Re: Feeding grain and supplements
This message is from: Marsha Jo Hannah <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > Equine Senior [...] > Some poor nutritionist has probably spent a good part of his/her career > developing a product balanced just right for a horse. Then the owner > comes along and mixes a couple of different products together, then adds > a little of this and a little of that and screws the whole thing up. Yeah---but feeding 100% of a complete feed is much too spendy. ;-) In the case of Equine Senior, the research nutritionist was Sarah Ralston. Years ago, I had several e-conversations with her about feeding it to Nansy. She said that ES was originally designed as a feed for older horses who couldn't keep weight on ANY OTHER WAY, and that (in her opinion) Purina has over-marketed it, as a complete feed for all horses over 15 years old. She feels it's too rich to be used as a complete feed for most horses. Basically, she saw no problem with my continuing to feed Nansy mostly hay products, with supplements as needed, as long as she could stay in good condition that way. In order to get supplements into Nansy, I need some tasty "carrier". She has proven to me that she can't chew/digest most grains, even the cracked ones in sweet feed---she'd eat them, but the birds who picked thru her manure were getting most of the "goody" out of them! Equine Senior is well accepted, and seems to be digested nicely. So, I use it instead of grain. (Actually, I tend to refer to ES plus supplements as my horses' "grain", just for a convenient shorthand word!) Since I've got ES on hand, the younger Fjords, and the donkey, also get a half cup of it with their supplements, too. But, I don't count on that quantity of it to provide a meaningful amount of any essential nutrient. Marsha Jo HannahMurphy must have been a horseman-- [EMAIL PROTECTED] anything that can go wrong, will! 15 mi SW of Roseburg, Oregon
Gunnar
This message is from: "Knutsen Fjord Farm" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Jean, my heart is with you and Gunnar! Will stay tuned. Joel, I agree about losing the sale to the lady who was afraid a Fjord would be too smart for her. By the way, if any of you are heading to Wilson Crick, as we say it around here, feel free to stop by before or after the plowing demos. We love to receive guests and are close in Ellensburg. Peg Knutsen - Ellensburg, WA http://www.eburg.com/~kffjord/
Re: dentist
This message is from: Marsha Jo Hannah <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > Dale Jeffries [...] had a three day course that people could take > and after completing it and buying a required amount of tools from > him you were given a diploma saying that you were a dentist. Argh!!! That's the type that give "dentists" a bad name! > Who's system is this? That is the problem. There needs to be a > nationally recognized program where people can get certified and have > opportunities for continuing education. Todd Williams---lives in Alberta. I understand that he's trying hard to get a real dental school going, with serious requirements, international approvals, etc. Meanwhile, he's doing it the old "guild" way---training apprentices, who (with enough experience) become journeymen, and take on their own apprentices. It was really interesting to watch him and his students interact at a clinic. But, he needs to clone himself several times over, to fill the need for dental teachers AND dentists. > I do believe there is a need for non-vet dentists. There are just too > many horses out there to have dentals done by vets, especially when we > also need to do general care, surgery, reproduction, lameness, etc, etc.. > Everyone just needs to lose their egos and come together for the good of > the horse and dentistry. AMEN to that! > Dentistry is really about finesse, rather than brute strength. With > some exceptions, if you are exerting a lot of energy than you are > not using the correct tool. This is especially true today with all > the power tools and carbide blades that are available. > > Steve White Todd believes otherwise. He finds that his female students are worn out after about 4 horses per day; men generally can do 6 to 8. Apparently, it takes a certain amount of upper body strength just to hold the tools up there, in awkward postures, with exactly the right position, angle, and force to get the job done. Sharp power tools can do a lot of damage if they're not controlled just right! I told him not to count women out---they'll be the ones to invent new tools and techniques that are easier on everyone! Marsha Jo HannahMurphy must have been a horseman-- [EMAIL PROTECTED] anything that can go wrong, will! 15 mi SW of Roseburg, Oregon
Re: Feeding grain and supplements
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Marsha, > Ah, but I'm not using Equine Senior as a "complete feed"; I'm using > it > as a "condiment" I'm glad to see that you've made that distinction. I see this mistake frequently. Equine Senior and Junior (and some other brands) are complete feeds but I see so many people use them as part of a ration. If you are not using them as directed, than you are not getting the nutrition that they claim. Some poor nutritionist has probably spent a good part of his/her career developing a product balanced just right for a horse. Then the owner comes along and mixes a couple of different products together, then adds a little of this and a little of that and screws the whole thing up. Steve Steve and Amy White Prairieholm Farm Waterloo, Nebraska
Re: dentist
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > The dentist I used had some interesting things to say about vets > attending dental classes. Apparently, some of them think that, > after > a 1-weekend seminar, they can buy all the nice shiny tools and do > advanced dentistry. This can be said of lay people as well. In fact that is why Dale Jeffries was run out of Nebraska. He had a three day course that people could take and after completing it and buying a required amount of tools from him you were given a diploma saying that you were a dentist. The state tried to get him to work with a tech. school so he could have an accredited course, but he refused. > Much of what "lay dentists" learn thru the apprentice > and > journeyman system Who's system is this? That is the problem. There needs to be a nationally recognized program where people can get certified and have opportunities for continuing education. > This dentist claimed that some of the worst messes he'd > had to "clean up after" were created by vets who had more tools > than > knowledge. (He was happy to share his knowledge, but most vets > don't > make time for the full, long courses.) Most people don't realize that there are several contin. ed. courses for veterinarians who want more dental training. I have taken some myself. I do believe there is a need for non-vet dentists. There are just too many horses out there to have dentals done by vets, especially when we also need to do general care, surgery, reproduction, lameness, etc, etc.. Everyone just needs to lose their egos and come together for the good of the horse and dentistry. This should be no different than human dental schools. You don't have to go to med school to be a dentist. You go to a specific school for dentistry. When you graduate you are then licensed and you have to have continuing ed. to maintain that license. > I had a vet admit that, fresh out of vet school, she had labored to > pull a gelding's canine teeth, because she hadn't been taught the > difference between canines (rarely removed) and "wolf teeth" (often > removed)! I think that this was probably her fault and not the schools. You get this in basic anatomy and again in equine clinics. She just never bothered to really study the horses mouth. > > Our vet said that she was not strong enough to handle the tools to > > do the procedure, but recommended another who had studied with > > Dale Jeffries. This should not be an excuse. Dentistry is really about finesse, rather than brute strength. With some exceptions, if you are exerting a lot of energy than you are not using the correct tool. This is especially true today with all the power tools and carbide blades that are available. Steve Steve and Amy White Prairieholm Farm Waterloo, Nebraska
Re: Feeding grain and supplements
This message is from: "Jean Gayle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Marsha that helps as I am also not using it as a complete feed and give him a vitamin mineral supplement every other day. Thanks. Jean Jean Gayle Aberdeen, WA [Authoress of "The Colonel's Daughter" Occupied Germany 1946 TO 1949 ] http://www.techline.com/~jgayle Barnes & Noble Book Stores
Re: Feeding grain and supplements
This message is from: Marsha Jo Hannah <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > "Jean Gayle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Marsha if you are feeding senior horse feed, which I am also feeding > my older horse, how much supplement do you give as senior horse has > all the necessary vitamins and minerals? Ah, but I'm not using Equine Senior as a "complete feed"; I'm using it as a "condiment" to encourage Nansy to eat her supplements and hay pellets. Most of her calories come from locally-grown ryegrass hay that is chopped and pressed into pellets, and from green pasture grass. (She can't chew long-stem hay, but does OK with short, succulent grass---about 3 hours pasture time per day.) Since the western Oregon soils are deficient in minerals, she gets the preferred local vitamin and mineral supplement, in the same amounts as my other Fjords. Marsha Jo HannahMurphy must have been a horseman-- [EMAIL PROTECTED] anything that can go wrong, will! 15 mi SW of Roseburg, Oregon
Re: Feeding grain and supplements
This message is from: "Jean Gayle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Marsha if you are feeding senior horse feed, which I am also feeding my older horse, how much supplement do you give as senior horse has all the necessary vitamins and minerals?Jean Jean Gayle Aberdeen, WA [Authoress of "The Colonel's Daughter" Occupied Germany 1946 TO 1949 ] http://www.techline.com/~jgayle Barnes & Noble Book Stores
Southeast Fjord Horse Association meeting
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Greetings, all Fjord lovers! The April meeting of the Southeast Fjord Horse Association will be held on April 1st, at Sara Worsham's farm, near Richmond, VA. The plan is to assemble around 11:30 for a brief business meeting, than have lunch, and by 12:30 be tacking up the horses for an afternoon clinic on preparing for the NFHR Evaluations (riding tests and conformation). All are welcome, to participate or to watch. We hope everybody will bring a fjord and be part of the fun. You will need to bring a lunch for yourself, and chairs. If you are bringing a horse, you will also need its coggins, a hardhat (must be worn at all times while mounted) and be ready to sign a waiver of liability. We would like to know in advance how many people and how many horses will be attending. Please RSVP to any of the following: Jan Bonner [EMAIL PROTECTED]or (804) 286-2785 Curt Pierce [EMAIL PROTECTED] or (703) 330-2498 Sue Banks[EMAIL PROTECTED] or (804) 785-7208 Directions to the meeting are as follows: >From 295 - Exit on Tappahannock exit, heading East on 360 to Rt. 30. Turn right on Rt. 30 towards West Point. Go 11 miles and turn left on Rt. 641 (Sandy Point Rd.). Go 7/10 miles and turn left at white sign for "Aria" Farm. >From 95/Kings Dominion - Take Exit 98 Doswell onto Rt. 30 heading east towards West Point, cross 301 and continue to 360. Cross 360 and proceed 11 miles to Rt. 641 (Sandy Point Rd.). Go 7/10 miles and turn left at white sign for "Aria" Farm. >From West Point - Take Rt. 30 West and proceed approximately 15 miles. Just past Colosse Baptist Church on your right, make a right turn onto Rt. 641 (Sandy Point Rd.). Go 7/10 miles and turn left at white sign for "Aria" Farm. Please remember: April 1st at 11:30 - bring horses - coggins - hardhat - chairs - lunch. Spread the word, we're looking forward to having lots of fun!
Re: Training
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 3/15/01 12:08:41 PM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: << How lucky for you having a fjord trainer almost in your backyard!!! I was telling my husband just the other day that my dream would be to go up north with my big boy for a week or two with a Fjord trainer. >> Hi Cindy- We are doing just that, and going to visit our big boy in Oregon! So when are we going to swap Fjord visits? Brigid Wasson San Francisco Bay Area, CA http://members.nbci.com/mrgnpetsit/fjord1";>Our Fjords
Re: dentist
This message is from: Marsha Jo Hannah <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Steve McIlree <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > several of the equine veterinarians here went to [Dale Jeffries'] > school, and were made aware of some of the dental problems horses > experience The dentist I used had some interesting things to say about vets attending dental classes. Apparently, some of them think that, after a 1-weekend seminar, they can buy all the nice shiny tools and do advanced dentistry. As with farriery, there is a lot of art/craft to dentistry. Much of what "lay dentists" learn thru the apprentice and journeyman system is the manual skills necessary to implement the ideas (most dental apprentices can soon recognize most of the problems, but it takes much longer before they develop the skills to fix them). This dentist claimed that some of the worst messes he'd had to "clean up after" were created by vets who had more tools than knowledge. (He was happy to share his knowledge, but most vets don't make time for the full, long courses.) > (One [vet] told me that he had done about three days on teeth at the > time he went thru [vet] school.) I had a vet admit that, fresh out of vet school, she had labored to pull a gelding's canine teeth, because she hadn't been taught the difference between canines (rarely removed) and "wolf teeth" (often removed)! > The explanation for this is that horses' teeth continue to > grow during their entire lives. Actually, "grow" may give the wrong impression. The teeth continue to "erupt", but don't actually regenerate. It's more like a Chapstick--- it's all there when you buy it; you just push more up out of the tube as you need it. But, when you get to the bottom of the tube, that's it. That's what happened to Nansy's molar---worn down to the point that all that was left was the root. > Our vet said that she was not strong enough to handle the tools to > do the procedure, but recommended another who had studied with > Dale Jeffries. IMHO, that is exactly what equine vets should be doing---educating themselves enough to recognize dental problems, then referring the patient to an expert, who has ALL the skills to fix matters. Just like my husband's GP MD told him to take his possible TMJ syndrome to a GP dentist, who confirmed the problem, then referred him to a dental specialist to fix it > Sorry this has become so long, but I've become a real evangelist of > knowledgeable equine dental care since this experience. Amen! I used to be somewhat skeptical when friends would make claims for the various lay practitioners that they use. However, having seen what a difference a good dentist can make to my Fjords' comfort and health, I'm now a believer. Marsha Jo HannahMurphy must have been a horseman-- [EMAIL PROTECTED] anything that can go wrong, will! 15 mi SW of Roseburg, Oregon
Re: mules
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hello everyone, << Breeding for a mule would be allowed since you would be breeding a fjord mare with a donkey stud. To get a hinny you would have to use a fjord stallion on a donkey mare. Is this really crossbreeding or creating a new species? >> To the best of my knowledge, crossbreeding is not allowed, period, within the NFHR guidelines, regardless if using a mare or a stallion, or to a subspecies or another horse breed. Please correct me if I am wrong! Lynda Lynda and Daniel Bailey's Norwegian Fjord Horse Farm White Cloud, MI 231.689.9902 http://hometown.aol.com/heithingi/BaileysNorwegianFjords.html
Re: Feeding grain and supplements
This message is from: Marsha Jo Hannah <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > "Sue Harrison" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > When one cuts out the grain, how can it be assured that they are > getting enough of necessary supplements (present in grain) to > maintain healthy bones and teeth. In the wild, grain is only widely available for a short part of the year. Most of the nutrition has to come from grass, or other forages. Pasture studies have indicated that a variety of minerals come from eating a variety of different plants. Some species of clover, for instance, have very long roots, so pick up both water and minerals (which find their way into the leaves) out of a different layer of soil than do shallow-rooted grasses, i.e. weeds have access to minerals that may have leached beyond the reach of the grasses. And, I would expect that grain grown in a selenium-deficient area would have the same imbalances as hay grown in such an area. > how does one get their powdered supplement into a horse without > putting it in grain?? My equines are fond of bran. I mix any powder with at least twice that volume of bran, and add just enough water to make it all stick together. I serve such things in large round-bottomed dog bowls (so the good stuff doesn't get lost in the corners of a feeder); mine always lick the bowl clean. However, I prefer to feed a pelleted supplement---Horse Guard is formulated for this area. I mix it with some grass hay pellets and/or Equine Senior, and it all disappears. > Are the supplements really necessary anyway? Our area supposedly > has insufficient amounts of Seleniun in the ground. I wonder what a > defficiency in this mineral can do to a horse? Selenium deficiency causes problems with growth of hoof and hair, as well as fertility problems. If your area is low on selenium, you need to supplement it. No hoof, no horse (But, be aware that too much selenium will also cause hoof problems! So, if you are using a "complete feed" that has adequate selenium in it, don't also use a mineral mix with extra selenium.) > About nipping in horses...we have always hand fedbut not so > often that nipping has ever become a problem. My 2 ranch-raised Fjords have always been very polite about taking hand-fed treats. I've had problems with the donkey that I raised (my first equine) and with our Fjord who was backyard-raised. Remedial work is fairly easy---"hand"-feed ALL treats via a pair of pliers. Saves wear and tear on fingers, and smart equines quickly figure out that the "fast chomp" treat-grabbing technique makes their teeth hurt! > He loves having his tongue taken hold of and rubbed. Sleepy can get lippy (but not nippy)---mostly when he's being held for the farrier. He wants to have his lips played with, or held. He's equally happy if I let him lick my hand, then I grab his tongue, he pulls it away from me; iterate. It's clearly a game that he invented to distract himself from shoeing, which he used to find stressful. Marsha Jo HannahMurphy must have been a horseman-- [EMAIL PROTECTED] anything that can go wrong, will! 15 mi SW of Roseburg, Oregon
mules
This message is from: "John Bosomworth" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Gail said <> Breeding for a mule would be allowed since you would be breeding a fjord mare with a donkey stud. To get a hinny you would have to use a fjord stallion on a donkey mare. Is this really crossbreeding or creating a new species? Fjordally yours, Eunice[EMAIL PROTECTED] `` John & Eunice Bosomworth Deere Country Fjords Ayton, Ontario, CANADA `
Re: Any Fjords in GA or AR...???
This message is from: Joyce Concklin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> --- Betsy Bauer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > This message is from: "Betsy Bauer" > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Hello Group, > > With Spring popping in around the country, I have > been contacted by folks > who are shopping for fjords in GA and AR... are any > of you in those areas > selling any fjords? Would you (or any fjord owners > across the US and > Canada) be interested in my marketing service? > > I assist folks find that special fjord for them... > Have you visited > www.fjordpony.com ? Bonnie Rieber (PEI) and I are > very busy with many of > you - fjord owners - and have helped some of you - > List participants - find > their new fjords. If you are looking for a new mare > or stallion (oldsters > or youngsters) please let us know. > > Also, if you are shopping for Books for children, I > have just added quite a > few books to my site... www.fjordpony.com/books.html > and more jewelry and > Fjord Socks are coming soon. > > I hope you are all doing well and you all who are > dealing with snow hang in > there... the sun is on its way. > > Happy Ridin' > Betsy Bauer > 559-645-4111 > [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi, We have Fjords for sale in the Tampa Bay area of Florida.Currently we have a 3 y/o gelding green trained and a older yearling gelding. If anyone is interested they can E Mail me at [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thanks Joyce Palm Concklin Clover Oaks Farm Fjords 352 596 1907 Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/
Re: salt licks
This message is from: carol j makosky <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hi, I think that I tried one of these last year and Heidi ate the whole thing in about 2 weeks. I did not think she needed to OD on this stuff and never got another. Gregor Fellers wrote: > This message is from: Gregor Fellers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > I saw a new (to me) type of salt lick at the grain store yesterday. It is > supposed to have chemicals that repel insects and flys. I'm sure it works > well this time of year but wonder if it works in the summer. It cost 3 > times the regular mineral salt lick. They would be worth the extra cost if > they were marginally effective. The cost of traditional fly sprays is > excessive. > > Does anyone know if these are effective and save to use? -- "Built FJORD tough" Carol M. On Golden Pond Northern Wisconsin
Thor, Equine Affaire
This message is from: Ingrid Ivic <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > show! We all took turns! I got to tell you, seeing the Friesian Thor?(can't > think of his name!) doing his dressage thing was enough to make your heart > stop! If I could, I would sneak a Friesian into my barn! Got to go do a > barn check!Some of the snow really started to melt today! > Sue g. Hi Sue, Yup, Thor it was...ain't he grand? We have the Equine Affaire coming to us...Columbus, Ohio, April 5th-8th. Many breeds will be represented. Any one from this List going? Here's the web addy: http://www.equineaffaire.com/ I LOVE my darling Fjordies...but gosh, then again I LOVE my Friesians too! I am fortunate to have the best of both worlds...the small and the tall. Both are people-loving breeds. LOL...It may be a bit hard to "sneak" a Friesian into your barn...they like to make a grand entrance no matter where they are. Best to you! Ingrid ;o) PS (Heh-heh-hehI have a Friesian foal due here very soon, out of my favorite dressage mare...and "he/or she" will be for saleJust thought I'd toss that in!)
Re: T-shirts & mugs
This message is from: John Bolinski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Wow, Joel, Those are some really neat items! Martie in MD Joel Harman wrote: > This message is from: Joel Harman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Following sites have head shots on T-shirts, mugs, mouse pads, etc. of a > three abreast taking a blow an Ethel, WA plowing match. > Different image on each site.
salt licks
This message is from: Gregor Fellers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I saw a new (to me) type of salt lick at the grain store yesterday. It is supposed to have chemicals that repel insects and flys. I'm sure it works well this time of year but wonder if it works in the summer. It cost 3 times the regular mineral salt lick. They would be worth the extra cost if they were marginally effective. The cost of traditional fly sprays is excessive. Does anyone know if these are effective and save to use?
Re: Gunnar
This message is from: "linda hickam" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
{finishing the previous note}.."progress" continues!
--
>From: "Jean Gayle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: "fjord"
>Subject: Gunnar
>Date: Fri, Mar 16, 2001, 1:36 PM
>
>This message is from: "Jean Gayle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
>Thanks for all the support from so many, what wonderful people. To see a
>horse in so much pain and realize how helpless he is and you are is
>difficult. He is I think better today altho not as interested in food as he
>should be. Very little and light feeding. He has a slight tremor but then
>had had a lot o pain and medication. My Vet is not certain what it is and
>we are watching quite carefully. That means being up at frequent times
>checking.
>
>This is the boy who was never sick. He has "pooped" twice with some mucous,
>urinates a bit, and lumbered away from me when I tired to get him off the
>grass in the yard and away from the other horses this morning. He was tubed
>and given banamine and Turbo- (sp) last night around ten. My Vet
>thought he had shown slight improvement in the gums and the gut within an
>hour. I stalled him and checked on him at four this morning and he was up
>and looking for food.
>At 8:30 this morning he waiting and I turned him out on the grass. He had
>again pooped and there were some dry clumps which hopefully mean this is an
>impaction. I think I had thought on two occasions that he seemed a bit off
>this past week which could have been the beginning of a backup. I had been
>cutting back as the weather warms on his feed and not so much alfalfa.
>Perhaps the grass hay is too fine. Who knows.
>
>I have always thought God could have done better by giving us all, animals
>and man, transparent skin so our health is not such a guessing game. "Ah,
>you see that bulge in his intestines? Yup! Well that is an impaction so do
>not worry that he has a twisted gut." etc. Jean
>
>
>
>
>
>Jean Gayle
>Aberdeen, WA
>[Authoress of "The Colonel's Daughter"
>Occupied Germany 1946 TO 1949 ]
>http://www.techline.com/~jgayle
>Barnes & Noble Book Stores
Re: Gunnar
This message is from: "linda hickam" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I'm glad to here Gunnar is doing better..your idea of transparent skin sounds like a pretty good idea...back to GunnarI hope his progress -- >From: "Jean Gayle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "fjord" >Subject: Gunnar >Date: Fri, Mar 16, 2001, 1:36 PM > >This message is from: "Jean Gayle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >Thanks for all the support from so many, what wonderful people. To see a >horse in so much pain and realize how helpless he is and you are is >difficult. He is I think better today altho not as interested in food as he >should be. Very little and light feeding. He has a slight tremor but then >had had a lot o pain and medication. My Vet is not certain what it is and >we are watching quite carefully. That means being up at frequent times >checking. > >This is the boy who was never sick. He has "pooped" twice with some mucous, >urinates a bit, and lumbered away from me when I tired to get him off the >grass in the yard and away from the other horses this morning. He was tubed >and given banamine and Turbo- (sp) last night around ten. My Vet >thought he had shown slight improvement in the gums and the gut within an >hour. I stalled him and checked on him at four this morning and he was up >and looking for food. >At 8:30 this morning he waiting and I turned him out on the grass. He had >again pooped and there were some dry clumps which hopefully mean this is an >impaction. I think I had thought on two occasions that he seemed a bit off >this past week which could have been the beginning of a backup. I had been >cutting back as the weather warms on his feed and not so much alfalfa. >Perhaps the grass hay is too fine. Who knows. > >I have always thought God could have done better by giving us all, animals >and man, transparent skin so our health is not such a guessing game. "Ah, >you see that bulge in his intestines? Yup! Well that is an impaction so do >not worry that he has a twisted gut." etc. Jean > > > > > >Jean Gayle >Aberdeen, WA >[Authoress of "The Colonel's Daughter" >Occupied Germany 1946 TO 1949 ] >http://www.techline.com/~jgayle >Barnes & Noble Book Stores
Re: Gunnar
This message is from: "Jean Gayle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Thanks Linda and I hope so too. He had been playing quite hard with my big gelding yesterday and at first I was afraid Charlie might have hurt him. I think it is an impaction, hope hope. Jean Jean Gayle Aberdeen, WA [Authoress of "The Colonel's Daughter" Occupied Germany 1946 TO 1949 ] http://www.techline.com/~jgayle Barnes & Noble Book Stores
FMD, packhorses, &Intro to driving clinic
This message is from: "sandra church" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hi everyone Vivian expressed concern over her to-be-imported fjords and just today this information was sent through The Horse newsletter. The procedure and requirements for handling horses imported into the US from countries with FMD (foot & mouth disease) is explained at this website: http://www.thehorse.com/news/index031601_fmd.html Gail's mention of the Santa Fe outfitter was timely for me. This weekend, our local Powhatan Riding Association is meeting at my home and the guest speaker will demonstrate how to "pack" a horse. Of course, my Loki will be used since he's more dependable than the rest of my equines. Hopefully, he won't startle too many of the club members because anytime he greets a new person, he sticks his nose in their face for a long sniff. Then if he likes the person, he sticks out his tongue from the side of his mouth and wants you to stroke it. That's the first thing he did to me when I answered his "for sale" ad and I'm curious if anyone else's fjord does this. For anyone near Richmond, Va. there's a Introduction to Carriage Driving clinic on Sunday, March 25th from 10am to 2:30pm at the Deep Run Hunt Club Showgrounds at Manakin-Sabot. The demonstrations include: obstacle course driving, driving attire & appropriate turnout, training, safety, & choosing a suitable driving horse. There is no charge but bring a pot luck dish. For more info, contac Dot Ruqus at 804-556-4486 or Cheryl Childress at 804-784-0001. Last year, there were several fjords there. Too bad Loki doesn't have his harness or cart yet. Happy trailsSandra in Va. _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
Re: Gunnar
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hello Jean, So glad to hear Gunnar is starting to improve, we will continue to think of you and your boy. Keep us informed! Lynda Lynda and Daniel Bailey's Norwegian Fjord Horse Farm White Cloud, MI 231.689.9902 http://hometown.aol.com/heithingi/BaileysNorwegianFjords.html
Any Fjords in GA or AR...???
This message is from: "Betsy Bauer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hello Group, With Spring popping in around the country, I have been contacted by folks who are shopping for fjords in GA and AR... are any of you in those areas selling any fjords? Would you (or any fjord owners across the US and Canada) be interested in my marketing service? I assist folks find that special fjord for them... Have you visited www.fjordpony.com ? Bonnie Rieber (PEI) and I are very busy with many of you - fjord owners - and have helped some of you - List participants - find their new fjords. If you are looking for a new mare or stallion (oldsters or youngsters) please let us know. Also, if you are shopping for Books for children, I have just added quite a few books to my site... www.fjordpony.com/books.html and more jewelry and Fjord Socks are coming soon. I hope you are all doing well and you all who are dealing with snow hang in there... the sun is on its way. Happy Ridin' Betsy Bauer 559-645-4111 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Gunnar
This message is from: "Jean Gayle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Thanks for all the support from so many, what wonderful people. To see a horse in so much pain and realize how helpless he is and you are is difficult. He is I think better today altho not as interested in food as he should be. Very little and light feeding. He has a slight tremor but then had had a lot o pain and medication. My Vet is not certain what it is and we are watching quite carefully. That means being up at frequent times checking. This is the boy who was never sick. He has "pooped" twice with some mucous, urinates a bit, and lumbered away from me when I tired to get him off the grass in the yard and away from the other horses this morning. He was tubed and given banamine and Turbo- (sp) last night around ten. My Vet thought he had shown slight improvement in the gums and the gut within an hour. I stalled him and checked on him at four this morning and he was up and looking for food. At 8:30 this morning he waiting and I turned him out on the grass. He had again pooped and there were some dry clumps which hopefully mean this is an impaction. I think I had thought on two occasions that he seemed a bit off this past week which could have been the beginning of a backup. I had been cutting back as the weather warms on his feed and not so much alfalfa. Perhaps the grass hay is too fine. Who knows. I have always thought God could have done better by giving us all, animals and man, transparent skin so our health is not such a guessing game. "Ah, you see that bulge in his intestines? Yup! Well that is an impaction so do not worry that he has a twisted gut." etc. Jean Jean Gayle Aberdeen, WA [Authoress of "The Colonel's Daughter" Occupied Germany 1946 TO 1949 ] http://www.techline.com/~jgayle Barnes & Noble Book Stores
RE: Feeding grain and supplements
This message is from: "Cindy Vallecillo" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 16, 2001 10:06 AM To: fjordhorse@angus.mystery.com Subject: Re: Feeding grain and supplements I feed my fjords a pelleted supplement called TDI-10. What is in the TDI-10 and is it readily available? Cindy Vallecillo The Cove, Millbrae California
Re: dentist
This message is from: Steve McIlree <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hello Ellen, Thursday, March 15, 2001, 15:34:50, you wrote: > I always have my vet check the horses teeth.I know there are people > out there that insist on only having a dentist work on their > horses.I asked a professional that I respect what a dentist could do > for me or do better than a vet.I was told by this person that it is > illegal to work as an equine dentist in Virginia although people do > it. I want to jump in here on this dentist discussion. We in Eastern Nebraska were at on time the home of Dale Jeffries, the guy who is responsible for many of the lay dentists who have been loosed on the land. (The other Steve's ex-boss eventually got him run out of the state and made lay dentistry illegal here too.) Anyway, as a result several of the equine veterinarians here went to his school, and were made aware of some of the dental problems horses experience that were not covered in school. (One of them told me that he had done about three days on teeth at the time he went thru school.) My personal experience with this comes from the fact that my Trakehner mare was always unthrifty, and my Morgan was beginning to look aged at 14, with his hips starting to poke out and his spine starting to show. Our vet at that time told me that both horses needed a common equine dental procedure, they needed to have their incisors cut down. The explanation for this is that horses' teeth continue to grow during their entire lives. This is nature's way to compensate for the hard wear that a grazer's teeth get from bitting and chewing abrasive grass. Unfortunately, we have eliminated the bitting part of the process for many of our hay-fed domesticated horses. They no longer have to bite the grass as it grows, only scoop up their grain and hay with their lips and tongues. So their molars get more wear than their incisors, and front teeth begin to get long in relationship to the back. Eventually, the incisors get so long that the molars can not longer meet to properly masticate their food. At that point the horse begin to become very hard to keep at proper weight. The way to reverse this condition is to cut off the front teeth with a cutoff wheel until the molars are meshing properly again. Our vet said that she was not strong enough to handle the tools to do the procedure, but recommended another who had studied with Dale Jeffries. To cut short what is becoming a long post, the procedure was a complete success. Both horses have since had no problem keeping weight on, actually quite the reverse. Both have been on pasture since so their diets have not led to a recurrence of the condition. I feel lucky that we had veterinarians here who were able to recognize and correct this problem. And my discussions with them led me to the conclusion that the bulk of their knowledge of equine tooth problems had come from Mr. Jeffries rather than vet school. Sorry this has become so long, but I've become a real evangelist of knowledgeable equine dental care since this experience. -- Steve McIlree -- Pferd & Skipper -- Omaha, Nebraska, USA When I bestride him, I soar, I am a hawk...the basest horn of his hoof is more musical than the pipe of Hermes. --William Shakespeare(1564-1616)
Re: Feeding grain and supplements
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sue, > Steve, as a vet...what do you feed to your Fjords? And in your > opinion what > makes a horse hard to handle...the molasses or the oats? I feed my fjords a pelleted supplement called TDI-10. They get that and grass hay. That's all, even during show season. Since it is a pellet, you don't have to worry about them not getting it all like you do with a powder or granular supplement. Also, I feed my old thoroughbred Equine Senior. So, feeding the fjords pellets makes them feel like they are getting something too and they don't cause a big fuss when I feed the TB. There is little energy in these pellets so they won't get fat off of them and it won't make them "hot". Since you live in an area that is Se deficient, I would definitely feed a mineral supplement. I disagree with your veterinarian. I would say many horses don't need sweet feed, especially a fjord. What makes a horse "hot" is energy, whether from molasses or grain. Molasses is a cheap source of carbohydrate so it is added to feed to increase the calories (and also because it is sticky so it holds the supplements). That is why the cheaper brands have a lot more molasses than the better brands. Steve Steve and Amy White Prairieholm Farm Waterloo, Nebraska
T-shirts & mugs
This message is from: Joel Harman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Following sites have head shots on T-shirts, mugs, mouse pads, etc. of a three abreast taking a blow an Ethel, WA plowing match. Different image on each site. They were awarded a blue for the most non traditional hitch. www.cafepress.com/fjords www.cafepress.com/fjords1 www.cafepress.comfjords2 For those of you that enjoy seeing horses turning dirt there is a plowing bee in Wilson Ck, WA on 24 &25 Mar. Last year there were 76 horses & a span of oxen. If you have not seen 8 horses pulling a 3 bottom plow you have not seen poetry in motion. Wilson Ck, WA is north of Moses Lake WA. Kind of north central WA. Joel Harman Brass Ring Ranch Mosier OR logging & custom farming with fjords
lost sale
This message is from: Joel Harman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> You should be glad you lost that sale as the lady probably would not have been smart enough to deal with a fjord. Then it would have been ruined & included in that vast pool of fjords that have been ruined by unaware yet well meaning owners.
Re: Mules, etc
This message is from: "Teressa Kandianis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Very true. I hear so much about the importance of routine from reading horse books and watching videos but it seems the fjords training emphasizes change instead so they don't get bored. We've totally changed our fjord's schedules this past two or three weeks and it seems it doesn't matter how we change it, within a couple of days, the pair of them adapt and start to anticipate my moves. And they don't have clocks either. And the change doesn't seem to make them the slightest bit unhappy - Teressa K. in NW Washington
Re: Gunnar
This message is from: Storme Lee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Jean Gayle wrote: > > This message is from: "Jean Gayle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Pray for Gunnar he is down and rolling hard. Vet is on the way. Jean I and Sally will both pray for the sweet little Gunnar. What is wrong with him? Storme
Re: Feeding grain and supplements
This message is from: Jean Ernest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >He loves having his tongue taken hold of and rubbed. >He started doing this as a baby (he is coming 2 in April). Does anyone else >have a Fjord that likes having his tongue rubbed? Bjorken, who I raised from a baby, also loved to have his tongue rubbed about that age. I also started it when he was very mouthy and nippy as a baby, and he got so he would stick it out "on command" when I said "tonguey". I then saw him stick it out to rub it on the horse he was playing with, chasing them around with his tongue sticking out a couple inches, and if you look closely at the picture of Adel and him "smooching" in the "Fjord's at play" page on the NFHR website, you will see he has his tongue out! So funny, to see Bjarne or Adel sucking or mouthing his tongue! Now he is 14 this year and will rarely do it for me now...as if it's "Oh Mom, I'm too old for that now", but still plays with the others that way. AS for grain, I feed supplements with just a bit of grain,usually plain oats, a half pound or so. I don't know why any horse would REQUIRE "SWEET" feed (molasses)...I heard that Purina is now formulating their Omolene with oil rather than molasses to bind the fine supplemental components! Jean in Fairbanks, Alaska, +30 with a bit of snow today. Jean Ernest Fairbanks, Alaska mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Gunnar
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Oh no. Prayers being sent. Hope the vet is there by now and all is well. Pamela
Re: Cavities
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 3/15/01 8:16:19 PM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > That's because there is no such thing, as an " Equine Dentist. "No > school, no clinical, no tests, no license. Anyone can hang out a shingle > and > call themselves anything, but it sure don't make it so. Lisa Oh man Lisa, them would be fightin words to my vet who spent a lot of time, money, energy learning equine dentistry. She's a fanatic about it. And, though it would be spendy to do things her way (with the power tools, etc, with 5 horses - $1000), she makes some good points on how proper dentistry makes life a LOT easier with our horses. I just smile and nod and have her do the regular floating, at this point. Someday I'd like to get the teeth done with all the bells and whistles, but not today.Oh yeah, we're over here in Maui now, so I couldn't get it done today if my life depended on it! It's 4:30 a.m. don't ask me why I'm awake. ask Raymond! I am sorely missing those horses, but will get a horse "fix" later today as we head to Makawao and meet a man who works with special kids (and us regular adults too). Pamela
Feeding grain and supplements
This message is from: "Sue Harrison" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hi everyoneregarding the "bad teeth" issue.would that have something to do with the amount of mineral available in the hay (from the soil) in different areas? Storm is still getting sweet feed...but now we are feeding less of that and supplementing him by giving him whole oats instead. When one cuts out the grain, how can it be assured that they are getting enough of necessary supplements (present in grain) to maintain healthy bones and teeth. We buy from Blue Sealbut how does one get their powdered supplement into a horse without putting it in grain?? Are the supplements really necessary anyway? Our area supposedly has insufficient amounts of Seleniun in the ground. I wonder what a defficiency in this mineral can do to a horse?... Our vets here say a horse needs sweet feed...and highly recommend feeding grain to every horse...even a Fjord. Steve, as a vet...what do you feed to your Fjords? And in your opinion what makes a horse hard to handle...the molasses or the oats? There seems to be a big controversery on this. We have always fed grain to our horses ...and some have been hard to handle...is grain the culprit? About nipping in horses...we have always hand fedbut not so often that nipping has ever become a problem. Storms thing is to have his nose rubbed...he will drop his head, get all sleepy looking and out comes 2 or 3 inches of pink tongue. He loves having his tongue taken hold of and rubbed. He started doing this as a baby (he is coming 2 in April). Does anyone else have a Fjord that likes having his tongue rubbed? I thought it was a great thing since he was very nippy (before we gelded him) and having his tongue between his teeth prevented him from being able to bite. I would rub his nose, out would come the tongue, and I could safely pet and talk to him. Now he never nips and is very gentle about accepting hand fed treats. This guy will even leave his dish of grain to come over to the stall door and socialize, even though we have no treats. All we have to do is walk by his stall and he will leave all food and come and beg for attention. We have never had a bigger babyin all our 29 years of owning horsesand are thinking strongly of getting another onearen't Fjords habit forming ((: (Like peanuts very hard to have just "one") Well have a great day everyone... Sue in N.B. (Desert Storm's mom)
