Re: what software can support that UPS ?

[Robert Huff]

Wojciech Puchar writes:

>  > /usr/ports/sysutils/apcupsd ?
>  
>  ? - so what to give as device? /dev/ugen1.3?
>  set
>  
>  UPSCABLE usb
>  UPSTYPE usb

My BackUPS RS 500 works fine using those and a empty "DEVICE" field.
It is possible this is a new/redesigned model that Apcupsd does
not handle correctly.  (APC is famous for not having a consistant
interface, even model lines.)  If so, you should post to the apcupsd
mailing list where these kind of things get prompt attention.


Robert Huff


___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: what software can support that UPS ?

[Wojciech Puchar]

/usr/ports/sysutils/apcupsd ?


? - so what to give as device? /dev/ugen1.3?
set

UPSCABLE usb
UPSTYPE usb
not set DEVICE as specified in comments for USB devices.

can't find UPS. tried setting DEVICE to /dev/ugen1.3 - no avail.



tried /usr/ports/sysutils/nut

selected "EVER" driver, and set up /dev/ugen1.3 as port - driver fails.


from what i found in linux groups it should work as USB HID device. but 
uhid doesn't attach.





On 05/14/2012 14:06, Wojciech Puchar wrote:

seems like it is very badly made USB interface, all class data is empty,



ugen1.3:  at usbus1, cfg=0 md=HOST spd=FULL 
(12Mbps) pwr=ON


  bLength = 0x0012
  bDescriptorType = 0x0001
  bcdUSB = 0x0101
  bDeviceClass = 0x
  bDeviceSubClass = 0x
  bDeviceProtocol = 0x
  bMaxPacketSize0 = 0x0008
  idVendor = 0x0403
  idProduct = 0xe520
  bcdDevice = 0x0400
  iManufacturer = 0x0001 
  iProduct = 0x0002 
  iSerialNumber = 0x0003 
  bNumConfigurations = 0x0001


FreeBSD gives only ugen interface.


what (if any) software support that?
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to 
"freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"



--
No trees were killed in the creation of this message.
However, many electrons were terribly inconvenienced.



___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: what software can support that UPS ?

[Julien Cigar]

/usr/ports/sysutils/apcupsd ?

On 05/14/2012 14:06, Wojciech Puchar wrote:

seems like it is very badly made USB interface, all class data is empty,



ugen1.3:  at usbus1, cfg=0 md=HOST spd=FULL 
(12Mbps) pwr=ON


  bLength = 0x0012
  bDescriptorType = 0x0001
  bcdUSB = 0x0101
  bDeviceClass = 0x
  bDeviceSubClass = 0x
  bDeviceProtocol = 0x
  bMaxPacketSize0 = 0x0008
  idVendor = 0x0403
  idProduct = 0xe520
  bcdDevice = 0x0400
  iManufacturer = 0x0001 
  iProduct = 0x0002 
  iSerialNumber = 0x0003 
  bNumConfigurations = 0x0001


FreeBSD gives only ugen interface.


what (if any) software support that?
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to 
"freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"



--
No trees were killed in the creation of this message.
However, many electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

what software can support that UPS ?

[Wojciech Puchar]

seems like it is very badly made USB interface, all class data is empty,



ugen1.3:  at usbus1, cfg=0 md=HOST spd=FULL (12Mbps) 
pwr=ON

  bLength = 0x0012
  bDescriptorType = 0x0001
  bcdUSB = 0x0101
  bDeviceClass = 0x
  bDeviceSubClass = 0x
  bDeviceProtocol = 0x
  bMaxPacketSize0 = 0x0008
  idVendor = 0x0403
  idProduct = 0xe520
  bcdDevice = 0x0400
  iManufacturer = 0x0001  
  iProduct = 0x0002  
  iSerialNumber = 0x0003  
  bNumConfigurations = 0x0001


FreeBSD gives only ugen interface.


what (if any) software support that?
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software Development using Freebsd.

[Jorge Biquez]

Hello all.

I have been reading in detail all your comments and advice.

Thank you very much for your time. I have clear vision now of what do 
I need to do.


I comment today to my students the help we were getting and all of 
them send you a BIG "THANK YOU VERY MUCH" comment. I hope that wieth 
your help and comments I could help them more.


Thanks again to all.

Have a nice day/night.

Jorge Biquez

At 06:23 p.m. 07/02/2012, C. P. Ghost wrote:

On Tue, Feb 7, 2012 at 5:34 PM, Waitman Gobble  wrote:
>
> On Feb 6, 2012 6:13 PM, "C. P. Ghost"  wrote:
>>
>> On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 11:37 PM, Jorge Biquez 
>> wrote:
>> > Now we will try to have a graphical mode in Freebsd. With that we would
>> > like
>> > to be able to develop graphical applications for Windows (we all know
>> > that's
>> > the market and here some companies is what they are looking), so maybe
>> > sound
>> > crazy but I am looking to develop applications for Windows without using
>> > WIndows or Microsofot products at least.
>>
>> Go for Qt. It is a great cross-platform C++ GUI framework, with plugins to
>> SQL
>> databases, networking and everything you would typically need. There's
>> even
>> PyQt, if you want Python bindings.
>>
>> Check out the examples in the Qt distribution too to get an idea:
>>
>> http://developer.qt.nokia.com/doc/qt-4.8/all-examples.html
>
> I agree Qt is a great solution however you are probably going to want to
> ship static binaries to windows clients (only), especially to non-techical
> end users... otherwise it gets kind of insane, much more challenging than
> distributing java based apps IMHO.
>
> But the IDE is fantastic plus you get a nice integration with webkit.
>
> if I remember (been awhile) the license terms are a little different for
> static, would have to re-read carefully.

I don't know about licensing issues w.r.t. static binaries; but you're
absolutely right: it's definitely worth looking into.

Another cross-platform GUI is wxWidgets (C++, but has Python
bindings too). It's not as rich a library as Qt IMHO, but quite nice
too. You may want to combine wxWidgets with Poco though (all
of this is in ports, btw).

-cpghost.

--
Cordula's Web. http://www.cordula.ws/


___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software Development using Freebsd.

[C. P. Ghost]

On Tue, Feb 7, 2012 at 5:34 PM, Waitman Gobble  wrote:
>
> On Feb 6, 2012 6:13 PM, "C. P. Ghost"  wrote:
>>
>> On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 11:37 PM, Jorge Biquez 
>> wrote:
>> > Now we will try to have a graphical mode in Freebsd. With that we would
>> > like
>> > to be able to develop graphical applications for Windows (we all know
>> > that's
>> > the market and here some companies is what they are looking), so maybe
>> > sound
>> > crazy but I am looking to develop applications for Windows without using
>> > WIndows or Microsofot products at least.
>>
>> Go for Qt. It is a great cross-platform C++ GUI framework, with plugins to
>> SQL
>> databases, networking and everything you would typically need. There's
>> even
>> PyQt, if you want Python bindings.
>>
>> Check out the examples in the Qt distribution too to get an idea:
>>
>> http://developer.qt.nokia.com/doc/qt-4.8/all-examples.html
>
> I agree Qt is a great solution however you are probably going to want to
> ship static binaries to windows clients (only), especially to non-techical
> end users... otherwise it gets kind of insane, much more challenging than
> distributing java based apps IMHO.
>
> But the IDE is fantastic plus you get a nice integration with webkit.
>
> if I remember (been awhile) the license terms are a little different for
> static, would have to re-read carefully.

I don't know about licensing issues w.r.t. static binaries; but you're
absolutely right: it's definitely worth looking into.

Another cross-platform GUI is wxWidgets (C++, but has Python
bindings too). It's not as rich a library as Qt IMHO, but quite nice
too. You may want to combine wxWidgets with Poco though (all
of this is in ports, btw).

-cpghost.

-- 
Cordula's Web. http://www.cordula.ws/
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: software raid

[Warren Block]

On Tue, 7 Feb 2012, Jim Pazarena wrote:


Does FreeBSD support any type of software raid?
I have an old rack mount server which has 8 bays, but all SATA,
and NO raid. Sure would be nice to have a software raid
to create a NAS device.


Sure, multiple ways, in fact:
http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/geom-striping.html
http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/geom-mirror.html
http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/geom-raid3.html
http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/filesystems-zfs.html
http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/vinum-vinum.html
http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/disks-hast.html

That's a start.  gmirror and ZFS are probably the most common.
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software Development using Freebsd.

[Patrick Lamaiziere]

Le Mon, 06 Feb 2012 16:37:37 -0600,
Jorge Biquez  a écrit :

> Hello all.

Hi,

> Maybe I am wrong but until now I think my only option is to use 
> Phyton. Is that correct? For what I have searched Python will let me 
> create executables and will let me create Graphical solutions even 
> for other platforms (Mac or LInux or whatever runs Python).
> 
> Talking with friend, he believes that my best bet is to teach them C 
> or C++ and use some of the options for developing graphically ( I am 
> not a C or C++ expert but I can learn alone).
> 
> I was wondering if you could give some advie and comments on this.
> 
> Are you developing commercial applications (including Windows ones) 
> using FreeBsd as your platform? Or Maybe any Linux Distribution?

It is hard to develop Windows application without Windows.

Why not java? For small applications it should run anywhere and it is
widely used. This is a language without surprise (not great, but also
not so bad).

I'm happy to develop on FreeBSD / OpenJDK / Netbeans, as far I can see
that works fine.

(To be honest, I would prefer good old C, but sometimes you don't have
the choice...)

Regards.
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software Development using Freebsd.

[Nikola Pavlović]

On Mon, Feb 06, 2012 at 09:06:49PM -0700, Chad Perrin wrote:
> On Mon, Feb 06, 2012 at 07:36:46PM -0800, Randal L. Schwartz wrote:
> > 
> > However, from personal experience, I know that Larry Wall understands
> > Object Oriented Programming, and Guido definitely doesn't get it.
> > Obviously, other people have worked on both languages, but keep that in
> > mind.  I can present my evidence of how Guido doesn't get it in a longer
> > post, if prompted.
> 
> I'm definitely curious.  If you don't think this is the place for it, I'd
> love to see your explanation in private email or by other means.
> 

Me too.

-- 
People will do tomorrow what they did today because that is what they
did yesterday.

___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: software raid

[Modulok]

> Does FreeBSD support any type of software raid?
> I have an old rack mount server which has 8 bays, but all SATA,
> and NO raid. Sure would be nice to have a software raid
> to create a NAS device.

Yes!

An example of setting up a 3 disk raidz might look like this:

zpool create myfancyraid raidz ad4 ad6 ad8
zfs create myfancyraid/foo
zfs set mountpoint=/usr/foo myfancyraid/foo
zfs mount -a
cd /usr/foo
echo "hello world" > hello.txt

Yay! Then edit /etc/rc.conf to enable zfs at boot time:

echo 'zfs_enable="YES"' >> /etc/rc.conf


How's my raid doing today? Cake:

zpool status
zfs list

You can even mix and match raid and encryption. Below, I put a raidz on top a
geli encryption layer on three devices. (There are other ways to do this too.)
When it comes time to decommission disks, there's no company data leaks
(depending on your needs):

# Create the geli:
geli init -b -e AES -l 256 /dev/ad4
geli init -b -e AES -l 256 /dev/ad6
geli init -b -e AES -l 256 /dev/ad8

# Attach it or reboot:
geli attach ad4
geli attach ad6
geli attach ad8

# Make the zpool and Z file system:
zpool create myfancyraid raidz ad4.eli ad6.eli ad8.eli
zfs create myfancyraid/foo
zfs set mountpoint=/usr/foo myfancyraid/foo
zfs mount -a

Then edit /boot/loader.conf to load geli at boot time::

echo 'geom_eli_load="YES"' >> /boot/loader.conf

Finally, add the bit about ZFS to /etc/rc.conf::

echo 'zfs_enable="YES"' >> /etc/rc.conf

You'll be asked for the password to each provider (disk) at boot time before
the system enters multi-user mode. Make sure you have console access
and a backup copy of the password somewhere!

A word on graid3: For a multi-user file server, serving lots of small requests,
graid3 is about the worst performance you can get due to its raid3 nature.
Requests have to be served sequentially, using all disks in the array.
Slow in my experience.

Good luck!
-Modulok-
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

software raid

[Jim Pazarena]

Does FreeBSD support any type of software raid?
I have an old rack mount server which has 8 bays, but all SATA,
and NO raid. Sure would be nice to have a software raid
to create a NAS device.
--
Jim Pazarena fqu...@paz.bz
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software Development using Freebsd.

[Waitman Gobble]

On Feb 6, 2012 6:13 PM, "C. P. Ghost"  wrote:
>
> On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 11:37 PM, Jorge Biquez 
wrote:
> > Now we will try to have a graphical mode in Freebsd. With that we would
like
> > to be able to develop graphical applications for Windows (we all know
that's
> > the market and here some companies is what they are looking), so maybe
sound
> > crazy but I am looking to develop applications for Windows without using
> > WIndows or Microsofot products at least.
>
> Go for Qt. It is a great cross-platform C++ GUI framework, with plugins
to SQL
> databases, networking and everything you would typically need. There's
even
> PyQt, if you want Python bindings.
>
> Check out the examples in the Qt distribution too to get an idea:
>
> http://developer.qt.nokia.com/doc/qt-4.8/all-examples.html
>
> --
> Cordula's Web. http://www.cordula.ws/
> ___
> freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
> http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "
freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

I agree Qt is a great solution however you are probably going to want to
ship static binaries to windows clients (only), especially to non-techical
end users... otherwise it gets kind of insane, much more challenging than
distributing java based apps IMHO.

But the IDE is fantastic plus you get a nice integration with webkit.

if I remember (been awhile) the license terms are a little different for
static, would have to re-read carefully.

Waitman Gobble
San Jose California USA
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software Development using Freebsd.

[Rod Person]

On Mon, 06 Feb 2012 19:36:46 -0800
mer...@stonehenge.com (Randal L. Schwartz) wrote:

> > "DDa" == Da Rock 
> > writes:
> 
> >> Would you do that with Python or something else?
> 
> DDa> Depending on what you really need to solve decides your
> DDa> language. Others have offered advice here, but may I suggest
> DDa> Perl? For most data and its proven ability to handle/match
> DDa> string data it is very useful. And using tk it will run on
> DDa> windows as well.
> 
> At this point, there's absolutely nothing that Python can do that Perl
> can't, and very likely vice versa.
> 
> However, from personal experience, I know that Larry Wall understands
> Object Oriented Programming, and Guido definitely doesn't get it.
> Obviously, other people have worked on both languages, but keep that
> in mind.  I can present my evidence of how Guido doesn't get it in a
> longer post, if prompted.
> 

I'll second the motion for this evidence.

-- 

Rod Person  http://www.rodperson.com  rodper...@rodperson.com

'Silence is a fence around wisdom'
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software Development using Freebsd.

[Da Rock]

On 02/07/12 14:06, Chad Perrin wrote:

On Mon, Feb 06, 2012 at 07:36:46PM -0800, Randal L. Schwartz wrote:

"DDa" == Da Rock writes:

Would you do that with Python or something else?

DDa>  Depending on what you really need to solve decides your
DDa>  language. Others have offered advice here, but may I suggest Perl?
DDa>  For most data and its proven ability to handle/match string data it
DDa>  is very useful. And using tk it will run on windows as well.

At this point, there's absolutely nothing that Python can do that Perl
can't, and very likely vice versa.

However, from personal experience, I know that Larry Wall understands
Object Oriented Programming, and Guido definitely doesn't get it.
Obviously, other people have worked on both languages, but keep that in
mind.  I can present my evidence of how Guido doesn't get it in a longer
post, if prompted.

I'm definitely curious.  If you don't think this is the place for it, I'd
love to see your explanation in private email or by other means.


+1
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software Development using Freebsd.

[Chad Perrin]

On Mon, Feb 06, 2012 at 07:36:46PM -0800, Randal L. Schwartz wrote:
> > "DDa" == Da Rock writes:
> 
> >> Would you do that with Python or something else?
> 
> DDa> Depending on what you really need to solve decides your
> DDa> language. Others have offered advice here, but may I suggest Perl?
> DDa> For most data and its proven ability to handle/match string data it
> DDa> is very useful. And using tk it will run on windows as well.
> 
> At this point, there's absolutely nothing that Python can do that Perl
> can't, and very likely vice versa.
> 
> However, from personal experience, I know that Larry Wall understands
> Object Oriented Programming, and Guido definitely doesn't get it.
> Obviously, other people have worked on both languages, but keep that in
> mind.  I can present my evidence of how Guido doesn't get it in a longer
> post, if prompted.

I'm definitely curious.  If you don't think this is the place for it, I'd
love to see your explanation in private email or by other means.

-- 
Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ]
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software Development using Freebsd.

[Randal L. Schwartz]

> "DDa" == Da Rock  writes:

>> Would you do that with Python or something else?

DDa> Depending on what you really need to solve decides your
DDa> language. Others have offered advice here, but may I suggest Perl?
DDa> For most data and its proven ability to handle/match string data it
DDa> is very useful. And using tk it will run on windows as well.

At this point, there's absolutely nothing that Python can do that Perl
can't, and very likely vice versa.

However, from personal experience, I know that Larry Wall understands
Object Oriented Programming, and Guido definitely doesn't get it.
Obviously, other people have worked on both languages, but keep that in
mind.  I can present my evidence of how Guido doesn't get it in a longer
post, if prompted.

-- 
Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
 http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
Smalltalk/Perl/Unix consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
See http://methodsandmessages.posterous.com/ for Smalltalk discussion
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software Development using Freebsd.

[C. P. Ghost]

On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 11:37 PM, Jorge Biquez  wrote:
> Now we will try to have a graphical mode in Freebsd. With that we would like
> to be able to develop graphical applications for Windows (we all know that's
> the market and here some companies is what they are looking), so maybe sound
> crazy but I am looking to develop applications for Windows without using
> WIndows or Microsofot products at least.

Go for Qt. It is a great cross-platform C++ GUI framework, with plugins to SQL
databases, networking and everything you would typically need. There's even
PyQt, if you want Python bindings.

Check out the examples in the Qt distribution too to get an idea:

http://developer.qt.nokia.com/doc/qt-4.8/all-examples.html

-- 
Cordula's Web. http://www.cordula.ws/
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software Development using Freebsd.

[Da Rock]

On 02/07/12 08:37, Jorge Biquez wrote:

Hello all.

This is kind of off topic. My apologies in advance.

I am helping a non profit organization and giving some classes to 
prepare students so they can be prepared and try to get a job (they 
are students also and have the basics concepts already)


Anyway, I am interested in teach them to develop some simple 
applications. From simple ones to destktop ones that access a 
database, desktop ones that use internet to connect to a remote 
database and web based ones with a database behind. We have 6 months 
and the idea is to work a lot remotely. Thin is that I do not want to 
use any kind of Microsoft products. Some of them do not have modern 
machines but until now, in previous classs, we could install Freebsd, 
text mode, and work from there.


Now we will try to have a graphical mode in Freebsd. With that we 
would like to be able to develop graphical applications for Windows 
(we all know that's the market and here some companies is what they 
are looking), so maybe sound crazy but I am looking to develop 
applications for Windows without using WIndows or Microsofot products 
at least.


I have been looking for this for months. First case using Windows but 
not Microsoft products. I found some options BUT they all were 
expensive on the deployment. The "runtimes" were not free and the 
amount of money to pay was not a good option. Others provide " real 
free" excutables for runtimes but the products were expensive. I am 
now trying to, If possible, have FreeBSD running graphically and then 
use open source software to develop graphical windows applications.


Maybe I am wrong but until now I think my only option is to use 
Phyton. Is that correct? For what I have searched Python will let me 
create executables and will let me create Graphical solutions even for 
other platforms (Mac or LInux or whatever runs Python).


Talking with friend, he believes that my best bet is to teach them C 
or C++ and use some of the options for developing graphically ( I am 
not a C or C++ expert but I can learn alone).


I was wondering if you could give some advie and comments on this.

Are you developing commercial applications (including Windows ones) 
using FreeBsd as your platform? Or Maybe any Linux Distribution?


Would you do that with Python or something else?
Depending on what you really need to solve decides your language. Others 
have offered advice here, but may I suggest Perl? For most data and its 
proven ability to handle/match string data it is very useful. And using 
tk it will run on windows as well.


My 2c... :)
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software Development using Freebsd.

[Leonardo M . Ramé]

>
> From: Mehmet Erol Sanliturk 
>To: Rod Person  
>Cc: Jorge Biquez ; FreeBSD Questions 
> 
>Sent: Monday, February 6, 2012 9:22 PM
>Subject: Re: Software Development using Freebsd.
> 
>On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 6:40 PM, Rod Person  wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 06 Feb 2012 16:37:37 -0600
>> Jorge Biquez  wrote:
>>
>> > Now we will try to have a graphical mode in Freebsd. With that we
>> > would like to be able to develop graphical applications for Windows
>> > (we all know that's the market and here some companies is what they
>> > are looking), so maybe sound crazy but I am looking to develop
>> > applications for Windows without using WIndows or Microsofot products
>> > at least.
>> >
>>
>> You could try mono and monodevelop
>> http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/url.cgi?ports/devel/monodevelop/pkg-descr
>>
>> Mono is the open source version of .NET/C#. This would teach the basics
>> of .NET and C#.
>>
>> > Maybe I am wrong but until now I think my only option is to use
>> > Phyton. Is that correct? For what I have searched Python will let me
>> > create executables and will let me create Graphical solutions even
>> > for other platforms (Mac or LInux or whatever runs Python).
>>
>> You can use Python and py2exe to create the executable that would run
>> on Windows, but you have to run py2exe on a Windows machine.
>>
>> If you know Pascal you can look at the FreePascal and Lazarus. I
>> haven't used it in years, but I was able to create several applications
>> that ran on both FreeBSD and Windows.
>> http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/url.cgi?ports/editors/lazarus/pkg-descr
>>
>>
>> --
>> Rod Person        http://www.rodperson.com    rodper...@rodperson.com
>>
>> "Let us in the name of the Holy Trinity, go on sending all the slaves
>>  that can be sold."
>> - Letter from Christopher Columbus.
>>  J.A. Rawley, The Trans-Atlantic Slave Trade: A History. Pg.3
>>
>
>
>
>
>Lazarus is an IDE ( Integrated Development Environment ) and its compiler
>is Free Pascal :
>
>
>http://www.freepascal.org/
>http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/
>
>
>When a program is developed in Lazarus , it can directly be compiled in
>Windows .
>There are a multitude of units for any kind of programming ( Web , Data
>base , etc. ) .
>
>Lazarus and FreePascal is available for FreeBSD , Linux , Windows , and
>many other operating systems .
>
>
>A study of the above sites will reveal their capabilities .
>
>http://wiki.freepascal.org/Cross_compiling_for_Win32_under_Linux
>http://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/Cross_compiling
>
>
>I did not use , but cross compiling should be possible by using Wine in
>FreeBSD to obtain Windows programs ( Windows versions of Lazarus and Free
>Pascal may be used in FreeBSD to generate Windows programs and they may be
>executed under Wine in FreeBSD for testing before transferred to Windows :
>This means a minimum number of Windows computer(s) may be used for final
>testing . ) .
>
>
>
>
>Thank you very much .
>
>
>Mehmet Erol Sanliturk


I do use Lazarus and FreePascal to develop professional applications, mainly I 
work on Linux and cross-compile to Win32/Win64. For FreeBsd I installed 
FreePascal on a Virtual Machine and compiled from it, I never tried 
cross-compiling from FreeBSD to other OSes, but I'm pretty sure it can be done.

An example of what I do is this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hc1RT-s-dw0


Leonardo M. Ramé
http://leonardorame.blogspot.com
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software Development using Freebsd.

[Frank Shute]

On Mon, Feb 06, 2012 at 04:37:37PM -0600, Jorge Biquez wrote:
>
> Hello all.
> 
> This is kind of off topic. My apologies in advance.
> 
> I am helping a non profit organization and giving some classes to 
> prepare students so they can be prepared and try to get a job (they 
> are students also and have the basics concepts already)
> 
> Anyway, I am interested in teach them to develop some simple 
> applications. From simple ones to destktop ones that access a 
> database, desktop ones that use internet to connect to a remote 
> database and web based ones with a database behind. We have 6 months 
> and the idea is to work a lot remotely. Thin is that I do not want to 
> use any kind of Microsoft products. Some of them do not have modern 
> machines but until now, in previous classs, we could install Freebsd, 
> text mode, and work from there.
> 
> Now we will try to have a graphical mode in Freebsd. With that we 
> would like to be able to develop graphical applications for Windows 
> (we all know that's the market and here some companies is what they 
> are looking), so maybe sound crazy but I am looking to develop 
> applications for Windows without using WIndows or Microsofot products at 
> least.
> 
> I have been looking for this for months. First case using Windows but 
> not Microsoft products. I found some options BUT they all were 
> expensive on the deployment. The "runtimes" were not free and the 
> amount of money to pay was not a good option. Others provide " real 
> free" excutables for runtimes but the products were expensive. I am 
> now trying to, If possible, have FreeBSD running graphically and then 
> use open source software to develop graphical windows applications.
> 
> Maybe I am wrong but until now I think my only option is to use 
> Phyton. Is that correct? For what I have searched Python will let me 
> create executables and will let me create Graphical solutions even 
> for other platforms (Mac or LInux or whatever runs Python).
> 
> Talking with friend, he believes that my best bet is to teach them C 
> or C++ and use some of the options for developing graphically ( I am 
> not a C or C++ expert but I can learn alone).
> 
> I was wondering if you could give some advie and comments on this.
> 
> Are you developing commercial applications (including Windows ones) 
> using FreeBsd as your platform? Or Maybe any Linux Distribution?
> 
> Would you do that with Python or something else?
> 
> Any extra advice is more than welcomed.
> 
> Thanks in advanced.
> 

Any reason you don't want to use Java?

OO, plenty of IDEs to choose from, ranging from vim to Eclipse which
run on both Windows and Unix.

If I wanted to develop for Windows (I don't), that's what I'd use so I
could develop my code using FreeBSD.

The best part is that Java skills are in demand. (I don't know if
that's the case in Mexico though).


Regards,

-- 

 Frank

 Contact info: http://www.shute.org.uk/misc/contact.html




pgpgtIfdq5w75.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Re: Software Development using Freebsd.

[Mehmet Erol Sanliturk]

On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 6:40 PM, Rod Person  wrote:

> On Mon, 06 Feb 2012 16:37:37 -0600
> Jorge Biquez  wrote:
>
> > Now we will try to have a graphical mode in Freebsd. With that we
> > would like to be able to develop graphical applications for Windows
> > (we all know that's the market and here some companies is what they
> > are looking), so maybe sound crazy but I am looking to develop
> > applications for Windows without using WIndows or Microsofot products
> > at least.
> >
>
> You could try mono and monodevelop
> http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/url.cgi?ports/devel/monodevelop/pkg-descr
>
> Mono is the open source version of .NET/C#. This would teach the basics
> of .NET and C#.
>
> > Maybe I am wrong but until now I think my only option is to use
> > Phyton. Is that correct? For what I have searched Python will let me
> > create executables and will let me create Graphical solutions even
> > for other platforms (Mac or LInux or whatever runs Python).
>
> You can use Python and py2exe to create the executable that would run
> on Windows, but you have to run py2exe on a Windows machine.
>
> If you know Pascal you can look at the FreePascal and Lazarus. I
> haven't used it in years, but I was able to create several applications
> that ran on both FreeBSD and Windows.
> http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/url.cgi?ports/editors/lazarus/pkg-descr
>
>
> --
> Rod Person http://www.rodperson.com rodper...@rodperson.com
>
> "Let us in the name of the Holy Trinity, go on sending all the slaves
>  that can be sold."
> - Letter from Christopher Columbus.
>  J.A. Rawley, The Trans-Atlantic Slave Trade: A History. Pg.3
>




Lazarus is an IDE ( Integrated Development Environment ) and its compiler
is Free Pascal :


http://www.freepascal.org/
http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/


When a program is developed in Lazarus , it can directly be compiled in
Windows .
There are a multitude of units for any kind of programming ( Web , Data
base , etc. ) .

Lazarus and FreePascal is available for FreeBSD , Linux , Windows , and
many other operating systems .


A study of the above sites will reveal their capabilities .

http://wiki.freepascal.org/Cross_compiling_for_Win32_under_Linux
http://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/Cross_compiling


I did not use , but cross compiling should be possible by using Wine in
FreeBSD to obtain Windows programs ( Windows versions of Lazarus and Free
Pascal may be used in FreeBSD to generate Windows programs and they may be
executed under Wine in FreeBSD for testing before transferred to Windows :
This means a minimum number of Windows computer(s) may be used for final
testing . ) .




Thank you very much .


Mehmet Erol Sanliturk
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software Development using Freebsd.

[Rod Person]

On Mon, 06 Feb 2012 16:37:37 -0600
Jorge Biquez  wrote:

> Now we will try to have a graphical mode in Freebsd. With that we
> would like to be able to develop graphical applications for Windows
> (we all know that's the market and here some companies is what they
> are looking), so maybe sound crazy but I am looking to develop
> applications for Windows without using WIndows or Microsofot products
> at least.
> 

You could try mono and monodevelop
http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/url.cgi?ports/devel/monodevelop/pkg-descr

Mono is the open source version of .NET/C#. This would teach the basics
of .NET and C#.

> Maybe I am wrong but until now I think my only option is to use
> Phyton. Is that correct? For what I have searched Python will let me
> create executables and will let me create Graphical solutions even
> for other platforms (Mac or LInux or whatever runs Python).

You can use Python and py2exe to create the executable that would run
on Windows, but you have to run py2exe on a Windows machine.

If you know Pascal you can look at the FreePascal and Lazarus. I
haven't used it in years, but I was able to create several applications
that ran on both FreeBSD and Windows.
http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/url.cgi?ports/editors/lazarus/pkg-descr


-- 
Rod Person http://www.rodperson.com rodper...@rodperson.com
  
"Let us in the name of the Holy Trinity, go on sending all the slaves 
 that can be sold." 
- Letter from Christopher Columbus.
  J.A. Rawley, The Trans-Atlantic Slave Trade: A History. Pg.3
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software Development using Freebsd.

[Adam Vande More]

On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 4:37 PM, Jorge Biquez wrote:

> Would you do that with Python or something else?
>

http://qt.nokia.com/

-- 
Adam Vande More
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software Development using Freebsd.

[Chad Perrin]

On Mon, Feb 06, 2012 at 04:37:37PM -0600, Jorge Biquez wrote:
> 
> I am helping a non profit organization and giving some classes to
> prepare students so they can be prepared and try to get a job (they
> are students also and have the basics concepts already)

That's admirable.  I hope that works out.


> 
> Anyway, I am interested in teach them to develop some simple
> applications. From simple ones to destktop ones that access a
> database, desktop ones that use internet to connect to a remote
> database and web based ones with a database behind. We have 6 months
> and the idea is to work a lot remotely. Thin is that I do not want
> to use any kind of Microsoft products. Some of them do not have
> modern machines but until now, in previous classs, we could install
> Freebsd, text mode, and work from there.
> 
> Now we will try to have a graphical mode in Freebsd. With that we
> would like to be able to develop graphical applications for Windows
> (we all know that's the market and here some companies is what they
> are looking), so maybe sound crazy but I am looking to develop
> applications for Windows without using WIndows or Microsofot
> products at least.

What kind of experience do you want these students to have when they
leave?  Do you just want them practiced in doing some general programming
with cross-platform tools, including database access and simple GUI work?
Do you want them to specifically work with commodity tools that will fit
in with mainstream job posting requirements on a resume?  Do you want
them to work with tools that will enable them to most easily expand their
experience on their own once they get done with the course of instruction
so they can more rapidly approach general competence and create useful
projects of their own very quickly, figuring they can then move on to
other tools and technologies as they decide which direction they want to
take their professional pursuits?  Do you just want it to be as easy as
possible?

Your top priority should probably help you make this decision.


> 
> I have been looking for this for months. First case using Windows
> but not Microsoft products. I found some options BUT they all were
> expensive on the deployment. The "runtimes" were not free and the
> amount of money to pay was not a good option. Others provide " real
> free" excutables for runtimes but the products were expensive. I am
> now trying to, If possible, have FreeBSD running graphically and
> then use open source software to develop graphical windows
> applications.
> 
> Maybe I am wrong but until now I think my only option is to use
> Phyton. Is that correct? For what I have searched Python will let me
> create executables and will let me create Graphical solutions even
> for other platforms (Mac or LInux or whatever runs Python).
> 
> Talking with friend, he believes that my best bet is to teach them C
> or C++ and use some of the options for developing graphically ( I am
> not a C or C++ expert but I can learn alone).

Depending on your goals, anything from Ruby to C could be an excellent
choice.  LLVM/Clang is a great compiler suite for C; the mainstream Ruby
implementation will get you far; both can use platform-independent
graphical toolkits and database access libraries.  PostgreSQL is a great
DBMS distributed under a copyfree license, and it is well supported for
both these languages.  They're sorta on opposite ends of a spectrum,
though, so some kind of narrowing down of goals should be done before
arriving at any conclusions.


> 
> I was wondering if you could give some advie and comments on this.
> 
> Are you developing commercial applications (including Windows ones)
> using FreeBsd as your platform? Or Maybe any Linux Distribution?

I've written C, C++, Ruby, Perl, and PHP on FreeBSD, for deployment in a
wide range of platform circumstances.  Some of my development has been
commercial, some of it just for fun, some to solve my own personal
problems. . . .

There's nothing wrong with FreeBSD as a development platform for most
purposes, especially if you want to work on portable software
development.  In fact, I think that for purposes of writing portable
code, it's difficult to do worse than FreeBSD, because it's probably
easier to move code from FreeBSD to Linux distributions, Apple MacOS, and
MS Windows due to social factors involved than the other way around.


> 
> Would you do that with Python or something else?

I personally am not the world's biggest Python fan, but my choice would
depend on the specific goals involved.  If you're leaning toward the
Python end of the spectrum, though, I (personally; your mileage may
differ) would probably choose Ruby instead.

-- 
Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ]
___

Re: Software Development using Freebsd.

[William Brown]

> 
> Maybe I am wrong but until now I think my only option is to use Phyton. Is 
> that correct? For what I have searched Python will let me create executables 
> and will let me create Graphical solutions even for other platforms (Mac or 
> LInux or whatever runs Python).
> 

I think that python is a great learning language. I would certainly be teaching 
it to people as the first language to help build concepts.

However, FreeBSD, contains mono. Mono is avaliable on Linux and OSX, but it is 
on windows natively as .NET. You can easily create some great C# applications 
that would be cross platform using this tool. 

Finally, the best cross platform tool is a web service. So perhaps you should 
explore the Django or Ruby on Rails path?


Sincerely,

William Brown

Research & Teaching, Technology Services
The University of Adelaide, AUSTRALIA 5005

CRICOS Provider Number 00123M
-
IMPORTANT: This message may contain confidential or legally privileged
information. If you think it was sent to you by mistake, please delete all
copies and advise the sender. For the purposes of the SPAM Act 2003, this
email is authorised by The University of Adelaide.

pgp.mit.edu
http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=vindex&search=0x3C0AC6DAB2F928A2






signature.asc
Description: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail

Re: Software Development using Freebsd.

[David Hughes]

Not an expert by any means, but what about Mono, the open source and 
cross platform version of the .NET framework?


If you take a look at http://www.mono-project.com/Compatibility , you'll 
see that it's mostly compatible with .NET 4.0, and claims to be 100% 
compatible with .NET 3.5.


Java is also cross platform and will run on FreeBSD; or, like you say, 
you could use Python with TkInter; there's doubtless many other 
cross-platform solutions that I'm not aware of.


All best,

David


Hello all.

This is kind of off topic. My apologies in advance.

I am helping a non profit organization and giving some classes to
prepare students so they can be prepared and try to get a job (they are
students also and have the basics concepts already)

Anyway, I am interested in teach them to develop some simple
applications. From simple ones to destktop ones that access a database,
desktop ones that use internet to connect to a remote database and web
based ones with a database behind. We have 6 months and the idea is to
work a lot remotely. Thin is that I do not want to use any kind of
Microsoft products. Some of them do not have modern machines but until
now, in previous classs, we could install Freebsd, text mode, and work
from there.

Now we will try to have a graphical mode in Freebsd. With that we would
like to be able to develop graphical applications for Windows (we all
know that's the market and here some companies is what they are
looking), so maybe sound crazy but I am looking to develop applications
for Windows without using WIndows or Microsofot products at least.

I have been looking for this for months. First case using Windows but
not Microsoft products. I found some options BUT they all were expensive
on the deployment. The "runtimes" were not free and the amount of money
to pay was not a good option. Others provide " real free" excutables for
runtimes but the products were expensive. I am now trying to, If
possible, have FreeBSD running graphically and then use open source
software to develop graphical windows applications.

Maybe I am wrong but until now I think my only option is to use Phyton.
Is that correct? For what I have searched Python will let me create
executables and will let me create Graphical solutions even for other
platforms (Mac or LInux or whatever runs Python).

Talking with friend, he believes that my best bet is to teach them C or
C++ and use some of the options for developing graphically ( I am not a
C or C++ expert but I can learn alone).

I was wondering if you could give some advie and comments on this.

Are you developing commercial applications (including Windows ones)
using FreeBsd as your platform? Or Maybe any Linux Distribution?

Would you do that with Python or something else?

Any extra advice is more than welcomed.

Thanks in advanced.

Jorge Biquez

___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to
"freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"


___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Software Development using Freebsd.

[Jorge Biquez]

Hello all.

This is kind of off topic. My apologies in advance.

I am helping a non profit organization and giving some classes to 
prepare students so they can be prepared and try to get a job (they 
are students also and have the basics concepts already)


Anyway, I am interested in teach them to develop some simple 
applications. From simple ones to destktop ones that access a 
database, desktop ones that use internet to connect to a remote 
database and web based ones with a database behind. We have 6 months 
and the idea is to work a lot remotely. Thin is that I do not want to 
use any kind of Microsoft products. Some of them do not have modern 
machines but until now, in previous classs, we could install Freebsd, 
text mode, and work from there.


Now we will try to have a graphical mode in Freebsd. With that we 
would like to be able to develop graphical applications for Windows 
(we all know that's the market and here some companies is what they 
are looking), so maybe sound crazy but I am looking to develop 
applications for Windows without using WIndows or Microsofot products at least.


I have been looking for this for months. First case using Windows but 
not Microsoft products. I found some options BUT they all were 
expensive on the deployment. The "runtimes" were not free and the 
amount of money to pay was not a good option. Others provide " real 
free" excutables for runtimes but the products were expensive. I am 
now trying to, If possible, have FreeBSD running graphically and then 
use open source software to develop graphical windows applications.


Maybe I am wrong but until now I think my only option is to use 
Phyton. Is that correct? For what I have searched Python will let me 
create executables and will let me create Graphical solutions even 
for other platforms (Mac or LInux or whatever runs Python).


Talking with friend, he believes that my best bet is to teach them C 
or C++ and use some of the options for developing graphically ( I am 
not a C or C++ expert but I can learn alone).


I was wondering if you could give some advie and comments on this.

Are you developing commercial applications (including Windows ones) 
using FreeBsd as your platform? Or Maybe any Linux Distribution?


Would you do that with Python or something else?

Any extra advice is more than welcomed.

Thanks in advanced.

Jorge Biquez

___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Media streaming software.

[Graeme Dargie]

Hi All

Must be a year or so ago I posted looking for some advice on media streaming 
software that had a some specific requirements, mainly that it would transcode 
media on the fly to an MPEG2 stream so the dlna enabled TV could display the 
stream, I did get some good advice at the time but ultimately nothing quite 
fitted the bill.

That was until someone mentioned serviio to me, so I looked in ports and sure 
it enough it is there (/usr/ports/net/serviio) it works great happily my TV 
will now play an MKV file and pretty much anything else I have thrown at it. So 
if you are looking for something that will work on a headless server to allow 
you stream media .. I would check this one out.

Regards

Graeme
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

School Management Software (School ERP)

[Marketing]

Hello Sir/Madam,

Greetings,

I am Amrish Patel from NGPL(Nem.Con Grandeur Pvt. Ltd.),Ahmedabad, India.

Basically we are in development field since year 2001.

We offer the complete set of web development services from requirement 
specifications to prototyping, copy writing, graphic design and development.

We also offer custom software programming services, from software development 
to support and enhancement.We have also our ready to use software like School 
Management, Document Management, Appointment Scheduler, Complaint Management 
Software, Farming ERP, Hospital Management Software, Booking Scheduler etc.

The prime features of our School Management Software are as under.

Administrative Module

Other Module: 

1. Notice Board 
2. SMS Module: Just to keep the parents update about their child status ESM 
provide the SMS service where admin can send the information like the scheduled 
meeting or exam result etc. to the parents. 
3. Backup: Backup of the database as and when required. 
4. Permission: Create users and assign different level of access permission. 
5. Change Password : User can change the password. 
6. Mail: Internal mailing system where teachers can communicate with the admin.

Teacher Module

. One of the key stakeholders is the Teacher and we give the teacher a new 
media of interaction with the Student. ESMS simplifies laborious and routine 
functions by automating pertinent data collection, generation and management.
. Profile: The Teacher can view his/her profile
. Attendance: The module enables the Teacher to view status of attendance as 
well as generate attendance reports for Students
. Time Table: A unique media that allows you to view and edit the class 
timetable and disseminate the information to the stakeholders in Real time
. Library: Teacher can search the database and reserve a book online
. Leave Status: Teacher can view Leave status as well as submit leave requests 
online
. Salary: Teacher can view his/her salary details
. Mail: Teacher can mail to Principal, Vice-Principal and Head Master
. Assignment: Teacher can submit assignments and review completed assignments 
by students
. Exam Schedule: Teacher can upload and view Examination Schedules
. Progress Report: The cumbersome process of recording marks in ledgers is done 
away with. With the use of navigational aids such as graphical icons, the 
Teacher can easily update and generate Progress Reports
. Search Student: Teacher can view relevant Student details
. Feedback: The Teacher now has a timesaving media for constantly updating 
Parents and students as well as sending mail or receiving feedback from other 
key stakeholders
. Leave Application: The Teacher can Submit Leave Application to the 
Administrator online

Student Module

. We live in the Information Age where computers have become inevitable in 
educational institution, with more than 90% of students being computer savvy.
. Profile: The Student can view his/her profile, Class Time Tables, attendance 
record, check examination schedules, see test scores and access subject syllabus
. Homework and Assignments: Using ESM, Students have a new platform to increase 
their knowledge base as well as receive and submit assignments
. Leave application: The student can submit leave applications online.
. Feedback: Students can keep channels of communication open with the 
administrator and teaching faculty and can give and receive feedback
. Transport: Students can access details regarding bus routes, bus timings and 
bus fares
. Hostel: Students can get online information about hostel details such as room 
availability and booking, mess details and other facilities offered
. Progress Reports: Students can access their performance scores and print 
Progress Reports
. Library: Students can access Library records for availability of books as 
well as reserve a book online
. Fee structure: Students can view fee structure and payment schedules.

Technology:

Front End: PHP
Back End Database: MySQL

You can have the demo of our software on www.ngplarena.com/demo/newschool1

For Admin

User Name :admin
Password : winadminwin

For Teachers

User name : ramya 
Password : ramya

For Students 

User Name : diya2005
Password : diya2005

Please feel free to contact us for any further query 

Awaiting for your favorable reply.

Thanking you,

For NGPL,
Amrish Patel
(Business Development)
(M)9824523645

___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: versions of software

[Allen]

On 6/17/2011 7:58 AM, Julian H. Stacey wrote:
>> FreeBSD can also run a lot of Linux Applications just fine with the
>> Linux_Enable="YES" added to /etc/rc.conf and, not only that, I've heard
> 
> /etc/defaults/rc.conf has it in lower caselinux_enable="NO" 

Yea I know, I'm still awake from yesterday, which is 24 hours as of now,
and I hit Shift heh ;)

> Cheers,
> Julian

-gore
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: versions of software

[Julian H. Stacey]

> FreeBSD can also run a lot of Linux Applications just fine with the
> Linux_Enable="YES" added to /etc/rc.conf and, not only that, I've heard

/etc/defaults/rc.conf has it in lower case  linux_enable="NO" 

Cheers,
Julian
-- 
Julian Stacey, BSD Unix Linux C Sys Eng Consultants Munich http://berklix.com
 Reply below, not above;  Indent with "> ";  Cumulative like a play script.
 Format: Plain text. Not HTML, multipart/alternative, base64, quoted-printable.
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: versions of software

[Allen]

On 6/15/2011 11:20 AM, spidey wrote:
> Good morning.
> 
> I have never used Freebsd.  For that matter, I have not used Linux since
> the early 1990s (1993 to be exact)  Anyway...
> BTW - I have  your logo on my xwindows on the Linux box I am trying to
> setup.  I think it's great.

OK, so, you haven't ever used FreeBSD, and you decided that you would
sign up for a FreeBSD mailing list to say that you have the logo on the
machine while trying to install Linux on it? OK, Intrigued...

> I have a need to use sendmail and DNS bind. Can someone tell me which
> versions of sendmail and DNS Bind are in the current Ubuntu 10??   In 
> your opinion, are they  going to be  hard to install.  I was going to
> use (Linux) Redhat but, could not figure out where the files were not to
> mention, I see there are some security issues with the version I have
> and updating looks like it would be hard as trying to pull teeth from
> Godzilla when he's got tooth ache and motheras flying around his head
> while smacking him in the head with a wing.  In other words.. on a
> bad day it looks hard.

Not real good with analogies are we? This is a FreeBSD mailing list, and
asking whicih version of Linux to use, which, by the wya, no one is ever
going to give you a straight answer too, since that CAN'T be answered
(Mostly because basically, there are around 12,000 versions of Linux,
and they all do something a little different).

If you'd like my OPINION; Ubuntu is African for "I can't install
Slackware or Debian" and sucks. So does Red Hat. So does Fedora. Debian,
Slackware, and SUSE are the best you'll get from Linux.

> That being said, I have a Dell 2650  dual 3200s, with 6 gig of memory
> and 36gig hard drive space.  I only need it for a test and was wondering
> how this would work under Freebsd.  If someone could let me know, I
> would really appreciate it.

A! Finally, we get to something related to the list this is posted
to! OK, basically, FreeBSD is like Linux since both are Unix like or
based Operating systems. However, even though Linux is getting better
and better all the time, it still isn't nearly as fast as FreeBSD.
FreeBSD is regarded as one of THE MOST Stable Operating Systems ever
written, and even people who like Linux more would admit that.

FreeBSD is an excellent choice for any Server task you might need, and
it's very fast. You can literally do anything your hardware and mind can
come up with, as those are basically the only two limitations to
FreeBSD. It's the reason I spend money on FreeBSD when I can easily get
it for free.

FreeBSD can also run a lot of Linux Applications just fine with the
Linux_Enable="YES" added to /etc/rc.conf and, not only that, I've heard
many MANY times that somehow, FreeBSD manages to run Linux apps faster
than Linux itself can. So if you'd like advice; INSTALL FREEBSD

And, you can also do what I did with MY Ubuntu Installation CDs; Coffee
Cup Coaster :)

>  Thanks much for  your time

You're very welcome. And please enjoy my playful sense of humor at 6:37
AM while still being awake, and having not slept :) lol.

> Andre

-gore (I have a thing for Horror Movies, lol).
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: versions of software

[Chuck Swiger]

On Jun 15, 2011, at 8:20 AM, spidey wrote:
> Can someone tell me which versions of sendmail and DNS Bind are in the 
> current Ubuntu 10??

Sure, but you're asking on the wrong mailing list: FreeBSD isn't Ubuntu.

[ Reply-to: set appropriately. ]

Regards,
-- 
-Chuck

___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: versions of software

[spidey]

Good morning.

I have never used Freebsd.  For that matter, I have not used Linux since 
the early 1990s (1993 to be exact)  Anyway...
BTW - I have  your logo on my xwindows on the Linux box I am trying to 
setup.  I think it's great.


I have a need to use sendmail and DNS bind. Can someone tell me which 
versions of sendmail and DNS Bind are in the current Ubuntu 10??   In  
your opinion, are they  going to be  hard to install.  I was going to 
use (Linux) Redhat but, could not figure out where the files were not to 
mention, I see there are some security issues with the version I have 
and updating looks like it would be hard as trying to pull teeth from 
Godzilla when he's got tooth ache and motheras flying around his head 
while smacking him in the head with a wing.  In other words.. on a 
bad day it looks hard.


That being said, I have a Dell 2650  dual 3200s, with 6 gig of memory 
and 36gig hard drive space.  I only need it for a test and was wondering 
how this would work under Freebsd.  If someone could let me know, I 
would really appreciate it.


 Thanks much for  your time

Andre
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Can I run a 32-bit jail (or software) on a 64-bit server?

[Devin Teske]

On Dec 6, 2010, at 1:01 PM, Randal L. Schwartz wrote:

>> "Devin" == Devin Teske  writes:
> 
> Devin> sudo cd /usr/repos
> 
> This is pretty useless. :)

I'd say it's _absolutely_ useless ^_^

Yes, indeed, the `sudo' should be omitted.
--
Cheers,
Devin Teske

-> CONTACT INFORMATION <-
Business Solutions Consultant II
FIS - fisglobal.com
510-735-5650 Mobile
510-621-2038 Office
510-621-2020 Office Fax
909-477-4578 Home/Fax
devin.te...@fisglobal.com

-> LEGAL DISCLAIMER <-
This message  contains confidential  and proprietary  information
of the sender,  and is intended only for the person(s) to whom it
is addressed. Any use, distribution, copying or disclosure by any
other person  is strictly prohibited.  If you have  received this
message in error,  please notify  the e-mail sender  immediately,
and delete the original message without making a copy.

-> END TRANSMISSION <-

___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Can I run a 32-bit jail (or software) on a 64-bit server?

[Randal L. Schwartz]

> "Devin" == Devin Teske  writes:

Devin> sudo cd /usr/repos

This is pretty useless. :)

-- 
Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
 http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
Smalltalk/Perl/Unix consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
See http://methodsandmessages.posterous.com/ for Smalltalk discussion
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Can I run a 32-bit jail (or software) on a 64-bit server?

[Devin Teske]

I wrote a utility (attached) to make the process really fast and easy:



jail_build(8): Build FreeBSD jails from binary distributions


Here's a simple howto:

Step 1: Create a landing zone for your binary distribution (jail_build(8) looks 
in `/usr/repos' for binary distributions)...

sudo mkdir -p /usr/repos
sudo cd /usr/repos

Step 2: Download one or more binary FreeBSD distributions (any version, any 
platform)...

wget -r ftp://ftp-archive.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/releases/i386/8.1-RELEASE

Step 3: Download jail_build(8)...

cd
wget http://druidbsd.sourceforge.net/download/jail_build.txt
mv jail_build.txt jail_build
chmod +x jail_build

Step 4: Build your jail(s)...

./jail_build
--
Devin

(full sig at bottom)

P.S. Feedback welcome.


On Dec 6, 2010, at 11:14 AM, Redd Vinylene wrote:

> How do I create a 32-bit jail on a 64-bit machine then?
> 
> http://forums.freebsd.org/showthread.php?t=3744 did not tell me much.
> 
> Thanks!
> ___
> freebsd-j...@freebsd.org mailing list
> http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-jail
> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-jail-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

--
Cheers,
Devin Teske

-> CONTACT INFORMATION <-
Business Solutions Consultant II
FIS - fisglobal.com
510-735-5650 Mobile
510-621-2038 Office
510-621-2020 Office Fax
909-477-4578 Home/Fax
devin.te...@fisglobal.com

-> LEGAL DISCLAIMER <-
This message  contains confidential  and proprietary  information
of the sender,  and is intended only for the person(s) to whom it
is addressed. Any use, distribution, copying or disclosure by any
other person  is strictly prohibited.  If you have  received this
message in error,  please notify  the e-mail sender  immediately,
and delete the original message without making a copy.

-> END TRANSMISSION <-

___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Can I run a 32-bit jail (or software) on a 64-bit server?

[Nerius Landys]

On Mon, Dec 6, 2010 at 11:14 AM, Redd Vinylene  wrote:
> How do I create a 32-bit jail on a 64-bit machine then?
>
> http://forums.freebsd.org/showthread.php?t=3744 did not tell me much.
>
> Thanks!
>

Use this as a start:
http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/jails.html
Then you have to specify target arch = i386 or something in the make
buildworld etc. steps.  I don't remember the exact syntax for the make
flags off hand.
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Can I run a 32-bit jail (or software) on a 64-bit server?

[Redd Vinylene]

How do I create a 32-bit jail on a 64-bit machine then?

http://forums.freebsd.org/showthread.php?t=3744 did not tell me much.

Thanks!
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Can I run a 32-bit jail (or software) on a 64-bit server?

[David DEMELIER]

2010/12/6 Redd Vinylene :
> Greetings!
>
> Can I run a 32-bit jail (or software) on a 64-bit server? I need to use some
> software that only works on 32-bit.
>
> Thanks!
> ___
> freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
> http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"
>

Hello,

Since this question is asked a lot of time I think we should update
the handbook to say `yes' it's possible ! :-)

http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-jail/2010-January/001139.html

http://www.mail-archive.com/freebsd-j...@freebsd.org/msg01201.html

-- 
Demelier David
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Can I run a 32-bit jail (or software) on a 64-bit server?

[Redd Vinylene]

Thanks a lot guys - I really appreciate it.

Redd
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Can I run a 32-bit jail (or software) on a 64-bit server?

[Nerius Landys]

I've had success running [at least some] 32 bit software on 64 bit
FreeBSD without even using a jail.
Do you have /usr/lib32 on your system?  This would get installed for
example if you rebuild world/kernel following this:
http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/makeworld.html
and if you don't inhibit the installation of /usr/lib32 by setting
some conf file flag somewhere.

There are probably other ways to "get" /usr/lib32 on your system, but
I usually rebuild world to make it happen.

On Mon, Dec 6, 2010 at 10:00 AM, Redd Vinylene  wrote:
> Greetings!
>
> Can I run a 32-bit jail (or software) on a 64-bit server? I need to use some
> software that only works on 32-bit.
>
> Thanks!
> ___
> freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
> http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"
>
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Can I run a 32-bit jail (or software) on a 64-bit server?

[Mike Bregg]

Yes, I believe this has been possible since 7.2.

Mike


On Mon, Dec 6, 2010 at 11:00 AM, Redd Vinylene wrote:

> Greetings!
>
> Can I run a 32-bit jail (or software) on a 64-bit server? I need to use
> some
> software that only works on 32-bit.
>
> Thanks!
> ___
> freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
> http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "
> freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"
>
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Can I run a 32-bit jail (or software) on a 64-bit server?

[Nerius Landys]

>> I've had success running [at least some] 32 bit software on 64 bit
>> FreeBSD without even using a jail.
>> Do you have /usr/lib32 on your system?  This would get installed for
>> example if you rebuild world/kernel following this:
>> http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/makeworld.html
>> and if you don't inhibit the installation of /usr/lib32 by setting
>> some conf file flag somewhere.
>>
>> There are probably other ways to "get" /usr/lib32 on your system, but
>> I usually rebuild world to make it happen.
>>
>
> Hey man!
>
> Matter of fact - yeah - I do have /usr/lib32. So that's all I need or do I
> need to activate something in rc.conf or whatever?
>
> Much obliged!

/usr/lib32 should be all you need [I think].
However you won't be able to correctly compile 32 bit software on your
64 bit system.  For
compiling, you _should_ use a jail, or compile on a 32 bit system.
They're addressing this cross-compiling issue in the latest FreeBSD
sources I think.
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Can I run a 32-bit jail (or software) on a 64-bit server?

[Redd Vinylene]

On Mon, Dec 6, 2010 at 7:25 PM, Nerius Landys  wrote:

> I've had success running [at least some] 32 bit software on 64 bit
> FreeBSD without even using a jail.
> Do you have /usr/lib32 on your system?  This would get installed for
> example if you rebuild world/kernel following this:
> http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/makeworld.html
> and if you don't inhibit the installation of /usr/lib32 by setting
> some conf file flag somewhere.
>
> There are probably other ways to "get" /usr/lib32 on your system, but
> I usually rebuild world to make it happen.
>

Hey man!

Matter of fact - yeah - I do have /usr/lib32. So that's all I need or do I
need to activate something in rc.conf or whatever?

Much obliged!
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Can I run a 32-bit jail (or software) on a 64-bit server?

[Redd Vinylene]

Greetings!

Can I run a 32-bit jail (or software) on a 64-bit server? I need to use some
software that only works on 32-bit.

Thanks!
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software Update

[Chris Brennan]

On Sat, Nov 27, 2010 at 8:50 PM, Steven Susbauer  wrote:

> On 11/27/2010 07:01 PM, RW wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 27 Nov 2010 19:36:09 -0500
>> Chris Brennan  wrote:
>>
>>  My fbsd desktop is popping up with Software Update. My question is
>>> weather this pulls updates from packages or ports.
>>>
>>
>> There are a few applications, such as opera, that can "phone home" and
>> check for newer versions. Typically they can't upgrade because they lack
>> privileges.
>>
>> Perhaps you could be a little less vague.
>>
>
> Software Update is provided by gnome-packagekit (or the kde equivalent) and
> will nag if updated packages are available.
>
> To the op, according to
> http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-ports/2009-September/057056.htmlPackageKit
>  was given support for ports using portupgrade or portaudit.
>
>
Thanks Steven, that's what I was looking for.
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software Update

[Steven Susbauer]

On 11/27/2010 07:01 PM, RW wrote:

On Sat, 27 Nov 2010 19:36:09 -0500
Chris Brennan  wrote:


My fbsd desktop is popping up with Software Update. My question is
weather this pulls updates from packages or ports.


There are a few applications, such as opera, that can "phone home" and
check for newer versions. Typically they can't upgrade because they lack
privileges.

Perhaps you could be a little less vague.


Software Update is provided by gnome-packagekit (or the kde equivalent) 
and will nag if updated packages are available.


To the op, according to 
http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-ports/2009-September/057056.html 
PackageKit was given support for ports using portupgrade or portaudit.

___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software Update

[RW]

On Sat, 27 Nov 2010 19:36:09 -0500
Chris Brennan  wrote:

> My fbsd desktop is popping up with Software Update. My question is
> weather this pulls updates from packages or ports.

There are a few applications, such as opera, that can "phone home" and
check for newer versions. Typically they can't upgrade because they lack
privileges.

Perhaps you could be a little less vague.
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Software Update

[Chris Brennan]

My fbsd desktop is popping up with Software Update. My question is weather
this pulls updates from packages or ports.

P.s. I think I asked this before but it got lost in some other hubbub.  So
appologies if I did ask already.
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: porting software to FreeBSD, what to do if Makefile lacks?

[O. Hartmann]

On 11/18/10 13:52, Rob Farmer wrote:

2010/11/18 O. Hartmann:

Well,
in this case, it would really be a 'nice to have', maybe this is worth a PR?



Try asking on the ports@ list. I'm not sure what the criteria is for
something being listed there - if something isn't going to be used by
very many ports, it may not be worth adding, from a bloat point of
view. I would say it is probably safe for your port to assume csh is
/bin/csh, though.



I'll do,
thanks ;-)

Oliver
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: porting software to FreeBSD, what to do if Makefile lacks?

[Rob Farmer]

2010/11/18 O. Hartmann :
> Well,
> in this case, it would really be a 'nice to have', maybe this is worth a PR?
>

Try asking on the ports@ list. I'm not sure what the criteria is for
something being listed there - if something isn't going to be used by
very many ports, it may not be worth adding, from a bloat point of
view. I would say it is probably safe for your port to assume csh is
/bin/csh, though.

-- 
Rob Farmer
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: porting software to FreeBSD, what to do if Makefile lacks?

[O. Hartmann]

On 11/18/10 03:12, Rob Farmer wrote:

On Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 16:58, O. Hartmann
  wrote:

Thanks.
I got it. But it seems that my first porting task run into some difficulties
for the advanced porters, since there is no autotool environment.

By the way, the global environment variable ${CSH} seems to be noneexistent,
instead ${SH} exists.


Interesting - I assumed it would be listed in bsd.commands.mk, but it
seems to not be. Most of the base system tools are. In any case, glad
to hear you got it working.



Well,
in this case, it would really be a 'nice to have', maybe this is worth a PR?
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: porting software to FreeBSD, what to do if Makefile lacks?

[Rob Farmer]

On Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 16:58, O. Hartmann
 wrote:
> Thanks.
> I got it. But it seems that my first porting task run into some difficulties
> for the advanced porters, since there is no autotool environment.
>
> By the way, the global environment variable ${CSH} seems to be noneexistent,
> instead ${SH} exists.

Interesting - I assumed it would be listed in bsd.commands.mk, but it
seems to not be. Most of the base system tools are. In any case, glad
to hear you got it working.

-- 
Rob Farmer
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: porting software to FreeBSD, what to do if Makefile lacks?

[O. Hartmann]

On 11/17/10 22:01, Rob Farmer wrote:

2010/11/17 O. Hartmann:

Hello.

I try to create a port of a software which does not have a Makefile and is
build via a propriate csh script. Installation is done temporarely into some
lib's and exe's subfolder withing the source folder, so I need to tell the
top level Makefile of the port to use a specific build script instead
implying having Makefile and a home-brewn install script, which takes the
binaries and libs out of the temporary folders and install them at the
proper places within the FreeBSD's tree. How can I perform these two tasks?


You want to override the do-build target, something like:

do-build:
${CSH} ${WRKSRC}/build-script.csh


For the install, do the same with the do-install target. Unless your
install script is particularly long or complicated, it will probably
be best to put it right into the port's Makefile. Then you can use the
INSTALL macros to ensure permissions are set correctly, binaries are
stripped if the user doesn't specify WITH_DEBUG, etc.

If you haven't already, check out the Porter's Handbook - it will
familiarize you with important guidelines and covers a lot of common
problems:

http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/porters-handbook/


Thanks.
I got it. But it seems that my first porting task run into some 
difficulties for the advanced porters, since there is no autotool 
environment.


By the way, the global environment variable ${CSH} seems to be 
noneexistent, instead ${SH} exists.


Regards,
Oliver
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: porting software to FreeBSD, what to do if Makefile lacks?

[Rob Farmer]

2010/11/17 O. Hartmann :
> Hello.
>
> I try to create a port of a software which does not have a Makefile and is
> build via a propriate csh script. Installation is done temporarely into some
> lib's and exe's subfolder withing the source folder, so I need to tell the
> top level Makefile of the port to use a specific build script instead
> implying having Makefile and a home-brewn install script, which takes the
> binaries and libs out of the temporary folders and install them at the
> proper places within the FreeBSD's tree. How can I perform these two tasks?

You want to override the do-build target, something like:

do-build:
${CSH} ${WRKSRC}/build-script.csh


For the install, do the same with the do-install target. Unless your
install script is particularly long or complicated, it will probably
be best to put it right into the port's Makefile. Then you can use the
INSTALL macros to ensure permissions are set correctly, binaries are
stripped if the user doesn't specify WITH_DEBUG, etc.

If you haven't already, check out the Porter's Handbook - it will
familiarize you with important guidelines and covers a lot of common
problems:

http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/porters-handbook/

-- 
Rob Farmer
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

porting software to FreeBSD, what to do if Makefile lacks?

[O. Hartmann]

Hello.

I try to create a port of a software which does not have a Makefile and 
is build via a propriate csh script. Installation is done temporarely 
into some lib's and exe's subfolder withing the source folder, so I need 
to tell the top level Makefile of the port to use a specific build 
script instead implying having Makefile and a home-brewn install script, 
which takes the binaries and libs out of the temporary folders and 
install them at the proper places within the FreeBSD's tree. How can I 
perform these two tasks?


Please set my CC, I'm not subscribing this list. Thanks in advance,


Oliver
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: CPU testing software?

[Chris Brennan]

On Tue, Nov 9, 2010 at 12:04 PM, Richard Morse  wrote:

> Hi! I've been having problems with FreeBSD 8.1-RELEASE crashing. This
> morning, it had hung -- it wasn't responding to any input, but there was no
> error message on screen. I ran MemTest86+ (which worked; MemTest86 doesn't
> for some reason), and it found no errors in two passes (one without ECC, one
> with). I was wondering if there is software that will test the CPUs in a
> similar manner?
>
> Thanks,
> Ricky
>
>
> The information in this e-mail is intended only for the person to whom it
> is
> addressed. If you believe this e-mail was sent to you in error and the
> e-mail
> contains patient information, please contact the Partners Compliance
> HelpLine at
> http://www.partners.org/complianceline . If the e-mail was sent to you in
> error
> but does not contain patient information, please contact the sender and
> properly
> dispose of the e-mail.
>
>
In my experiences, FreeBSD is very /var dependent and I've had machines lock
up and even refuse to reboot because either a) /var was unwritable for some
reason or b) /var was just plain full. For my, I've made it a habit of
looking at /var/spool/mqueue, for the longest time I couldn't get sSMTP to
work properly w/ my mail server and that location would chew up all my free
space and cause similar problems. Also what you could do is make sure your
fBSD box has a Head and leave it idle (no blanking) on the root-console
(ttyv0) and look and see. This was how I discovered my space issues.

Ultimatly, more information is require, spec your machine for us to start.
Can you include what the machines function/role is?

Did you know...

If you play a Windows 2000 CD backwards, you hear satanic messages,

but what's worse is when you play it forward
  ...it installs Windows 2000

   -- Alfred Perlstein on chat at freebsd.org
<http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions>
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

CPU testing software?

[Richard Morse]

Hi! I've been having problems with FreeBSD 8.1-RELEASE crashing. This morning, 
it had hung -- it wasn't responding to any input, but there was no error 
message on screen. I ran MemTest86+ (which worked; MemTest86 doesn't for some 
reason), and it found no errors in two passes (one without ECC, one with). I 
was wondering if there is software that will test the CPUs in a similar manner?

Thanks,
Ricky


The information in this e-mail is intended only for the person to whom it is
addressed. If you believe this e-mail was sent to you in error and the e-mail
contains patient information, please contact the Partners Compliance HelpLine at
http://www.partners.org/complianceline . If the e-mail was sent to you in error
but does not contain patient information, please contact the sender and properly
dispose of the e-mail.

___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Bruce Cran]

On Friday 08 October 2010 01:12:55 Robert Bonomi wrote:

> he'll tell you: "I need to review the copyright notices, licenses, and
> distribution restricions on _each_and_every_ item in that package.  Go
> check _every_ file you intend to include,  bring me a list showing
>   1) every file name
>   2) who holds the copyright to that file
>   3) what form of license it is issued under, and for each form of license
>   a complete copy of that license.
>   4) any 'restricted use' notices you may find along the way
> 
> Then _you_ actually perform the audit.

Which is why it's so important not to customize the license text when creating 
new files!

-- 
Bruce Cran
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Robert Bonomi]

> From owner-freebsd-questi...@freebsd.org  Thu Oct  7 18:28:10 2010
> Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2010 09:29:46 +1000
> From: Danny Carroll 
> To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
> Subject: Re: Like it or not,
>  Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted
>  software in the core
>
>  On 7/10/2010 8:23 PM, Gonzalo Nemmi wrote:
> >
> > I would assume you already did that before walking into my office to
> > ...
> > If you go tell your Dr. you have a simple cof and a runy nose, he
> > won´t ask you to go trhough a colonoscopy or a brain tomography ...
> > and, _please_, _by_all_means_ don´t count on him finding anything on
> > your colon or in your brain in that case.
> >
>
> True, but if you told your doctor to test that you did not have cancer
> and he neglected to give you a colonoscopy, then he'd be, well, negligent.
> But I am just being fecetious, I guess a lawyer may not have the
> technical knowledge to know *where* to get each license that may be used.

The lawyer doesn't need to know where to get each license.  He, does know,
however, that he needs -all- of them,  -and- that they're not necessarily
all in 'obvious' places.

The conversation start with you asking your lawyer something along the lines
of:
   "I'm considering exporting _this_ bundle of sofware,  what needs to be
checked?"

he'll tell you: "I need to review the copyright notices, licenses, and 
distribution restricions on _each_and_every_ item in that package.  Go
check _every_ file you intend to include,  bring me a list showing 
  1) every file name
  2) who holds the copyright to that file
  3) what form of license it is issued under, and for each form of license
  a complete copy of that license.
  4) any 'restricted use' notices you may find along the way

Then _you_ actually perform the audit.

___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Chad Perrin]

On Thu, Oct 07, 2010 at 05:47:23PM -0500, Robert Bonomi wrote:
> 
> Pure and simple, _if_ there is software involved, there *MAY* be export-
> control issues.
> 
> *ANYONE* in the business of exporting software _should_ be aware of that
> fact, and as a matter of basic 'due diligence' know about _their_ national
> laws on the matter, and how/where to find out what kinds of software are
> restricted, and on what basis.

Anyone who stores software on GitHub, BitBucket, or SourceForge could
conceivably be accuse of being "in the software export business" -- but I
bet very few people who use those services ever think about that.  Of
course, practically speaking, the chances of ending up in US court simply
for putting some simple home-brewed CMS on BitBucket are probably pretty
slim, in my non-lawyer opinion.  Still . . . not having a moment where
one thinks about the possibility seems like a pretty clear indication
that it is rare for a non-lawyer to consider *all* the possible ways to
get in legal trouble for "exporting" software.

I do not really think that implying someone is stupid for failing to
consider all possibilities is productive, especially since if we all had
to get legal help every time we started a GitHub project, we would have
considerably fewer GitHub projects in the world.


> 
> It is worth noting that since the original software author (Intel) put the
> "it is possible an export license may be required under some circumstances"
> notice on their software that anyone who takes said notice -off- had better
> have (1) a -solid- professionally-rendered legal opinion that no such license
> is required under _any_ circumstances, and (2) massive liability insuance
> in case they are wrong.

They could also just ask Intel, I suppose.  There must be *someone* there
who has the job of answering questions like this.  I am pretty sure that
Intel's stable of lawyers isn't as big as IBM's, but it might be close to
the size of the US DOJ.  Even if Intel said "Sure, go ahead, we don't
care," I'd still be inclined to seek further advice more concerned with
my own legal safety before removing any legal notices though -- aside
from the tags on my matresses and pillows (for instance).

-- 
Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ]


pgphjDhhH1dHJ.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Danny Carroll]

 On 7/10/2010 8:23 PM, Gonzalo Nemmi wrote:
>
> I would assume you already did that before walking into my office to
> ask me about the set of licenses up for a review ... otherwise,
> there´s no way to me to look close enough where I wasn´t asked to look
> ...
> If you go tell your Dr. you have a simple cof and a runy nose, he
> won´t ask you to go trhough a colonoscopy or a brain tomography ...
> and, _please_, _by_all_means_ don´t count on him finding anything on
> your colon or in your brain in that case.
>

True, but if you told your doctor to test that you did not have cancer
and he neglected to give you a colonoscopy, then he'd be, well, negligent.
But I am just being fecetious, I guess a lawyer may not have the
technical knowledge to know *where* to get each license that may be used.

-D
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Randal L. Schwartz]

> "Glen" == Glen Barber  writes:

Glen> Can this thread go away now?

Only when the problem goes away.

Is there a comprehensive list of restrictive sublicenses, or pointers to
same, somewhere prominent at the top of the core distro?

Or maybe some tool that would dynamically discover same, like maybe a
convention that a license file is always called LICENSE or something?

*That* would be helpful.

-- 
Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
 http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
Smalltalk/Perl/Unix consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
See http://methodsandmessages.posterous.com/ for Smalltalk discussion
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Glen Barber]

On 10/7/10 6:47 PM, Robert Bonomi wrote:
>> To: FreeBSD 
>> Date: Wed, 06 Oct 2010 14:46:34 -0700
>> Subject: Re: Like it or not,
>>  Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software
>>  in the core
>>
>>
>> I understand that entirely.  Which is why it would be reasonable (and
>> downright ethical) to ensure that every FreeBSD integrator be made well
>> aware of this restriction.
>>
>> It hadn't occurred to *me* for example to think that FreeBSD might be
>> restricted. 
> 
> We are not responsible for _your_ lack of understanding OF THE LAW.
> 
> But then, you've been there before on that, and learned the 'hard way'
> didn't you.
> 
> Pure and simple, _if_ there is software involved, there *MAY* be export-
> control issues.
> 
> *ANYONE* in the business of exporting software _should_ be aware of that
> fact, and as a matter of basic 'due diligence' know about _their_ national
> laws on the matter, and how/where to find out what kinds of software are
> restricted, and on what basis.
> 
> It is worth noting that since the original software author (Intel) put the
> "it is possible an export license may be required under some circumstances"
> notice on their software that anyone who takes said notice -off- had better
> have (1) a -solid- professionally-rendered legal opinion that no such license
> is required under _any_ circumstances, and (2) massive liability insuance
> in case they are wrong.
> 
> The party that removes the warning notice of a possible risk *IS* liable
> to the party who 'relies' on such removal as evidence that no license is
> needed.
> 
> If a cautionary notice was _never_ present, that is one thing, and one cannot
> draw conclusions from the omission.
> 
> If a notice _was_ present, and "someone" removes it, that 'affirmtive acton'
> is a _very_ different thing.
> 

Can this thread go away now?

-- 
Glen Barber
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Robert Bonomi]

> To: FreeBSD 
> Date: Wed, 06 Oct 2010 14:46:34 -0700
> Subject: Re: Like it or not,
>   Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software
>   in the core
>
>
> I understand that entirely.  Which is why it would be reasonable (and
> downright ethical) to ensure that every FreeBSD integrator be made well
> aware of this restriction.
>
> It hadn't occurred to *me* for example to think that FreeBSD might be
> restricted. 

We are not responsible for _your_ lack of understanding OF THE LAW.

But then, you've been there before on that, and learned the 'hard way'
didn't you.

Pure and simple, _if_ there is software involved, there *MAY* be export-
control issues.

*ANYONE* in the business of exporting software _should_ be aware of that
fact, and as a matter of basic 'due diligence' know about _their_ national
laws on the matter, and how/where to find out what kinds of software are
restricted, and on what basis.

It is worth noting that since the original software author (Intel) put the
"it is possible an export license may be required under some circumstances"
notice on their software that anyone who takes said notice -off- had better
have (1) a -solid- professionally-rendered legal opinion that no such license
is required under _any_ circumstances, and (2) massive liability insuance
in case they are wrong.

The party that removes the warning notice of a possible risk *IS* liable
to the party who 'relies' on such removal as evidence that no license is
needed.

If a cautionary notice was _never_ present, that is one thing, and one cannot
draw conclusions from the omission.

If a notice _was_ present, and "someone" removes it, that 'affirmtive acton'
is a _very_ different thing.

___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[CyberLeo Kitsana]

On 10/07/2010 12:46 PM, Rob Farmer wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 7, 2010 at 10:19, Gonzalo Nemmi  wrote:
>> If you have a point, then there´s no point in me addressing your point
>> .. unless you are asking me for legal advice ..
>> Should that be the case, just let me know; I charge by the hour .. no
>> "pro bono".
> 
> Seeing as your messages says things like "El 07/10/2010" and "Rob
> Farmer escribió" and you seem unwilling to actually talk about US law,
> I'm curious to know where you attended law school and what states you
> are licensed to practice in, since you seem to be offering paid
> professional services.

Argentina?

[0] http://ar.linkedin.com/pub/gonzalo-nemmi/21/22b/267

-- 
Fuzzy love,
-CyberLeo
Technical Administrator
CyberLeo.Net Webhosting
http://www.CyberLeo.Net


Furry Peace! - http://.fur.com/peace/
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Robert Bonomi]

> Date: Thu, 7 Oct 2010 07:23:02 +0200
> From: Erik Trulsson 
> To: "Randal L. Schwartz" 
> Cc: RW , freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
> Subject: Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping
>  export-restricted software in the core
>
> On Wed, Oct 06, 2010 at 04:08:35PM -0700, Randal L. Schwartz wrote:
> > >>>>> "Erik" == Erik Trulsson  writes:
> > 
> > Do you have a different opinion, and is it a legal opinion?
>
> To me it looks much more like a case of some corporate standard
> cover-your-ass boilerplate text that is used regardless of whether
> there is reason to believe any particular piece of software needs any
> special export approval.
>

That is an *exactly* correct reading of the text in question.

What requires explicit permission from the U.S. government (or other
national authority , for those in a different locale) *changes* over time.
"Just because" it doesn't require a license _now_ doesn't mean that it
will =never= need one.  And simplarly, if it -does- need a license now
it may _not_ need one at some (unknown) point in the future.

*ALL* that language is doing is saying that the original licensor (INTEL)
has _not_ made any determination as to what, *IF*ANY*, export controls may
apply, now or at some unspeciied point in the future, to that code.  

AND that anyone who _does_ intend export said software has to (a) make 
that determination for themselves, and (b) _comply_ with such legal 
requirements themselves to be in compliance with the license from Intel.

As a matter of _law_, those exact restrictions apply to *EVERY* piece 
of _every_ O/S -- OpenBSD, NetBSD, Open Solaris, Linux, FreeBSD, or 
'whatever' -- that are accessed from a server that is located in the
United States.  It _doesn't_ matter where the code 'came from', you can
import from anywhere, but certain things you _cannot_ 'export', even if
you got it from 'somewhere outside the U.S.'-- a 'somewhere' that the 
person you're sending it to could go to themselves and get it.


Intel is simply protecting _themselves_ against a =future= claim that
_they_ (Intel) 'facilitated' the distrubution of 'export-controlled'
software to the 'bad guys'.

"When in doubt" you placard 'everything'.  For stuf that you -give- away,
there is nothing to be gained by spending the time/money to make the
determinatin yourself -- It's not going to make you any additional profits
if you do it, do "why bother?" applies.

___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Rob Farmer]

On Thu, Oct 7, 2010 at 10:19, Gonzalo Nemmi  wrote:
> If you have a point, then there´s no point in me addressing your point
> .. unless you are asking me for legal advice ..
> Should that be the case, just let me know; I charge by the hour .. no
> "pro bono".

Seeing as your messages says things like "El 07/10/2010" and "Rob
Farmer escribió" and you seem unwilling to actually talk about US law,
I'm curious to know where you attended law school and what states you
are licensed to practice in, since you seem to be offering paid
professional services.

--
Rob Farmer
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Gonzalo Nemmi]

On Thu, Oct 7, 2010 at 7:29 PM, Adam Vande More  wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 7, 2010 at 12:19 PM, Gonzalo Nemmi  wrote:
>>
>> On Thu, Oct 7, 2010 at 6:59 PM, Rob Farmer 
>> wrote:
>> > On Thu, Oct 7, 2010 at 03:23, Gonzalo Nemmi  wrote:
>> >> Im saying what I already said.
>> >
>> > And yet, you haven't really addressed my core point.
>> > ...
>> >
>> > My point is  ...
>>
>> If you have a point, then there´s no point in me addressing your point
>> .. unless you are asking me for legal advice ..
>> Should that be the case, just let me know; I charge by the hour .. no
>> "pro bono".
>
> Funny how you say you have a point, but you can't validate it or even
> articulate it when challenged.  Acting like you had a legal opinion on
> something earlier, then playing those games makes you a troll.  Please drum
> up business elsewhere.

Actually my point was that Randal was right about Theo´s point ..
whether I want or like to validate it according to your or Rob´s needs
is not my problem .. it´s yours. I don´t _have_to_ validate a thing
only because you want me too. I actually _meant_ not to validate them,
and did that on pourpose.
And BTW, I never drummed up any business .. I kept answering Rob´s
questions until I wanted to. If he/you want some more, go find them
some place else.
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Adam Vande More]

On Thu, Oct 7, 2010 at 12:19 PM, Gonzalo Nemmi  wrote:

> On Thu, Oct 7, 2010 at 6:59 PM, Rob Farmer 
> wrote:
> > On Thu, Oct 7, 2010 at 03:23, Gonzalo Nemmi  wrote:
> >> Im saying what I already said.
> >
> > And yet, you haven't really addressed my core point.
> > ...
> >
> > My point is  ...
>
> If you have a point, then there´s no point in me addressing your point
> .. unless you are asking me for legal advice ..
> Should that be the case, just let me know; I charge by the hour .. no
> "pro bono".
>

Funny how you say you have a point, but you can't validate it or even
articulate it when challenged.  Acting like you had a legal opinion on
something earlier, then playing those games makes you a troll.  Please drum
up business elsewhere.

-- 
Adam Vande More
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Gonzalo Nemmi]

On Thu, Oct 7, 2010 at 6:59 PM, Rob Farmer  wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 7, 2010 at 03:23, Gonzalo Nemmi  wrote:
>> Im saying what I already said.
>
> And yet, you haven't really addressed my core point.
> ...
>
> My point is  ...

If you have a point, then there´s no point in me addressing your point
.. unless you are asking me for legal advice ..
Should that be the case, just let me know; I charge by the hour .. no
"pro bono".

> ...
> People shouldn't be
> watching out for a particular license, but rather the broader
> implications of distributing stuff internationally

Usually, the implications of distributing stuff internationally have a
really strict realation with "what is exactly what you want to
export?" ... which in this case, leads you straight into the reading
of the terms of the licenses of the software subject to international
distribution.

> ...
>
> By clicking on and downloading Fedora, you agree to comply with the
> following terms and conditions:
>
> Fedora software and technical information is subject to the U.S.
> ...

Plase, get in touch with Fedora´a legal advisors. They´ll be able to
ask every question and legal concern you may have about their
operation.

> ...
> If I consulted
> a lawyer about doing such an export, it is reasonable to expect that
> they would bring this up, rather than just summarize license terms on
> a one-off basis.
>

By all mean, feel free to get in touch with your lawyer and ask him
everything you would like to know.

Best Regards
Gonzalo Nemmi
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Rob Farmer]

On Thu, Oct 7, 2010 at 03:23, Gonzalo Nemmi  wrote:
> Im saying what I already said.

And yet, you haven't really addressed my core point.

Consider the following scenario:
I write a tutorial on how to use GCC (a program originally written in
the US by a US citizen and stills recieves significant contributions
from US citizens) to compile programs for targeting ICBM's. I burn my
tutorial plus a copy of GCC to a CD and ship it to Supreme Leader Kim
Jong-il's residence, then he sends me $50,000 cash in exchange.

The GPL has no problems whatsoever with this (it never addresses
exports, says there shall be no discrimination against certain fields
of endeavor, and the added "services and support" sidestep any sales
issues).

Yet, do you really think this would be a-ok with customs? There are
various laws that covered the situation, in addition to the license -
for example, there are restrictions on transporting more than $9,999
worth of paper currency across the US border in a single transaction
(even just to Canada).

My point is that the US export restrictions apply to the Intel ACPI
code, they apply to most of the GNU toolchain, they apply to work
Yahoo has paid people to do, etc. FreeBSD, like it or not, is largely
under the jurisdiction of US export law. You are saying that there
should be a disclaimer telling people to "watch out for this one. Ask
your lawyer about it's terms and conditions." People shouldn't be
watching out for a particular license, but rather the broader
implications of distributing stuff internationally, which, due to
cold-war era laws, can involve a significant prison sentence if done
wrong. If you are interested in adding a disclaimer, consider the
following one from Red Hat's legal department, which covers the
*entire* distribution:

By clicking on and downloading Fedora, you agree to comply with the
following terms and conditions:

Fedora software and technical information is subject to the U.S.
Export Administration Regulations and other U.S. and foreign law, and
may not be exported or re-exported to certain countries (currently
Cuba, Iran, Iraq, North Korea, Sudan, and Syria) or to persons or
entities prohibited from receiving U.S. exports (including those (a)
on the Bureau of Industry and Security Denied Parties List or Entity
List, (b) on the Office of Foreign Assets Control list of Specially
Designated Nationals and Blocked Persons, and (c) involved with
missile technology or nuclear, chemical or biological weapons). You
may not download Fedora software or technical information if you are
located in one of these countries, or otherwise affected by these
restrictions. You may not provide Fedora software or technical
information to individuals or entities located in one of these
countries or otherwise affected by these restrictions. You are also
responsible for compliance with foreign law requirements applicable to
the import and use of Fedora software and technical information.

Perhaps there are loopholes (I export to Canada, then a Canadian
exports to somewhere else) but this doesn't change the situation for
people in the US, like the OP. You are talking about reviewing the
licenses, but exporting is also matter of criminal law. If I consulted
a lawyer about doing such an export, it is reasonable to expect that
they would bring this up, rather than just summarize license terms on
a one-off basis.

-- 
Rob Farmer
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Brandon Gooch]

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 10:11 PM, Randal L. Schwartz
 wrote:
[SNIP]
>
> Or a third alternative... use the ACPI implementation from OpenBSD,
> which doesn't have such a restriction.

Port it! I'll test it for you (on 9-CURRENT and, if possible, a
backport to 8-STABLE).

In your opinion, how long will it take, and how difficult will the process be?

-Brandon
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Gonzalo Nemmi]

El 07/10/2010 02:18 a.m., Rob Farmer escribió:

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 20:38, Gonzalo Nemmi  wrote:


As a lawyer, no matter how much I review your set up, it´s a _fact_ that a
license place in a place like
/usr/src/sys/contrib/dev/acpica/hardware/hwsleep.c, that is to say, lost
amongs a gazillion files: _will_ scape any review.

Furthermore, you can count on legal advise about the thing you tell you
lawyer to review, but if you ignore _what_ you want to get reviewed: you
can´t count on anyone knowing it for you.


I would assume that such a review would involve extracting all the
licenses in the source tree, eliminating the duplicates, and having
those reviewed. I'm saying I don't find the "oh I missed that one"
argument convincing, because if there is the possibility of missing a
license, then you aren't looking closely enough in the first place.


I would assume you already did that before walking into my office to ask 
me about the set of licenses up for a review ... otherwise, there´s no 
way to me to look close enough where I wasn´t asked to look ...


If you go tell your Dr. you have a simple cof and a runy nose, he won´t 
ask you to go trhough a colonoscopy or a brain tomography ... and, 
_please_, _by_all_means_ don´t count on him finding anything on your 
colon or in your brain in that case.




This license is not just in
src/sys/contrib/dev/acpica/hardware/hwsleep.c - it is in all the files
within the acpica contrib directory, plus the upstream vendor states
that it applies to the entire tarball on their website. You should
reasonably expect that each piece of software (ie directory) within
contrib may be under a different license and needs to be reviewed.


It´s not about what a lawyer or an accountant expects or doesn´t.

It´s about what _you_, who know your way around your business (only you 
know your code, the licenses it contains and where) a lot better than he 
(who actually only knows "his way around his business"), ask him to 
review. If you didn´t: don´t count on him jumping at you answering a 
question that was never asked in the first place, regardless of whether 
the license is on every acpica file or any file on the scheduler or on 
the bluetooth, usb or tcp/ip stack or anywhere else ...



Making the license more visible may be a good idea, but doesn't
materially change the situation any.


It does by making it visible and thus telling potential
exporters/re-exporters "watch out for this one. Ask your lawyer about it´s
terms and conditions".


What I meant by "doesn't materially change the situation any" is that
everything exported from the US should be considered under export
restrictions unless proven otherwise. Jung-uk Kim says:

Historically FreeBSD never touched the license header.  However, I am
going to do it next time to avoid confusions.
( http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-questions/2010-October/222451.html
)

I don't think this makes a bit of difference (it fact it would be
somewhat misleading) since the export restrictions are a valid law and
dropping clauses from the license doesn't change that - are you saying
I'm wrong here?


Im saying what I already said.

Best Regards
Gonzalo Nemmi
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Erik Trulsson]

On Wed, Oct 06, 2010 at 04:08:35PM -0700, Randal L. Schwartz wrote:
> >>>>> "Erik" == Erik Trulsson  writes:
> 
> Erik> Since it essentially says that if you export it from the USA you will
> Erik> have to follow whatever laws and regulations covers such exports, it
> Erik> doesn't really add any burden since anybody doing such an export would
> Erik> be legally required to do so anyway.
> 
> Erik> AFAICT the paragraph in question does not add any restrictions or
> Erik> burdens, it just points out potentially existing ones.
> 
> Yes, you always have to obey the law when you export.  But this clause
> seems to imply that the associated software *knowingly* triggers the
> export laws, probably in a bad way.
> 
> Do you have a different opinion, and is it a legal opinion?

To me it looks much more like a case of some corporate standard
cover-your-ass boilerplate text that is used regardless of whether
there is reason to believe any particular piece of software needs any
special export approval.



-- 

Erik Trulsson
ertr1...@student.uu.se
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Rob Farmer]

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 20:38, Gonzalo Nemmi  wrote:
>
> As a lawyer, no matter how much I review your set up, it´s a _fact_ that a
> license place in a place like
> /usr/src/sys/contrib/dev/acpica/hardware/hwsleep.c, that is to say, lost
> amongs a gazillion files: _will_ scape any review.
>
> Furthermore, you can count on legal advise about the thing you tell you
> lawyer to review, but if you ignore _what_ you want to get reviewed: you
> can´t count on anyone knowing it for you.

I would assume that such a review would involve extracting all the
licenses in the source tree, eliminating the duplicates, and having
those reviewed. I'm saying I don't find the "oh I missed that one"
argument convincing, because if there is the possibility of missing a
license, then you aren't looking closely enough in the first place.

This license is not just in
src/sys/contrib/dev/acpica/hardware/hwsleep.c - it is in all the files
within the acpica contrib directory, plus the upstream vendor states
that it applies to the entire tarball on their website. You should
reasonably expect that each piece of software (ie directory) within
contrib may be under a different license and needs to be reviewed.

>> Making the license more visible may be a good idea, but doesn't
>> materially change the situation any.
>
> It does by making it visible and thus telling potential
> exporters/re-exporters "watch out for this one. Ask your lawyer about it´s
> terms and conditions".

What I meant by "doesn't materially change the situation any" is that
everything exported from the US should be considered under export
restrictions unless proven otherwise. Jung-uk Kim says:

Historically FreeBSD never touched the license header.  However, I am
going to do it next time to avoid confusions.
( http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-questions/2010-October/222451.html
)

I don't think this makes a bit of difference (it fact it would be
somewhat misleading) since the export restrictions are a valid law and
dropping clauses from the license doesn't change that - are you saying
I'm wrong here?

-- 
Rob Farmer
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Gonzalo Nemmi]

El 07/10/2010 12:11 a.m., Randal L. Schwartz escribió:

"Michael" == Michael Powell  writes:


Michael>  I was under the impression that the most onerous of these
Michael>  export rules and restrictions applied to crypto technology. If
Michael>  this is so, what I don't quite grasp is what do crypto export
Michael>  restrictions have to do with acpi? Is acpi a copyrighted,
Michael>  patented, or trademark otherwise owned by some entity? Quite
Michael>  possibly so as it is in contrib. I just have no idea who might
Michael>  "own" it. Or how it would fall afoul of crypto export
Michael>  restrictions.

Exactly my point.  Either it's crypto, and the whole distro is tainted
and should be marked as such UP FRONT, or it's not, and the paragraph
should be removed, if possible.

Or a third alternative... use the ACPI implementation from OpenBSD,
which doesn't have such a restriction.



You just read my mind ... I was about to point out the same thing .. 
which I think was what inspired Theo to title his mail "FreeBSD isn't 
Free" ... I took it as he was making fun about the fact that they have 
their own acpi implementation whereas, by following acpica, FreeBSD 
turned out being subject to intel´s acpica copyright notice and terms.


Boiling it down, Theo´s mail was nothing but a "MDIBTY ... and 
furthermore: we are not tiered by legal restrictions" ... and just as 
you said: "Like it or not, Theo has a point..." although from where I´m 
standing, he has two ...


Best Regards
Gonzalo Nemmi
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Gonzalo Nemmi]

El 06/10/2010 11:18 p.m., Rob Farmer escribió:

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 14:46, Randal L. Schwartz  wrote:

I understand that entirely.  Which is why it would be reasonable (and
downright ethical) to ensure that every FreeBSD integrator be made well
aware of this restriction.

It hadn't occurred to *me* for example to think that FreeBSD might be
restricted.  And I hadn't seen any prominent disclaimers.  Why rely on a
very very buried notice?


If your business model involves importing/exporting large collections
of material which you did not create, and further more do not outright
own, but are licensed to use under certain conditions, then you need
to have both a lawyer and an accountant review your setup for any
potential issues.  There are entire college degrees in international


As a lawyer, no matter how much I review your set up, it´s a _fact_ that 
a license place in a place like 
/usr/src/sys/contrib/dev/acpica/hardware/hwsleep.c, that is to say, lost 
amongs a gazillion files: _will_ scape any review.


Furthermore, you can count on legal advise about the thing you tell you 
lawyer to review, but if you ignore _what_ you want to get reviewed: you 
can´t count on anyone knowing it for you.



business and it is folly to think that all the ins and outs of a
particular scenario will be readily apparent.

A competent review would turn up this license clause and would give
you advice on what to do about it. I don't think complaining that you
weren't aware of the license terms before exporting is valid.


No ... and you are dead wrong about that .. a competent review will only 
answer the questions asked ... if you ignore the existence of such 
license and it´s terms, then there´s no way you would ask for advice 
about it, and _that_ I think is the point Randal is trying to make.



Furthermore, this isn't really a license issue, but more of a issue of
federal law. If you are in the US, these laws regarding what may be
exported to where always apply, regardless of what the license says.

Making the license more visible may be a good idea, but doesn't
materially change the situation any.


It does by making it visible and thus telling potential 
exporters/re-exporters "watch out for this one. Ask your lawyer about 
it´s terms and conditions".


Best Regards
Gonzalo Nemmi
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Rob Farmer]

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 20:04, Michael Powell  wrote:
> I was under the impression that the most onerous of these export rules and
> restrictions applied to crypto technology. If this is so, what I don't quite
> grasp is what do crypto export restrictions have to do with acpi? Is acpi a
> copyrighted, patented, or trademark otherwise owned by some entity? Quite
> possibly so as it is in contrib. I just have no idea who might "own" it. Or
> how it would fall afoul of crypto export restrictions.
>
> Looking forward to enlightenment.  :-)

I'm not a lawyer either, so take all this with a grain of salt.

Basically, there are two reasons the US will block an export, which
you can read about at:
http://www.bis.doc.gov/licensing/exportingbasics.htm

1) The export is considered "dangerous" for one reason or another, and
needs to be licensed so the government can keep track of who is
getting it and why they want it. Examples include military equipment,
nuclear equipment, controlled substances, firearms, etc. Crypto is
defined as a "munition" and is restricted for this reason. There are a
lot of opinions about whether this is "right", but it has held up in
court.

2) The destination is "designated as supporting terrorist activities"
or is embargoed for political reasons (socialist/totalitarian
government - Cuba, Iran, North Korea, Sudan, and Syria). Most of the
people in these countries don't have access to a computer and the
rights to install whatever they want on it, so this is targeted at
government officials.

As such, you are correct that for the vast majority of cases, the ACPI
code shouldn't have problems or need a license. The biggest legal risk
I can see is if ftp.freebsd.org and such allow people in the embargoed
countries to download code - I've seen a brief reference saying
Sourceforge was forced to IP ban these.

-- 
Rob Farmer
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Randal L. Schwartz]

>>>>> "Jung-uk" == Jung-uk Kim  writes:

Jung-uk> Please stop the FUD.  ACPICA is actually triple-licensed, i.e., 
Jung-uk> generic Intel software license, (three-clause) BSD-like license, and 
Jung-uk> GPLv2.

[...]

Jung-uk> Historically FreeBSD never touched the license header.  However, I am 
Jung-uk> going to do it next time to avoid confusions.

Then. Please. Do.

I would have never brought this up (nor would the OpenBSD list before
me) if the right license was here.

Geez.  What a wasted amount of effort.  If anything to be learned from
here, it's use the right boilerplate when you include something into the
distro.

Otherwise, smart people will react to license notices because yes
indeed, THESE MATTER.

-- 
Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
 http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
Smalltalk/Perl/Unix consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
See http://methodsandmessages.posterous.com/ for Smalltalk discussion
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Jung-uk Kim]

On Wednesday 06 October 2010 03:40 pm, Randal L. Schwartz wrote:
> http://article.gmane.org/gmane.os.openbsd.misc/178267
>
> And yes, there it is, in
> /usr/src/sys/contrib/dev/acpica/hardware/hwsleep.c:
>
>  * 4.3. Licensee shall not export, either directly or indirectly,
> any of this * software or system incorporating such software
> without first obtaining any * required license or other approval
> from the U. S. Department of Commerce or * any other agency or
> department of the United States Government.  In the * event
> Licensee exports any such software from the United States or *
> re-exports any such software from a foreign destination, Licensee
> shall * ensure that the distribution and export/re-export of the
> software is in * compliance with all laws, regulations, orders, or
> other restrictions of the * U.S. Export Administration Regulations.
> Licensee agrees that neither it nor * any of its subsidiaries will
> export/re-export any technical data, process, * software, or
> service, directly or indirectly, to any country for which the *
> United States government or any agency thereof requires an export
> license, * other governmental approval, or letter of assurance,
> without first obtaining * such license, approval or letter.
>
> So, is such approval on file with the FreeBSD Foundation?

Please stop the FUD.  ACPICA is actually triple-licensed, i.e., 
generic Intel software license, (three-clause) BSD-like license, and 
GPLv2.  For example, please see the same file on Linux:

http://fxr.watson.org/fxr/source/drivers/acpi/acpica/hwsleep.c?v=linux-2.6

When a new ACPICA release is merged to Linux tree, it is pre-processed 
with acpisrc (which is also included in ACPICA release tarball) and 
all C source files are converted to Linux style.  Actually this tool 
replaces the generic Intel license with the actual BSD/GPLv2 dual 
license header at the same time:

http://git.moblin.org/cgit.cgi/acpica/tree/source/tools/acpisrc

The following file contains source conversion table for Linux:

http://git.moblin.org/cgit.cgi/acpica/tree/source/tools/acpisrc/astable.c#n158

Historically FreeBSD never touched the license header.  However, I am 
going to do it next time to avoid confusions.

Jung-uk Kim
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Randal L. Schwartz]

> "Michael" == Michael Powell  writes:

Michael> I was under the impression that the most onerous of these
Michael> export rules and restrictions applied to crypto technology. If
Michael> this is so, what I don't quite grasp is what do crypto export
Michael> restrictions have to do with acpi? Is acpi a copyrighted,
Michael> patented, or trademark otherwise owned by some entity? Quite
Michael> possibly so as it is in contrib. I just have no idea who might
Michael> "own" it. Or how it would fall afoul of crypto export
Michael> restrictions.

Exactly my point.  Either it's crypto, and the whole distro is tainted
and should be marked as such UP FRONT, or it's not, and the paragraph
should be removed, if possible.

Or a third alternative... use the ACPI implementation from OpenBSD,
which doesn't have such a restriction.

-- 
Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
 http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
Smalltalk/Perl/Unix consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
See http://methodsandmessages.posterous.com/ for Smalltalk discussion
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Michael Powell]

Michael Powell wrote:

[snip] export restrictions have to do with acpi? Is
> acpi a copyrighted, patented, or trademark otherwise owned by some entity?
> Quite possibly so as it is in contrib. I just have no idea who might "own"
> it. Or how it would fall afoul of crypto export restrictions.
> 
> Looking forward to enlightenment.  :-)
> 
Oh - I see now, it is "owned" by Intel.

-Mike



___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Michael Powell]

Rob Farmer wrote:

> On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 14:46, Randal L. Schwartz 
> wrote:
>> I understand that entirely.  Which is why it would be reasonable (and
>> downright ethical) to ensure that every FreeBSD integrator be made well
>> aware of this restriction.
>>
>> It hadn't occurred to *me* for example to think that FreeBSD might be
>> restricted.  And I hadn't seen any prominent disclaimers.  Why rely on a
>> very very buried notice?
> 
> If your business model involves importing/exporting large collections
> of material which you did not create, and further more do not outright
> own, but are licensed to use under certain conditions, then you need
> to have both a lawyer and an accountant review your setup for any
> potential issues. There are entire college degrees in international
> business and it is folly to think that all the ins and outs of a
> particular scenario will be readily apparent.
> 
> A competent review would turn up this license clause and would give
> you advice on what to do about it. I don't think complaining that you
> weren't aware of the license terms before exporting is valid.
> Furthermore, this isn't really a license issue, but more of a issue of
> federal law. If you are in the US, these laws regarding what may be
> exported to where always apply, regardless of what the license says.
> 
> Making the license more visible may be a good idea, but doesn't
> materially change the situation any.
> 

Please forgive my somewhat ignorant idea(s) on this subject, as I am 
definitely not a lawyer. 

I was under the impression that the most onerous of these export rules and 
restrictions applied to crypto technology. If this is so, what I don't quite 
grasp is what do crypto export restrictions have to do with acpi? Is acpi a 
copyrighted, patented, or trademark otherwise owned by some entity? Quite 
possibly so as it is in contrib. I just have no idea who might "own" it. Or 
how it would fall afoul of crypto export restrictions.

Looking forward to enlightenment.  :-)

-Mike


___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Randal L. Schwartz]

> "Rob" == Rob Farmer  writes:

Rob> Making the license more visible may be a good idea, but doesn't
Rob> materially change the situation any.

I agree, it doesn't change it materially.

But for the casual integrator, making it very visible would help.

-- 
Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
 http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
Smalltalk/Perl/Unix consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
See http://methodsandmessages.posterous.com/ for Smalltalk discussion
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Rob Farmer]

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 14:46, Randal L. Schwartz  wrote:
> I understand that entirely.  Which is why it would be reasonable (and
> downright ethical) to ensure that every FreeBSD integrator be made well
> aware of this restriction.
>
> It hadn't occurred to *me* for example to think that FreeBSD might be
> restricted.  And I hadn't seen any prominent disclaimers.  Why rely on a
> very very buried notice?

If your business model involves importing/exporting large collections
of material which you did not create, and further more do not outright
own, but are licensed to use under certain conditions, then you need
to have both a lawyer and an accountant review your setup for any
potential issues. There are entire college degrees in international
business and it is folly to think that all the ins and outs of a
particular scenario will be readily apparent.

A competent review would turn up this license clause and would give
you advice on what to do about it. I don't think complaining that you
weren't aware of the license terms before exporting is valid.
Furthermore, this isn't really a license issue, but more of a issue of
federal law. If you are in the US, these laws regarding what may be
exported to where always apply, regardless of what the license says.

Making the license more visible may be a good idea, but doesn't
materially change the situation any.

-- 
Rob Farmer
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Gonzalo Nemmi]

El 06/10/2010 08:08 p.m., Randal L. Schwartz escribió:

"Erik" == Erik Trulsson  writes:


Erik>  Since it essentially says that if you export it from the USA you will
Erik>  have to follow whatever laws and regulations covers such exports, it
Erik>  doesn't really add any burden since anybody doing such an export would
Erik>  be legally required to do so anyway.

Erik>  AFAICT the paragraph in question does not add any restrictions or
Erik>  burdens, it just points out potentially existing ones.

Yes, you always have to obey the law when you export.  But this clause
seems to imply that the associated software *knowingly* triggers the
export laws, probably in a bad way.

Do you have a different opinion, and is it a legal opinion?

Either this clause needs to be hoisted to the front page of the FreeBSD
distro proper ("Some software contained within may be subject to...")
or it should be removed from this software entirely.

Burying it is irresponsible.



+1

BTW: IAAL

Best Regards
Gonzalo Nemmi
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Randal L. Schwartz]

>>>>> "Erik" == Erik Trulsson  writes:

Erik> Since it essentially says that if you export it from the USA you will
Erik> have to follow whatever laws and regulations covers such exports, it
Erik> doesn't really add any burden since anybody doing such an export would
Erik> be legally required to do so anyway.

Erik> AFAICT the paragraph in question does not add any restrictions or
Erik> burdens, it just points out potentially existing ones.

Yes, you always have to obey the law when you export.  But this clause
seems to imply that the associated software *knowingly* triggers the
export laws, probably in a bad way.

Do you have a different opinion, and is it a legal opinion?

Either this clause needs to be hoisted to the front page of the FreeBSD
distro proper ("Some software contained within may be subject to...")
or it should be removed from this software entirely.

Burying it is irresponsible.

-- 
Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
 http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
Smalltalk/Perl/Unix consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
See http://methodsandmessages.posterous.com/ for Smalltalk discussion
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Erik Trulsson]

On Wed, Oct 06, 2010 at 02:16:37PM -0700, Randal L. Schwartz wrote:
> > "RW" == RW   writes:
> 
> RW> It doesn't say approval is needed. It says that it's needed if it's
> RW> required by the appropriate agencies. In other words, it's needed if
> RW> it's needed.
> 
> But doesn't this then shift the burden to every exporter, knowing or
> unknowing, willing or unwilling?
>
> 
> Seems like an onerous burden.  Is it well-documented?

Since it essentially says that if you export it from the USA you will
have to follow whatever laws and regulations covers such exports, it
doesn't really add any burden since anybody doing such an export would
be legally required to do so anyway.

AFAICT the paragraph in question does not add any restrictions or
burdens, it just points out potentially existing ones.




-- 

Erik Trulsson
ertr1...@student.uu.se
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Randal L. Schwartz]

> "Jerry" == Jerry   writes:

>> But doesn't this then shift the burden to every exporter, knowing or
>> unknowing, willing or unwilling?
>> 
>> Seems like an onerous burden.  Is it well-documented?

Jerry> Are you familiar with the axiom:

Jerry> Ignorantia juris non excusat or Ignorantia legis neminem excusat

Jerry> Translated:

Jerry> "ignorance of the law does not excuse" or "ignorance of the law excuses
Jerry> no one" In other words, it is a legal principle holding that a person who
Jerry> is unaware of a law may not escape liability for violating that law
Jerry> merely because he or she was unaware of its content.

Jerry> There are exception; however, they are rare.

I understand that entirely.  Which is why it would be reasonable (and
downright ethical) to ensure that every FreeBSD integrator be made well
aware of this restriction.

It hadn't occurred to *me* for example to think that FreeBSD might be
restricted.  And I hadn't seen any prominent disclaimers.  Why rely on a
very very buried notice?

-- 
Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
 http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
Smalltalk/Perl/Unix consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
See http://methodsandmessages.posterous.com/ for Smalltalk discussion
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Jerry]

On Wed, 06 Oct 2010 14:16:37 -0700
Randal L. Schwartz  articulated:

> > "RW" == RW   writes:
> 
> RW> It doesn't say approval is needed. It says that it's needed if
> RW> it's required by the appropriate agencies. In other words, it's
> RW> needed if it's needed.
> 
> But doesn't this then shift the burden to every exporter, knowing or
> unknowing, willing or unwilling?
> 
> Seems like an onerous burden.  Is it well-documented?

Are you familiar with the axiom:

Ignorantia juris non excusat or Ignorantia legis neminem excusat

Translated:

"ignorance of the law does not excuse" or "ignorance of the law excuses
no one" In other words, it is a legal principle holding that a person who
is unaware of a law may not escape liability for violating that law
merely because he or she was unaware of its content.

There are exception; however, they are rare.

-- 
Jerry ✌
freebsd.u...@seibercom.net

Disclaimer: off-list followups get on-list replies or get ignored.
Please do not ignore the Reply-To header.
__

___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Randal L. Schwartz]

> "RW" == RW   writes:

RW> It doesn't say approval is needed. It says that it's needed if it's
RW> required by the appropriate agencies. In other words, it's needed if
RW> it's needed.

But doesn't this then shift the burden to every exporter, knowing or
unknowing, willing or unwilling?

Seems like an onerous burden.  Is it well-documented?

-- 
Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
 http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
Smalltalk/Perl/Unix consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
See http://methodsandmessages.posterous.com/ for Smalltalk discussion
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[RW]

On Wed, 06 Oct 2010 12:40:54 -0700
mer...@stonehenge.com (Randal L. Schwartz) wrote:

> 
> http://article.gmane.org/gmane.os.openbsd.misc/178267
>...
> So, is such approval on file with the FreeBSD Foundation?

" without first obtaining _any_ _required_ license or other
approval ..."

It doesn't say approval is needed. It says that it's needed if it's
required by the appropriate agencies. In other words, it's needed if
it's needed.

___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Like it or not, Theo has a point... freebsd is shipping export-restricted software in the core

[Randal L. Schwartz]

http://article.gmane.org/gmane.os.openbsd.misc/178267

And yes, there it is, in /usr/src/sys/contrib/dev/acpica/hardware/hwsleep.c:

 * 4.3. Licensee shall not export, either directly or indirectly, any of this
 * software or system incorporating such software without first obtaining any
 * required license or other approval from the U. S. Department of Commerce or
 * any other agency or department of the United States Government.  In the
 * event Licensee exports any such software from the United States or
 * re-exports any such software from a foreign destination, Licensee shall
 * ensure that the distribution and export/re-export of the software is in
 * compliance with all laws, regulations, orders, or other restrictions of the
 * U.S. Export Administration Regulations. Licensee agrees that neither it nor
 * any of its subsidiaries will export/re-export any technical data, process,
 * software, or service, directly or indirectly, to any country for which the
 * United States government or any agency thereof requires an export license,
 * other governmental approval, or letter of assurance, without first obtaining
 * such license, approval or letter.

So, is such approval on file with the FreeBSD Foundation?

-- 
Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
 http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
Smalltalk/Perl/Unix consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
See http://methodsandmessages.posterous.com/ for Smalltalk discussion
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software to SEND log files only?

[Polytropon]

On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 06:33:20 +0100, Bruce Cran  wrote:
> Most mail servers will block sendmail's connections from a dynamic IP:
> the advantage to ssmtp is that it forwards mail to the ISP's server.

That's sadly true (mostly because of the amounts of spam produced
by ordinary PCs on dynamic IPs). But sendmail has a fine solution
for that, erm, problem:

define(`SMART_HOST', `mx.foo.bar')

It's often useful to have the ISP's MX handle that problem, as it
usually has a static IP and is "widely accepted". :-)

This workaround makes it possible again to use basic techniques of
communications that were common in "the good days", as it should
be. This way plain sendmail can be used. Maybe masquerading envelope
is also needed, but I'm not entirely sure.


-- 
Polytropon
Magdeburg, Germany
Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software to SEND log files only?

[Robert Bonomi]

> From owner-freebsd-questi...@freebsd.org  Wed Sep 22 00:32:52 2010
> Date: Wed, 22 Sep 2010 06:33:20 +0100
> From: Bruce Cran 
> To: Adam Vande More 
> Cc: Ed Flecko , freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
> Subject: Re: Software to SEND log files only?
>
> On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 15:16:35 -0500
> Adam Vande More  wrote:
>
> > That's pretty silly article if you ask me, sendmail is setup to that
> > by default.
> > 
> > just add something like this to cron:
> > 
> > uuencode /path/to/logfile logfile | mail -s "logfile"
> > yourem...@example.com
>
> Most mail servers will block sendmail's connections from a dynamic IP:
> the advantage to ssmtp is that it forwards mail to the ISP's server.

*ONE* line in the sendmail config file ("smarthost"), and sendmail does
the same thing.  



___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Mailing list software recommendations

[Julian H. Stacey]

> > I'm thinking about installing either ezmlm or mailman.
> > 
> > I'm not against others; thoughts?

To quote my:
http://berklix.com/~jhs/src/bsd/fixes/FreeBSD/ports/gen/mail/mailman/files/
  "An agressive 5 minute killer python loop in /var/cron/tanbs/mailman
  has been killing my hosts for 5 years"

I dont know if they fixed it.
What worried me was what else might be sloppy & dangerous,
& I didnt have time/ enthusiasm to do a code read through.

One day, if when & after mailman has a code read through to confirm
it has no more killer loops, I'd like to find time for a 2nd stab
to convert all my lists on majord...@berklix.org to mailman.

Cheers,
Julian
-- 
Julian Stacey: BSD Unix Linux C Sys Eng Consultants Munich http://berklix.com
Munich 18th Sept  Free Software, Lectures & Installs  http://berklix.org/sdf/
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Mailing list software recommendations

[Jerry]

On Tue, 21 Sep 2010 23:34:15 -0500
Ryan Coleman  articulated:

> I'm thinking about installing either ezmlm or mailman.
> 
> I'm not against others; thoughts?

DADA Mail,  is an excellent program. It is
not in the ports system although it is on my list of things to do
eventually.

-- 
Jerry ✌
freebsd.u...@seibercom.net

Disclaimer: off-list followups get on-list replies or get ignored.
Please do not ignore the Reply-To header.
__
Zymurgy's Law of Volunteer Labor:
People are always available for work in the past tense.
___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: Software to SEND log files only?

[Bas Smeelen]

On 09/21/2010 10:17 PM, Len Conrad wrote:
> -- Original Message --
> From: Ed Flecko 
> Date:  Tue, 21 Sep 2010 12:56:13 -0700
>
>   
>> According to the FreeBSD website
>> (http://www.freebsd.org/doc/handbook/outgoing-only.html), the easiest
>> way to send mail only is to install the mail/ssmtp port.
>>
>> Does anyone have an example of a script or other method (maybe a cron
>> script?) that would e-mail my log files to me daily?
>> 
> log files can be (too) huge as smtp DATA.  
>
> I zip mine and use the mpack port to send the .zip file as MIME attachment.
>
> Len
You could install the logrotate port /usr/ports/sysutils/logrotate and
switch the logfiles you want to this instead of newsyslog

For webserver error logs I use something like this scripts which runs
from cron
#!/bin/sh

cd /home/www

LOGFILES=`ls */logfiles/errorlog.txt`

for i in $LOGFILES
do
if [ -s $i ]
then
tail -r -n 100 $i |mail -s $i 
fi
done




DISCLAIMER: This e-mail is for the intended recipient(s) only. Access, 
disclosure, copying,
distribution or reliance on any of it by anyone else is prohibited. If you have 
received it
by mistake please let us know by reply and then delete it from your system.

___
freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"