Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ??
The article about broadband noise from the Flex radios was published in the DUBUS Magazine 3 -2013. I was a long time waiting for a official response from Flexradio. As nothing happened I contacted Flexradio and got the same information from Tim Ellison: Yes, we agree upon SM5BSZs measurement but this broadband noise is in our opinion but a practical problem. If it is, buy a Flex 6000. SM5BSZ has in his article proposed a solution to minimize the problem, but this seems not to have any interest at Flexradio. Im an active microwaver. Until I got this message I used 2 Flex 1500 with transverters and PAs to 1,3 47 GHz. On some bands I use maximum legal power and dish antennas. Under good propagation conditions I can raise the noise floor at UK stations 600 km away across the North Sea. That is not OK even if the radio meets US standard. Thats too bad. This arrogant attitude to the problem has forced me and other microwavers to go for radios not suffering from this problem, f. ex KX3 or ANAN. My 2 Flex 1500 are now collecting dust on the shelf. Vy 73 de OZ1FF - Kjeld Phone/SMS +45 4021 1119 Skype oz1ff-1 mailto:kj...@oz1ff.dk mailto:kj...@oz1ff.dk http://www.oz1ff.dk/ http://www.oz1ff.dk ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ??
My toyota Prius is a wonderful piece of technology but I don't expect it to excel at all things. Saves gas but will never win anything. On Apr 23, 2014, at 5:42 AM, Kjeld Bülow Thomsen oz...@mail.dk wrote: The article about broadband noise from the Flex radios was published in the DUBUS Magazine 3 -2013. I was a long time waiting for a official response from Flexradio. As nothing happened I contacted Flexradio and got the same information from Tim Ellison: Yes, we agree upon SM5BSZ’s measurement but this broadband noise is in our opinion but a practical problem. If it is, buy a Flex 6000. SM5BSZ has in his article proposed a solution to minimize the problem, but this seems not to have any interest at Flexradio. I’m an active microwaver. Until I got this message I used 2 Flex 1500 with transverters and PA’s to 1,3 – 47 GHz. On some bands I use maximum legal power and dish antennas. Under good propagation conditions I can raise the noise floor at UK stations 600 km away across the North Sea. That is not OK even if the radio meets US standard. That’s too bad. This arrogant attitude to the problem has forced me and other microwavers to go for radios not suffering from this problem, f. ex KX3 or ANAN. My 2 Flex 1500 are now collecting dust on the shelf. Vy 73 de OZ1FF - Kjeld Phone/SMS +45 4021 1119 Skype oz1ff-1 mailto:kj...@oz1ff.dk mailto:kj...@oz1ff.dk http://www.oz1ff.dk/ http://www.oz1ff.dk ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ??
I'd like to know what is arrogant about making a radio that surpasses all legitimate legal requirements by quite a bit? Most places have a noise floor so high you'll never notice this at all. Some people just live to complain and tear things down. I put that in this category. Lets just drop it. Steven On Wed, Apr 23, 2014 at 7:19 AM, Steven Hess flameb...@gmail.com wrote: I'd like to know what is arrogant about making a radio that surpasses all legitimate legal requirements by quite a bit? Most places have a noise floor so high you'll never notice this at all. Some people just live to complain and tear things down. I put that in this category. Lets just drop it. Steven On Wed, Apr 23, 2014 at 6:44 AM, Drax Felton draxfel...@gmail.com wrote: My toyota Prius is a wonderful piece of technology but I don't expect it to excel at all things. Saves gas but will never win anything. On Apr 23, 2014, at 5:42 AM, Kjeld Bülow Thomsen oz...@mail.dk wrote: The article about broadband noise from the Flex radios was published in the DUBUS Magazine 3 -2013. I was a long time waiting for a official response from Flexradio. As nothing happened I contacted Flexradio and got the same information from Tim Ellison: Yes, we agree upon SM5BSZ’s measurement but this broadband noise is in our opinion but a practical problem. If it is, buy a Flex 6000. SM5BSZ has in his article proposed a solution to minimize the problem, but this seems not to have any interest at Flexradio. I’m an active microwaver. Until I got this message I used 2 Flex 1500 with transverters and PA’s to 1,3 – 47 GHz. On some bands I use maximum legal power and dish antennas. Under good propagation conditions I can raise the noise floor at UK stations 600 km away across the North Sea. That is not OK even if the radio meets US standard. That’s too bad. This arrogant attitude to the problem has forced me and other microwavers to go for radios not suffering from this problem, f. ex KX3 or ANAN. My 2 Flex 1500 are now collecting dust on the shelf. Vy 73 de OZ1FF - Kjeld Phone/SMS +45 4021 1119 Skype oz1ff-1 mailto:kj...@oz1ff.dk mailto:kj...@oz1ff.dk http://www.oz1ff.dk/ http://www.oz1ff.dk ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ -- Apply appropriate technology. Use what works without prejudice. Steven L Hess ARS KC6KGE DM05gd22 Owner Flex-1500 and Flex-3000, FT-857D, FT-817ND, FT-450 openSUSE Linux 12.3 KDE Known as FlameBait and The Sock Puppet of Doom. -- Apply appropriate technology. Use what works without prejudice. Steven L Hess ARS KC6KGE DM05gd22 Owner Flex-1500 and Flex-3000, FT-857D, FT-817ND, FT-450 openSUSE Linux 12.3 KDE Known as FlameBait and The Sock Puppet of Doom. ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ??
In Vermont, these people are called 'giners, Agin this, agin that. Or, as my grandmother would have said, Never wanting what you've got. Always wanting what it's not. They are always with us. On Wed, Apr 23, 2014 at 10:21 AM, Steven Hess flameb...@gmail.com wrote: I'd like to know what is arrogant about making a radio that surpasses all legitimate legal requirements by quite a bit? Most places have a noise floor so high you'll never notice this at all. Some people just live to complain and tear things down. I put that in this category. Lets just drop it. Steven On Wed, Apr 23, 2014 at 7:19 AM, Steven Hess flameb...@gmail.com wrote: I'd like to know what is arrogant about making a radio that surpasses all legitimate legal requirements by quite a bit? Most places have a noise floor so high you'll never notice this at all. Some people just live to complain and tear things down. I put that in this category. Lets just drop it. Steven On Wed, Apr 23, 2014 at 6:44 AM, Drax Felton draxfel...@gmail.com wrote: My toyota Prius is a wonderful piece of technology but I don't expect it to excel at all things. Saves gas but will never win anything. On Apr 23, 2014, at 5:42 AM, Kjeld Bülow Thomsen oz...@mail.dk wrote: The article about broadband noise from the Flex radios was published in the DUBUS Magazine 3 -2013. I was a long time waiting for a official response from Flexradio. As nothing happened I contacted Flexradio and got the same information from Tim Ellison: Yes, we agree upon SM5BSZ's measurement but this broadband noise is in our opinion but a practical problem. If it is, buy a Flex 6000. SM5BSZ has in his article proposed a solution to minimize the problem, but this seems not to have any interest at Flexradio. I'm an active microwaver. Until I got this message I used 2 Flex 1500 with transverters and PA's to 1,3 - 47 GHz. On some bands I use maximum legal power and dish antennas. Under good propagation conditions I can raise the noise floor at UK stations 600 km away across the North Sea. That is not OK even if the radio meets US standard. That's too bad. This arrogant attitude to the problem has forced me and other microwavers to go for radios not suffering from this problem, f. ex KX3 or ANAN. My 2 Flex 1500 are now collecting dust on the shelf. Vy 73 de OZ1FF - Kjeld Phone/SMS +45 4021 1119 Skype oz1ff-1 mailto:kj...@oz1ff.dk mailto:kj...@oz1ff.dk http://www.oz1ff.dk/ http://www.oz1ff.dk ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ -- Apply appropriate technology. Use what works without prejudice. Steven L Hess ARS KC6KGE DM05gd22 Owner Flex-1500 and Flex-3000, FT-857D, FT-817ND, FT-450 openSUSE Linux 12.3 KDE Known as FlameBait and The Sock Puppet of Doom. -- Apply appropriate technology. Use what works without prejudice. Steven L Hess ARS KC6KGE DM05gd22 Owner Flex-1500 and Flex-3000, FT-857D, FT-817ND, FT-450 openSUSE Linux 12.3 KDE Known as FlameBait and The Sock Puppet of Doom. ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ -- I can explain it to you, but I can't comprehend it for you. ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ??
I don’t usually want to get involved in this type of argument but I have to say for the few contacts that are made on the microwave bands in comparison to what are usually made on HF I really don’t see this as an issue also by the fact that you are using dishes with very small beam widths again it’s a non issue. You also ran the flex 1500 with no problem until you read the article it was only then that it came relevant. Ian On 23/04/2014 10:42, Kjeld Bülow Thomsen oz...@mail.dk wrote: The article about broadband noise from the Flex radios was published in the DUBUS Magazine 3 -2013. I was a long time waiting for a official response from Flexradio. As nothing happened I contacted Flexradio and got the same information from Tim Ellison: Yes, we agree upon SM5BSZ�s measurement but this broadband noise is in our opinion but a practical problem. If it is, buy a Flex 6000. SM5BSZ has in his article proposed a solution to minimize the problem, but this seems not to have any interest at Flexradio. I�m an active microwaver. Until I got this message I used 2 Flex 1500 with transverters and PA�s to 1,3 � 47 GHz. On some bands I use maximum legal power and dish antennas. Under good propagation conditions I can raise the noise floor at UK stations 600 km away across the North Sea. That is not OK even if the radio meets US standard. That�s too bad. This arrogant attitude to the problem has forced me and other microwavers to go for radios not suffering from this problem, f. ex KX3 or ANAN. My 2 Flex 1500 are now collecting dust on the shelf. Vy 73 de OZ1FF - Kjeld Phone/SMS +45 4021 1119 Skype oz1ff-1 mailto:kj...@oz1ff.dk mailto:kj...@oz1ff.dk http://www.oz1ff.dk/ http://www.oz1ff.dk ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ??
I for one appreciate hearing all sides of this story. Why else have a reflector ? IMO there is a little more to this story than meets the eye. For VHF/UHF signals the FCC limits for spurs and harmonics become more strict than those for HF signals. These signals must be at least 60 dB below the fundamental. I have the test equipment to accurately measure the phase noise mentioned in the article, and my results using my 5000A very closely match those by SM5BSZ. I would not expect the high phase noise to be an issue on HF due to the high ambient noise levels present in most environments for most ops. I am a HF and VHF op and I happen to do a lot of weak signal work on 2m and 432. I use my 5000A with V/U module along with a kW and 34 elements at 85' so I have a fairly good signal with good coverage on 2m. I also have within a 15 mile radius of me several hard core 2m EME operators who routinely work guys at and below the NF by using digital modes such as JT65 etc. The bottom line for me is this, yes the Flex radio does meet even the -60 dBc FCC requirement. However, VHF weak signal operators hunt and work signals that are right at the NF of the receiver, which, with a good LNA can be under -140 dBm. The phase noise I generate, esp when running QRO, can be WAY over the NF for even modest VHF weak signal stations. So while our signals meet FCC specs, when I operate my 5000A and a kW the noise I generate pretty much wipes out any possibility of my surrounding VHF ops from working any 2m EME or other weak DX signals. I love my 5000A and no, I will not be getting rid of it any time soon but I for one appreciate knowing what my radio does to other ops around me. Because of this I try not to operate when they are QRV. Gedas, W8BYA Gallery at http://w8bya.com Light travels faster than sound This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak. - Original Message - From: Steven Hess flameb...@gmail.com To: FlexRadio reflector FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz Sent: Wednesday, April 23, 2014 10:21 AM Subject: Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ?? I'd like to know what is arrogant about making a radio that surpasses all legitimate legal requirements by quite a bit? Most places have a noise floor so high you'll never notice this at all. Some people just live to complain and tear things down. I put that in this category. Lets just drop it. Steven On Wed, Apr 23, 2014 at 7:19 AM, Steven Hess flameb...@gmail.com wrote: I'd like to know what is arrogant about making a radio that surpasses all legitimate legal requirements by quite a bit? Most places have a noise floor so high you'll never notice this at all. Some people just live to complain and tear things down. I put that in this category. Lets just drop it. Steven On Wed, Apr 23, 2014 at 6:44 AM, Drax Felton draxfel...@gmail.com wrote: My toyota Prius is a wonderful piece of technology but I don't expect it to excel at all things. Saves gas but will never win anything. On Apr 23, 2014, at 5:42 AM, Kjeld Bülow Thomsen oz...@mail.dk wrote: The article about broadband noise from the Flex radios was published in the DUBUS Magazine 3 -2013. I was a long time waiting for a official response from Flexradio. As nothing happened I contacted Flexradio and got the same information from Tim Ellison: Yes, we agree upon SM5BSZ’s measurement but this broadband noise is in our opinion but a practical problem. If it is, buy a Flex 6000. SM5BSZ has in his article proposed a solution to minimize the problem, but this seems not to have any interest at Flexradio. I’m an active microwaver. Until I got this message I used 2 Flex 1500 with transverters and PA’s to 1,3 – 47 GHz. On some bands I use maximum legal power and dish antennas. Under good propagation conditions I can raise the noise floor at UK stations 600 km away across the North Sea. That is not OK even if the radio meets US standard. That’s too bad. This arrogant attitude to the problem has forced me and other microwavers to go for radios not suffering from this problem, f. ex KX3 or ANAN. My 2 Flex 1500 are now collecting dust on the shelf. Vy 73 de OZ1FF - Kjeld Phone/SMS +45 4021 1119 Skype oz1ff-1 mailto:kj...@oz1ff.dk mailto:kj...@oz1ff.dk http://www.oz1ff.dk/ http://www.oz1ff.dk ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ??
It is obvious that those who condemn this statement have no idea what he is talking about or understand any weak signal work . Perhaps people should educate themselves about the said topic . Sam Strongin kf4yox Sent from my iPhone On Apr 23, 2014, at 10:21 AM, Steven Hess flameb...@gmail.com wrote: I'd like to know what is arrogant about making a radio that surpasses all legitimate legal requirements by quite a bit? Most places have a noise floor so high you'll never notice this at all. Some people just live to complain and tear things down. I put that in this category. Lets just drop it. Steven On Wed, Apr 23, 2014 at 7:19 AM, Steven Hess flameb...@gmail.com wrote: I'd like to know what is arrogant about making a radio that surpasses all legitimate legal requirements by quite a bit? Most places have a noise floor so high you'll never notice this at all. Some people just live to complain and tear things down. I put that in this category. Lets just drop it. Steven On Wed, Apr 23, 2014 at 6:44 AM, Drax Felton draxfel...@gmail.com wrote: My toyota Prius is a wonderful piece of technology but I don't expect it to excel at all things. Saves gas but will never win anything. On Apr 23, 2014, at 5:42 AM, Kjeld Bülow Thomsen oz...@mail.dk wrote: The article about broadband noise from the Flex radios was published in the DUBUS Magazine 3 -2013. I was a long time waiting for a official response from Flexradio. As nothing happened I contacted Flexradio and got the same information from Tim Ellison: Yes, we agree upon SM5BSZ’s measurement but this broadband noise is in our opinion but a practical problem. If it is, buy a Flex 6000. SM5BSZ has in his article proposed a solution to minimize the problem, but this seems not to have any interest at Flexradio. I’m an active microwaver. Until I got this message I used 2 Flex 1500 with transverters and PA’s to 1,3 – 47 GHz. On some bands I use maximum legal power and dish antennas. Under good propagation conditions I can raise the noise floor at UK stations 600 km away across the North Sea. That is not OK even if the radio meets US standard. That’s too bad. This arrogant attitude to the problem has forced me and other microwavers to go for radios not suffering from this problem, f. ex KX3 or ANAN. My 2 Flex 1500 are now collecting dust on the shelf. Vy 73 de OZ1FF - Kjel ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ??
At 13:20 4/22/2014, John Kramer wrote: I read a disturbing post on the TS-2000 reflector claiming that the legacy Flex radios pollute the bands with noise .it claimed that the Flex-5000, 3000 and 1500 are by far the worst of any modern radio. The poster also said that under no circumstances should a Flex be used with an amplifier, as all this noise is amplified. Of course I jumped in to defend the Flex radios.. Then I received a private mail from the poster with a link to show an extensive study that was done which proves this point Any technical hams, and Flex in particular, please read this link. I would love to hear comments on the validity of this claim If I read this article correctly, the out-of-bandwidth emissions are being compared. As I recall, the FCC likes 60dB or so, which all the radios meet handily. Sounds like a non-issue to me. http://www.sm5bsz.com/dynrange/dubus313.pdf 73 John, ZS5J Flex-5000, Flex-3000 and Flex-1500 owner ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ -- Dave Gomberg, San Francisco NE5EE Programming since 1961 All addresses, phones, etc. at http://www.wcf.com/ham/info.html - ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ??
Yes, I first discovered this issue as i red SM5BSZs article. But I do care about my fellow radio amateurs in the neighborhood or across the North Sea. My 1,5 m dish for 23/13 cm has it 3 dB points between ~150 km over the London area. By lifted conditions that are very common during spring and summer time the signals over this distance can easily be up to 80 dB over the noise floor. So Im able to pollute the bands in the whole London area with noise. And there is a lot of weak signal communication going on there. SM5BSZ has identified the source of the TX-noise and Flexradio has confirmed this. For the SDR1000 there is an easy fix for this problem by putting a filter I the cable to the TX-soundcard. It should be easy for Flexradio to work out a fix for the 1500/3000/5000. But they recommend me to buy a new radio. Which I did. And this radio does not act as a broadband noise source. I hope that there will be a fix as I want still to use my 1500 on the less used microwave bands. A satisfied customer tells his experience to 3 other people. An unsatisfied customer tells it to 10 other people. Vy 73 de OZ1FF - Kjeld Phone/SMS +45 4021 1119 Skype oz1ff-1 mailto:kj...@oz1ff.dk mailto:kj...@oz1ff.dk http://www.oz1ff.dk/ http://www.oz1ff.dk http://www.mail-archive.com/search?l=flexradio@flex-radio.bizq=from:%22Ian +Scoble%22 Ian Scoble http://www.mail-archive.com/search?l=flexradio@flex-radio.bizq=date:201404 23 Wed, 23 Apr 2014 07:56:26 -0700 I dont usually want to get involved in this type of argument but I have to say for the few contacts that are made on the microwave bands in comparison to what are usually made on HF I really dont see this as an issue also by the fact that you are using dishes with very small beam widths again its a non issue. You also ran the flex 1500 with no problem until you read the article it was only then that it came relevant. Ian ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ??
I have two SDR1000 and have observed side band splatter on the built in PSDR pan adapters. They are significantly suppressed and of course the built in pan adapters are capable of capturing infiltrating signals that may or may not be actually delivered to the antenna port. In any case, there was a suggestion included in the original post that seems not to be taken by those that have responded...namely to keep the ALC down. I use the digital modes and the waterfall display all the time. Overdriving the required power and a freely running ALC are clearly evident from many users, but I don't see any feedback (e.g. criticism) to these operators, be they using a SDR or a conventional radio. With an FLEX SDR, it is easy to see how good or bad your signal looks, even though it is not a calibrated measurement. Minimizing the TX bandwidth filters also seem to clean up the sidebands on both the digital (AFSK) and SSB. John -Original Message- From: FlexRadio [mailto:flexradio-boun...@flex-radio.biz] On Behalf Of Ian Scoble Sent: Wednesday, April 23, 2014 9:55 AM To: flexradio@flex-radio.biz Subject: Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ?? I don’t usually want to get involved in this type of argument but I have to say for the few contacts that are made on the microwave bands in comparison to what are usually made on HF I really don’t see this as an issue also by the fact that you are using dishes with very small beam widths again it’s a non issue. You also ran the flex 1500 with no problem until you read the article it was only then that it came relevant. Ian On 23/04/2014 10:42, Kjeld Bülow Thomsen oz...@mail.dk wrote: The article about broadband noise from the Flex radios was published in the DUBUS Magazine 3 -2013. I was a long time waiting for a official response from Flexradio. As nothing happened I contacted Flexradio and got the same information from Tim Ellison: Yes, we agree upon SM5BSZ�s measurement but this broadband noise is in our opinion but a practical problem. If it is, buy a Flex 6000. SM5BSZ has in his article proposed a solution to minimize the problem, but this seems not to have any interest at Flexradio. I�m an active microwaver. Until I got this message I used 2 Flex 1500 with transverters and PA�s to 1,3 ?47 GHz. On some bands I use maximum legal power and dish antennas. Under good propagation conditions I can raise the noise floor at UK stations 600 km away across the North Sea. That is not OK even if the radio meets US standard. That�s too bad. This arrogant attitude to the problem has forced me and other microwavers to go for radios not suffering from this problem, f. ex KX3 or ANAN. My 2 Flex 1500 are now collecting dust on the shelf. Vy 73 de OZ1FF - Kjeld Phone/SMS +45 4021 1119 Skype oz1ff-1 mailto:kj...@oz1ff.dk mailto:kj...@oz1ff.dk http://www.oz1ff.dk/ http://www.oz1ff.dk ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ??
Perhaps the pollution situation is more of an ethical issue than a legal one. An analogy might help to understand. As far as I remember, the FCC and other authorities place no legal constraints on audio quality.A transmitter with badly distorted audio and a loud 120 Hz hum is painful for others to hear, but perfectly legal to transmit. Most of us would be embarrassed to use such a rig, and work vigorously to fix it when somebody tells us we sound horrible. Radio manufacturers, including Flex, tout their rigs as possessing excellent audio. It's a feature to be proud of, not required by legal rules, but considered polite to our society. I'm not a microwave guy, but it sounds to me like the Flex units RF sounds horrible in that society. Not illegal, but something to know when you make the decision as to which rig to get for your shack. For much of us, running on HF, it doesn't matter. For others, it does, and they choose a different rig, or, as some have done, simply put the unit on a shelf to collect dust after you find out how bad you sound to your neighbors on the bands. 73, /Jack de K3FIV On Wed, Apr 23, 2014 at 8:50 AM, Dave Gomberg da...@wcf.com wrote: At 13:20 4/22/2014, John Kramer wrote: I read a disturbing post on the TS-2000 reflector claiming that the legacy Flex radio’s pollute the bands with noise….it claimed that the Flex-5000, 3000 and 1500 are by far the worst of any modern radio. The poster also said that under no circumstances should a Flex be used with an amplifier, as all this noise is amplified. Of course I jumped in to defend the Flex radio’s.. Then I received a private mail from the poster with a link to show an extensive study that was done which proves this point Any technical hams, and Flex in particular, please read this link. I would love to hear comments on the validity of this claim If I read this article correctly, the out-of-bandwidth emissions are being compared. As I recall, the FCC likes 60dB or so, which all the radios meet handily. Sounds like a non-issue to me. http://www.sm5bsz.com/dynrange/dubus313.pdf 73 John, ZS5J Flex-5000, Flex-3000 and Flex-1500 owner ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ -- Dave Gomberg, San Francisco NE5EE Programming since 1961 All addresses, phones, etc. at http://www.wcf.com/ham/info.html - ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ??
Gedas, This is an interesting situation for me, and indeed I had never considered the possible unwanted emissions from a Flex or any other SDR. This is this interesting because I'm hoping to use a nice 90ft dish in the future and with the gain this beasty has I could make a right royal nuisance of myself. Again - thanks the Leif and those who brought it up. Simon Brown http://v2.sdr-radio.com -Original Message- From: FlexRadio [mailto:flexradio-boun...@flex-radio.biz] On Behalf Of Gedas I am a HF and VHF op and I happen to do a lot of weak signal work on 2m and 432. I use my 5000A with V/U module along with a kW and 34 elements at 85' so I have a fairly good signal with good coverage on 2m. I also have within a 15 mile radius of me several hard core 2m EME operators who routinely work guys at and below the NF by using digital modes such as JT65 etc. ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ??
Seeing responses from so many different segments of the ham population I found this thread very telling. Tim N9RO -Original Message- From: FlexRadio [mailto:flexradio-boun...@flex-radio.biz] On Behalf Of Jack Haverty Sent: Wednesday, April 23, 2014 11:23 AM To: Dave Gomberg Cc: Flex Reflector Subject: Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ?? Perhaps the pollution situation is more of an ethical issue than a legal one. An analogy might help to understand. As far as I remember, the FCC and other authorities place no legal constraints on audio quality.A transmitter with badly distorted audio and a loud 120 Hz hum is painful for others to hear, but perfectly legal to transmit. Most of us would be embarrassed to use such a rig, and work vigorously to fix it when somebody tells us we sound horrible. Radio manufacturers, including Flex, tout their rigs as possessing excellent audio. It's a feature to be proud of, not required by legal rules, but considered polite to our society. I'm not a microwave guy, but it sounds to me like the Flex units RF sounds horrible in that society. Not illegal, but something to know when you make the decision as to which rig to get for your shack. For much of us, running on HF, it doesn't matter. For others, it does, and they choose a different rig, or, as some have done, simply put the unit on a shelf to collect dust after you find out how bad you sound to your neighbors on the bands. 73, /Jack de K3FIV On Wed, Apr 23, 2014 at 8:50 AM, Dave Gomberg da...@wcf.com wrote: At 13:20 4/22/2014, John Kramer wrote: I read a disturbing post on the TS-2000 reflector claiming that the legacy Flex radio’s pollute the bands with noise….it claimed that the Flex-5000, 3000 and 1500 are by far the worst of any modern radio. The poster also said that under no circumstances should a Flex be used with an amplifier, as all this noise is amplified. Of course I jumped in to defend the Flex radio’s.. Then I received a private mail from the poster with a link to show an extensive study that was done which proves this point Any technical hams, and Flex in particular, please read this link. I would love to hear comments on the validity of this claim If I read this article correctly, the out-of-bandwidth emissions are being compared. As I recall, the FCC likes 60dB or so, which all the radios meet handily. Sounds like a non-issue to me. http://www.sm5bsz.com/dynrange/dubus313.pdf 73 John, ZS5J Flex-5000, Flex-3000 and Flex-1500 owner ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ -- Dave Gomberg, San Francisco NE5EE Programming since 1961 All addresses, phones, etc. at http://www.wcf.com/ham/info.html - ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
[Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ??
I read a disturbing post on the TS-2000 reflector claiming that the legacy Flex radio’s pollute the bands with noise….it claimed that the Flex-5000, 3000 and 1500 are by far the worst of any modern radio. The poster also said that under no circumstances should a Flex be used with an amplifier, as all this noise is amplified. Of course I jumped in to defend the Flex radio’s.. Then I received a private mail from the poster with a link to show an extensive study that was done which proves this point Any technical hams, and Flex in particular, please read this link. I would love to hear comments on the validity of this claim http://www.sm5bsz.com/dynrange/dubus313.pdf 73 John, ZS5J Flex-5000, Flex-3000 and Flex-1500 owner ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ??
Looks all the world to me like somebody with an agenda and an axe to grind. I don't know for sure but the tone of the writing sure reminds me of a poster over on e-ham who has been screaming about transmitter IMD performance for years. He never talks about anything else and most of us have just learned to ignore him. I wouldn't pay much attention to ityou can manipulate facts, figures and stats and prove the world is flat if you set your mind to it. Doesn't make it true. 73, Michael, W4HIJ On 4/22/2014 4:20 PM, John Kramer wrote: I read a disturbing post on the TS-2000 reflector claiming that the legacy Flex radio’s pollute the bands with noise….it claimed that the Flex-5000, 3000 and 1500 are by far the worst of any modern radio. The poster also said that under no circumstances should a Flex be used with an amplifier, as all this noise is amplified. Of course I jumped in to defend the Flex radio’s.. Then I received a private mail from the poster with a link to show an extensive study that was done which proves this point Any technical hams, and Flex in particular, please read this link. I would love to hear comments on the validity of this claim http://www.sm5bsz.com/dynrange/dubus313.pdf 73 John, ZS5J Flex-5000, Flex-3000 and Flex-1500 owner ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ??
Greg Thank you very much for your response, it does somewhat put my mind at ease. I was not aware that this complaint has been circulating for some time now - it is the first I have heard of it. Being a responsible ham, I always strive to transmit the cleanest signal that I possibly can….and so when I was mailed a copy of this study, I was very disturbed. Thanks again for the very fast response 73 John, ZS5J and C91J On 22 Apr 2014, at 10:45 PM, Greg Jurrens g...@flexradio.com wrote: John: This set of complaints has been rattling around for several years now. Here are FlexRadio's comments on the DUBUS article by SM5BSZ: 1. FlexRadio is very much aware of Leif SM5BSZ's report and his ongoing concerns regarding FlexRadio's Direct Conversion IQ-based software defined radios. He has shared his concerns with us and in public for several years. 2. The noise he refers to is an artifact of the Delta-Sigma CODECs used to generate the baseband signals. These CODECs were originally designed for the audio domain and attain very high dynamic range by modulating the noise outside of the audio passband. In this case, it's approximately 300kHz away from DC. This noise would appear to look similar to the transmit phase noise of most all transmitters. 3. We believe Leif's measurements are basically accurate and have verified them in our lab using our test equipment. 4. Using Leif's own measurements, the worst case signal generated is 82dBc, or 82dB BELOW the carrier. The FCC and CE require all spurious and unintentional signals to be at least 43dBc. We are 40dB BELOW the legal requirements so there is no issue there. At 5Watts full scale output for the FLEX-1500, the resulting signal is 0.0316 microwatts! Even if you drive an amplifier to full legal limit with your FLEX-1500, the result would only be 10 microwatts. 5. While measurable using sophisticated test equipment, we do not believe that under normal real-world operating conditions this noise will ever be perceived by other operators on the band - other than those hams within site of your tower. On a FLEX-5000A driving a full-legal limit PA, If the 5000A is transmitting on 14.349USB, a person trying to work CW at 14.001 a 1 S-unit rise in the noise floor at about a mile away BUT Only if you are in a quiet rural location that the environmental noise floor doesn't obscure it. 6. Time marches on and so does technology. Our new FLEX-6000 Series uses Direct Up Conversion technology for generating the transmitted signal. Because it's DUC, the only thing you need to worry about is the Phase Noise of the master oscillator. In our case, the oscillator is better than -140dBc/Hz at 2kHZ from the carrier! At 50kHz from the carrier its better than -150dBc/Hz. Very quiet indeed! This just isn't a problem on the new radios. Punch Line: Yes, there is a lab measurable noise hump at about 350kHz on the FLEX-1500, FLEX-3000, and FLEX-5000. No, we don't believe it's a problem in the real world unless you are trying to run Multi-Multi or a stack of FLEX-3000/5000s at Field Day on the same band. The new FLEX-6000 Signature Series employs a DUC transmitter and does not exhibit this noise. John, I hope this puts your mind to ease. You have no fear of being arrested by the NOISE POLICE for using your FLEX-1500,3000, or 5000 radio. We just hope that people would spend less time transmitting into expensive spectrum analyzers and more time re-discovering radio by transmitting on the air. 73, Greg - K5GJ FlexRadio On Tue, Apr 22, 2014 at 3:20 PM, John Kramer jkra...@iafrica.com wrote: I read a disturbing post on the TS-2000 reflector claiming that the legacy Flex radio’s pollute the bands with noise….it claimed that the Flex-5000, 3000 and 1500 are by far the worst of any modern radio. The poster also said that under no circumstances should a Flex be used with an amplifier, as all this noise is amplified. Of course I jumped in to defend the Flex radio’s.. Then I received a private mail from the poster with a link to show an extensive study that was done which proves this point Any technical hams, and Flex in particular, please read this link. I would love to hear comments on the validity of this claim http://www.sm5bsz.com/dynrange/dubus313.pdf 73 John, ZS5J Flex-5000, Flex-3000 and Flex-1500 owner ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ -- Greg Jurrens - K5GJ VP, Sales and Business Development FlexRadio Systems 4616 W Howard Lane Ste 1-150 Austin, TX 78728 T: 512-535-4713 x203 E: g...@flexradio.com “Tune in
Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ??
The original article claimed that the problem arose at UHF frequencies, and suggested that transverters shouldn't be used with the Flex. As expected, many hams did not read the entire article, and now claim that Flex's are a polluter. Tell me, have you ever seen evidence of this? Has anyone told you this? More important to me, has the original article every been independently confirmed by a lab that is unaffiliated with other SDR software? Jim KJ2P From: jkra...@iafrica.com Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2014 23:02:10 +0200 To: flexradio@flex-radio.biz Subject: Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ?? Greg Thank you very much for your response, it does somewhat put my mind at ease. I was not aware that this complaint has been circulating for some time now - it is the first I have heard of it. Being a responsible ham, I always strive to transmit the cleanest signal that I possibly can….and so when I was mailed a copy of this study, I was very disturbed. Thanks again for the very fast response 73 John, ZS5J and C91J On 22 Apr 2014, at 10:45 PM, Greg Jurrens g...@flexradio.com wrote: John: This set of complaints has been rattling around for several years now. Here are FlexRadio's comments on the DUBUS article by SM5BSZ: 1. FlexRadio is very much aware of Leif SM5BSZ's report and his ongoing concerns regarding FlexRadio's Direct Conversion IQ-based software defined radios. He has shared his concerns with us and in public for several years. 2. The noise he refers to is an artifact of the Delta-Sigma CODECs used to generate the baseband signals. These CODECs were originally designed for the audio domain and attain very high dynamic range by modulating the noise outside of the audio passband. In this case, it's approximately 300kHz away from DC. This noise would appear to look similar to the transmit phase noise of most all transmitters. 3. We believe Leif's measurements are basically accurate and have verified them in our lab using our test equipment. 4. Using Leif's own measurements, the worst case signal generated is 82dBc, or 82dB BELOW the carrier. The FCC and CE require all spurious and unintentional signals to be at least 43dBc. We are 40dB BELOW the legal requirements so there is no issue there. At 5Watts full scale output for the FLEX-1500, the resulting signal is 0.0316 microwatts! Even if you drive an amplifier to full legal limit with your FLEX-1500, the result would only be 10 microwatts. 5. While measurable using sophisticated test equipment, we do not believe that under normal real-world operating conditions this noise will ever be perceived by other operators on the band - other than those hams within site of your tower. On a FLEX-5000A driving a full-legal limit PA, If the 5000A is transmitting on 14.349USB, a person trying to work CW at 14.001 a 1 S-unit rise in the noise floor at about a mile away BUT Only if you are in a quiet rural location that the environmental noise floor doesn't obscure it. 6. Time marches on and so does technology. Our new FLEX-6000 Series uses Direct Up Conversion technology for generating the transmitted signal. Because it's DUC, the only thing you need to worry about is the Phase Noise of the master oscillator. In our case, the oscillator is better than -140dBc/Hz at 2kHZ from the carrier! At 50kHz from the carrier its better than -150dBc/Hz. Very quiet indeed! This just isn't a problem on the new radios. Punch Line: Yes, there is a lab measurable noise hump at about 350kHz on the FLEX-1500, FLEX-3000, and FLEX-5000. No, we don't believe it's a problem in the real world unless you are trying to run Multi-Multi or a stack of FLEX-3000/5000s at Field Day on the same band. The new FLEX-6000 Signature Series employs a DUC transmitter and does not exhibit this noise. John, I hope this puts your mind to ease. You have no fear of being arrested by the NOISE POLICE for using your FLEX-1500,3000, or 5000 radio. We just hope that people would spend less time transmitting into expensive spectrum analyzers and more time re-discovering radio by transmitting on the air. 73, Greg - K5GJ FlexRadio On Tue, Apr 22, 2014 at 3:20 PM, John Kramer jkra...@iafrica.com wrote: I read a disturbing post on the TS-2000 reflector claiming that the legacy Flex radio’s pollute the bands with noise….it claimed that the Flex-5000, 3000 and 1500 are by far the worst of any modern radio. The poster also said that under no circumstances should a Flex be used with an amplifier, as all this noise is amplified. Of course I jumped in to defend the Flex radio’s.. Then I received a private mail from the poster with a link to show an extensive study that was done which proves this point Any technical hams
Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ??
This thread is hardly worth the bandwidth! Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S® III mini, an ATT 4G LTE smartphone Original message From: Jim Jannuzzo jsqu...@msn.com Date:04/22/2014 2:45 PM (GMT-08:00) To: John Kramer jkra...@iafrica.com,flexradio@flex-radio.biz Subject: Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ?? The original article claimed that the problem arose at UHF frequencies, and suggested that transverters shouldn't be used with the Flex. As expected, many hams did not read the entire article, and now claim that Flex's are a polluter. Tell me, have you ever seen evidence of this? Has anyone told you this? More important to me, has the original article every been independently confirmed by a lab that is unaffiliated with other SDR software? Jim KJ2P From: jkra...@iafrica.com Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2014 23:02:10 +0200 To: flexradio@flex-radio.biz Subject: Re: [Flexradio] Flex radios are the worst polluters ?? Greg Thank you very much for your response, it does somewhat put my mind at ease. I was not aware that this complaint has been circulating for some time now - it is the first I have heard of it. Being a responsible ham, I always strive to transmit the cleanest signal that I possibly can….and so when I was mailed a copy of this study, I was very disturbed. Thanks again for the very fast response 73 John, ZS5J and C91J On 22 Apr 2014, at 10:45 PM, Greg Jurrens g...@flexradio.com wrote: John: This set of complaints has been rattling around for several years now. Here are FlexRadio's comments on the DUBUS article by SM5BSZ: 1. FlexRadio is very much aware of Leif SM5BSZ's report and his ongoing concerns regarding FlexRadio's Direct Conversion IQ-based software defined radios. He has shared his concerns with us and in public for several years. 2. The noise he refers to is an artifact of the Delta-Sigma CODECs used to generate the baseband signals. These CODECs were originally designed for the audio domain and attain very high dynamic range by modulating the noise outside of the audio passband. In this case, it's approximately 300kHz away from DC. This noise would appear to look similar to the transmit phase noise of most all transmitters. 3. We believe Leif's measurements are basically accurate and have verified them in our lab using our test equipment. 4. Using Leif's own measurements, the worst case signal generated is 82dBc, or 82dB BELOW the carrier. The FCC and CE require all spurious and unintentional signals to be at least 43dBc. We are 40dB BELOW the legal requirements so there is no issue there. At 5Watts full scale output for the FLEX-1500, the resulting signal is 0.0316 microwatts! Even if you drive an amplifier to full legal limit with your FLEX-1500, the result would only be 10 microwatts. 5. While measurable using sophisticated test equipment, we do not believe that under normal real-world operating conditions this noise will ever be perceived by other operators on the band - other than those hams within site of your tower. On a FLEX-5000A driving a full-legal limit PA, If the 5000A is transmitting on 14.349USB, a person trying to work CW at 14.001 a 1 S-unit rise in the noise floor at about a mile away BUT Only if you are in a quiet rural location that the environmental noise floor doesn't obscure it. 6. Time marches on and so does technology. Our new FLEX-6000 Series uses Direct Up Conversion technology for generating the transmitted signal. Because it's DUC, the only thing you need to worry about is the Phase Noise of the master oscillator. In our case, the oscillator is better than -140dBc/Hz at 2kHZ from the carrier! At 50kHz from the carrier its better than -150dBc/Hz. Very quiet indeed! This just isn't a problem on the new radios. Punch Line: Yes, there is a lab measurable noise hump at about 350kHz on the FLEX-1500, FLEX-3000, and FLEX-5000. No, we don't believe it's a problem in the real world unless you are trying to run Multi-Multi or a stack of FLEX-3000/5000s at Field Day on the same band. The new FLEX-6000 Signature Series employs a DUC transmitter and does not exhibit this noise. John, I hope this puts your mind to ease. You have no fear of being arrested by the NOISE POLICE for using your FLEX-1500,3000, or 5000 radio. We just hope that people would spend less time transmitting into expensive spectrum analyzers and more time re-discovering radio by transmitting on the air. 73, Greg - K5GJ FlexRadio On Tue, Apr 22, 2014 at 3:20 PM, John Kramer jkra...@iafrica.com wrote: I read a disturbing post on the TS-2000 reflector claiming that the legacy Flex radio’s pollute the bands with noise….it claimed that the Flex-5000, 3000 and 1500 are by far the worst of any modern radio
