[Flexradio] Tokyo Hy-Power external automatic antenna tuner

[TOM BLACKWELL]

Is there anyone here with experience with the 5000a and the Tokyo
Hy-Power antenna tuner (model HC-1.5KAT) ?


http://www.thp.co.jp/thp%20hp%20Eng/amateur_eng/others.htm#hc1.5kat


-- 


  Regards, TOM BLACKWELL, PO Box 25403, Dallas, Texas 75225











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Re: [Flexradio] AGC

[Dale Boresz]

Hi Dennis,

I think you may have confused me with one of the other contributors to 
this thread. I agree with you -- I think the current AGC implementation 
works very well. I like the ability to be able to apply as much or as 
little gain compression as is needed. Generally, I don't like a flat AGC 
response (lots of compression), but I also don't like to hear a lot of 
band noise, so I've found that an AGC-T setting of about 68 provides a 
nice balance between the two.

There's also a lot that can be done via the "Custom" AGC setting where 
all AGC parameters can be adjusted via the Setup > DSP > AGC/ALC tab in 
the [AGC] grouping of controls.

73, Dale
WA8SRA

 
Dennis Petrich wrote:
> Hi Dale,
>
> I didn't quite understand your response.  First you said you liked the 
> AGC-T and then you said you didn't?  So your response was a bit 
> confusing to me...
>
> My thoughts on the subject are:
>
> "I disagree with your comments about AGC-T.  It works exactly the way 
> the advanced "delayed AGC threshold" system is supposed to work.  For 
> example the Collins 75A4 uses a "delayed AGC threshold" system and it 
> has no problem with loud signals when they occur while you are 
> listening to weak signals."
>
> I just got my SDR-1000 with FA-66 a few weeks ago and am very 
> satisfied so far.  The only think I don't quite like are all the spurs 
> at the bottom of the noise floor but I'll get use to them I'm sure...
>
> 73's, Dennis, k0eoo
>
> - Original Message - From: "Robert Dennison" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; 
> Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2008 1:56 PM
> Subject: Re: [Flexradio] AGC
>
>
> Hi Dale,
>
> Sorry to take so long getting back..
>
> I also like the AGC-T very much.  Here's the problem as I see it.
>
> Most modern radios implement AGC as an active feedback control system
> which maintains signal level at the set point the op picks by juggling AF
> and RF gain.  The operative words are "FEEDBACK CONTROL SYSTEM."   Having
> read the knowledge base, all of FlexRadio's information indicates that
> their implementation is one of changing gain factors using AGC-T to pick
> the point at which gain changes.  This is a deeply flawed implementation.
> In fact,  it is dangerous to my ears.
>
> Consider receiving DX CW at -90dBm, I pick an AGC threshold of 72 and an
> AF value of 72.  This gives me comfortable audio volume and very little
> noise.  Now a local with a beam and amp calls him.   At my QTH the
> local's sig strength is  -60 dbm.   That means, even if the PSDR AGC gain
> is unity above the threshold. local's signal is say 30 dBm or 1000 times
> louder in my ear  This is intolerable not to say painful.
>
> If you carefully read Knowledge Base Article 10403,  it even says as
> much:
>
> "This may not always be desirable however.  For example, consider
> participation in a roundtable.  You may find that this large difference
> between signal volume levels causes you to keep adjusting your AF [gain]
> constantly, in order to compensate for the very quiet (yet very readable)
> stations, and the louder stations.  In that case, you may want to
> increase the AGC-T and back off on the AF [gain] so that the volume
> levels of all signals will be much more uniform - although with a higher
> background level on the weaker stations."
>
> The problem in the DX CW case is you're screaming before you can find the
> mouse to make a change!  Flex really needs to understand that it's
> current AGC implementation is not acceptable and in fact most likely
> violates OSHA regulations...  A simple feedback control loop should not
> be hard to implement in floating point SW..
>
> very best regards to all
> Rob
> AB7CF
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, 05 May 2008 18:21:28 -0400 Dale Boresz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> writes:
>> Hi Rob,
>>
>> A few minutes ago, I was listening to a round table on 20m
>> (miserable
>> band condx.!). One station was about S8, one was about S6 and one
>> was
>> just at the noise floor at about S2. With my usual AGC-T setting of
>> 70,
>> I could comfortably copy the S8 and S6 stations, but the S2 station
>> was
>> just a whisper. When I turned up the volume to hear the S2 station,
>> the
>> S8 station was way too loud. So, I increased the AGC-T setting to
>> 90,
>> which caused me to turn the AF gain down a little bit because the
>> background noise was a bit too loud, however I could then copy all
>> three
>> stations at about the same level. True, the S2 station still had a
>> lot
>> of noise accompanying it that the S8 station did not, but their
>> actual
>> level in my headphones was about the same. Personally, I don't like
>>
>> setting AGC-T that high (PowerSDR's default setting) because I find
>> the
>> background noise to be irritating and fatiguing, so I usually run it
>> at
>> about the same level as you. However, I do occasionally get blasted
>> by a
>> loud station in the passband.
>>
>> I think most radios set their AGC threshold similar to PowerSDR when
>> it
>> is set to 9

Re: [Flexradio] AGC

[Dale Boresz]

Hi Rob,

I made some dynamic range measurements at two AGC-T settings, with the 
intent of determining to what degree the audio gain compression changes 
as a function of AGC-T. I used the Elecraft XG2 signal generator which 
enables switching between 1 uV and 50 uV (~34 dB)

With AGC-T = 95:
50 uV at antenna terminals produces .125 Vrms audio output
1 uV at antenna terminals produces .120 Vrms audio output
Audio voltage ratio = 0.35 dB (Virtually no change in audio level for 
change of almost six s-units)

With AGC-T = 40:
50 uV at antenna terminals produces .125 Vrms audio output
1 uV at antenna terminals produces .010 Vrms audio output
Audio voltage ratio = 22 dB

If you figure that 1dB is the least perceptible change, then with an 
AGC-T setting of 95, there is no perceived difference in loudness 
between a signal at S9 and one barely over S3.

With AGC-T set to 40, the same change on the input produces a 22 dB 
difference in volume level, and I have no doubt that if the volume level 
is already raised to hear the weak one, a 22 dB increase would be pretty 
jarring.

So, setting AGC-T to 95 should protect your ears -- at the expense of 
greater noise between the signal peaks, but the weak DX is still just as 
copyable, it's just a little more fatiguing because of the higher noise 
level. For CW, a little bit of RX EQ to roll off the higher frequencies 
of the noise helps to reduce that listening fatigue by quite a bit.

I believe PowerSDR's AGC system is currently based upon the concepts 
presented in this article: 
http://support.flex-radio.com/Downloads.aspx?id=98 by Phil Harman, 
VK6APH. To what degree, I do not know.

73, Dale
WA8SRA




Robert Dennison wrote:
> Hi Dale,
> Sorry to take so long getting back..
> I also like the AGC-T very much. Here's the problem as I see it.
> Most modern radios implement AGC as an active feedback control system 
> which maintains signal level at the set point the op picks by juggling 
> AF and RF gain. The operative words are "FEEDBACK CONTROL SYSTEM." 
> Having read the knowledge base, all of FlexRadio's information 
> indicates that their implementation is one of changing gain factors 
> using AGC-T to pick the point at which gain changes. This is a deeply 
> flawed implementation. In fact, it is dangerous to my ears.
> Consider receiving DX CW at -90dBm, I pick an AGC threshold of 72 and 
> an AF value of 72. This gives me comfortable audio volume and very 
> little noise. Now a local with a beam and amp calls him. At my QTH the 
> local's sig strength is -60 dbm. That means, even if the PSDR AGC gain 
> is unity above the threshold. local's signal is say 30 dBm or 1000 
> times louder in my ear This is intolerable not to say painful.
> If you carefully read Knowledge Base Article 10403, it even says as much:
> "This may not always be desirable however. For example, consider 
> participation in a roundtable. You may find that this large difference 
> between signal volume levels causes you to keep adjusting your AF 
> [gain] constantly, in order to compensate for the very quiet (yet very 
> readable) stations, and the louder stations. In that case, you may 
> want to increase the AGC-T and back off on the AF [gain] so that the 
> volume levels of all signals will be much more uniform – although with 
> a higher background level on the weaker stations."
> The problem in the DX CW case is you're screaming before you can find 
> the mouse to make a change! Flex really needs to understand that it's 
> current AGC implementation is not acceptable and in fact most likely 
> violates OSHA regulations... A simple feedback control loop should not 
> be hard to implement in floating point SW..
> very best regards to all
> Rob
> AB7CF
> On Mon, 05 May 2008 18:21:28 -0400 Dale Boresz <[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> > writes:
> > Hi Rob,
> >
> > A few minutes ago, I was listening to a round table on 20m
> > (miserable
> > band condx.!). One station was about S8, one was about S6 and one
> > was
> > just at the noise floor at about S2. With my usual AGC-T setting of
> > 70,
> > I could comfortably copy the S8 and S6 stations, but the S2 station
> > was
> > just a whisper. When I turned up the volume to hear the S2 station,
> > the
> > S8 station was way too loud. So, I increased the AGC-T setting to
> > 90,
> > which caused me to turn the AF gain down a little bit because the
> > background noise was a bit too loud, however I could then copy all
> > three
> > stations at about the same level. True, the S2 station still had a
> > lot
> > of noise accompanying it that the S8 station did not, but their
> > actual
> > level in my headphones was about the same. Personally, I don't like
> >
> > setting AGC-T that high (PowerSDR's default setting) because I find
> > the
> > background noise to be irritating and fatiguing, so I usually run it
> > at
> > about the same level as you. However, I do occasionally get blasted
> > by a
> > loud station in the passband.
> >

Re: [Flexradio] AGC

[Bob Tracy]

Rob,

In you message you said:

"Flex really needs to understand that it's current AGC implementation is not
acceptable and in fact most likely violates OSHA regulations..."

Whether or not the AGC implementation is acceptable or not is a personal
opinion, for the sound pressure levels to be violating OSHA (OCCUPATIONAL
Safety and Health Administration) regulations would require that the radio
be used in the workplace and the levels exceed 115 dBA continuous or 140 dB
SPL impulse.

I personally have never experienced a problem with excessive noise in my
headsets but I live in a rural setting with the nearest KW+ about four miles
away.  Having been a "professional" CW op in a previous life, I have had my
ears blasted and can sympathize with your complaint.

73,

Bob, K5KDN

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Robert Dennison
Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2008 1:57 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; flexradio@flex-radio.biz
Subject: Re: [Flexradio] AGC


Hi Dale,

Sorry to take so long getting back..

I also like the AGC-T very much.  Here's the problem as I see it.

Most modern radios implement AGC as an active feedback control system
which maintains signal level at the set point the op picks by juggling AF
and RF gain.  The operative words are "FEEDBACK CONTROL SYSTEM."   Having
read the knowledge base, all of FlexRadio's information indicates that
their implementation is one of changing gain factors using AGC-T to pick
the point at which gain changes.  This is a deeply flawed implementation.
 In fact,  it is dangerous to my ears.

Consider receiving DX CW at -90dBm, I pick an AGC threshold of 72 and an
AF value of 72.  This gives me comfortable audio volume and very little
noise.  Now a local with a beam and amp calls him.   At my QTH the
local's sig strength is  -60 dbm.   That means, even if the PSDR AGC gain
is unity above the threshold. local's signal is say 30 dBm or 1000 times
louder in my ear  This is intolerable not to say painful.

If you carefully read Knowledge Base Article 10403,  it even says as
much:

"This may not always be desirable however.  For example, consider
participation in a roundtable.  You may find that this large difference
between signal volume levels causes you to keep adjusting your AF [gain]
constantly, in order to compensate for the very quiet (yet very readable)
stations, and the louder stations.  In that case, you may want to
increase the AGC-T and back off on the AF [gain] so that the volume
levels of all signals will be much more uniform – although with a higher
background level on the weaker stations."

The problem in the DX CW case is you're screaming before you can find the
mouse to make a change!  Flex really needs to understand that it's
current AGC implementation is not acceptable and in fact most likely
violates OSHA regulations...  A simple feedback control loop should not
be hard to implement in floating point SW..

very best regards to all
Rob
AB7CF





On Mon, 05 May 2008 18:21:28 -0400 Dale Boresz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
writes:
> Hi Rob,
>
> A few minutes ago, I was listening to a round table on 20m
> (miserable
> band condx.!). One station was about S8, one was about S6 and one
> was
> just at the noise floor at about S2. With my usual AGC-T setting of
> 70,
> I could comfortably copy the S8 and S6 stations, but the S2 station
> was
> just a whisper. When I turned up the volume to hear the S2 station,
> the
> S8 station was way too loud. So, I increased the AGC-T setting to
> 90,
> which caused me to turn the AF gain down a little bit because the
> background noise was a bit too loud, however I could then copy all
> three
> stations at about the same level. True, the S2 station still had a
> lot
> of noise accompanying it that the S8 station did not, but their
> actual
> level in my headphones was about the same. Personally, I don't like
>
> setting AGC-T that high (PowerSDR's default setting) because I find
> the
> background noise to be irritating and fatiguing, so I usually run it
> at
> about the same level as you. However, I do occasionally get blasted
> by a
> loud station in the passband.
>
> I think most radios set their AGC threshold similar to PowerSDR when
> it
> is set to 90, so that all signals are at about the same audio level
> in
> the headphones or speakers. The only thing that changes is the
> amount of
> noise that accompanies the signal. I really like the fact that
> PowerSDR
> allows us to change that threshold (and essentially sneak up on
> AGC-OFF
> without quite getting there) because lowering the number drastically
>
> reduces noise level between signal peaks. The downside to that
> though is
> the increased possibility of getting blasted by a strong station.
> I've
> learned the hard way, to never turn the AF gain up too high while
> the
> AGC-T setting is set low. If I know that I'm going to have to dig
> for
> weak sig's, I bump up the AGC-T to the mid-80 range, and turn down
> the
> audio gain to 

Re: [Flexradio] AGC

[Robert Dennison]

Hi Dale,

Sorry to take so long getting back..

I also like the AGC-T very much.  Here's the problem as I see it.

Most modern radios implement AGC as an active feedback control system
which maintains signal level at the set point the op picks by juggling AF
and RF gain.  The operative words are "FEEDBACK CONTROL SYSTEM."   Having
read the knowledge base, all of FlexRadio's information indicates that
their implementation is one of changing gain factors using AGC-T to pick
the point at which gain changes.  This is a deeply flawed implementation.
 In fact,  it is dangerous to my ears.

Consider receiving DX CW at -90dBm, I pick an AGC threshold of 72 and an
AF value of 72.  This gives me comfortable audio volume and very little
noise.  Now a local with a beam and amp calls him.   At my QTH the
local's sig strength is  -60 dbm.   That means, even if the PSDR AGC gain
is unity above the threshold. local's signal is say 30 dBm or 1000 times
louder in my ear  This is intolerable not to say painful.

If you carefully read Knowledge Base Article 10403,  it even says as
much:

"This may not always be desirable however.  For example, consider
participation in a roundtable.  You may find that this large difference
between signal volume levels causes you to keep adjusting your AF [gain]
constantly, in order to compensate for the very quiet (yet very readable)
stations, and the louder stations.  In that case, you may want to
increase the AGC-T and back off on the AF [gain] so that the volume
levels of all signals will be much more uniform – although with a higher
background level on the weaker stations."

The problem in the DX CW case is you're screaming before you can find the
mouse to make a change!  Flex really needs to understand that it's
current AGC implementation is not acceptable and in fact most likely
violates OSHA regulations...  A simple feedback control loop should not
be hard to implement in floating point SW..

very best regards to all
Rob
AB7CF





On Mon, 05 May 2008 18:21:28 -0400 Dale Boresz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
writes:
> Hi Rob,
> 
> A few minutes ago, I was listening to a round table on 20m 
> (miserable 
> band condx.!). One station was about S8, one was about S6 and one 
> was 
> just at the noise floor at about S2. With my usual AGC-T setting of 
> 70, 
> I could comfortably copy the S8 and S6 stations, but the S2 station 
> was 
> just a whisper. When I turned up the volume to hear the S2 station, 
> the 
> S8 station was way too loud. So, I increased the AGC-T setting to 
> 90, 
> which caused me to turn the AF gain down a little bit because the 
> background noise was a bit too loud, however I could then copy all 
> three 
> stations at about the same level. True, the S2 station still had a 
> lot 
> of noise accompanying it that the S8 station did not, but their 
> actual 
> level in my headphones was about the same. Personally, I don't like 
> 
> setting AGC-T that high (PowerSDR's default setting) because I find 
> the 
> background noise to be irritating and fatiguing, so I usually run it 
> at 
> about the same level as you. However, I do occasionally get blasted 
> by a 
> loud station in the passband.
> 
> I think most radios set their AGC threshold similar to PowerSDR when 
> it 
> is set to 90, so that all signals are at about the same audio level 
> in 
> the headphones or speakers. The only thing that changes is the 
> amount of 
> noise that accompanies the signal. I really like the fact that 
> PowerSDR 
> allows us to change that threshold (and essentially sneak up on 
> AGC-OFF 
> without quite getting there) because lowering the number drastically 
> 
> reduces noise level between signal peaks. The downside to that 
> though is 
> the increased possibility of getting blasted by a strong station. 
> I've 
> learned the hard way, to never turn the AF gain up too high while 
> the 
> AGC-T setting is set low. If I know that I'm going to have to dig 
> for 
> weak sig's, I bump up the AGC-T to the mid-80 range, and turn down 
> the 
> audio gain to make the levels comfortable again.
> 
> vy 73, Dale
> WA8SRA
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Robert Dennison wrote:
> > Hi Dale,
> >
> > Thanks for the response.  That's about how I thought the AGC-T 
> control
> > works.   Still it seems to me either PowerSDR's response is 
> extremely
> > slow, or the AGC compression curve is linear not exponential.  
> >
> > In the prior case the problem may lie in the Windoze audio system, 
> in the
> > other case they have some algorithm work to do..  maybe both...
> >
> > As it stands, I think Flex is leaving potential liability on the 
> table!  
> > I've never had an experience where I had to rip my phones off in
> > thousands of hours of air time!
> >
> > vy 73
> > Rob  
> >
> >
> > On Mon, 05 May 2008 08:40:06 -0400 Dale Boresz 
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > writes:
> >   
> >> Rob,
> >>
> >> One of the great things about PowerSDR is that you can so easily 
> 
> >> adjust 
> >> the AGC threshold to accomodate band 

Re: [Flexradio] w2rf update 2 for CW ops

[Dave Blaschke]

Ed, W2RF, you are on a roll. Keep up the great work. Working mighty 
fine here on CW

Dave, W5UN


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Re: [Flexradio] Help.

[EAJacobson]

I agree. The button should definitely click in and out. My 5000A power 
button did hang up at times when I first got it. Loosening the screws 
holding the front face on and moving it slightly has eliminated the issue.

GL & 73,
Ed
WB0VHF

At 05:33 AM 5/11/2008, you wrote:
>Check to see that the power button isn't physically stuck in the on
>position.  The button on my Flex sticks all the time.
>
>de Rick, KN3C
>
>
>
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>http://www.flex-radio.com/


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Re: [Flexradio] w2rf update 2 for CW ops

[Mel Whitten]

Yes, great cw improvement!  I would like to see
"less changes" in the GUI between rx to rx and tx to rx.
I find this a bit distracting. Perhaps, an option to "turn off"
GUI changes in cw tx?  Just leave the GUI as is during
tx and toggle the start/stop color only.

Thanks, Ed!

Mel, k0pfx



- Original Message - 
From: "John Sweeney" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; 
Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2008 7:10 AM
Subject: Re: [Flexradio] w2rf update 2 for CW ops


> CW ops, give the new w2rf SVN a try!There is significant improvement 
> in
> full QSK performance.  Ed , W2RF, even posted an updated SVN at 5AM
> Sunday morning.  Ed must dream about this stuff.
>
> Now with no audio pops or crackles on the TR/RX transition.  Can't quite
> hear between the elements of a letter at 26wps, but can hear between
> letters.   Set sidetone level at same level as AF sounds best.
>
> Settings:audio-  96K/256( 48K/256  is good too),   DSP buffer-
> 4096/256   ,Delay 10ms ,  Ramp(MS)  3 or 4weight 55
>
>
>
>
>
> John, N3WT
>
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Ed Russell
> Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2008 8:10 PM
> To: flexradio@flex-radio.biz
> Subject: [Flexradio] w2rf update 2 for CW ops
>
> CW Flexers,
>
> I've again made some significant changes to the QSK response. Let me
> know of any questions or problems.
>
> Available in the SVN w2rf branch.
>
> 73 Ed W2RF
>
>
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> http://www.flex-radio.com/
>
>
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>
> 



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Re: [Flexradio] Shuttle Pro 2 Keyboard Shortcuts

[Peter Spader]

Thanks Ken and Dale! I have it now.

Pete (K2HGO)


- Original Message - 
From: "Peter Spader" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2008 9:25 PM
Subject: [Flexradio] Shuttle Pro 2 Keyboard Shortcuts


>I have decided to try the Shuttle Pro 2 with my 5000A.  The quick Start 
>guide refers to a spreadsheet of keyboard shortcuts at:
> www.flex-radio.com/keymap.xls
>
> It does not seem to be there anymore and I cannot find it abywhere on the 
> Flexradio site.  Does anyone know where it is now?
>
> Thanks
>
> Pete (K2HGO)
>
>
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> http://www.flex-radio.com/
>
> 



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Re: [Flexradio] Behringer Re: M Delta 44 and Flex 1000

[David Little]

Jim,

My use of Behringer as example is just a target of opportunity as they are
noted for lowest price.  

Our US made audio gear that is FCC compliant isn't exactly known for being
inexpensive, or even cost efficient.

I am sure that a US made product that does the same job as the fifty dollar
Behringer model could be bought for less than three to five hundred
dollars...

I am not a fan of theirs, nor do I own any of their gear, but do appreciate
the research, and will keep it in mind.

David
KD4NUE

-Original Message-
From: Jim Lux [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2008 10:09 AM
To: David Little
Cc: flexradio@flex-radio.biz
Subject: Behringer Re: [Flexradio] M Delta 44 and Flex 1000


Quoting David Little <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on Sun 11 May 2008  
04:10:30 AM PDT:

> Tom,

> If it is inadequate for the job, let the poor soul know it is inadequate
for
> the job, and that a $40.00 Behringer will solve the problem; before they
> develop a $300.00 attitude that is neither good for themselves or Flex
> Radio.


> $49.00 being applied to an inexpensive preamp.  We really are a company
who
> care about our customers.  I would recommend buying a Behringer 502 or 802
> mixer and see if that doesn't take care of the problem.  If you find that
> this solves your problems and makes the SDR experience more enjoyable,
> perhaps you would consider paying the $49.00 tech support supplement so we
> can continue the SDR family atmosphere and give the best advice every
time,
> even if it hurts a bit.
>


It's only somewhat related, but I have a bit of a problem with using  
Behringer gear.  Sure, it's inexpensive, and works fairly well, but  
the company itself is notorious for having been slapped with the  
largest(?) fine ever for non-Part 15 compliance (>$1M).  If you read  
the FCC notices, you get the distinct impression that Behringer really  
didn't give a rodent's fuzzy behind for the rules, and considered it  
just a cost of doing business.

Since we in ham radio live and die by those FCC rules, in particular  
Part 15, I think it incumbent on us to not support blatant scofflaws.  
My opionion only, for what it's worth.

Jim, W6RMK

original press release:
http://www.fcc.gov/eb/News_Releases/DOC-263862A1.html
The NAL: http://www.fcc.gov/eb/Orders/2006/FCC-06-13A1.html

"Behringer acknowledged that its audio
  products are Class B digital devices subject to the
  Commission's equipment verification and related
  requirements, including the applicable technical
  standards.   Behringer also acknowledged that it
  had not verified compliance of any of the 66 models
  of its digital devices with the applicable FCC
  technical standards, prior to importing and
  marketing such devices in the United States.
..
Accordingly, based on the preponderance
  of the evidence, we find that Behringer apparently
  violated, and continues to violate more than a year
  after receiving the First LOI from the Enforcement
  Bureau, Section 302(b) of the Act and Section
  2.803(a) of the Rules by marketing unauthorized
  Class B digital devices in the United States.
  Within the last year specifically, which is the
  time period covered by this NAL, Behringer
  apparently marketed 50 models of unauthorized Class
  B digital devices in the United States.



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[Flexradio] Behringer Re: M Delta 44 and Flex 1000

[Jim Lux]

Quoting David Little <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on Sun 11 May 2008  
04:10:30 AM PDT:

> Tom,

> If it is inadequate for the job, let the poor soul know it is inadequate for
> the job, and that a $40.00 Behringer will solve the problem; before they
> develop a $300.00 attitude that is neither good for themselves or Flex
> Radio.


> $49.00 being applied to an inexpensive preamp.  We really are a company who
> care about our customers.  I would recommend buying a Behringer 502 or 802
> mixer and see if that doesn't take care of the problem.  If you find that
> this solves your problems and makes the SDR experience more enjoyable,
> perhaps you would consider paying the $49.00 tech support supplement so we
> can continue the SDR family atmosphere and give the best advice every time,
> even if it hurts a bit.
>


It's only somewhat related, but I have a bit of a problem with using  
Behringer gear.  Sure, it's inexpensive, and works fairly well, but  
the company itself is notorious for having been slapped with the  
largest(?) fine ever for non-Part 15 compliance (>$1M).  If you read  
the FCC notices, you get the distinct impression that Behringer really  
didn't give a rodent's fuzzy behind for the rules, and considered it  
just a cost of doing business.

Since we in ham radio live and die by those FCC rules, in particular  
Part 15, I think it incumbent on us to not support blatant scofflaws.  
My opionion only, for what it's worth.

Jim, W6RMK

original press release: http://www.fcc.gov/eb/News_Releases/DOC-263862A1.html
The NAL: http://www.fcc.gov/eb/Orders/2006/FCC-06-13A1.html

"Behringer acknowledged that its audio
  products are Class B digital devices subject to the
  Commission's equipment verification and related
  requirements, including the applicable technical
  standards.   Behringer also acknowledged that it
  had not verified compliance of any of the 66 models
  of its digital devices with the applicable FCC
  technical standards, prior to importing and
  marketing such devices in the United States.
..
Accordingly, based on the preponderance
  of the evidence, we find that Behringer apparently
  violated, and continues to violate more than a year
  after receiving the First LOI from the Enforcement
  Bureau, Section 302(b) of the Act and Section
  2.803(a) of the Rules by marketing unauthorized
  Class B digital devices in the United States.
  Within the last year specifically, which is the
  time period covered by this NAL, Behringer
  apparently marketed 50 models of unauthorized Class
  B digital devices in the United States.



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Re: [Flexradio] w2rf update 2 for CW ops

[FireBrick]

Big time improvement.
And the settings below even work in 192K for me.
I'm not a QSK type.
The relay chatter is too annoying in contesting or dxing. (amp relays)
So I keep my Delay around 150ms
At 192K, still a pop or crackle occasionally.
I can live with it when the DX station has a big spread QSX and I need to see 
the station worked.

Ed Russel and Steve Nance are my heros. They have made my Flex5Ka a 
contesting/dxing machine.
now if they could just write software to raise the SFI. 
I can't hear that XW1B on 30 cw 

Also all the guys at Flex, don't want to leave them out.

With their software I presently have running.
PWSDR SVN 2188
DDTu powering: & (controlling Quadra)
DXBase2008
DXLabs Suite of Commander, SC, DXK, WW, DXV(rotor control)
   Writelog for the Volta Contest
VE7CC's cluster frontend feeding SC and DXBase

CPU use about 30-35% on a 3.2meg quad core Dell





On 5/11/2008 7:10:09 AM, John Sweeney ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
> CW ops, give the new w2rf SVN a try!There is significant improvement
> in
> full QSK performance.  Ed , W2RF, even posted an updated SVN at 5AM
> Sunday morning.  Ed must dream about this stuff.
> 
> Now with no audio pops or crackles on the TR/RX transition.
> Can't quite
> hear between the elements of a letter at 26wps, but can hear between
> letters.   Set sidetone level at same level as AF sounds best.
> 
> Settings:audio-  96K/256( 48K/256  is good too),   DSP buffer-
> 4096/256   ,Delay 10ms ,  Ramp(MS)  3 or 4weight 55
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> John, N3WT
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Ed Russell
> Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2008 8:10 PM
> To: flexradio@flex-radio.biz
> Subject: [Flexradio] w2rf update 2 for CW ops
> 
> CW Flexers,
> 
> I've
> again made some significant changes to the QSK response. Let me
> know of any questions or problems.
> 
> Available in the SVN w2rf branch.
> 
> 73 Ed W2RF
> 
> 
> ___
> FlexRadio Systems Mailing List
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: [Flexradio] w2rf update 2 for CW ops

[John Sweeney]

CW ops, give the new w2rf SVN a try!There is significant improvement in
full QSK performance.  Ed , W2RF, even posted an updated SVN at 5AM
Sunday morning.  Ed must dream about this stuff.

Now with no audio pops or crackles on the TR/RX transition.  Can't quite
hear between the elements of a letter at 26wps, but can hear between
letters.   Set sidetone level at same level as AF sounds best.

Settings:audio-  96K/256( 48K/256  is good too),   DSP buffer-
4096/256   ,Delay 10ms ,  Ramp(MS)  3 or 4weight 55





John, N3WT

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Ed Russell
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2008 8:10 PM
To: flexradio@flex-radio.biz
Subject: [Flexradio] w2rf update 2 for CW ops

CW Flexers,

I've again made some significant changes to the QSK response. Let me
know of any questions or problems.

Available in the SVN w2rf branch.

73 Ed W2RF


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http://www.flex-radio.com/


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Re: [Flexradio] M Delta 44 and Flex 1000

[David Little]

Tom,

This is probably the best description/explanation that I have received to
date.  

The bottom line is that the SDR-1000 transceiver, PowerSDR Software and M
Delta 44 Sound card combo is not an acceptable setup until you add a Mic
preamp into the equation.

Another sound card solves the problem, audio processing solves the problem,
a preamp solves the problem.

However, there is a problem.

It no longer matters.  

The SDR-1000 is now an orphan, mine will ship out to the new owner minutes
after it arrives back fro Flex-Radio, and I will do my homework better next
time around.

All I would request in return is that folks be a little more honest with the
new owner using the M Delta 44 sound card.  

If it is inadequate for the job, let the poor soul know it is inadequate for
the job, and that a $40.00 Behringer will solve the problem; before they
develop a $300.00 attitude that is neither good for themselves or Flex
Radio.

I would not sell my SDR-1000 until I had a very long telephone conversation
with the new prospective owner, letting him know the problem with the Delta
44 and how to solve it.  I wouldn't sell it otherwise.  I don't have a
business to run, but have been buying and selling via e-commerce since the
days of CompuServe's Hamnet accessed by 300 Baud dial-up.  

In those 27 to 28 years of being involved with e-commerce, I have learned
that when you are dealing with someone you don't know, will probably never
meet, and can't look in the eye that either one of 2 things will happen:
Someone is likely to get twisted out of shape (properly defined as "screwed"
in contemporary vernacular), or a lot of questions need to be answered; even
if they are not asked.  No-one knows more about what is up for sale than the
person who owns it and has used it.  

In my transaction, I am comfortable that the new owner has a good
understanding of the strong and weak points of the outfit, is getting a
setup that is in proper operating condition, and is qualified to make it
play.  He got a great price on it, I took my lumps and I will move forward.
Life is a learning experience.

I appreciate your help, and that of all the others who took the time to
respond.

If the tech support that I paid the $49.00 for after my first encounter had
been more forthright, I would probably be a happy SDR-1000 owner today.  I
would have surely paid the extra $40.00 to make up for the shortcomings in
the Flex SDR-1000 as originally shipped with the M Delta 44 Card.  In fact,
based on my experience with sealing on the retail level over the past 40
years, if I was faced with the same situation I would have done this:

Situation:  SDR-1000 Radio, PowerSDR Software and M Delta 44 are discovered
not to be a well matched combo

Evolution:  Folks identify the problem and overcome it with an inexpensive
addition to better match the setup (Behringer or equivalent)

Fork in the road: New owner has problems with poor audio 
Fork 1.  Do this, Do that, take 2 aspirins and pay $49.00 for tech support
Fork 2:  Hi, I am David from Flex-Radio customer support.  The problem you
describe is fairly common.  It was shortcoming in the choices originally
made for distribution.  We charge $49.00 for tech support to defray the time
spent on the phone that could be spent developing the product and making
better choices in the future.  Your problem could be solved with the same
$49.00 being applied to an inexpensive preamp.  We really are a company who
care about our customers.  I would recommend buying a Behringer 502 or 802
mixer and see if that doesn't take care of the problem.  If you find that
this solves your problems and makes the SDR experience more enjoyable,
perhaps you would consider paying the $49.00 tech support supplement so we
can continue the SDR family atmosphere and give the best advice every time,
even if it hurts a bit.

Folks, I can almost promise you that the second choice will exponentially
reap benefits.  

You will occasionally find the truly socialistic ham that will never pay for
tech support and will expect a $100.00 item to outperform a $1000.000 item,
simply because they are out the $100.00.  Nothing to see here; move along.
The cure for their problem is not tech support; it is attrition.
Pallbearers 'R Us will help seal their fate.

The other side of the coin is the Ham who understands that this is not a
perfect world and really appreciates being treated with respect and honesty;
the first time and every time - Just like a Bic pen's purported reliability.

It is the second customer type that will decide and provide the continuity
necessary for a company's viability in the future.

Flex-Radio has the right idea at the right time as far as design and the way
of the future.  I hope that my suggestions will be considered as a means of
keeping the doors open long enough to help the right idea, at the right time
become commonplace.

And, Tom, this wasn't aimed at you.  I really do appreciate you explanation
and confirmation, as well

Re: [Flexradio] Help.

[Rick Markey, KN3C]

Check to see that the power button isn't physically stuck in the on
position.  The button on my Flex sticks all the time.

de Rick, KN3C



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