Vet Manners Happy Ending
This message is from: "Big Horn Forge Daniel Nauman" Dear List, Last Monday my Vet was scheduled to return and give my horses the balance of their shots. I was unable to speak directly with my Vet when making the appointment, but left a message that I had been working with my horse and may need extra time with her, and would be willing to pay a double barn fee if things went long. Monday morning came and I was pretty nervous. Anyway, the Vet that showed up was her husband. (The other partner in the clinic.) He usually only does small animals, but there he was! No handler. No stud chain. I instantly relaxed. I told him what I had been doing with my horse to make things easier and safer for everyone and said, "I beg you to work with me on this". His response was positive and I gave him a crash course in clicker training and in advance and retreat methods. Everything went swimmingly. My Vet seemed to have a easy time with it, my horse let out a big sigh and was wonderful, and I was on cloud nine. We worked on a loose lead, in an open paddock, and allowed the horse to move when he needed to. Both horses were standing calmly and quietly when they got their shots, and the Vet was done and gone in about 20 minutes. I was on top of the world the rest of the day. When my Vet was leaving I was thanking him (for the umteenth time! ) for taking time with me and my horse, and hoped that we could build on the positive experience for next year. Thanks to everyone who posted privately and on the list with encouragement and help. Toni, with Erick , who thinks the Vet with the food is the way to go. Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw Classified Ads: http://tinyurl.com/5b5g2f
Vet Manners Thank You
This message is from: "Big Horn Forge Daniel Nauman" A big thank you to everyone who responded to my post. I've had time to think, read, and respond. I cannot give my own shots. I used to but, somewhere along the line, I whimped out. I just can't. I even have a hard time stepping on a bug! I do believe giving my own shots was the best suggestion, but yours truly doesn't have the heart for it anymore. Words that echoed my own thoughts were... matter of time before being attacked, (The ONLY reason my horse stood was because he decided to. If the handler thought she was keeping him from going anywhere, she was deluded) . fight or flight train wreck etc, etc. Erick has never tried to kick or bite, but he sure has tried to run away. I would hate to see the aftermath of that if he got his own way. I started clicker training in the last month or so, and Erick loves it. (So does my mustang) Monday, I took Erick to the round pen and started clicker training him to "sharp" objects on his butt. I used my thumb nail to start. Every time I jabbed him, and he stood, I clicked and treated. (He stood EVERY time.) I went to a ball point pen thinking he needed something that looked like a syringe type item. It didn't bother him at all. I decided that he trusted me too much. My next move is to use a horse savvy neighbor down the road that he doesn't know very well. Maybe a combination of fake syringe and stranger will help. I'm not hoping to get a bad reaction out of him, but I would like to make sure it isn't the needle causing the panic. Thank you to the person who suggested clicker training. It was way in the back of my mind. I'm glad you mentioned it. I am dreading the "talk with the Vet". When I set up the appointment for the booster shots, I am going to discuss approach, safety, the horse's fear, etc. I will also let her know that she needs to take way more time with the horse, and I will pay a double barn call fee if need be. If she is trying to fit too many appointments into a day, and will not take the time, I will have to find another Vet. (Actually, I'm already looking in case it comes to that.) Thank you again for your help and advice. (My horse thanks you too.) Toni Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw Classified Ads: http://tinyurl.com/5b5g2f
Proper Vet Manners (a little long, but I need your help)
This message is from: "Big Horn Forge Daniel Nauman" I need your help ! Yesterday, my Vet came out to give the horses and dogs their spring shots. The last few years she has had a "handler" with her on all her calls. I realize, from my Vet's point of view, that the handler is there to help keep her safe; and that most owners, while meaning well, can be a big hinderance. If I were a Vet, I would be on Red Alert at all times when it came to safety. So, with that said, I need your advice. My 9yo Fjord started acting up about two years ago for his shots. I believe it was the first time the handler held my horse. I asked the Vet if I could "hold" him for her and she basically said "no", she now had a handler for that. (I know she has been injured because of well meaning owners.) The handler is rather pushy (my opinion). I became a passive observer, and more than a little irritated at how my horse was handled. I suggested that the handler (a woman also) not hold his head so tight. The horse was afraid, and I could tell, was ready to "get out of Dodge". He tolerated the handling and stood very stiff. Any suggestions I had fell on "deaf ears". Last year the handler "remembered" that my horse was "hard to hold" and put a chain over his nose. Things got worse. My fjord pushed past both of them and ran out into the pasture. When he saw me, he ran up to me. I collected him and returned him to the barn alley. My Vet and handler decided to give the shots in his stall, and had to use quite a bit of pressure. I protested once more and got a look that said "don't to go there". Yesterday, the Vet and handler immediately put a chain over my horse's nose, pushed him up against the back wall of his stall, and went right for his rump. I thought my horse's eyes were going to jump out of his head. (I had visions of a "B" movie drug bust.) BIG protest on my part. I was told that the handler was there to keep my Vet safe and was just doing her job. I went into the stall, picked up on the lead rope, asked my horse for his shoulder over, and reluctantly and fearfully got it. It lasted little longer than 2 seconds. I was hoping to build on that, but that would take time, and time is what my Vet evidently didn't have. The coggins test was last. My horse stood like a gentleman, very relaxed, head lowered. He didn't seem to mind at all. The Vet was really surprised, and mentioned the behavior. After the whole ordeal, while my Vet was packing up, I asked her if their was anything I could do to help with this situation. I explained that I wanted my horse to stand on a loose lead while getting his shots. (Like in the past) My Vet said try feeding grain while he is getting vaccinated. My heart sank. I truly believe that the shots are not the issue. The handling is so rough and scares my horse so much, that pretty soon, no one will be able to get near him with a needle. I have used this Vet for 18 years, and have not had these problems in the past. Switching Vets is not really an option because of where I live. I really want to retain this Vet, and mend any problems. If anyone has any experience or advice for me on what I can do from a training point of view, or a Vet's point of view, I would love to hear it. I have decided to work with the horse and talk to my Vet about working with me when she comes to give the boosters. I'm hoping we can cooperate with each other for everyone's benefit. If my needs are ignored, I will have to find a different Vet. But, there aren't many available, and I don't want to go from one problem to another. I won't even get into talking about the other horse or the dogs. Thanks for any help you may be able to give, Toni (and Erick, her Fjord, who thinks the Vet is out to kill him) :( Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw Classified Ads: http://tinyurl.com/5b5g2f
PNH Level 1
This message is from: "Big Horn Forge Daniel Nauman" Rachel, Thanks for allowing us to view your on line PNH Level 1 video. It was fun to watch. (At least your horse wasn't afraid of the tarp!) Although I know what you're doing in the video, a commentary on the requirements for level one and how you accomplished that would be welcome. Please remember to let us know how you did. Thanks, Toni > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HbBU1p6lpGA Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw Classified Ads: http://tinyurl.com/5b5g2f
Re: Standing Still Training
This message is from: "Big Horn Forge Daniel Nauman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Phil's advice was superb, and well said. I have used this same method on all my horses. (Not all of them Fjords.) However; I had the same "problem" (opportunity) with my horse not wanting to stand tied when I wasn't there. I have a HUGE tree in my front yard. (My whole property is a potential training playground.) I tied my mare to the tree with enough float in the line so she wouldn't feel trapped, and went and weeded the garden. I did this for at least an hour each day, moving in and out of sight for longer periods. She was miffed at first, but could see me a distance away. She would pace back and forth on her line for a while, but eventually she became more and more content to just stand and watch traffic go by. Please understand, I'm talking about a horse who already ties, not about teaching a horse to tie. She always ground tied well, but there are times a horse needs to be tied while it's owner is not directly at it's side. It was nice and slow and gradual, and she fell into it real nice. Also, I got the garden weeded. Try to find a chore around the barn you can do where you have to disappear for a second or two at a time. Gradually build up your time away. Catch him standing nicely and reward him with a pet or a "good boy". You get the idea. Good luck. Sounds like you have a nice horse there. Toni in Wisconsin Kate Wrote: It's when I tie him and walk away that he seems to have difficulty. I suspect this is an issue of needing to increase his tolerance level. Good lord, I've created a co-dependency issue with my horse where we can't stand to be away from each otheryou'd think I'd have learned better after doing it with my kids The FjordHorse List archives can be found at: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw
Re: Question for the list
This message is from: "Big Horn Forge Daniel Nauman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Patti Jo, First, I am not a Vet OR a Doctor, but I just read of this same condition in a person. Believe it or not, it was constipation! The diarrhea was an overflow (around the hard stool in the intestine). The person was put on laxatives until the stool was passed. (About a week) A lot of water had to be consumed also. Bowel movements returned to normal after that. Have a Vet thoroughly examine this horse before doing anything. The hard spot on his left side gives me pause. Sounds like an impaction. We've all had our bouts with colic. Please let us all know what the ailment was, and how the horse is doing. Good Luck. Toni The FjordHorse List archives can be found at: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw
Re: fjordhorse-digest V2007 #221
This message is from: "Big Horn Forge Daniel Nauman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Robin wrote: > First off I would just like to introduce myself as a newly enlisted > member of the digest. My name is Robin Holland, I am attending > Murray State University in Murray Kentucky, and currently own a colt > named Holden, and show a family owned 8 year old gelding named Pines > Edge Ivan. Robin, My husband and I own Pines Edge Erick; a year younger than PE Ivan (I think). When we looked at Fjords, we considered Ivan, but then chose Erick. We love him! He is so quiet it's sometimes hard to tell what's going on in that head of his. So much different than the Thoroughbreds and Arabs I'm used to. I also have a mustang that is very curious, relaxed, and full of fun. They play together constantly. FUN, FUN, FUN Toni and Dan ___ This message was scanned and certified Virus Free by Alexssa | HNet. www.alexssa.net www.hnet.net www.neverlosedata.com The FjordHorse List archives can be found at: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw
Re: Steel Toed Shoes
This message is from: "Big Horn Forge Daniel Nauman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> DeeAnna Wrote: I have not been able to find any eye-witness report of a specific accident where any horse, draft or otherwise, has crushed the steel toe of a safety shoe. Can anyone point me to a reliable report of a real incident, so I can banish my skepticism? I hardly ever post, but I feel moved to join this discussion. I remember when I lived in Seattle. I loved the place; still think about it after 25 years of living in Wisconsin. Anyway, I remember spending as much time at the fishing docks as I could. I had a friend that fished for halibut in Alaska. I told her she was crazy after hearing all her adventures. She said that at least she wasn't a "crabber". Crab fisherman get their toes crushed if they're in it for any length of time, because the huge cages they use sometimes drop. I asked her why they didn't wear steel toed shoes, and she said that then their toes would be cut off! Don't know if she meant that literally, but I didn't labor the point. I got the idea and have never worn steel toed shoes around my horses. Just a safety factor for me. I know a crab cage (even empty) is a "tad" heavier than my fjord, but I won't take the chance. I've had the small toe on my right foot broken three times by being stepped on. After a while, I learned to keep my feet out from under my horse's feet :) (I'm a slow learner.) Anyway, the better I got at handling horses, the less I got stepped on, pushed into, head butted, etc, etc. Reading a horse's body language is second nature now, and I haven't had a major incident in a number of years. I'm ALWAYS alert and very cautious, and I wear a good, sturdy, waterproof pair of leather boots that fit well. Toni ___ This message was scanned and certified Virus Free by Alexssa | HNet. www.alexssa.net www.hnet.net www.neverlosedata.com The FjordHorse List archives can be found at: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw
Re: Popular Trainers
This message is from: "Big Horn Forge Daniel Nauman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hello, I haven't posted in quite a while, but I have to join the training conversation. I like attending as many clinics as I can afford, by as many different trainers as possible. I have my favorites and also a "list" of people I wouldn't waste my time on ever again. I have the great good fortune to have had access to horses most of my life, and have "ridden" before I could walk. One develops good core strength this way. I also have been trained in classic riding skills. These have kept me in good stead through the years. I have obseved that most of the trainers out there are HORSE Trainers, not riding instructors. All that said, if you want good riding instruction, go to a Julie Goodnight Clinic. She teaches classic riding skills using NH methods. I took a 3 day clinic from her a couple years back and BOY did it ever help with seat, balance and rythm. She is clear in her instruction and deals very well with those who may be a little timid or - out right scared. She split our group into two sections, and the timid riders got instruction tailored to their needs. She was a hit. Those people afraid to canter (or whatever) were confident and challenging themselves at the end of the clinic. I can't say enough good things about her. As far as training horses; John Lyons (and I'm sure many others) says that you are ALWAYS training your horse. After attending so many clinics, and observing the everyday person (including myself) working with horses, I am convinced of that statement. I am very careful what I "keep" and what I "throw away". In the end, if you have a HAPPY, responsive, couragous horse, you must be doing something right. I'm happy to see this line of conversation. So many people I know don't believe NH works, even though they see (and comment) that it does when they see how respectful my horses are. Love the list even though I lurk most of the time. Toni in WIsconsin ___ This message was scanned and certified Virus Free by Alexssa | HNet. www.alexssa.net www.hnet.net www.neverlosedata.com The FjordHorse List archives can be found at: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw
