[FairfieldLife] Re: gyani's karma
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: (snip) What are your views on karma: You asked for my views so I gave them to you. My first response to your original post was hasty and flip but sometimes there is little time and these things get dashed off in a hurry. Do you hold that karma does not exist? If so, do you have an alternative model of action? I have always understood karma to mean literally action. In my view every action requires a desire and an intent of some sort, and although some actions may seem inconsequential in their impact, even a small action carries a small puff of desire and intent with it. So a karmic disease or accident or financial loss is desired? No, but whatever happens in life is our destiny created by our karma. Do you think a liberated one has absolutely no karma returning to them in this life / body? Not only that but I do not think that liberated ones even exist on earth unless they are an avatar. So there are no realized liberated ones walking the earth? I would call that an avatar. When people talk of their experiences of no-doer, what is the role of karma in that state? When people talk of their experiences of no-doer I do not think that they are liberated. Sorry I don't follow, your theory appears not based on any source other than speculation and your reasoning appears jumbled to me. That's fine if you do not follow what I am saying, we don't know each other and our glossary is probably totally out of synch. It doesn't matter, I wrote my sincere views on karma and I stand by them. It appears that you are the one who jumbled my reasoning through misinterpretation and as far as speculation is concerned; it's all speculation. Everything on the linked website, what you wrote and what I wrote, it's all speculation. Sometimes you just have to say what you feel and forget the sources, after all the sources are just other people saying what they feel. Rick Carlstrom Well good luck with that, with your profound views. May they serve you well. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: gyani's karma
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: (snip) What are your views on karma: You asked for my views so I gave them to you. My first response to your original post was hasty and flip but sometimes there is little time and these things get dashed off in a hurry. Do you hold that karma does not exist? If so, do you have an alternative model of action? I have always understood karma to mean literally action. In my view every action requires a desire and an intent of some sort, and although some actions may seem inconsequential in their impact, even a small action carries a small puff of desire and intent with it. So a karmic disease or accident or financial loss is desired? No, but whatever happens in life is our destiny created by our karma. snip I was looking over what the 'MMY' Gita has to say on this, and came across Chapter 4, v.17, which speaks about action, and specifically defines wrong actions as those that: 1. harm the doer in the present or the future 2. do not succeed 3. hinder evolution 4. bind the doer to the cycle of birth and death 5. produce life-damaging influences upon the surroundings and upon others 6. are against the laws of nature This exposition is presented in an interesting context, in that Maharishi continues to comment that such wrong action is only possible as long as the doer is: 1. in a state of ignorance about his own dharma 2. unaware of the essential nature of his own self 3. unaware of the nature of activity and the nature of God 4. not supported by transcendental pure consciousness in his waking state of consciousness He continues in the following verse to state that: 'A man for whom the level of transcendental consciousness has become the level of the conscious mind appreciates the thought at its very start before it actually develops into a desire. His thought becomes transformed into action without expressing itself as a desire.' And: 'The question may then be asked: What is responsible for initiating action in such a man? The answer is the almighty power of Nature, which is the cause of the vast and incessant activity of creation and evolution throught the cosmos.' So I conclude three things from this: 1. personally it is helpful to continue to meditate, to increase synchronicity with Being; identification with Nature. 2. to undertake what is perceived as right action. 3. a discussion of karma regarding the enlightened is pretty meaningless with regard to the enlightened, and only useful for the ignorant as a spur to continue #1 and #2, insofar as actions are driven by desire. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] re: gyani's karma
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -- http://www.mudgala.com/articles/gyani_actions.html (snip) Per this framwork, if a gyani had some odd sexual and business karma, the unfoldment of such could look bizzare to onlookers. But it is not volitional nor stemming from unresolved vasanas needs). Its taking it (Prarabdha karma) as it comes. So this means that a gyani's karma(action) in a previous life led him to a place in a present life where he had to fuck someone and he could not say no? Hoo boy, that's a good one. Rick Carlstrom Yes, its easy to be smug about such things. And perhaps you have a more accurate model of karma. Or perhaps you hold that karma does not exist. In your above point, why is saying no superior to saying yes? In a gyani, what is it that is saying / deciding yes or no? I have found the Angora trilogy by Robert Svoboda quite fascinating regarding his teachers experience with karma. Have you read it? The resolution (or reseeding) of past sexual encounters is so prominent that this type of karma even has its own name. What are your views on karma: Do you hold that karma does not exist? If so, do you have an alternative model of action? I have always understood karma to mean literally action. In my view every action requires a desire and an intent of some sort, and although some actions may seem inconsequential in their impact, even a small action carries a small puff of desire and intent with it. So a karmic disease or accident or financial loss is desired? It is this desire and intent that is the important part. This is the part that lives on and comes back to the initiator once or many times as an act or an object or an event ocurring on a concrete level or even in an inner realm such as a mood or an emotion. These acts, objects or events continue to be experienced until there is a learning, a realization that they were created by our very own desires. And that stops Prarabdha karma? Why does MMY have tons of yagyas done for hiself if he has no returning Prarabdha karma? What was the last push of the cart SBS talked about if not Prarabdha karma? Do you think liberation has anything to do with deactivating seeds of karma? Yes, I think liberation is the absolute lack of seeds of karma. see above. You dont distinguish between Prarabdha karma and Sanchitta karma? Do you think a liberated one has absolutely no karma returning to them in this life / body? Not only that but I do not think that liberated ones even exist on earth unless they are an avatar. So there are no realized liberated ones walking the earth? When people talk of their experiences of no-doer, what is the role of karma in that state? All action takes place on the field of the three gunas. It is the infinite unmanifest mind of Brahm that perfectly expresses this action so technically the individual self does not perform any action. However the state of identification as a body produces an individual self that thinks it IS a body and that it IS the one performing action and that it needs something from out there to be whole. With deep realization the individual can relax the reigns of it's personal desires, stop creating new seeds of karma and allow Brahm to be uninteruptedly the charioteer of activity. So MMY or SBS or Amma, their social / physical entities, don't have any effect on the world -- that is the physical actions of thier bodies don't have any effect? Odd theory. The little self is no longer there mucking up the works so those all those planted seeds of karma can unfold in a perfectly coordinated and efficient manner, until they are all gone. I thought they WERE all gone -- per you answer above, Yes, I think liberation is the absolute lack of seeds of karma. Okay, so now having thought about all that, I will revise my reaction to your original thoughts about gurus, sex and karma. I could see a situation where a guru or any highly evolved individual would be exposed to a willing sex partner because of their unfolding seeds of karma (both of them). Are they still attached to those desires, do they still want to engage in them? That is the important point, in my opinion. Could there be a situation where Brahm is using a guru as a tool to unfold seeds of karma in someone else by having them engage in sexual activity with them? Yes, I think so, but I also think that this would illustrate continuing attachment on the part of both. Sorry I don't follow, your theory appears not based on any source other than speculation and your reasoning appears jumbled to me. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to:
[FairfieldLife] Re: gyani's karma
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: (snip) What are your views on karma: You asked for my views so I gave them to you. My first response to your original post was hasty and flip but sometimes there is little time and these things get dashed off in a hurry. Do you hold that karma does not exist? If so, do you have an alternative model of action? I have always understood karma to mean literally action. In my view every action requires a desire and an intent of some sort, and although some actions may seem inconsequential in their impact, even a small action carries a small puff of desire and intent with it. So a karmic disease or accident or financial loss is desired? No, but whatever happens in life is our destiny created by our karma. Do you think a liberated one has absolutely no karma returning to them in this life / body? Not only that but I do not think that liberated ones even exist on earth unless they are an avatar. So there are no realized liberated ones walking the earth? I would call that an avatar. When people talk of their experiences of no-doer, what is the role of karma in that state? When people talk of their experiences of no-doer I do not think that they are liberated. Sorry I don't follow, your theory appears not based on any source other than speculation and your reasoning appears jumbled to me. That's fine if you do not follow what I am saying, we don't know each other and our glossary is probably totally out of synch. It doesn't matter, I wrote my sincere views on karma and I stand by them. It appears that you are the one who jumbled my reasoning through misinterpretation and as far as speculation is concerned; it's all speculation. Everything on the linked website, what you wrote and what I wrote, it's all speculation. Sometimes you just have to say what you feel and forget the sources, after all the sources are just other people saying what they feel. Rick Carlstrom To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: gyani's karma
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That's fine if you do not follow what I am saying, we don't know each other and our glossary is probably totally out of synch. It doesn't matter, I wrote my sincere views on karma and I stand by them. It appears that you are the one who jumbled my reasoning through misinterpretation and as far as speculation is concerned; it's all speculation. Everything on the linked website, what you wrote and what I wrote, it's all speculation. Sometimes you just have to say what you feel and forget the sources, after all the sources are just other people saying what they feel. ALL of them. Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
