seems in India it was just a big business with a cover story of
> education..  Here, we raised the money for them, and also did the
> scientific research part.
> > Buck, are there big raja meetings to discuss this stuff? I wold think
> that Bevan and JOhn and RajaRaam are pretty worried.
> >
> 
> 
> Susan,  Yep one should wonder and hope that everyone on this Board of
> Directors list is thinking a lot about this.  Notice there are no women
> on our SBS Foundation Board:

Yes, there are no women.  Because I believe that MMY did not want them on the 
board, right?  It would be a real shame if the actions of one or a few undid 
all the years of genuine devotion on the part of many on this list, and Tony 
and John and Bevan. Whether you like them or not, they are devotees and have, 
imo, worked hard to make MMY"s ideas a reality.
Probably after MMY died they had serious misgivings about Girish and wanted 
to remove him, but they waited knowing MMY had picked him.  Graft can happen 
anywhere, but I think organizations that are more mature have learned to have 
committees and oversight at every stage, especially when it comes to money 
issues. The temptation is just so great. And then there is the sex issue.  
Tough one, that.
> 
> 
> http://globalpeaceproject.net/about-us/the-foundation/brahmananda-sarasw\
> ati-foundatio-board-of-directors/
> <http://globalpeaceproject.net/about-us/the-foundation/brahmananda-saras\
> wati-foundatio-board-of-directors/>
> 
> * Avinoam Shlomo Barkol – Educator
> Ramat-Gan, Israel
> * John H. Black, M.A. – Educator
> Palo Alto, CA, USA
> * Rafael David – Business Entrepreneur
> Vero Beach, FL, USA
> * Howard Martin Chandler, Ph.D. – Educator
> Boston, MA , USA
> * James Kevin Egan, Ph.D. – Business Entrepreneur
> Boone, NC, USA
> * Hugh Richard Alan Godfrey – Retired Businessman
> London, England
> * Shawn Jeffrey Herman, MBA – Retired Real Estate Manager
> Palo Alto, CA, USA
> * Richard Glenn Ross, B.F.A. – Educator
> Fairfield, IA, USA
> * Harris Kaplan – Retired Investment Fund Manager
> Boone, NC, USA
> * Steve Rubin – Retired Businessman
> Sebastian, F

[FairfieldLife] Re: Girish Varma accused of sexual harassment

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
>
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "salyavin808"  wrote:
> >
> > 
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
> > >
> > > In a modern world the TM-movement still does not have sexual harassment 
> > > guideline for its employees and officers?
> > 
> > Probably not, I imagine they still hope that the stuff they
> > teach about spontaneous right action and coherent behaviour
> > is actually true and they therefore don't need a legal fall 
> > back.
> > 
> > But if this story is true, it isn't an employee it's the guy
> > at the top and he isn't going to want harassment guidelines
> > is he?
> > 
> > Still, at least he hasn't claimed he was "helping her with
> > her karma". I look forward to a full report in TM News 
> > magazine.
> >
> 
> 
> What is the TM administration going to do about him? [?] The Girish story 
> seems to broaden everyday.  Do a google 'news' search for "Girish Varma".  He 
> comes right up now,  Times of India every day:  Molestation, extortion, 
> attemped murder,  Sex in the back seat of an Audi.  Five-Star Hotels. Other 
> women come forward.  It's very unfortunate.  Jeeesus. 
> 
> The guy could take the whole Indian TM sub-continent down with him and TM 
> Europe and the Americas too.  Who would want to be associated with him?
> http://globalpeaceproject.net/about-us/the-foundation/brahmananda-saraswati-foundatio-board-of-directors/
>  
Agreed, he could take the entire TMO down.  At the very least, there will need 
to be major restructuring, looking over finances (that is if there is anything 
left for the TMO as opposed to the family members!).  Girish could be the 
legacy that gets remembered. Starts with MMY and the Beatles and the finale is 
50 years later with Girish. Somewhere here are lessons to be learned.  It could 
be that TM-USA will separate from India. Seems in India it was just a big 
business with a cover story of education..  Here, we raised the money for them, 
and also did the scientific research part. 
Buck, are there big raja meetings to discuss this stuff? I wold think that 
Bevan and JOhn and RajaRaam are pretty worried.

[FairfieldLife] Re: New Interview on Buddha at the Gas Pump - 03/27/2013

[Susan]

Hey All,  Rick Archer is the one being interviewed on this particular segment, 
telling his story and experiences.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Archer"  wrote:
>
>  
> 
> 
> blog updates from
> 
> 
> Buddha at the Gas Pump
> 
> 
>    
> 
> 
> published 03/27/2013
> 
> 
> 166. Rick Archer, Interviewed by Alex Tsakiris of Skeptiko.com 
> 
>  
> 
> Mar 26, 2013 07:01 am | Rick
> 
> Rick is host of this show. Alex Tsakiris, host of Skeptiko, is a successful 
> entrepreneur turned science podcaster. In 2007 he founded Skeptiko, which has 
> become the #1 podcast covering the science of human consciousness. Alex has 
> appeared on syndicated … Continue reading  
> 
>  â†'
> 
> The post 166. Rick Archer, Interviewed by Alex Tsakiris of Skeptiko.com 
> 
>   appeared first on Buddha at the Gas Pump 
> 
>  .
> 
>    
> 166_rick_archer_alex_tsakiris.mp3 
> 
>   36.8 MB
> 
> comments 
> 
>   | read more 
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
>    
> Elsewhere
> 
> *  
> 
>  Visit My Blog
> 
> *  
> 
>  Share This with a friend
> 
> *  
> 
>  Follow me on Twitter
> 
> *  
> 
>  RSS feed
> 
>    
> 
> 
> view email in a browser 
> 
>   | 
> 
> 
> Regular announcement of new interviews posted at http://batgap.com.
> 
> Buddha at the Gas Pump
> 
> 1108 South B Street
> 
> Fairfield, Iowa 52556
> 
> 
> Add us to your address book 
> 
>  
> 
> Copyright (C) 2013 Buddha at the Gas Pump All rights reserved.
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>   
> 
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Girish Varma accused of sexual harassment

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
>
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> >
> > You should know that this guy is MMY's nephew. In India, due to their 
> > belief in reincarnation, nepotism is the norm and is usually celebrated as 
> > the proper way things get done.  The first Prime Minister of India was 
> > named Jawaharlal Nehru. Coincidentally, Indira Ghandi was his 
> > granddaughter, and Rajiv Ghandi was his great-grandson.  
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Prime_Ministers_of_India#Prime_Ministers
> > 
> > The swami named in the will to succeed Gurudev was Gurudev's nephew, it 
> > turns out. Indians just assume that their relatives are the best person for 
> > the job because the cosmos chose them for it by causing them to be born as 
> > relatives of the person in power.
> > 
> > 
> > That said, I've heard the rumors of the nephews of MMY being bad people for 
> > years. But those same rumors say that TM doesn't work, that all the 
> > research is bogus and so on. It wouldn't be surprising if some of the 
> > rumors were true. It also wouldn't be surprising if some of the rumors were 
> > false.
> > 
> > L.
> >
> 
> We've been hearing about Girish extorting kick-backs and such around pundits 
> in the pundit program for some long time.  I would not want to be the 
> Westerners wading into figure out what is going on in the workings of the TM 
> movement there.  Sociopaths are not likely to put capable honorable people 
> around them either.  For as big as it is this is going to be extremely 
> complicated for Tony and the board of trustees to manage.  I'd really fear 
> for their safety if and when they go over there to help straighten it out. 

You mean, that despite the huge piles of money Girish and family have stashed 
away, and living very well indeed, he felt the need to make a few dollars from 
kickbacks from pundits?  And people in Fairfield know about this for a long 
time?  Bevan and John H knew this and stood by?  The Rajas?  They all looked 
the other way? If that is true, then trouble is ahead, big trouble. 

So Buck, are people talking about this is Fairfield?  What is the general 
feeling about this? About the TMO's future given this?   
> 
>  
> >  
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> > [...]
> > > Given that perspective by people who knew him when, how did he come to 
> > > run the hugely lucrative TMO India?  And why didn't people speak up?  
> > > (Maybe they did but we would never know). Why did the American Rajas over 
> > > there put up with this crap all these years?  Surely they must have seen 
> > > and sensed that things were not right.
> >
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Girish Varma accused of sexual harassment

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
>
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> >
> > It is an interesting coincidence [sic?] that all the TM bigwigs are in 
> > India just as this comes to a head.
> > 
> > Judy may be right: this could be part of a power-struggle in the TM 
> > organization that goes beyond just India.
> > 
> > 
> > L
> >
> 
> Would seem that whole side of the Maharishi family could stand to be stripped 
> of their bank accounts, fancy cars, real estate and mansions and swiftly 
> banished to caves somewhere in penance for all the trouble they cause the 
> larger movement with this behavior.  These molestation charges seem a tip of 
> an iceberg with a lot more bad underneath. These charges are simply really 
> bad and create quite a vacuum in the movement.

I think it is more likely that the "whole side of the Maharishi family" will 
keep the money and leave the TMO without much at all.  I assume they own the 
bulk of the money.
>  
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
> > 
> > > Well it does seem by the newspaper accounts that this guy is getting 
> > > caught with his hands in the cookie jar.  It is going to be very 
> > > interesting to see what Tony Nader and the TM movement does with this 
> > > going forward.  This is a very big deal that evidently was a long time in 
> > > coming.
> >
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Girish Varma accused of sexual harassment

[Susan]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
>
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson  wrote:
> >
> > Oh by all means post the links, please!
> > 
> > Apparently he is being accused of attempted murder as well, ahhh Marshy's 
> > legacy, it just keeps getting more
> >  sattvic all the time.
> > 
> > http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/bhopal/Maharishi-Vidya-Mandir-chairman-accused-of-molestation/articleshow/18857765.cms
> > 
> >
> 
> Whacky. 
> Well, stories from people who seem to know tell that evidently the guy was a 
> "get done" kind of guy from even back in his college days. 

Given that perspective by people who knew him when, how did he come to run the 
hugely lucrative TMO India?  And why didn't people speak up?  (Maybe they did 
but we would never know). Why did the American Rajas over there put up with 
this crap all these years?  Surely they must have seen and sensed that things 
were not right.
>  
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Girish Varma accused of sexual harassment
> >  
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> > >
> > > Buck, has there been any Tmo official response to this in Ffld or India?  
> > >  And who is in charge of all that money in India now that Girish is 
> > > going?  There must be some scrambling and realigning of the rajas and 
> > > folks in charge
> > >
> > 
> > Nothing here local yet, too new.  Lot of our poobahs and people are still 
> > out of town to the inauguration of the big Temple to Maharishi's Presence 
> > in India. Mostly just underlings here now.  Dome numbers are generally 
> > subdued with people still traveling.  Likely still some discovery going on. 
> >  Indian Newspapers are saying some other women are coming forward with 
> > similar complaints about Girish. 
> > 
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > This is really a fabulous opportunity for the new movement to come 
> > > > forward and say,"We are not that!" and put good people in to those 
> > > > facilities with an expectation of good and honorable behavior from the 
> > > > whole movement.  Make it clear.  Make a break from the past.  Even for 
> > > > the guy at the top.
> > > > -Buck
> > > > 
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck" wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > >  Interesting this comes out now.  We were just talking here 
> > > > > > comparing TM and the Papists the other morning.
> > > > > > Such synchrony.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, navashok  wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > I'm not sure people here are aware that there is a new 
> > > > > > > > sensitivity in India with regard to sexism, especially in 
> > > > > > > > Delhi, after this gang-rape case, which is still going on. 
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > The movement should go into quick action and fire him, otherwise 
> > > > > > > the movement in India will be dead.
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > >  According to the newspaper accounts
> > > > > it is more than sexual harassment,
> > > > > 'twas molestation and predatory.
> > > > > 
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > In a modern world the TM-movement still does not have sexual 
> > > > > > > harassment guideline for its employees and officers?
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley" 
> > > > > > >  wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Well, you know what they say... if it's got tits, tires, or 
> > > > > > > > testicles, there's gonna be trouble.
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck" wrote:
&g

[FairfieldLife] Re: Girish Varma accused of sexual harassment

[Susan]

Buck, has there been any Tmo official response to this in Ffld or India?   And 
who is in charge of all that money in India now that Girish is going?  There 
must be some scrambling and realigning of the rajas and folks in charge

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
>
> This is really a fabulous opportunity for the new movement to come forward 
> and say,"We are not that!" and put good people in to those facilities with an 
> expectation of good and honorable behavior from the whole movement.  Make it 
> clear.  Make a break from the past.  Even for the guy at the top.
> -Buck
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck" wrote:
> >
> > >  Interesting this comes out now.  We were just talking here comparing TM 
> > > and the Papists the other morning.
> > > Such synchrony.
> > > 
> > > 
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, navashok  wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > I'm not sure people here are aware that there is a new sensitivity in 
> > > > > India with regard to sexism, especially in Delhi, after this 
> > > > > gang-rape case, which is still going on. 
> > > > 
> > > > The movement should go into quick action and fire him, otherwise the 
> > > > movement in India will be dead.
> > > > 
> > 
> >  According to the newspaper accounts
> > it is more than sexual harassment,
> > 'twas molestation and predatory.
> >   
> > > 
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > In a modern world the TM-movement still does not have sexual harassment 
> > > > guideline for its employees and officers?
> > > > 
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley" 
> > > >  wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Well, you know what they say... if it's got tits, tires, or 
> > > > > testicles, there's gonna be trouble.
> > > > > 
> > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck" wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > This is extremely saddening and I feel very sorry for everyone 
> > > > > > around it now,  for all the good people who work properly with 
> > > > > > extreme propriety to make things work well and achieve great 
> > > > > > things.  This is disheartening sickening.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > She's a very brave person.  He's a very powerful man.  
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bill Coop  
> > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >  Maharishi Vidya Mandir chairman accused of molestation
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > A married woman working as a teacher at Maharishi Vidya Mandir 
> > > > > > > > in
> > > > > > > > Bhopal
> > > > > > > >  has filed a complaint against the chairman of Maharishi Vidya 
> > > > > > > > Mandir group
> > > > > > > > of schools Girish Chandra Varma for molestation and mental 
> > > > > > > > torture.
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > Varma has just been granted bail in a firing incident earlier 
> > > > > > > > this year at
> > > > > > > > Maharishi Mahesh Yogi Ashram in Allahabad and came back to 
> > > > > > > > Bhopal couple of
> > > > > > > > days ago.
> > > > > > > > The woman filed a complaint to the State Women's Commission 
> > > > > > > > (SWC) alleging
> > > > > > > > that Varma threatened that she and her husband, who also worked 
> > > > > > > > with the
> > > > > > > > group, would lose their jobs if she failed to cooperate with 
> > > > > > > > him.
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > The woman said that the accused used to insist her husband take 
> > > > > > > > her along
> > > > > > > > on tours to other cities and countries. Each time, a five star 
> > > > > > > > hotel was
> > > > > > > > booked with adjoining rooms. Varma would send her husband away 
> > > > > > > > on errands
> > > > > > > > and then molest her.
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > She did not say anything earlier fearing social ostracism but 
> > > > > > > > when it
> > > > > > > > became too much to take, she told her husband and decided to 
> > > > > > > > file a
> > > > > > > > complaint.
> > > > > > > > There have been counter allegations that the husband had been 
> > > > > > > > trying to
> > > > > > > > extort money from Varma since 2011 for a new house with claims 
> > > > > > > > that he sent
> > > > > > > > various abusive e-mails and letters to Varma and maligned 
> > > > > > > > Varma's image on
> > > > > > > > social networking sites.
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2013-03-08/bhopal/37560420_1_molestation-husband-complaint
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Girish Varma accused of sexual harassment

[Susan]

At first hearing - yes. After thinking about it - not at all
Five star hotels?  H
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Joe"  wrote:
>
> Indeed it is. Are you surprised?
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Susan"  wrote:
> >
> > Wait, is this the same person who is related to MMY and is the head of the 
> > TM org in India?  The one who is in the photos we see of events in India?
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
> > >
> > > In a modern world the TM-movement still does not have sexual harassment 
> > > guideline for its employees and officers?
> > > 
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley" 
> > >  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Well, you know what they say... if it's got tits, tires, or testicles, 
> > > > there's gonna be trouble.
> > > > 
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck" wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > 
> > > > > This is extremely saddening and I feel very sorry for everyone around 
> > > > > it now,  for all the good people who work properly with extreme 
> > > > > propriety to make things work well and achieve great things.  This is 
> > > > > disheartening sickening.
> > > > > 
> > > > > >
> > > > > > She's a very brave person.  He's a very powerful man.  
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bill Coop  
> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >  Maharishi Vidya Mandir chairman accused of molestation
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > A married woman working as a teacher at Maharishi Vidya Mandir in
> > > > > > > Bhopal<http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/topic/Bhopal>
> > > > > > >  has filed a complaint against the chairman of Maharishi Vidya 
> > > > > > > Mandir group
> > > > > > > of schools Girish Chandra Varma for molestation and mental 
> > > > > > > torture.
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > Varma has just been granted bail in a firing incident earlier 
> > > > > > > this year at
> > > > > > > Maharishi Mahesh Yogi Ashram in Allahabad and came back to Bhopal 
> > > > > > > couple of
> > > > > > > days ago.
> > > > > > > The woman filed a complaint to the State Women's Commission (SWC) 
> > > > > > > alleging
> > > > > > > that Varma threatened that she and her husband, who also worked 
> > > > > > > with the
> > > > > > > group, would lose their jobs if she failed to cooperate with him.
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > The woman said that the accused used to insist her husband take 
> > > > > > > her along
> > > > > > > on tours to other cities and countries. Each time, a five star 
> > > > > > > hotel was
> > > > > > > booked with adjoining rooms. Varma would send her husband away on 
> > > > > > > errands
> > > > > > > and then molest her.
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > She did not say anything earlier fearing social ostracism but 
> > > > > > > when it
> > > > > > > became too much to take, she told her husband and decided to file 
> > > > > > > a
> > > > > > > complaint.
> > > > > > > There have been counter allegations that the husband had been 
> > > > > > > trying to
> > > > > > > extort money from Varma since 2011 for a new house with claims 
> > > > > > > that he sent
> > > > > > > various abusive e-mails and letters to Varma and maligned Varma's 
> > > > > > > image on
> > > > > > > social networking sites.
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2013-03-08/bhopal/37560420_1_molestation-husband-complaint
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>