[Flexradio] External reference

[David Hilton-Jones]

I would very much like to hear from anyone who has successfully used an 
external 10MHz oscillator and the Ext. clock kit modification - or anyone who 
has had problems doing so.

Thanks

David, G4YTL

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Re: [Flexradio] External ref problem (Peter)

[petervn]

David, 
 
I am allmost out of ideas now,
 
Look likes the DDS gets no reffrence when external is selected
 
What is (can be) different in both the situations
- signal level 
  ... should be OK (within spec, maybe check again, measure)
- the circuit around the jumpers 
  ... to be checked (how ???)
- the setting of the DDS 
  ... is unlikely (software and it works with the 200MHz)
- some bad contact or short on reassembly of the boardstack 
  ... unlikely (you assemled is a few times)
 
Someone on the list with better experience or other ideas?
 
groeten Peter
petervn-at-hetnet-nl  pa0pvn-at-hetnet-nl  pa0pvn-at-amsat-org
only large files:pa0pvn-at-gmail-com
There are 10 kind of people, those who understand binary and those who don't
 



Van: David Hilton-Jones [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Verzonden: do 11-10-2007 9:29
Aan: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Onderwerp: RE: External ref problem (Peter)



Thanks Peter

I have done all of that!!

The info about the modification is, as you say, on the Flex website.

I tried another 10MHz input at 7dbm, but no joy.

The transmitter also does not work, so I guess the problem is not getting 
anything out of the DDS.

I was too tire to play any more last night! Will try again at the weekend.

I will also post to see if I can find anyone who has made the conversion.

73 and thanks for your help

David

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10/10/07 23:12 
David, Sorry to hear that the problem persits,

The Board stack is not easy to measure on. also assembling
and disassembling must be done with care.

Find enclosed
- the procedure to make the external ref. input
- a spec of the xtal oscilator
- part of the DDS schematic, it is not verry clear but is readable.

--- headlines:
- solder the coax brade to Pin 7
- Solder the center conductor of the coax cable to Pin 8
- drive should be between 4dBm and 14dBm. Do not exceed 14dBm.
note the 50 ohm resitor connected over the input
--- most of it is or has been somewhere in the flex site, but I lost track 
of it

So that shoud be OK, maybe use 10dBm  to be sure

The input from the reference must have enough voltage.
Block and sinus must work.
I did not do it myself, but have the original modification parts in house
just in case.

Question: What does the transmitter do

If the DDS gets no reference or a to low reference it schould not
produce an output or at best a verry unstable one.

I hope this helps you

groeten Peter
petervn-at-hetnet-nl  pa0pvn-at-hetnet-nl  pa0pvn-at-amsat-org
only large files:pa0pvn-at-gmail-com
There are 10 kind of people, those who understand binary and those who don't




Van: David Hilton-Jones [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Verzonden: wo 10-10-2007 20:43
Aan: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Onderwerp: Peter



Peter

I have tried again feeding the SDR-100 with an external 10MHz signal and failed 
again

Have you done this yourself?

I am feeding a 10MHz 4dbm sine wave into pin 8, and the earth is connected to 
pin 7. I have moved the two jumpers to pins 23.

Is a sine wave OK = does it need to be square?

Any comments greatly appreciated.

73

David

PS One of the difficulties is that the boards are on top of each other and it 
is impossible to probe with a scope/meter/etc. And you can't really experiment 
without completely reassembling it!






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Re: [Flexradio] Do they *all* fit inside?

[Lee A Crocker]

The epsresso interface comes with the vapor phase cooled version of the F5K  
its called the F5K-T for tea kettle and comes with the 5KW solid state final.  
The box is a little bigger than the F5K-A  PowerSDR had to be modified to 
include a brew button and it resets the Temp cut out to precisely 160 deg the 
perfect temp to brew espresso.  (that ought to get Bob and Gerald chewing the 
rug)   In my PowerSDR contest interface I just have the espresso come out to an 
IV port and drip it straight into the blood stream the rate of espresso 
expression is inversely linked to the QSO rate, which acts as a throttle. (for 
Jim Lux's benefit)  

73  W9OY




  

Tonight's top picks. What will you watch tonight? Preview the hottest shows on 
Yahoo! TV.
http://tv.yahoo.com/ 


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Re: [Flexradio] RTTY Operation

[FireBrick]

I do a lot of contesting, cw  rtty varieties.
I don't use the click tuning but tune via Writelog which has a feature that 
utilized the mouse scroll wheel to fine tune.
The other utility is Sami's 'HotWheels' applet, that allows you to control 
the scroll/tune with a mouse wheel even if you do not apply 'Focus' to the 
PWSDR program.
In other words, you can have the mouse over Writelog, and fine tune a signal 
(adjust PWSDR frequency) with the mouse.
I rarely even put the mouse on the PWSDR panadaptor. All frequency 
adjustments made with Writelog's Bandmap or fine tune with mouse.

Make sure the Cat option Cat Control, does NOT have the DIGL/U LSB/USB 
enabled.
That will cause your Writelog bandmap/log to be off by the afsk 2.1 factor.

I use PWSDR in left monitor and Writelog in right(main) monitor.

When the 2nd receiver comes out, I'm hoping to be able to monitor two bands.
Sort of a SO1R-2rcvr.


On 10/10/2007 6:29:54 PM, Harold Aaron ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
 Hi folks.  Today I managed to get WriteLog behaving with the Flex-5000.
 I
 believe Mark, NU6X mentioned earlier that click tuning a RTTY signal
 tunes
 to center frequency, not the Mark frequency.  Confirmed that today and
 was
 wondering if there is any prognosis for a fix in upcoming releases of
 PowerSDR, or if it has already been addressed in the Betas.



 Really interested in RTTY contesting, and would like to hear from others
 using the Flex-5000 and Writelog, especially for RTTY contests.



 Harold Aaron



 Aaron Consulting

 Ph. +1 (252) 249-3767  +1 (252) 557-1085

 Mobile +1 252-626-8156



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[Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions

[FireBrick]

how do I get on the list for the 2nd receiver option
and is there a early payment discount?

Here's my application question.
I do a lot of contesting, cw and rtty.
Will I be able to use the 2nd receiver, on a different band than receiver 1

so I can do full duplex, single op, 2 band, contest mode.

call cq on band 1, and then band 2 alternating.

about half way through a contest, replies to cq's start to dwindle.
so many ops use two radios to work on two bands
you only have one signal on the air at any one time

When the 2nd receiver option is available, will the PWSDR console have two 
panadaptors or will they be automatically switchable to the receiver of 
choice?
I would vote for two panadaptors. LOL

At 2am, it will be necessary to utilize the upcoming 'Expresso Brew' option 
to keep on top of which band your listening to.

(anyone have a recording of fist-sent cw after the op had two cups of 
expresso?)


-
I've always wanted to be somebody, but I should have been more specific.
-

Bill H. in Chicagoland
webcams at http://76.16.160.118:8080/
weather at http://hhweather.webhop.org


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Re: [Flexradio] Do they *all* fit inside?

[petervn]

And what with space for the Enigma-E, nice to prevent others 
to understand your binary mode and/or CW communication?
Exept maybe for Bletchley Park.
 
BTW look for the Enigma-E on http://www.jancorver.org/en/bouw/enigma/index.htm
or http://www.xat.nl/enigma-e/
 
No kidding, nice DIY project
73
 
groeten Peter
petervn-at-hetnet-nl  pa0pvn-at-hetnet-nl  pa0pvn-at-amsat-org
only large files:pa0pvn-at-gmail-com
There are 10 kind of people, those who understand binary and those who don't
 



Van: [EMAIL PROTECTED] namens Lee A Crocker
Verzonden: do 11-10-2007 12:19
Aan: Flexradio
Onderwerp: Re: [Flexradio] Do they *all* fit inside?



The epsresso interface comes with the vapor phase cooled version of the F5K  
its called the F5K-T for tea kettle and comes with the 5KW solid state final.  
The box is a little bigger than the F5K-A  PowerSDR had to be modified to 
include a brew button and it resets the Temp cut out to precisely 160 deg the 
perfect temp to brew espresso.  (that ought to get Bob and Gerald chewing the 
rug)   In my PowerSDR contest interface I just have the espresso come out to an 
IV port and drip it straight into the blood stream the rate of espresso 
expression is inversely linked to the QSO rate, which acts as a throttle. (for 
Jim Lux's benefit) 

73  W9OY




  

Tonight's top picks. What will you watch tonight? Preview the hottest shows on 
Yahoo! TV.
http://tv.yahoo.com/


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Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions

[petervn]

I understood (Hope ??) that the receiver on the FLEX5k is 
independent of the transmitter. If so then splitband should be 
possible already, and is the software the bottleneck.
Or I am to optimistic and is the hardware not able to cater for that.
 
Other question
Can the 2nd receiver be used on the sane frequency as the main receiver,
BUT WITH EXACTLY THE SAME FREQUENCY AND PHASE?
Then you can do nice experiments with 2 small loop arials, 90 degrees crossed.
73
 
groeten Peter
petervn-at-hetnet-nl  pa0pvn-at-hetnet-nl  pa0pvn-at-amsat-org
only large files:pa0pvn-at-gmail-com
There are 10 kind of people, those who understand binary and those who don't
 



Van: [EMAIL PROTECTED] namens FireBrick
Verzonden: do 11-10-2007 13:04
Aan: FlexRadio List
Onderwerp: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions



how do I get on the list for the 2nd receiver option
and is there a early payment discount?

Here's my application question.
I do a lot of contesting, cw and rtty.
Will I be able to use the 2nd receiver, on a different band than receiver 1

so I can do full duplex, single op, 2 band, contest mode.

call cq on band 1, and then band 2 alternating.

about half way through a contest, replies to cq's start to dwindle.
so many ops use two radios to work on two bands
you only have one signal on the air at any one time

When the 2nd receiver option is available, will the PWSDR console have two
panadaptors or will they be automatically switchable to the receiver of
choice?
I would vote for two panadaptors. LOL

At 2am, it will be necessary to utilize the upcoming 'Expresso Brew' option
to keep on top of which band your listening to.

(anyone have a recording of fist-sent cw after the op had two cups of
expresso?)


-
I've always wanted to be somebody, but I should have been more specific.
-

Bill H. in Chicagoland
webcams at http://76.16.160.118:8080/
weather at http://hhweather.webhop.org http://hhweather.webhop.org/ 


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Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions

[Jim Lux]

At 05:37 AM 10/11/2007, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I understood (Hope ??) that the receiver on the FLEX5k is
independent of the transmitter. If so then splitband should be
possible already, and is the software the bottleneck.
Or I am to optimistic and is the hardware not able to cater for that.

Other question
Can the 2nd receiver be used on the sane frequency as the main receiver,
BUT WITH EXACTLY THE SAME FREQUENCY AND PHASE?
Then you can do nice experiments with 2 small loop arials, 90 degrees crossed.


I believe that this came up in early discussions of the F5K design on 
the list.  Here's my recollection.
Yes, the LO to the two receivers is driven from the same reference 
oscillator, so setting to exactly the same frequency is trivial.  The 
latch signal to the two DDSes can theoretically be asserted 
simultaneously, so the phase should be the same (but this detail is 
buried in the firmware of the F5K, perhaps a Flex rep can confirm), 
with perhaps a slight offset due to propagation delay in the wires 
which will inevitably be of different lengths, etc.

So the real question is whether the audio interface brings the data 
across time aligned from all receivers.  There's no reason why it 
wouldn't be so, assuming all the A/Ds are clocked at the same rate. 
Again, I suspect that this is under the control of the firmware 
inside the F5K, so Flex would need to confirm.

SO all you're left with is the inevitable offsets because of the 
differences in electronics among the channels (the filters on the 
output of the DDS, the RF components ahead of the QSD, etc.).

As always with these sorts of things... absolute phase to 10 degrees 
is easy. to 0.1 degrees is hard.

Jim, W6RMK



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Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions

[Lee Mushel]

OK, Gerald, step up and explain to these kids what dual diversity is all
about!

Lee   K9WRU
- Original Message - 
From: Jim Lux [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; FireBrick [EMAIL PROTECTED]; FlexRadio List
flexradio@flex-radio.biz
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 8:11 AM
Subject: Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions


 At 05:37 AM 10/11/2007, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 I understood (Hope ??) that the receiver on the FLEX5k is
 independent of the transmitter. If so then splitband should be
 possible already, and is the software the bottleneck.
 Or I am to optimistic and is the hardware not able to cater for that.
 
 Other question
 Can the 2nd receiver be used on the sane frequency as the main receiver,
 BUT WITH EXACTLY THE SAME FREQUENCY AND PHASE?
 Then you can do nice experiments with 2 small loop arials, 90 degrees
crossed.


 I believe that this came up in early discussions of the F5K design on
 the list.  Here's my recollection.
 Yes, the LO to the two receivers is driven from the same reference
 oscillator, so setting to exactly the same frequency is trivial.  The
 latch signal to the two DDSes can theoretically be asserted
 simultaneously, so the phase should be the same (but this detail is
 buried in the firmware of the F5K, perhaps a Flex rep can confirm),
 with perhaps a slight offset due to propagation delay in the wires
 which will inevitably be of different lengths, etc.

 So the real question is whether the audio interface brings the data
 across time aligned from all receivers.  There's no reason why it
 wouldn't be so, assuming all the A/Ds are clocked at the same rate.
 Again, I suspect that this is under the control of the firmware
 inside the F5K, so Flex would need to confirm.

 SO all you're left with is the inevitable offsets because of the
 differences in electronics among the channels (the filters on the
 output of the DDS, the RF components ahead of the QSD, etc.).

 As always with these sorts of things... absolute phase to 10 degrees
 is easy. to 0.1 degrees is hard.

 Jim, W6RMK



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Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions

[Jim, W4ATK]

AS I remember there is more to diversity reception than just two receivers.
Back in the war (Korea) we used three rosettes of rhombics fairly widely
seperated with our RCA Diversity receivers (Huge seven foot racks). Later in
my career we used diversity across Lake Ponchatrain on 6GHz, the dishes were
spaced several wavelengths apart vertically on the tower. I doubt that many
hams would have the space or antenna farm to support such activity, but then
again I may be wrong. After seeing the full sized 80M 5 element Yagi the
gentleman is Japan had constructed, I guess all it takes is $$.

Jim, W4ATK

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Lee Mushel
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 8:34 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; FireBrick; FlexRadio List; Jim Lux
Subject: Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions


OK, Gerald, step up and explain to these kids what dual diversity is all
about!

Lee   K9WRU
- Original Message -
From: Jim Lux [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; FireBrick [EMAIL PROTECTED]; FlexRadio List
flexradio@flex-radio.biz
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 8:11 AM
Subject: Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions


 At 05:37 AM 10/11/2007, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 I understood (Hope ??) that the receiver on the FLEX5k is
 independent of the transmitter. If so then splitband should be
 possible already, and is the software the bottleneck.
 Or I am to optimistic and is the hardware not able to cater for that.
 
 Other question
 Can the 2nd receiver be used on the sane frequency as the main receiver,
 BUT WITH EXACTLY THE SAME FREQUENCY AND PHASE?
 Then you can do nice experiments with 2 small loop arials, 90 degrees
crossed.


 I believe that this came up in early discussions of the F5K design on
 the list.  Here's my recollection.
 Yes, the LO to the two receivers is driven from the same reference
 oscillator, so setting to exactly the same frequency is trivial.  The
 latch signal to the two DDSes can theoretically be asserted
 simultaneously, so the phase should be the same (but this detail is
 buried in the firmware of the F5K, perhaps a Flex rep can confirm),
 with perhaps a slight offset due to propagation delay in the wires
 which will inevitably be of different lengths, etc.

 So the real question is whether the audio interface brings the data
 across time aligned from all receivers.  There's no reason why it
 wouldn't be so, assuming all the A/Ds are clocked at the same rate.
 Again, I suspect that this is under the control of the firmware
 inside the F5K, so Flex would need to confirm.

 SO all you're left with is the inevitable offsets because of the
 differences in electronics among the channels (the filters on the
 output of the DDS, the RF components ahead of the QSD, etc.).

 As always with these sorts of things... absolute phase to 10 degrees
 is easy. to 0.1 degrees is hard.

 Jim, W6RMK



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[Flexradio] 2kHz off freq.

[Michael Kallstrom]

To those who have experienced the 2kHz off problem with SVN1652, try 
clicking all the different mode buttons (LSB, USB, etc.) and then see if 
your receiver resets correctly. It worked for me this morning. Solution 
courtesy of WB9DNZ.

Mike NU4Q
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Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions

[petervn]

Thanks Lee for that kids being build in WWII, thats nice,
Will paint my hair black again ;-)
I know aboud diversity. With the crossed loops you can see the
phasing of the reflected verical incident waves  I do not know
if that has praktical value, but what is amateur radio?
73
 
groeten Peter
petervn-at-hetnet-nl  pa0pvn-at-hetnet-nl  pa0pvn-at-amsat-org
only large files:pa0pvn-at-gmail-com
There are 10 kind of people, those who understand binary and those who don't
 



Van: Lee Mushel [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Verzonden: do 11-10-2007 15:33
Aan: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; FireBrick; FlexRadio List; Jim Lux
Onderwerp: Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions



OK, Gerald, step up and explain to these kids what dual diversity is all
about!

Lee   K9WRU
- Original Message -
From: Jim Lux [EMAIL PROTECTED]


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Re: [Flexradio] 2kHz off freq.

[joetorrey]

I've also experienced the same issue. This happens every time I re-start
Powersdr. Also, you will need to change and re-set the AGC seting because
it will seem as if very high in setting. The equalizer settings are also
affected.

Joe
WD5Y


 To those who have experienced the 2kHz off problem with SVN1652, try
 clicking all the different mode buttons (LSB, USB, etc.) and then see if
 your receiver resets correctly. It worked for me this morning. Solution
 courtesy of WB9DNZ.

 Mike NU4Q
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Re: [Flexradio] 2kHz off freq.

[hartfuss]

Yes, Mike, this is what I experienced too after a newstart of v1.10.4 
SVN: 1652. Just changing one time the sideband (from LSB to USB and 
back) and all works correctly as expected.
73, Hans, DL2MDQ




Michael Kallstrom schrieb:
 To those who have experienced the 2kHz off problem with SVN1652, try 
 clicking all the different mode buttons (LSB, USB, etc.) and then see if 
 your receiver resets correctly. It worked for me this morning. Solution 
 courtesy of WB9DNZ.
 
 Mike NU4Q
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Re: [Flexradio] 2kHz off freq.

[José Dumoulin]

And the reason was ?

73

José F5JD


Le jeudi 11 octobre 2007 à 08:56 -0500, Michael Kallstrom a écrit :
 To those who have experienced the 2kHz off problem with SVN1652, try 
 clicking all the different mode buttons (LSB, USB, etc.) and then see if 
 your receiver resets correctly. It worked for me this morning. Solution 
 courtesy of WB9DNZ.
 
 Mike NU4Q
 -- next part --
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 Name: michael.kallstrom.vcf
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Re: [Flexradio] 2kHz off freq.

[Michael Kallstrom]

I don't know the reason! Perhaps someone with more technical knowledge 
can answer?

Mike NU4Q

José Dumoulin wrote:
 And the reason was ?

 73

 José F5JD


 Le jeudi 11 octobre 2007 à 08:56 -0500, Michael Kallstrom a écrit :
   
 To those who have experienced the 2kHz off problem with SVN1652, try 
 clicking all the different mode buttons (LSB, USB, etc.) and then see if 
 your receiver resets correctly. It worked for me this morning. Solution 
 courtesy of WB9DNZ.

 Mike NU4Q
 -- next part --
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Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions

[PaulTG2]

Hello,
 
Here is a good article on Diversity Reception. 
 
_http://www.radioblvd.com/DiversityDD1.html_ 
(http://www.radioblvd.com/DiversityDD1.html) 
 
In a different life I worked on the original Motorola cellular telephone  
base stations at the manufacturing plant. The system used true diversity  
reception mixed at the IF. It was a complicated design to keep the signals 
lined  up 
for the mixing, but it worked well -- even if it was over engineered.  :D
 
--p



** See what's new at http://www.aol.com
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[Flexradio] what is Diversity?

[FireBrick]

the best explanation I heard was

Listening to your wife, mother-in-law, mother and each of your children at 
the same time

and choosing the best to obey!


-
Quantum mechanics: The dreams stuff is made of.
-

Bill H. in Chicagoland
webcams at http://76.16.160.118:8080/
weather at http://hhweather.webhop.org


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Re: [Flexradio] Spam: Question about CAT/Console logic

[Rob Dennison]

 Hi Jim,

Keep up the pressure.   

It's kinda amusing to read about PowerSDR regressions in one mail, and
the lack of formal api's and documentation in the next.

I spent a life time (successfully) developing complex hardware/SW
systems.  We never ever allowed prototypers to develop production SW much
less price and schedule production development.  Also vice versa.  Both
personalities have their times and places.  

Both are absolutely necessary.  Both are a joy to be around, but neither
understands the other.  Yet they so need each other...  A very few are
strong enough to bridge between the two.   

Fortunately, I'm now retired sanity intact (I think!)

;o))~

Rob
AB7CF




On Wed, 10 Oct 2007 16:31:39 -0700 Jim Lux [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
 At 03:49 PM 10/10/2007, Frank Brickle wrote:
 Jim Lux wrote:
 
   Is it the intention to follow these recommendations?
 
 The model we're following is the source distribution for ejabberd.
 
 So, then, we can expect to need to create (or read) something along 
 
 the lines of
 http://www.process-one.net/en/wiki/gen_mod/ for a erlang module like 
 
 VR-kernel or SDR-core or whathaveyou?
 
 And message protocols will be defined similar to, e.g., 
 XEP-0114:Jabber Component Protocol 
 (http://www.xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0114.html)
 
 This is substantially more documentation than is provided with the 
 current PowerSDR software, and a good thing...
 
 
 Jim, W6RMK 
 
 
 
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Re: [Flexradio] Definition of F5K control interface, MIDI, FWC class, API?

[Eric Wachsmann]

From: Jim Lux [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 4:15 PM
To: Eric Wachsmann; FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz
Subject: RE: [Flexradio] Definition of F5K control interface, MIDI, FWC
class,API?

Is there a policy,procedure,intention, etc. that you'll only add new
functions at the end, and not reuse functions in the middle, so that a third
party is safe in coding something that uses the existing mapping and being
reasonably sure it won't break with a future firmware rev?

[Eric] I'm not sure I would call it a policy, but I can definitely say that
we will not change the guts of the function list without a really really
good reason.  I think I can count on 2 fingers the number of times that we
have changed the middle of that list since we began.

 
So the message formats are essentially defined implicitly, based on how they
happen to be coded in the current rev of the modules in FWC.  So, the
natural question is: how likely is it that an already existing message will
have its semantics changed?  

[Eric] Not likely since we have to define the function handling
boxing/unboxing on both ends (firmware and PC).


Is Flex-radio undertaking to keep either of those interfaces reasonably
stable over the near term (say 2 years)?  I would think the MIDI message
interface is inherently more stable, because it represents hardware
implementation.

These two interfaces are really one and the same.  There is only one
interface to the hardware currently and that is through MIDI.  The C#
control code is simply build on top of that interface.  It is the reference
for now, given that it is the only instantiation of a control interface to
the FLEX-5000, but I expect to see many other flavors develop over time.
 
What about future instantiations?  For the future, is it safe to code to
the FWC interface as currently defined? Or will it change significantly in
the near future (e.g. 2 years)

[Eric] As above, we will not commit to NEVER changing our interface.  If
someone comes up with a really good reason to do things another way, it is
possible that we could change things.  Having said that, the likelihood of
making wholesale changes without leaving the old interface intact is next to
zero.  Incremental additions are the most likely change and very infrequent
corrections/mods to existing functions.  Even those would likely just change
implementation and not the interface itself though.

Let me see if I can jump to the chase here.  If you're looking for something
that is never going to change, then you have it.  You can simply take a
version of firmware and always use that.  It is not going to change out from
under you.

Clearly what you are giving up is the ongoing improvements/changes to code
whether it be on the firmware or the PC side.


Eric Wachsmann
FlexRadio Systems


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Re: [Flexradio] 2kHz off freq.

[Alan NV8A]

I see the Bug Tracker shows this as having been FIXED -- presumably in 
the latest SVN.

73

Alan NV8A


On 10/11/07 09:56 am Michael Kallstrom wrote:

 To those who have experienced the 2kHz off problem with SVN1652, try 
 clicking all the different mode buttons (LSB, USB, etc.) and then see if 
 your receiver resets correctly. It worked for me this morning. Solution 
 courtesy of WB9DNZ.


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Re: [Flexradio] Spam: Question about CAT/Console logic

[Frank Brickle]

Rob Dennison wrote:

 Keep up the pressure.   

I don't think you quite understand. There *is* no leverage here.
There are only two things that matter: (1) lines of working source
code (2) cash.

*Every*thing else is bloviation.

73
Frank
AB2KT

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Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions

[Tayloe Dan-P26412]

Diversity reception reduces resistance to fades.  For this, we try to
space our cell site antenna 10 wavelengths apart in order to minimize
the correlation of the fades between the two antennas.  However,
diversity is also deployed on a lot of cell phone handsets today and the
antenna spacing they use is much closer than this.  7 of separation at
800 MHz is only about half a wavelength.  Never-the-less we see large
improvements in the throughput capabilities even with this close
spacing.

I guess all I am saying here is that when using diversity, it is best to
spread the antenna apart quite a ways, but that even a half wavelength
spacing provides benefits.

I should note that the new generation of cell phone equipment is not
only making use of receiver diversity (that is kind of old hat), but
that it is now making use of transmit diversity also.  Unfortunately,
that does not work with CW or SSB since sending the same signal out both
antennas causes beam forming.  It only works with data modes that modify
the data from the one antenna so that it is different from the same data
from the second antenna (complex conjugate?) and requires the receiver
on the other end to understand what is going on so that it can put the
two back together. 

I think SDR is an exciting concept.  One of things that we are doing for
the next generation of cell phone equipment is to do beam forming using
feedback from the other receiving end.  We call this precoding.  It
seems feasible that a high tech SSB or cw QSO between a pair of
diversity transmit equipped transceivers could run a separate, slow
speed, intermittent data stream that could feedback to each other
precoding data that would allow phased transmit antennas on both sides
to automatically track and align the beam steered transmit signal to
each other in an optimized fashion.  It could take the form of a small
blip of precoding data on the receive to transmit changeover.

- Dan, N7VE

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jim, W4ATK
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 6:41 AM
To: Lee Mushel; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; FireBrick; FlexRadio List; Jim Lux
Subject: Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions

AS I remember there is more to diversity reception than just two
receivers.
Back in the war (Korea) we used three rosettes of rhombics fairly
widely seperated with our RCA Diversity receivers (Huge seven foot
racks). Later in my career we used diversity across Lake Ponchatrain on
6GHz, the dishes were spaced several wavelengths apart vertically on the
tower. I doubt that many hams would have the space or antenna farm to
support such activity, but then again I may be wrong. After seeing the
full sized 80M 5 element Yagi the gentleman is Japan had constructed, I
guess all it takes is $$.

Jim, W4ATK

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Lee Mushel
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 8:34 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; FireBrick; FlexRadio List; Jim Lux
Subject: Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions


OK, Gerald, step up and explain to these kids what dual diversity is all
about!

Lee   K9WRU
- Original Message -
From: Jim Lux [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; FireBrick [EMAIL PROTECTED]; FlexRadio
List
flexradio@flex-radio.biz
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 8:11 AM
Subject: Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions


 At 05:37 AM 10/11/2007, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 I understood (Hope ??) that the receiver on the FLEX5k is independent

 of the transmitter. If so then splitband should be possible already, 
 and is the software the bottleneck.
 Or I am to optimistic and is the hardware not able to cater for that.
 
 Other question
 Can the 2nd receiver be used on the sane frequency as the main 
 receiver, BUT WITH EXACTLY THE SAME FREQUENCY AND PHASE?
 Then you can do nice experiments with 2 small loop arials, 90 degrees
crossed.


 I believe that this came up in early discussions of the F5K design on 
 the list.  Here's my recollection.
 Yes, the LO to the two receivers is driven from the same reference 
 oscillator, so setting to exactly the same frequency is trivial.  The 
 latch signal to the two DDSes can theoretically be asserted 
 simultaneously, so the phase should be the same (but this detail is 
 buried in the firmware of the F5K, perhaps a Flex rep can confirm), 
 with perhaps a slight offset due to propagation delay in the wires 
 which will inevitably be of different lengths, etc.

 So the real question is whether the audio interface brings the data 
 across time aligned from all receivers.  There's no reason why it 
 wouldn't be so, assuming all the A/Ds are clocked at the same rate.
 Again, I suspect that this is under the control of the firmware inside

 the F5K, so Flex would need to confirm.

 SO all you're left with is the inevitable offsets because of the 
 differences in electronics among the channels (the filters on the 
 output of 

[Flexradio] Strange Janus effect

[a.groff]

On Aug 30 I posted to the HPSDR mailing list
-

Subject: [hpsdr] Strange Janus effect...

* High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion List *

I am noticing a strange cross-talk ( ?? ) effect with Janus ( OZY ? )
when used with SDR-1000  PowerSDR  (v1.9.1 svn 1354, v1.10.2 ) that I
do not notice with the D44 sound card...

I notice this effect in the receive audio when I start to decrease the
AGC-T ( RF Gain ) control in Power SDR.  As the received signal starts
to disappear from audibility, it is replaced by very distorted replica
at a reduced amplitude.  The effect was first observed in SSB modes but
is also present it AM mode ( maybe more so. )

Does you one else have this effect or do I have a problem with my
Janus/Ozy/system ??  How would I start to isolate the problem?

AL, K0VM
-

I received a couple of affirmative response and no don't see it here's.

I have uploaded spectrum analyze screen shots of the speaker/head phone audio 
that further demonstrate the problem..
( SDR-1000 w/PwrSRD 1.10.3)

The first screen shot *http://www.hamsdr.com/dnld.aspx?id=676 *is with the D44 
sound ( preamp off, antenna connected to dummy load AGC-T = 120). Note noise 
floor above 3khz.

The second screen shot *http://www.hamsdr.com/dnld.aspx?id=677 *is with the 
Janus sound card and AGC-T=120. Note elevated noise floor above 3khz.

The third screen shot *http://www.hamsdr.com/dnld.aspx?id=678* is Janus with 
AGC-T=100. Note again noise floor above 3khz compared to AGC-T=120.

The fourth screen shot *http://www.hamsdr.com/dnld.aspx?id=679   *is Janus with 
AGC-T=70. Note noise floor through entire audio range.

With the D44 sound card, the noise floor about 3khz is consistently flat with 
all AGC-T settings.

My first guess was that this may be a Ozy/Janus hardware problem but to the 
best of my knowledge, AGC-T only operated on software, which suggests to me 
that some kind of cross talk problem in the software specific to Ozy/Janus.

I would be happy to isolate this with further testing if someone can suggest 
what to look for ??






 
 








 filesize: 43,021
 Downloads: 0
   *http://www.hamsdr.com/dnld.aspx?id=
 filesize: 43,021
 Downloads: 0
 http://www.hamsdr.com/dnld.aspx?id=672*

 filesize: 43,021
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 *672*


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[Flexradio] HL-1.5 Interface

[deuhs]

Greetings fellow flexers:

Does anybody have any tips on interfacing the Tokyo Hy-poer HL-1.5 with a 
SDR-1000? (I geuss I should have checked into this before ordering the amp ;)

TIA!

Greg K0PJ/9

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Re: [Flexradio] Spam: Question about CAT/Console logic

[Rob Dennison]

Hi Frank,

Grab the cash!

Rob


On Thu, 11 Oct 2007 12:20:09 -0400 Frank Brickle [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
 Rob Dennison wrote:
 
  Keep up the pressure.   
 
 I don't think you quite understand. There *is* no leverage here.
 There are only two things that matter: (1) lines of working source
 code (2) cash.
 
 *Every*thing else is bloviation.
 
 73
 Frank
 AB2KT
 
 

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Re: [Flexradio] 2kHz off freq.

[hartfuss]

Yes, it seems to be fixed, not anymore present in SVN 1653.
Thanks, Hans, DL2MDQ.


  fixedAlan NV8A schrieb:
 I see the Bug Tracker shows this as having been FIXED -- presumably in 
 the latest SVN.
 
 73
 
 Alan NV8A
 
 
 On 10/11/07 09:56 am Michael Kallstrom wrote:
 
 
To those who have experienced the 2kHz off problem with SVN1652, try 
clicking all the different mode buttons (LSB, USB, etc.) and then see if 
your receiver resets correctly. It worked for me this morning. Solution 
courtesy of WB9DNZ.
 
 
 
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 FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/
 FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/
 
 
 .
 


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[Flexradio] Band data output from SDR-5000

[Dave Blaschke]

I am anxiously awaiting the arrival of my SDR-5000.

As I wait, I continue studying the manual. Here is my dilemma: I 
operate all HF bands as well as 6 and 2. On every radio I have owned, 
I demanded an output from that  which would let me get the band data. 
I have always built the required interface to allow that band data to 
switch the rig to the correct antenna for the chosen band.  Each band 
here has its own antenna here at my QTH.

I do not see this capability with the SDR-5000; am I missing 
something? I would appreciate input if I'm missing this.

Dave, W5UN



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Re: [Flexradio] Spam: Question about CAT/Console logic

[Frank Brickle]

Rob Dennison wrote:

 Grab the cash!

And stop bloviating myself? Not for a million bucks. Well, maybe.

73
Frank
AB2KT

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Re: [Flexradio] what is Diversity?

[petervn]

Don't have a dog ?
 
groeten Peter
petervn-at-hetnet-nl  pa0pvn-at-hetnet-nl  pa0pvn-at-amsat-org
only large files:pa0pvn-at-gmail-com
There are 10 kind of people, those who understand binary and those who don't
 



Van: [EMAIL PROTECTED] namens FireBrick
Verzonden: do 11-10-2007 17:35
Aan: FlexRadio List
Onderwerp: [Flexradio] what is Diversity?



the best explanation I heard was

Listening to your wife, mother-in-law, mother and each of your children at
the same time

and choosing the best to obey!


-
Quantum mechanics: The dreams stuff is made of.
-

Bill H. in Chicagoland
webcams at http://76.16.160.118:8080/
weather at http://hhweather.webhop.org http://hhweather.webhop.org/ 


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Re: [Flexradio] Band data output from SDR-5000

[Bob Tracy]

Dave,

Currently there is only one way to get band data from either Flex radio and
that is via CAT.  The hooks to do direct band decoding are in the FLEX5000
(FlexWire) but have not yet been implemented.

Many of the logger programs like N1MM and HRD have decoders built in that
will talk to a parallel port for doing antenna switching.  Interfacing with
these programs using vCom (or other) virtual serial ports and the CAT module
in PowerSDR should provide you with the control you need to switch your
(green with envy :)) antenna farm.

Let me know if I can provide more info on the CAT system.

73,

Bob K5KDN

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Dave Blaschke
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 12:13 PM
To: FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz
Subject: [Flexradio] Band data output from SDR-5000


I am anxiously awaiting the arrival of my SDR-5000.

As I wait, I continue studying the manual. Here is my dilemma: I
operate all HF bands as well as 6 and 2. On every radio I have owned,
I demanded an output from that  which would let me get the band data.
I have always built the required interface to allow that band data to
switch the rig to the correct antenna for the chosen band.  Each band
here has its own antenna here at my QTH.

I do not see this capability with the SDR-5000; am I missing
something? I would appreciate input if I'm missing this.

Dave, W5UN



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Re: [Flexradio] FlexRadio Digest, Vol 30, Issue 11 (all fit inside)

[W4ABW]

I looked inside the 5000A at the Huntsville Hamfest. You could put a 6-pack  
in there and have room for clean socks.
 
Al
W4ABW



** See what's new at http://www.aol.com
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Re: [Flexradio] Spam: Question about CAT/Console logic

[petervn]

Have you read the soul of the new machine it was called 
I think to remember, aboud the building of one of the NOVA 
computers? Harware boys working in the early mornig,
the softys in the afternoon until late
;-)
 
groeten Peter
petervn-at-hetnet-nl  pa0pvn-at-hetnet-nl  pa0pvn-at-amsat-org
only large files:pa0pvn-at-gmail-com
There are 10 kind of people, those who understand binary and those who don't
 



Van: [EMAIL PROTECTED] namens Rob Dennison
Verzonden: do 11-10-2007 17:54
Aan: FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz
CC: FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz
Onderwerp: Re: [Flexradio] Spam: Question about CAT/Console logic



 Hi Jim,

Keep up the pressure.  

It's kinda amusing to read about PowerSDR regressions in one mail, and
the lack of formal api's and documentation in the next.

I spent a life time (successfully) developing complex hardware/SW
systems.  We never ever allowed prototypers to develop production SW much
less price and schedule production development.  Also vice versa.  Both
personalities have their times and places. 

Both are absolutely necessary.  Both are a joy to be around, but neither
understands the other.  Yet they so need each other...  A very few are
strong enough to bridge between the two.  

Fortunately, I'm now retired sanity intact (I think!)

;o))~

Rob
AB7CF




On Wed, 10 Oct 2007 16:31:39 -0700 Jim Lux [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
 At 03:49 PM 10/10/2007, Frank Brickle wrote:
 Jim Lux wrote:
 
   Is it the intention to follow these recommendations?
 
 The model we're following is the source distribution for ejabberd.

 So, then, we can expect to need to create (or read) something along

 the lines of
 http://www.process-one.net/en/wiki/gen_mod/ for a erlang module like

 VR-kernel or SDR-core or whathaveyou?

 And message protocols will be defined similar to, e.g.,
 XEP-0114:Jabber Component Protocol
 (http://www.xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0114.html)

 This is substantially more documentation than is provided with the
 current PowerSDR software, and a good thing...


 Jim, W6RMK



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Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions

[Jim Lux]

At 07:05 AM 10/11/2007, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Thanks Lee for that kids being build in WWII, thats nice,
Will paint my hair black again ;-)
I know aboud diversity. With the crossed loops you can see the
phasing of the reflected verical incident waves  I do not know
if that has praktical value, but what is amateur radio?



And, in fact, there's some good research in France on using just this 
technique to achieve substantially better performance on 1000 km HF 
links.  Just providing polarization diversity is helpful, but you DO 
need to have coherent receiver channels. 



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Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions

[Jim Lux]

At 06:41 AM 10/11/2007, Jim, W4ATK wrote:
AS I remember there is more to diversity reception than just two receivers.


Lots of implementations around for diversity techniques (now 
fashionably called MIMO, by the way).

Your wireless LAN probably implements a simple antenna switched 
diversity scheme.  Lots of FM car radios use an incoherent combining scheme.




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Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions

[Jim Lux]

At 06:33 AM 10/11/2007, Lee Mushel wrote:
OK, Gerald, step up and explain to these kids what dual diversity is all
about!



Lots of reasons why one might want phase coherent receiver channels 
other than diversity combining.  Heck, if you're doing coherent 
diversity combining, you need it too.



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Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions

[Tom Thompson]

Dan,

This is very interesting.  It occurred to me that we can now take the CB 
roger beep and put it to good use grin

Tom  W0IVJ



Tayloe Dan-P26412 wrote:

Diversity reception reduces resistance to fades.  For this, we try to
space our cell site antenna 10 wavelengths apart in order to minimize
the correlation of the fades between the two antennas.  However,
diversity is also deployed on a lot of cell phone handsets today and the
antenna spacing they use is much closer than this.  7 of separation at
800 MHz is only about half a wavelength.  Never-the-less we see large
improvements in the throughput capabilities even with this close
spacing.

I guess all I am saying here is that when using diversity, it is best to
spread the antenna apart quite a ways, but that even a half wavelength
spacing provides benefits.

I should note that the new generation of cell phone equipment is not
only making use of receiver diversity (that is kind of old hat), but
that it is now making use of transmit diversity also.  Unfortunately,
that does not work with CW or SSB since sending the same signal out both
antennas causes beam forming.  It only works with data modes that modify
the data from the one antenna so that it is different from the same data
from the second antenna (complex conjugate?) and requires the receiver
on the other end to understand what is going on so that it can put the
two back together. 

I think SDR is an exciting concept.  One of things that we are doing for
the next generation of cell phone equipment is to do beam forming using
feedback from the other receiving end.  We call this precoding.  It
seems feasible that a high tech SSB or cw QSO between a pair of
diversity transmit equipped transceivers could run a separate, slow
speed, intermittent data stream that could feedback to each other
precoding data that would allow phased transmit antennas on both sides
to automatically track and align the beam steered transmit signal to
each other in an optimized fashion.  It could take the form of a small
blip of precoding data on the receive to transmit changeover.

- Dan, N7VE

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jim, W4ATK
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 6:41 AM
To: Lee Mushel; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; FireBrick; FlexRadio List; Jim Lux
Subject: Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions

AS I remember there is more to diversity reception than just two
receivers.
Back in the war (Korea) we used three rosettes of rhombics fairly
widely seperated with our RCA Diversity receivers (Huge seven foot
racks). Later in my career we used diversity across Lake Ponchatrain on
6GHz, the dishes were spaced several wavelengths apart vertically on the
tower. I doubt that many hams would have the space or antenna farm to
support such activity, but then again I may be wrong. After seeing the
full sized 80M 5 element Yagi the gentleman is Japan had constructed, I
guess all it takes is $$.

Jim, W4ATK

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Lee Mushel
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 8:34 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; FireBrick; FlexRadio List; Jim Lux
Subject: Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions


OK, Gerald, step up and explain to these kids what dual diversity is all
about!

Lee   K9WRU
- Original Message -
From: Jim Lux [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; FireBrick [EMAIL PROTECTED]; FlexRadio
List
flexradio@flex-radio.biz
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 8:11 AM
Subject: Re: [Flexradio] 2nd receiver option questions


  

At 05:37 AM 10/11/2007, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


I understood (Hope ??) that the receiver on the FLEX5k is independent
  


  

of the transmitter. If so then splitband should be possible already, 
and is the software the bottleneck.
Or I am to optimistic and is the hardware not able to cater for that.

Other question
Can the 2nd receiver be used on the sane frequency as the main 
receiver, BUT WITH EXACTLY THE SAME FREQUENCY AND PHASE?
Then you can do nice experiments with 2 small loop arials, 90 degrees
  

crossed.
  

I believe that this came up in early discussions of the F5K design on 
the list.  Here's my recollection.
Yes, the LO to the two receivers is driven from the same reference 
oscillator, so setting to exactly the same frequency is trivial.  The 
latch signal to the two DDSes can theoretically be asserted 
simultaneously, so the phase should be the same (but this detail is 
buried in the firmware of the F5K, perhaps a Flex rep can confirm), 
with perhaps a slight offset due to propagation delay in the wires 
which will inevitably be of different lengths, etc.

So the real question is whether the audio interface brings the data 
across time aligned from all receivers.  There's no reason why it 
wouldn't be so, assuming all the A/Ds are clocked at the same rate.
Again, I suspect that this is under the control of the firmware inside



  

the F5K, so 

Re: [Flexradio] Definition of F5K control interface, MIDI, FWC class, API?

[Larry Loen]

Eric Wachsmann wrote:
 
 
 From: Jim Lux [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 4:15 PM
 To: Eric Wachsmann; FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz
 Subject: RE: [Flexradio] Definition of F5K control interface, MIDI, FWC
 class,API?
 
 Is there a policy,procedure,intention, etc. that you'll only add new
 functions at the end, and not reuse functions in the middle, so that a third
 party is safe in coding something that uses the existing mapping and being
 reasonably sure it won't break with a future firmware rev?
 
 [Eric] I'm not sure I would call it a policy, but I can definitely say that
 we will not change the guts of the function list without a really really
 good reason.  I think I can count on 2 fingers the number of times that we
 have changed the middle of that list since we began.


Great answer.  I think we can say seldom, really seldom here.

  
 So the message formats are essentially defined implicitly, based on how they
 happen to be coded in the current rev of the modules in FWC.  So, the
 natural question is: how likely is it that an already existing message will
 have its semantics changed?  
 
 [Eric] Not likely since we have to define the function handling
 boxing/unboxing on both ends (firmware and PC).
 

I translate that to:  Slowly and infrequently, with good reasons only.

 
 Is Flex-radio undertaking to keep either of those interfaces reasonably
 stable over the near term (say 2 years)?  I would think the MIDI message
 interface is inherently more stable, because it represents hardware
 implementation.
 
 These two interfaces are really one and the same.  There is only one
 interface to the hardware currently and that is through MIDI.  The C#
 control code is simply build on top of that interface.  It is the reference
 for now, given that it is the only instantiation of a control interface to
 the FLEX-5000, but I expect to see many other flavors develop over time.
  
 What about future instantiations?  For the future, is it safe to code to
 the FWC interface as currently defined? Or will it change significantly in
 the near future (e.g. 2 years)
 
 [Eric] As above, we will not commit to NEVER changing our interface.  If
 someone comes up with a really good reason to do things another way, it is
 possible that we could change things.  Having said that, the likelihood of
 making wholesale changes without leaving the old interface intact is next to
 zero.  Incremental additions are the most likely change and very infrequent
 corrections/mods to existing functions.  Even those would likely just change
 implementation and not the interface itself though.
 
 Let me see if I can jump to the chase here.  If you're looking for something
 that is never going to change, then you have it.  You can simply take a
 version of firmware and always use that.  It is not going to change out from
 under you.


I don't think you can guarantee that, either, quite, not even for 
homebrewers replacing the PowerSDR.  Not in practice.  Certainly not 
for those running PowerSDR itself.  Since the PowerSDR code is open 
source, it can't be withdrawn and nothing stops a valid user from 
running what they have, but that's not the same as support, which 
eventually will matter.

Earlier, I asked in passing for a listing on the site somewhere to match 
up supported versions of firmware and the PowerSDR code (and which goes 
with which).

If you actually ever do make incompatible changes (which I agree, should 
never be unconditionally promised, but not made too easy either), you're 
likely going to face the reality that PowerSDR (and anyone else building 
to the firmware) is going to find themselves drawing a line in the sand 
and saying if you have pre 1.x.y firmware, use PowerSDR 1.zz.q and 
below, otherwise use 2.aa.a and above.

One thing I've learned in open source is that change happens.  Yes, if 
you are absolutely willing to freeze function, you never have to change. 
  GPL means that othing can be withdrawn.  But, eventually, even the 
most change-resistant of us will change.  I've been running Red Hat 8 
about forever, but I will need to upgrade in the near future to get 
MySQL improvements, Java 5, and, when/if I go there, PowerSDR under 
Linux (whatever its proper name is).  So, even I, Mr. Production 
Mentality, am going to upgrade.

The other reason I humbly suggest you make a list of what combinations 
are supported is that even if you don't change interfaces incompatibly, 
the code will be what it is and you don't want to support 12 total 
combinations simply because you have three supported firmware and four 
supported console versions out there.

It will be reasonable to tell people with problems that they must 
reproduce them on a supported combination.

Perhaps you have this in mind and you think it doesn't matter yet.  But, 
I did look in the site for that kind of statement (I'm already trying to 
sort out what I have to do for 1.10.3) and I 

[Flexradio] Ham radio deluxe

[José Dumoulin]

Hi flexers

HRD/DM780 new version 1628 can be downloaded here :
http://www.ham-radio.ch/kits/beta/3.5/1628/

73
José F5JD


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Re: [Flexradio] Definition of F5K control interface, MIDI, FWC class, API?

[Eric Wachsmann]

 -Original Message-
 From: Larry Loen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 3:32 PM
 To: Eric Wachsmann
 Cc: 'Jim Lux'; FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz
 Subject: Re: [Flexradio] Definition of F5K control interface, MIDI, FWC
 class, API?
 
...snip...
  ...you don't want to support 12 total
 combinations simply because you have three supported firmware and four
 supported console versions out there.

This is actually taken care of in PowerSDR itself both in the source and in
the window that pops up if you have a version of firmware that it doesn't
like.  It will tell you what it found and what it was looking for.  All
versions of firmware will stay available on our download page on the website
for as long as they need to.


Eric Wachsmann
FlexRadio Systems


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Re: [Flexradio] Band data output from SDR-5000

[Jerry Flanders]

Some of what I developed to bandswitch my Quadra may be useful, 
especially if you already run one of the common logging/contesting 
programs when you operate, as I always do. I am now using this same 
setup with my SDR-1000.

See http://www.ab4oj.com/quadra/w4uk.html

Jerry W4UK

At 01:13 PM 10/11/2007, Dave Blaschke wrote:
I am anxiously awaiting the arrival of my SDR-5000.

As I wait, I continue studying the manual. Here is my dilemma: I
operate all HF bands as well as 6 and 2. On every radio I have owned,
I demanded an output from that  which would let me get the band data.
I have always built the required interface to allow that band data to
switch the rig to the correct antenna for the chosen band.  Each band
here has its own antenna here at my QTH.

I do not see this capability with the SDR-5000; am I missing
something? I would appreciate input if I'm missing this.

Dave, W5UN


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Re: [Flexradio] Definition of F5K control interface, MIDI, FWC class, API?

[Jim Lux]

At 01:32 PM 10/11/2007, Larry Loen wrote:
Eric Wachsmann wrote:

From: Jim Lux [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, 
October 10, 2007 4:15 PM
To: Eric Wachsmann; FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz
Subject: RE: [Flexradio] Definition of F5K control interface, MIDI, FWC
class,API?
Is there a policy,procedure,intention, etc. that you'll only add new
functions at the end, and not reuse functions in the middle, so that a third
party is safe in coding something that uses the existing mapping and being
reasonably sure it won't break with a future firmware rev?
[Eric] I'm not sure I would call it a policy, but I can definitely say that
we will not change the guts of the function list without a really really
good reason.  I think I can count on 2 fingers the number of times that we
have changed the middle of that list since we began.

Great answer.  I think we can say seldom, really seldom here.

Indeed..


So the message formats are essentially defined implicitly, based on how they
happen to be coded in the current rev of the modules in FWC.  So, the
natural question is: how likely is it that an already existing message will
have its semantics changed?
[Eric] Not likely since we have to define the function handling
boxing/unboxing on both ends (firmware and PC).

I translate that to:  Slowly and infrequently, with good reasons only.



[Eric] As above, we will not commit to NEVER changing our interface.  If
someone comes up with a really good reason to do things another way, it is
possible that we could change things.  Having said that, the likelihood of
making wholesale changes without leaving the old interface intact is next to
zero.  Incremental additions are the most likely change and very infrequent
corrections/mods to existing functions.  Even those would likely just change
implementation and not the interface itself though.
Let me see if I can jump to the chase here.  If you're looking for something
that is never going to change, then you have it.  You can simply take a
version of firmware and always use that.  It is not going to change out from
under you.


I don't think you can guarantee that, either, quite, not  even for 
homebrewers replacing the PowerSDR.  Not in practice.  Certainly 
not for those running PowerSDR itself.  Since the PowerSDR code is 
open source, it can't be withdrawn and nothing stops a valid user 
from running what they have, but that's not the same as support, 
which eventually will matter.

Indeed... one can't run forever on an obsolete version, and creating 
your own self maintained fork would be painful.  But, the reasonable 
assertion Eric has made is that they won't be changing it under your 
feet any time soon.


Earlier, I asked in passing for a listing on the site somewhere to 
match up supported versions of firmware and the PowerSDR code (and 
which goes with which).

If you actually ever do make incompatible changes (which I agree, 
should never be unconditionally promised, but not made too easy 
either), you're likely going to face the reality that PowerSDR (and 
anyone else building to the firmware) is going to find themselves 
drawing a line in the sand and saying if you have pre 1.x.y 
firmware, use PowerSDR 1.zz.q and below, otherwise use 2.aa.a and above.


And this is pretty typical for most software of any reasonable complexity.




One thing I've learned in open source is that change happens.  Yes, 
if you are absolutely willing to freeze function, you never have to 
change.  GPL means that othing can be withdrawn.  But, eventually, 
even the most change-resistant of us will change.  I've been running 
Red Hat 8 about forever, but I will need to upgrade in the near 
future to get MySQL improvements, Java 5, and, when/if I go there, 
PowerSDR under Linux (whatever its proper name is).  So, even I, Mr. 
Production Mentality, am going to upgrade.

The other reason I humbly suggest you make a list of what 
combinations are supported is that even if you don't change 
interfaces incompatibly, the code will be what it is and you don't 
want to support 12 total combinations simply because you have three 
supported firmware and four supported console versions out there.

It will be reasonable to tell people with problems that they must 
reproduce them on a supported combination.

Perhaps you have this in mind and you think it doesn't matter 
yet.  But, I did look in the site for that kind of statement (I'm 
already trying to sort out what I have to do for 1.10.3) and I 
didn't see it.  So, at least for now, I'm still on 1.10.2.


For instance, right now, PowerSDR checks that the firmware version is 
0.1.1.x  and throws an error if it isn't (It tells you to go to the 
website and download a new version). Presumably, future versions of 
the firmware will keep the get firmware version message at #1200.


Jim W6RMK 



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[Flexradio] another (stupid) MIDI question

[Jim Lux]

Looking in fwc_midi.cs

There's a reference to MidiInGetName(i) which apparently returns the 
name of the i-th MIDI device.  It gets compared to 4 possibilities 
for the F5K, and if it's a match, the routine keeps track of which 
device it is.

However, I can't find the MidiInGetName property in the MSDN 
knowledgebase.  In fact, you can google for it and not find it. I can 
find all the other properties and methods.

So where is the object Midi defined/instantiated, and what class is it?

maybe it's a VS2003 .net1.1 thing? (I'm browsing with Vs2005)

Jim, W6RMK 



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Re: [Flexradio] another (stupid) MIDI question

[Eric Wachsmann]

The Midi. means that this function is defined in the Midi namespace.  It
will make it easier if you browse in 2003 if you have it handy because you
can just right click on it and select Go To Definition.

Here's a snippet from midi.cs that I think answers your question:

=
public static string MidiInGetName(int index)
{
MIDIINCAPS caps = new MIDIINCAPS();
int error = MidiInGetDevCaps(index, ref caps, 44);

if(error == 0) return caps.szPname;
else return ;
}
=

 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 radio.biz] On Behalf Of Jim Lux
 Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 4:45 PM
 To: FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz
 Subject: [Flexradio] another (stupid) MIDI question
 
 Looking in fwc_midi.cs
 
 There's a reference to MidiInGetName(i) which apparently returns the
 name of the i-th MIDI device.  It gets compared to 4 possibilities
 for the F5K, and if it's a match, the routine keeps track of which
 device it is.
 
 However, I can't find the MidiInGetName property in the MSDN
 knowledgebase.  In fact, you can google for it and not find it. I can
 find all the other properties and methods.
 
 So where is the object Midi defined/instantiated, and what class is it?
 
 maybe it's a VS2003 .net1.1 thing? (I'm browsing with Vs2005)
 
 Jim, W6RMK
 
 
 
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[Flexradio] HRD

[w8ikn]

What is procedure for using HRD with the F5K ?
   
  Thanks,
   
  Art

   
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Re: [Flexradio] another (stupid) MIDI question

[Jim Lux]

At 02:50 PM 10/11/2007, Eric Wachsmann wrote:
The Midi. means that this function is defined in the Midi namespace.  It
will make it easier if you browse in 2003 if you have it handy because you
can just right click on it and select Go To Definition.

Here's a snippet from midi.cs that I think answers your question:

You gave me the key piece of info..I found midi.cs.. It's back up in 
the Console directory, not down in FWC...

So, it's a wrapper that abstracts part of the devcaps to get the name.

so we have FWC.cs which uses things in fwc_midi.cs which in turn uses 
midi.cs which provides an instantiation of the windows multimedia dll.

All pretty clear once you know where it is.  I'll update my 
architecture drawing.

It has no copyright header. Is it part of PowerSDR, or elsewhere?


Jim, W6RMK 



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[Flexradio] HRD AND FLEX 5K

[K3PZ]

Sorry Guys, according to the HRD support forums, it is not yet working with the 
Flex 5K (probably because because they don't have a radio to modify the code 
with yet). I enquired a few weeks ago and here is the response that I got:

http://forums.ham-radio.ch/showthread.php?t=8357

I used to use HRD with my Flex 1K and loved it mainly for the DX Cluster and 
shortwave database. I miss it and can't wait until the code is modified for the 
5K


73 de
Paul Zora
K3PZ
Port Saint Lucie, FL


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[Flexradio] FLEX-5000 Production Update

[Gerald Youngblood]

Dear FLEX-5000 customers,

It has been several weeks since my last update to the reflector.  Since that
time everyone at FlexRadio has been working hard to get shipments out the
door as quickly as possible without sacrificing quality.  In the process, we
have made a significant number of improvements in our production processes
and have added several new people to our staff.  

Unfortunately, last week we ran into a problem when the supply of PC boards
from our contract manufacturer dropped to a trickle.  It has improved quite
a bit this week and we expect it to improve even further next week.  We now
expect completion of the first production run shipments, probably by the end
of next week.  The second production run is in process and should start
hitting final assembly by the end of next week as well.

We are about two to three weeks behind where we had hoped to be for the
second production run shipments.  Our second run was built this week on a
new high speed Fuji line that can place 20,000 components per hour.  On the
subsequent run, it will go to a newer machine that places 40,000 components
per hour.  

After surface mount assembly the boards will next go to flying probe
testing.  This is a completely new step in our process that measures the
impedance of all key nodes on the PC board before being delivered to us for
functional testing.  This should greatly improve throughput on our main
transceiver board, which has over 1,000 components made up of over 200
unique part numbers.  The main board is a very high density design with
0.006 inch to 0.010 inch circuit spacing in most of the key high performance
areas.  While these new assembly and test processes come at higher cost to
FlexRadio, we believe they will result in much better throughput. 

This weekend we expect to begin final on air testing of the new FLEX-5000C
model so that we can begin final assembly of the first production run.
Manufacturing of the new model is well underway and we expect to complete
first production run shipments by the end of this month.  The second run
will begin a few weeks after that.

Due to the current backlog of FLEX-5000A models, new orders received now
will ship in early January.  We have a very limited number of FLEX-5000C
models available for shipment before December 15.

Once again, we at FlexRadio would like to thank all of you for your trust,
confidence and patience.  You are truly the best customers in the world.  It
is our desire that you truly enjoy our products.

73,
Gerald
 
Gerald Youngblood, K5SDR
FlexRadio Systems
Ph: 512-535-4713
Fax: 512-233-5143
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Web: www.flex-radio.com http://www.flex-radio.com/ 


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Re: [Flexradio] HRD

[Neal Campbell K3NC]

Hi Art

Its no different than with the SDR1K, if you know anything about that.

You need the N8VB virtual commport driver and define a comm port  
pair, assign one of the pair as the cat port in PowerSDR, then the  
other to HRD. It works very well.


Neal Campbell K3NC
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

telnet to our DX Spotting clusters at: dxc.k3nc.com, ports 12001 and 23

Devoted to Dogs: How to be your dog's best owner
Great Dog Book  at www.abrohamneal.com



On Oct 11, 2007, at 6:34 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 What is procedure for using HRD with the F5K ?

   Thanks,

   Art


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Re: [Flexradio] [hpsdr] Strange Janus effect

[Phil Harman]

Hi Al,

This is what I suspect you are seeing.

There are two audio outputs from Janus, one from the TLV320 and the 
other from the PWM DAC.  We originally intended the TLV320 to drive 
headphones/speakers/line out and the PWM DAC to provide I and Q to the 
SDR Tx.

Very late in the design I spoke to Bob N4HY who let me know that he was 
considering altering PowerSDR to move the I and Q signals away from 
baseband to get rid of the low frequency noise that some sound cards 
produce.

This change would have meant that we could not have used the I and Q 
outputs to drive the Tx since they were intended to work at baseband. 
So we modified the FPGA code to send the Rx audio to the Janus IQ 
outputs and the IQ signals to the TLV320.

The PWM DAC that is now used for Rx audio uses about 11 bits as apposed 
to the 16 bits that the TLV320 uses.  So,if you reduce AGC-T (RF Gain) 
and increase the AF gain you reach a point where you starve the PWM DAC 
of bits and it starts to distort.  I can hear this happening if I set 
the controls as above.

There are a number of options (since we use FPGAs!)

1. Keep the RF gain at the level at which the band noise just does not 
activate the AGC - which is how it was intended to be used.

2. Change the Ozy FPGA code so that we swap the audio outputs - we will 
need you to run some test on the IQ outputs to check the S/N, phase 
and amplitude balance etc is OK. This should be OK unless PowerSDR 
changes to non baseband IQ signals some time in the future.

3. Wait for Penelope and/or Mercury since both have additional TLV320s 
which we can use for Rx audio!

Sorry for the long winded answer and hope this makes sense.

73's PhilVK6APH



Quoting a.groff [EMAIL PROTECTED]:

 * High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion List *

 On Aug 30 I posted to the HPSDR mailing list
 -

 Subject: [hpsdr] Strange Janus effect...

 * High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion List *

 I am noticing a strange cross-talk ( ?? ) effect with Janus ( OZY ? )
 when used with SDR-1000  PowerSDR  (v1.9.1 svn 1354, v1.10.2 ) that I
 do not notice with the D44 sound card...

 I notice this effect in the receive audio when I start to decrease the
 AGC-T ( RF Gain ) control in Power SDR.  As the received signal starts
 to disappear from audibility, it is replaced by very distorted replica
 at a reduced amplitude.  The effect was first observed in SSB modes but
 is also present it AM mode ( maybe more so. )

 Does you one else have this effect or do I have a problem with my
 Janus/Ozy/system ??  How would I start to isolate the problem?

 AL, K0VM



This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program.


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Re: [Flexradio] HRD

[Bob Tracy]

Art,

I'm not sure what you mean by procedure for using HRD with the F5K.
Possibly the confusion may be that there is no F5K selection on the CAT tab
(I plan to change that to FlexRadio instead of model numbers) so just
select SDR-1000 and follow the virtual port setup found in the Knowledge
Base.

I use HRD with my F5K on a daily basis.

73,

Bob K5KDN

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 5:35 PM
To: flexradio@flex-radio.biz
Subject: [Flexradio] HRD


What is procedure for using HRD with the F5K ?

  Thanks,

  Art


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Re: [Flexradio] HRD AND FLEX 5K

[Bob Tracy]

Paul,

Jose' is a little confused.  There may be no F5K selection on the CAT tab at
the present time but HRD will work just fine using the SDR-1000 as the radio
type.  I use my F5K with HRD every day without problems.

73,

Bob K5KDN

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of K3PZ
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 5:39 PM
To: Flex Reflector
Subject: [Flexradio] HRD AND FLEX 5K


Sorry Guys, according to the HRD support forums, it is not yet working with
the Flex 5K (probably because because they don't have a radio to modify the
code with yet). I enquired a few weeks ago and here is the response that I
got:

http://forums.ham-radio.ch/showthread.php?t=8357

I used to use HRD with my Flex 1K and loved it mainly for the DX Cluster and
shortwave database. I miss it and can't wait until the code is modified for
the 5K


73 de
Paul Zora
K3PZ
Port Saint Lucie, FL


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[Flexradio] [KB] New article posted to the Knowledge Base

[Tim Ellison]

A new article Q10433 - FLEX-5000 EEPROM / Firewire Diagnostic Tool has
been posted to the Knowledge base

This article contains a link to download a FLEX-5000 EEPROM reader.
This reader can be used as a diagnostic tool to determine if your
computer is properly communicating with a Firewire connected FLEX-5000
by reading the serial number and revision numbers for installed hardware
components.

You can access the article using the URL listed below.
http://kb.flex-radio.com/article.aspx?id=10433


-Tim
FRS KB Administrator

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[Flexradio] more midi questions, SysEx, mfr ID

[Jim Lux]

It looks like the long messages (aside from simple note on/off) are 
using a standard SysEx type structure.  You've got a manufacturer 
code of 00 00 41, which one source gives as Microsoft, but the MMA 
says Microsoft is 00 01 0A.  No matter, as long as it's consistent, I 
suppose.  Why not apply for a Flex-Radio manufacturer ID (except it 
probably costs a fortune...)


There's a field labeled in the code as Protocol ID, but I think it's 
always zero?  Is this right?.. basically reserved for future expansion.

And the msgID just increments every message, and is used to relate a 
response to the message that was sent?


Jim, W6RMK  



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