Re: Fjord Research
This message is from: Heather Baskey Submitted the completed survey, tonight. Heather Baskey Rockwood, ON Canada __ Get the name you've always wanted @ymail.com or @rocketmail.com! Go to http://ca.promos.yahoo.com/jacko/ Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw Classified Ads: http://tinyurl.com/5b5g2f
Fjord Research
This message is from: "robin.holl...@murraystate.edu" Dear Fjord Horse Digest Some time has passed since my last post and our research on white markings in the Fjord is progressing. I would like to once again ask for the Fjord Horse Community’s help. Please fill out a survey for any and all Fjord horses that you know of. It doesn’t matter if you know 1 horse or 100, ANY information is beneficial to our research. Remember, the survey may be obtained from our website : www.murraystate.edu/fjord_horse on the link “survey”. Our website also includes information about our research and genetics. If you need us to send you copies of the survey by mail, please contact us and we will do so. Once again, any and all information is appreciated and is very helpful to our research. I would like to clarify on one point: submitting a survey on a horse that does NOT have white is just as important as submitting a survey on a horse that DOES have white. We need to have confirmations from as many Fjord owners, breeders, trainers and any other affiliates as possible. Please do not feel that your contribution would not be helpful, for I promise you that every single survey helps immensely. It is very important that we know for sure that a Fjord does not have white, as well if a Fjord has white, so please, fill out and send a survey to us on as many Fjords that you know of. If you remember seeing a Fjord that had a marking and you cannot remember exactly the shape, that is perfectly fine. Just make a note on the survey that you know the horse has a white markings, you just do not know precisely the exact shape. By receiving multiple surveys from many different people, our confidence in the Fjord having or not having white strengthens. We are conducting this research not only to learn more about equine genetics, but also as a service to the Fjord community. In order for us to present to you the best results possible, we must first have information from you. Our results will be given to the Fjord Horse community so that it may be an educational tool for breeders, and even a study to apply the methods to other aspects of the Fjord. If you have any questions, comments, or concerns, please feel free to contact either myself (robin.holl...@murraystate.edu) or the professor I am working with (everett.we...@murraystate.edu) and we will be more than happy to help you out in any way possible. Thank you for all of your help! Robin L Holland 8510 Springer Hall Murray KY 42071 Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw Classified Ads: http://tinyurl.com/5b5g2f
Fjord Research
This message is from: "robin.holl...@murraystate.edu" Ruthie What a wonderful post! Thank you so much for your knowledge on this subject! I would like to clarify the purpose of our research. Upon completion of our study, say we determine that there is one stallion, Stallion X, that started white markings (hypothetically). We are NOT going to tell the Fjord community to castrate all stallions and spay all mares with Stallion X in their ancestry. This study is by no means saying white markings are a negative trait that should be completely eradicated from the Fjord breed. Ruthie did an excellent job of explaining the effects on a breed if this was done. This study is purely for KNOWLEDGE. We want to inform the Fjord community as to how these traits are inherited, so that if an owner so chooses to breed a Fjord that has white, they would know the possibilities of what the foal would look like/the genes they would carry. We want to inform the Fjord community of our methods, so if there is an individual who has a great interest in another trait, whether it be cosmetic, or a genetic disease, they may use our study, modify our methods and create their own study to enhance the knowledge the Fjord community has on breeding practices and the genetics of the Fjord. Once again, this is purely for research and knowledge. Thanks again for these wonderful discussions! Robin L Holland 8510 Springer Hall Murray KY 42071 815/858-4042 Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw Classified Ads: http://tinyurl.com/5b5g2f
Fjord Research Questions Response
This message is from: "robin.holl...@murraystate.edu" Dear Lisa For your red colt, you can go ahead and submit a survey on the pink skin on his penis. Being that it is on an area that many owners of male horses would tend not to examine unless the markings were quite substantial, we are not focusing our research on that part of the body. We felt it might be asking too much of owners to fully examine their male horse to determine if they had pink skin. White markings on the head, legs, or other parts of the body are more easily noticed and better recorded by owners. If you have a horse that you have noticed the white skin, you may fill out a survey and we will make an account of it. Dear Jean You bring up a very interesting point about the cloned foals having different white markings. Yes, being that the two foals are clones they have identical genetic make-up, however, there is a developmental factor in the markings. When mammalian embryos are developing, pigmentation actually begins near the base of the neck on the back and radiates outward. This helps to explain why we see white markings on the legs on the lowermost portion, and moving upward. Unless you have a color breed of horse, you do not see white knees, or white elbows, or white hocks in spots, you see white hooves with the amount of white moving upward. The genes of the clones may indicate that they have a white blaze, but depending on the environment as they are developing, will determine the actual shape, even with identical twins. One foal might be closer to the uterine wall resulting in a temperature stimulus, or bump his head, or have better nutrient availability, and so forth. It is virtually impossible to have all environmental factors be equal in order to result in identical markings. Now, can the environmental factors be so great as to completely remove a trait such as a white marking? I honestly do not know, however, I do know that an individual can have the genetic makeup for a trait, and not express the trait phenotypically, this is called incomplete penetrance and is what we currently see is occurring in the Fjord with the inheritance of white markings. Thank you both very much for your interesting discussions! Any more questions, comments or concerns please feel free to contact us! And remember to visit our website at http://www.murraystate.edu/fjord_horse/ for complete information about this study! Thanks again! Robin L Holland robin.holl...@murraystate.edu 8510 Springer Hall Murray KY 42071 815/858-4042 Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw Classified Ads: http://tinyurl.com/5b5g2f
Fjord Research Questions Response
This message is from: "robin.holl...@murraystate.edu" Dear Kathy and Willi I honestly have no opinion in whether or not white markings are desirable, I see them as purely a trait that some horses have and I am interested in how they are inherited. I do realize, from conversations with other individuals (in the Fjord community and other equine breed associations) that opinions do arise regarding white markings. I just want to cover all bases, and in case individuals are worried about the trait, I want everyone to know that we respect everyone’s opinions, we realize this may be a sensitive issue for some, and we will do everything to make sure that our data collected and results are as reasonable and correct as possible. Dear Bonnie “Are you referring to white markings with pink skin only?” This is an excellent question, and is one that we have been discussing for quite some time. It might be thought that if a horse has white hair, it also has pink skin, however, we know this is not always the case. At this point of our study, when we refer to white markings, we are not specifying that there must also be pink skin. The main reason we chose this route for the beginning stages of our research is for data collection. We felt it might be asking much more of individuals who have horses with white to determine whether or not they have pink skin. This might sound fairly simple, but if you have a Fjord with a smaller white marking, it becomes more difficult and it is sometimes hard to tell. This issue will definitely be addressed in the later stages of our study, but as of now, please submit a survey for any horse, even if they have white without pink skin (make a note on the survey if this is the case). “As all Fjords have white hairs. Are there certain areas of the body that would be excluded?” I would have to say that no areas of the body are excluded. If the white hairs are near 100% characteristic of the breed, for example having white in the mane/forelock/tail, and some have lighter hairs on the lower leg, then those hairs do not need to be reported. If your horse has white hairs that you do not believe are a “white marking”, go ahead and fill out a survey, describing the hairs in detail, and if you believe you know what they are from. For example, you might have a horse that has white on his neck from a reaction to an injection, or white on their head from old age, or on their back from a saddle/harness not fitting right, or even from an injury. We realize that white hairs arise from a variety of means, and if you submit a survey saying your horse has white hairs on his shoulder, we’re not going to automatically define a new type of marking if all other evidence supports the marking resulting from an injection, injury, wear, age, etc. So if the white hairs are typical of the Fjord (mane, forelock, tail) those do not have to be submitted, but if you have a horse with white hairs on another location, go ahead and submit it, more information is always better than less information in our research. “How much area or hairs counts as a white marking?” It’s hard to define exactly a “white marking”, therefore, for our research, if you see any white hairs/markings, go ahead and submit a survey, just write a description on the markings/hairs and what you believe they might be the result of. “If colored hairs and white hairs are mixed does that count?” Once again, another excellent question. If you look at different breeds of horses that have large white markings over their body, you might notice that between the areas of white and color there is a small “blended” area. I did speak to a molecular biologist professor here at Murray State a while back about areas of depigmentation, and one explanation he offered was a sort of progression of the markings throughout a lineage. Once again, this was a while back and I do not remember exactly the detail s of the inheritance or origination on the cellular scale of these areas. I would say that if the colored hairs and the white hairs are mixed, it would count for this part of our study. Once again, go ahead and submit a survey with a description of the markings. If we receive surveys saying that a Fjord has a few white hairs and the owner is unsure about where they came from, or if they have an area where white hairs and colored hairs are mixed without a solid white area, we will mark them on our pedigree, but we will not compare them directly with individuals who have conclusive white stars, blazes, socks etc. If it comes to a point that it is key for us to know exactly what type of marking an individual has (that has a white hairs/colored hairs combination), we will contact the owner/breeder for more information. I would like to say thank you all so much for your questions, input, and help! This is all so wonderful for the progression of our research! If you have any questions, comments, or concerns, please contact us and we will be more than happy to help! Remember
Fjord Research
This message is from: "robin.holl...@murraystate.edu" Dear Lisa Besides from personal experience/observation, I would say it is difficult to conclude if a bloodline is completely absent of white markings; for, as is the purpose of our survey, there are Fjords that are not recorded as having white and some that are not registered for various reasons. In response to your question, I do not know of any bloodlines off hand that do not have white at all. As Gail brought up, we currently see that white markings are inherited as a dominant trait with incomplete penetrance (explained in our website). And I must emphasize this, that this was based off of the CURRENT data. We realize that there are Fjords with/without white that are not recorded or registered, and with more complete data, our results may very well change, to being a simple dominant, recessive, or another mode of inheritance. This is where the surveys come in. By people in the Fjord community submitting surveys on Fjords that they know of confirming their markings, we will have a much higher confidence in the inheritance pattern of white markings, and we will hopefully then be able to determine the originating ancestors. As Gail also mentioned, we might be able to determine which bloodlines carry certain traits. Maybe markings on the head began in one bloodline and markings on the legs in another. Maybe one lineage is more likely to have blazes while another has stars. Maybe it is possible that different markings are inherited in different methods. These are all questions that have the possibility of being answered, but we must begin with accurate data. When this study is completed, not only will we have a knowledge of white markings, but our methods may very well be made applicable to other traits in the Fjord that owners/breeders are interested in studying. Perhaps you are interested in why some Fjords have darker leg markings, or thicker manes, or are of a draft type while others are of a lighter type, or why some are better at driving while others are better at riding. This is why science is so much fun, you have a question or an idea, and you can find a way to reach the solution, and sometimes, you discover new things along the way that you were not expecting. So I highly encourage all of you, to please complete a survey on horses that you know, and participate in this study, and hopefully, when this is complete, we’ll all have a deeper understanding of this wonderful breed of horse and the doors will be opened to a vast array of ideas and questions that we will all be eager to learn more about. Thank you guys for all of your help! If you have any questions, comments or concerns about this project, please feel free to contact us! Remember our website is http://www.murraystate.edu/fjord_horse/. Robin L Holland robin.holl...@murraystate.edu 8510 Springer Hall Murray KY 42071 815/858-4042 Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw Classified Ads: http://tinyurl.com/5b5g2f
Fjord Research Receives Grant from Murray State University
This message is from: "robin.holl...@murraystate.edu" Dear Fjord Digest A little over a month ago I wrote a post regarding a research study that I am conducting on the inheritance of white markings in the Norwegian Fjord. In the post I mentioned that we submitted a grant proposal to Murray State University and were awaiting results. This post is to inform the Fjord community that we have officially received funding from the Murray State University Undergraduate Research and Scholarly Activities (URSA) office for our research on the Fjord. Upon review of our proposal, professors from the University had some remarks, those of which I would like to address with the Fjord community. The largest concern was data collection. Many reviewers were concerned with the quality and quantity of data to be obtained through the surveys, being that this is a sensitive issue for owners, breeders, and/or trainers. Therefore, I would like to reemphasize a few points in regards to the surveys. Please fill out a survey for as many Fjords that you know of and can be confident of in their markings. It is not a requirement that you have owned the horse. If there is a Fjord that is owned by a friend, neighbor, family member, or another individual, you can submit a survey for that horse. It is beneficial to our study that we have multiple surveys on one horse. If we are looking through a pedigree, and we see that a horse (who was not documented as having white) has five surveys all saying that he has a small white star, then we have very high confidence that the individual has white, which is extremely important in analyzing the pedigrees. If you know of a horse that has white that you have not seen in a while and are unsure about the exact size and/or location, go ahead a complete a survey, and make a note explaining the situation. Also remember, that thorough documentation of a Fjord NOT having white is equally important in knowing that a horse has white. True, the study is on the inheritance of white markings, but we must know with as high of confidence as possible that a horse does not have white to see the overall inheritance pattern. And finally, remember that these surveys will NOT be made public. If you submit a survey on a horse that you have not owned, we will NOT contact the owner informing them that you have done so. All surveys will remain completely confidential. As we collect them, we will compare and analyze the data. Some individuals might worry about a dishonesty issue (someone possibly submitting a survey saying your Fjord has white when they do not), whether it was simply on accident or not. We realize that accidents happen, and therefore we will analyze ALL the data collected and take into account all possibilities. For example, if we receive five surveys saying a Fjord has white and one saying he does not, then we will look closer for any additional variations and possibly contact the individuals who submitted the survey for a follow up discussion on the horse. Once again, the more surveys we receive, the more confidence we will have that our results are as accurate as possible. Surveys may be obtained from our website at: http://www.murraystate.edu/fjord_horse/ under "Survey Form". You may print out the form, complete it, and send it to us by: Mailing it to: Fjord Study Department of Biology Murray State University Murray, KY 42071 Faxing it to: 270-809-2788 Or if you have a scanner, you can scan it as an image/document, and email it to: everett.we...@murraystate.edu We are currently looking into having an online submission form, either through Google Documents, or possibly on our website. We honestly and truly appreciate any information you can provide us with. If you have ANY questions, comments or concerns, please feel free to contact either myself (robin.holl...@murraystate.edu) or Dr. Everett Weber (everett.we...@murraystate.edu) and we will be more than happy to help in any way possible. Thank you! Robin L Holland 8510 Springer Hall Murray KY 42071 815/858-4042 Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw Classified Ads: http://tinyurl.com/5b5g2f
