Re: [FRIAM] on the obustness of globalism

[Marcus Daniels]

Find a conflict-of-interest or a way to profit from government regulation, and 
you’ll find a way to predict the Trump administration.   Remember this?

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/startup-aims-skirt-visa-limits-cruise-ship-foreign/story?id=18958353

From: Friam [mailto:friam-boun...@redfish.com] On Behalf Of Alfredo Covaleda 
Vélez
Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2017 6:07 PM
To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group 
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] on the obustness of globalism

Looking at PISA results, you can see that most of today's talented boys were 
born and are growing outside USA. Your current government is closing doors to 
everybody, included talented ones, while your teenager's results in Maths and 
Science and Comprehensive Reading in PISA tests are pitiful considering who you 
are. For sure, your local talent will not be enough to maintain leadership in 
new knowledge and innovation.  I guess, that 's the risk for your future.

On Wed, Feb 1, 2017 at 4:50 PM, glen ☣ 
> wrote:

Open thread for mathematicians on the immigration executive order
Terance Tao

> Even if the order was withdrawn immediately, there is no longer an assurance, 
> even for nationals not initially impacted by that order, that some similar 
> abrupt and major change in the rules for entry to the United States could not 
> occur, for instance for a visitor who has already gone through the lengthy 
> visa application process and background checks, secured the appropriate visa, 
> and is already in flight to the country.  This is already affecting upcoming 
> or ongoing mathematical conferences or programs in the US, with many 
> international speakers (including those from countries not directly affected 
> by the order) now cancelling their visit, either in protest or in concern 
> about their ability to freely enter and leave the country.


--
☣ glen


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Re: [FRIAM] on the obustness of globalism

[Alfredo Covaleda Vélez]

Looking at PISA results, you can see that most of today's talented boys
were born and are growing outside USA. Your current government is closing
doors to everybody, included talented ones, while your teenager's results
in Maths and Science and Comprehensive Reading in PISA tests are pitiful
considering who you are. For sure, your local talent will not be enough to
maintain leadership in new knowledge and innovation.  I guess, that 's the
risk for your future.

On Wed, Feb 1, 2017 at 4:50 PM, glen ☣  wrote:

>
> Open thread for mathematicians on the immigration executive order
> Terance Tao
>
> > Even if the order was withdrawn immediately, there is no longer an
> assurance, even for nationals not initially impacted by that order, that
> some similar abrupt and major change in the rules for entry to the United
> States could not occur, for instance for a visitor who has already gone
> through the lengthy visa application process and background checks, secured
> the appropriate visa, and is already in flight to the country.  This is
> already affecting upcoming or ongoing mathematical conferences or programs
> in the US, with many international speakers (including those from countries
> not directly affected by the order) now cancelling their visit, either in
> protest or in concern about their ability to freely enter and leave the
> country.
>
>
> --
> ☣ glen
>
> 
> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
> to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com
> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove

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Re: [FRIAM] on the obustness of globalism

[Robert J. Cordingley]

"When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and 
carrying a cross." - possibly paraphrased from a 1935 Sinclair Lewis novel.



On 2/2/17 11:23 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote:


*“*Where are our shared values?”

Once imposed, they will be our shared values.

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/317542-trump-vows-to-destroy-the-johnson-amendment




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--
Cirrillian
Web Design & Development
Santa Fe, NM
http://cirrillian.com
281-989-6272 (cell)
Member Design Corps of Santa Fe


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[FRIAM] Brave (was The year ahead)

[glen ☣]

On 01/09/2017 02:57 PM, Owen Densmore wrote:
> If you try it, let us know how it goes.

I don't intend to use Brave for now.  I'm fairly committed to Firefox.  But 
here's an interesting example of payments made by some arbitrary person on 
Twitter:

  https://twitter.com/bcrypt/status/827237286773264384

-- 
☣ glen


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Re: [FRIAM] on the obustness of globalism

[Marcus Daniels]

“Where are our shared values?”

Once imposed, they will be our shared values.

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/317542-trump-vows-to-destroy-the-johnson-amendment



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Re: [FRIAM] on the obustness of globalism

[Joshua Thorp]

Interesting article regarding making an argument based on the values of
your opposition instead of your own.  Makes sense but as is pointed out so
hard to follow through on because why argue if not because of your own
values?  Where are our shared values?   Are these the ones at the bottom
center of the canoe?

https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2017/02/the-simple-psychological-trick-to-political-persuasion/515181/?utm_source=atlfb

On Thu, Feb 2, 2017 at 10:53 AM, glen ☣  wrote:

> On 02/02/2017 08:49 AM, Owen Densmore wrote:
> > when do you know something like that is fully baked.
>
> Well, we know the answer to that is "never".  We only need it to be baked
> enough for some use case.  If your use case is to trick someone into
> thinking something that's false, then the baking need only go so far as
> Gary's point, to satisfy the need for drama.  This is why avid readers
> insist that books engage your imagination more than TV or movies.  It's a
> blessing and a curse that our minds fill in the blanks for us.
>
>   http://www.brainhq.com/brain-resources/brain-teasers/scrambled-text
>
> --
> ☣ glen
>
> 
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> to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com
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>

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Re: [FRIAM] on the obustness of globalism

[glen ☣]

On 02/02/2017 08:49 AM, Owen Densmore wrote:
> when do you know something like that is fully baked.

Well, we know the answer to that is "never".  We only need it to be baked 
enough for some use case.  If your use case is to trick someone into thinking 
something that's false, then the baking need only go so far as Gary's point, to 
satisfy the need for drama.  This is why avid readers insist that books engage 
your imagination more than TV or movies.  It's a blessing and a curse that our 
minds fill in the blanks for us.

  http://www.brainhq.com/brain-resources/brain-teasers/scrambled-text

-- 
☣ glen


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Re: [FRIAM] on the obustness of globalism

[Owen Densmore]

Yup:

*POSTED:*JAN 31 2017 05:33PM EST

*UPDATED:*FEB 02 2017 09:38AM EST

On Thu, Feb 2, 2017 at 9:49 AM, Owen Densmore  wrote:

> Roger: thanks for catching that. It was added after I saw the tweet and
> the article. At least the False News was avoided, but sheesh, when do you
> know something like that is fully baked.
>
>-- Owen
>
> On Thu, Feb 2, 2017 at 9:45 AM, Marcus Daniels 
> wrote:
>
>> Steve writes:
>>
>>
>> "I just hope he manages to do it without snapping off the masts and the
>> wheelhouse, and then careens overboard before he sinks the entire ship,
>> rats and all.  Maybe there IS an awesome, high-tech ship-of-state or
>> ship-of-society just over the horizon or beyond the fog of culture-wars
>> ready to sweep us up and jet us off into some unspecified utopian future,
>> but I'm not seeing it."
>>
>>
>> I mean:  All they know is their canoe, and somehow even though they see
>> all these other kinds of boats on the river, they can't imagine anything
>> but huddling in the center of their little canoe in the wind and rain.
>> Fellow canoers, let us build vessels with shelter!   No, you say?
>>
>>
>> At some point some subset will build those vessels, but they'll call them
>> arks.
>>
>>
>> Marcus
>> --
>> *From:* Friam  on behalf of Steven A Smith <
>> sasm...@swcp.com>
>> *Sent:* Thursday, February 2, 2017 9:09:41 AM
>> *To:* The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group
>> *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] on the obustness of globalism
>>
>>
>> Steve writes:
>>
>>
>>
>> "I learned early in life that if a canoe is tipping to one side, you
>> don't lean out the other, you drop to the bottom center, lower your center
>> of gravity.   Why is that so hard in sociopolitical contexts?  Unless you
>> want to tip into the drink!”
>>
>>
>>
>> Except that if we tip it over, we can swim over to that jet boat that is
>> a hundred meters away.   (See the thread on the 10 meter diving platform.)
>>
>> I think I get that part I grew up with a fascination with
>> post-apocalyptic worlds and sci-fi themes of transcendence.  I still have a
>> soft spot for it.  We have in our local circle (but surely not on this
>> list) a near-inner circle Singularian, the futurist/author Steven Kotler:
>> http://diamandis.com/abundance
>>
>> I put more stock in complexity thinking than exponential thinking.
>>
>> Your logic is the only hope I hold out for this Trumpian regime.  He is a
>> loose cannon who is in the process of clearing the deck of our ship of
>> state.  I just hope he manages to do it without snapping off the masts and
>> the wheelhouse, and then careens overboard before he sinks the entire ship,
>> rats and all.  Maybe there IS an awesome, high-tech ship-of-state or
>> ship-of-society just over the horizon or beyond the fog of culture-wars
>> ready to sweep us up and jet us off into some unspecified utopian future,
>> but I'm not seeing it.
>>
>> I also outgrew utopian fantasies when I realized they were a thin
>> disguise for a dystopia.   I'm still fascinated with the dual of
>> utopia/dystopia, but I'm not easily taken in by the idea that when you
>> can't react fast enough *already* to the things appearing on the road in
>> your headlights, that you should just *drive faster*.
>>
>> - Steve
>>
>>
>>
>> Marcus
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
>> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
>> to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com
>> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
>> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
>> to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com
>> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove
>>
>
>

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Re: [FRIAM] on the obustness of globalism

[Owen Densmore]

Roger: thanks for catching that. It was added after I saw the tweet and the
article. At least the False News was avoided, but sheesh, when do you know
something like that is fully baked.

   -- Owen

On Thu, Feb 2, 2017 at 9:45 AM, Marcus Daniels  wrote:

> Steve writes:
>
>
> "I just hope he manages to do it without snapping off the masts and the
> wheelhouse, and then careens overboard before he sinks the entire ship,
> rats and all.  Maybe there IS an awesome, high-tech ship-of-state or
> ship-of-society just over the horizon or beyond the fog of culture-wars
> ready to sweep us up and jet us off into some unspecified utopian future,
> but I'm not seeing it."
>
>
> I mean:  All they know is their canoe, and somehow even though they see
> all these other kinds of boats on the river, they can't imagine anything
> but huddling in the center of their little canoe in the wind and rain.
> Fellow canoers, let us build vessels with shelter!   No, you say?
>
>
> At some point some subset will build those vessels, but they'll call them
> arks.
>
>
> Marcus
> --
> *From:* Friam  on behalf of Steven A Smith <
> sasm...@swcp.com>
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 2, 2017 9:09:41 AM
> *To:* The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group
> *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] on the obustness of globalism
>
>
> Steve writes:
>
>
>
> "I learned early in life that if a canoe is tipping to one side, you
> don't lean out the other, you drop to the bottom center, lower your center
> of gravity.   Why is that so hard in sociopolitical contexts?  Unless you
> want to tip into the drink!”
>
>
>
> Except that if we tip it over, we can swim over to that jet boat that is a
> hundred meters away.   (See the thread on the 10 meter diving platform.)
>
> I think I get that part I grew up with a fascination with
> post-apocalyptic worlds and sci-fi themes of transcendence.  I still have a
> soft spot for it.  We have in our local circle (but surely not on this
> list) a near-inner circle Singularian, the futurist/author Steven Kotler:
> http://diamandis.com/abundance
>
> I put more stock in complexity thinking than exponential thinking.
>
> Your logic is the only hope I hold out for this Trumpian regime.  He is a
> loose cannon who is in the process of clearing the deck of our ship of
> state.  I just hope he manages to do it without snapping off the masts and
> the wheelhouse, and then careens overboard before he sinks the entire ship,
> rats and all.  Maybe there IS an awesome, high-tech ship-of-state or
> ship-of-society just over the horizon or beyond the fog of culture-wars
> ready to sweep us up and jet us off into some unspecified utopian future,
> but I'm not seeing it.
>
> I also outgrew utopian fantasies when I realized they were a thin disguise
> for a dystopia.   I'm still fascinated with the dual of utopia/dystopia,
> but I'm not easily taken in by the idea that when you can't react fast
> enough *already* to the things appearing on the road in your headlights,
> that you should just *drive faster*.
>
> - Steve
>
>
>
> Marcus
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
> to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com
> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove
>
>
>
> 
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> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
> to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com
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>

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Re: [FRIAM] on the obustness of globalism

[Marcus Daniels]

Steve writes:


"I just hope he manages to do it without snapping off the masts and the 
wheelhouse, and then careens overboard before he sinks the entire ship, rats 
and all.  Maybe there IS an awesome, high-tech ship-of-state or ship-of-society 
just over the horizon or beyond the fog of culture-wars ready to sweep us up 
and jet us off into some unspecified utopian future, but I'm not seeing it."


I mean:  All they know is their canoe, and somehow even though they see all 
these other kinds of boats on the river, they can't imagine anything but 
huddling in the center of their little canoe in the wind and rain.  Fellow 
canoers, let us build vessels with shelter!   No, you say?


At some point some subset will build those vessels, but they'll call them arks.


Marcus


From: Friam  on behalf of Steven A Smith 

Sent: Thursday, February 2, 2017 9:09:41 AM
To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] on the obustness of globalism


Steve writes:

"I learned early in life that if a canoe is tipping to one side, you don't lean 
out the other, you drop to the bottom center, lower your center of gravity.   
Why is that so hard in sociopolitical contexts?  Unless you want to tip into 
the drink!”

Except that if we tip it over, we can swim over to that jet boat that is a 
hundred meters away.   (See the thread on the 10 meter diving platform.)
I think I get that part I grew up with a fascination with post-apocalyptic 
worlds and sci-fi themes of transcendence.  I still have a soft spot for it.  
We have in our local circle (but surely not on this list) a near-inner circle 
Singularian, the futurist/author Steven Kotler: http://diamandis.com/abundance

I put more stock in complexity thinking than exponential thinking.

Your logic is the only hope I hold out for this Trumpian regime.  He is a loose 
cannon who is in the process of clearing the deck of our ship of state.  I just 
hope he manages to do it without snapping off the masts and the wheelhouse, and 
then careens overboard before he sinks the entire ship, rats and all.  Maybe 
there IS an awesome, high-tech ship-of-state or ship-of-society just over the 
horizon or beyond the fog of culture-wars ready to sweep us up and jet us off 
into some unspecified utopian future, but I'm not seeing it.

I also outgrew utopian fantasies when I realized they were a thin disguise for 
a dystopia.   I'm still fascinated with the dual of utopia/dystopia, but I'm 
not easily taken in by the idea that when you can't react fast enough *already* 
to the things appearing on the road in your headlights, that you should just 
*drive faster*.

- Steve

Marcus






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Re: [FRIAM] on the obustness of globalism

[Steven A Smith]

Steve writes:

"I learned early in life that if a canoe is tipping to one side, you 
don't lean out the other, you drop to the bottom center, lower your 
center of gravity.   Why is that so hard in sociopolitical contexts?  
Unless you want to tip into the drink!”


Except that if we tip it over, we can swim over to that jet boat that 
is a hundred meters away.   (See the thread on the 10 meter diving 
platform.)


I think I get that part I grew up with a fascination with 
post-apocalyptic worlds and sci-fi themes of transcendence.  I still 
have a soft spot for it.  We have in our local circle (but surely not on 
this list) a near-inner circle Singularian, the futurist/author Steven 
Kotler: http://diamandis.com/abundance


I put more stock in complexity thinking than exponential thinking.

Your logic is the only hope I hold out for this Trumpian regime.  He is 
a loose cannon who is in the process of clearing the deck of our ship of 
state.  I just hope he manages to do it without snapping off the masts 
and the wheelhouse, and then careens overboard before he sinks the 
entire ship, rats and all.  Maybe there IS an awesome, high-tech 
ship-of-state or ship-of-society just over the horizon or beyond the fog 
of culture-wars ready to sweep us up and jet us off into some 
unspecified utopian future, but I'm not seeing it.


I also outgrew utopian fantasies when I realized they were a thin 
disguise for a dystopia.   I'm still fascinated with the dual of 
utopia/dystopia, but I'm not easily taken in by the idea that when you 
can't react fast enough *already* to the things appearing on the road in 
your headlights, that you should just *drive faster*.


- Steve


Marcus




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Re: [FRIAM] on the obustness of globalism

[Marcus Daniels]

Steve writes:

"I learned early in life that if a canoe is tipping to one side, you don't lean 
out the other, you drop to the bottom center, lower your center of gravity.   
Why is that so hard in sociopolitical contexts?  Unless you want to tip into 
the drink!”

Except that if we tip it over, we can swim over to that jet boat that is a 
hundred meters away.   (See the thread on the 10 meter diving platform.)

Marcus



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Re: [FRIAM] on the obustness of globalism

[Steven A Smith]

Homo sapiens dramaticus

And we *wonder* at why we live in such a polarized society?

I learned early in life that if a canoe is tipping to one side, you 
don't lean out the other, you drop to the bottom center, lower your 
center of gravity.   Why is that so hard in sociopolitical contexts?  
Unless you want to tip into the drink!


The point of paddling a canoe is to explore and enjoy the world, so you 
don't want to spend it huddled in the bottom.  I suppose the 
sociopolitical equivalent is maintaining a moderate/centrist stance on 
*everything*.


Maybe it is a bad metaphor.



On Thu, Feb 2, 2017 at 8:53 AM, Steven A Smith > wrote:


REC -

Why do "we" do this?   I mean the part about stretching the truth
to support our point, only to undermine our point?

I don't have any trouble extrapolating from THIS story that the
ban and attendant delays *could have* caused the death in the way
implied, but that isn't the same and just feeds the whole "culture
of fake news".

I don't know how many of my anti-Trumpian friends have reported
things to me that sounded outrageous, only to follow it up and
discover that while there was a grain of truth in it, what they
reported was some kind of distortion that undermined *their*
credibility more than it undermined the position of their opposition?

- SAS


On 2/2/17 1:55 AM, Roger Critchlow wrote:

If you read the linked article, you'll see that this Mom died
several days before the executive order was signed.

-- rec --

On Wed, Feb 1, 2017 at 10:44 PM, Owen Densmore
> wrote:

We just got a lot dumber.

(Terence Tao? Wow! Didn't know many of us followed him.
Fascinating guy.)​

Sadly, the ban has now killed someone:
Inline image 1
http://www.fox2detroit.com/news/local-news/232856168-story


On Wed, Feb 1, 2017 at 2:50 PM, glen ☣ > wrote:


Open thread for mathematicians on the immigration
executive order
Terance Tao

> Even if the order was withdrawn immediately, there is
no longer an assurance, even for nationals not initially
impacted by that order, that some similar abrupt and
major change in the rules for entry to the United States
could not occur, for instance for a visitor who has
already gone through the lengthy visa application process
and background checks, secured the appropriate visa, and
is already in flight to the country.  This is already
affecting upcoming or ongoing mathematical conferences or
programs in the US, with many international speakers
(including those from countries not directly affected by
the order) now cancelling their visit, either in protest
or in concern about their ability to freely enter and
leave the country.


--
☣ glen


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FRIAM-COMIChttp://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ 
  by Dr. Strangelove

 FRIAM
Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe
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FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/
 by Dr. Strangelove 

Re: [FRIAM] on the obustness of globalism

[Gary Schiltz]

Homo sapiens dramaticus

On Thu, Feb 2, 2017 at 8:53 AM, Steven A Smith  wrote:

> REC -
>
> Why do "we" do this?   I mean the part about stretching the truth to
> support our point, only to undermine our point?
>
> I don't have any trouble extrapolating from THIS story that the ban and
> attendant delays *could have* caused the death in the way implied, but that
> isn't the same and just feeds the whole "culture of fake news".
>
> I don't know how many of my anti-Trumpian friends have reported things to
> me that sounded outrageous, only to follow it up and discover that while
> there was a grain of truth in it, what they reported was some kind of
> distortion that undermined *their* credibility more than it undermined the
> position of their opposition?
>
> - SAS
>
> On 2/2/17 1:55 AM, Roger Critchlow wrote:
>
> If you read the linked article, you'll see that this Mom died several days
> before the executive order was signed.
>
> -- rec --
>
> On Wed, Feb 1, 2017 at 10:44 PM, Owen Densmore 
> wrote:
>
>> We just got a lot dumber.
>>
>> (Terence Tao? Wow! Didn't know many of us followed him. Fascinating guy.)​
>>
>> Sadly, the ban has now killed someone:
>> [image: Inline image 1]
>> http://www.fox2detroit.com/news/local-news/232856168-story
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 1, 2017 at 2:50 PM, glen ☣  wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Open thread for mathematicians on the immigration executive order
>>> Terance Tao
>>>
>>> > Even if the order was withdrawn immediately, there is no longer an
>>> assurance, even for nationals not initially impacted by that order, that
>>> some similar abrupt and major change in the rules for entry to the United
>>> States could not occur, for instance for a visitor who has already gone
>>> through the lengthy visa application process and background checks, secured
>>> the appropriate visa, and is already in flight to the country.  This is
>>> already affecting upcoming or ongoing mathematical conferences or programs
>>> in the US, with many international speakers (including those from countries
>>> not directly affected by the order) now cancelling their visit, either in
>>> protest or in concern about their ability to freely enter and leave the
>>> country.
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> ☣ glen
>>>
>>> 
>>> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
>>> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
>>> to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com
>>> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
>> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
>> to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com
>> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove
>>
>
>
>
> 
> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
> to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com
> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove
>
>
>
> 
> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
> to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com
> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove
>

FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
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FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove

Re: [FRIAM] on the obustness of globalism

[Steven A Smith]

REC -

Why do "we" do this?   I mean the part about stretching the truth to 
support our point, only to undermine our point?


I don't have any trouble extrapolating from THIS story that the ban and 
attendant delays *could have* caused the death in the way implied, but 
that isn't the same and just feeds the whole "culture of fake news".


I don't know how many of my anti-Trumpian friends have reported things 
to me that sounded outrageous, only to follow it up and discover that 
while there was a grain of truth in it, what they reported was some kind 
of distortion that undermined *their* credibility more than it 
undermined the position of their opposition?


- SAS


On 2/2/17 1:55 AM, Roger Critchlow wrote:
If you read the linked article, you'll see that this Mom died several 
days before the executive order was signed.


-- rec --

On Wed, Feb 1, 2017 at 10:44 PM, Owen Densmore > wrote:


We just got a lot dumber.

(Terence Tao? Wow! Didn't know many of us followed him.
Fascinating guy.)​

Sadly, the ban has now killed someone:
Inline image 1
http://www.fox2detroit.com/news/local-news/232856168-story


On Wed, Feb 1, 2017 at 2:50 PM, glen ☣ > wrote:


Open thread for mathematicians on the immigration executive order
Terance Tao

> Even if the order was withdrawn immediately, there is no
longer an assurance, even for nationals not initially impacted
by that order, that some similar abrupt and major change in
the rules for entry to the United States could not occur, for
instance for a visitor who has already gone through the
lengthy visa application process and background checks,
secured the appropriate visa, and is already in flight to the
country. This is already affecting upcoming or ongoing
mathematical conferences or programs in the US, with many
international speakers (including those from countries not
directly affected by the order) now cancelling their visit,
either in protest or in concern about their ability to freely
enter and leave the country.


--
☣ glen


FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
to unsubscribe
http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com

FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/
 by Dr. Strangelove




FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
to unsubscribe
http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com

FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/
 by Dr. Strangelove





FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com
FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove



FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com
FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove

Re: [FRIAM] on the obustness of globalism

[Roger Critchlow]

If you read the linked article, you'll see that this Mom died several days
before the executive order was signed.

-- rec --

On Wed, Feb 1, 2017 at 10:44 PM, Owen Densmore  wrote:

> We just got a lot dumber.
>
> (Terence Tao? Wow! Didn't know many of us followed him. Fascinating guy.)​
>
> Sadly, the ban has now killed someone:
> [image: Inline image 1]
> http://www.fox2detroit.com/news/local-news/232856168-story
>
> On Wed, Feb 1, 2017 at 2:50 PM, glen ☣  wrote:
>
>>
>> Open thread for mathematicians on the immigration executive order
>> Terance Tao
>>
>> > Even if the order was withdrawn immediately, there is no longer an
>> assurance, even for nationals not initially impacted by that order, that
>> some similar abrupt and major change in the rules for entry to the United
>> States could not occur, for instance for a visitor who has already gone
>> through the lengthy visa application process and background checks, secured
>> the appropriate visa, and is already in flight to the country.  This is
>> already affecting upcoming or ongoing mathematical conferences or programs
>> in the US, with many international speakers (including those from countries
>> not directly affected by the order) now cancelling their visit, either in
>> protest or in concern about their ability to freely enter and leave the
>> country.
>>
>>
>> --
>> ☣ glen
>>
>> 
>> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
>> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
>> to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com
>> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove
>
>
>
> 
> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
> to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com
> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove
>

FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com
FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove