Re: [Flightgear-devel] Pushback
Ah, thanks for your work! It's nice to hear someone's working on it. I've tried to get the pushback work yesterday and I find out that it needs a lot of power (even when towing a light bocian). But if I increase power (in the code) the pushback races when there's no plane behind. So I think (no, I know) I can't do the nasal stuff myself. It would be great if you (or someone else) will do that. Regards, Gijs Date: Sat, 12 Jan 2008 23:49:37 +0100 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] Pushback Hi Gijs, a few days ago Jester, simstick and me tried to get the pushback working over the MP-protocol. In principle it worked. But the problem is the time lag between th different users. To avoid ugly oscillations it was necessary to use a very elastic junction between pushbak und 787, which looks (and is) very unrealistic. I think many users would rate this as a bug. At aerotow the elastic tow is not so noticeable. I think for simulating pushback (or skydiver; anything where a non-elastic junction is needed), we need another concept. The FDM of the airliner in pushback (or the FMD of the skydiver while lifting) need to be switched off and the the pushback (or of the jump-plane) need to do all the simulation. Therefore we need to set position and orientation of another aircraft over the MP-protocol instead of transmitting forces. For the skydiver nearly anything is there. We just need one Nasal listener on the skydiver side, which listens for setting position/orientation/speed by the FDM and overwrites this with the values (+ offset) of the jump-plane. And we need something similar at the jump-plane to set the position of the skydiver inside the jump-plane (without the skydiver would follow the jump plane in some distance (due to the time lag)). For the pushback we need something similar. Additionally the pushback need to know the gear positions of the airliner to simulate it properly. But all this should be possible in Nasal. Best regards, Maik _ Bekijk Yes-R's real life soap op MSN Video! http://video.msn.com/video.aspx?mkt=nl-nltab=m1192527562294vid=8aff5b76-b78d-4b55-8b64-ef7e1d73aab2playlist=videoByUuids:uuids:50b732c2-c105-41e9-adf0-36bd627d4eaa,0813da8c-031b-423f-a79d-35d925aee805,5cce447e-948d-43af-9862-45bb6bb9d6d8,6a39138c-f562-4254-be70-9d93343650f8,f9b8d78f-05a4-4c74-8e4b-28d20a4037abfrom=NLNL_Yes-R- Check out the new SourceForge.net Marketplace. It's the best place to buy or sell services for just about anything Open Source. http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;164216239;13503038;w?http://sf.net/marketplace___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Pushback
Am Samstag 12 Januar 2008 schrieb Maik Justus: ...[MP FDM override]... For the pushback we need something similar. Additionally the pushback need to know the gear positions of the airliner to simulate it properly. But all this should be possible in Nasal. I'd like to see the Slave FDM implemented in C++, as I can see connections to the AI system (AIModel). Being able to reuse your code allows for push back of AI airliners (i.e. not only the MP ones), as well as proper user aircraft pushback in single player scenarios (with AI pushback trucks). Thomas - Check out the new SourceForge.net Marketplace. It's the best place to buy or sell services for just about anything Open Source. http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;164216239;13503038;w?http://sf.net/marketplace ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Pushback
Hello Maik, Am Samstag, den 12.01.2008, 23:49 +0100 schrieb Maik Justus: Hi Gijs, a few days ago Jester, simstick and me tried to get the pushback working over the MP-protocol. In principle it worked. But the problem is the time lag between th different users. To avoid ugly oscillations it was necessary to use a very elastic junction between pushbak und 787, which looks (and is) very unrealistic. I think many users would rate this as a bug. At aerotow the elastic tow is not so noticeable. I think for simulating pushback (or skydiver; anything where a non-elastic junction is needed), we need another concept. The FDM of the airliner in pushback (or the FMD of the skydiver while lifting) need to be switched off and the the pushback (or of the jump-plane) need to do all the simulation. Therefore we need to set position and orientation of another aircraft over the MP-protocol instead of transmitting forces. For the skydiver nearly anything is there. We just need one Nasal listener on the skydiver side, which listens for setting position/orientation/speed by the FDM and overwrites this with the values (+ offset) of the jump-plane. This is very interesting. I've recently done some work on detaching a view from the aircraft/vehicle to have a kind of passenger walk inside the aircraft (which is already possible in the Albatross) and on the ground while the Aircraft is somewhere else. Some of that nasal code could be reused for a skydiver which has to walk to the door prior to jumping (and of course walk on the ground if he missed the landing zone ;-) ). Who is working on the skydiver? I think we have some ideas to share. On the far end, this would enable us to load any vehicle/human model into aircraft that offer the capacity to carry anything. And we need something similar at the jump-plane to set the position of the skydiver inside the jump-plane (without the skydiver would follow the jump plane in some distance (due to the time lag)). For the pushback we need something similar. Additionally the pushback need to know the gear positions of the airliner to simulate it properly. But all this should be possible in Nasal. Best regards, Maik Gijs de Rooy schrieb am 21.12.2007 16:06: Ok, let's try the 787-8 than. Gijs Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2007 15:54:41 +0100 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] Pushback 787-8 --- Gijs de Rooy [EMAIL PROTECTED] schrieb: The 737 is JSBSim - it only works with YASim. HHS still in work: http://www.hoerbird.net/galerie.html But already done: http://www.hoerbird.net/reisen.html Well, what aircraft do you recommend? _ Bekijk Yes-R's real life soap op MSN Video! http://video.msn.com/video.aspx?mkt=nl-nltab=m1192527562294vid=8aff5b76-b78d-4b55-8b64-ef7e1d73aab2playlist=videoByUuids:uuids:50b732c2-c105-41e9-adf0-36bd627d4eaa,0813da8c-031b-423f-a79d-35d925aee805,5cce447e-948d-43af-9862-45bb6bb9d6d8,6a39138c-f562-4254-be70-9d93343650f8,f9b8d78f-05a4-4c74-8e4b-28d20a4037abfrom=NLNL_Yes-R - This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2005. http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse012070mrt/direct/01/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel still in work: http://www.hoerbird.net/galerie.html But already done: http://www.hoerbird.net/reisen.html __ Ihr erstes Fernweh? Wo gibt es den schönsten Strand? www.yahoo.de/clever - This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2005. http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse012070mrt/direct/01/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel Plan je evenement, nodig mensen uit en deel je foto's met Windows Live Events http://events.live.com - This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2005. http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse012070mrt/direct/01/
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Weekly CVS Changelog Summary: SimGear
On Sunday 13 January 2008 12:00:10 am Curtis L. Olson wrote: =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= 2008-01-06_09:04:44 (timoore) /var/cvs/SimGear-0.3/source/simgear/scene/tgdb/SGModelBin.hxx /var/cvs/SimGear-0.3/source/simgear/scene/tgdb/SGTexturedTriangleBin.hxx /var/cvs/SimGear-0.3/source/simgear/scene/util/QuadTreeBuilder.cxx Random object support from Stuart Buchanan In addition to Stuart's changes, there's an independent quad tree builder class for constructing loose quad trees from scene graph nodes. Stuart also implemented changes to the random number generator suggested by Andy Ross. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= 2008-01-06_09:04:45 (timoore) /var/cvs/SimGear-0.3/source/simgear/scene/util/QuadTreeBuilder.hxx Random object support from Stuart Buchanan In addition to Stuart's changes, there's an independent quad tree builder class for constructing loose quad trees from scene graph nodes. Stuart also implemented changes to the random number generator suggested by Andy Ross. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= 2008-01-12_02:50:21 (fredb) /var/cvs/SimGear-0.3/source/simgear/scene/model/ModelRegistry.cxx Avoid spitting gazillion 'Cannot find image file ' message on the console while loading random objects 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae I assume that the random objects include buildings. Starting up at KSFO last night after updating my sources was a nice suprise. The area was populated with buildings looking more realistic and not as barren. The real suprise is that it does not appear to have impacted frame rates and I believe it might be running smoother with slightly better framerates. signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. - Check out the new SourceForge.net Marketplace. It's the best place to buy or sell services for just about anything Open Source. http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;164216239;13503038;w?http://sf.net/marketplace___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] autopilot controller filter weirdness
On Sunday 13 January 2008 05:14, Ron Jensen wrote: On Sat, 2008-01-12 at 21:22 +, LeeE wrote: Oops - forgot to mention also that with '--log-level=info' the 'Processing registration HA-LHA with callsign MAH096/5' type messages still seem to be continuously output. Is this right? It makes the output from --log-level=info pretty useless because everything else is scrolled away - I use a 2k line scroll buffer but even so, anything from start-up is very quickly lost. LeeE add --prop:/sim/traffic-manager/enabled=0 to the command line. This is output from the traffic-manager. Ron Thanks Ron, I guessed it was from the traffic manager - it just seemed odd that the same output and values were being constantly repeated. LeeE - Check out the new SourceForge.net Marketplace. It's the best place to buy or sell services for just about anything Open Source. http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;164216239;13503038;w?http://sf.net/marketplace ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] autopilot controller filter weirdness
On Sunday 13 January 2008 06:46, K. Hoercher wrote: On Sat, Jan 12, 2008 at 09:22:15PM +, LeeE wrote: On Saturday 12 January 2008 21:12, LeeE wrote: On Saturday 12 January 2008 15:28, Curtis Olson wrote: On Jan 11, 2008 7:09 PM, LeeE wrote: From just a quick check, removing the explicit call to build() after init() in reinit() seems to work here:) New configs seems to be read in ok when the autopilot is updated via the menu - I deliberately drove an controller into oscillating and backed it back out again. Didn't notice the filter output 'oscillating' either. That was just a few minutes check though - bit short of time atm. Can some other people try the same change in xmlauto.xml (comment out/remove the call to build() at line 801) and confirm it's ok? I'd like to confirm. I had been learning/tuning/messing around with some autopilot here too. Before I could come down to a firm conclusion I seemed to have odd effects on reloading changed configurations, like apparently fighting of different controllers. When I noticed your observation here, I successfully tried the suggested commenting out (cvs of 28122007) and at least now the stuff seems to work and does also pick up changed configurations when reloading. It makes the output from --log-level=info pretty useless because everything else is scrolled away - I use a 2k line scroll buffer but even so, anything from start-up is very quickly lost. LeeE You could single out the logging class (seemingly only at runtime) by manipulating /sim/logging/classes. On a side note: I don't think the usage of SG_ALL for a couple of SG_LOG statements is a desired one. They pretty much defy that filtering out especially at higher debug levels. Imho SG_ALL is not (or should not be) a valid class for SG_LOG but a mere convenience on the logging output side of things. regards K. Hoercher Thanks for confirming - this bug has been troubling me for some time:) As this bug, and it's associated fix, will only have an effect when the autopilot is reloaded i.e. when reinit() is called, it won't have any effect in normal operation and existing autopilot controllers etc. should continue to function exactly as before. In view of this, and if no one else can find any problems with it, could this fix be applied? It's likely that some people will be developing aircraft against SG/FG v1.0 (plib) so it should probably be applied to that branch as well, in readiness for the next update to v1.0. LeeE - Check out the new SourceForge.net Marketplace. It's the best place to buy or sell services for just about anything Open Source. http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;164216239;13503038;w?http://sf.net/marketplace ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] bad error message in animation code
I just found that if you use (at least) a rotate animation and pass it a bad property in the following form: foo/bar/[0]/something You get this misleading error message: Could not find at least one of the following objects for animation: SomeObjectName This happens even when the object name is correct. Simply misspelling the property will not cause this either. It has to be an index right after a '/'. This had me looking at the .ac file and the wrong part of the animation for quite a while before I happened to spot the typo in the property tag. Josh - Check out the new SourceForge.net Marketplace. It's the best place to buy or sell services for just about anything Open Source. http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;164216239;13503038;w?http://sf.net/marketplace ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
