[FRIAM] Memetic Drift in Threads, was: off topic....., but still

2011-05-04 Thread Steve Smith
On reflection of Owen's thread hygiene around hijacking, etc., I have to 
wonder about the implications of  what I want to call memetic drift.   
We start with a topic, and at some point it has wandered enough to 
qualify for a new subject... but it is not always obvious when it 
deserved a new Subject: line.


I believe I am as guilty as most for this form of slow hijacking... the 
vehicle (thread) is not abruptly taken by force and driven off in some 
totally different direction than it's original route plan suggested, 
instead it is seduced iteratively into taking us to Havana.


To stretch the metaphor from hijacking to kidnapping, are we all the 
Patty Hearsts of our own discussions?


- Steve


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Re: [FRIAM] Memetic Drift in Threads, was: off topic....., but still

2011-05-04 Thread Vladimyr Burachynsky
Very sly you are Steve Smith,

The topic with no Name has been an ever present part of the group
discussions. It drifts because we have never nailed it to the wall. There is
a propensity to organize and control discussions. The nameless issues are
like flies in our face.
We try so hard to shoo them away but they leave us all a little silly
looking . The fly keeps showing up right in the middle of our brows.

The nameless issue seems to be Human Nature and it is uncomfortably not what
we generally assumed from idealistic perspectives. Often we drift directly
into this area as a result of some calamitous world wide affair.
All of us are showing surprise at the unpredictable recklessness of our
global society.  Perhaps clutching to the grail of Complexity is a feeble
notion. I admit I am awestruck with the bizarre events of recent months,
seemingly errant events recurring in greater and greater frequency. These
events seem every few days to imply we really have very little understanding
of what is going on around us. In retrospect each event was predictable yet
we are clearly unable to see the real world beyond the reflection of our own
internal fictions.   

Our brains like most people are handicapped in some way by short cuts in
design. We know there is a world or reality beyond ours but rarely take it
into consideration. WE get trapped into deviously designed narratives and
have to wait for the penultimate chapter to find the hidden passage way
behind the fireplace. The last chapter simply reconstructs all the missing
bits which we never noticed. We all end up happier with a clean story line
that appears self consistent. Unfortunately the desire for a clean story
line is the problem with us. Every story demands one topic, one problem, one
hero, one villain. The real world is obviously not structured around our
prejudices yet we persist in making it so. ( I read Herodotus and laugh at
his explanations of the world. He was a charmer I love his style. No one
would dare today write ceaselessly with no plot. But maybe that is what is
what I relish. He did not really care himself for the nonsense explanations
and showed his dismissal ) Perhaps the writer is our God and he will show us
the Truth if we listen closely. The Logos, the Word the hand of God may be
nothing more than explanations externalized for  intrinsic defects in human
brains. The Dogma professed to allay our questions and let us live in peace
but it never worked as well as hoped. Reality kept showing up as a nameless
annoying fly. 

We always assume there must be a category and that there must be a plot and
some obvious truth. Well maybe that is just our addiction to narrative
styles. 

Complexity is part of the future , but by itself at best it can display some
shadows of reality. Most of our difficulties seem to me to be the
peculiarities of human intelligence. I personally do not actually have any
more faith in it now than God, the Soul, Good or Evil or economic reform. I
believe that we are so facile creating illusions we can no longer
distinguish truth from fiction.  I have a bone to pick with the equivalence
of narratives. It plays well with people who have nothing of substance to
offer but more fears and economic opportunities. Besides I am not the only
one to notice each new revolution seems to be a conflict of fictions, or
whether or not the young people are willing to endure the tyranny of an
older narrative. Perhaps the people have a shelf life for narratives, it
used to keep writers busy and paid.
Did the digital era start to disturb the functioning of traditional Human
delusions? Why is every new TV show a remake or mix up of older stories in
new fashions?

Steve there is no need to beat your chest in aguish that you feel you
violated some form of ethical guide line.

 When I used to go fishing I have often had to step  over a few old fence
lines. Being stuck on one side of the fence can be frustrating fishing or
with research. 

The fish seems to be Human Intelligence or the lack of it. The reason for
the lack seems awkward because most of us are a little embarrassed to admit
we ever were so easily duped. Now why is it that old men look backward and
start to feel ashamed at what they once loved so stridently. 

The truth upon reflection was always obvious so why did we choose to ignore
it. The Complexity Theory revelations or truths will also be easily ignored
until a catastrophe strikes. Then we go about the business of burying
bodies at sea for various reasons. Why is the truth so difficult to face.? I
suspect that once our brains are commited to a narrative we do not find it
easy to alter it substantially. Like a filing system we make small
alterations but big changes need a house fire or a computer melt down before
they are implemented.  More than filling in gaps we also seem to wilfully
ignore certain information to preserve the established narrative. This is
difficult to spot. Our brains seem to be wired for short cuts but