Re: [Foundation-l] moderation soft limit

[Mateus Nobre]

I think it's relative (like everything, anyway)

When we were discussing about image filter I remember over one hundred-mails. 
It was a good discussion. It would be hilarious if someone speak ''Hey 
everybody, we exceed the thirty messages soft limit, let's end this discussion 
right now.'' :P

Some debates are big and the consensus doesn't come easy, what could we do? 
Suddenly stop?

A ''soft'' limit is always great, but in some cases is not applicable.

_
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> Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2011 17:55:26 +0100
> From: dger...@gmail.com
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] moderation soft limit
> 
> On 25 October 2011 17:52, Andreas K.  wrote:
> 
> > For those interested, there is a current request for arbitration on English
> > Wikipedia related to the board resolution on controversial content, which
> > contains some further views and discussion. I have summarised my view that
> > our illustrations, just like our texts, should follow good practice
> > established in reliable sources here:
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case&oldid=457335488#Statement_by_Jayen466
> 
> 
> And the AC summarised theirs: 0 accept, 6 decline. As tends to happen
> when people go forum-shopping.
> 
> 
> - d.
> 
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Re: [Foundation-l] Show community consensus for Wikilove

[Mateus Nobre]

Etienne,

Why any Wikipedia would not want the Wikilove feature?

This is inconsistent for me. Wikilove's a global improvement, there's no reason 
to disagree improvements.

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> Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2011 12:31:24 -0300
> From: betie...@bellaliant.net
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Show community consensus for Wikilove
> 
> But if we enable it at a wiki that doesn't want it, there could be a
> boycott, and vandals just get the place up to there "code".  It would be
> very detrimental to wikipedia.
> 
> 
> On 11-10-29 12:27 PM, "Nickanc Wikipedia"  wrote:
> 
> > IMHO, Wikilove is something so important about wikipedia's ethics and
> > behaviour that shall be in every wiki. IMHO.
> > 
> > 2011/10/29 WereSpielChequers :
> >>> Message: 1
> >>> Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 15:31:07 -0700
> >>> From: Brandon Harris 
> >>> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] On certain shallow, American-centered,
> >>>foolish software initiatives backed by WMF
> >>> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> >>> Message-ID: <4eab2d2b.3020...@wikimedia.org>
> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> On 10/28/11 3:27 PM, Etienne Beaule wrote:
>  It's disabled on certain wikis because of technical problems.
>  
> >>> 
> >>>Oh? I wasn't aware that it had been disabled anywhere as yet.
> >>> 
> >>>WikiLove was not rolled out "en mass"; the policy for deployment of
> >>> the
> >>> tool is that it is by request only, and the requesting wiki must:
> >>> 
> >>>a) Make sure the tool is localized (via TranslateWiki);
> >>>b) Make sure they have a local configuration; and
> >>>c) Show community consensus.
> >>> 
> >>>So if it was enabled and then *disabled*, I have not heard of this.
> >>>  Is
> >>> there a bug report I can look to?  Or if you know of a wiki where this
> >>> is the case, I can do a search.
> >>> 
> >>>Thanks!
> >>> 
> >>>-b.
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> --
> >>> Brandon Harris, Senior Designer, Wikimedia Foundation
> >>> 
> >>> Support Free Knowledge: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >> Good to hear that wikilove is only going in on wikis where there is
> >> consensus for it. Can anyone give me a link to the discussion that
> >> established consensus on EN wikipedia? The nearest I could find was
> >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_%28miscellaneous%29/Archi
> >> ve_33#Thoughts_on_WikiLove.3F
> >> 
> >> Ta
> >> 
> >> WerepielChequers
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> >> 
> > 
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> 
> 
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Re: [Foundation-l] New Version of PROTECT IP Bill May Target Legal Sites

[Mateus Nobre]

What is the real situation of this law?

Is it still enter into discussion?  It has been confirmed? Or is it just a 
proposal? 

Sorry, I don't know the goings of U.S. law, but this news is concern to me.
_
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> Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2011 23:39:17 +0300
> From: cimonav...@gmail.com
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] New Version of PROTECT IP Bill May Target Legal   
> Sites
> 
> On Wed, Oct 26, 2011 at 10:49 PM, emijrp  wrote:
> > Or in a micronation, in international waters, or into orbit.[1]
> >
> > [1]
> > http://torrentfreak.com/pirate-parties-plan-to-shoot-torrent-site-into-orbit-101020/
> >
> > 2011/10/26 Etienne Beaule 
> >
> >> Or Canada, as proposed for april fools!
> >>
> >>
> >> On 11-10-26 4:16 PM, "Yaroslav M. Blanter"  wrote:
> >>
> >> > On Wed, 26 Oct 2011 20:02:19 +0200, Milos Rancic 
> >> > wrote:
> >> >> If so, goodbye wiki, as well. At least in US.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> http://yro.slashdot.org/story/11/10/26/0451240/new-version-of-protect-ip-bill-
> >> > may-target-legal-sites
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> > Well, the servers still could be moved to Europe.
> >> >
> 
> This one is never going to score. Going against a team of 900 pound
> gorillas on the
> intarwebs? Get serious. I mean, lost for words...
> 
> 
> -- 
> --
> Jussi-Ville Heiskanen, ~ [[User:Cimon Avaro]]
> 
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Re: [Foundation-l] Show community consensus for Wikilove

[Mateus Nobre]

We shouldn't be taken by the spirit of wiki environment. Sometimes, at Village 
Pump, through great debats and violent discussions, I feel like a lawyer, 
defending my point of view. We're more a tribunal than a colaborative and 
friendly ambience. Blocks are the prisons, and we're lawyers defending our 
opinions, supports are the witnesses.

Wikipedia has become more and more in a bureaucratic project until a few people 
understand its operation today. We are one of those exceptions that have come 
to understand the endless pages of policies. Do not think everyone can easily 
understand how Wikipedia works. Totally not. It's too hard guys, not everybody 
has that patience. We're few.

I think we (the Wikipedia community in general) gradually become more and more 
wikipedian and less humans. We become increasingly bureacratic, rigorous, 
severe, formal and boring. Virtually robots. Wikilove is a step against this 
process. 

We're not just talking about a tool, but a revolution in the way of 
communicative and collaborative Wikipedia. It is a way to make Wikipedia a 
family environment, not a court or an academy of letters. We need that. 
Wikipedia really needs that at all.
_
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> Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2011 19:12:52 +0530
> From: de10...@gmail.com
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Show community consensus for Wikilove
> 
> On Sun, Oct 30, 2011 at 3:52 PM, Oliver Keyes wrote:
> 
> > You seem to be missing my point - that the WL tool serves an ulterior
> > function of allowing users who do not understand markup to communicate and
> > request help in a way they can understand. I *am* saying that most of those
> > with few or no edits will have problems understanding markup, which is why
> > it's important, even without WL's core purpose, that the tool remain
> > available to new editors.
> >
> > On Sun, Oct 30, 2011 at 9:55 AM, Fae  wrote:
> >
> > > On 30 October 2011 08:06, Oliver Keyes  wrote:
> > > > Surely making it only available to those users who understand markup
> > > > completely undermines one of the great unintended consequences - that
> > > it's
> > > > really useful for posting talkpage messages?
> > >
> > > I did not equate "users with 10 edits" with those that understand
> > > markup, these are different things. My use of the word "template" is
> > > generic, in that Wikilove provides standard templates for user talk
> > > pages, this does not imply anything about the ability of users to
> > > understand wiki markup or html.
> > >
> > > Apologies if my language was not plain enough to avoid
> > > misinterpretation in unexpected ways.
> > >
> > > Cheers,
> > > Fae
> > >
> > > ___
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> >
> 
> Those are two separate things. One, the delivery mechanism for Wikilove, a
> pop-up window on top of the userpage to select and click on a pretty
> picture and add a message. Second, the actual content, the
> barn-star/kitty/food template.
> 
> I disagree with Ironholds that it would be easier for a new users to
> navigate the hundreds of pages of commonly used templates and then find the
> right one to use and then use it correctly after customizing it, as opposed
> to you know, leaving a message in plain English. Last I checked,
> "pseudo-HTML markups" weren't a necessity for posting on a talk page.
> 
> It prob. takes someone at least a good 50-100 edits before they even know
> what a template is, then using and customizing the right one might take
> longer.
> 
> The delivery mechanism on the other hand is what I think is very useful for
> new users. There is an enormous amount of benefit if that could be
> customized for new users pre-loaded with some generic help templates they
> can actually use to edit, rather than spam love.
> 
> Theo
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Re: [Foundation-l] Show community consensus for Wikilove

[Mateus Nobre]

I don't know about your family, but I have no enemies at mine. Didn't 
understand the relation about ''family environment'' and ''friends and 
enemies'': this looks like more ''factions/clans environments'' than ''family 
envornment''. Actually, in some wikipedias (including pt.wiki) we have some 
factions  (great groups of users who disagree in everything that another group 
agree, and vice versa), consequence of our lagged and tory collaborative way,  
which is actually the antithesis of the word ''collaborative'': very 
unattractive to newbies today.


When I spoke ''family'' I wanted to say we need a more likable system of 
communication. We need a real collaborative method, which not only fit for the 
editions, but for the treatment of users too. We're a big family working for a 
common objective: a world in which every single human being can freely share in 
the sum of all knowledge.

Why we treat ourselves like co-workes when we have so many things in common? 
Why we have to be a firm when we could be friends who works together for the 
common good? Why not reduce the unnecessary bureaucracy among the editors 
communication with Wikilove? It's just a way to make the Wikimedia projects 
friendly and really collaborative!
_
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> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2011 22:30:23 +0400
> From: pute...@mccme.ru
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Show community consensus for Wikilove
> 
> 
> > We're not just talking about a tool, but a revolution in the way of
> > communicative and collaborative Wikipedia. It is a way to make Wikipedia
> a
> > family environment, not a court or an academy of letters. We need that.
> > Wikipedia really needs that at all.
> > _
> > MateusNobre
> > MetalBrasil on Wikimedia projects
> > (+55) 85 88393509
> >   30440865
> 
> No, not at all. I do not want to work in a family environment. A couple of
> years ago, on Russian Wikipedia we had an admin who indeed treated
> Wikipedia as a family environment, dividing the community into "friends"
> and "enemies", being rude to enemies, making plots with friends and so on.
> She was quickly desysopped and then banned for two years, and it looks like
> she had finally learned some of her lessons, but I still recollect this
> editing atmosphere of 2008 over there as a nightmare, with several
> "families" fighting against each other and so on. I have heard that
> Portuguese Wikipedia something similar is or was going on (not that I care
> so much). Traditional societies have their advantages and disadvantages. 
> 
> Cheers
> Yaroslav
> 
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Re: [Foundation-l] Show community consensus for Wikilove

[Mateus Nobre]

Totally disagree with you, Yaroslav.

Do you really think a traditional (you know, traditional in Wikipedia 
equivalent to bureaucratic) communication and social system, friendship-free, 
at wikis reduces the efficiency? Why the friendship and camaraderie in editions 
and talk should reduce the efficiency of quality? Why working in a pleasant 
ambiete worse results. I think economists and business-men disagree with you.

For your e-mail I found that you are probably Russian. You probably have read 
Tolstoi, Anna Karênina. Using a literary example, Lievin, the landowner, 
greatly increased his profit by changing the method of work of his moujiks. The 
moujiks used to work in bad taste and bad-tempered when just followind orders 
in a bad envronment. When Lievin adopted a collaborative approach, when the 
moujiks could work without the several rules at a amicable environment, profits 
rose.
For Wikis is the same thing. Only the ideals are not enough. We have to have a 
friendly, a pleasant, a nice environment. We've to make the time of editions a 
good time to us. We've to smile editing Wikipedia. And know our work is 
important to the community, moral support. Wikilove make Wikipedia less a 
obligation and more a thing which we need every single day. This is the point.

_
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> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2011 23:22:27 +0400
> From: pute...@mccme.ru
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Show community consensus for Wikilove
> 
> > When I spoke ''family'' I wanted to say we need a more likable system of
> > communication. We need a real collaborative method, which not only fit
> for
> > the editions, but for the treatment of users too. We're a big family
> > working for a common objective: a world in which every single human
> being
> > can freely share in the sum of all knowledge.
> > 
> > Why we treat ourselves like co-workes when we have so many things in
> > common? Why we have to be a firm when we could be friends who works
> > together for the common good? Why not reduce the unnecessary bureaucracy
> > among the editors communication with Wikilove? It's just a way to make
> the
> > Wikimedia projects friendly and really collaborative!
> 
> Just because often it contradicts efficiency. Some people come here to
> make friends, other come to have the job done (some of them have an agenda,
> and others just want indeed to increase the sum of knowledge). For me
> personally, making friends sounds like opposite to efficiency, because I
> care about quality first. I see from the discussions that there are people
> like me. I also know there are many people unlike me, for whom the
> collaborative aspect is more important than the result. This is fine with
> me. I just do not want any universal decisions to be made under assumptions
> that we are all alike. We are not.
> 
> Cheers
> Yaroslav
> 
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Re: [Foundation-l] Show community consensus for Wikilove

[Mateus Nobre]

Agree with Erik at his last e-mail. To me is a nice way to get consensus about 
this issue.

_
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> Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2011 11:02:47 -0700
> From: rkald...@wikimedia.org
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Show community consensus for Wikilove
> 
> As better explained by Erik, the deployment to en.wiki was not done with 
> community consensus. The purpose of the deployment, as I understand it, 
> was two-fold:
> * To address one of the main reasons cited for people leaving en.wiki 
> (lack of positive feedback)
> * To experiment with new methods of user communication
> As mentioned by Erik, the feature is still considered experimental. 
> Ironically, the main thing we've learned from WikiLove is that our 
> existing interface for user talk page interaction is pretty abysmal 
> (judging by the large number of people using WikiLove to post simple 
> questions or comments).
> 
> Ryan Kaldari
> 
> On 10/31/11 6:54 AM, Nathan wrote:
> > I see Brandon replied to this thread several times; did anyone notice
> > if the question in the OP (if community consensus is required for
> > implementation, where was it demonstrated for en.wp) was answered?
> >
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Re: [Foundation-l] just wondering, are we going to take down en.wikipedia.org?

[Mateus Nobre]

Wikipedia just can make protests when we're talking things which could affect 
the integrity of website.

If we take down for political reasons, will not be long to take down for 
religious reasons and others opinionated reasons.

Neutrality is a pillar of Wiki. My opinion is to only manifest ourselves when 
our Wikimedia is in existencial danger.
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> Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2011 19:51:08 -0400
> From: kirill.loks...@gmail.com
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] just wondering,   are we going to take down 
> en.wikipedia.org?
> 
> On Mon, Oct 31, 2011 at 5:52 PM, emijrp  wrote:
> 
> > Additional reasons to shut down English Wikipedia as protest ASAP
> >
> > http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/u-s-cuts-funding-for-unesco-after-palestinian-vote-1.392996
> 
> 
> This has little enough to do with Wiki(m/p)edia, however; while UNESCO's
> mission does have some overlap with that of the WMF, we are not connected
> to them in any substantive way.  Certainly, the mere fact that a cultural
> institution of some sort has had its funding cut should not cause us to do
> anything spectacularly unusual, as that's a fairly routine event these days.
> 
> Kirill
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Re: [Foundation-l] Office Hours

[Mateus Nobre]

Lost the first one, 'll attend now o/

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> Date: Tue, 1 Nov 2011 19:15:52 +
> From: oke...@wikimedia.org
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: [Foundation-l] Office Hours
> 
> Hey guys
> 
> Brandon, Howie, Fabrice and I will be holding a second Office Hours session
> on the new Article Feedback Tool on Thursday 3 November. This will be at
> 24:00 UTC, which works out at 4pm PST and 11pm GMT. This timing is designed
> to allow east coast editors, who would be at work during the normal time
> periods, to attend. I hope to see you all there :).
> 
> Thanks
> 
> -- 
> Oliver Keyes
> Community Liason, Product Development
> Wikimedia Foundation
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Re: [Foundation-l] Office Hours

[Mateus Nobre]

#wikimedia-office
I think :P

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> From: bodnot...@gmail.com
> Date: Tue, 1 Nov 2011 20:06:18 +
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Office Hours
> 
> On Tue, Nov 1, 2011 at 7:15 PM, Oliver Keyes  wrote:
> > Hey guys
> >
> > Brandon, Howie, Fabrice and I will be holding a second Office Hours session
> > on the new Article Feedback Tool on Thursday 3 November. This will be at
> > 24:00 UTC, which works out at 4pm PST and 11pm GMT. This timing is designed
> > to allow east coast editors, who would be at work during the normal time
> > periods, to attend. I hope to see you all there :).
> 
> Can you remind us of the channel and the link to the sitey thing? I've
> forgotten where we go as I haven't done one of these for a while.
> 
> Freenode something or other, isn't it?
> 
> Bodnotbod
> 
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Re: [Foundation-l] Ideas for newbie recruitment

[Mateus Nobre]

Agree with David.

We ask for sources everywhere, every place of Wikipedia have ''Cite your 
Sources''. How could a newbie know how to quote a reference in: {{cite web 
|url= |title= |author= |date= |work= |publisher= |accessdate= }} ?

And then a newbie get out of the 70% who doesn't saves (funny, it's 70% of 
waiver and we still have infinite vandalism...) and finally, finally, saves, 
some pseudo-user (a bot disguised as a user, reverting vandalisms and sending 
automatic messages 24/7) reverts the newbie cause he doesn't put a source, the 
newbie gives up. At his second day he have new messages saying ''You didn't put 
the source. Put a source or I'll revert you againd and again.'' -so, he: ''How 
could I do that?'' - and the user: easy: ''{{cite web |url= |title= 
|author= |date= |work= |publisher= |accessdate= }}''

True story.

Something have to change about the sources. I learned put sources after one 
week trying to learn and not miss the code.

If the sources are so important to Wikipedia, this has to be easier to newbies. 

_
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> Date: Tue, 1 Nov 2011 04:14:28 +0200
> From: cimonav...@gmail.com
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Ideas for newbie recruitment
> 
> On Mon, Oct 31, 2011 at 3:06 PM, David Gerard  wrote:
> > On 31 October 2011 13:01, Oliver Keyes  wrote:
> >
> >> I imagine for the other 14.6 percent the
> >> process goes something along the lines of "oh, it says I can make the
> >> changes myself, lets do thaWAUGH, WHAT IN CTHULU'S NAME DOES ALL THIS TEXT
> >> MEAN"
> >
> >
> > I've been editing nearly 8 years and I get that reaction ... here's to
> > usable WYSIWYG!
> >
> >
> 
> 
> Purely aside from the clutter effect of all those tags, particularly
> the references syntax is remarkably opaque. I would imagine a huge
> part of non-stickyness of edits and the
> subsequent demoralisation, stems from the steep learing curve for
> citing sources, Personally I have added a few refences, and each time
> had to pore with considerabe expense of time
> over the relevant help and policy pages. It really is hard to remember
> how the syntax works.
> Would it be overwhelmingly hard to program a pop-up dialogue which
> would first ask which type of source the editor is citing from, which
> would lead to a form with labeled textboxes for the
> various elements of a reference citation with an asterisk beside the
> elements considered vital. My guess is that quite a few of the
> elements of such are already in the code.
> 
> 
> -- 
> --
> Jussi-Ville Heiskanen, ~ [[User:Cimon Avaro]]
> 
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Re: [Foundation-l] New IRC Group Contact

[Mateus Nobre]

a new IRC group? like #wikimedia-something ?

what's the theme of the group and its name?

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> Date: Tue, 1 Nov 2011 23:32:49 +0100
> From: dungod...@gmail.com
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: [Foundation-l] New IRC Group Contact
> 
> Hello,
> 
> I am pleased to announce that Casey and I have chosen Barras as a new 
> IRC Group Contact. He is an experienced and trusted user and we think he 
> is going to fit in the team nicely. He will join our team effective 
> immediately.
> 
> On behalf of the Group Contacts,
> Filip Maljković
> 
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Re: [Foundation-l] Ideas for newbie recruitment

[Mateus Nobre]

This hostility is being reflected in the drop at the number of the editors.I 
agree with the ''automatic-message theory''. None likes automatic messages. In 
my view, it should be reserved for vandals.
Newbies needs a special priority. Something like: ''Hi, thanks for your 
edition! We hope you become part of our team. If you need anything, just talk 
to us''.
It's not hard to do, is it?

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> Date: Tue, 1 Nov 2011 23:45:33 +
> From: dger...@gmail.com
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Ideas for newbie recruitment
> 
> On 1 November 2011 23:39, Mateus Nobre  wrote:
> 
> > If the sources are so important to Wikipedia, this has to be easier to 
> > newbies.
> 
> 
> The essential problem is that the Wikipedia community is newbie-hostile.
> 
> Not actively - mostly - but passively. They view newbies as trouble and work.
> 
> Hence all the pushes back against newbies - trying to further restrict
> page creation and so forth, the problem with citations, defending the
> impossible markup, open hostility on Special:Newpages ...
> 
> So how to make the other side of the newbie experience not suck for
> the incumbents?
> 
> 
> - d.
> 
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Re: [Foundation-l] Ideas for newbie recruitment

[Mateus Nobre]

The learning of the new editors have to be more instinctive and less 
bureaucratic. Seriously, who here, at the first time editing Wikipedia, read 
the policy BEFORE editing a lot? None. Everyone just reads the rules a long 
time after the beggining of Wikipedian life.

I think a system like used in Commons too, but now about editing Wikipedia. 
Could be used for IPs and accounts with less than 100 editions, for example, 
and concealable, of course.
A system whick teach to newbies about the syntax  ( that's the most 
complicated thin to teach newbies: [[ ]], {{ }} and of course,
{{cite web |url= |title= |author= |date= |work= |publisher= 
|accessdate= }})

It has to be discussed. It would be a important system, essential nowadays.


-Mensagem Original- 
From: Marco Chiesa
Sent: Wednesday, November 02, 2011 6:02 AM
To: Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List
Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Ideas for newbie recruitment

On Wed, Nov 2, 2011 at 12:43 AM, Béria Lima  wrote:
> https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/cite4wiki/ (in wiki:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Cite4Wiki )
>
> right click and paste in the article. Easier than that can't be ;)

There are a lot of tools available to make the life of a Wiki editor
simple. The problem is that by the time you come into them, you have
already learned how to do things, where to find templates. I think we
need to develop a kind of wizard similar to the one used in Commons.
For example something like:
*What is the article about? with specific instructions for some of the
commonest categories (biographies, films, geographic places
*Write the text
*Wikify it
*Add references. Is it a book? A website? The templates are
straightforward to fill but difficult to find
*Preview and proofread
*Save it

Cruccone

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Re: [Foundation-l] Newbie recruitment: referencing

[Mateus Nobre]

Loving these discussions about newbie recuitment.

This tool have to be available for everyone, not as a gagdet for logged users. 
Mostly newbies don't even know what is a gagdet. This have to be available to 
IPs and all users.
The idea by clicking in ''citation needed'' was the first great one here. 
You're awesome, guys.
But I thought something about a tool in the edition box. A tool aside the 
edition box sayin ''Put your source here'', and the newbie would put just the 
URL and then, would appear some blank lines for Author, Date, etc.. Just the 
essential ones. Have to be fast, instictive, and no-boring at all.

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> Date: Wed, 2 Nov 2011 17:41:20 -0400
> From: nawr...@gmail.com
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Newbie recruitment: referencing
> 
> I knew it looked so obvious someone must've already tried to do it.
> See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:ProveIt.jpg and
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:ProveIt_GT. This is a GUI reference
> adding interface that shows up while editing (i.e., after you click
> "edit this page.") It's a gadget currently available to everyone.
> 
> A gadget is certainly handy and I'll be using ProveIt from now on,
> but... it doesn't help people who are not logged in or have never
> edited before, it's not widely publicised, etc. etc.
> 
> ~Nathan
> 
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Re: [Foundation-l] Frustration with WMF = WP

[Mateus Nobre]

"a world in which every single human being can freely share in the sum of all 
knowledge"
Of course it's for any Wikimedia project, Dominic. We are talking about free 
knowledge. And Wikimedia Foundation, in all activities, all, have one thing in 
common: free the knowledge. Make a world with every single human could acess 
and share all knowledge, may this is an encyclopedia, a dictionary, a text, a 
class even. Our objective, of wikipedians and any other wikimedia projects is 
just one: Share and make available free knowledge. Knowledge free the world's 
mind, so, knowledge have to stop being limited. Has to be FREE. Here's our 
objective, in my view.
_
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> Date: Wed, 2 Nov 2011 17:19:25 -0400
> From: mcdev...@gmail.com
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Frustration with WMF = WP
> 
> On 2 November 2011 13:54, Kul Wadhwa  wrote:
> 
> >
> > 2) A conspiracy to push Wikipedia at the expense of the sister projects
> >
> >
> > In regards to #2, there is no conspiracy here. We've been quite open
> > about this. Yes, there is more of an emphasis on Wikipedia but it goes
> > back to WMF's prioritization of "A rising tide lifts all boats"
> > strategy. The more interest in Wikipedia will then hopefully translate
> > into more interest on Wikimedia in general and benefit the other
> > projects. Therefore, pushing interest in Wikipedia doesn't take away
> > from the sister projects, rather, it should hopefully lead to more
> > interest in them in the future. Furthermore, the zero-rated Wikipedia
> > initiative is focused on developing countries where people have
> > limited or no access to the internet, so many of the projects aren't
> > well known enough or developed enough in those native languages where
> > operators are willing to promote them. If users from developing
> > countries discover more ways to access Wikipedia then we're hoping
> > that it would then be easier for them to discover the sister projects.
> >
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Can we not refer to people's reasoned complaints as conspiracy theories?
> Or, better yet, let's actually respond to the complaints in question if you
> are going to post, rather than just replying to the joke someone made?
> 
> In general, editors of non-Wikipedia projects have an appreciation for
> Wikipedia and its special role within the Wikimedia community and the
> Wikimedia Foundation's strategy. This is reflected by Andrew even referring
> to is as the "flagship" in his opening post, and I also stated that it was
> reasonable that Wikipedia gets extra attention. I mean, we're Wikipedia
> administrators; we're not anti-Wikipedia. I don't understand how "A rising
> tide lifts all boats" has anything to do with the real concerns within the
> community. Does developing things for Wikipedia magically make MediaWiki a
> useful platform for building a dictionary? Does it somehow make up for
> acting as if those other projects don't exist, like referring to Wikipedia
> alone as the project making "a world in which every single human being can
> freely share in the sum of all knowledge", as if the others have no
> relation to that mission. These are the the sorts of things that are actual
> causes of frustration, not merely the fact that Wikipedia gets emphasized.
> This criticism is not specific to the mobile team, or even necessarily as
> relevant there as it is to some of the WMF's other activities.
> 
> Dominic
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Re: [Foundation-l] Wikimedia Participation Grants

[Mateus Nobre]

congratulations, Wikimedia!
A real important project to volunteers Wikimedians. Loved the idea.

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> Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2011 23:06:24 +0100
> From: to.aru.shiroi.n...@gmail.com
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Wikimedia Participation Grants
> 
> I am very pleased to see this idea come into full action. :)
> 
>   -- とある白い猫  (To Aru Shiroi Neko)
> 
> 
> On Tue, Nov 8, 2011 at 00:10, Asaf Bartov  wrote:
> 
> > Hello, everyone.
> >
> > I am pleased to announce a new grants program available to Wikimedia
> > community members worldwide: the Wikimedia Participation Grants program.
> >  Read all about it in our blog post:
> > https://blog.wikimedia.org/2011/11/05/enabling-worldwide-participation/
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> >   Asaf Bartov
> >   Wikimedia Foundation
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Re: [Foundation-l] Finnish MP FAIL!!!

[Mateus Nobre]

> Puts the neutrality of the Wikipedia into severe doubt, though. Parliament
> speeches aren't particularly known for choosing a neutral point of view.

Anyone can freely use the Wikipedia articles, even politicians (or dictators 
:p), as long as they cite the source (no one quotes :(

The Italian parliament quickly changed its mind cause they can't make new 
speechs without the Wikipedia articles help, hahahaha.
(And their children were failing to do their school homeworks :p)

Wikipedia is needed for everyone, any place. 

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> From: andreeng...@gmail.com
> Date: Sat, 19 Nov 2011 10:49:46 +0100
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Finnish MP FAIL!!!
> 
> On Sat, Nov 19, 2011 at 9:39 AM, Jussi-Ville Heiskanen  > wrote:
> 
> > Not sure if this is appropriate for this list, but just for lulz. A
> > finnish member of
> > parliament just got caught for his speech being a word for word piece of
> > snippets from a Finnish Wikipedia article. No intervening binding lines,
> > just
> > the Wikipedia text. Way to go!!!
> >
> 
> Puts the neutrality of the Wikipedia into severe doubt, though. Parliament
> speeches aren't particularly known for choosing a neutral point of view.
> 
> -- 
> André Engels, andreeng...@gmail.com
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Re: [Foundation-l] A proposal for a Wikimedia project that helps people find solutions to their problems

[Mateus Nobre]

+1.

always thought it.

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> Date: Tue, 8 Nov 2011 20:53:54 +0800
> From: yaoziy...@gmail.com
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: [Foundation-l] A proposal for a Wikimedia project that helps people 
> find solutions to their problems
> 
> Hello Jimmy Wales and other Wikimedia Foundation members,
> 
> I'm writing you to propose a Wikimedia project (tentatively called
> "WikiSolve") no less important than Wikipedia.
> 
> We know Wikipedia can teach people knowledge (in terms of concepts),
> but it can't directly help people find solutions to their problems,
> because it's "concept-oriented" rather than "problem-oriented".
> 
> I envision a wiki that collects virtually every known problem in the
> world and their corresponding solutions, so that people with a problem
> in mind can find a solution on it.
> 
> The key problem in designing such a wiki is how such a wiki can guide
> the user to the problem page he wants. I believe a hypertext-based
> mechanism called "troubleshooting wizard" is the answer. A good
> example of a troubleshooting wizard is
> http://support.hubris.net/dialup/wizard/ . As you can see, this is a
> way for the user to locate his problem in a wiki without knowing
> keywords used to name or describe that problem, just like Wikipedia
> allows a user to locate a concept without knowing its name or any
> keywords used to describe it.
> 
> There is actually more background to this idea. I strongly recommend
> you read the following article that compares how AI and a wiki tackle
> two old problems differently: knowledge representation and problem
> solving:
> 
> --
> 
> (A formatted version of the following article is at
> https://plus.google.com/u/0/102291835965130378165/posts/finzeoipR7A)
> 
> From formal to semi-formal: knowledge representation and problem
> solving in the AI way and the wiki way
> 
> 1. Failure of the formal way to represent encyclopedic knowledge
> Big thinkers like Leibniz, Dijkstra and John McCarthy all dreamed
> about an encyclopedia written in formal language and an automated
> reasoner that could solve a problem by reasoning on this formal
> knowledge base. Unfortunately attempts at this like the Cyc project
> still have a long way to go.
> 
> 2. Success of the semi-formal way to represent encyclopedic knowledge
> In contrast, Wikipedia is a big success. Most stuff on Wikipedia is
> written in natural language, but Wikipedia does have some formal
> elements. Most fundamentally, each concept on Wikipedia has a unique
> formal name, and there are hyperlinks between related concepts,
> enabling the user to navigate to a target concept without initially
> knowing its name (which makes Wikipedia an important "global
> positioning system" (GPS) for concepts).
> 
> 3. What would be the wiki (semi-formal) way to problem solving, then?
> When it comes to "problem solving", there are actually two kinds of
> problem solving:
> 
> 3.1. Wiki-based solution sharing
> The first kind is when you have a problem already solved by experts,
> and these experts want to create a wiki as a "solved problem base"
> where you can easily find your problem and consequently see the
> corresponding solution written by these experts. Now the question is:
> how can such a "problem base" wiki be organized so you (the user) can
> find your problem easily?
> 
> What I want to say is "troubleshooting wizard". Do a Google search for
> [ troubleshooting wizard ], and the first result is a good example of
> what it is like: http://support.hubris.net/dialup/wizard/
> 
> As you see now, a troubleshooting wizard uses a series of questions to
> let you specify your problem's characteristics (or "symptoms"), and
> eventually leads you to a solution to your specific problem. You will
> find this immediately familiar because you probably already saw this
> kind of thing in Windows XP's Help System.
> 
> Now you can realize that a wiki as a hypertext system can surely
> implement a troubleshooting wizard that walks the user to his problem
> in a "problem base" wiki.
> 
> 3.2. Wiki-based problem solving
> The second kind is when you have an open problem that doesn't have a
> known solution (otherwise you're supposed to find its solution in a
> "problem base" wiki as discussed in Section 3.1). Now if you want to
> attack this open problem on your own, creating a wiki may help, for
> the following reason.
> 
> During your problem-solving process you may need to divide the
> original problem into subproblems, or apply certain strategies such as
> "generalization", "specialization" and "analogy" to the original
> problem to obtain some "derived problems", whose solving may help you
> solve the original problem (this is what George Polya's famous book
> "How to Solve It" talks about). To keep track of these "subproblems",
> "derived problems" and other kinds of middle results, a wiki would

Re: [Foundation-l] Finnish MP FAIL!!!

[Mateus Nobre]

Thank you.

When you have any result call me back, ok?

Cheers,

_
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  30440865


> Date: Sat, 19 Nov 2011 19:20:15 +
> From: dger...@gmail.com
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Finnish MP FAIL!!!
> 
> On 19 November 2011 14:09, Mateus Nobre  wrote:
> 
> >> Puts the neutrality of the Wikipedia into severe doubt, though. Parliament
> >> speeches aren't particularly known for choosing a neutral point of view.
> 
> > The Italian parliament quickly changed its mind cause they can't make new 
> > speechs without the Wikipedia articles help, hahahaha.
> > (And their children were failing to do their school homeworks :p)
> > Wikipedia is needed for everyone, any place.
> 
> 
> Don't forget that John McCain did this when running for US President
> in 2008 - a speech on Georgia which one of his staff clearly assembled
> from [[:en:Georgia (country)]]. This was in the media for about a
> week.
> 
> 
> - d.
> 
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Re: [Foundation-l] Finnish MP FAIL!!!

[Mateus Nobre]

> Thank you.
> 
> When you have any result call me back, ok?
> 
> Cheers,

I'm sorry, 
I was answering another e-mail but I did at this one, hahahah

Cheers,

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> From: mateus.no...@live.co.uk
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Date: Sat, 19 Nov 2011 23:15:02 +0300
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Finnish MP FAIL!!!
> 
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> When you have any result call me back, ok?
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> _
> MateusNobre
> MetalBrasil on Wikimedia projects
> (+55) 85 88393509
>   30440865
> 
> 
> > Date: Sat, 19 Nov 2011 19:20:15 +
> > From: dger...@gmail.com
> > To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Finnish MP FAIL!!!
> > 
> > On 19 November 2011 14:09, Mateus Nobre  wrote:
> > 
> > >> Puts the neutrality of the Wikipedia into severe doubt, though. 
> > >> Parliament
> > >> speeches aren't particularly known for choosing a neutral point of view.
> > 
> > > The Italian parliament quickly changed its mind cause they can't make new 
> > > speechs without the Wikipedia articles help, hahahaha.
> > > (And their children were failing to do their school homeworks :p)
> > > Wikipedia is needed for everyone, any place.
> > 
> > 
> > Don't forget that John McCain did this when running for US President
> > in 2008 - a speech on Georgia which one of his staff clearly assembled
> > from [[:en:Georgia (country)]]. This was in the media for about a
> > week.
> > 
> > 
> > - d.
> > 
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Re: [Foundation-l] Wikimania 2011 videos - mission complete!

[Mateus Nobre]

hahaha, this last one is the only I appeared at all :P
The guy in pink with a white hat.

Btw, congratulations! Loved the videos and the soundtracks, very good editions! 
And waiting for the next Wikimania to have videos as good as these ;p

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> Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2011 07:08:28 -0800
> From: phoebe.w...@gmail.com
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Wikimania 2011 videos - mission complete!
> 
> On Tue, Nov 29, 2011 at 3:48 AM, Itzik Edri  wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > *I happy to announce that all the videos from Wikimania 2011 in Haifa are
> > now available on our channel in YouTube!: http://www.youtube.com/WikimediaIL
> > .*
> > Next week I will send a HDD with all the footage and the edited videos to
> > the WMF so they will have a copy for archive and so they can upload it to
> > commons also.
> >
> > *Don't forget also to check our Flickr stream!:
> > http://www.flickr.com/WikimediaIL*
> >
> > On the schedule you will find links to the videos:
> > http://wikimania2011.wikimedia.org/wiki/Schedule
> 
> Dear Itzik and the rest of the Wikimania 2011 team -- congratulations!
> This is a huge achievement. You continue to set the bar high for
> Wikimania. And thank you for continuing to work on the conference long
> after it finished to get this done -- I know how hard that can be :)
> 
> thank you,
> phoebe
> 
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Re: [Foundation-l] Wikipedia Account Creation

[Mateus Nobre]

I think it's easier if you write your username in a box and appears early 
''sorry, it's already used'' or ''available!''.





Like the e-mail system.





I never liked the suggestions system. 




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> Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2011 03:10:33 -0700
> From: fredb...@fairpoint.net
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Wikipedia Account Creation
> 
> >>> >
> >>> > Hello,
> >>> > Last month I was in Qatar and introduced some people to Wikipedia.
> >>> While
> >>> > they were creating their accounts, some of them had their initial
> >>> > suggested username taken, so they had to repeat it a couple of times
> >>> > until they finally found an available username. One of them had
> >>> repeated
> >>> > it around 3 or 4 times until he had gotten frustrated. Which is why
> >>> I'm
> >>> > asking if it's possible to add search type-ahead suggestions for
> >>> > available accounts.
> >>> > //Abbas.
> >>>
> >>> We have a page to do that at Special:ListUsers
> >>>
> >>> https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Special:ListUsers
> >>>
> >>> or
> >>>
> >>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:ListUsers
> >>>
> >>> Fred
> >>>
> >>
> >> Special:ListUsers =/= list of all users with SUL
> >>
> >> przykuta
> >>
> >
> > What does Special:ListUsers =/= list of all users with SUL mean?
> >
> > I thought the problem was to find account names that are not being used.
> > If you search for a name you think you might want to use it returns a
> > list of existing accounts.
> >
> > What is "SUL"?
> >
> > I know I'm supposed to understand Wikipedia acronyms, but I almost never
> > do, unless I use them regularly myself, but I try to never use them, so
> > never get practiced up.
> >
> > Fred
> 
> OK, here is a tool: http://toolserver.org/~quentinv57/sulinfo
> 
> This gives user info from every Wikimedia wiki. "SUL Info
> 
> This script gives a list of every account using a specified name on WMF
> wikis, and displays SUL data if accounts have been merged."
> 
> The catch though is that if there is not an exact match it just returns
> no account. Special:ListUsers shows most close matches.
> 
> It serves well enough for creation of an account on the wiki you're
> running it on. But there might be someone on another wiki using the same
> name, or one that is confusingly close.
> 
> Fred
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [Foundation-l] just wondering, are we going to take down en.wikipedia.org?

[Mateus Nobre]

+ support!

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> From: emi...@gmail.com
> Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2011 23:40:06 +0100
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] just wondering,   are we going to take down 
> en.wikipedia.org?
> 
> ANDDD HERE WE GO
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Jimbo_Wales#Request_for_Comment:_SOPA_and_a_strike
> 
> 2011/10/27 Domas Mituzas 
> 
> > Hi!
> >
> > we recently did some practice on italian wikipedia, are we going to
> > protest IP legislation in US by taking down English Wikipedia?
> >
> >
> > https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2011/10/disastrous-ip-legislation-back-%E2%80%93-and-it%E2%80%99s-worse-ever
> >
> > Domas
> > ___
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Re: [Foundation-l] How SOPA will hurt the free web and Wikipedia

[Mateus Nobre]

> What did WMF do when WikiLeaks domains were seized and its fundraising
> payment processors (PayPal, Visa, MasterCard) were cut off? Did WMF protest
> against Internet censorship? No.

Wikimedia defends itself, not the ''justice in America and worldwide''. 
Remember we are not a political party. But we have to defend ourselves.
It's not against internet censorship. It's pretty clear, It's about defending 
us.

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> From: emi...@gmail.com
> Date: Wed, 14 Dec 2011 13:08:38 +0100
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] How SOPA will hurt the free web and Wikipedia
> 
> Hi all;
> 
> Looks like Wikimedia Foundation is very worried about censorship and the
> cut off of fundraising payment processors. Now.
> 
> What did WMF do when WikiLeaks domains were seized and its fundraising
> payment processors (PayPal, Visa, MasterCard) were cut off? Did WMF protest
> against Internet censorship? No.
> 
> WMF did nothing. Well, Wikipedia community wrote this disclaimer "WikiLeaks
> is not affiliated with Wikipedia or the Wikimedia Foundation"[1] on the
> top, and turned a blind eye.
> 
> Now it is your turn. Enjoy.
> 
> Regards,
> emijrp
> 
> [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WikiLeaks
> 
> 2011/12/14 Jussi-Ville Heiskanen 
> 
> > On Wed, Dec 14, 2011 at 8:48 AM, Jay Walsh  wrote:
> > > Today the Wikimedia Foundation posted an important update on how the Stop
> > > Online Piracy Act (SOPA) legislation being considered in DC this week
> > > threatens an open and free web, and particularly how it threatens
> > Wikipedia.
> > >
> > > The post is authored by WMF's General Counsel, Geoff Brigham, and can be
> > > found here:
> > >
> > http://blog.wikimedia.org/2011/12/13/how-sopa-will-hurt-the-free-web-and-wikipedia/
> > >
> >
> > "Under the new bill, there is one significant improvement.  The new
> > version exempts U.S. based companies – including the Wikimedia
> > Foundation – from being subject to a litigation regime in which rights
> > owners could claim that our site was an “Internet site dedicated to
> > theft of U.S. property.”  Such a damnation against Wikimedia could
> > have easily resulted in demands to cut off our fundraising payment
> > processors.   The new version now exempts U.S. sites like ours."
> >
> > I am genuinely not anti-american. The logic here does escape me though.
> >
> > --
> > --
> > Jussi-Ville Heiskanen, ~ [[User:Cimon Avaro]]
> >
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Re: [Foundation-l] How SOPA will hurt the free web and Wikipedia

[Mateus Nobre]

It's complex, Milos.

We are not activists. Being a volunteer in Wikimedia do not torn ourselves 
activists.

It could be, but the option to be a volunteer in Wikipedia is just a option to 
share the free knowledge, not about political issues.

I totally agree to fight against censorships in Internet and in real life, I 
agree with that. And I fight against that. We can, as people and citizens; But 
Wikimedia Foundation can't, cause we can't force the volunteers to agree that 
visions.

We're not a political party (yet?)



_
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  30440865


> From: mill...@gmail.com
> Date: Wed, 14 Dec 2011 21:33:41 +0100
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] How SOPA will hurt the free web and Wikipedia
> 
> On Wed, Dec 14, 2011 at 19:23, Mateus Nobre  wrote:
> >> What did WMF do when WikiLeaks domains were seized and its fundraising
> >> payment processors (PayPal, Visa, MasterCard) were cut off? Did WMF protest
> >> against Internet censorship? No.
> >
> > Wikimedia defends itself, not the ''justice in America and worldwide''. 
> > Remember we are not a political party. But we have to defend ourselves.
> > It's not against internet censorship. It's pretty clear, It's about 
> > defending us.
> 
> Defending just your own bunker is tactics for losers.
> 
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Re: [Foundation-l] How SOPA will hurt the free web and Wikipedia

[Mateus Nobre]

> At some point of time we'll have to articulate ourselves politically.

When that day comes call me, I'll join the party asap.

Wikimedia Foundation makes me create new values, about copyright, about 
knowledge and about freedom. I think (talking about that list) everyone see it 
at the same way, we're connected with these values. It's like a political 
party, really. 

But the day Wikimedia Foundation would say:
 ''Dear Wikimedians, from now Wikimedia Foundation will fight publicily against 
all kinds of censorships, all kinds of dictatorships. We ask you to go to 
streets, do manifestations in our name.''
we will simple quick away the NPOV pillar.

And with no-NPOV, it'll open to criticize the articles about China, for 
example. The articles about SOPA, even!
Can you imagine?

As a serious encylopedia, and a serious foundation, WMF can't defend political 
visions. But as serious WIKIPEDIANS, and serious WIKIMEDIANS, we will do it.

_
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  30440865


> From: mill...@gmail.com
> Date: Wed, 14 Dec 2011 22:05:04 +0100
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] How SOPA will hurt the free web and Wikipedia
> 
> On Wed, Dec 14, 2011 at 21:38, Mateus Nobre  wrote:
> > It's complex, Milos.
> >
> > We are not activists. Being a volunteer in Wikimedia do not torn ourselves 
> > activists.
> >
> > It could be, but the option to be a volunteer in Wikipedia is just a option 
> > to share the free knowledge, not about political issues.
> >
> > I totally agree to fight against censorships in Internet and in real life, 
> > I agree with that. And I fight against that. We can, as people and 
> > citizens; But Wikimedia Foundation can't, cause we can't force the 
> > volunteers to agree that visions.
> 
> I know that it's complex, of course. And I know that it was necessary
> to see that our bunker is on the front line to realize that it's
> better to help others before.
> 
> > We're not a political party (yet?)
> 
> At some point of time we'll have to articulate ourselves politically.
> There is relatively clear set of values behind our movement and there
> are clear benefits which all humans are getting thanks to our work.
> Pretending that we are apolitical makes our position worse and
> inevitably leads to the crisis, like this one is.
> 
> Leadership inside of one network, no matter how loose the connections
> are inside of that network, has responsibility to raise and articulate
> relevant political issues, as well. And I am glad to see that Jimmy
> has taken at least the articulation role in this case.
> 
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Re: [Foundation-l] How SOPA will hurt the free web and Wikipedia

[Mateus Nobre]

87% is more than sufficient.

En.wikipedia (not that one, I'm native of ptwiki and I voted in it too) it's 
like a whole country.

It's simple impossible to reach a consensus in a place where have 500 people 
voting.
Sometimes polls are the only way. I'm not saying the best. It's the only.

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  30440865


> Date: Wed, 14 Dec 2011 23:00:38 +
> From: dger...@gmail.com
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] How SOPA will hurt the free web and Wikipedia
> 
> On 14 December 2011 21:57, Kim Bruning  wrote:
> > On Wed, Dec 14, 2011 at 05:43:03PM +, Thomas Dalton wrote:
> 
> >> Presumably
> >> there will be a more formal process to decide whether we actually go
> >> ahead with it - has that started somewhere? If not, has anyone at
> >> least figured out what form that process will take?
> 
> > Strictly speaking, the straw poll there is sufficient, unless people bring
> > up true blockers.
> 
> 
> The poll is at 87% or so (taking a straight count of support vs.
> oppose from the page). Should it be considered sufficient to
> demonstrate overwhelming consensus, the precise course of action has
> not AFAIK been determined.
> 
> 
> - d.
> 
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Re: [Foundation-l] How SOPA will hurt the free web and Wikipedia

[Mateus Nobre]

Ask for a ''consensus way'' in decisions like that one tends to humor.

I can compare asking a consensus for presidential elections. 

_
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  30440865


> From: mateus.no...@live.co.uk
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2011 02:10:32 +0300
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] How SOPA will hurt the free web and Wikipedia
> 
> 
> 87% is more than sufficient.
> 
> En.wikipedia (not that one, I'm native of ptwiki and I voted in it too) it's 
> like a whole country.
> 
> It's simple impossible to reach a consensus in a place where have 500 people 
> voting.
> Sometimes polls are the only way. I'm not saying the best. It's the only.
> 
> _
> MateusNobre
> MetalBrasil on Wikimedia projects
> (+55) 85 88393509
>   30440865
> 
> 
> > Date: Wed, 14 Dec 2011 23:00:38 +
> > From: dger...@gmail.com
> > To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] How SOPA will hurt the free web and Wikipedia
> > 
> > On 14 December 2011 21:57, Kim Bruning  wrote:
> > > On Wed, Dec 14, 2011 at 05:43:03PM +, Thomas Dalton wrote:
> > 
> > >> Presumably
> > >> there will be a more formal process to decide whether we actually go
> > >> ahead with it - has that started somewhere? If not, has anyone at
> > >> least figured out what form that process will take?
> > 
> > > Strictly speaking, the straw poll there is sufficient, unless people bring
> > > up true blockers.
> > 
> > 
> > The poll is at 87% or so (taking a straight count of support vs.
> > oppose from the page). Should it be considered sufficient to
> > demonstrate overwhelming consensus, the precise course of action has
> > not AFAIK been determined.
> > 
> > 
> > - d.
> > 
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Re: [Foundation-l] How SOPA will hurt the free web and Wikipedia

[Mateus Nobre]

It's virtually impossible break down a law when it's already approved.

We would need more than a strike to do that. Maybe some tents ocuppying front 
of White House.

The Strike can't be our last resource, it have to be used EARLY. It's our main 
hope!

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  30440865


> Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2011 08:40:31 -0800
> From: phoebe.w...@gmail.com
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] How SOPA will hurt the free web and Wikipedia
> 
> On Thu, Dec 15, 2011 at 4:26 AM, Philippe Beaudette
>  wrote:
> > Hi folks,
> >
> > Just wanted to let you know that I got word a few minutes ago that today's
> > SOPA markup meeting will be using a new tool that allows for public input
> > into the markup.  Shortly before 8:30, you'll see the SOPA bill replace the
> > OPEN bill at Keepthewebopen.com.  If you'd like to have input during the
> > markup process, this is a nice way to do it.
> >
> > pb
> 
> Fascinating! A little late though... clearly these representatives
> haven't had the community lessons of Wikimedia drilled into them, heh.
> (As an aside, I really like the editing interface that keepthewebopen
> is using).
> 
> On the question of to strike or not to strike -- my *personal* view is
> to agree that we should a) discuss other measures, such as perhaps a
> text banner on en.wp; and b) use a strike as a last resort, as there
> is no other place to go if we did strike. I think Jimmy's poll was
> just that -- a way to gauge support for any particular action. And all
> the discussions I've seen have run pretty strongly in favor of doing
> something to oppose the bill, with the 'something' tbd.
> 
> As with the Italian action though timing is everything. This vote is a
> committee vote; if it dies here it will be exceedingly hard to
> resuscitate, but if it goes on it still has to pass a House floor
> vote, Senate floor vote, get reconciled and get signed. In other
> words, today is a critical time (and especially if you are in the US,
> this is a good time to try to sway judiciary committee members) and we
> really hope it dies here and now. But if it doesn't, this process
> could go on for months, and we should consider what the next best
> timing to do anything is. This is a community question, and must be a
> community-led action.
> 
> BTW, Vint Cerf, Paul Vixie and many others just signed a letter of
> internet engineers opposing SOPA:
> http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-tech/post/top-internet-engineers-warn-against-sopa/2011/12/15/gIQAGRV4vO_blog.html
> 
> -- phoebe
> 
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Re: [Foundation-l] How SOPA will hurt the free web and Wikipedia

[Mateus Nobre]

I know, I'm just answering to some guys below, who are sayin' the strike is a 
last resource/applicable only after approval.
It's not possible. We've to concentrate our forces  before.

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> Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2011 17:05:30 +
> From: berial...@gmail.com
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] How SOPA will hurt the free web and Wikipedia
> 
> Mateus the law is not approved yet. Is still in a committee.
> _
> *Béria Lima*
> <http://wikimedia.pt/>(351) 925 171 484
> 
> *Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter
> livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a
> construir esse sonho. <http://wikimedia.pt/Donativos>*
> 
> 
> On 15 December 2011 16:46, Mateus Nobre  wrote:
> 
> >
> > It's virtually impossible break down a law when it's already approved.
> >
> > We would need more than a strike to do that. Maybe some tents ocuppying
> > front of White House.
> >
> > The Strike can't be our last resource, it have to be used EARLY. It's our
> > main hope!
> >
> > _
> > MateusNobre
> > MetalBrasil on Wikimedia projects
> > (+55) 85 88393509
> >  30440865
> >
> >
> > > Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2011 08:40:31 -0800
> > > From: phoebe.w...@gmail.com
> > > To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > > Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] How SOPA will hurt the free web and Wikipedia
> > >
> > > On Thu, Dec 15, 2011 at 4:26 AM, Philippe Beaudette
> > >  wrote:
> > > > Hi folks,
> > > >
> > > > Just wanted to let you know that I got word a few minutes ago that
> > today's
> > > > SOPA markup meeting will be using a new tool that allows for public
> > input
> > > > into the markup.  Shortly before 8:30, you'll see the SOPA bill
> > replace the
> > > > OPEN bill at Keepthewebopen.com.  If you'd like to have input during
> > the
> > > > markup process, this is a nice way to do it.
> > > >
> > > > pb
> > >
> > > Fascinating! A little late though... clearly these representatives
> > > haven't had the community lessons of Wikimedia drilled into them, heh.
> > > (As an aside, I really like the editing interface that keepthewebopen
> > > is using).
> > >
> > > On the question of to strike or not to strike -- my *personal* view is
> > > to agree that we should a) discuss other measures, such as perhaps a
> > > text banner on en.wp; and b) use a strike as a last resort, as there
> > > is no other place to go if we did strike. I think Jimmy's poll was
> > > just that -- a way to gauge support for any particular action. And all
> > > the discussions I've seen have run pretty strongly in favor of doing
> > > something to oppose the bill, with the 'something' tbd.
> > >
> > > As with the Italian action though timing is everything. This vote is a
> > > committee vote; if it dies here it will be exceedingly hard to
> > > resuscitate, but if it goes on it still has to pass a House floor
> > > vote, Senate floor vote, get reconciled and get signed. In other
> > > words, today is a critical time (and especially if you are in the US,
> > > this is a good time to try to sway judiciary committee members) and we
> > > really hope it dies here and now. But if it doesn't, this process
> > > could go on for months, and we should consider what the next best
> > > timing to do anything is. This is a community question, and must be a
> > > community-led action.
> > >
> > > BTW, Vint Cerf, Paul Vixie and many others just signed a letter of
> > > internet engineers opposing SOPA:
> > >
> > http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-tech/post/top-internet-engineers-warn-against-sopa/2011/12/15/gIQAGRV4vO_blog.html
> > >
> > > -- phoebe
> > >
> > > ___
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> > > foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
> >
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Re: [Foundation-l] New link for SOPA - fantastic

[Mateus Nobre]

fantastic!
wathing every word

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> From: phili...@wikimedia.org
> Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2011 10:04:56 -0800
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: [Foundation-l] New link for SOPA - fantastic
> 
> Chairman Issa's office sent me this link... live streaming and markup of
> the SOPA bill:  http://keepthewebopen.com/sopa
> ___
> Philippe Beaudette
> Head of Reader Relations
> Wikimedia Foundation, Inc.
> 
> 415-839-6885, x 6643
> 
> phili...@wikimedia.org
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Re: [Foundation-l] Polish Wikimania scholarship program

[Mateus Nobre]

Don't you accept a brazilian from these hot lands of South America? hahahah ;p

Greetings,

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> Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2012 00:29:17 +0100
> From: polime...@gmail.com
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: [Foundation-l] Polish Wikimania scholarship program
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Wikimedia Polska (Poland) has just launched its own scholarships
> programme for Wikimedians willing to attend Wikimania 2012 in
> Washington, D.C. This year, apart from up to 10 scholarships for
> Wikimedians from Poland, we are also going to grant up to 6
> scholarships for Wikimedians from other countries. Only countries
> which have lower national income per capita than Poland (according to
> World Bank 2010 stats) are eligible. We are particularly willing to
> reach out to the Wikimedians from the former USSR countries (except
> Estonia, which doesn't meet the income criteria) and from the Balkans
> (except Greece and Slovenia, for the same reason). The scholarship
> covers travel and accommodation expenses, as well as conference fee.
> 
> More details are available here: 
> http://pl.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimania_2012/en
> 
> The closing date for applications is March 9.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> 
> -- 
> Tomek "Polimerek" Ganicz
> http://pl.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Polimerek
> http://www.ganicz.pl/poli/
> http://www.cbmm.lodz.pl/work.php?id=29&title=tomasz-ganicz
> 
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Re: [Foundation-l] Polish Wikimania scholarship program

[Mateus Nobre]

They're talking about per capita, which is like two hundred dollars below the 
polish one.

Ai ai, Beria :P

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> From: berial...@gmail.com
> Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2012 21:33:47 -0200
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Polish Wikimania scholarship program
> 
> You joking right? Our economy is better than UK one  (or so they say), I
> don't even want to compare with Polish one :D
> _
> *Béria Lima*
> 
> *Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter
> livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a
> construir esse sonho. <http://wikimedia.pt/Donativos>*
> 
> 
> On 16 February 2012 21:32, Mateus Nobre  wrote:
> 
> >
> > Don't you accept a brazilian from these hot lands of South America?
> > hahahah ;p
> >
> > Greetings,
> >
> > _
> > MateusNobre
> > MetalBrasil on Wikimedia projects
> > (+55) 85 88393509
> >  30440865
> >
> >
> > > Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2012 00:29:17 +0100
> > > From: polime...@gmail.com
> > > To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > > Subject: [Foundation-l] Polish Wikimania scholarship program
> > >
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > Wikimedia Polska (Poland) has just launched its own scholarships
> > > programme for Wikimedians willing to attend Wikimania 2012 in
> > > Washington, D.C. This year, apart from up to 10 scholarships for
> > > Wikimedians from Poland, we are also going to grant up to 6
> > > scholarships for Wikimedians from other countries. Only countries
> > > which have lower national income per capita than Poland (according to
> > > World Bank 2010 stats) are eligible. We are particularly willing to
> > > reach out to the Wikimedians from the former USSR countries (except
> > > Estonia, which doesn't meet the income criteria) and from the Balkans
> > > (except Greece and Slovenia, for the same reason). The scholarship
> > > covers travel and accommodation expenses, as well as conference fee.
> > >
> > > More details are available here:
> > http://pl.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimania_2012/en
> > >
> > > The closing date for applications is March 9.
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Tomek "Polimerek" Ganicz
> > > http://pl.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Polimerek
> > > http://www.ganicz.pl/poli/
> > > http://www.cbmm.lodz.pl/work.php?id=29&title=tomasz-ganicz
> > >
> > > ___
> > > foundation-l mailing list
> > > foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
> >
> > ___
> > foundation-l mailing list
> > foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
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> >
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Re: [Foundation-l] Polish Wikimania scholarship program

[Mateus Nobre]

Close enough, Beria. Everyone already saw. haha :P

_
MateusNobre
MetalBrasil on Wikimedia projects
(+55) 85 88393509
  30440865


> From: berial...@gmail.com
> Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2012 21:41:06 -0200
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Polish Wikimania scholarship program
> 
> You mean 3 thousand right?
> 
> Brazil: 9,390
> Poland: 12,440
> 
> Source: http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NY.GNP.PCAP.CD
> _
> *Béria Lima*
> <http://wikimedia.pt/>(351) 925 171 484
> 
> *Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter
> livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a
> construir esse sonho. <http://wikimedia.pt/Donativos>*
> 
> 
> On 16 February 2012 21:35, Mateus Nobre  wrote:
> 
> >
> > They're talking about per capita, which is like two hundred dollars below
> > the polish one.
> >
> > Ai ai, Beria :P
> >
> > _
> > MateusNobre
> > MetalBrasil on Wikimedia projects
> > (+55) 85 88393509
> >  30440865
> >
> >
> > > From: berial...@gmail.com
> > > Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2012 21:33:47 -0200
> > > To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > > Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Polish Wikimania scholarship program
> > >
> > > You joking right? Our economy is better than UK one  (or so they say), I
> > > don't even want to compare with Polish one :D
> > > _
> > > *Béria Lima*
> > >
> > > *Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter
> > > livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a
> > > construir esse sonho. <http://wikimedia.pt/Donativos>*
> > >
> > >
> > > On 16 February 2012 21:32, Mateus Nobre  wrote:
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Don't you accept a brazilian from these hot lands of South America?
> > > > hahahah ;p
> > > >
> > > > Greetings,
> > > >
> > > > _
> > > > MateusNobre
> > > > MetalBrasil on Wikimedia projects
> > > > (+55) 85 88393509
> > > >  30440865
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2012 00:29:17 +0100
> > > > > From: polime...@gmail.com
> > > > > To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > > > > Subject: [Foundation-l] Polish Wikimania scholarship program
> > > > >
> > > > > Hi,
> > > > >
> > > > > Wikimedia Polska (Poland) has just launched its own scholarships
> > > > > programme for Wikimedians willing to attend Wikimania 2012 in
> > > > > Washington, D.C. This year, apart from up to 10 scholarships for
> > > > > Wikimedians from Poland, we are also going to grant up to 6
> > > > > scholarships for Wikimedians from other countries. Only countries
> > > > > which have lower national income per capita than Poland (according to
> > > > > World Bank 2010 stats) are eligible. We are particularly willing to
> > > > > reach out to the Wikimedians from the former USSR countries (except
> > > > > Estonia, which doesn't meet the income criteria) and from the Balkans
> > > > > (except Greece and Slovenia, for the same reason). The scholarship
> > > > > covers travel and accommodation expenses, as well as conference fee.
> > > > >
> > > > > More details are available here:
> > > > http://pl.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimania_2012/en
> > > > >
> > > > > The closing date for applications is March 9.
> > > > >
> > > > > Regards,
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Tomek "Polimerek" Ganicz
> > > > > http://pl.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Polimerek
> > > > > http://www.ganicz.pl/poli/
> > > > > http://www.cbmm.lodz.pl/work.php?id=29&title=tomasz-ganicz
> > > > >
> > > > > ___
> > > > > foundation-l mailing list
> > > > > foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > > > > Unsubscribe:
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
> > > >
> > > > ___
> > > > foundation-l mailing list
> > > > foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
> > > >
> > > ___
> > > foundation-l mailing list
> > > foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
> >
> > ___
> > foundation-l mailing list
> > foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
> >
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Re: [Foundation-l] Polish Wikimania scholarship program

[Mateus Nobre]

I always thought mother Russia the really inventor of vodka :(

Hahaha, even the list of Wikimedia FOundation teach me new stuff! The next shot 
of Vodka I drink will be ''to Poland!''

Greetings from cachaça land, 

_
MateusNobre
MetalBrasil on Wikimedia projects
(+55) 85 88393509
  30440865


> From: russavia.wikipe...@gmail.com
> Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2012 07:54:22 +0800
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Polish Wikimania scholarship program
> 
> Beria, there are two lessons to be learnt here.
> 
> 1) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_%28PPP%29_per_capita
> -- Wikipedia is obviously not to be used as a reliable source,
> especially for facetious comments.
> 2) Re: vodka - 
> http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/429547_2604401508972_1222894747_32310964_1084040106_n.jpg
> 
> 
> On Fri, Feb 17, 2012 at 7:45 AM, Béria Lima  wrote:
> > Actually I believe the Poles stole your vodka, Russavia, because yor GNI
> > per capita is only 9,900  :P
> > _
> > *Béria Lima*
> >  (351) 925 171 484
> >
> > *Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter
> > livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a
> > construir esse sonho. *
> >
> >
> > On 16 February 2012 21:42, Russavia  wrote:
> >
> >> Hi Tomasz
> >>
> >> It also wouldn't include Russia by the looks of it, given that
> >> Russians are apparently 4 bottles of vodka a year richer than Poles ;)
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Fri, Feb 17, 2012 at 7:29 AM, Tomasz Ganicz 
> >> wrote:
> >> > Hi,
> >> >
> >> > Wikimedia Polska (Poland) has just launched its own scholarships
> >> > programme for Wikimedians willing to attend Wikimania 2012 in
> >> > Washington, D.C. This year, apart from up to 10 scholarships for
> >> > Wikimedians from Poland, we are also going to grant up to 6
> >> > scholarships for Wikimedians from other countries. Only countries
> >> > which have lower national income per capita than Poland (according to
> >> > World Bank 2010 stats) are eligible. We are particularly willing to
> >> > reach out to the Wikimedians from the former USSR countries (except
> >> > Estonia, which doesn't meet the income criteria) and from the Balkans
> >> > (except Greece and Slovenia, for the same reason). The scholarship
> >> > covers travel and accommodation expenses, as well as conference fee.
> >> >
> >> > More details are available here:
> >> http://pl.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimania_2012/en
> >> >
> >> > The closing date for applications is March 9.
> >> >
> >> > Regards,
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> > Tomek "Polimerek" Ganicz
> >> > http://pl.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Polimerek
> >> > http://www.ganicz.pl/poli/
> >> > http://www.cbmm.lodz.pl/work.php?id=29&title=tomasz-ganicz
> >> >
> >> > ___
> >> > foundation-l mailing list
> >> > foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> >> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
> >>
> >> ___
> >> foundation-l mailing list
> >> foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> >> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
> >>
> > ___
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> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
> 
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Re: [Foundation-l] Polish Wikimania scholarship program

[Mateus Nobre]

This is sooo true, Russavia!

Santos Dumont FTW, national hero.

p.s.: Nice gags, BTW :p

_
MateusNobre
MetalBrasil on Wikimedia projects
(+55) 85 88393509
  30440865


> From: russavia.wikipe...@gmail.com
> Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2012 08:35:15 +0800
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Polish Wikimania scholarship program
> 
> Hi Brazilball
> 
> yes, indeed, you do learn new things every day on this list.
> 
> For example, this has just come to my attention
> 
> http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/190/348/1319406261001.png
> 
> My next flight, i'll thank good ol' USA ingenuity and foresight :)
> 
> 
> 
> On Fri, Feb 17, 2012 at 8:00 AM, Mateus Nobre  wrote:
> >
> > I always thought mother Russia the really inventor of vodka :(
> >
> > Hahaha, even the list of Wikimedia FOundation teach me new stuff! The next 
> > shot of Vodka I drink will be ''to Poland!''
> >
> > Greetings from cachaça land,
> >
> > _
> > MateusNobre
> > MetalBrasil on Wikimedia projects
> > (+55) 85 88393509
> >  30440865
> >
> >
> >> From: russavia.wikipe...@gmail.com
> >> Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2012 07:54:22 +0800
> >> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> >> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Polish Wikimania scholarship program
> >>
> >> Beria, there are two lessons to be learnt here.
> >>
> >> 1) 
> >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_%28PPP%29_per_capita
> >> -- Wikipedia is obviously not to be used as a reliable source,
> >> especially for facetious comments.
> >> 2) Re: vodka - 
> >> http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/429547_2604401508972_1222894747_32310964_1084040106_n.jpg
> >>
> >>
> >> On Fri, Feb 17, 2012 at 7:45 AM, Béria Lima  wrote:
> >> > Actually I believe the Poles stole your vodka, Russavia, because yor GNI
> >> > per capita is only 9,900  :P
> >> > _
> >> > *Béria Lima*
> >> >  <http://wikimedia.pt/>(351) 925 171 484
> >> >
> >> > *Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter
> >> > livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a
> >> > construir esse sonho. <http://wikimedia.pt/Donativos>*
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On 16 February 2012 21:42, Russavia  wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> Hi Tomasz
> >> >>
> >> >> It also wouldn't include Russia by the looks of it, given that
> >> >> Russians are apparently 4 bottles of vodka a year richer than Poles ;)
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> On Fri, Feb 17, 2012 at 7:29 AM, Tomasz Ganicz 
> >> >> wrote:
> >> >> > Hi,
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Wikimedia Polska (Poland) has just launched its own scholarships
> >> >> > programme for Wikimedians willing to attend Wikimania 2012 in
> >> >> > Washington, D.C. This year, apart from up to 10 scholarships for
> >> >> > Wikimedians from Poland, we are also going to grant up to 6
> >> >> > scholarships for Wikimedians from other countries. Only countries
> >> >> > which have lower national income per capita than Poland (according to
> >> >> > World Bank 2010 stats) are eligible. We are particularly willing to
> >> >> > reach out to the Wikimedians from the former USSR countries (except
> >> >> > Estonia, which doesn't meet the income criteria) and from the Balkans
> >> >> > (except Greece and Slovenia, for the same reason). The scholarship
> >> >> > covers travel and accommodation expenses, as well as conference fee.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > More details are available here:
> >> >> http://pl.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimania_2012/en
> >> >> >
> >> >> > The closing date for applications is March 9.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Regards,
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > --
> >> >> > Tomek "Polimerek" Ganicz
> >> >> > http://pl.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Polimerek
> >> >> > http://www.ganicz.pl/poli/
> >> >> > http://www.cbmm.lodz.pl/work.php?id=29&title=tomasz-ganicz
> >> >> >

Re: [Foundation-l] EFE: Indigenous languages entering Wikipedia

[Mateus Nobre]

Wikimedia Brasil also have a project of indigenous language, the nheengatu 
project.

http://br.wikimedia.org/wiki/Nheengattu

_
MateusNobre
MetalBrasil on Wikimedia projects
(+55) 85 88393509
  30440865


> Date: Sat, 18 Feb 2012 18:50:20 -0300
> From: os...@wikimediachile.cl
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: [Foundation-l] EFE: Indigenous languages entering Wikipedia
> 
> Hi everyone!
> 
> Yesterday, news agency EFE published a note about the work done mainly by
> Wikimedia Argentina about the development of projects in Native American
> languages like aymara, guarani and mapudungun. The news have been replied
> in the largest newspapers and websites of Latin America and Spain.
> 
> The work to develop Wikimedia projects in Native American languages have
> been taken as a priority for the chapters members of Iberocoop (Wikimedia
> Argentina, Chile, Mexico and Venezuela) and we expect this year 2012 to
> work in the development of those communities of users and editors. But we
> expect also the support of the Language Committee and the Wikimedia
> Foundation for this work.
> 
> http://www.que.es/201202171651-lenguas-indigenas-abren-paso-wikipedia-efe.html
> 
> Here is a fast translation to English of the article (sorry for my English
> btw):
> 
> Indigenous languages ​​like Guaraní and Mapuche are making their way into
> Wikipedia with the help offered by the editors of the colorful encyclopedia
> to teachers and students of the University of Buenos Aires (UBA), the
> largest in Argentina.
> These presentations for teachers and students of Guaraní and Mapuche in the
> Language Center of the UBA wants to "promote the development of content in
> versions that are underrepresented on the Internet," said Patricio Lorente,
> president of Wikimedia Argentina, local official of the encyclopedia.
> The training courses were held at the headquarters of the university in
> late 2011 and are planned to be repeated this year to expand the initiative.
> The editors of this South American country contacted with users of
> neighboring Bolivia promote the incorporation of content in Aymara, one of
> the main indigenous languages ​​of that country, but is also spoken in
> parts of Argentina, Peru and Chile.
> According to Unesco, language preservation is a challenge considering the
> danger of extinction that half of the 6,000 languages ​​in the world are
> facing.
> "We are concerned about the preservation of culture. That is why we teach
> to those who speak these languages ​​about Wikipedia editing rules," said
> the head of the subsidiary in Argentina, with an indigenous population of
> about 600,000 people, according to official estimates.
> Currently, the encyclopedia has about 1,500 items in Guaraní and another
> 1,700 in Aymara, while the Mapuche or Mapudungun, as is known, is still in
> "experimental phase", he said.
> However, in other Indian languages ​​such as Quechua, used in Argentina and
> six other South American countries, the experience is more extensive, with
> some 16,000 articles entered.
> "With the Mapudungun there are some additional problems because until
> recently it had no writing. And, according to the communities, they have
> different ways of writing by region. So we are seeing the possibility of
> applying a technical solution so everyone can view the articles in their
> own dialect," said Lorente.
> The main Mapuche community is in Chile, where some 600,000 members
> concentrated mainly in the region of La Araucania, and also extends to the
> Argentine Patagonia, with a hundred thousand members.
> For its part, the Guarani is one of the two official languages ​​of
> Paraguay, alongside Spanish, but also has strong presence in northern
> Argentina, especially in the province of Corrientes, which is valid for the
> authorities.
> In general, articles entered in "Vikipeta", the Guarani version of the
> encyclopedia, are small in size and are mostly associated with
> geo-referenced with data on Paraguay, Bolivia and Brazil, among others.
> The editors of the site believe that the poverty facing these peoples
> should not be an obstacle to greater difussion of their languages,
> especially when those are the only languages some of them know.
> "They have a very strong linguistic identity and vocation for the
> preservation of the language. And Wikipedia is an encyclopedia in permanent
> construction that seeks to incorporate more and more content like this," he
> said Lorente.
> For that, the local site editors also prepared a manual for editing in
> Wikipedia to be delivered to recipients of the training.
> 
> 
> 
> Osmar Valdebenito Gaete
> 
> Presidente de Wikimedia Chile
> 
> http://www.wikimediachile.cl
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Re: [Foundation-l] sad news

[Mateus Nobre]

=(

_
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> From: george.herb...@gmail.com
> Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2012 00:41:34 -0700
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> CC: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org; wikie...@lists.wikimedia.org
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] sad news
> 
> Very sad, I met him and he seemed to be a very good guy.
> 
> Seems to be a bad week; a friend of mine from college passed on Sunday 
> morning.
> 
> Focus on big things and have fun while you're here.
> 
> George William Herbert
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Mar 14, 2012, at 19:42, phoebe ayers  wrote:
> 
> > Those of you who have been around for a few years may remember
> > user:Tlogmer, aka Ben Yates -- co-author with Charles Matthews and I
> > on "How Wikipedia Works."
> > 
> > I got an email from his mother this morning with the very sad news
> > that Ben passed away yesterday. I do not know the details. He was in
> > his 20s and lived in Michigan, USA.
> > 
> > There will be a memorial service in Michigan on Friday; contact me if
> > you want that information. His userpages are
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Tlogmer
> > and http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Tlogmer
> > 
> > For several years Ben wrote a blog about Wikipedia that was incisive
> > and widely read. Older posts can be found here:
> > http://wikip.blogspot.com/
> > 
> > He also designed the Wikimania logo with the two "w"s; originally
> > designed for Wikimania 2006, we use it to this day:
> > http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Wikimania_%28spacing%29.png
> > 
> > Ben was a skilled artist and designer and was responsible for all of
> > the figures in "How Wikipedia Works." He also designed posters and
> > graphic materials for Wikimania and proposed many other merchandise
> > designs to promote Wikipedia.
> > 
> > He was funny, smart, and shy; I never had a bad interaction with him.
> > I worked with him intensively for many months but never got a chance
> > to meet him in person, but I counted him as a friend long after we
> > finished the book. He will be missed.
> > 
> > If you have any comments that you would like to be given to his family
> > or read at the service, please post them on Ben's talk page or send to
> > me directly. Wikimedia was meaningful to Ben, and it would mean a lot
> > to let his mom that people cared about her son as a colleague and
> > friend.
> > 
> > thanks,
> > -- Phoebe
> > 
> > ___
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> > foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
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