Re: [funsec] Don't mess with Canadians carrying sticks ...
If nothing else, remember that most of them have families that will grieve. Those politicians need to lose an election. Not a life. Can't agree more! Michael P. Blanchard Principal Security Engineer, CISSP, GCIH, CCSA-NGX, MCSE Cyber Security Services EMC ² Corporation 32 Coslin Drive Southboro, MA 01772 -Original Message- From: funsec [mailto:funsec-boun...@linuxbox.org] On Behalf Of valdis.kletni...@vt.edu Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2014 5:58 PM To: noloa...@gmail.com Cc: FunSec List; Rob Slade; infose...@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [funsec] Don't mess with Canadians carrying sticks ... On Wed, 22 Oct 2014 17:02:14 -0400, Jeffrey Walton said: Politicians are usually corrupt to the core. They are more than happy to take money and peddle influence. I'd much rather see a politician killed, and I'm not sure I would bestow honors on someone who stopped it... Would you bestow honors on the guys who stopped John Hinkly Jr before he managed to get another bullet into Reagan? How about if somebody had stopped Lee Harvey Oswald or the guys who shot Ghandi and Benazir Bhutto? Yes, many of them *are* corrupt, but jumping from there to Every single one of them is so corrupt that they don't deserve an attempt to stop an assassination shows something pretty sad about you. If nothing else, remember that most of them have families that will grieve. Those politicians need to lose an election. Not a life. ___ Fun and Misc security discussion for OT posts. https://linuxbox.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/funsec Note: funsec is a public and open mailing list.
Re: [funsec] Don't mess with Canadians carrying sticks ...
On Wed, 22 Oct 2014 21:36:16 -0400, Jeffrey Walton said: Given that some politicians are more dangerous than terrorist, and we kill terrorist, then what should be done with politicians who commit crimes against the democracy and the citizens? They should either lose elections, or they should end up in a criminal court and given a fair trial, no matter *how* big a scum they are. Saying that it's OK for random vigilantes to shoot at them means you've basically given up the idea of the rule of law. pgpdj2WiCxj_S.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Fun and Misc security discussion for OT posts. https://linuxbox.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/funsec Note: funsec is a public and open mailing list.
Re: [funsec] Don't mess with Canadians carrying sticks ...
On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 01:04:00PM -0400, valdis.kletni...@vt.edu wrote: Saying that it's OK for random vigilantes to shoot at them means you've basically given up the idea of the rule of law. Agreed. I think this is apropos: Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. --- Friedrich Nietzsche ---rsk ___ Fun and Misc security discussion for OT posts. https://linuxbox.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/funsec Note: funsec is a public and open mailing list.
Re: [funsec] Don't mess with Canadians carrying sticks ...
On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 1:04 PM, valdis.kletni...@vt.edu wrote: On Wed, 22 Oct 2014 21:36:16 -0400, Jeffrey Walton said: Given that some politicians are more dangerous than terrorist, and we kill terrorist, then what should be done with politicians who commit crimes against the democracy and the citizens? They should either lose elections, or they should end up in a criminal court and given a fair trial, no matter *how* big a scum they are. Saying that it's OK for random vigilantes to shoot at them means you've basically given up the idea of the rule of law. I think there's a critical flaw in your logic. I think its the difference between theory and practice. The rule of law applies to little folks like you and I; and does not appear to apply to the oligarchy. Until the law applies to everyone equally, I'm more than happy to find satisfaction in the vigilantes. Too big to jail FTW... Battle evil with a different kind of evil... ___ Fun and Misc security discussion for OT posts. https://linuxbox.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/funsec Note: funsec is a public and open mailing list.
[funsec] Don't mess with Canadians carrying sticks ...
http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/1034708-kevin-vickers-sergeant-at-arms- shoots-a-shooting-suspect-in-ottawa/ == (quote inserted randomly by Pegasus Mailer) rsl...@vcn.bc.ca sl...@victoria.tc.ca rsl...@computercrime.org Sometimes I think that the patron saint of lawyers ought to be Pontius Pilate, for surely he said it best: What is truth? - Sharyn McCrumb victoria.tc.ca/techrev/rms.htm http://www.infosecbc.org/links http://blogs.securiteam.com/index.php/archives/author/p1/ http://twitter.com/rslade ___ Fun and Misc security discussion for OT posts. https://linuxbox.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/funsec Note: funsec is a public and open mailing list.
Re: [funsec] Don't mess with Canadians carrying sticks ...
On Wed, Oct 22, 2014 at 4:19 PM, Rob, grandpa of Ryan, Trevor, Devon Hannah rmsl...@shaw.ca wrote: http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/1034708-kevin-vickers-sergeant-at-arms- shoots-a-shooting-suspect-in-ottawa/ Not sure about this quote from the article, though: Vickers is being described by many as a hero. Politicians are usually corrupt to the core. They are more than happy to take money and peddle influence. I'd much rather see a politician killed, and I'm not sure I would bestow honors on someone who stopped it... ___ Fun and Misc security discussion for OT posts. https://linuxbox.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/funsec Note: funsec is a public and open mailing list.
Re: [funsec] Don't mess with Canadians carrying sticks ...
On Wed, 22 Oct 2014 17:02:14 -0400, Jeffrey Walton said: Politicians are usually corrupt to the core. They are more than happy to take money and peddle influence. I'd much rather see a politician killed, and I'm not sure I would bestow honors on someone who stopped it... Would you bestow honors on the guys who stopped John Hinkly Jr before he managed to get another bullet into Reagan? How about if somebody had stopped Lee Harvey Oswald or the guys who shot Ghandi and Benazir Bhutto? Yes, many of them *are* corrupt, but jumping from there to Every single one of them is so corrupt that they don't deserve an attempt to stop an assassination shows something pretty sad about you. If nothing else, remember that most of them have families that will grieve. Those politicians need to lose an election. Not a life. pgp5HH0PnMLWi.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Fun and Misc security discussion for OT posts. https://linuxbox.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/funsec Note: funsec is a public and open mailing list.
Re: [funsec] Don't mess with Canadians carrying sticks ...
On Wed, Oct 22, 2014 at 5:57 PM, valdis.kletni...@vt.edu wrote: On Wed, 22 Oct 2014 17:02:14 -0400, Jeffrey Walton said: Politicians are usually corrupt to the core. They are more than happy to take money and peddle influence. I'd much rather see a politician killed, and I'm not sure I would bestow honors on someone who stopped it... Would you bestow honors on the guys who stopped John Hinkly Jr before he managed to get another bullet into Reagan? Reagan was not a good example. Six or so of his senior staff went to jail after his presidency for their crimes. The investigations stopped at Bush and Reagan (take a guess why...). Bin Laden and friends were Reagan's Freedom Fighters. They were well funded and well trained. We can thank Reagan and friends for the rise of the nice folks who are trying to kill us, and who we're trying to kill now. Oh, and Reagan was an illegal arms dealer. I still remember Iran Contragate. Hinckley did the right thing for the wrong reason. Hindsight being 20/20, the one bullet should have found its mark. * Yes, many of them *are* corrupt, but jumping from there to Every single one of them is so corrupt that they don't deserve an attempt to stop an assassination shows something pretty sad about you. Yes. I have no faith that the oligarchy can police itself. Their actions and crimes become more brazen over time. I'm more than happy to watch the vigilantes dispense justice. I actually take great pleasure in it. When I see a corrupt politician taken down, I say Awesome, that's one less we have to deal with. I'm glad I was around to see it. It really saddened me that Ted Kennedy lived so long. I wanted to see him go sooner. He was a murderer, a liar and a cheat. Its a shame justice never caught up with him. * If nothing else, remember that most of them have families that will grieve. Those politicians need to lose an election. Not a life. Its unfortunate for the families. But at least they lived through the event. You can look at it like collateral damage... Similar to the collateral damage in the middle east from the allies (Australia, Canada, New Zealand, the United Kingdom and the United States)? Remember, the allies are accidentally killing off entire families in pursuit of their targets. They have no reservation in razing an entire city block because a cell phone signals. Don't bother with details like [0]... In this perspective, a grieving politician's family pales in comparison. * Related: another great case study is William McKinley. Leon Czolgosz should be celebrated as a hero. Do you know why Czolgosz is a better choice? (It has to do with the Robber Barons buying the election, how the political machinery tried to tame Roosevelt, and the reforms that Roosevelt implemented after he assumed the office). Jeff [0] THE NSA’S SECRET ROLE IN THE U.S. ASSASSINATION PROGRAM, https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2014/02/10/the-nsas-secret-role/ ___ Fun and Misc security discussion for OT posts. https://linuxbox.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/funsec Note: funsec is a public and open mailing list.
Re: [funsec] Don't mess with Canadians carrying sticks ...
On Wed, Oct 22, 2014 at 5:57 PM, valdis.kletni...@vt.edu wrote: On Wed, 22 Oct 2014 17:02:14 -0400, Jeffrey Walton said: Politicians are usually corrupt to the core. They are more than happy to take money and peddle influence. I'd much rather see a politician killed, and I'm not sure I would bestow honors on someone who stopped it... Yes, many of them *are* corrupt, but jumping from there to Every single one of them is so corrupt that they don't deserve an attempt to stop an assassination shows something pretty sad about you. I should probably agree with you here. Not all of them deserve to be punished. I would shed a tear for ones with political courage. But they are very few and far between. Here's another way to look at the penalty, though: politicians and their friends commit crimes against the democracy and the people that would make Bin Laden green with envy. The breadth and depth of their crimes are unrivaled. Bin Laden himself could not pull off a crime that affected 330+ million Americans and tore at the fabric of the democracy. Given that some politicians are more dangerous than terrorist, and we kill terrorist, then what should be done with politicians who commit crimes against the democracy and the citizens? ___ Fun and Misc security discussion for OT posts. https://linuxbox.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/funsec Note: funsec is a public and open mailing list.
