Re: help please re: pasture
This message is from: katesei...@aol.com My gelding is relatively flat soled, even after being barefoot for 4 years. Great big round feet, fabulous shape, but just not nicely concave. He is fine in most places, but on rocky gravel will still mince. And my mare who has rock hard feet will also mince on gravel. They just don't like it. Kate with Della and Joe ** In a message dated 4/16/2009 12:41:45 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, mcdic...@hotmail.com writes: He has never exhibited lameness but he is flat soled and tender at times. He lives in a "paddock paradise environment" this is 20 foot wide gravel and mud track with access to pasture am and pm. I am concerned because he does get a cresty neck **Great deals on Dellâs most popular laptops â Starting at $479 (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1220029082x1201385915/aol?redir=http :%2F%2Fad.doubleclick.net%2Fclk%3B213969145%3B35701480%3Bh) Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw Classified Ads: http://tinyurl.com/5b5g2f
Re: help please
This message is from: "Reena Giola" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I am not on the digest, but I too, sometimes have to scroll through a ton of the email only to find way at the bottom, the reply. It is easier to read a reply to an email (such as I am doing here) if you put it at the TOP of the message with the original below Reena in AZ Gustav (who has been body clipped twice and now has a trace clip) This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] can we all quote just enough to clarify what we are referring to, when we reply. i just scrolled through many repetitions and answers just to get to a one line response to the initial post The FjordHorse List archives can be found at: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw
Re: Help Please - Bad Farrier? Bad Trim? Emergency?
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 12/3/01 10:58:45 AM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: << I think I must take a stronger role even tho we do not have that much choice in farriers. >> Hi Jean- I think you said it all here. We must remember that despite the education, experience, etc., of the professionals, WE are the owners and we know our horses best. I can't count the times I've read on this list of someone "suspecting" their horse had a physical problem which was undetected by vet or farrier. Later, the problem made itself quite evident. I'm not trashing vets or farriers ... they have their work cut out for them, and most do their best, but for them it's a business. Your horse is one of many. As a professional pet sitter, I have to be open minded to the many ways folks care for their animals. I can't impose my ideas on them. If they ask for advice, I give it. Otherwise I do what they tell me (within reason of course)! Farriers should do the same, and accept without offense the "stronger role" the owner plays. Brigid M Wasson San Francisco Bay Area, CA http://ourfjords.freeservers.com/fjord1/Our_Fjordsx.html";>Our http://ourfjords.freeservers.com/fjord1/Our_Fjordsx.html";>Fjords / )__~ /L /L
Re: Help Please - Bad Farrier? Bad Trim? Emergency?
This message is from: "Jean Gayle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Brigid, I have had very difficult problems with a most reliable farrier who began to make mistakes. I now have a new one who did very well with my huge warm blood gelding but then this last time trimmed my warmblood mare like a quarter horse. She was lame all over for five days and $360 later. Vet. I can only figure that after doing the 17+ the other horses appear smaller? I mentioned to him that I liked her to have large feet but he did not do as I asked. I think I must take a stronger role even tho we do not have that much choice in farriers. Luckily the "friendlier one" Gunnar, is done well each time. Jean Walters Gayle [Authoress of "The Colonel's Daughter" Occupied Germany 1946 To 1949 ] http://users.techline.com/jgayle Send $20 Three Horses Press PO Box 104 Montesano, WA 98563
Re: Help Please - Bad Farrier? Bad Trim? Emergency?
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 12/2/01 5:44:11 PM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: << There is a lot of controversy about the Strasser method. >> Hi Jean- I enjoyed your post, and am glad you have a good farrier! We are not Strasser (or any other professional's) devotees. Rather, we take what works from each system (of hoof care, training, or whatever). However we often recommend Dr. Strasser's books because they are the most informative, easy to read and based on exhaustive scientific study rather than just theory. Also good reads are Jaime Jackson's two books on hoof care and natural life style for horses. As far as the actual trim ... each horse is such an individual that what is done must be decided by the owner and farrier. There is no one way to do it. It is often a case of trial-and-error. We have 3 Fjords, and they all have TOTALLY different feet. Different size, shape, wear pattern. Whoever is being ridden/exercised more will tend to have tougher hooves and need less trimming. The best part of keeping our horses barefoot and doing the trims myself is an increased awareness. Never before did I notice all the nuances of the hooves: the angles, measurements, textures, color... It's fascinating. Brigid M Wasson San Francisco Bay Area, CA http://ourfjords.freeservers.com/fjord1/Our_Fjordsx.html";>Our http://ourfjords.freeservers.com/fjord1/Our_Fjordsx.html";>Fjords / )__~ /L /L
Re: Help Please - Bad Farrier? Bad Trim? Emergency?
This message is from: GAIL RUSSELL <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Some of the sites Jean sent are really good and make sense about barefoot horses. I also found some that discussed whether sole and frog should be taken out ...generally the answer seems to be NO. I REALLY want to learn how to recognize good and bad farriery. Probably will take the course at the local junior college this spring. In the meantime...my update. The horse seems better. Still rainy and wet here. I could put iodine on him, but it seems to me there is no way to dry him out when everything, even the well-drained areas, is wet. Farrier called today and said the problem was probably that he trimmed too much frog off. From what I can tell, the only reason to trim frog is if there are stray pieces that make it impossible to clean the hooves. Anyway...was going to interview a new farrier today...but his barn is flooding from the BIG rains here. Perhaps next week. > >My farrier is VERY careful about not trimming too short, especially a horse >that will go barefoot. >Trimming them might have caused bruising of the sole due to the hard frozen >ground. He also will not take much sole out. Gail Russell Forestville CA [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Help Please - Bad Farrier? Bad Trim? Emergency?
This message is from: Jean Ernest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Jack, There is a lot of controversy about the Strasser method. Check out the discussion on the Equine Studies Institute (Deb Bennett) website. (Hurry, they're going to scrub these messages and start over so they may not be available for long.) http://www.equinestudies.org/disc_toc.htm Under the heading "Finally an answer about windpuffs": BIG long heated discussion, arguments on both sides about the Strasser natural Hoof idea..some links: "At the risk of stirring up the Brigade of Strasserite Devotees, please review the following information: http://web.cetlink.net/~farrier/fads.htm http://www.cpb.uokhsc.edu/ojvr/hoof99b.htm http://www.horseshoes.com/advice/balancingnormalfoot/balancingnormalfoot.htm I have two of my Fjords shod with winter shoes and rim snow pads and two unshod. The two unshod ones may never have to have shoes, but if I rode them much in winter on the ice I would want to put borium winter shoes and snow pads on for safety. My farrier is VERY careful about not trimming too short, especially a horse that will go barefoot. He refused to trim my two mares who don't have shoes, even tho their feet were a bit long, as the ground is so frozen and hard with very little snow and the weather was due to turn very cold. Trimming them might have caused bruising of the sole due to the hard frozen ground. He also will not take much sole out. I have never had a lame horse due to shoeing or trimming in 14 years with this farrier. BTW he is very apposed to the Strasser method, having had to correct a lot of problems caused by application or perhaps misapplication of this method. I am not saying the Strasser method is wrong..just it is not the answer for every horse. Do your research and make up your own mind, but don't accept any method blindly. Jean in Fairbanks, Alaska, clear and VERY cold, -30F this morning with only 4 1/2 hours daylight! Hooves don't grow much in the winter here! >Hi there, >I totally agree with the above suggestion. Someone once told me that >horses hoofs are four hearts on the ground. After much research on the >subject, I am more than inclined to agree. It's strange that so many know so >much about our beloved horses, but, know little about the importance of the >hoof. I strongly recommend that you purchase the book (only 182 pages) "A >lifetime of Soundness" by Hiltrud Strasser. Jean Ernest Fairbanks, Alaska mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Help Please - Bad Farrier? Bad Trim? Emergency?
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 11/30/01 1:39:07 PM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: << I wanted to add something to what everyone has said about the sore feet. Do you know how to check and see if there is a strong pulse going to the feet? A short trim job can founder a horse, and bute or banamine plus corrective shoeing might be needed immediately. If you wanted to feel safe, maybe a call to the vet is not a bad idea. Also, the vet could tell you if the horse is trimmed too short. >> Hi there, I totally agree with the above suggestion. Someone once told me that horses hoofs are four hearts on the ground. After much research on the subject, I am more than inclined to agree. It's strange that so many know so much about our beloved horses, but, know little about the importance of the hoof. I strongly recommend that you purchase the book (only 182 pages) "A lifetime of Soundness" by Hiltrud Strasser. It is filled with valuable information about the hoof. You can only get it through the web at: www.star-ridge.com .. She has also written another 127 page book entitled "Shoeing: A necessary Evil?" If you are not into "bare foot," these books are still a vital tool to enlighten you to the importance of the hoof. I hope you have a vet look at your horse, (and the Farrier should pay in my own opinion) or you could have a lame horse on your hands. Please let us know what comes of all this. Thank you for listening. Jack
Re: Help Please - Bad Farrier? Bad Trim? Emergency?
This message is from: GAIL RUSSELL <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Thank you all for your kind responses to my post. Karen...you may be right...he might just be a tenderfoot. We will see. I was also concerned about founder...see below. > >I wanted to add something to what everyone has said about the sore feet. Do >you know how to check and see if there is a strong pulse going to the feet? No...and I should learn. We called the vet who was on call...no response. (Turns out their answering service had a new employee). I called my previous farrier, who said he thought it was probably OK, but to call the vet right away. (He confirmed that there is a danger of founder...which was what I was worried about.) In the end, no one saw him (the horse) and he is slightly better today, so I think he will be OK. Whether he ever gets accustomed to going without shoes is another question. My farrier did say that he remembered him as having good feet...did not see why he would have trouble without shoes. As to my current farrierhe claims he took very little off him. Hmmwhen we looked at his soles...they were yellowish/white. Absolutely clean looking. Now I know it has rained the last few days...but seems to me his soles should not be absolutely uniformly light colored if they were not trimmed significantly. And I looked at some of the scraps he took off...looked about 1/4 inch plus to me...and this was at a seven week trim. His feet looked absolutely flat...no rim where the horn is to speak of. So...after conferring with my farrier's (and his wife...who knows my current farrier) ...she and I decided to try to get a new farrier. This farrier does not have a forge, takes less time to shoe than the old one (who had a forge) and the horse's feet are looking slightly less round...more upright. Hmm...could he be shoeing them too tight? I have been so busy I have been unable to check over the shoeing jobs (FINALLY FINISHED MY BIG PROJECT YESTERDAY...TIME FOR THE HORSES!!!) but, when I have checked, I have seen no room for expansion. Upshot of all this...if anyone knows of a good farrier in Sonoma County area who might take a new client with several horses, some of whom stay shod year round, and whose horses are absolute angels, and whose checks (mine, not the horse's) have not yet bounced...let me know. I am going to do my best sales pitch on the oldtimers my farrier recommends and work up from there. Gail Gail Russell Forestville CA [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Help Please - Bad Farrier? Bad Trim? Emergency?
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] I wanted to add something to what everyone has said about the sore feet. Do you know how to check and see if there is a strong pulse going to the feet? A short trim job can founder a horse, and bute or banamine plus corrective shoeing might be needed immediately. If you wanted to feel safe, maybe a call to the vet is not a bad idea. Also, the vet could tell you if the horse is trimmed too short.
Re: Help Please - Bad Farrier? Bad Trim? Emergency?
This message is from: "Karen McCarthy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Gail, some horses ARE naturally tenderfooted. There are so many degrees of normal. If he's had shoes on since before you can remember, then yes, very often it is like the "princess and the pea" syndrome, and he will feel everything underfoot for awhile, and it should dissapate, but maybe never really go away, due to either the conditioning of wearing shoes all his life, and/or a pre-disposition to ouchy feet (inherieted). Most horses w/ thin soles are this way. If your farrier did take out sole, then you are justified in being a little steamed over a bad trim job, he should know better; either way give the poor guy some bute, wait a couple of days, then just call & discuss w/ your vet - maybe shoes are warrented 12 months a year...Good luck! Kmac ...who's S.O. Dave, is a farrier. Guess who's horsies are the last ones shod??! 3 guesses and the first 2 don't count... _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp
Re: Help Please - Bad Farrier? Bad Trim? Emergency?
This message is from: "Jean Gayle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Gail, I have had this short trimming recently to where it was absolutely cruel..It took my big boy three months to recover. You need to contact the Vet and get banamine going to help them through until they develop enough hoof to stand on. They are on their soles and can bruise them badly. It they are shod it may not be so bad but they need pain meds. Why Farriers do this is beyond me. It is pure agony for the horse and certainly was for my pocket book. Jean Jean Walters Gayle [Authoress of "The Colonel's Daughter" Occupied Germany 1946 To 1949 ] http://users.techline.com/jgayle Send $20 PO Box 104 Montesano, Wa 98563
Re: Help Please - Bad Farrier? Bad Trim? Emergency?
This message is from: Jon & Mary Ofjord <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Gail, Sounds like bruising, but don't know the cause. It doesn't sound like a veterinary emergency, but I would call your vet as soon as he/she gets back. Jon At 07:27 PM 11/29/01 -0500, you wrote: >This message is from: GAIL RUSSELL <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >At 02:11 PM 11/29/2001 -0600, you wrote: >>This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >>Gail Russel wrote: >>...My bad fortune may be your good fortune. > >Well folks, I do not know if this is really because my new farrier is not >doing a good job, or just coincidence, but our horse on whom we had the >shoes pulled and feet trimmed yesterday is now four-footed foot sore. Moves >very gingerly. Backs might even be worse than the fronts. Our soil is wet, >fine sandy loam...nothing that should hurt his soles. We purchased this >horse last spring and he has had shoes on the entire time we have had him. >I do know that this I noticed a pink line in the toe (horn area) of our big >percheron/tB cross the last time he was trimmed. > >My question...is this an emergency? My vet is out of town and I would >prefer not to deal with the particular vet who is on call. My vet will be >back tomorrow. > >Gail Russell >Forestville CA >[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >_ >The simple way to read all your emails at ThatWeb >http://www.thatweb.com
Re: Help, please.
This message is from: "Jean Gayle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Denise, there is a mini breeder just down the road from me . Jean Jean Gayle Aberdeen, WA [Authoress of "The Colonel's Daughter" Occupied Germany 1946 TO 1949 ] http://www.techline.com/~jgayle Barnes & Noble Book Stores
Re: Help, please.
This message is from: "Denise Delgado" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> larson, i know a mini breeder, but he does'nt go on line. do you have a phone number? denise
