[FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
http://intellguru.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/government-corporation-regulation-cartoon.png http://intellguru.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/government-corporation-regulation-cartoon.png --- noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote : Image if your local police department reported a murder as someone shot the person. Case closed That's almost what the 9-11 official story is like. You would have been well advised not to use RationalWiki which skeptics don't even like. Those of us who think there is something more to a case than reported don't call ourselves conspiracy theorists. That term has come about and used by PSYOPS to discredit us since the JFK assassination which I don't think Oswald had anything to do with because he had a cheap gun and was seen in the lunch room at the book depository when the assassination took place. He was a convenience patsy due to his activities. If Ruby had not shot him it might have come out that he got framed. Jeez, everyone knows Elvis shot JFK. It's hardly news. Anyone on the right track to solving these crimes who has any visibility such as a news reporter often gets offed or suicided. Some of the nutty stuff you will find in conspiracy theorist are PSYOPS trying to poison the well lest the truth be known. Just think if we could prove beyond a doubt that 9-11 was indeed an inside job and who the perps were how confidence in our government would fall, not that it isn't anyway. And we have long had little confidence in our corporations and banks which these days run like gang operations. After reading the articles Barry posted I was going to write something about how conspiracy theories are probably created by the government to distract everyone from what a crap job they actually do at running the country. Be nice to think there was someone in power who could organise a job that big, we can't even make a computer system to link up health districts without the ministry going bankrupt and abandoning it. The USA is a very dirty place. It was that way from it's inception because some of the wealthy landowners didn't want their workers to have rights and some wanted the US to still be beholding to Britain. Our democracy is an illusion and the king makers hate anyone who points that out. A lot more people would have probably taken to the streets during the Occupy Movement but they feared losing their jobs. We live in a country of increasing have nots, people who have lost even their simple pleasures of life because a plan to put all but a few in austerity. So many detractors here seem to have little knowledge of history and just react emotionally. I guess some folks want to live in a simple world of Santy Claus and Easter Bunnies. Both of which are inventions, just like the conspiracies. What worries is me that you have such a disconnect from the people that run the US that you actually think they would murder thousands of their own people for reasons best known to themselves. Whoa, Jack! You're half reading me. I'm not alleging that our politicians conspired to pull off 9-11. It's a shadow government that many people in the US believe exists (and probably many folks in the UK believe about your own government). Killing thousands would rile up Americans (and believe me the days following they were insanely riled) to support anything the government asked if it involved retaliation. So Arab terrorists did 9-11 and we go off and bomb Afghanistan and Iraq. Shouldn't we have bombed Saudi Arabia instead? Something wrong with that picture? BTW, for some reason a lot of people who worked at the WTC were told to stay home that day. There's a kind of movement like that in the UK about the Islamic terrorist that blew up some tube trains a decade ago. The story goes that the government knew about it but let it happen because it would be an excuse to rachet up the anti-terror laws, which completely coincidentally can also be used to harass innocent people whenever the state feels like it. The UK subway bombings indeed smell of a false flag. These types of operations have been around for centuries but I guess that history wasn't your favorite subject? I don't believe it for the simple fact that however cynical politicians get it's their own friends and family that might get blown up. You don't seem to have that sort of human link, sure the govt in the US has blood on its hands but the 9/11 conspiracies are qualitatively different from interfering in the politics of left wing countries or suppressing anti-capitalist demonstrations. It isn't a quantitative thing at all. See my above comment. I think it's the conspiracists that react emotionally, something unbelievable happens and the dots get joined up irrationally, anything to make it make sense that doesn't just mean the world is so dangerous a bunch of religious fruitcakes can walk
[FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
--- Duveyoung@... wrote : Yeah, of course you can find MANY who would be part of arranging a false flag for 9-11. What a bunch of blinkered fools we are. Let's open our scrunched-up eyes a crack and admit one thing: the authorities of the world will do cruelty in any form upon anyone no matter the legal framework. Your local cop IS A MOTHERFUCKING KILLER wishing for his moment to totally ruin someone's life. And if he isn't, then he's an enabler of a fellow cop who is a sociopathand that is just AS BAD. Case in point: I know of an 2007 incident in sleepy little-town FAIRFIELD in which a cop TORTURED A ROO for over 12 hours in the presence of the other officers. Not a headline. (Don't ask for details -- can't out a Roo who doesn't want more of the same if he's seen bitching about it in public. No charges, let the guy go the next day.) But see? This is the heart of darkness within ALL OF US in Kali Yuga. Even our heroes will be found to be tilted in this age. Even the good guys...consider how the TMO did all it could to subvert the legal requirements during the murder at MUM. Those were saints, right? Even inside them was the I get to do whatever shit I want to dynamic. Consider Ed Beckeley, Dr. Bloomfield, the commodities groups, the TMO money laundering and smuggling, etc. Young pundits and anybody from TMO, returning to india, each person would be given particular quantity (legal) of gold. As soon as the plane lands in india, TMO henchmen would be waiting there to collect the gold, load the pundits on to the waiting van, and off they go. So much gold was brought in, that they decided to make jewellery and sell the gold. The TMO's finances are so murky the you would never have the clear idea what happened to all the money. I have been to 17 countries and saw the same shit everywhere. Give someone a gun and they're looking for game cuz they're on safari, donchaknow. To sum: how many good Americans would be willing to put a tactical nuke inside a 9-11 tower? Almost any cop, any soldier. Deal with this fact. It's the truth. Krishna took sattva with Him 5,000 years ago. There's no Arjuna out there wearing a badge of honor and integrity.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
the TMO money laundering and smuggling, etc. On 10/12/2014 2:49 AM, blue_bungalo...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: Young pundits and anybody from TMO, returning to india, each person would be given particular quantity (legal) of gold. As soon as the plane lands in india, TMO henchmen would be waiting there to collect the gold, load the pundits on to the waiting van, and off they go. /So, how much money did you get //from the TMO? We already know that one FFL informant lived at a TM Center for five years and another FFL reporter got a free pod for two years at MIU./ So much gold was brought in, that they decided to make jewellery and sell the gold. The TMO's finances are so murky the you would never have the clear idea what happened to all the money. /Non sequitur. It has already been established that nobody knows the extent of TMO finances. What we want to know is what happened to all the money you got from the TMO./
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Perhaps it might help if you know how things are done in the US. Here's a movie out today about the Gary Webb, a newspaper reporter who exposed Iran Contra and later committed suicide (more likely suicided): Why more likely? I've said it before, governments do shady deals like this. They do it because they think it will ultimately do us (and them) a favour by tilting world influence away from unfriendly powers. Trouble is it might be technically illegal under international law so a bit of subterfuge is necessary. The CIA helped dispose of many governments that adopted left wing governments and deprived US companies of their money in favour of keeping it in the country. Iran, Guatemala, Chile etc.. All this is known and the orders came from the top and none of it remained secret for very long. What you don't have with the 9/11 conspiracy is any sort of reason for it, or any sort of organisation that could do the job and keep it secret. But it's the point of the whole thing that baffles me. What did it achieve? They got rid of a few embarrassing documents, great but couldn't they have gone in at night or even ordered a member of staff to remove them as it was their building? And remote control planes just adds another huge layer of people that would have to keep quite. I'm English, I don't need telling that our government plays a double game on the world stage. But you have to see everything in a context of cost/benefit or you have to start inventing things to justify your beliefs and I think the truthers are far into that behaviour. Just think, if the buildings hadn't gone and collapsed this conversation wouldn't be happening. http://youtu.be/VW4XO-52ubE http://youtu.be/VW4XO-52ubE Seems that the CIA has started to come forward and say that some of Webb's assertions were true: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/10/gary-webb-dark-alliance_n_5961748.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/10/gary-webb-dark-alliance_n_5961748.html On 10/10/2014 01:26 PM, salyavin808 wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote : Salyavin, you're reviewing the movie without having seen it just like Judy. You say: BTW, I remember the movie well, I was near a TV on the day. Saw the whole thing, but not live. I was working at the TM academy at the time and they didn't tell us it happened as there was a course on and didn't want to upset anybody! If we hadn't had someone staying for BB to mention it over the evening meal I might never have heard about it at all. Maybe.. So I might have missed the first defining moment of the 21st century!
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
From: Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com On 10/10/2014 06:59 PM, TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : On 10/10/2014 01:04 PM, salyavin808 wrote: Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in Afghanistan ran the whole operation but that really sounds wacky! :-D Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few planes? It's too simple isn't it. That's the problem people have, they can't believe that much destruction was caused by a few maniacs in hijacked planes. But it was not that simple. And the alleged fliers couldn't even fly a Cessna properly let alone a jet. Those planes were remote controlled and such systems were available in advance of 9-11.I disagree, I think they were telepathically controlled by the Space Brothers from their secret base on Pluto. Weak minds glom onto conspiracy theories the same way that weak minds follow cult leaders. That's all anyone ever needs to know about discussions like this. Are you inferring that I'm a weak mind, Barry? What's happened to you? Getting old and cranky and the contracts not showing up like they used too? I am saying that a *tendency* to believe in conspiracy theories is a mental disorder strongly linked to the mental disorder that attracts people to cults. IMO, conspiracy theories offer those who tend to gravitate to them the same thing that cults do -- 1) easy answers to complex questions, and 2) the feeling of being special, because you know the truth while lesser people don't. There have been many studies of conspiracy theories and why they've become so popular. Here are a few articles on the subject. I really like one line from this first one: The best predictor of belief in a conspiracy theory is belief in other conspiracy theories... That, for me, indicates a *strong* link between conspiracy nuts and cultists. Just think about Fairfield, and why *every* huckster selling New Age potions and seminars and techniques comes through town -- they do this because TMers, having been taught to believe *one* set of improbable things (dare I mention levitation and butt bounce for peace), are now primed to believe *more* improbable things. Fairfielders are well known in the U.S. as being the Biggest Suckers In The Country -- if you want to sell *anything* bizarre and New Agey, you take your snake oil routine to Fairfield. Well, I'm suggesting that the same is true of conspiracy nuts -- once you've bought into one of them, and felt all special because you know the truth and lesser people around you don't, you become an easy mark for the next conspiracy theory. And the next. And the next. And... Why Rational People Buy Into Conspiracy Theories Why Rational People Buy Into Conspiracy Theories Psychologists are beginning to unravel the mystery behind this brand of American political paranoia. View on www.nytimes.com Preview by Yahoo This next article also agrees with my personal theories about conspiracy theories in another way: Conspiracy theories offer easy answers by casting the world as simpler and more predictable than it is. Neither conspiracy nuts nor cultists like mysteries, things they can't explain. So they tend to glom onto the first easy explanation to ease their cognitive dissonance. Why People Believe in Conspiracy Theories Why People Believe in Conspiracy Theories Conspiracy theories offer easy answers by casting the world as simpler and more predictable than it is. Their popularity may pose a threat to societal well-being View on www.scientificameri... Preview by Yahoo And back to the particular conspiracy theory that started all this: 9/11 Conspiracy Theories: Why Do People Believe In September 11 Conspiracies? 9/11 Conspiracy Theories: Why Do People Believe In Septe... A deeper look into why people believe in 9/11 conspiracy theories. View on www.ibtimes.com Preview by Yahoo
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : From: Bhairitu noozguru@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com On 10/10/2014 06:59 PM, TurquoiseBee turquoiseb@... mailto:turquoiseb@... [FairfieldLife] wrote: From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com mailto:no_re...@yahoogroups.com ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote : On 10/10/2014 01:04 PM, salyavin808 wrote: Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in Afghanistan ran the whole operation but that really sounds wacky! :-D Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few planes? It's too simple isn't it. That's the problem people have, they can't believe that much destruction was caused by a few maniacs in hijacked planes. But it was not that simple. And the alleged fliers couldn't even fly a Cessna properly let alone a jet. Those planes were remote controlled and such systems were available in advance of 9-11.I disagree, I think they were telepathically controlled by the Space Brothers from their secret base on Pluto. Weak minds glom onto conspiracy theories the same way that weak minds follow cult leaders. That's all anyone ever needs to know about discussions like this. Are you inferring that I'm a weak mind, Barry? What's happened to you? Getting old and cranky and the contracts not showing up like they used too? I think our bawee has taken profound ownership of his own conspiracy theory and he seems to be sticking to it - like glue. 'Weak mindedness' seems to be the catch-all reason for most things that human beings do, in bawee's mind anyway. Thank God this man didn't enter the field of psychiatry. Can you imagine? His one diagnosis for everything, You are weak minded, now get out of my office. Next. I am saying that a *tendency* to believe in conspiracy theories is a mental disorder strongly linked to the mental disorder that attracts people to cults. IMO, conspiracy theories offer those who tend to gravitate to them the same thing that cults do -- 1) easy answers to complex questions, and 2) the feeling of being special, because you know the truth while lesser people don't. There have been many studies of conspiracy theories and why they've become so popular. Here are a few articles on the subject. I really like one line from this first one: The best predictor of belief in a conspiracy theory is belief in other conspiracy theories... That, for me, indicates a *strong* link between conspiracy nuts and cultists. Just think about Fairfield, and why *every* huckster selling New Age potions and seminars and techniques comes through town -- they do this because TMers, having been taught to believe *one* set of improbable things (dare I mention levitation and butt bounce for peace), are now primed to believe *more* improbable things. Fairfielders are well known in the U.S. as being the Biggest Suckers In The Country -- if you want to sell *anything* bizarre and New Agey, you take your snake oil routine to Fairfield. Well, I'm suggesting that the same is true of conspiracy nuts -- once you've bought into one of them, and felt all special because you know the truth and lesser people around you don't, you become an easy mark for the next conspiracy theory. And the next. And the next. And... Why Rational People Buy Into Conspiracy Theories http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all Why Rational People Buy Into Conspiracy Theories http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all Psychologists are beginning to unravel the mystery behind this brand of American political paranoia. View on www.nytimes.com http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all Preview by Yahoo This next article also agrees with my personal theories about conspiracy theories in another way: Conspiracy theories offer easy answers by casting the world as simpler and more predictable than it is. Neither conspiracy nuts nor cultists like mysteries, things they can't explain. So they tend to glom onto the first easy explanation to ease their cognitive dissonance. Why People Believe in Conspiracy Theories http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-people-believe-conspiracy-theories/ http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-people-believe-conspiracy-theories/ Why People Believe in Conspiracy Theories http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-people-believe-conspiracy-theories/ Conspiracy theories offer easy answers by casting the world as simpler and more
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
It is hardly mental disorder that leads people to spiritual organizations - If so, Barry would be among our sickest members. His perspective is always one of failure, of settling for less, if it beats a sharp stick in the eye, it'll do. Barry, after having had some flashy stuff in his life, cannot rekindle that flame again (except with his self-created deadly enemy, TM), and so he goes on tiredly, poking a sad sort of fun, at any need for anyone to believe in, or seek, something greater than themselves, whatever its attributes. He is desperately trying to settle for less, and have us all do the same. He walks forward, ever deeper, into his compressed past, as I walk backwards, into the future. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : From: Bhairitu noozguru@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com On 10/10/2014 06:59 PM, TurquoiseBee turquoiseb@... mailto:turquoiseb@... [FairfieldLife] wrote: From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com mailto:no_re...@yahoogroups.com ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote : On 10/10/2014 01:04 PM, salyavin808 wrote: Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in Afghanistan ran the whole operation but that really sounds wacky! :-D Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few planes? It's too simple isn't it. That's the problem people have, they can't believe that much destruction was caused by a few maniacs in hijacked planes. But it was not that simple. And the alleged fliers couldn't even fly a Cessna properly let alone a jet. Those planes were remote controlled and such systems were available in advance of 9-11.I disagree, I think they were telepathically controlled by the Space Brothers from their secret base on Pluto. Weak minds glom onto conspiracy theories the same way that weak minds follow cult leaders. That's all anyone ever needs to know about discussions like this. Are you inferring that I'm a weak mind, Barry? What's happened to you? Getting old and cranky and the contracts not showing up like they used too? I think our bawee has taken profound ownership of his own conspiracy theory and he seems to be sticking to it - like glue. 'Weak mindedness' seems to be the catch-all reason for most things that human beings do, in bawee's mind anyway. Thank God this man didn't enter the field of psychiatry. Can you imagine? His one diagnosis for everything, You are weak minded, now get out of my office. Next. I am saying that a *tendency* to believe in conspiracy theories is a mental disorder strongly linked to the mental disorder that attracts people to cults. IMO, conspiracy theories offer those who tend to gravitate to them the same thing that cults do -- 1) easy answers to complex questions, and 2) the feeling of being special, because you know the truth while lesser people don't. There have been many studies of conspiracy theories and why they've become so popular. Here are a few articles on the subject. I really like one line from this first one: The best predictor of belief in a conspiracy theory is belief in other conspiracy theories... That, for me, indicates a *strong* link between conspiracy nuts and cultists. Just think about Fairfield, and why *every* huckster selling New Age potions and seminars and techniques comes through town -- they do this because TMers, having been taught to believe *one* set of improbable things (dare I mention levitation and butt bounce for peace), are now primed to believe *more* improbable things. Fairfielders are well known in the U.S. as being the Biggest Suckers In The Country -- if you want to sell *anything* bizarre and New Agey, you take your snake oil routine to Fairfield. Well, I'm suggesting that the same is true of conspiracy nuts -- once you've bought into one of them, and felt all special because you know the truth and lesser people around you don't, you become an easy mark for the next conspiracy theory. And the next. And the next. And... Why Rational People Buy Into Conspiracy Theories http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all Why Rational People Buy Into Conspiracy Theories http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all Psychologists are beginning to unravel the mystery behind this brand of American political paranoia. View on www.nytimes.com http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all Preview by Yahoo This next article also agrees with my
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
On 10/10/2014 8:59 PM, TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: Weak minds glom onto conspiracy theories the same way that weak minds follow cult leaders. That's all anyone ever needs to know about discussions like this. /It sounds like Barry did a 180 and changed his mind about conspiracy theories. Go figure./ Subject: OT: Israel From: John Manning Group: alt.meditation.transcendental Date: 8/8/2003 http://tinyurl.com/qf5x6t9
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
On 10/10/2014 9:28 PM, Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife] wrote: If 9-11 were an inside job then there would be plenty of funding to poison the well with sites like Rational Wiki. I don't have time to look at all of it now and I'm sure someone else has gone through a debunked most of the holes here. I see a couple already. If you don't agree with every single word of this guy's rant, YOU'RE FUCKED UP IN THE HEAD. Duveyoung Wed, 08 Oct 2014 10:02:10 -0700 http://www.mail-archive.com/fairfieldlife%40yahoogroups.com/msg332298.html /O'Keefe denied the plausibility that the September 11 attacks were committed by Osama bin Laden and the 19 hijackers. He claimed it was an inside job and that the US government and intelligence agencies, including Mossad were responsible./ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_O%27Keefe
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
On 10/11/2014 02:10 AM, TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: *From:* Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com On 10/10/2014 06:59 PM, TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com mailto:turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: *From:* salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com mailto:no_re...@yahoogroups.com ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote : On 10/10/2014 01:04 PM, salyavin808 wrote: Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in Afghanistan ran the whole operation but that really sounds wacky! :-D Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few planes? It's too simple isn't it. That's the problem people have, they can't believe that much destruction was caused by a few maniacs in hijacked planes. But it was not that simple. And the alleged fliers couldn't even fly a Cessna properly let alone a jet. Those planes were remote controlled and such systems were available in advance of 9-11. I disagree, I think they were telepathically controlled by the Space Brothers from their secret base on Pluto. Weak minds glom onto conspiracy theories the same way that weak minds follow cult leaders. That's all anyone ever needs to know about discussions like this. Are you inferring that I'm a weak mind, Barry? What's happened to you? Getting old and cranky and the contracts not showing up like they used too? I am saying that a *tendency* to believe in conspiracy theories is a mental disorder strongly linked to the mental disorder that attracts people to cults. IMO, conspiracy theories offer those who tend to gravitate to them the same thing that cults do -- 1) easy answers to complex questions, The easy answer would be the Official 9-11 Story or: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yuC_4mGTs98https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yuC_4mGTs98 Those whose investigate 9-11 further have more complex answers so you have it a little backward. and 2) the feeling of being special, because you know the truth while lesser people don't. No, we're just pointing out some interesting clues to a massive crime scene. It is an educational effort. There have been many studies of conspiracy theories and why they've become so popular. Here are a few articles on the subject. I really like one line from this first one: The best predictor of belief in a /conspiracy theory/ is belief in other conspiracy theories... That, for me, indicates a *strong* link between conspiracy nuts and cultists. Just think about Fairfield, and why *every* huckster selling New Age potions and seminars and techniques comes through town -- they do this because TMers, having been taught to believe *one* set of improbable things (dare I mention levitation and butt bounce for peace), are now primed to believe *more* improbable things. Fairfielders are well known in the U.S. as being the Biggest Suckers In The Country -- if you want to sell *anything* bizarre and New Agey, you take your snake oil routine to Fairfield. Well, I'm suggesting that the same is true of conspiracy nuts -- once you've bought into one of them, and felt all special because you know the truth and lesser people around you don't, you become an easy mark for the next conspiracy theory. And the next. And the next. And... Why Rational People Buy Into Conspiracy Theories http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all image http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all Why Rational People Buy Into Conspiracy Theories http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all Psychologists are beginning to unravel the mystery behind this brand of American political paranoia. View on www.nytimes.com http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all Preview by Yahoo This next article also agrees with my personal theories about conspiracy theories in another way: Conspiracy theories offer easy answers by casting the world as simpler and more predictable than it is. Neither conspiracy nuts nor cultists like mysteries, things they can't explain. So they tend to glom onto the first easy explanation to ease their cognitive dissonance. Why People Believe in Conspiracy Theories http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-people-believe-conspiracy-theories/ image http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-people-believe-conspiracy-theories/ Why People Believe in Conspiracy Theories http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-people-believe-conspiracy-theories/ Conspiracy
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
The term “conspiracy theory”, though I use it myself, is a two-edged sword that may have outlived its usefulness. Those challenging mainstream knowledge and conventions are routinely cast as conspiracy nuts – and implying that such nut jobs glob onto many such “oddball” explanations of the universe as a crutch to cope with reality, It has acquired a derogatory meaning and can become a perverse tool applied to dismiss or ridicule unconventional beliefs, a tool of suppressing sincere inquiry and challenging of prevailing norms and wisdom, defying gut instincts (aka cognitive biases) and seeking truth no matter where it takes you and at what costa. Many breakthroughs and new understanding of how the world works, including counter-culture ideas, and challenges to the establishment, have been initially derided as crack-pot ideas, conspiracy theories, promoted by nut jobs. Derision of challenging and troubling ideas is a core defense mechanism. A vast list of crack-pot ideas, inflammatory, and/or conspiracy-driven dibble has unfolded and become in our lifetimes mainstream wisdom – a few, both large and small (may) include (not in any order of impact or importance: the Snowden leaks, Pentagon Papers, Lewinsky’s blue dress, lack of weapons of mass destruction, Judith Bourque’s book, Iran-Contra, the Madoff scandal, genocides and mass murder of German concentration camps, Stalin, Mao, Khmer Rouge, Sudan, Native Americans, “California real-estate prices never go down”, the USDA’s food triangle, equal pay for equal work, segregation, JFK’s affairs, Watergate, MY Lai, black site prisons, priest pedophilia, the tech bubble (“you just don’t GET it”), the housing bubble, Goldman Sachs, the extent of regulatory capture, animals having emotions, Sandusky, celebrities coming out of the closet, the Higgs Boson, Masters and Johnson, a black president, LBJ’s decline seek re-election, the value of “health foods”, vegetarianism, yoga and meditation, game-changing technology, global climate change, etc. More so over the march of time – much of mainstream science came from those initially labeled heretics, crackpots, etc. Though many weird, strange, mind-blowing, unbelievable things have turned out to be true, that hardly means that all weird, strange, mind-blowing, unbelievable things are true. Some core distinctions are willingness to systematically, without bias or agenda, challenge one’s own and society’s views, models of how the world works, prevailing understandings and conventional wisdom. These are high virtues, not something that is worthy of derision and labels such as conspiracy theories.. However, it is hardly a virtue to be driven by conformational bias in assembling facts to form an apparent, though illusory random pattern in order to fulfill some inner need to cast blows against the empire, exude elitism, deride others, irrationally attempt to bring order and make sense of a seemly, at times, irrational challenging life and universe. A key distinction is whether one first shoots the arrow or paints the target, is open to considering all evidence, a willingness to change views as new evidence presents itself, always seeking to find alternative answers to explain and overturn one’s current pet POV, having a healthy sense of both skepticism and optimism, and having an identity independent of a particular “truth”.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
Some conspiracy theories are more fun and more chilling than others - read this obit of Billie Sol Estes and see what you think: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/may/17/billie-sol-estes Billie Sol Estes obituary Spectacularly successful Texas fraudster who figured in conspiracy theories about the death of John F Kennedy View on www.theguardian.com Preview by Yahoo From: seerd...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 1:46 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11 The term “conspiracy theory”, though I use it myself, is a two-edged sword that may have outlived its usefulness. Those challenging mainstream knowledge and conventions are routinely cast as conspiracy nuts – and implying that such nut jobs glob onto many such “oddball” explanations of the universe as a crutch to cope with reality, It has acquired a derogatory meaning and can become a perverse tool applied to dismiss or ridicule unconventional beliefs, a tool of suppressing sincere inquiry and challenging of prevailing norms and wisdom, defying gut instincts (aka cognitive biases) and seeking truth no matter where it takes you and at what costa. Many breakthroughs and new understanding of how the world works, including counter-culture ideas, and challenges to the establishment, have been initially derided as crack-pot ideas, conspiracy theories, promoted by nut jobs. Derision of challenging and troubling ideas is a core defense mechanism. A vast list of crack-pot ideas, inflammatory, and/or conspiracy-driven dibble has unfolded and become in our lifetimes mainstream wisdom – a few, both large and small (may) include (not in any order of impact or importance: the Snowden leaks, Pentagon Papers, Lewinsky’s blue dress, lack of weapons of mass destruction, Judith Bourque’s book, Iran-Contra, the Madoff scandal, genocides and mass murder of German concentration camps, Stalin, Mao, Khmer Rouge, Sudan, Native Americans, “California real-estate prices never go down”, the USDA’s food triangle, equal pay for equal work, segregation, JFK’s affairs, Watergate, MY Lai, black site prisons, priest pedophilia, the tech bubble (“you just don’t GET it”), the housing bubble, Goldman Sachs, the extent of regulatory capture, animals having emotions, Sandusky, celebrities coming out of the closet, the Higgs Boson, Masters and Johnson, a black president, LBJ’s decline seek re-election, the value of “health foods”, vegetarianism, yoga and meditation, game-changing technology, global climate change, etc. More so over the march of time – much of mainstream science came from those initially labeled heretics, crackpots, etc. Though many weird, strange, mind-blowing, unbelievable things have turned out to be true, that hardly means that all weird, strange, mind-blowing, unbelievable things are true. Some core distinctions are willingness to systematically, without bias or agenda, challenge one’s own and society’s views, models of how the world works, prevailing understandings and conventional wisdom. These are high virtues, not something that is worthy of derision and labels such as conspiracy theories.. However, it is hardly a virtue to be driven by conformational bias in assembling facts to form an apparent, though illusory random pattern in order to fulfill some inner need to cast blows against the empire, exude elitism, deride others, irrationally attempt to bring order and make sense of a seemly, at times, irrational challenging life and universe. A key distinction is whether one first shoots the arrow or paints the target, is open to considering all evidence, a willingness to change views as new evidence presents itself, always seeking to find alternative answers to explain and overturn one’s current pet POV, having a healthy sense of both skepticism and optimism, and having an identity independent of a particular “truth”.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
Image if your local police department reported a murder as someone shot the person. Case closed That's almost what the 9-11 official story is like. You would have been well advised not to use RationalWiki which skeptics don't even like. Those of us who think there is something more to a case than reported don't call ourselves conspiracy theorists. That term has come about and used by PSYOPS to discredit us since the JFK assassination which I don't think Oswald had anything to do with because he had a cheap gun and was seen in the lunch room at the book depository when the assassination took place. He was a convenience patsy due to his activities. If Ruby had not shot him it might have come out that he got framed. Anyone on the right track to solving these crimes who has any visibility such as a news reporter often gets offed or suicided. Some of the nutty stuff you will find in conspiracy theorist are PSYOPS trying to poison the well lest the truth be known. Just think if we could prove beyond a doubt that 9-11 was indeed an inside job and who the perps were how confidence in our government would fall, not that it isn't anyway. And we have long had little confidence in our corporations and banks which these days run like gang operations. The USA is a very dirty place. It was that way from it's inception because some of the wealthy landowners didn't want their workers to have rights and some wanted the US to still be beholding to Britain. Our democracy is an illusion and the king makers hate anyone who points that out. A lot more people would have probably taken to the streets during the Occupy Movement but they feared losing their jobs. We live in a country of increasing have nots, people who have lost even their simple pleasures of life because a plan to put all but a few in austerity. So many detractors here seem to have little knowledge of history and just react emotionally. I guess some folks want to live in a simple world of Santy Claus and Easter Bunnies. On 10/11/2014 10:46 AM, seerd...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: The term “conspiracy theory”, though I use it myself, is a two-edged sword that may have outlived its usefulness. Those challenging mainstream knowledge and conventions are routinely cast as conspiracy nuts – and implying that such nut jobs glob onto many such “oddball” explanations of the universe as a crutch to cope with reality, It has acquired a derogatory meaning and can become a perverse tool applied to dismiss or ridicule unconventional beliefs, a tool of suppressing sincere inquiry and challenging of prevailing norms and wisdom, defying gut instincts (aka cognitive biases) and seeking truth no matter where it takes you and at what costa. Many breakthroughs and new understanding of how the world works, including counter-culture ideas, and challenges to the establishment, have been initially derided as crack-pot ideas, conspiracy theories, promoted by nut jobs. Derision of challenging and troubling ideas is a core defense mechanism. A vast list of crack-pot ideas, inflammatory, and/or conspiracy-driven dibble has unfolded and become in our lifetimes mainstream wisdom – a few, both large and small (may) include (not in any order of impact or importance: the Snowden leaks, Pentagon Papers, Lewinsky’s blue dress, lack of weapons of mass destruction, Judith Bourque’s book, Iran-Contra, the Madoff scandal, genocides and mass murder of German concentration camps, Stalin, Mao, Khmer Rouge, Sudan, Native Americans, “California real-estate prices never go down”, the USDA’s food triangle, equal pay for equal work, segregation, JFK’s affairs, Watergate, MY Lai, black site prisons, priest pedophilia, the tech bubble (“you just don’t GET it”), the housing bubble, Goldman Sachs, the extent of regulatory capture, animals having emotions, Sandusky, celebrities coming out of the closet, the Higgs Boson, Masters and Johnson, a black president, LBJ’s decline seek re-election, the value of “health foods”, vegetarianism, yoga and meditation, game-changing technology, global climate change, etc. More so over the march of time – much of mainstream science came from those initially labeled heretics, crackpots, etc. Though many weird, strange, mind-blowing, unbelievable things have turned out to be true, that hardly means that all weird, strange, mind-blowing, unbelievable things are true. Some core distinctions are willingness to systematically, without bias or agenda, challenge one’s own and society’s views, models of how the world works, prevailing understandings and conventional wisdom. These are high virtues, not something that is worthy of derision and labels such as conspiracy theories.. However, it is hardly a virtue to be driven by conformational bias in assembling facts to form an apparent, though illusory random pattern in order to fulfill some inner need to cast blows against the empire,
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
Very well said. This sentence, Derision of challenging and troubling ideas is a core defense mechanism., stood out for me. In the face of a modern age, with an endless cascade of information, to assimilate, or challenge, it becomes an easy out, to draw broad conclusions, either casting too critical an eye at unconventional life, or, becoming naively accepting of it. I try to keep an open mind, especially for events where I was not present, and must rely on a media source for information. Fwiw, in terms of public events, the one that still has me thinking, is the JFK killing - Mostly because Oswald was then killed, in a highly secure environment (the basement of Dallas Police HQ), by Jack Ruby, who then died on the eve of his second trial, four years later, at 55. Perhaps it was exactly how the govt. said it was, but too many questions, for my liking. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, seerdope@... wrote : The term “conspiracy theory”, though I use it myself, is a two-edged sword that may have outlived its usefulness. Those challenging mainstream knowledge and conventions are routinely cast as conspiracy nuts – and implying that such nut jobs glob onto many such “oddball” explanations of the universe as a crutch to cope with reality, It has acquired a derogatory meaning and can become a perverse tool applied to dismiss or ridicule unconventional beliefs, a tool of suppressing sincere inquiry and challenging of prevailing norms and wisdom, defying gut instincts (aka cognitive biases) and seeking truth no matter where it takes you and at what costa. Many breakthroughs and new understanding of how the world works, including counter-culture ideas, and challenges to the establishment, have been initially derided as crack-pot ideas, conspiracy theories, promoted by nut jobs. Derision of challenging and troubling ideas is a core defense mechanism. A vast list of crack-pot ideas, inflammatory, and/or conspiracy-driven dibble has unfolded and become in our lifetimes mainstream wisdom – a few, both large and small (may) include (not in any order of impact or importance: the Snowden leaks, Pentagon Papers, Lewinsky’s blue dress, lack of weapons of mass destruction, Judith Bourque’s book, Iran-Contra, the Madoff scandal, genocides and mass murder of German concentration camps, Stalin, Mao, Khmer Rouge, Sudan, Native Americans, “California real-estate prices never go down”, the USDA’s food triangle, equal pay for equal work, segregation, JFK’s affairs, Watergate, MY Lai, black site prisons, priest pedophilia, the tech bubble (“you just don’t GET it”), the housing bubble, Goldman Sachs, the extent of regulatory capture, animals having emotions, Sandusky, celebrities coming out of the closet, the Higgs Boson, Masters and Johnson, a black president, LBJ’s decline seek re-election, the value of “health foods”, vegetarianism, yoga and meditation, game-changing technology, global climate change, etc. More so over the march of time – much of mainstream science came from those initially labeled heretics, crackpots, etc. Though many weird, strange, mind-blowing, unbelievable things have turned out to be true, that hardly means that all weird, strange, mind-blowing, unbelievable things are true. Some core distinctions are willingness to systematically, without bias or agenda, challenge one’s own and society’s views, models of how the world works, prevailing understandings and conventional wisdom. These are high virtues, not something that is worthy of derision and labels such as conspiracy theories.. However, it is hardly a virtue to be driven by conformational bias in assembling facts to form an apparent, though illusory random pattern in order to fulfill some inner need to cast blows against the empire, exude elitism, deride others, irrationally attempt to bring order and make sense of a seemly, at times, irrational challenging life and universe. A key distinction is whether one first shoots the arrow or paints the target, is open to considering all evidence, a willingness to change views as new evidence presents itself, always seeking to find alternative answers to explain and overturn one’s current pet POV, having a healthy sense of both skepticism and optimism, and having an identity independent of a particular “truth”.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Image if your local police department reported a murder as someone shot the person. Case closed That's almost what the 9-11 official story is like. You would have been well advised not to use RationalWiki which skeptics don't even like. Those of us who think there is something more to a case than reported don't call ourselves conspiracy theorists. That term has come about and used by PSYOPS to discredit us since the JFK assassination which I don't think Oswald had anything to do with because he had a cheap gun and was seen in the lunch room at the book depository when the assassination took place. He was a convenience patsy due to his activities. If Ruby had not shot him it might have come out that he got framed. Jeez, everyone knows Elvis shot JFK. It's hardly news. Anyone on the right track to solving these crimes who has any visibility such as a news reporter often gets offed or suicided. Some of the nutty stuff you will find in conspiracy theorist are PSYOPS trying to poison the well lest the truth be known. Just think if we could prove beyond a doubt that 9-11 was indeed an inside job and who the perps were how confidence in our government would fall, not that it isn't anyway. And we have long had little confidence in our corporations and banks which these days run like gang operations. After reading the articles Barry posted I was going to write something about how conspiracy theories are probably created by the government to distract everyone from what a crap job they actually do at running the country. Be nice to think there was someone in power who could organise a job that big, we can't even make a computer system to link up health districts without the ministry going bankrupt and abandoning it. The USA is a very dirty place. It was that way from it's inception because some of the wealthy landowners didn't want their workers to have rights and some wanted the US to still be beholding to Britain. Our democracy is an illusion and the king makers hate anyone who points that out. A lot more people would have probably taken to the streets during the Occupy Movement but they feared losing their jobs. We live in a country of increasing have nots, people who have lost even their simple pleasures of life because a plan to put all but a few in austerity. So many detractors here seem to have little knowledge of history and just react emotionally. I guess some folks want to live in a simple world of Santy Claus and Easter Bunnies. Both of which are inventions, just like the conspiracies. What worries is me that you have such a disconnect from the people that run the US that you actually think they would murder thousands of their own people for reasons best known to themselves. There's a kind of movement like that in the UK about the Islamic terrorist that blew up some tube trains a decade ago. The story goes that the government knew about it but let it happen because it would be an excuse to rachet up the anti-terror laws, which completely coincidentally can also be used to harass innocent people whenever the state feels like it. I don't believe it for the simple fact that however cynical politicians get it's their own friends and family that might get blown up. You don't seem to have that sort of human link, sure the govt in the US has blood on its hands but the 9/11 conspiracies are qualitatively different from interfering in the politics of left wing countries or suppressing anti-capitalist demonstrations. It isn't a quantitative thing at all. I think it's the conspiracists that react emotionally, something unbelievable happens and the dots get joined up irrationally, anything to make it make sense that doesn't just mean the world is so dangerous a bunch of religious fruitcakes can walk onto planes in America and fly them into public buildings. I'd hate to live in a country where I thought the government would actually blow me up as an excuse for starting a war in a third world country, some of the residents of which had already made some bold attacks on the US - unless they were conspiracies too. Because of the crap you can find on youtube, I know people who actually think ISIS and Al Queda don't exist at all and were created so the west can clamp down on personal freedom. We realists know they just used the 9/11 and 7/7 bombings as an excuse for that. On 10/11/2014 10:46 AM, seerdope@... mailto:seerdope@... [FairfieldLife] wrote: The term “conspiracy theory”, though I use it myself, is a two-edged sword that may have outlived its usefulness. Those challenging mainstream knowledge and conventions are routinely cast as conspiracy nuts – and implying that such nut jobs glob onto many such “oddball” explanations of the universe as a crutch to cope with reality, It has acquired a derogatory meaning and can become a perverse
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
Elvis didn't shoot JFK - Mac Wallace did. Billie Sol said so: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/may/17/billie-sol-estes Billie Sol Estes obituary Spectacularly successful Texas fraudster who figured in conspiracy theories about the death of John F Kennedy View on www.theguardian.com Preview by Yahoo From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 3:20 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11 ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Image if your local police department reported a murder as someone shot the person. Case closed That's almost what the 9-11 official story is like. You would have been well advised not to use RationalWiki which skeptics don't even like. Those of us who think there is something more to a case than reported don't call ourselves conspiracy theorists. That term has come about and used by PSYOPS to discredit us since the JFK assassination which I don't think Oswald had anything to do with because he had a cheap gun and was seen in the lunch room at the book depository when the assassination took place. He was a convenience patsy due to his activities. If Ruby had not shot him it might have come out that he got framed. Jeez, everyone knows Elvis shot JFK. It's hardly news. Anyone on the right track to solving these crimes who has any visibility such as a news reporter often gets offed or suicided. Some of the nutty stuff you will find in conspiracy theorist are PSYOPS trying to poison the well lest the truth be known. Just think if we could prove beyond a doubt that 9-11 was indeed an inside job and who the perps were how confidence in our government would fall, not that it isn't anyway. And we have long had little confidence in our corporations and banks which these days run like gang operations. After reading the articles Barry posted I was going to write something about how conspiracy theories are probably created by the government to distract everyone from what a crap job they actually do at running the country. Be nice to think there was someone in power who could organise a job that big, we can't even make a computer system to link up health districts without the ministry going bankrupt and abandoning it. The USA is a very dirty place. It was that way from it's inception because some of the wealthy landowners didn't want their workers to have rights and some wanted the US to still be beholding to Britain. Our democracy is an illusion and the king makers hate anyone who points that out. A lot more people would have probably taken to the streets during the Occupy Movement but they feared losing their jobs. We live in a country of increasing have nots, people who have lost even their simple pleasures of life because a plan to put all but a few in austerity. So many detractors here seem to have little knowledge of history and just react emotionally. I guess some folks want to live in a simple world of Santy Claus and Easter Bunnies. Both of which are inventions, just like the conspiracies. What worries is me that you have such a disconnect from the people that run the US that you actually think they would murder thousands of their own people for reasons best known to themselves. There's a kind of movement like that in the UK about the Islamic terrorist that blew up some tube trains a decade ago. The story goes that the government knew about it but let it happen because it would be an excuse to rachet up the anti-terror laws, which completely coincidentally can also be used to harass innocent people whenever the state feels like it. I don't believe it for the simple fact that however cynical politicians get it's their own friends and family that might get blown up. You don't seem to have that sort of human link, sure the govt in the US has blood on its hands but the 9/11 conspiracies are qualitatively different from interfering in the politics of left wing countries or suppressing anti-capitalist demonstrations. It isn't a quantitative thing at all. I think it's the conspiracists that react emotionally, something unbelievable happens and the dots get joined up irrationally, anything to make it make sense that doesn't just mean the world is so dangerous a bunch of religious fruitcakes can walk onto planes in America and fly them into public buildings. I'd hate to live in a country where I thought the government would actually blow me up as an excuse for starting a war in a third world country, some of the residents of which had already made some bold attacks on the US - unless they were conspiracies too. Because of the crap you can find on youtube, I know people who actually think ISIS and Al Queda don't exist at all and were created so the west can clamp down on personal freedom. We realists know they just used the 9/11 and 7/7 bombings as an excuse
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
In the 1980s I knew some ex-cops from Texas who were probably in witness protection because of what they knew about Billy Sol Estes. On 10/11/2014 11:01 AM, Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: Some conspiracy theories are more fun and more chilling than others - read this obit of Billie Sol Estes and see what you think: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/may/17/billie-sol-estes image http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/may/17/billie-sol-estes Billie Sol Estes obituary http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/may/17/billie-sol-estes Spectacularly successful Texas fraudster who figured in conspiracy theories about the death of John F Kennedy View on www.theguardian.com http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/may/17/billie-sol-estes Preview by Yahoo *From:* seerd...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com *To:* FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com *Sent:* Saturday, October 11, 2014 1:46 PM *Subject:* Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11 The term “conspiracy theory”, though I use it myself, is a two-edged sword that may have outlived its usefulness. Those challenging mainstream knowledge and conventions are routinely cast as conspiracy nuts – and implying that such nut jobs glob onto many such “oddball” explanations of the universe as a crutch to cope with reality, It has acquired a derogatory meaning and can become a perverse tool applied to dismiss or ridicule unconventional beliefs, a tool of suppressing sincere inquiry and challenging of prevailing norms and wisdom, defying gut instincts (aka cognitive biases) and seeking truth no matter where it takes you and at what costa. Many breakthroughs and new understanding of how the world works, including counter-culture ideas, and challenges to the establishment, have been initially derided as crack-pot ideas, conspiracy theories, promoted by nut jobs. Derision of challenging and troubling ideas is a core defense mechanism. A vast list of crack-pot ideas, inflammatory, and/or conspiracy-driven dibble has unfolded and become in our lifetimes mainstream wisdom – a few, both large and small (may) include (not in any order of impact or importance: the Snowden leaks, Pentagon Papers, Lewinsky’s blue dress, lack of weapons of mass destruction, Judith Bourque’s book, Iran-Contra, the Madoff scandal, genocides and mass murder of German concentration camps, Stalin, Mao, Khmer Rouge, Sudan, Native Americans, “California real-estate prices never go down”, the USDA’s food triangle, equal pay for equal work, segregation, JFK’s affairs, Watergate, MY Lai, black site prisons, priest pedophilia, the tech bubble (“you just don’t GET it”), the housing bubble, Goldman Sachs, the extent of regulatory capture, animals having emotions, Sandusky, celebrities coming out of the closet, the Higgs Boson, Masters and Johnson, a black president, LBJ’s decline seek re-election, the value of “health foods”, vegetarianism, yoga and meditation, game-changing technology, global climate change, etc. More so over the march of time – much of mainstream science came from those initially labeled heretics, crackpots, etc. Though many weird, strange, mind-blowing, unbelievable things have turned out to be true, that hardly means that all weird, strange, mind-blowing, unbelievable things are true. Some core distinctions are willingness to systematically, without bias or agenda, challenge one’s own and society’s views, models of how the world works, prevailing understandings and conventional wisdom. These are high virtues, not something that is worthy of derision and labels such as conspiracy theories.. However, it is hardly a virtue to be driven by conformational bias in assembling facts to form an apparent, though illusory random pattern in order to fulfill some inner need to cast blows against the empire, exude elitism, deride others, irrationally attempt to bring order and make sense of a seemly, at times, irrational challenging life and universe. /A key distinction is whether one first shoots the arrow or paints the target, is open to considering all evidence, a willingness to change views as new evidence presents itself, always seeking to find alternative answers to explain and overturn one’s current pet POV, having a healthy sense of both skepticism and optimism, and having an identity independent of a particular “truth”. /
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
On 10/11/2014 12:20 PM, salyavin808 wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Image if your local police department reported a murder as someone shot the person. Case closed That's almost what the 9-11 official story is like. You would have been well advised not to use RationalWiki which skeptics don't even like. Those of us who think there is something more to a case than reported don't call ourselves conspiracy theorists. That term has come about and used by PSYOPS to discredit us since the JFK assassination which I don't think Oswald had anything to do with because he had a cheap gun and was seen in the lunch room at the book depository when the assassination took place. He was a convenience patsy due to his activities. If Ruby had not shot him it might have come out that he got framed. Jeez, everyone knows Elvis shot JFK. It's hardly news. Anyone on the right track to solving these crimes who has any visibility such as a news reporter often gets offed or suicided. Some of the nutty stuff you will find in conspiracy theorist are PSYOPS trying to poison the well lest the truth be known. Just think if we could prove beyond a doubt that 9-11 was indeed an inside job and who the perps were how confidence in our government would fall, not that it isn't anyway. And we have long had little confidence in our corporations and banks which these days run like gang operations. After reading the articles Barry posted I was going to write something about how conspiracy theories are probably created by the government to distract everyone from what a crap job they actually do at running the country. Be nice to think there was someone in power who could organise a job that big, we can't even make a computer system to link up health districts without the ministry going bankrupt and abandoning it. The USA is a very dirty place. It was that way from it's inception because some of the wealthy landowners didn't want their workers to have rights and some wanted the US to still be beholding to Britain. Our democracy is an illusion and the king makers hate anyone who points that out. A lot more people would have probably taken to the streets during the Occupy Movement but they feared losing their jobs. We live in a country of increasing have nots, people who have lost even their simple pleasures of life because a plan to put all but a few in austerity. So many detractors here seem to have little knowledge of history and just react emotionally. I guess some folks want to live in a simple world of Santy Claus and Easter Bunnies. Both of which are inventions, just like the conspiracies. What worries is me that you have such a disconnect from the people that run the US that you actually think they would murder thousands of their own people for reasons best known to themselves. Whoa, Jack! You're half reading me. I'm not alleging that our politicians conspired to pull off 9-11. It's a shadow government that many people in the US believe exists (and probably many folks in the UK believe about your own government). Killing thousands would rile up Americans (and believe me the days following they were insanely riled) to support anything the government asked if it involved retaliation. So Arab terrorists did 9-11 and we go off and bomb Afghanistan and Iraq. Shouldn't we have bombed Saudi Arabia instead? Something wrong with that picture? BTW, for some reason a lot of people who worked at the WTC were told to stay home that day. There's a kind of movement like that in the UK about the Islamic terrorist that blew up some tube trains a decade ago. The story goes that the government knew about it but let it happen because it would be an excuse to rachet up the anti-terror laws, which completely coincidentally can also be used to harass innocent people whenever the state feels like it. The UK subway bombings indeed smell of a false flag. These types of operations have been around for centuries but I guess that history wasn't your favorite subject? I don't believe it for the simple fact that however cynical politicians get it's their own friends and family that might get blown up. You don't seem to have that sort of human link, sure the govt in the US has blood on its hands but the 9/11 conspiracies are qualitatively different from interfering in the politics of left wing countries or suppressing anti-capitalist demonstrations. It isn't a quantitative thing at all. See my above comment. I think it's the conspiracists that react emotionally, something unbelievable happens and the dots get joined up irrationally, anything to make it make sense that doesn't just mean the world is so dangerous a bunch of religious fruitcakes can walk onto planes in America and fly them into public buildings. I'd hate to live in a country where I thought the government would actually blow me up as an excuse for starting a
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
To me the (mythical/hypothetical rational, impartial) jury is still out on the JFK assassination. It has so many undisclosed facts, mistruths, destroyed or missing data, convenient subsequent deaths, agenda's build on agendas (on many sides of the question), whitewashes, etc. For me, 9/11 has similar problems (though I am not equating frameworks or magnitude.) . To me other issues such as the undisclosed, hidden full backroom story and agendas of how and why the US and others have gotten involved in, instigated, and/or prolonged major wars is deeply problematic and troubling (Spanish American war, Philippine American war, WWI, WWII, Vietnam, Central America, Gulf War, Iraq and Afghanistan, Lybia, ISIS, etc. Eisenhower's caution about the military/industrial complex is as valid if not more so today than in 1960 when he left office with those words. I would expand it to the military/industrial/financial. So much lays beneath the surface that should be uncovered. Other issues, while fairly well documented still need much more to be uncovered (and the public to wake up to it) such as regulatory capture (when a regulatory agency, created to act in the public interest, advances the commercial or special concerns of interest groups that dominate the industry or sector it is charged with regulating), the revolving door between government and high paying private sector jobs and influence, the power and influence of of Investment banks, the substantial science supporting global warming and the vast and far reaching costs and disruption of its current and unfolding impacts over the next century agra-business's influence on public (non)nutrition AMA and FDA (at times) perverse influence and roadblocks to the pursuit of a healthy life the obstacles to deep, constructive reform to primary and secondary education (including and not limited to teachers unions, text book publishers, etc) the perverse and cozy healthcare / insurance complex Medicare solvency advances in brain science in the past 10 years concentration of power in governments, corporations and high wealth individuals/families pervasive influence of cognitive biases and irrational / anti-science bias growing divergence of income distribution There are so many issues that need fuller investigation, disclosure and understanding. Given limited time and resources, to me its a question of choosing one's battles, identifying which areas of disclosure and changes will make a substantive difference. And that is at the cost of less focus on really perverse, messed-up, clearly corrupt, black (yet still fascinating and intriguing) events and processes. To me, the JFK assassination (as well as Kennedy's and brothers' at least in part questionable behind the scenes actions and agendas) are fascinating -- having lived through that era and through the implications of those events -- and clearly somethings are still quite rotten and smelly. However, will getting to the bottom of that provide as much fuel for positive change and reform as, for example, helping to provide greater insight into, and actions to help mitigate and adapt to, the vast tsunami of disruption that global climate change that is unfolding? Or does real change really begin (and end) with individual change. Is that the more effective pursuit -- even if it means foregoing worthy public inquiry outlined above?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
Mac: Very well said. This sentence, Derision of challenging and troubling ideas is a core defense mechanism., stood out for me. In the face of a modern age, with an endless cascade of information, to assimilate, or challenge, it becomes an easy out, to draw broad conclusions, either casting too critical an eye at unconventional life, or, becoming naively accepting of it. I try to keep an open mind, especially for events where I was not present, and must rely on a media source for information. Mac: Fwiw, in terms of public events, the one that still has me thinking, is the JFK killing - Mostly because Oswald was then killed, in a highly secure environment (the basement of Dallas Police HQ), by Jack Ruby, who then died on the eve of his second trial, four years later, at 55. Perhaps it was exactly how the govt. said it was, but too many questions, for my liking. Seerdope Reply: To me the (mythical/hypothetical rational, impartial) jury is still out on the JFK assassination. It has so many undisclosed facts, mistruths, destroyed or missing data, convenient subsequent deaths, agenda's build on agendas (on many sides of the question), whitewashes, etc. For me, 9/11 has similar problems (though I am not equating frameworks or magnitude.) . To me other issues such as the undisclosed, hidden full backroom story and agendas of how and why the US and others have gotten involved in, instigated, and/or prolonged major wars is deeply problematic and troubling (Spanish American war, Philippine American war, WWI, WWII, Vietnam, Central America, Gulf War, Iraq and Afghanistan, Lybia, ISIS, etc. Eisenhower's caution about the military/industrial complex is as valid if not more so today than in 1960 when he left office with those words. I would expand it to the military/industrial/financial. So much lays beneath the surface that should be uncovered. Other issues, while fairly well documented still need much more to be uncovered (and the public to wake up to it) such as regulatory capture (when a regulatory agency, created to act in the public interest, advances the commercial or special concerns of interest groups that dominate the industry or sector it is charged with regulating), the revolving door between government and high paying private sector jobs and influence, the power and influence of of Investment banks, the substantial science supporting global warming and the vast and far reaching costs and disruption of its current and unfolding impacts over the next century agra-business's influence on public (non)nutrition AMA and FDA (at times) perverse influence and roadblocks to the pursuit of a healthy life the obstacles to deep, constructive reform to primary and secondary education (including and not limited to teachers unions, text book publishers, etc) the perverse and cozy healthcare / insurance complex Medicare solvency advances in brain science in the past 10 years concentration of power in governments, corporations and high wealth individuals/families pervasive influence of cognitive biases and irrational / anti-science bias growing divergence of income distribution There are so many issues that need fuller investigation, disclosure and understanding. Given limited time and resources, to me its a question of choosing one's battles, identifying which areas of disclosure and changes will make a substantive difference. And that is at the cost of less focus on really perverse, messed-up, clearly corrupt, black (yet still fascinating and intriguing) events and processes. To me, the JFK assassination (as well as Kennedy's and brothers' at least in part questionable behind the scenes actions and agendas) are fascinating -- having lived through that era and through the implications of those events -- and clearly somethings are still quite rotten and smelly. However, will getting to the bottom of that provide as much fuel for positive change and reform as, for example, helping to provide greater insight into, and actions to help mitigate and adapt to, the vast tsunami of disruption that global climate change that is unfolding? Or does real change really begin (and end) with individual change. Is that the more effective pursuit -- even if it means foregoing worthy public inquiry outlined above?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
Snoozguru (is that Bhairitu?) said: You would have been well advised not to use RationalWiki which skeptics don't even like. SD: I am not relying on RationalWiki as an authority. However, it provides some credible counter arguments to some 9/11 points that you (and others, such as O'keefe in related video) have raised. I don't find all the points raised in the 9/11 section of RationalWiki particular relevant or well considered. The same points that I drew upon are found from a number of alternative sources. RationalWiki simply compiled otherwise existing information is a convenient format (for me). I hope you will address (at least some) of the specific counter points that I listed. I hope you will not not blanketly discredit or disregard the counterpoints because you are not a fan of the site that compiled them from many other sources. I do not have a rigid stance on many 911 issues and am not trying to win any sort of debate. You raised some interesting points. Upon research I found,further information that, until refuted or discredited, appears to counter some of your your points. Not the end of the story in my view. Successive exchanges of points and rational counterpoints is at least one means to get further towards the bottom of things. Snoozeguru: Those of us who think there is something more to a case than reported don't call ourselves conspiracy theorists. SD: I don't like the term conspiracy theorist either as I outline in a prior post this morning. I was responding to Turq's (to me useful) articles -- but pointing out the pitfalls of terms stemming from conspiracy.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : On 10/11/2014 12:20 PM, salyavin808 wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote : What worries is me that you have such a disconnect from the people that run the US that you actually think they would murder thousands of their own people for reasons best known to themselves. Whoa, Jack! You're half reading me. I'm not alleging that our politicians conspired to pull off 9-11. It's a shadow government that many people in the US believe exists (and probably many folks in the UK believe about your own government). Killing thousands would rile up Americans (and believe me the days following they were insanely riled) to support anything the government asked if it involved retaliation. So Arab terrorists did 9-11 and we go off and bomb Afghanistan and Iraq. Shouldn't we have bombed Saudi Arabia instead? Something wrong with that picture? But the hijackers weren't working for the Saudi government. The organisers lived in Afghanistan and we just knocked off Iraq for the hell of it. Been after an excuse for years. BTW, for some reason a lot of people who worked at the WTC were told to stay home that day. There's a kind of movement like that in the UK about the Islamic terrorist that blew up some tube trains a decade ago. The story goes that the government knew about it but let it happen because it would be an excuse to rachet up the anti-terror laws, which completely coincidentally can also be used to harass innocent people whenever the state feels like it. The UK subway bombings indeed smell of a false flag. These types of operations have been around for centuries but I guess that history wasn't your favorite subject? I think you've lost it. Can you tell fact from fiction any more? Too much TV perhaps, it's hard to tell sometimes, except the news doesn't have happy endings. I don't believe it for the simple fact that however cynical politicians get it's their own friends and family that might get blown up. You don't seem to have that sort of human link, sure the govt in the US has blood on its hands but the 9/11 conspiracies are qualitatively different from interfering in the politics of left wing countries or suppressing anti-capitalist demonstrations. It isn't a quantitative thing at all. See my above comment. I think it's the conspiracists that react emotionally, something unbelievable happens and the dots get joined up irrationally, anything to make it make sense that doesn't just mean the world is so dangerous a bunch of religious fruitcakes can walk onto planes in America and fly them into public buildings. I'd hate to live in a country where I thought the government would actually blow me up as an excuse for starting a war in a third world country, some of the residents of which had already made some bold attacks on the US - unless they were conspiracies too. In the 1960s they wanted to send us young guys off to the rice paddies of Vietnam to get our asses shot off. Gulf of Tonkin is a confirmed false flag to gain public support. The poor Vietnamese just wanted their country back after centuries of domination by foreign powers. Now we do trade with them. Go figger. Because of the crap you can find on youtube, I know people who actually think ISIS and Al Queda don't exist at all and were created so the west can clamp down on personal freedom. We realists know they just used the 9/11 and 7/7 bombings as an excuse for that. This history of Al Qaeda is well known from their existence as Mujahideen and supported by our CIA to fight against the Russians in Afghanistan. They've now morphed into ISIS. Erm, that's what I've said here many times. It's the conspiracy theorists who've taken it too far. Not me. Some of us weren't born yesterday. BTW, when is it you turn 1? :-D I'm guessing this is some derision at challenging ideas yes?
[FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
Yeah, of course you can find MANY who would be part of arranging a false flag for 9-11. What a bunch of blinkered fools we are. Let's open our scrunched-up eyes a crack and admit one thing: the authorities of the world will do cruelty in any form upon anyone no matter the legal framework. Your local cop IS A MOTHERFUCKING KILLER wishing for his moment to totally ruin someone's life. And if he isn't, then he's an enabler of a fellow cop who is a sociopathand that is just AS BAD. Case in point: I know of an 2007 incident in sleepy little-town FAIRFIELD in which a cop TORTURED A ROO for over 12 hours in the presence of the other officers. Not a headline. (Don't ask for details -- can't out a Roo who doesn't want more of the same if he's seen bitching about it in public. No charges, let the guy go the next day.) But see? This is the heart of darkness within ALL OF US in Kali Yuga. Even our heroes will be found to be tilted in this age. Even the good guys...consider how the TMO did all it could to subvert the legal requirements during the murder at MUM. Those were saints, right? Even inside them was the I get to do whatever shit I want to dynamic. Consider Ed Beckeley, Dr. Bloomfield, the commodities groups, the TMO money laundering and smuggling, etc. I have been to 17 countries and saw the same shit everywhere. Give someone a gun and they're looking for game cuz they're on safari, donchaknow. To sum: how many good Americans would be willing to put a tactical nuke inside a 9-11 tower? Almost any cop, any soldier. Deal with this fact. It's the truth. Krishna took sattva with Him 5,000 years ago. There's no Arjuna out there wearing a badge of honor and integrity.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
seerdope, I agree and ask myself 1 question: if the conspiracy theories are true, which I think they are, would I live my life any differently. The answer is no. On Saturday, October 11, 2014 3:24 PM, seerd...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Mac: Very well said. This sentence, Derision of challenging and troubling ideas is a core defense mechanism., stood out for me. In the face of a modern age, with an endless cascade of information, to assimilate, or challenge, it becomes an easy out, to draw broad conclusions, either casting too critical an eye at unconventional life, or, becoming naively accepting of it. I try to keep an open mind, especially for events where I was not present, and must rely on a media source for information. Mac: Fwiw, in terms of public events, the one that still has me thinking, is the JFK killing - Mostly because Oswald was then killed, in a highly secure environment (the basement of Dallas Police HQ), by Jack Ruby, who then died on the eve of his second trial, four years later, at 55. Perhaps it was exactly how the govt. said it was, but too many questions, for my liking. Seerdope Reply: To me the (mythical/hypothetical rational, impartial) jury is still out on the JFK assassination. It has so many undisclosed facts, mistruths, destroyed or missing data, convenient subsequent deaths, agenda's build on agendas (on many sides of the question), whitewashes, etc. For me, 9/11 has similar problems (though I am not equating frameworks or magnitude.) . To me other issues such as the undisclosed, hidden full backroom story and agendas of how and why the US and others have gotten involved in, instigated, and/or prolonged major wars is deeply problematic and troubling (Spanish American war, Philippine American war, WWI, WWII, Vietnam, Central America, Gulf War, Iraq and Afghanistan, Lybia, ISIS, etc. Eisenhower's caution about the military/industrial complex is as valid if not more so today than in 1960 when he left office with those words. I would expand it to the military/industrial/financial. So much lays beneath the surface that should be uncovered. Other issues, while fairly well documented still need much more to be uncovered (and the public to wake up to it) such as * regulatory capture (when a regulatory agency, created to act in the public interest, advances the commercial or special concerns of interest groups that dominate the industry or sector it is charged with regulating), * the revolving door between government and high paying private sector jobs and influence, * the power and influence of of Investment banks, * the substantial science supporting global warming and the vast and far reaching costs and disruption of its current and unfolding impacts over the next century * agra-business's influence on public (non)nutrition * AMA and FDA (at times) perverse influence and roadblocks to the pursuit of a healthy life * the obstacles to deep, constructive reform to primary and secondary education (including and not limited to teachers unions, text book publishers, etc) * the perverse and cozy healthcare / insurance complex * Medicare solvency * advances in brain science in the past 10 years * concentration of power in governments, corporations and high wealth individuals/families * pervasive influence of cognitive biases and irrational / anti-science bias * growing divergence of income distribution There are so many issues that need fuller investigation, disclosure and understanding. Given limited time and resources, to me its a question of choosing one's battles, identifying which areas of disclosure and changes will make a substantive difference. And that is at the cost of less focus on really perverse, messed-up, clearly corrupt, black (yet still fascinating and intriguing) events and processes. To me, the JFK assassination (as well as Kennedy's and brothers' at least in part questionable behind the scenes actions and agendas) are fascinating -- having lived through that era and through the implications of those events -- and clearly somethings are still quite rotten and smelly. However, will getting to the bottom of that provide as much fuel for positive change and reform as, for example, helping to provide greater insight into, and actions to help mitigate and adapt to, the vast tsunami of disruption that global climate change that is unfolding? Or does real change really begin (and end) with individual change. Is that the more effective pursuit -- even if it means foregoing worthy public inquiry outlined above?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
On 10/11/2014 4:03 PM, Duveyoung wrote: Yeah, of course you can find MANY who would be part of arranging a false flag for 9-11. If you don't agree with every single word of this guy's rant, YOU'RE FUCKED UP IN THE HEAD. Duveyoung Wed, 08 Oct 2014 10:02:10 -0700 http://www.mail-archive.com/fairfieldlife%40yahoogroups.com/msg332298.html /O'Keefe denied the plausibility that the September 11 attacks were committed by Osama bin Laden and the 19 hijackers. He claimed it was an inside job and that the US government and intelligence agencies, including Mossad were responsible./ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_O%27Keefe
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
On 10/11/2014 01:56 PM, salyavin808 wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : On 10/11/2014 12:20 PM, salyavin808 wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote : What worries is me that you have such a disconnect from the people that run the US that you actually think they would murder thousands of their own people for reasons best known to themselves. Whoa, Jack! You're half reading me. I'm not alleging that our politicians conspired to pull off 9-11. It's a shadow government that many people in the US believe exists (and probably many folks in the UK believe about your own government). Killing thousands would rile up Americans (and believe me the days following they were insanely riled) to support anything the government asked if it involved retaliation. So Arab terrorists did 9-11 and we go off and bomb Afghanistan and Iraq. Shouldn't we have bombed Saudi Arabia instead? Something wrong with that picture? But the hijackers weren't working for the Saudi government. You know this how? Supposedly the 28 pages redacted from the Official 911 Report say otherwise. Some members of Congress who have read those pages want them released to the public. The organisers lived in Afghanistan and we just knocked off Iraq for the hell of it. Been after an excuse for years. Yup, Rumsfeld even has been quoted as asking if there was a way to tie Saddam to 9-11. But then I've mentioned I heard in the late 1990s the military was preparing for a war in the middle east. They just needed a new Pearl Harbor even if they did it themselves. For the record I opposed wars of empire as any sane thinking American should. BTW, for some reason a lot of people who worked at the WTC were told to stay home that day. There's a kind of movement like that in the UK about the Islamic terrorist that blew up some tube trains a decade ago. The story goes that the government knew about it but let it happen because it would be an excuse to rachet up the anti-terror laws, which completely coincidentally can also be used to harass innocent people whenever the state feels like it. The UK subway bombings indeed smell of a false flag. These types of operations have been around for centuries but I guess that history wasn't your favorite subject? I think you've lost it. Can you tell fact from fiction any more? Too much TV perhaps, it's hard to tell sometimes, except the news doesn't have happy endings. Why couldn't it have been a false flag? I bet you swallowed the propaganda hook line and sinker. I don't believe it for the simple fact that however cynical politicians get it's their own friends and family that might get blown up. You don't seem to have that sort of human link, sure the govt in the US has blood on its hands but the 9/11 conspiracies are qualitatively different from interfering in the politics of left wing countries or suppressing anti-capitalist demonstrations. It isn't a quantitative thing at all. See my above comment. I think it's the conspiracists that react emotionally, something unbelievable happens and the dots get joined up irrationally, anything to make it make sense that doesn't just mean the world is so dangerous a bunch of religious fruitcakes can walk onto planes in America and fly them into public buildings. I'd hate to live in a country where I thought the government would actually blow me up as an excuse for starting a war in a third world country, some of the residents of which had already made some bold attacks on the US - unless they were conspiracies too. In the 1960s they wanted to send us young guys off to the rice paddies of Vietnam to get our asses shot off. Gulf of Tonkin is a confirmed false flag to gain public support. The poor Vietnamese just wanted their country back after centuries of domination by foreign powers. Now we do trade with them. Go figger. Because of the crap you can find on youtube, I know people who actually think ISIS and Al Queda don't exist at all and were created so the west can clamp down on personal freedom. We realists know they just used the 9/11 and 7/7 bombings as an excuse for that. This history of Al Qaeda is well known from their existence as Mujahideen and supported by our CIA to fight against the Russians in Afghanistan. They've now morphed into ISIS. Erm, that's what I've said here many times. It's the conspiracy theorists who've taken it too far. Not me. That's history pal. Look it up! Or are you afraid to? Some of us weren't born yesterday. BTW, when is it you turn 1? :-D I'm guessing this is some derision at challenging ideas
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
Spot on, Edg. It's amazing how many people who haven't been abroad or worked in government just buy the propaganda. I guess history wasn't their favorite subject. Ask some of the young kids who got shot up in Afghanistan or Iraq why they joined the military? They'll tell you it was the only job they could get. On 10/11/2014 02:03 PM, Duveyoung wrote: Yeah, of course you can find MANY who would be part of arranging a false flag for 9-11. What a bunch of blinkered fools we are. Let's open our scrunched-up eyes a crack and admit one thing: the authorities of the world will do cruelty in any form upon anyone no matter the legal framework. Your local cop IS A MOTHERFUCKING KILLER wishing for his moment to totally ruin someone's life. And if he isn't, then he's an enabler of a fellow cop who is a sociopathand that is just AS BAD. Case in point: I know of an 2007 incident in sleepy little-town FAIRFIELD in which a cop TORTURED A ROO for over 12 hours in the presence of the other officers. Not a headline. (Don't ask for details -- can't out a Roo who doesn't want more of the same if he's seen bitching about it in public. No charges, let the guy go the next day.) But see? This is the heart of darkness within ALL OF US in Kali Yuga. Even our heroes will be found to be tilted in this age. Even the good guys...consider how the TMO did all it could to subvert the legal requirements during the murder at MUM. Those were saints, right? Even inside them was the I get to do whatever shit I want to dynamic. Consider Ed Beckeley, Dr. Bloomfield, the commodities groups, the TMO money laundering and smuggling, etc. I have been to 17 countries and saw the same shit everywhere. Give someone a gun and they're looking for game cuz they're on safari, donchaknow. To sum: how many good Americans would be willing to put a tactical nuke inside a 9-11 tower? Almost any cop, any soldier. Deal with this fact. It's the truth. Krishna took sattva with Him 5,000 years ago. There's no Arjuna out there wearing a badge of honor and integrity.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
The first thing I saw in your points from RationalWiki were Bill Maher and Michael Shermer taken as credible. Maher is a comedian and actually thinks truthers is blaming the government for 9-11 which shows how little he knows about truthers. I say the same about Rachel Maddow who mocks Alex Jones when it is obviously she has never listened to him (one of her interns probably found a few clips that would piss her off to show her). She might be shocked to find she agrees on some stuff that is on Infowars. Michael Shermer has long been known to be a PSYOP and well poisoner. You might as well quote Hearst owned Popular Mechanics, a bastion of yellow journalism. Maybe you can find some articles in Reader's Digest as well. Before I wasted any time with those points I made the effort to look up RationalWiki and it's reputation. There are a number of blog articles and opinion pieces by skeptics who think it is a joke. They'll dig up anything negative to say about anything. Do they have some anti-TM articles as well? Probably anti-Mindfulness pieces as well. Note please that I post my own opinions and if I make references don't demand that people go read them. I do have other things to do. You can look up my past references to 9-11 and debates here going back years. Even Rick questioned WTC 7. I just think that some folks feel really uncomfortable waking up to the idea that they might be living in the Fourth Reich or something like it. The Earth is round BTW. Well not really, it bulges some places. :-D On 10/11/2014 01:45 PM, seerd...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: Snoozguru (is that Bhairitu?) said: You would have been well advised not to use RationalWiki which skeptics don't even like. SD: I am not relying on RationalWiki as an authority. However, it provides some credible counter arguments to some 9/11 points that you (and others, such as O'keefe in related video) have raised. I don't find all the points raised in the 9/11 section of RationalWiki particular relevant or well considered. The same points that I drew upon are found from a number of alternative sources. RationalWiki simply compiled otherwise existing information is a convenient format (for me). I hope you will address (at least some) of the specific counter points that I listed. I hope you will not not blanketly discredit or disregard the counterpoints because you are not a fan of the site that compiled them from many other sources. I do not have a rigid stance on many 911 issues and am not trying to win any sort of debate. You raised some interesting points. Upon research I found,further information that, until refuted or discredited, appears to counter some of your your points. Not the end of the story in my view. Successive exchanges of points and rational counterpoints is at least one means to get further towards the bottom of things. Snoozeguru: Those of us who think there is something more to a case than reported don't call ourselves conspiracy theorists. SD: I don't like the term conspiracy theorist either as I outline in a prior post this morning. I was responding to Turq's (to me useful) articles -- but pointing out the pitfalls of terms stemming from conspiracy.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
That's a powerful statement - wonder how long it'll take Share, Steve and Feste to say no such cop/TMer incident happened? From: Duveyoung no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 5:03 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11 Yeah, of course you can find MANY who would be part of arranging a false flag for 9-11. What a bunch of blinkered fools we are. Let's open our scrunched-up eyes a crack and admit one thing: the authorities of the world will do cruelty in any form upon anyone no matter the legal framework. Your local cop IS A MOTHERFUCKING KILLER wishing for his moment to totally ruin someone's life. And if he isn't, then he's an enabler of a fellow cop who is a sociopathand that is just AS BAD. Case in point: I know of an 2007 incident in sleepy little-town FAIRFIELD in which a cop TORTURED A ROO for over 12 hours in the presence of the other officers. Not a headline. (Don't ask for details -- can't out a Roo who doesn't want more of the same if he's seen bitching about it in public. No charges, let the guy go the next day.) But see? This is the heart of darkness within ALL OF US in Kali Yuga. Even our heroes will be found to be tilted in this age. Even the good guys...consider how the TMO did all it could to subvert the legal requirements during the murder at MUM. Those were saints, right? Even inside them was the I get to do whatever shit I want to dynamic. Consider Ed Beckeley, Dr. Bloomfield, the commodities groups, the TMO money laundering and smuggling, etc. I have been to 17 countries and saw the same shit everywhere. Give someone a gun and they're looking for game cuz they're on safari, donchaknow. To sum: how many good Americans would be willing to put a tactical nuke inside a 9-11 tower? Almost any cop, any soldier. Deal with this fact. It's the truth. Krishna took sattva with Him 5,000 years ago. There's no Arjuna out there wearing a badge of honor and integrity.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
The cop was trying to get the TMer to tell him his mantra. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : That's a powerful statement - wonder how long it'll take Share, Steve and Feste to say no such cop/TMer incident happened? From: Duveyoung no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 5:03 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11 Yeah, of course you can find MANY who would be part of arranging a false flag for 9-11. What a bunch of blinkered fools we are. Let's open our scrunched-up eyes a crack and admit one thing: the authorities of the world will do cruelty in any form upon anyone no matter the legal framework. Your local cop IS A MOTHERFUCKING KILLER wishing for his moment to totally ruin someone's life. And if he isn't, then he's an enabler of a fellow cop who is a sociopathand that is just AS BAD. Case in point: I know of an 2007 incident in sleepy little-town FAIRFIELD in which a cop TORTURED A ROO for over 12 hours in the presence of the other officers. Not a headline. (Don't ask for details -- can't out a Roo who doesn't want more of the same if he's seen bitching about it in public. No charges, let the guy go the next day.) But see? This is the heart of darkness within ALL OF US in Kali Yuga. Even our heroes will be found to be tilted in this age. Even the good guys...consider how the TMO did all it could to subvert the legal requirements during the murder at MUM. Those were saints, right? Even inside them was the I get to do whatever shit I want to dynamic. Consider Ed Beckeley, Dr. Bloomfield, the commodities groups, the TMO money laundering and smuggling, etc. I have been to 17 countries and saw the same shit everywhere. Give someone a gun and they're looking for game cuz they're on safari, donchaknow. To sum: how many good Americans would be willing to put a tactical nuke inside a 9-11 tower? Almost any cop, any soldier. Deal with this fact. It's the truth. Krishna took sattva with Him 5,000 years ago. There's no Arjuna out there wearing a badge of honor and integrity.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : The cop was trying to get the TMer to tell him his mantra. Wow, good for the TMer. I mean, one's mantra is hardly worthy of 12 hours of torture but if it was me I would have resisted just because someone was pressing me so hard, not necessarily because I felt saying my mantra out loud was so terribly verboten. But any asshole willing to torture an MIU student over such a thing needs his head examined. I mean, why would the cop want to know someone else's mantra? He didn't; he was just a masochistic bastard if Edg and Feste are to be believed.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
Michael, you are cuckoo. Give you brain a rest. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : That's a powerful statement - wonder how long it'll take Share, Steve and Feste to say no such cop/TMer incident happened? From: Duveyoung no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 5:03 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11 Yeah, of course you can find MANY who would be part of arranging a false flag for 9-11. What a bunch of blinkered fools we are. Let's open our scrunched-up eyes a crack and admit one thing: the authorities of the world will do cruelty in any form upon anyone no matter the legal framework. Your local cop IS A MOTHERFUCKING KILLER wishing for his moment to totally ruin someone's life. And if he isn't, then he's an enabler of a fellow cop who is a sociopathand that is just AS BAD. Case in point: I know of an 2007 incident in sleepy little-town FAIRFIELD in which a cop TORTURED A ROO for over 12 hours in the presence of the other officers. Not a headline. (Don't ask for details -- can't out a Roo who doesn't want more of the same if he's seen bitching about it in public. No charges, let the guy go the next day.) But see? This is the heart of darkness within ALL OF US in Kali Yuga. Even our heroes will be found to be tilted in this age. Even the good guys...consider how the TMO did all it could to subvert the legal requirements during the murder at MUM. Those were saints, right? Even inside them was the I get to do whatever shit I want to dynamic. Consider Ed Beckeley, Dr. Bloomfield, the commodities groups, the TMO money laundering and smuggling, etc. I have been to 17 countries and saw the same shit everywhere. Give someone a gun and they're looking for game cuz they're on safari, donchaknow. To sum: how many good Americans would be willing to put a tactical nuke inside a 9-11 tower? Almost any cop, any soldier. Deal with this fact. It's the truth. Krishna took sattva with Him 5,000 years ago. There's no Arjuna out there wearing a badge of honor and integrity.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
It was a joke, Ann. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : The cop was trying to get the TMer to tell him his mantra. Wow, good for the TMer. I mean, one's mantra is hardly worthy of 12 hours of torture but if it was me I would have resisted just because someone was pressing me so hard, not necessarily because I felt saying my mantra out loud was so terribly verboten. But any asshole willing to torture an MIU student over such a thing needs his head examined. I mean, why would the cop want to know someone else's mantra? He didn't; he was just a masochistic bastard if Edg and Feste are to be believed.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : It was a joke, Ann. Good joke. I can see it now. Meditator under bright lights. Cop in his face, pointing, gesturing demanding to know the holy word. The meditator pursing his lips closed and shaking his head vigorously. The cop threatens to feed him Iowa-raised pork. Meditator near hysterical, calling for mercy. You know the drill. Good story. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : The cop was trying to get the TMer to tell him his mantra. Wow, good for the TMer. I mean, one's mantra is hardly worthy of 12 hours of torture but if it was me I would have resisted just because someone was pressing me so hard, not necessarily because I felt saying my mantra out loud was so terribly verboten. But any asshole willing to torture an MIU student over such a thing needs his head examined. I mean, why would the cop want to know someone else's mantra? He didn't; he was just a masochistic bastard if Edg and Feste are to be believed.
[FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
Lynch is asking very important questions. There appears to be a conspiracy or government coverup. He should try to prove the doubts he has about the 911 scenario. Or, he could have been trying to sell his new movie to the public. He's doing the shock and awe tactics for publicity sake. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Should cause some commotion here: http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/ http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
Here's hoping he will combine his 9-11 questions with his TM pitches If we had more politicians doing TM, they wouldn't lie about things like 9-11! We need answers! I get mine from hallucinations I have of midgets talking to me in my dreams! Do TM! It'll save the world! From: jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 1:31 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11 Lynch is asking very important questions. There appears to be a conspiracy or government coverup. He should try to prove the doubts he has about the 911 scenario. Or, he could have been trying to sell his new movie to the public. He's doing the shock and awe tactics for publicity sake. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Should cause some commotion here: http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
MJ, For this particular radio program, he might have been promoting the local TM rajah in the Netherlands. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : Here's hoping he will combine his 9-11 questions with his TM pitches If we had more politicians doing TM, they wouldn't lie about things like 9-11! We need answers! I get mine from hallucinations I have of midgets talking to me in my dreams! Do TM! It'll save the world! From: jr_esq@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 1:31 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11 Lynch is asking very important questions. There appears to be a conspiracy or government coverup. He should try to prove the doubts he has about the 911 scenario. Or, he could have been trying to sell his new movie to the public. He's doing the shock and awe tactics for publicity sake. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Should cause some commotion here: http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/ http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
Good! The more stuff he blabbers about that mainstream people don't like will give less credibility to his TM sales pitches. From: jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 2:02 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11 MJ, For this particular radio program, he might have been promoting the local TM rajah in the Netherlands. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : Here's hoping he will combine his 9-11 questions with his TM pitches If we had more politicians doing TM, they wouldn't lie about things like 9-11! We need answers! I get mine from hallucinations I have of midgets talking to me in my dreams! Do TM! It'll save the world! From: jr_esq@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 1:31 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11 Lynch is asking very important questions. There appears to be a conspiracy or government coverup. He should try to prove the doubts he has about the 911 scenario. Or, he could have been trying to sell his new movie to the public. He's doing the shock and awe tactics for publicity sake. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Should cause some commotion here: http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/
[FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
Ah, celebrity endorsement. It must be true! ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Should cause some commotion here: http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/ http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
Alex Jones broadcasts out of Austin, Texas. I don't know when he did the interview with Lynch. David Duchovny in drag? That was before The X-Files. Jones knows a lot of Hollywood people and they sometimes appear on his show: Ed Asner, Richard Belzer, Mike Judge (does a Hank Hill promo for Infowars), Charlie Sheen, etc. Alex appears in two Richard Linklater films: Waking Life and A Scanner Darkly. The radio show (which can be streamed free) is far more entertaining than the crap on mainstream media. On 10/10/2014 11:02 AM, jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: MJ, For this particular radio program, he might have been promoting the local TM rajah in the Netherlands. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : Here's hoping he will combine his 9-11 questions with his TM pitches If we had more politicians doing TM, they wouldn't lie about things like 9-11! We need answers! I get mine from hallucinations I have of midgets talking to me in my dreams! Do TM! It'll save the world! *From:* jr_esq@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com *To:* FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com *Sent:* Friday, October 10, 2014 1:31 PM *Subject:* [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11 Lynch is asking very important questions. There appears to be a conspiracy or government coverup. He should try to prove the doubts he has about the 911 scenario. Or, he could have been trying to sell his new movie to the public. He's doing the shock and awe tactics for publicity sake. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Should cause some commotion here: http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
There are lots of celebrities who question the 9-11 story. I liked the time that Mos Def was on Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the official story. That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place because he like Mos but goes unglued over the 9-11 allegations. Maher even had some audience folks thrown out because they yelled it was an inside job. Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from Courtney Brown. It's more about the process the two remote viewers went through and very interesting. One point I wonder about though was if one of them remote viewed the war room for the war game that day which would have had nothing to do with the false flag. But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big corporations who represent the truth. On 10/10/2014 11:14 AM, salyavin808 wrote: Ah, celebrity endorsement. It must be true! ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Should cause some commotion here: http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/
RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 1:37 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11 There are lots of celebrities who question the 9-11 story. I liked the time that Mos Def was on Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the official story. That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place because he like Mos but goes unglued over the 9-11 allegations. Maher even had some audience folks thrown out because they yelled it was an inside job. Maher got slammed and had to grovel to keep his job after 9/11 when he commented that it took courage to fly those planes into the buildings. Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from Courtney Brown. It's more about the process the two remote viewers went through and very interesting. One point I wonder about though was if one of them remote viewed the war room for the war game that day which would have had nothing to do with the false flag. But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big corporations who represent the truth. On 10/10/2014 11:14 AM, salyavin808 wrote: Ah, celebrity endorsement. It must be true! ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com , mailto:noozguru@... noozguru@... wrote : Should cause some commotion here: http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : There are lots of celebrities who question the 9-11 story. I liked the time that Mos Def was on Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the official story. That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place because he like Mos but goes unglued over the 9-11 allegations. Maher even had some audience folks thrown out because they yelled it was an inside job. Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from Courtney Brown. It's more about the process the two remote viewers went through and very interesting. One point I wonder about though was if one of them remote viewed the war room for the war game that day which would have had nothing to do with the false flag. But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big corporations who represent the truth. The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen exploding! Bit risky for the plotters. You got to be on more than peanuts to take any of it even remotely seriously. Basically something shit happened and it's hard to take on board so someone has to be to blamed. Just as with Lady Di, that had to be an inside job - even though none of it made any sense - otherwise it's all just so pointless and destructive. Much better if the government are behind it. Something to get excited about. On 10/10/2014 11:14 AM, salyavin808 wrote: Ah, celebrity endorsement. It must be true! ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote : Should cause some commotion here: http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/ http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
Salyavin, you're reviewing the movie without having seen it just like Judy. You say: The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen exploding! Bit risky for the plotters. This is because you don't actually know what 9-11 investigators allege. We allege it was a conspiracy by a faction in the government and some corporations. The planes were a cover and they alone would not have collapsed the building. See, Mr. Science, you don't even know that the buildings were designed to take a hit by those size planes. This because a large plane hit the Empire State by accident back in the 1940s but it also didn't sustain much damage from that. So they made sure future buildings were also built to take such hits. Also planes hitting the building would not have made them fall over. To do that is a bit tricky and they hit too high to do that. Thus it required demolition to complete the job. It is alleged that Flight 93 was supposed to hit WTC 7 where the operation was run from and it was also the principal target because it contained documents that the perpetrators didn't want investigated. When the Flight 93 got shot down (no it didn't crash) then they had to pull the building (as soon as the operations team got out). Silverstein goofed and said they had to pull building. It wouldn't be possible to set the building up for demolition under those conditions and that fast. It was set up in advance. Most of us know that a large jet liner could not have maneuvered to hit the Pentagon. There would have been crash debris and a much larger hole. It was most likely a missile. Some folks claim they saw a plane but that too may have been the operations plane flying over at the time (and one was seen in the vicinity). Your knowledge of modern tactical nuclear weapons is a bit lacking. They would necessarily exposed the perps to any danger setting them up. I've spent over 10 years on this subject and have many reference materials if you want to argue more and get an education. Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in Afghanistan ran the whole operation but that really sounds wacky! :-D On 10/10/2014 12:09 PM, salyavin808 wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : There are lots of celebrities who question the 9-11 story. I liked the time that Mos Def was on Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the official story. That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place because he like Mos but goes unglued over the 9-11 allegations. Maher even had some audience folks thrown out because they yelled it was an inside job. Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from Courtney Brown. It's more about the process the two remote viewers went through and very interesting. One point I wonder about though was if one of them remote viewed the war room for the war game that day which would have had nothing to do with the false flag. But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big corporations who represent the truth. The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen exploding! Bit risky for the plotters. You got to be on more than peanuts to take any of it even remotely seriously. Basically something shit happened and it's hard to take on board so someone has to be to blamed. Just as with Lady Di, that had to be an inside job - even though none of it made any sense - otherwise it's all just so pointless and destructive. Much better if the government are behind it. Something to get excited about. On 10/10/2014 11:14 AM, salyavin808 wrote: Ah, celebrity endorsement. It must be true! ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote : Should cause some commotion here: http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Salyavin, you're reviewing the movie without having seen it just like Judy. You say: The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen exploding! Bit risky for the plotters. This is because you don't actually know what 9-11 investigators allege. We allege it was a conspiracy by a faction in the government and some corporations. The planes were a cover and they alone would not have collapsed the building. See, Mr. Science, you don't even know that the buildings were designed to take a hit by those size planes. This because a large plane hit the Empire State by accident back in the 1940s but it also didn't sustain much damage from that. So they made sure future buildings were also built to take such hits. Also planes hitting the building would not have made them fall over. To do that is a bit tricky and they hit too high to do that. Thus it required demolition to complete the job. It is alleged that Flight 93 was supposed to hit WTC 7 where the operation was run from and it was also the principal target because it contained documents that the perpetrators didn't want investigated. When the Flight 93 got shot down (no it didn't crash) then they had to pull the building (as soon as the operations team got out). Silverstein goofed and said they had to pull building. It wouldn't be possible to set the building up for demolition under those conditions and that fast. It was set up in advance. Most of us know that a large jet liner could not have maneuvered to hit the Pentagon. There would have been crash debris and a much larger hole. It was most likely a missile. Some folks claim they saw a plane but that too may have been the operations plane flying over at the time (and one was seen in the vicinity). Do you have any idea how desperate this sounds? Maybe that's part of it, it's all so ridiculous no one would ever believe it! Your knowledge of modern tactical nuclear weapons is a bit lacking. They would necessarily exposed the perps to any danger setting them up. But you wouldn't know how the buildings would react if they set them off, It's all preposterous. I can't imagine what your government has done to make you so convinced they harbour such evil geniuses. I've spent over 10 years on this subject and have many reference materials if you want to argue more and get an education. Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in Afghanistan ran the whole operation but that really sounds wacky! :-D Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few planes? It's too simple isn't it. That's the problem people have, they can't believe that much destruction was caused by a few maniacs in hijacked planes. On 10/10/2014 12:09 PM, salyavin808 wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote : There are lots of celebrities who question the 9-11 story. I liked the time that Mos Def was on Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the official story. That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place because he like Mos but goes unglued over the 9-11 allegations. Maher even had some audience folks thrown out because they yelled it was an inside job. Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from Courtney Brown. It's more about the process the two remote viewers went through and very interesting. One point I wonder about though was if one of them remote viewed the war room for the war game that day which would have had nothing to do with the false flag. But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big corporations who represent the truth. The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen exploding! Bit risky for the plotters. You got to be on more than peanuts to take any of it even remotely seriously. Basically something shit happened and it's hard to take on board so someone has to be to blamed. Just as with Lady Di, that had to be an inside job - even though none of it made any sense - otherwise it's all just so pointless and destructive. Much better if the government are behind it. Something to get excited about. On
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Salyavin, you're reviewing the movie without having seen it just like Judy. You say: BTW, I remember the movie well, I was near a TV on the day. Saw the whole thing, but not live. I was working at the TM academy at the time and they didn't tell us it happened as there was a course on and didn't want to upset anybody! If we hadn't had someone staying for BB to mention it over the evening meal I might never have heard about it at all. Maybe.. So I might have missed the first defining moment of the 21st century!
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
Everyone knows Lady Di's death was orchestrated by MI6 on the orders of the Duke of Edinburgh, the Prince of Wales and Lady Sarah McCorquodale cuz they couldn't stand the thought of a Muzzlim gittn' in the britches of the Princess. That's what Mohamed al Fayed said anyways! From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 3:09 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11 ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : There are lots of celebrities who question the 9-11 story. I liked the time that Mos Def was on Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the official story. That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place because he like Mos but goes unglued over the 9-11 allegations. Maher even had some audience folks thrown out because they yelled it was an inside job. Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from Courtney Brown. It's more about the process the two remote viewers went through and very interesting. One point I wonder about though was if one of them remote viewed the war room for the war game that day which would have had nothing to do with the false flag. But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big corporations who represent the truth. The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen exploding! Bit risky for the plotters. You got to be on more than peanuts to take any of it even remotely seriously. Basically something shit happened and it's hard to take on board so someone has to be to blamed. Just as with Lady Di, that had to be an inside job - even though none of it made any sense - otherwise it's all just so pointless and destructive. Much better if the government are behind it. Something to get excited about. On 10/10/2014 11:14 AM, salyavin808 wrote: Ah, celebrity endorsement. It must be true! ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Should cause some commotion here: http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
I can't imagine what your government has done to make you so convinced they harbour such evil geniuses. I think its mainly the fact that Dick Cheny orchestrated the Patriot Act and used his behind the curtain powers to see to it that we invaded Afghanistan and especially Iraq, not so much for the oil as to be able to award all the rebuilding contracts to his old company Haliburton and its subsidiaries - he and they made billions off that deal. From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 4:04 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11 ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Salyavin, you're reviewing the movie without having seen it just like Judy. You say: The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen exploding! Bit risky for the plotters. This is because you don't actually know what 9-11 investigators allege. We allege it was a conspiracy by a faction in the government and some corporations. The planes were a cover and they alone would not have collapsed the building. See, Mr. Science, you don't even know that the buildings were designed to take a hit by those size planes. This because a large plane hit the Empire State by accident back in the 1940s but it also didn't sustain much damage from that. So they made sure future buildings were also built to take such hits. Also planes hitting the building would not have made them fall over. To do that is a bit tricky and they hit too high to do that. Thus it required demolition to complete the job. It is alleged that Flight 93 was supposed to hit WTC 7 where the operation was run from and it was also the principal target because it contained documents that the perpetrators didn't want investigated. When the Flight 93 got shot down (no it didn't crash) then they had to pull the building (as soon as the operations team got out). Silverstein goofed and said they had to pull building. It wouldn't be possible to set the building up for demolition under those conditions and that fast. It was set up in advance. Most of us know that a large jet liner could not have maneuvered to hit the Pentagon. There would have been crash debris and a much larger hole. It was most likely a missile. Some folks claim they saw a plane but that too may have been the operations plane flying over at the time (and one was seen in the vicinity). Do you have any idea how desperate this sounds? Maybe that's part of it, it's all so ridiculous no one would ever believe it! Your knowledge of modern tactical nuclear weapons is a bit lacking. They would necessarily exposed the perps to any danger setting them up. But you wouldn't know how the buildings would react if they set them off, It's all preposterous. I can't imagine what your government has done to make you so convinced they harbour such evil geniuses. I've spent over 10 years on this subject and have many reference materials if you want to argue more and get an education. Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in Afghanistan ran the whole operation but that really sounds wacky! :-D Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few planes? It's too simple isn't it. That's the problem people have, they can't believe that much destruction was caused by a few maniacs in hijacked planes. On 10/10/2014 12:09 PM, salyavin808 wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : There are lots of celebrities who question the 9-11 story. I liked the time that Mos Def was on Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the official story. That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place because he like Mos but goes unglued over the 9-11 allegations. Maher even had some audience folks thrown out because they yelled it was an inside job. Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from Courtney Brown. It's more about the process the two remote viewers went through and very interesting. One point I wonder about though was if one of them remote viewed the war room for the war game that day which would have had nothing to do with the false flag. But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big corporations who represent the truth. The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into them? And without ever practising! What would have happened
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
What is BB as relates to a residence course or WPA? And did the course leaders give the person any crap for telling about it? From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 4:26 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11 ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Salyavin, you're reviewing the movie without having seen it just like Judy. You say: BTW, I remember the movie well, I was near a TV on the day. Saw the whole thing, but not live. I was working at the TM academy at the time and they didn't tell us it happened as there was a course on and didn't want to upset anybody! If we hadn't had someone staying for BB to mention it over the evening meal I might never have heard about it at all. Maybe.. So I might have missed the first defining moment of the 21st century!
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
On 10/10/2014 01:04 PM, salyavin808 wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Salyavin, you're reviewing the movie without having seen it just like Judy. You say: The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen exploding! Bit risky for the plotters. This is because you don't actually know what 9-11 investigators allege. We allege it was a conspiracy by a faction in the government and some corporations. The planes were a cover and they alone would not have collapsed the building. See, Mr. Science, you don't even know that the buildings were designed to take a hit by those size planes. This because a large plane hit the Empire State by accident back in the 1940s but it also didn't sustain much damage from that. So they made sure future buildings were also built to take such hits. Also planes hitting the building would not have made them fall over. To do that is a bit tricky and they hit too high to do that. Thus it required demolition to complete the job. It is alleged that Flight 93 was supposed to hit WTC 7 where the operation was run from and it was also the principal target because it contained documents that the perpetrators didn't want investigated. When the Flight 93 got shot down (no it didn't crash) then they had to pull the building (as soon as the operations team got out). Silverstein goofed and said they had to pull building. It wouldn't be possible to set the building up for demolition under those conditions and that fast. It was set up in advance. Most of us know that a large jet liner could not have maneuvered to hit the Pentagon. There would have been crash debris and a much larger hole. It was most likely a missile. Some folks claim they saw a plane but that too may have been the operations plane flying over at the time (and one was seen in the vicinity). Do you have any idea how desperate this sounds? Maybe that's part of it, it's all so ridiculous no one would ever believe it! Do you know what the word may means? It's a theory, Sal. Some people have claimed to have seen a plane but it might have been an operations plane (a tanker). Nice cover up. Also many airline pilots have said that it would have been impossible for even an experienced pilot to fly that could have hit the Pentagon. So why has the FBI not released the numerous security videos they confiscated from surrounding businesses. The wing that was hit was about to start their yearly accounting of finances and there were alleged trillions of dollars missing. Very suspicious. Your knowledge of modern tactical nuclear weapons is a bit lacking. They would necessarily exposed the perps to any danger setting them up. But you wouldn't know how the buildings would react if they set them off, It's all preposterous. I can't imagine what your government has done to make you so convinced they harbour such evil geniuses. OMG, such devices were tested and even in the news years before 9-11. I've spent over 10 years on this subject and have many reference materials if you want to argue more and get an education. Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in Afghanistan ran the whole operation but that really sounds wacky! :-D Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few planes? It's too simple isn't it. That's the problem people have, they can't believe that much destruction was caused by a few maniacs in hijacked planes. But it was not that simple. And the alleged fliers couldn't even fly a Cessna properly let alone a jet. Those planes were remote controlled and such systems were available in advance of 9-11. How are things at MI5 these days? :-D On 10/10/2014 12:09 PM, salyavin808 wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote : There are lots of celebrities who question the 9-11 story. I liked the time that Mos Def was on Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the official story. That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place because he like Mos but goes unglued over the 9-11 allegations. Maher even had some audience folks thrown out because they yelled it was an inside job. Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from Courtney Brown. It's more about the process the two remote viewers went through and very interesting. One point I wonder about though was if one of them remote viewed the war room for the war game that day which would have had nothing to do with the false flag. But keep eating the peanuts and believing
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : Everyone knows Lady Di's death was orchestrated by MI6 on the orders of the Duke of Edinburgh, the Prince of Wales and Lady Sarah McCorquodale cuz they couldn't stand the thought of a Muzzlim gittn' in the britches of the Princess. That's what Mohamed al Fayed said anyways! Here's a fascinating insight into how conspiracy theories are worked out: That Mitchell and Webb Look - Diana Assassination https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4meFC1ee7Q https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4meFC1ee7Q That Mitchell and Webb Look - Diana Assassination https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4meFC1ee7Q That Mitchel and Webb Look- Season 4- Episode 6 This isn't taking the piss out of Princess Diana but in fact the idiots who believe in conspiracy theories so... View on www.youtube.com https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4meFC1ee7Q Preview by Yahoo From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 3:09 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11 ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : There are lots of celebrities who question the 9-11 story. I liked the time that Mos Def was on Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the official story. That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place because he like Mos but goes unglued over the 9-11 allegations. Maher even had some audience folks thrown out because they yelled it was an inside job. Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from Courtney Brown. It's more about the process the two remote viewers went through and very interesting. One point I wonder about though was if one of them remote viewed the war room for the war game that day which would have had nothing to do with the false flag. But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big corporations who represent the truth. The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen exploding! Bit risky for the plotters. You got to be on more than peanuts to take any of it even remotely seriously. Basically something shit happened and it's hard to take on board so someone has to be to blamed. Just as with Lady Di, that had to be an inside job - even though none of it made any sense - otherwise it's all just so pointless and destructive. Much better if the government are behind it. Something to get excited about. On 10/10/2014 11:14 AM, salyavin808 wrote: Ah, celebrity endorsement. It must be true! ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote : Should cause some commotion here: http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/ http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
Yay, MJ, we finally agree on something! I don't know if it was M16, etc. but pretty sure they couldn't allow it. On Friday, October 10, 2014 3:50 PM, salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : Everyone knows Lady Di's death was orchestrated by MI6 on the orders of the Duke of Edinburgh, the Prince of Wales and Lady Sarah McCorquodale cuz they couldn't stand the thought of a Muzzlim gittn' in the britches of the Princess. That's what Mohamed al Fayed said anyways! Here's a fascinating insight into how conspiracy theories are worked out: That Mitchell and Webb Look - Diana Assassination That Mitchell and Webb Look - Diana Assassination That Mitchel and Webb Look- Season 4- Episode 6 This isn't taking the piss out of Princess Diana but in fact the idiots who believe in conspiracy theories so... View on www.youtube.comPreview by Yahoo From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 3:09 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11 ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : There are lots of celebrities who question the 9-11 story. I liked the time that Mos Def was on Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the official story. That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place because he like Mos but goes unglued over the 9-11 allegations. Maher even had some audience folks thrown out because they yelled it was an inside job. Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from Courtney Brown. It's more about the process the two remote viewers went through and very interesting. One point I wonder about though was if one of them remote viewed the war room for the war game that day which would have had nothing to do with the false flag. But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big corporations who represent the truth. The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen exploding! Bit risky for the plotters. You got to be on more than peanuts to take any of it even remotely seriously. Basically something shit happened and it's hard to take on board so someone has to be to blamed. Just as with Lady Di, that had to be an inside job - even though none of it made any sense - otherwise it's all just so pointless and destructive. Much better if the government are behind it. Something to get excited about. On 10/10/2014 11:14 AM, salyavin808 wrote: Ah, celebrity endorsement. It must be true! ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Should cause some commotion here: http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : On 10/10/2014 01:04 PM, salyavin808 wrote: Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in Afghanistan ran the whole operation but that really sounds wacky! :-D Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few planes? It's too simple isn't it. That's the problem people have, they can't believe that much destruction was caused by a few maniacs in hijacked planes. But it was not that simple. And the alleged fliers couldn't even fly a Cessna properly let alone a jet. Those planes were remote controlled and such systems were available in advance of 9-11. I disagree, I think they were telepathically controlled by the Space Brothers from their secret base on Pluto. How are things at MI5 these days? :-D On 10/10/2014 12:09 PM, salyavin808 wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote : There are lots of celebrities who question the 9-11 story. I liked the time that Mos Def was on Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the official story. That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place because he like Mos but goes unglued over the 9-11 allegations. Maher even had some audience folks thrown out because they yelled it was an inside job. Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from Courtney Brown. It's more about the process the two remote viewers went through and very interesting. One point I wonder about though was if one of them remote viewed the war room for the war game that day which would have had nothing to do with the false flag. But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big corporations who represent the truth. The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen exploding! Bit risky for the plotters. You got to be on more than peanuts to take any of it even remotely seriously. Basically something shit happened and it's hard to take on board so someone has to be to blamed. Just as with Lady Di, that had to be an inside job - even though none of it made any sense - otherwise it's all just so pointless and destructive. Much better if the government are behind it. Something to get excited about. On 10/10/2014 11:14 AM, salyavin808 wrote: Ah, celebrity endorsement. It must be true! ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote : Should cause some commotion here: http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/ http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
I was being facetious just to see what Sal would say. I think if MI6 was to have done it, they could have make it look as tho they had drownt in a bathtub - why make it messy and public? From: Share Long sharelon...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 4:58 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11 Yay, MJ, we finally agree on something! I don't know if it was M16, etc. but pretty sure they couldn't allow it. On Friday, October 10, 2014 3:50 PM, salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : Everyone knows Lady Di's death was orchestrated by MI6 on the orders of the Duke of Edinburgh, the Prince of Wales and Lady Sarah McCorquodale cuz they couldn't stand the thought of a Muzzlim gittn' in the britches of the Princess. That's what Mohamed al Fayed said anyways! Here's a fascinating insight into how conspiracy theories are worked out: That Mitchell and Webb Look - Diana Assassination That Mitchell and Webb Look - Diana Assassination That Mitchel and Webb Look- Season 4- Episode 6 This isn't taking the piss out of Princess Diana but in fact the idiots who believe in conspiracy theories so... View on www.youtube.comPreview by Yahoo From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 3:09 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11 ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : There are lots of celebrities who question the 9-11 story. I liked the time that Mos Def was on Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the official story. That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place because he like Mos but goes unglued over the 9-11 allegations. Maher even had some audience folks thrown out because they yelled it was an inside job. Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from Courtney Brown. It's more about the process the two remote viewers went through and very interesting. One point I wonder about though was if one of them remote viewed the war room for the war game that day which would have had nothing to do with the false flag. But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big corporations who represent the truth. The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen exploding! Bit risky for the plotters. You got to be on more than peanuts to take any of it even remotely seriously. Basically something shit happened and it's hard to take on board so someone has to be to blamed. Just as with Lady Di, that had to be an inside job - even though none of it made any sense - otherwise it's all just so pointless and destructive. Much better if the government are behind it. Something to get excited about. On 10/10/2014 11:14 AM, salyavin808 wrote: Ah, celebrity endorsement. It must be true! ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Should cause some commotion here: http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
He is certainly giving voice to 2-3 important questions many are asking Twin Peaks Creator Questions 9/11 http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/ http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/ Twin Peaks Creator Questions 9/11 http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/ Famed Hollywood director casts doubt on government narrative. View on www.infowars.com http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/ Preview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
You probably don't know him very well, he's a very private fellow. The last thing he would do is to create a shock for the sake of publicity. He was asked a question and gave his honest opinion; the hole in Pentagon wasn't big enough for a plane to have crashed, why did 3 huge buildings collapse when only two were hit by planes and why were there no wreckage or skidmarks on the ground from the plane that supposedly went down in Pennsylvania. Like Lynch said; we need answers, that's all. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Lynch is asking very important questions. There appears to be a conspiracy or government coverup. He should try to prove the doubts he has about the 911 scenario. Or, he could have been trying to sell his new movie to the public. He's doing the shock and awe tactics for publicity sake. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Should cause some commotion here: http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/ http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
Perhaps it might help if you know how things are done in the US. Here's a movie out today about the Gary Webb, a newspaper reporter who exposed Iran Contra and later committed suicide (more likely suicided): http://youtu.be/VW4XO-52ubE Seems that the CIA has started to come forward and say that some of Webb's assertions were true: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/10/gary-webb-dark-alliance_n_5961748.html On 10/10/2014 01:26 PM, salyavin808 wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Salyavin, you're reviewing the movie without having seen it just like Judy. You say: BTW, I remember the movie well, I was near a TV on the day. Saw the whole thing, but not live. I was working at the TM academy at the time and they didn't tell us it happened as there was a course on and didn't want to upset anybody! If we hadn't had someone staying for BB to mention it over the evening meal I might never have heard about it at all. Maybe.. So I might have missed the first defining moment of the 21st century!
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
All Lynch has to do is ask Salyavin since he has it all figured out. :-D On 10/10/2014 03:09 PM, nablusoss1008 wrote: You probably don't know him very well, he's a very private fellow. The last thing he would do is to create a shock for the sake of publicity. He was asked a question and gave his honest opinion; the hole in Pentagon wasn't big enough for a plane to have crashed, why did 3 huge buildings collapse when only two were hit by planes and why were there no wreckage or skidmarks on the ground from the plane that supposedly went down in Pennsylvania. Like Lynch said; we need answers, that's all. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Lynch is asking very important questions. There appears to be a conspiracy or government coverup. He should try to prove the doubts he has about the 911 scenario. Or, he could have been trying to sell his new movie to the public. He's doing the shock and awe tactics for publicity sake. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Should cause some commotion here: http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
On 10/10/2014 2:54 PM, Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife] wrote: We allege it was a conspiracy by a faction in the government and some corporations. /We allege that the U.S. Government can't even design a web site, much less conduct a secret conspiracy to demolish the WTC./
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Salyavin, you're reviewing the movie without having seen it just like Judy. You say: The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen exploding! Bit risky for the plotters. This is because you don't actually know what 9-11 investigators allege. We allege it was a conspiracy by a faction in the government and some corporations. The planes were a cover and they alone would not have collapsed the building. See, Mr. Science, you don't even know that the buildings were designed to take a hit by those size planes. This because a large plane hit the Empire State by accident back in the 1940s but italso didn't sustain much damage from that. So they made sure future buildings were also built to take such hits. Also planes hitting the building would not have made them fall over. To do that is a bit tricky and they hit too high to do that. Thus it required demolition to complete the job. It is alleged that Flight 93 was supposed to hit WTC 7 where the operation was run from and it was also the principal target because it contained documents that the perpetrators didn't want investigated. When the Flight 93 got shot down (no it didn't crash) then they had to pull the building (as soon as the operations team got out). Silverstein goofed and said they had to pull building. It wouldn't be possible to set the building up for demolition under those conditions and that fast. It was set up in advance. Most of us know that a large jet liner could not have maneuvered to hit the Pentagon. There would have been crash debris and a much larger hole. It was most likely a missile. Some folks claim they saw a plane but that too may have been the operations plane flying over at the time (and one was seen in the vicinity). Your knowledge of modern tactical nuclear weapons is a bit lacking. They would necessarily exposed the perps to any danger setting them up. I've spent over 10 years on this subject and have many reference materials if you want to argue more and get an education. Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in Afghanistan ran the whole operation but that really sounds wacky! :-D
[FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
I think what you are saying Sal, is that you are susceptible to celebrity endorsements. You are looking a little transparent, son. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : Ah, celebrity endorsement. It must be true! ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Should cause some commotion here: http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/ http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
While I am open to and inclined to believe that there is still a lot unknown about the 911 attacks, many of the arguments that Bhairitu makes appear to have substantial counter arguments as I have outlined below. . A general criticism, not of Bhairitu’s arguments specifically, is voiced by Thomas W. Eagar, an engineering professor at MIT, [9/11 conspiracy advocates]use the 'reverse scientific method'. They determine what happened, throw out all the data that doesn't fit their conclusion, and then hail their findings as the only possible conclusion. Eagar's criticisms also exemplify a common stance that the theories are best ignored. I've told people that if the argument gets too mainstream, I'll engage in the debate. Michael Shermer, in Scientific American http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_American, said: The mistaken belief that a handful of unexplained anomalies can undermine a well-established theory lies at the heart of all conspiratorial thinking. All the evidence for a 9/11 conspiracy falls under the rubric of this fallacy. Such notions are easily refuted by noting that scientific theories are not built on single facts alone but on a convergence of evidence assembled from multiple lines of inquiry. If the following counter arguments don’t hold water, please explain, I am all ears. 1)1) Bhairitu: We allege it was a conspiracy by a faction in the government and some corporations. Rational Wiki: [Regarding claims that] Powerful money/Bush family/military-industrial conspirers did it, all of whom needed a new war in the Middle East for various commercial reasons (oil http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Oil, arm sales, real estate, precious bodily fluids etc.): While it could easily be said that they used 9/11 to create an unrelated Iraq War http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Iraq_War, they did not blame the Iraqis http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Iraq, but al-Qaeda, which isn't really as convenient if you want to declare war with Iraq and not lose some friends. To quote Bill Maher http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Bill_Maher, [That Bush had prior knowledge of the 9/11 attacks] is an absurd statement, because it contains the words Bush and knowledge. … the biggest problem is that for the Bush administration to enact such an abhorrent plot and keep it a secret would seem to require a level of competence they never displayed at anything else. While there is some evidence that intelligence http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Intelligence_(government) regarding the attack was ignored, that does not mean it was a nefarious plot. As Heinlein http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Heinlein said, You have attributed conditions to villainy that simply result from stupidity. The second problem is that if BushCo did stage the 9/11 attack, their failure to place the blame directly on Saddam Hussein http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Saddam_Hussein's regime is rather baffling, since their alleged main use of 9/11 was to force the US into war with Iraq. Rational Wiki: [Regarding claims that] It was carried out by Mossad to galvanize US support for Israel and destroy their enemies: The story of Mossad allegedly telling Jews http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Jew to stay home the day of the attack, or that no Jews died in the attack, both of which are false, brought this one forward (the most common of these claims is that 4,000 Jews were warned to stay home).[41] http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/9-11_conspiracy_theories#cite_note-40 However, as Bush was already one of the strongest supporters Israel has ever had, it is questionable as to why they'd need more of his support. The idea that the Jews were forewarned may originate in the fact that 9/11 happened to fall at the end of the month of Elul, during the days leading up to Rosh Hashanah http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Jewish_holidays#Rosh_Hashanah, when observant Jews would have additional prayers at their morning prayer services and therefore would likely be late to work. However, given that there were several Orthodox http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Orthodox_Judaism minyanim (prayer groups) organized within the WTC, it is unclear how many, if any, Jews were away from the towers due to prayer services. Then again, if Mossad had wanted to destroy the towers when there were no Jews in them, they could simply have waited a few days until Rosh Hashanah or Yom Kippur http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Yom_Kippur, when practically no Jews would have been at work. 9/11 conspiracy theories(Wiki): In 2006, members of the group Scholars for 9/11 Truth http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scholars_for_9/11_Truth argued that a group of US neo-conservatives called the Project for a New American Century (PNAC), which included Paul Wolfowitz http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Wolfowitz, Dick Cheney http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dick_Cheney and Donald Rumsfeld http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donald_Rumsfeld, set on US world dominance and
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : On 10/10/2014 01:04 PM, salyavin808 wrote: Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in Afghanistan ran the whole operation but that really sounds wacky! :-D Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few planes? It's too simple isn't it. That's the problem people have, they can't believe that much destruction was caused by a few maniacs in hijacked planes. But it was not that simple. And the alleged fliers couldn't even fly a Cessna properly let alone a jet. Those planes were remote controlled and such systems were available in advance of 9-11. I disagree, I think they were telepathically controlled by the Space Brothers from their secret base on Pluto. Weak minds glom onto conspiracy theories the same way that weak minds follow cult leaders. That's all anyone ever needs to know about discussions like this.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
On 10/10/2014 06:59 PM, TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: *From:* salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : On 10/10/2014 01:04 PM, salyavin808 wrote: Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in Afghanistan ran the whole operation but that really sounds wacky! :-D Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few planes? It's too simple isn't it. That's the problem people have, they can't believe that much destruction was caused by a few maniacs in hijacked planes. But it was not that simple. And the alleged fliers couldn't even fly a Cessna properly let alone a jet. Those planes were remote controlled and such systems were available in advance of 9-11. I disagree, I think they were telepathically controlled by the Space Brothers from their secret base on Pluto. Weak minds glom onto conspiracy theories the same way that weak minds follow cult leaders. That's all anyone ever needs to know about discussions like this. Are you inferring that I'm a weak mind, Barry? What's happened to you? Getting old and cranky and the contracts not showing up like they used too?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
If 9-11 were an inside job then there would be plenty of funding to poison the well with sites like Rational Wiki. I don't have time to look at all of it now and I'm sure someone else has gone through a debunked most of the holes here. I see a couple already. On 10/10/2014 06:55 PM, seerd...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: While I am open to and inclined to believe that there is still a lot unknown about the 911 attacks, many of the arguments that Bhairitu makes appear to have substantial counter arguments as I have outlined below. . A general criticism, not of Bhairitu’s arguments specifically, is voiced by Thomas W. Eagar, an engineering professor atMIT http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massachusetts_Institute_of_Technology, [9/11 conspiracy advocates]use the 'reverse scientific method'. They determine what happened, throw out all the data that doesn't fit their conclusion, and then hail their findings as the only possible conclusion. Eagar's criticisms also exemplify a common stance that the theories are best ignored. I've told people that if the argument gets too mainstream, I'll engage in the debate. Michael Shermer, in /Scientific American http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_American/, said: The mistaken belief that a handful of unexplained anomalies can undermine a well-established theory lies at the heart of all conspiratorial thinking. All the evidence for a 9/11 conspiracy falls under the rubric of this fallacy. Such notions are easily refuted by noting that scientific theories are not built on single facts alone but on a convergence of evidence assembled from multiple lines of inquiry. If the following counter arguments don’t hold water, please explain, I am all ears. 1)1) Bhairitu: We allege it was a conspiracy by a faction in the government and some corporations. Rational Wiki: [Regarding claims that] Powerful money/Bush family/military-industrial conspirers did it, all of whom needed a new war in the Middle East for various commercial reasons (oil http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Oil, arm sales, real estate, precious bodily fluids etc.): While it could easily be said that they used 9/11 to create an unrelatedIraq War http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Iraq_War, they did not blame theIraqis http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Iraq, but al-Qaeda, which isn't really as convenient if you want to declare war with Iraq and not lose some friends. To quoteBill Maher http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Bill_Maher, [That Bush had prior knowledge of the 9/11 attacks] is an absurd statement, because it contains the wordsBush andknowledge. … the biggest problem is that for the Bush administration to enact such an abhorrent plot and keep it a secret would seem to require a level of competence they/never displayed at anything else/. While there is some evidence thatintelligence http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Intelligence_%28government%29regarding the attack was ignored, that does not mean it was a nefarious plot. AsHeinlein http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Heinleinsaid, You have attributed conditions to villainy that simply result from stupidity http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Hanlon%27s_razor. The second problem is that if BushCo/did/stage the 9/11 attack, their failure to place the blame directly onSaddam Hussein http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Saddam_Hussein's regime is rather baffling, since their alleged main use of 9/11 was to force the US into war with Iraq. Rational Wiki: [Regarding claims that] It was carried out by Mossad to galvanize US support for Israel and destroy their enemies: The story ofMossad http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Mossadallegedly tellingJews http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Jewto stay home the day of the attack, or that no Jews died in the attack, both of which are false, brought this one forward (the most common of these claims is that 4,000 Jews were warned to stay home).^[41] http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/9-11_conspiracy_theories#cite_note-40 However, as Bush was already one of the strongest supportersIsrael http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Israelhas ever had, it is questionable as to why they'd needmoreof his support. The idea that the Jews were forewarned may originate in the fact that 9/11 happened to fall at the end of the month of Elul, during the days leading up toRosh Hashanah http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Jewish_holidays#Rosh_Hashanah, when observant Jews would have additionalprayers http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Prayerat their morning prayer services and therefore would likely be late to work. However, given that there were severalOrthodox http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Orthodox_Judaismminyanim (prayer groups) organized within the WTC, it is unclear how many, if any, Jews were away from the towers due to prayer services. Then again, if
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
On 10/10/2014 06:59 PM, TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: *From:* salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : On 10/10/2014 01:04 PM, salyavin808 wrote: Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in Afghanistan ran the whole operation but that really sounds wacky! :-D Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few planes? It's too simple isn't it. That's the problem people have, they can't believe that much destruction was caused by a few maniacs in hijacked planes. But it was not that simple. And the alleged fliers couldn't even fly a Cessna properly let alone a jet. Those planes were remote controlled and such systems were available in advance of 9-11. I disagree, I think they were telepathically controlled by the Space Brothers from their secret base on Pluto. Weak minds glom onto conspiracy theories the same way that weak minds follow cult leaders. That's all anyone ever needs to know about discussions like this. Actually it is weak minds who tend to believe what the government and mainstream media tells them.
