Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
At 3:43 PM -0700 3/13/05, Bruce Johnson wrote: On Mar 13, 2005, at 3:11 PM, Clark Martin wrote: While I tend to believe he might not have said the line often attributed to him he did wax on about the 640K memory space. And after his testimony I would utterly discount any denials on his part. There is also the fact that NO ONE has ever been able to substantiate the statement, a puzzling thing because he's alleged to have said it in a print interview in 1981. You would think at least ONE person would have had the ability to do a quick Lexis search for the interview. Unless of course the statement was excised by a certain brand of operating system where ever it was found. -- Clark Martin Redwood City, CA, USA Macintosh / Internet Consulting I'm a designated driver on the Information Super Highway -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
On Mar 14, 2005, at 8:43 AM, Clark Martin wrote: Unless of course the statement was excised by a certain brand of operating system where ever it was found. That ascribes a level of competence to Windows that just isn't realistic. :-P -- Bruce Johnson University of Arizona College of Pha rmacy Information Technology Group Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
On Sun, 13 Mar 2005, Bruce Johnson wrote: On Mar 13, 2005, at 12:10 PM, Frank P. Eigler wrote: Nope, but it's 8 bit, I believe: 2^0 = 0; 2^1 = 2; etc Zeros are people, too! ;-) 2^0 is 1 not zero. Yeah, I caught it - *after* I hit the ente button. Late nights; early mornings... and now for all the world to see. Sigh... heh, but it sounded so good. LOL -- Non Illegitimi Carborundum -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
At 9:38 PM -0500 3/12/05, Laurent Daudelin wrote: In the protocol, they probably reserved 7 bits to represent the address, like 000. So, with 7 digits, if you try all combinations of 0s and 1s you can have, you will come to the total of 127 different combinations. Just to clarify the above, 2 to the 7th power equals 128 so you have that many possible combinations TOTAL. However, you have to subtract 1 for the host, which leaves 127 as the maximum number of devices. -- Sincerely, Dennis B. Swaney Windows is a command-line OS with a GUI shell while Mac System 10 is ... oh, never mind. -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
On Sat, 12 Mar 2005, Laurent Daudelin wrote: on 12/03/05 19:16, Zoltan Batiz at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 12, 2005, at 4:03 PM, Laurent Daudelin wrote: on 12/03/05 18:19, Zoltan Batiz at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [snip pondering usb limit of 127 being arbitrary] It's not an arbitrary number. It has to do with computer programming maths. For the same reason that memory comes in multiple of 64. 128, 256, 512, etc., and not 25, 50, 75. The root is the binary system that is the basic unit by which a computer can compute... -Laurent. -- Oh ok, so what you are saying is that nobody actually tried connecting 127 devices to their system. Someone just came up with the number due to a mathematical formula? No, I'm not saying that. What might have happened is, in the protocol, they identified some kind of ways to represent the unique address of a device on the bus. In other words, the USB protocol is made of a set of commands, which are basically a series of 0s and 1s. In the protocol, they probably reserved 7 bits to represent the address, like 000. So, with 7 digits, if you try all combinations of 0s and 1s you can have, you will come to the total of 127 different combinations. I'm not an electrical or hardware engineer, I'm a software engineer, and I think that's why they came up with 127. Now, if you ask me why they choose 7 bits, then I wouldn't know. Maybe some restrictions on the electrical side, or in the chip that sends and receives those bits and convert them, I really don't know... Now, does that make more sense or did I make everything worst? Nope, but it's 8 bit, I believe: 2^0 = 0; 2^1 = 2; etc Zeros are people, too! ;-) -- Non Illegitimi Carborundum -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
On Mar 13, 2005, at 12:10 PM, Frank P. Eigler wrote: Nope, but it's 8 bit, I believe: 2^0 = 0; 2^1 = 2; etc Zeros are people, too! ;-) 2^0 is 1 not zero. -- Bruce Johnson -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
on 13/03/05 16:37, Bruce Johnson at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 12, 2005, at 10:01 PM, Laurent Daudelin wrote: on 12/03/05 23:17, Jason at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ..and now I have 128 Megs on my keychainand It was I think Billy boy, but I cant be sure.. On Mar 12, 2005, at 19:32, Laurent Daudelin wrote: Yep, limits to be exceeded. Did anybody remember who said, a few years ago, that nobody would ever need more than 640KB in a computer? ;-) -Laurent. That was exactly him! Billy Boy! Whilst I'll join in the Gates-Bash any time happily, this is an urban legend..he never said any such thing. No one has ever been able to come up with a citation for this statement, and he has denied it repeatedly. http://tafkac.org/celebrities/bill.gates/gates_memory.html Of course he denies it, otherwise, that would just make him look dumber! -Laurent. -- Laurent Daudelin AIM/iChat: LaurentDaudelinhttp://nemesys.dyndns.org Logiciels Nemesys Software mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] card walloper n.: An EDP programmer who grinds out batch programs that do stupid things like print people's paychecks. Compare code grinder. See also punched card, eighty-column mind. -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
At 2:37 PM -0700 3/13/05, Bruce Johnson wrote: On Mar 12, 2005, at 10:01 PM, Laurent Daudelin wrote: on 12/03/05 23:17, Jason at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ..and now I have 128 Megs on my keychainand It was I think Billy boy, but I cant be sure.. On Mar 12, 2005, at 19:32, Laurent Daudelin wrote: Yep, limits to be exceeded. Did anybody remember who said, a few years ago, that nobody would ever need more than 640KB in a computer? ;-) -Laurent. That was exactly him! Billy Boy! Whilst I'll join in the Gates-Bash any time happily, this is an urban legend..he never said any such thing. No one has ever been able to come up with a citation for this statement, and he has denied it repeatedly. http://tafkac.org/celebrities/bill.gates/gates_memory.html -- Bruce Johnson While I tend to believe he might not have said the line often attributed to him he did wax on about the 640K memory space. And after his testimony I would utterly discount any denials on his part. There is also the fact that M$ products wouldn't work right in more than 1Mb of RAM because their development system could only handle 20bit addressing. That is they wouldn't work right until Apple jimmyied the system to only load M$ s/w in the first 1Mb. -- Clark Martin Redwood City, CA, USA Macintosh / Internet Consulting I'm a designated driver on the Information Super Highway -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
On Mar 13, 2005, at 3:11 PM, Clark Martin wrote: While I tend to believe he might not have said the line often attributed to him he did wax on about the 640K memory space. And after his testimony I would utterly discount any denials on his part. There is also the fact that NO ONE has ever been able to substantiate the statement, a puzzling thing because he's alleged to have said it in a print interview in 1981. You would think at least ONE person would have had the ability to do a quick Lexis search for the interview. -- Bruce Johnson -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Ok. . .USB thought. . .
OK, I know this thread isn't completely on topic of G-Books, but hey, I did start thinking of it while using my Pismo system so here we go: I was thinking the other day of the limits USB has, in the department of just how many devices can be connected to one USB port. According to the facts, the limit is 127 devices. Who, may I ask, actually came up with that number?! Did someone in their garage actually connect 128 devices only to discover that the 128th device didn't work, therefore coming up with the 127 number? Let's say that you used the Belkin 7 port hub to do this. In theory, you'd need 18 hubs, giving you 126 ports; still short by one port. That also means you'd need 18 plugs, assuming ALL 126 devices are bus powered. Are these numbers really just a marketing gimmick? Anyway, this is really just me thinking out loud and nobody has to respond, but I'm still wondering about the reality and practicality of these numbers. Food for Thought. . . Zoltan THE BLUETOOTH (and WiFi) MASTER -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
on 12/03/05 18:19, Zoltan Batiz at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: OK, I know this thread isn't completely on topic of G-Books, but hey, I did start thinking of it while using my Pismo system so here we go: I was thinking the other day of the limits USB has, in the department of just how many devices can be connected to one USB port. According to the facts, the limit is 127 devices. Who, may I ask, actually came up with that number?! Did someone in their garage actually connect 128 devices only to discover that the 128th device didn't work, therefore coming up with the 127 number? Let's say that you used the Belkin 7 port hub to do this. In theory, you'd need 18 hubs, giving you 126 ports; still short by one port. That also means you'd need 18 plugs, assuming ALL 126 devices are bus powered. Are these numbers really just a marketing gimmick? Anyway, this is really just me thinking out loud and nobody has to respond, but I'm still wondering about the reality and practicality of these numbers. Food for Thought. . . It's not an arbitrary number. It has to do with computer programming maths. For the same reason that memory comes in multiple of 64. 128, 256, 512, etc., and not 25, 50, 75. The root is the binary system that is the basic unit by which a computer can compute... -Laurent. -- Laurent Daudelin AIM/iChat: LaurentDaudelinhttp://nemesys.dyndns.org Logiciels Nemesys Software mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] GIGO /gi:'goh/ [acronym]: 1. `Garbage In, Garbage Out' -- usually said in response to lusers who complain that a program didn't do the right thing when given imperfect input or otherwise mistreated in some way. Also commonly used to describe failures in human decision making due to faulty, incomplete, or imprecise data. 2. `Garbage In, Gospel Out': this more recent expansion is a sardonic comment on the tendency human beings have to put excessive trust in `computerized' data. -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
On Mar 12, 2005, at 4:03 PM, Laurent Daudelin wrote: on 12/03/05 18:19, Zoltan Batiz at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: OK, I know this thread isn't completely on topic of G-Books, but hey, I did start thinking of it while using my Pismo system so here we go: I was thinking the other day of the limits USB has, in the department of just how many devices can be connected to one USB port. According to the facts, the limit is 127 devices. Who, may I ask, actually came up with that number?! Did someone in their garage actually connect 128 devices only to discover that the 128th device didn't work, therefore coming up with the 127 number? Let's say that you used the Belkin 7 port hub to do this. In theory, you'd need 18 hubs, giving you 126 ports; still short by one port. That also means you'd need 18 plugs, assuming ALL 126 devices are bus powered. Are these numbers really just a marketing gimmick? Anyway, this is really just me thinking out loud and nobody has to respond, but I'm still wondering about the reality and practicality of these numbers. Food for Thought. . . It's not an arbitrary number. It has to do with computer programming maths. For the same reason that memory comes in multiple of 64. 128, 256, 512, etc., and not 25, 50, 75. The root is the binary system that is the basic unit by which a computer can compute... -Laurent. -- Oh ok, so what you are saying is that nobody actually tried connecting 127 devices to their system. Someone just came up with the number due to a mathematical formula? -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
On 13 Mar 2005, at 11:16, Zoltan Batiz wrote: Oh ok, so what you are saying is that nobody actually tried connecting 127 devices to their system. Someone just came up with the number due to a mathematical formula? I'm no USB expert, but I strongly suspect the limitation comes from the way USB devices are addressed. Each device on the bus needs to have its own unique identifier, so that the host can exchange data with it. Due to whatever addressing scheme the designers of USB came up with, it's simply not possible to have more than 127 devices connected to a host at any given time. Cheers, Ben -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
on 12/03/05 19:16, Zoltan Batiz at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 12, 2005, at 4:03 PM, Laurent Daudelin wrote: on 12/03/05 18:19, Zoltan Batiz at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: OK, I know this thread isn't completely on topic of G-Books, but hey, I did start thinking of it while using my Pismo system so here we go: I was thinking the other day of the limits USB has, in the department of just how many devices can be connected to one USB port. According to the facts, the limit is 127 devices. Who, may I ask, actually came up with that number?! Did someone in their garage actually connect 128 devices only to discover that the 128th device didn't work, therefore coming up with the 127 number? Let's say that you used the Belkin 7 port hub to do this. In theory, you'd need 18 hubs, giving you 126 ports; still short by one port. That also means you'd need 18 plugs, assuming ALL 126 devices are bus powered. Are these numbers really just a marketing gimmick? Anyway, this is really just me thinking out loud and nobody has to respond, but I'm still wondering about the reality and practicality of these numbers. Food for Thought. . . It's not an arbitrary number. It has to do with computer programming maths. For the same reason that memory comes in multiple of 64. 128, 256, 512, etc., and not 25, 50, 75. The root is the binary system that is the basic unit by which a computer can compute... -Laurent. -- Oh ok, so what you are saying is that nobody actually tried connecting 127 devices to their system. Someone just came up with the number due to a mathematical formula? No, I'm not saying that. What might have happened is, in the protocol, they identified some kind of ways to represent the unique address of a device on the bus. In other words, the USB protocol is made of a set of commands, which are basically a series of 0s and 1s. In the protocol, they probably reserved 7 bits to represent the address, like 000. So, with 7 digits, if you try all combinations of 0s and 1s you can have, you will come to the total of 127 different combinations. I'm not an electrical or hardware engineer, I'm a software engineer, and I think that's why they came up with 127. Now, if you ask me why they choose 7 bits, then I wouldn't know. Maybe some restrictions on the electrical side, or in the chip that sends and receives those bits and convert them, I really don't know... Now, does that make more sense or did I make everything worst? -Laurent. -- Laurent Daudelin AIM/iChat: LaurentDaudelinhttp://nemesys.dyndns.org Logiciels Nemesys Software mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] code police n.: [by analogy with George Orwell's `thought police'] A mythical team of Gestapo-like storm troopers that might burst into one's office and arrest one for violating programming style rules. May be used either seriously, to underline a claim that a particular style violation is dangerous, or ironically, to suggest that the practice under discussion is condemned mainly by anal-retentive weenies. Dike out that goto or the code police will get you! The ironic usage is perhaps more common. -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
That is correct. USB uses 7-bit addressing = 128 devices, 1 of them is the computer = 127 devices. On 13/03/2005, at 13:07, Ben Dyer wrote: On 13 Mar 2005, at 11:16, Zoltan Batiz wrote: Oh ok, so what you are saying is that nobody actually tried connecting 127 devices to their system. Someone just came up with the number due to a mathematical formula? I'm no USB expert, but I strongly suspect the limitation comes from the way USB devices are addressed. Each device on the bus needs to have its own unique identifier, so that the host can exchange data with it. Due to whatever addressing scheme the designers of USB came up with, it's simply not possible to have more than 127 devices connected to a host at any given time. Cheers, Ben -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com --- -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
Oh ok, so what you are saying is that nobody actually tried connecting 127 devices to their system. Someone just came up with the number due to a mathematical formula? Right. Actually, the number of USB devices on a bus is 128 (one is reserved for the host leaving only 127 available for peripheral devices). IIRC, hubs also count as one device. Putting 127 devices on one bus would be insane... You'd have so much overhead and competing packets that your practical bandwidth would be too low to do anything. Peace, Drew -- Author of ClassicStumbler email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] web: http://www.alksoft.com/ Visit the PowerBook 5300 FAQ! http://www.alksoft.com/5300_FAQ/ -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
At 8:02 PM -0700 3/12/05, Andrew Kershaw wrote: Oh ok, so what you are saying is that nobody actually tried connecting 127 devices to their system. Someone just came up with the number due to a mathematical formula? Right. Actually, the number of USB devices on a bus is 128 (one is reserved for the host leaving only 127 available for peripheral devices). IIRC, hubs also count as one device. Putting 127 devices on one bus would be insane... You'd have so much overhead and competing packets that your practical bandwidth would be too low to do anything. Which is probably in part why the limit is 127. It's high enough to be unlikely to ever be reached in reality. Too often in the history of computers arbitrary limits have been set with the assumption that they would never be reached only to be reached and exceeded, by a lot. ie RAM, HD, optical disk size, network speeds, network nodes and so on. But USB is different in that even if one could hook up 127 devices and get practical use out of them it's just not likely to be done outside of a lab or something similar. BTW, a little quick math, to connect 127 devices you'd need 18 7-port hubs. That 127 number includes the 18 hubs. -- Clark Martin Redwood City, CA, USA Macintosh / Internet Consulting I'm a designated driver on the Information Super Highway -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
on 12/03/05 22:28, Clark Martin at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 8:02 PM -0700 3/12/05, Andrew Kershaw wrote: Oh ok, so what you are saying is that nobody actually tried connecting 127 devices to their system. Someone just came up with the number due to a mathematical formula? Right. Actually, the number of USB devices on a bus is 128 (one is reserved for the host leaving only 127 available for peripheral devices). IIRC, hubs also count as one device. Putting 127 devices on one bus would be insane... You'd have so much overhead and competing packets that your practical bandwidth would be too low to do anything. Which is probably in part why the limit is 127. It's high enough to be unlikely to ever be reached in reality. Too often in the history of computers arbitrary limits have been set with the assumption that they would never be reached only to be reached and exceeded, by a lot. ie RAM, HD, optical disk size, network speeds, network nodes and so on. But USB is different in that even if one could hook up 127 devices and get practical use out of them it's just not likely to be done outside of a lab or something similar. Yep, limits to be exceeded. Did anybody remember who said, a few years ago, that nobody would ever need more than 640KB in a computer? ;-) -Laurent. -- Laurent Daudelin AIM/iChat: LaurentDaudelinhttp://nemesys.dyndns.org Logiciels Nemesys Software mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] fiber-seeking backhoe: [common among backbone ISP personnel] Any of a genus of large, disruptive machines which routinely cut critical backbone links, creating Internet outages and packet over air problems. -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
At 10:32 PM -0500 3/12/05, Laurent Daudelin wrote: on 12/03/05 22:28, Clark Martin at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Which is probably in part why the limit is 127. It's high enough to be unlikely to ever be reached in reality. Too often in the history of computers arbitrary limits have been set with the assumption that they would never be reached only to be reached and exceeded, by a lot. ie RAM, HD, optical disk size, network speeds, network nodes and so on. But USB is different in that even if one could hook up 127 devices and get practical use out of them it's just not likely to be done outside of a lab or something similar. Yep, limits to be exceeded. Did anybody remember who said, a few years ago, that nobody would ever need more than 640KB in a computer? ;-) Or 2,4, 120 Gb. We still haven't run into 200Tb (well at least most of us haven't). -- Clark Martin Redwood City, CA, USA Macintosh / Internet Consulting I'm a designated driver on the Information Super Highway -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
..and now I have 128 Megs on my keychainand It was I think Billy boy, but I cant be sure.. On Mar 12, 2005, at 19:32, Laurent Daudelin wrote: Yep, limits to be exceeded. Did anybody remember who said, a few years ago, that nobody would ever need more than 640KB in a computer? ;-) -Laurent. -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
on 12/03/05 23:17, Jason at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ..and now I have 128 Megs on my keychainand It was I think Billy boy, but I cant be sure.. On Mar 12, 2005, at 19:32, Laurent Daudelin wrote: Yep, limits to be exceeded. Did anybody remember who said, a few years ago, that nobody would ever need more than 640KB in a computer? ;-) -Laurent. That was exactly him! Billy Boy! -Laurent. -- Laurent Daudelin AIM/iChat: LaurentDaudelinhttp://nemesys.dyndns.org Logiciels Nemesys Software mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Heuristics are bug ridden by definition. If they didn't have bugs, then they'd be algorithms. -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---
Re: Ok. . .USB thought. . .
On 13/03/2005, at 2:32 PM, Laurent Daudelin wrote: [snip] Yep, limits to be exceeded. Did anybody remember who said, a few years ago, that nobody would ever need more than 640KB in a computer? ;-) Urban legend. Bill Gates, 1981. Refuted, 1996. Used to be on urbanmyths.com when that still existed, and nobody's come up with an authorative cite for it that I know of - not that Google and 10 seconds worth of looking exactly counts as exhaustive. http://tafkac.org/celebrities/bill.gates/gates_memory.html -Laurent. -- === = Laurent Daudelin AIM/iChat: LaurentDaudelin http://nemesys.dyndns.org Logiciels Nemesys Software mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] fiber-seeking backhoe: [common among backbone ISP personnel] Any of a genus of large, disruptive machines which routinely cut critical backbone links, creating Internet outages and packet over air problems. -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:G-Books@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com ---