Re: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Chris Coggins]

We purchased our copies of Frame a couple years ago from evaluesoftware,
for download versions only (no CD). They currently have Frame 10 Full
Version under $500, which is tempting to add another copy or two to our
library.
http://www.evaluesoftware.com/index.php?l=product_detailp=2123

On Mon, Oct 1, 2012 at 10:21 PM, Shelly Schneider she...@softest.comwrote:

 An additional contractor has been brought on by my company. If I can find
 a low-price copy of FrameMaker, perhaps she won’t end up moving her docs to
 Word (shudder). I know folks on this list swear by FrameMaker 8. FrameMaker
 9 was a bug-fest. I doubt I’ll find many people offering FrameMaker 10.
 I've had no luck on eBay . I’d love to find a copy of FrameMaker 8  with a
 transferable license (was it 8.2 everyone loved?). Does anybody have any
 thoughts or caveats on how to go about this?  Thanks! 

 Shelly Schneider

 It is no coincidence that in no known language does the phrase 'As pretty
 as an airport'  appear.  Douglas Adams

 ** **

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RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[David Artman]

 Original Message 
Subject: RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

David said: that's why I was off-list for almost six years: working long-term
for a client that's on DITA and uses a seriously robust editor.

Please tell me What Editor you were using for DITA ?
(Maybe I missed the Punch Line ??? )

I can't say without a high probability of revealing the client and,
thus, confidential aspects of their workflow. But the editor is a Major
One that is pretty thoroughly customized for the client's environment,
deliverables, and workflow (e.g., translation; shipping).

If I had to pull the trigger now, to get one for freelance work (my
clients tend to own the tools, whether I recommend them or not) then I'd
probably go with oXygen (with a SVN CMS).

It just makes me drool :P
David
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RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[David Artman]

  Original Message 
 From: Jeremy H. Griffith jer...@omsys.com
 I did think 8 was an improvement, but the road
 after that turned so sharply downhill it resembled
 falling off a cliff... IMNSHO.  I still use 8;
 we have the later ones for testing with Mif2Go,
 but do not use them for any other purpose.

And THAT is perhaps the most damning assessment I could read, of
post-FM8. Wow...

As much as I love the old darling... I don't think that I'm going to be
using it after the next year or so (barring certain types of clients).
It's got too far to go to even catch up with current, top-notch XML
editor standards; and it doesn't seem to be moving the bar very far for
multiple modern output formats.

(FWIW, that's why I was off-list for almost six years: working long-term
for a client that's on DITA and uses a seriously robust editor.)
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RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Shelly Schneider]

Thanks to all for your responses. Now all I have to do is sell the idea, before 
I buy the software

Shelly Schneider
I love flying. I've been to almost as many places as my luggage. Bob Hope 


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RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Peter Courlis]

David said: that's why I was off-list for almost six years: working long-term
for a client that's on DITA and uses a seriously robust editor.

Please tell me What Editor you were using for DITA ?
(Maybe I missed the Punch Line ??? )

Peter

--- On Tue, 10/2/12, David Artman da...@davidartman.com wrote:

From: David Artman da...@davidartman.com
Subject: RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker
To: Jeremy H. Griffith jer...@omsys.com, framers@lists.frameusers.com 
framers@lists.frameusers.com
Cc: she...@softest.com
Date: Tuesday, October 2, 2012, 2:45 PM

  Original Message 
 From: Jeremy H. Griffith jer...@omsys.com
 I did think 8 was an improvement, but the road
 after that turned so sharply downhill it resembled
 falling off a cliff... IMNSHO.  I still use 8;
 we have the later ones for testing with Mif2Go,
 but do not use them for any other purpose.

And THAT is perhaps the most damning assessment I could read, of
post-FM8. Wow...

As much as I love the old darling... I don't think that I'm going to be
using it after the next year or so (barring certain types of clients).
It's got too far to go to even catch up with current, top-notch XML
editor standards; and it doesn't seem to be moving the bar very far for
multiple modern output formats.

(FWIW, that's why I was off-list for almost six years: working long-term
for a client that's on DITA and uses a seriously robust editor.)
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Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Helen Borrie]

At 03:21 PM 2/10/2012, Shelly Schneider wrote:

>An additional contractor has been brought on by my company. If I can find a 
>low-price copy of FrameMaker, perhaps she won?t end up moving her docs to Word 
>(shudder). I know folks on this list swear by FrameMaker 8. FrameMaker 9 was a 
>bug-fest. I doubt I?ll find many people offering FrameMaker 10. I've had no 
>luck on eBay . I?d love to find a copy of FrameMaker 8  with a transferable 
>license (was it 8.2 everyone loved?). Does anybody have any thoughts or 
>caveats on how to go about this?  Thanks! 

I went the FM 8 route after trying to work with the FM 9 trial version and 
nearly losing my mind with the damned pods and a raft of things that either 
didn't work, disappeared spontaneously, or caused FM to fall over completely.  
The day I decided to buy the FM8 *upgrade* (from v.6) instead, was a few days 
after the FM 9 release.  By that time, Adobe had pulled every FM 8 pack in the 
world.  Even resellers who actually had stocks were not allowed to sell it.  
The only solution Adobe offered at that time (2009) was to buy the *full* FM 9 
retail pack and use that licence to apply for a URL to download the FM 8 
downgrade as an ISO.

Companies do clear out unused stuff from time to time and I did eventually 
manage to source an unopened retail pack at an attainable price, through eBay, 
after a while of watching.  With all the updates, it is announcing itself as 
v.8.0p277.  Another possible source is Amazon, as remaindered software is often 
offered there by third parties.

A possible caveat at this distance could be that Adobe might have pulled the 
updates.  I just don't know.  At the time I needed them, they were available;  
but that was 2009.  That said, if you are using FM 8 on site already, you 
probably have all the updates backed up for reinstalls, as I do.

Good luck!
Helen

Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Shelly Schneider]

Thanks to all for your responses. Now all I have to do is sell the idea, before 
I buy the software>

Shelly Schneider
I love flying. I've been to almost as many places as my luggage. Bob Hope 

Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Peter Courlis]

David said: "that's why I was off-list for almost six years: working long-term
for a client that's on DITA and uses a seriously robust editor.

Please tell me What Editor you were using for DITA ?
(Maybe I missed the Punch Line ??? )

Peter

--- On Tue, 10/2/12, David Artman  wrote:

From: David Artman <da...@davidartman.com>
Subject: RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker
To: "Jeremy H. Griffith" , "framers at 
lists.frameusers.com" 
Cc: shelly at softest.com
Date: Tuesday, October 2, 2012, 2:45 PM

>  Original Message 
> From: "Jeremy H. Griffith" 
> I did think 8 was an improvement, but the road
> after that turned so sharply downhill it resembled
> falling off a cliff... IMNSHO.? I still use 8;
> we have the later ones for testing with Mif2Go,
> but do not use them for any other purpose.

And THAT is perhaps the most damning assessment I could read, of
post-FM8. Wow...

As much as I love the old darling... I don't think that I'm going to be
using it after the next year or so (barring certain types of clients).
It's got too far to go to even catch up with current, top-notch XML
editor standards; and it doesn't seem to be moving the bar very far for
multiple modern output formats.

(FWIW, that's why I was off-list for almost six years: working long-term
for a client that's on DITA and uses a seriously robust editor.)
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Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Chris Coggins]

We purchased our copies of Frame a couple years ago from evaluesoftware,
for download versions only (no CD). They currently have Frame 10 Full
Version under $500, which is tempting to add another copy or two to our
library.
http://www.evaluesoftware.com/index.php?l=product_detail=2123

On Mon, Oct 1, 2012 at 10:21 PM, Shelly Schneider wrote:

> An additional contractor has been brought on by my company. If I can find
> a low-price copy of FrameMaker, perhaps she won?t end up moving her docs to
> Word (shudder). I know folks on this list swear by FrameMaker 8. FrameMaker
> 9 was a bug-fest. I doubt I?ll find many people offering FrameMaker 10.
> I've had no luck on eBay . I?d love to find a copy of FrameMaker 8  with a
> transferable license (was it 8.2 everyone loved?). Does anybody have any
> thoughts or caveats on how to go about this?  Thanks! 
>
> Shelly Schneider
>
> "It is no coincidence that in no known language does the phrase 'As pretty
> as an airport'  appear."  Douglas Adams
>
> ** **
>
> ___
>
>
> You are currently subscribed to framers as cacoggins at gmail.com.
>
> Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com.
>
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to
> framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com
> or visit
> http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/cacoggins%40gmail.com
>
> Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit
> http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
>
>
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Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[David Artman]

 Original Message 
Subject: RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

>David said: "that's why I was off-list for almost six years: working long-term
>for a client that's on DITA and uses a seriously robust editor.

>Please tell me What Editor you were using for DITA ?
>(Maybe I missed the Punch Line ??? )

I can't say without a high probability of revealing the client and,
thus, confidential aspects of their workflow. But the editor is a Major
One that is pretty thoroughly customized for the client's environment,
deliverables, and workflow (e.g., translation; shipping).

If I had to pull the trigger now, to get one for freelance work (my
clients tend to own the tools, whether I recommend them or not) then I'd
probably go with oXygen (with a SVN CMS).

It just makes me drool :P
David

Re: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Peter Courlis]

Shelly Schneider is (potentially) looking for a copy of Frame Maker 8.2.
Which brings to mind an interesting question.
Does anyone know of the distribution of F M'er (versions) in use?
That is, some earlier versions of F M'er are still in use in a production 
environment
and too what extent are these earlier versions used (???)

Anyone have a best guess or some data ?

T I A

peter





 From: Shelly Schneider she...@softest.com
To: framers@lists.frameusers.com 
Sent: Monday, October 1, 2012 10:21 PM
Subject: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker
 

An additional contractor has been brought on by my company. If I can find a 
low-price copy of FrameMaker, perhaps she won’t end up moving her docs to Word 
(shudder). I know folks on this list swear by FrameMaker 8. FrameMaker 9 was a 
bug-fest. I doubt I’ll find many people offering FrameMaker 10. I've had no 
luck on eBay . I’d love to find a copy of FrameMaker 8  with a transferable 
license (was it 8.2 everyone loved?). Does anybody have any thoughts or caveats 
on how to go about this?  Thanks! 
Shelly Schneider
It is no coincidence that in no known language does the phrase 'As pretty as 
an airport'  appear.  Douglas Adams
 
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RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Syed Zaeem Hosain (syed.hos...@aeris.net)]

There isn’t any FM 8.2 that I know of.

The Windows versions that I used/upgraded-to were (early numbering may be 
incorrect, but everything after 7.0 is correct):

5.0, 5.5, 5.6, 6.0, 7.0, 7.2, 8.0, 9.0, 10.0, and 11.0

With a varying number of available patches for each.

Also, I am not counting the older versions I used on Sun systems way back when 
– started with either 2.X or 3.0 from Frame Technology back in 1988! :)

Z

From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com 
[mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Peter Courlis
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 6:13 AM
To: Shelly Schneider; framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: Re: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

Shelly Schneider is (potentially) looking for a copy of Frame Maker 8.2.
Which brings to mind an interesting question.
Does anyone know of the distribution of F M'er (versions) in use?
That is, some earlier versions of F M'er are still in use in a production 
environment
and too what extent are these earlier versions used (???)

Anyone have a best guess or some data ?

T I A

peter


From: Shelly Schneider she...@softest.commailto:she...@softest.com
To: framers@lists.frameusers.commailto:framers@lists.frameusers.com
Sent: Monday, October 1, 2012 10:21 PM
Subject: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker


An additional contractor has been brought on by my company. If I can find a 
low-price copy of FrameMaker, perhaps she won’t end up moving her docs to Word 
(shudder). I know folks on this list swear by FrameMaker 8. FrameMaker 9 was a 
bug-fest. I doubt I’ll find many people offering FrameMaker 10. I've had no 
luck on eBay . I’d love to find a copy of FrameMaker 8  with a transferable 
license (was it 8.2 everyone loved?). Does anybody have any thoughts or caveats 
on how to go about this?  Thanks!
Shelly Schneider
It is no coincidence that in no known language does the phrase 'As pretty as 
an airport'  appear.  Douglas Adams


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RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Combs, Richard]

Syed Zaeem Hosain wrote:
 
 The Windows versions that I used/upgraded-to were (early numbering may
 be incorrect, but everything after 7.0 is correct):
 
 5.0, 5.5, 5.6, 6.0, 7.0, 7.2, 8.0, 9.0, 10.0, and 11.0

Pretty close. I recall having a 5.1 version, and it was 5.5.6, not 5.6. Loved 
that version -- absolutely rock-solid, and it had an excellent manual (the last 
excellent manual, IMHO). 

Richard G. Combs
Senior Technical Writer
Polycom, Inc.
richardDOTcombs AT polycomDOTcom
303-223-5111
--
rgcombs AT gmailDOTcom
303-903-6372
--






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RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Fred Ridder]

Just a few minor corrections/amplifications:
 
5.0 was the last release from Frame Technology.
5.1 (which I think may have officially been 5.1.2) was the first release from 
Adobe.
5.6 is an incorrect number. The version was actually numbered 5.5.6.
There was indeed a 7.1 version between 7.0 and 7.2.
 
-Fred Ridder
 



From: syed.hos...@aeris.net
To: neat_g...@yahoo.com; she...@softest.com; framers@lists.frameusers.com
Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2012 07:09:24 -0700
Subject: RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker







There isn’t any FM 8.2 that I know of.

The Windows versions that I used/upgraded-to were (early numbering may be 
incorrect, but everything after 7.0 is correct):
 
5.0, 5.5, 5.6, 6.0, 7.0, 7.2, 8.0, 9.0, 10.0, and 11.0
 
With a varying number of available patches for each.
 
Also, I am not counting the older versions I used on Sun systems way back when 
– started with either 2.X or 3.0 from Frame Technology back in 1988! :)
 
Z
 


From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com 
[mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Peter Courlis
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 6:13 AM
To: Shelly Schneider; framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: Re: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker
 

Shelly Schneider is (potentially) looking for a copy of Frame Maker 8.2.
Which brings to mind an interesting question.
Does anyone know of the distribution of F M'er (versions) in use?
That is, some earlier versions of F M'er are still in use in a production 
environment
and too what extent are these earlier versions used (???)

Anyone have a best guess or some data ?

T I A

peter

 






From: Shelly Schneider she...@softest.com
To: framers@lists.frameusers.com 
Sent: Monday, October 1, 2012 10:21 PM
Subject: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker







An additional contractor has been brought on by my company. If I can find a 
low-price copy of FrameMaker, perhaps she won’t end up moving her docs to Word 
(shudder). I know folks on this list swear by FrameMaker 8. FrameMaker 9 was a 
bug-fest. I doubt I’ll find many people offering FrameMaker 10. I've had no 
luck on eBay . I’d love to find a copy of FrameMaker 8  with a transferable 
license (was it 8.2 everyone loved?). Does anybody have any thoughts or caveats 
on how to go about this?  Thanks! 

Shelly Schneider

It is no coincidence that in no known language does the phrase 'As pretty as 
an airport'  appear.  Douglas Adams

 

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RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Syed Zaeem Hosain (syed.hos...@aeris.net)]

Oops, yes. I spaced out about the 5.5.6 (not 5.6) ... I don't remember the 5.1 
version at all though - might have been a period when I had stopped using 
FrameMaker for a while (had beta-tested the 5.0 version for Frame Technology), 
so I don't have that disk.

Z


-Original Message-
From: Combs, Richard [mailto:richard.co...@polycom.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 7:22 AM
To: Syed Zaeem Hosain (syed.hos...@aeris.net); Peter Courlis; Shelly Schneider; 
framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

Syed Zaeem Hosain wrote:
 
 The Windows versions that I used/upgraded-to were (early numbering may 
 be incorrect, but everything after 7.0 is correct):
 
 5.0, 5.5, 5.6, 6.0, 7.0, 7.2, 8.0, 9.0, 10.0, and 11.0

Pretty close. I recall having a 5.1 version, and it was 5.5.6, not 5.6. Loved 
that version -- absolutely rock-solid, and it had an excellent manual (the last 
excellent manual, IMHO). 

Richard G. Combs
Senior Technical Writer
Polycom, Inc.
richardDOTcombs AT polycomDOTcom
303-223-5111
--
rgcombs AT gmailDOTcom
303-903-6372
--






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RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Syed Zaeem Hosain (syed.hos...@aeris.net)]

Yes, I definitely erred on the 5.6 version ... it was 5.5.6 for sure now that 
both you and Richard mention it.

I don't remember the 5.1 (or 5.1.2?) version at all - like I mentioned in 
another response, I may not have been using FrameMaker at that time (due to the 
company I was working for).

Separately, I have to admit I also don't recall the 7.1 version at all. I guess 
my old age is creeping up on me more than I thought!
Z

From: Fred Ridder [mailto:docu...@hotmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 8:08 AM
To: Syed Zaeem Hosain (syed.hos...@aeris.net); neat_g...@yahoo.com; 
she...@softest.com; framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

Just a few minor corrections/amplifications:

5.0 was the last release from Frame Technology.
5.1 (which I think may have officially been 5.1.2) was the first release from 
Adobe.
5.6 is an incorrect number. The version was actually numbered 5.5.6.
There was indeed a 7.1 version between 7.0 and 7.2.

-Fred Ridder


From: syed.hos...@aeris.netmailto:syed.hos...@aeris.net
To: neat_g...@yahoo.commailto:neat_g...@yahoo.com; 
she...@softest.commailto:she...@softest.com; 
framers@lists.frameusers.commailto:framers@lists.frameusers.com
Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2012 07:09:24 -0700
Subject: RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker
There isn't any FM 8.2 that I know of.

The Windows versions that I used/upgraded-to were (early numbering may be 
incorrect, but everything after 7.0 is correct):

5.0, 5.5, 5.6, 6.0, 7.0, 7.2, 8.0, 9.0, 10.0, and 11.0

With a varying number of available patches for each.

Also, I am not counting the older versions I used on Sun systems way back when 
- started with either 2.X or 3.0 from Frame Technology back in 1988! :)

Z

From: 
framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.commailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com
 
[mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com]mailto:[mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com]
 On Behalf Of Peter Courlis
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 6:13 AM
To: Shelly Schneider; 
framers@lists.frameusers.commailto:framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: Re: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

Shelly Schneider is (potentially) looking for a copy of Frame Maker 8.2.
Which brings to mind an interesting question.
Does anyone know of the distribution of F M'er (versions) in use?
That is, some earlier versions of F M'er are still in use in a production 
environment
and too what extent are these earlier versions used (???)

Anyone have a best guess or some data ?

T I A

peter


From: Shelly Schneider she...@softest.commailto:she...@softest.com
To: framers@lists.frameusers.commailto:framers@lists.frameusers.com
Sent: Monday, October 1, 2012 10:21 PM
Subject: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

An additional contractor has been brought on by my company. If I can find a 
low-price copy of FrameMaker, perhaps she won't end up moving her docs to Word 
(shudder). I know folks on this list swear by FrameMaker 8. FrameMaker 9 was a 
bug-fest. I doubt I'll find many people offering FrameMaker 10. I've had no 
luck on eBay . I'd love to find a copy of FrameMaker 8  with a transferable 
license (was it 8.2 everyone loved?). Does anybody have any thoughts or caveats 
on how to go about this?  Thanks!
Shelly Schneider
It is no coincidence that in no known language does the phrase 'As pretty as 
an airport'  appear.  Douglas Adams


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RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Syed Zaeem Hosain (syed.hos...@aeris.net)]

Cool link ... thanks for the info, Scott!

Based on this, it looks like I started using FrameMaker with version 1.0, since 
the first server copy I bought was for a Sun 3/50 monochrome system back in 
mid-1988 or so. Now that I see it, I think I remember the upgrade to version 
1.3 ... but could have sworn it was before the end of 1988, not 1989. Oh, well!

At the company I worked for, the Technical Publications department used 
Interleaf for their specs and marketing collateral, and my software/engineering 
team selected FrameMaker for our documentation work. Shared server licenses was 
the reason as I recall ... with Interleaf, the Sun booted into the program 
and was thus locked to each system. FrameMaker just ran as another 
application under SunView instead.

Z

From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com 
[mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Scott Prentice
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 9:23 AM
To: framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: Re: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

In addition to the wealth of other types of FrameMaker information and tools on 
his website, Klaus Daube has a very informative history of FrameMaker page ..

http://www.daube.ch/docu/fmhist00.html

Cheers,

...scott
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Re: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Robert Lauriston]

7.2 was the one that added multiple undo. 8 added Unicode support.

9 included the incompetent UI makeover and broke keyboard navigation.
10 doesn't seem much different to me.

Used copies of FrameMaker turn up on eBay now and then. Currently I
see copies of 6, 7, 7.1, and 7.2. Which version are you using?

On Mon, Oct 1, 2012 at 7:21 PM, Shelly Schneider she...@softest.com wrote:
 An additional contractor has been brought on by my company. If I can find a
 low-price copy of FrameMaker, perhaps she won’t end up moving her docs to
 Word (shudder). I know folks on this list swear by FrameMaker 8. FrameMaker
 9 was a bug-fest. I doubt I’ll find many people offering FrameMaker 10. I've
 had no luck on eBay . I’d love to find a copy of FrameMaker 8  with a
 transferable license (was it 8.2 everyone loved?).
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Re: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Jeremy H. Griffith]

On Tue, 2 Oct 2012 11:08:30 -0400, Fred Ridder 
docu...@hotmail.com wrote:

There was indeed a 7.1 version between 7.0 and 7.2.

Yes, and it was the last version produced by the
engineering team Adobe acquired with Frame Technology.
The 7.2 version was the first from Adobe India.

As a side note, Adobe acquired RH after Macromedia 
had already laid off the RH developers, who went
on to become Madcap and produced Flare.

That's also when the doc updates ended; the 7.1 
docs were shipped for the next few, along with
an update release-notes doc.

I did think 8 was an improvement, but the road
after that turned so sharply downhill it resembled
falling off a cliff... IMNSHO.  I still use 8;
we have the later ones for testing with Mif2Go,
but do not use them for any other purpose.

-- Jeremy H. Griffith, at Omni Systems Inc.
  jer...@omsys.comhttp://mif2go.com/
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Re: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Mike Wickham]

I'm pretty sure there was also a 7.1 version.

Mike Wickham

On 10/2/2012 9:22 AM, Combs, Richard wrote:

Syed Zaeem Hosain wrote:
  

The Windows versions that I used/upgraded-to were (early numbering may
be incorrect, but everything after 7.0 is correct):

5.0, 5.5, 5.6, 6.0, 7.0, 7.2, 8.0, 9.0, 10.0, and 11.0

Pretty close. I recall having a 5.1 version, and it was 5.5.6, not 5.6. Loved 
that version -- absolutely rock-solid, and it had an excellent manual (the last 
excellent manual, IMHO).

Richard G. Combs
Senior Technical Writer
Polycom, Inc.
richardDOTcombs AT polycomDOTcom
303-223-5111
--
rgcombs AT gmailDOTcom
303-903-6372
--






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Re: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Helen Borrie]

At 03:21 PM 2/10/2012, Shelly Schneider wrote:

An additional contractor has been brought on by my company. If I can find a 
low-price copy of FrameMaker, perhaps she won’t end up moving her docs to Word 
(shudder). I know folks on this list swear by FrameMaker 8. FrameMaker 9 was a 
bug-fest. I doubt I’ll find many people offering FrameMaker 10. I've had no 
luck on eBay . I’d love to find a copy of FrameMaker 8  with a transferable 
license (was it 8.2 everyone loved?). Does anybody have any thoughts or 
caveats on how to go about this?  Thanks! 

I went the FM 8 route after trying to work with the FM 9 trial version and 
nearly losing my mind with the damned pods and a raft of things that either 
didn't work, disappeared spontaneously, or caused FM to fall over completely.  
The day I decided to buy the FM8 *upgrade* (from v.6) instead, was a few days 
after the FM 9 release.  By that time, Adobe had pulled every FM 8 pack in the 
world.  Even resellers who actually had stocks were not allowed to sell it.  
The only solution Adobe offered at that time (2009) was to buy the *full* FM 9 
retail pack and use that licence to apply for a URL to download the FM 8 
downgrade as an ISO.

Companies do clear out unused stuff from time to time and I did eventually 
manage to source an unopened retail pack at an attainable price, through eBay, 
after a while of watching.  With all the updates, it is announcing itself as 
v.8.0p277.  Another possible source is Amazon, as remaindered software is often 
offered there by third parties.

A possible caveat at this distance could be that Adobe might have pulled the 
updates.  I just don't know.  At the time I needed them, they were available;  
but that was 2009.  That said, if you are using FM 8 on site already, you 
probably have all the updates backed up for reinstalls, as I do.

Good luck!
Helen

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RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Tammy Van Boening]

Richard Combs wrote:
 
 Pretty close. I recall having a 5.1 version, and it was 5.5.6, not 5.6.
Loved that version -- absolutely rock-solid, and it had an   excellent
manual (the last excellent manual, IMHO). 

Oh man, that is the truth!!! 

TVB






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Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Shelly Schneider]

An additional contractor has been brought on by my company. If I can find a
low-price copy of FrameMaker, perhaps she won't end up moving her docs to
Word (shudder). I know folks on this list swear by FrameMaker 8. FrameMaker
9 was a bug-fest. I doubt I'll find many people offering FrameMaker 10. I've
had no luck on eBay . I'd love to find a copy of FrameMaker 8  with a
transferable license (was it 8.2 everyone loved?). Does anybody have any
thoughts or caveats on how to go about this?  Thanks! 

Shelly Schneider

"It is no coincidence that in no known language does the phrase 'As pretty
as an airport'  appear."  Douglas Adams



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Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Peter Courlis]

Shelly Schneider is (potentially) looking for a copy of Frame Maker 8.2.
Which brings to mind an interesting question.
Does anyone know of the distribution of F M'er (versions) in use?
That is, some earlier versions of F M'er are still in use in a production 
environment
and too what extent are these earlier versions used (???)

Anyone have a "best guess" or some data ?

T I A

peter





 From: Shelly Schneider 
To: framers at lists.frameusers.com 
Sent: Monday, October 1, 2012 10:21 PM
Subject: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker


An additional contractor has been brought on by my company. If I can find a 
low-price copy of FrameMaker, perhaps she won?t end up moving her docs to Word 
(shudder). I know folks on this list swear by FrameMaker 8. FrameMaker 9 was a 
bug-fest. I doubt I?ll find many people offering FrameMaker 10. I've had no 
luck on eBay . I?d love to find a copy of FrameMaker 8 ?with a transferable 
license (was it 8.2 everyone loved?). Does anybody have any thoughts or caveats 
on how to go about this?? Thanks! 
Shelly Schneider
"It is no coincidence that in no known language does the phrase 'As pretty as 
an airport'? appear."? Douglas Adams
?
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Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Syed Zaeem Hosain (syed.hos...@aeris.net)]

There isn?t any FM 8.2 that I know of.

The Windows versions that I used/upgraded-to were (early numbering may be 
incorrect, but everything after 7.0 is correct):

5.0, 5.5, 5.6, 6.0, 7.0, 7.2, 8.0, 9.0, 10.0, and 11.0

With a varying number of available patches for each.

Also, I am not counting the older versions I used on Sun systems way back when 
? started with either 2.X or 3.0 from Frame Technology back in 1988! :)

Z

From: framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com 
[mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Peter Courlis
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 6:13 AM
To: Shelly Schneider; framers at lists.frameusers.com
Subject: Re: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

Shelly Schneider is (potentially) looking for a copy of Frame Maker 8.2.
Which brings to mind an interesting question.
Does anyone know of the distribution of F M'er (versions) in use?
That is, some earlier versions of F M'er are still in use in a production 
environment
and too what extent are these earlier versions used (???)

Anyone have a "best guess" or some data ?

T I A

peter


From: Shelly Schneider mailto:she...@softest.com>>
To: framers at lists.frameusers.com<mailto:framers at lists.frameusers.com>
Sent: Monday, October 1, 2012 10:21 PM
Subject: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker


An additional contractor has been brought on by my company. If I can find a 
low-price copy of FrameMaker, perhaps she won?t end up moving her docs to Word 
(shudder). I know folks on this list swear by FrameMaker 8. FrameMaker 9 was a 
bug-fest. I doubt I?ll find many people offering FrameMaker 10. I've had no 
luck on eBay . I?d love to find a copy of FrameMaker 8  with a transferable 
license (was it 8.2 everyone loved?). Does anybody have any thoughts or caveats 
on how to go about this?  Thanks!
Shelly Schneider
"It is no coincidence that in no known language does the phrase 'As pretty as 
an airport'  appear."  Douglas Adams


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Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Combs, Richard]

Syed Zaeem Hosain wrote:

> The Windows versions that I used/upgraded-to were (early numbering may
> be incorrect, but everything after 7.0 is correct):
> 
> 5.0, 5.5, 5.6, 6.0, 7.0, 7.2, 8.0, 9.0, 10.0, and 11.0

Pretty close. I recall having a 5.1 version, and it was 5.5.6, not 5.6. Loved 
that version -- absolutely rock-solid, and it had an excellent manual (the last 
excellent manual, IMHO). 

Richard G. Combs
Senior Technical Writer
Polycom, Inc.
richardDOTcombs AT polycomDOTcom
303-223-5111
--
rgcombs AT gmailDOTcom
303-903-6372
--

Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Fred Ridder]

Just a few minor corrections/amplifications:

5.0 was the last release from Frame Technology.
5.1 (which I think may have officially been 5.1.2) was the first release from 
Adobe.
5.6 is an incorrect number. The version was actually numbered 5.5.6.
There was indeed a 7.1 version between 7.0 and 7.2.

-Fred Ridder




From: syed.hos...@aeris.net
To: neat_gent at yahoo.com; shelly at softest.com; framers at 
lists.frameusers.com
Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2012 07:09:24 -0700
Subject: RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker







There isn?t any FM 8.2 that I know of.

The Windows versions that I used/upgraded-to were (early numbering may be 
incorrect, but everything after 7.0 is correct):

5.0, 5.5, 5.6, 6.0, 7.0, 7.2, 8.0, 9.0, 10.0, and 11.0

With a varying number of available patches for each.

Also, I am not counting the older versions I used on Sun systems way back when 
? started with either 2.X or 3.0 from Frame Technology back in 1988! :)

Z



From: framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com 
[mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Peter Courlis
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 6:13 AM
To: Shelly Schneider; framers at lists.frameusers.com
Subject: Re: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker


Shelly Schneider is (potentially) looking for a copy of Frame Maker 8.2.
Which brings to mind an interesting question.
Does anyone know of the distribution of F M'er (versions) in use?
That is, some earlier versions of F M'er are still in use in a production 
environment
and too what extent are these earlier versions used (???)

Anyone have a "best guess" or some data ?

T I A

peter








From: Shelly Schneider <she...@softest.com>
To: framers at lists.frameusers.com 
Sent: Monday, October 1, 2012 10:21 PM
Subject: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker







An additional contractor has been brought on by my company. If I can find a 
low-price copy of FrameMaker, perhaps she won?t end up moving her docs to Word 
(shudder). I know folks on this list swear by FrameMaker 8. FrameMaker 9 was a 
bug-fest. I doubt I?ll find many people offering FrameMaker 10. I've had no 
luck on eBay . I?d love to find a copy of FrameMaker 8  with a transferable 
license (was it 8.2 everyone loved?). Does anybody have any thoughts or caveats 
on how to go about this?  Thanks! 

Shelly Schneider

"It is no coincidence that in no known language does the phrase 'As pretty as 
an airport'  appear."  Douglas Adams



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Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Syed Zaeem Hosain (syed.hos...@aeris.net)]

Oops, yes. I spaced out about the 5.5.6 (not 5.6) ... I don't remember the 5.1 
version at all though - might have been a period when I had stopped using 
FrameMaker for a while (had beta-tested the 5.0 version for Frame Technology), 
so I don't have that disk.

Z


-Original Message-
From: Combs, Richard [mailto:richard.co...@polycom.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 7:22 AM
To: Syed Zaeem Hosain (Syed.Hosain at aeris.net); Peter Courlis; Shelly 
Schneider; framers at lists.frameusers.com
Subject: RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

Syed Zaeem Hosain wrote:

> The Windows versions that I used/upgraded-to were (early numbering may 
> be incorrect, but everything after 7.0 is correct):
> 
> 5.0, 5.5, 5.6, 6.0, 7.0, 7.2, 8.0, 9.0, 10.0, and 11.0

Pretty close. I recall having a 5.1 version, and it was 5.5.6, not 5.6. Loved 
that version -- absolutely rock-solid, and it had an excellent manual (the last 
excellent manual, IMHO). 

Richard G. Combs
Senior Technical Writer
Polycom, Inc.
richardDOTcombs AT polycomDOTcom
303-223-5111
--
rgcombs AT gmailDOTcom
303-903-6372
--

Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Syed Zaeem Hosain (syed.hos...@aeris.net)]

Yes, I definitely erred on the 5.6 version ... it was 5.5.6 for sure now that 
both you and Richard mention it.

I don't remember the 5.1 (or 5.1.2?) version at all - like I mentioned in 
another response, I may not have been using FrameMaker at that time (due to the 
company I was working for).

Separately, I have to admit I also don't recall the 7.1 version at all. I guess 
my old age is creeping up on me more than I thought!
Z

From: Fred Ridder [mailto:docu...@hotmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 8:08 AM
To: Syed Zaeem Hosain (Syed.Hosain at aeris.net); neat_gent at yahoo.com; 
shelly at softest.com; framers at lists.frameusers.com
Subject: RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

Just a few minor corrections/amplifications:

5.0 was the last release from Frame Technology.
5.1 (which I think may have officially been 5.1.2) was the first release from 
Adobe.
5.6 is an incorrect number. The version was actually numbered 5.5.6.
There was indeed a 7.1 version between 7.0 and 7.2.

-Fred Ridder


From: Syed.Hosain at aeris.net<mailto:syed.hos...@aeris.net>
To: neat_gent at yahoo.com<mailto:neat_gent at yahoo.com>; shelly at 
softest.com<mailto:shelly at softest.com>; framers at 
lists.frameusers.com<mailto:framers at lists.frameusers.com>
Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2012 07:09:24 -0700
Subject: RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker
There isn't any FM 8.2 that I know of.

The Windows versions that I used/upgraded-to were (early numbering may be 
incorrect, but everything after 7.0 is correct):

5.0, 5.5, 5.6, 6.0, 7.0, 7.2, 8.0, 9.0, 10.0, and 11.0

With a varying number of available patches for each.

Also, I am not counting the older versions I used on Sun systems way back when 
- started with either 2.X or 3.0 from Frame Technology back in 1988! :)

Z

From: framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com<mailto:framers-bounces at 
lists.frameusers.com> [mailto:framers-bounces at 
lists.frameusers.com]<mailto:[mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com]> On 
Behalf Of Peter Courlis
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 6:13 AM
To: Shelly Schneider; framers at lists.frameusers.com<mailto:framers at 
lists.frameusers.com>
Subject: Re: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

Shelly Schneider is (potentially) looking for a copy of Frame Maker 8.2.
Which brings to mind an interesting question.
Does anyone know of the distribution of F M'er (versions) in use?
That is, some earlier versions of F M'er are still in use in a production 
environment
and too what extent are these earlier versions used (???)

Anyone have a "best guess" or some data ?

T I A

peter


From: Shelly Schneider mailto:she...@softest.com>>
To: framers at lists.frameusers.com<mailto:framers at lists.frameusers.com>
Sent: Monday, October 1, 2012 10:21 PM
Subject: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

An additional contractor has been brought on by my company. If I can find a 
low-price copy of FrameMaker, perhaps she won't end up moving her docs to Word 
(shudder). I know folks on this list swear by FrameMaker 8. FrameMaker 9 was a 
bug-fest. I doubt I'll find many people offering FrameMaker 10. I've had no 
luck on eBay . I'd love to find a copy of FrameMaker 8  with a transferable 
license (was it 8.2 everyone loved?). Does anybody have any thoughts or caveats 
on how to go about this?  Thanks!
Shelly Schneider
"It is no coincidence that in no known language does the phrase 'As pretty as 
an airport'  appear."  Douglas Adams


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Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Scott Prentice]

In addition to the wealth of other types of FrameMaker information and 
tools on his website, Klaus Daube has a very informative history of 
FrameMaker page ..

 http://www.daube.ch/docu/fmhist00.html

Cheers,

...scott

On 10/2/12 8:28 AM, Syed Zaeem Hosain wrote:
> Oops, yes. I spaced out about the 5.5.6 (not 5.6) ... I don't remember the 
> 5.1 version at all though - might have been a period when I had stopped using 
> FrameMaker for a while (had beta-tested the 5.0 version for Frame 
> Technology), so I don't have that disk.
>
> Z
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Combs, Richard [mailto:richard.combs at Polycom.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 7:22 AM
> To: Syed Zaeem Hosain (Syed.Hosain at aeris.net); Peter Courlis; Shelly 
> Schneider; framers at lists.frameusers.com
> Subject: RE: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker
>
> Syed Zaeem Hosain wrote:
>   
>> The Windows versions that I used/upgraded-to were (early numbering may
>> be incorrect, but everything after 7.0 is correct):
>>
>> 5.0, 5.5, 5.6, 6.0, 7.0, 7.2, 8.0, 9.0, 10.0, and 11.0
> Pretty close. I recall having a 5.1 version, and it was 5.5.6, not 5.6. Loved 
> that version -- absolutely rock-solid, and it had an excellent manual (the 
> last excellent manual, IMHO).
>
> Richard G. Combs
> Senior Technical Writer
> Polycom, Inc.
> richardDOTcombs AT polycomDOTcom
> 303-223-5111
> --
> rgcombs AT gmailDOTcom
> 303-903-6372
> --
>
>
>
>
>

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Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Syed Zaeem Hosain (syed.hos...@aeris.net)]

Cool link ... thanks for the info, Scott!

Based on this, it looks like I started using FrameMaker with version 1.0, since 
the first server copy I bought was for a Sun 3/50 monochrome system back in 
mid-1988 or so. Now that I see it, I think I remember the upgrade to version 
1.3 ... but could have sworn it was before the end of 1988, not 1989. Oh, well!

At the company I worked for, the Technical Publications department used 
Interleaf for their specs and marketing collateral, and my software/engineering 
team selected FrameMaker for our documentation work. Shared server licenses was 
the reason as I recall ... with Interleaf, the Sun "booted" into the program 
and was thus "locked" to each system. FrameMaker just ran as another 
application under SunView instead.

Z

From: framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com 
[mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Scott Prentice
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 9:23 AM
To: framers at lists.frameusers.com
Subject: Re: Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

In addition to the wealth of other types of FrameMaker information and tools on 
his website, Klaus Daube has a very informative history of FrameMaker page ..

http://www.daube.ch/docu/fmhist00.html

Cheers,

...scott
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Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Robert Lauriston]

7.2 was the one that added multiple undo. 8 added Unicode support.

9 included the incompetent UI makeover and broke keyboard navigation.
10 doesn't seem much different to me.

Used copies of FrameMaker turn up on eBay now and then. Currently I
see copies of 6, 7, 7.1, and 7.2. Which version are you using?

On Mon, Oct 1, 2012 at 7:21 PM, Shelly Schneider  wrote:
> An additional contractor has been brought on by my company. If I can find a
> low-price copy of FrameMaker, perhaps she won?t end up moving her docs to
> Word (shudder). I know folks on this list swear by FrameMaker 8. FrameMaker
> 9 was a bug-fest. I doubt I?ll find many people offering FrameMaker 10. I've
> had no luck on eBay . I?d love to find a copy of FrameMaker 8  with a
> transferable license (was it 8.2 everyone loved?).

Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Jeremy H. Griffith]

On Tue, 2 Oct 2012 11:08:30 -0400, Fred Ridder 
 wrote:

>There was indeed a 7.1 version between 7.0 and 7.2.

Yes, and it was the last version produced by the
engineering team Adobe acquired with Frame Technology.
The 7.2 version was the first from Adobe India.

As a side note, Adobe acquired RH after Macromedia 
had already laid off the RH developers, who went
on to become Madcap and produced Flare.

That's also when the doc updates ended; the 7.1 
docs were shipped for the next few, along with
an update release-notes doc.

I did think 8 was an improvement, but the road
after that turned so sharply downhill it resembled
falling off a cliff... IMNSHO.  I still use 8;
we have the later ones for testing with Mif2Go,
but do not use them for any other purpose.

-- Jeremy H. Griffith, at Omni Systems Inc.
  http://mif2go.com/

Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Mike Wickham]

I'm pretty sure there was also a 7.1 version.

Mike Wickham

On 10/2/2012 9:22 AM, Combs, Richard wrote:
> Syed Zaeem Hosain wrote:
>   
>> The Windows versions that I used/upgraded-to were (early numbering may
>> be incorrect, but everything after 7.0 is correct):
>>
>> 5.0, 5.5, 5.6, 6.0, 7.0, 7.2, 8.0, 9.0, 10.0, and 11.0
> Pretty close. I recall having a 5.1 version, and it was 5.5.6, not 5.6. Loved 
> that version -- absolutely rock-solid, and it had an excellent manual (the 
> last excellent manual, IMHO).
>
> Richard G. Combs
> Senior Technical Writer
> Polycom, Inc.
> richardDOTcombs AT polycomDOTcom
> 303-223-5111
> --
> rgcombs AT gmailDOTcom
> 303-903-6372
> --
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ___
>
>
> You are currently subscribed to framers as info at mikewickham.com.
>
> Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com.
>
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to
> framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com
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>
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>
>

Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Wolfgang Schapat]

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Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Tammy Van Boening]

Richard Combs wrote:

> Pretty close. I recall having a 5.1 version, and it was 5.5.6, not 5.6.
Loved that version -- absolutely rock-solid, and it had an > > excellent
manual (the last excellent manual, IMHO). 

Oh man, that is the truth!!! 

TVB






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Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[David Artman]

>  Original Message 
> From: "Jeremy H. Griffith" 
> I did think 8 was an improvement, but the road
> after that turned so sharply downhill it resembled
> falling off a cliff... IMNSHO.  I still use 8;
> we have the later ones for testing with Mif2Go,
> but do not use them for any other purpose.

And THAT is perhaps the most damning assessment I could read, of
post-FM8. Wow...

As much as I love the old darling... I don't think that I'm going to be
using it after the next year or so (barring certain types of clients).
It's got too far to go to even catch up with current, top-notch XML
editor standards; and it doesn't seem to be moving the bar very far for
multiple modern output formats.

(FWIW, that's why I was off-list for almost six years: working long-term
for a client that's on DITA and uses a seriously robust editor.)

Buying an old copy of FrameMaker

[Shelly Schneider]

An additional contractor has been brought on by my company. If I can find a
low-price copy of FrameMaker, perhaps she won't end up moving her docs to
Word (shudder). I know folks on this list swear by FrameMaker 8. FrameMaker
9 was a bug-fest. I doubt I'll find many people offering FrameMaker 10. I've
had no luck on eBay . I'd love to find a copy of FrameMaker 8  with a
transferable license (was it 8.2 everyone loved?). Does anybody have any
thoughts or caveats on how to go about this?  Thanks! 

Shelly Schneider

It is no coincidence that in no known language does the phrase 'As pretty
as an airport'  appear.  Douglas Adams

 

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