[Audyssey] question about grogan, an old game for the apple
Hi. I remember in about 1990 or 1991 there was a game I played on my apple 2gs called something like Grogan. If you dawdle around for too long in any part of the game, something always happens to you to kill you. For example at the start, you are being attacked by a troll with an axe. You can get past the troll by tickling it and running away. Another part of the game is where you have to go into a phone booth and dial a number, and the floor of the booth drops out from under your feet and you are suddenly somewhere else. There is also a character called the kindly old gentleman who demands all your treasures. hurry up, I haven't got all day!! and if he doesn't get what he wants, he calmly shoots you through the head. If you've previously been cheating in the game, he'll know about it, and he says I hate cheaters! then kills you there and then. you could cheat 3 times by typing in cheat to get a hint on what to do next in the game. If you tried to cheat a fourth time, you end up in a room with no exits, and the troll chops off your head and the game ends. There's another part of the game where you are being attacked by a swarm of hungry rats. You feel tiny teeth sink into your ancle. The scurrying sound gets louder. Another part had you wearing rollerscates, trying to make it through a field of deadly poppies. Trying to wear the rollerscates however was a puzzle in itself, you needed to put them on and then tighten them with a gold key, so they wouldn't keep falling off. There was another scene where you are being attacked by a witch on a broomstick. and yet another where you are standing on some train tracks and there is a train speeding towards you. Some parts of the game were faulty. The game was written in apple basic, and if you listed the contents, there was one part of the code that said this section still under construction Does anyone know if this game was ever released for the pc, and where on earth I can find this gem? Thanks. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] BGT / Gamepad support?
I should know all about that - I was on the team doing sections of the music... lol -Original Message- From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Hayden Presley Sent: 28 December 2010 02:32 To: 'Gamers Discussion list' Subject: Re: [Audyssey] BGT / Gamepad support? Hi, Ah yes...the great problem of sounds. That, in my opinion, has to be one of the most grueling tasks when creating a game. Just think of all the time it took to get all those sounds for TDV...plus the voice acting. Best Regards, Hayden -Original Message- From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Bryan Peterson Sent: Monday, December 27, 2010 2:38 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] BGT / Gamepad support? Well I definitely hope to do my share of side scrollers since unlike some people I don't feel that now that the genre has been slightly tapped into we can abandon it altogether. And I have heard comments like that, to the effect that now that we have Super Liam, MOTA, Tarzan Junior, Q9 and now Battle Zone there are enough side scrollers out there. We are the Knights who say...Ni! - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Monday, December 27, 2010 1:28 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] BGT / Gamepad support? Hi Bryan, Oh, I'm pretty certain you could create something like TDV with the BGT Engine. You need to remember that BGT's primary roll is to handle the low-level end of game programming like input, audio, speech, networking, etc wrapped by a powerful scripting language. Beyond that what you create with BGT is completely up to you. If you want to crank out a 2d side-scroller like MOTA that is easy enough with BGT. However, you could create TDV and other games like it just as well. It really comes down to personal skill and how much money you have to spend on acting, music, and sounds. On 12/27/10, Bryan Peterson bpeterson2...@cableone.net wrote: That would come in handy, especially for a game like TDV. I wonder if BGT will ever be able to develop something like that. Then again, considering the types of games that have already been developed using it I'm not unhopeful. We are the Knights who say...Ni! --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] some pipe stats
Wow... not bad... talk about down to the wire... -Original Message- From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of NIcol Sent: 29 December 2010 11:45 To: 'Gamers Discussion list' Subject: [Audyssey] some pipe stats HI all Here is some pipe stats of a game I most recently finished. I noticed that my score is lower than the number1 score on the scoreboard for normal difficulty. Tom Ward explained to me that the score can only be posted if its higher than the number1 score. But I have noticed that there is only 8 scores, not 10. So should not this rule apply only if there are 10 scores? ***Statistics for Game Started on 2010/12/29 12:47:55 PM Final Score: 3008259; you got in position 7 in your local top ten You beat the game! Congratulations! Difficulty: Normal Game Duration: 30 minutes 40 seconds Minutes remaining on game clock: 12 Total hammer swings: 1536 Hammer hitting accuracy: 99.9% On level13 I accidentally hit the control key once without the correct pipe. You killed 12 thugs on the first bonus level, received 145500 points, and ten extra minutes You killed 12 thugs on the second bonus level, received 145500 points, and ten extra minutes After killing a thug on the left or right, I always go back to middle because then if a thug appears to the left or right, I only have to press left or right arrow once instead of twice. Number of lives lost: 6 You lost your first life on level 2, which was a sidescrolling steam level.(Killed by a barrel) You lost your second life on level 4, which was a sidescrolling steam level.(Killed by a sewer lid) You lost your third life on level 9, which was a normal pipe level.(Killed by a spider) You lost your fourth life on level 14, which was a sidescrolling steam level.(Killed by electricity) You lost your fifth life on level 14, which was a sidescrolling steam level.(Killed by electricity) You lost your sixth life on level 14, which was a sidescrolling steam level.(Killed by electricity) You killed 13 Spiders You killed 6 Rats I accidentally used my flash light in level1 shortly after receiving it, and later on some rats appeared which I couldn't kill. You killed 11 Thugs You avoided 9 steams on sidescroller levels You avoided 20 electricities on sidescroller levels You avoided 19 sewer lids on sidescroller levels You avoided 19 barrels on sidescroller levels You unlocked a toolbox and received a flashlight on level 1 You searched a trashcan and found a time bonus on level 2 You searched a trashcan and found a bag of potato chips on level 2 You encountered stairs on level 3 and they brought you up to level 4 You searched a trashcan and found a bag of potato chips on level 4 You searched a trashcan and found a time bonus on level 4 You unlocked a toolbox and received a pack of ammo on level 5 You searched a trashcan and found a bag of potato chips on level 7 You searched a trashcan and found a welding kit on level 7 You encountered stairs on level 9 but they dropped you down to level 8 You encountered stairs on level 10 but they dropped you down to level 9 You searched a trashcan and found a 6 point bonus on level 11 You searched a trashcan and found a construction hat on level 11 You unlocked a toolbox and received a wrench on level 12 You unlocked a toolbox and received a pack of ammo on level 13 You searched a trashcan and found a welding kit on level 14 You searched a trashcan and found a can of soda pop on level 14 which came in very handy as plumber joe was quite thirsty. Happy gaming. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] question about grogan, an old game for the apple
Hi. That sounds a lot like one of the old style text adventure games similar to zork. You can try searching on http://www.wurb.com/if/ or even google. there used to be a very good site called textmode.com, but sadly they seem to be down now. to be honest though as to your description of the game, it sounds to be exactly the reason why I don't play Interactive fiction anymore, insane riddles with no logic and too much guess the verb puzles. Beware the grue! Dark. - Original Message - From: Stephen whocr...@internode.on.net To: gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 8:46 AM Subject: [Audyssey] question about grogan, an old game for the apple Hi. I remember in about 1990 or 1991 there was a game I played on my apple 2gs called something like Grogan. If you dawdle around for too long in any part of the game, something always happens to you to kill you. For example at the start, you are being attacked by a troll with an axe. You can get past the troll by tickling it and running away. Another part of the game is where you have to go into a phone booth and dial a number, and the floor of the booth drops out from under your feet and you are suddenly somewhere else. There is also a character called the kindly old gentleman who demands all your treasures. hurry up, I haven't got all day!! and if he doesn't get what he wants, he calmly shoots you through the head. If you've previously been cheating in the game, he'll know about it, and he says I hate cheaters! then kills you there and then. you could cheat 3 times by typing in cheat to get a hint on what to do next in the game. If you tried to cheat a fourth time, you end up in a room with no exits, and the troll chops off your head and the game ends. There's another part of the game where you are being attacked by a swarm of hungry rats. You feel tiny teeth sink into your ancle. The scurrying sound gets louder. Another part had you wearing rollerscates, trying to make it through a field of deadly poppies. Trying to wear the rollerscates however was a puzzle in itself, you needed to put them on and then tighten them with a gold key, so they wouldn't keep falling off. There was another scene where you are being attacked by a witch on a broomstick. and yet another where you are standing on some train tracks and there is a train speeding towards you. Some parts of the game were faulty. The game was written in apple basic, and if you listed the contents, there was one part of the code that said this section still under construction Does anyone know if this game was ever released for the pc, and where on earth I can find this gem? Thanks. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH?
Hi Thomas, The games from APH are designed to be purchased by sighted teachers for blind and visually impaired children. They all have large print graphics. Larry Skutchan is the head of development and being totally blind he is aware of the range of games for the blind as he purchased all of PCS earlier DOS games. Unfortunately he has to have the game concepts accepted by a board of advisers who probably reduced the challenge in the game concepts to make them easier to play for young children. I had fun playing Toodle Tiles, Based on the ancient game of Mahjong And Talking Word Puzzles is very challenging. It is an accessible crossword puzzle game. The others, Armadillo Army, Termite torpedo, and Hurry Scurry I wouldn't buy as they are too easy. Phil - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Saturday, January 22, 2011 11:17 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH? Hi Ryan, In my personal opinion the games aren't worth the price. It has always seamed to me the developer who created the APH games wasn't aware there are plenty of competing accessible games out there on the market. Besides the high price they are not that great to begin with. To me Shades of Doom or something else is far better games and are worth the price to license. HTH On 1/22/11, Ryan Conroy staindadd...@juno.com wrote: Hey everyone, I just ran across these games from American Printing House for the Blind, but they seem a little highly priced to me. Does anyone have these games, and are they worth it? The games are: Armidillo Army, Termite Torpedo, and Tudle Tiles or something like that.. Sorry, I know I destroyed the spelling on those, lol. If anyone has any information, please let me know. Take care, Ryan Globe Life Insurance $1* Buys $50,000 Life Insurance. Adults or Children. No Medical Exam. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/4d3b990149a1981410ast05vuc --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1191 / Virus Database: 1435/3396 - Release Date: 01/22/11 --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH?
Hi Phil what about young adults who love game fun too, maube someday he'll work on more games for older people too, although I'd think Super Egg Hunt a good one for kids, oh and Packman and Sarah also. - Original Message - From: Phil Vlasak p...@pcsgames.net To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 11:40 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH? Hi Thomas, The games from APH are designed to be purchased by sighted teachers for blind and visually impaired children. They all have large print graphics. Larry Skutchan is the head of development and being totally blind he is aware of the range of games for the blind as he purchased all of PCS earlier DOS games. Unfortunately he has to have the game concepts accepted by a board of advisers who probably reduced the challenge in the game concepts to make them easier to play for young children. I had fun playing Toodle Tiles, Based on the ancient game of Mahjong And Talking Word Puzzles is very challenging. It is an accessible crossword puzzle game. The others, Armadillo Army, Termite torpedo, and Hurry Scurry I wouldn't buy as they are too easy. Phil - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Saturday, January 22, 2011 11:17 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH? Hi Ryan, In my personal opinion the games aren't worth the price. It has always seamed to me the developer who created the APH games wasn't aware there are plenty of competing accessible games out there on the market. Besides the high price they are not that great to begin with. To me Shades of Doom or something else is far better games and are worth the price to license. HTH On 1/22/11, Ryan Conroy staindadd...@juno.com wrote: Hey everyone, I just ran across these games from American Printing House for the Blind, but they seem a little highly priced to me. Does anyone have these games, and are they worth it? The games are: Armidillo Army, Termite Torpedo, and Tudle Tiles or something like that.. Sorry, I know I destroyed the spelling on those, lol. If anyone has any information, please let me know. Take care, Ryan Globe Life Insurance $1* Buys $50,000 Life Insurance. Adults or Children. No Medical Exam. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/4d3b990149a1981410ast05vuc --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1191 / Virus Database: 1435/3396 - Release Date: 01/22/11 --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH?
Um...Phil did not develop super edging Sent from my iPhone On Jan 23, 2011, at 6:30 AM, Lori Duncan lori_dunca...@hotmail.com wrote: Hi Phil what about young adults who love game fun too, maube someday he'll work on more games for older people too, although I'd think Super Egg Hunt a good one for kids, oh and Packman and Sarah also. - Original Message - From: Phil Vlasak p...@pcsgames.net To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 11:40 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH? Hi Thomas, The games from APH are designed to be purchased by sighted teachers for blind and visually impaired children. They all have large print graphics. Larry Skutchan is the head of development and being totally blind he is aware of the range of games for the blind as he purchased all of PCS earlier DOS games. Unfortunately he has to have the game concepts accepted by a board of advisers who probably reduced the challenge in the game concepts to make them easier to play for young children. I had fun playing Toodle Tiles, Based on the ancient game of Mahjong And Talking Word Puzzles is very challenging. It is an accessible crossword puzzle game. The others, Armadillo Army, Termite torpedo, and Hurry Scurry I wouldn't buy as they are too easy. Phil - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Saturday, January 22, 2011 11:17 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH? Hi Ryan, In my personal opinion the games aren't worth the price. It has always seamed to me the developer who created the APH games wasn't aware there are plenty of competing accessible games out there on the market. Besides the high price they are not that great to begin with. To me Shades of Doom or something else is far better games and are worth the price to license. HTH On 1/22/11, Ryan Conroy staindadd...@juno.com wrote: Hey everyone, I just ran across these games from American Printing House for the Blind, but they seem a little highly priced to me. Does anyone have these games, and are they worth it? The games are: Armidillo Army, Termite Torpedo, and Tudle Tiles or something like that.. Sorry, I know I destroyed the spelling on those, lol. If anyone has any information, please let me know. Take care, Ryan Globe Life Insurance $1* Buys $50,000 Life Insurance. Adults or Children. No Medical Exam. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/4d3b990149a1981410ast05vuc --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1191 / Virus Database: 1435/3396 - Release Date: 01/22/11 --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at
Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH?
Wow are you serious about the voiceovers? Sent from my iPhone On Jan 23, 2011, at 1:13 AM, Valiant8086 valiant8...@lavabit.com wrote: Hi. Actually, I like termite torpedo. It actually takes some intelligence and strategy to play that game. And the voiceovers for it are fantastic. I'd venture to say that it has the best recorded voiceover of any game I have ever played, audio or not. On 1/23/2011 12:48 AM, shaun everiss wrote: I wouldn't touch them. I played termite torpedo once. Its probably good if you are the average poor handicapt blind retard maybe even a child that has even less inteligence than a deranged retard and is generally bad and likes to format his drive or run things like lets see what this command does kind of thing. But for any real computer user, ie one that can actually know what the internet is, well. Long and short is These are worse than bavisoft and they well are not for us. Maybe some narrow minded sole made these because thats what the retarded blind are worth. I don't want to be associated with the blind retards association and I don't play these though I did find and try these ages ago. To say, bd, is an understatement. If you want something like this, then you should play the kitchensinc games. Yeah, basic, and quite old school but at least they emulate the physical boards and actually are enjoyable. At 03:56 p.m. 23/01/2011, you wrote: Hey everyone, I just ran across these games from American Printing House for the Blind, but they seem a little highly priced to me. Does anyone have these games, and are they worth it? The games are: Armidillo Army, Termite Torpedo, and Tudle Tiles or something like that.. Sorry, I know I destroyed the spelling on those, lol. If anyone has any information, please let me know. Take care, Ryan Globe Life Insurance $1* Buys $50,000 Life Insurance. Adults or Children. No Medical Exam. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/4d3b990149a1981410ast05vuc --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Community Game-building Project
But he has an account in the audiogames.net called keywasful. sevgiler saygilar - Original Message - From: Hayden Presley hdpres...@hotmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 1:15 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Community Game-building Project Lol...it's keyisfull not keywasfull Sent from my iPhone On Jan 20, 2011, at 10:18 PM, shaun everiss sm.ever...@gmail.com wrote: well I'd like to do some sfx and maybe other things, sertainly test the game. I think you really should shove this in the bgt thing if you want. ask keywasfull if you can get on his bgt folder then ask him for permision to use or look at his chopper code, its a bit like copter man chopper chace or whatever the game is called, but you should get an idea how to do things that way. just add sm.ever...@gmail.com to the dropbox. I may help with sfx, so we will see what happens. At 09:50 a.m. 21/01/2011, you wrote: Well, there has been much talk in the past about a game building project that many people can participate in. Well, I've begun one. Now, here's where the rubber meets the road. Here is where we'll see if gamers are all talk about this subject or if they add their own ideas. The game So far, here is the game, designed in VB6. Yes, it's archaic or whatever, but it's what I know. Wanna translate it? Go ahead. Anyway, the basic idea is that you and a friend just got a couple of those new battle copters, you know, the ones you fly around the house? Well, you're in a living room that's about ten feet high, and 20 by 20. You fly your chopper around the room, trying to shoot down your friend before he gets you. The Trim: Now, you're not the only one that flies this helicopter, because you have a young brother/sister/cousin that plays with it, so every time you start the game you'll need to adjust the trim to 0. To adjust it, use the home and end keys. As you adjust it, you'll hear the clicking of a knob that seems to move around your head. When it gets to 0, the sound of the knob turning will change and be directly in front of you. To fly, hold down the page up key to gain altitude. Since you're flying a helicopter, the faster the rotors turn, the higher it goes. As you increase in height, your velocity in that direction also increases. If you get going too fast you'll smash against the ceiling, and your chopper will fall. You get about ten smashes before it's unusable. Also, page down will slow the rotors, making the chopper descend. You can show off to your friend by landing the chopper on your head, but that takes a lot of work and a little luck. Use left and right arrows to turn, and up and down arrows to fly forward and backward. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
[Audyssey] help with heli
Hi ken, I got this game and I must say I quite like it, however I don't understand something. How exactly do you move. I'm for instance trying to smash the tv. what I do is hit home until the little click comes from my left instead of the right, then I begin to hold page up to accelerate, then I use my left arrow until I hear a click on my left (where the tv is I think). but when I hold up arrow it just begins flying in circles or that's what it sounds like. I can shoot it to turn it off but can't find it to smash it. likewise I'm trying to hit the light switch but can't. in the manual you say to get 5 feet into the air, but I keep hitting page up but can never get the z access high until I eventually hit the seeling. at that point there's a bug, because I can only hear the fan and the tv but not the helicopters. so it's hard to fly around at that point. Nice idea though. take care! - Peter Mahach |piterm...@gmail.com msn: pitermac...@hotmail.com skype (not very often): pitermach twitter: http://www.twitter.com/pitermach webpage: http://pmsworld.weisi4u.de/ __ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 5266 (20100709) __ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Game Engines was Heli
Hi Thomas and others, Just a few points from a probably biased user :-) I think the idea of Open Source Software are generally miss understood. Part of that may be because of the fact that certain groups prefer to call it Free Software, which is associated with freeware. Open source software is not freeware and will never be. The idea of Open Source Software is just that the source code should be open and available to any one who would like to study or modify it. That is also the reason that many people including myself prefer to use Linux. If I want my computer to say hello every time it begins the boot process, I can do so without having to edit some binary file with a hex editor. Also it encourage the studying of source code. Thus if someone enters the audio gaming community, he/she can immediately find out how a game engine works for instance without having to reinvent the wheel. Some people think that open source software grows faster than other software, but that is mostly open for debate. Nothing prevents one from selling a program under the GPL, although your users must receive the same rights under the GPL, and can for instance sell it themselves, modify it or just give it away. One thing I've thought about is to put the game itself under an open source license, and sell the sounds and/or music. Take care, Rynhardt * Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com [110123 04:53]: Hi Philip, That is very good to know. As I mentioned in my earlier message to the list I'm currently looking at replacing one of my computers with a Mac. Recently my old desktop, we used as a family computer, gave up the ghost over the Christmas holidays. Now, my wife and I are in the process of discussing replacing it. If we do decide to replace it with a Mac I'll be interested in porting my current projects, including the Genesis 3D Engine, to Mac OS. If you happen to release a copy of BGT for Mac before I get there I'd probably consider buying a license for the port. However, that said the APIs for Linux and the APIs for Mac OS are not that different. For example, I have a rough idea of how I'm going to create the Mac OS and Linux version of the Genesis Engine. I'll begin with writing a middleware library similar to Streemway that wraps OpenAL and loads wav, ogg, and other open source file types and mixes them with OpenAL. For things like threading, serialization, etc I'll use the cross-platform boost library. Finally, input, networking, and the window manager will be handled by SDL 1.2. I believe that this would provide an excellent basis for any game engine targeting the Mac or Linux operating systems. Although, there is an alternative way of handling this. SFML already has a decent networking API, supports OpenAL via sfml-audio, input handling is fine, threading works pretty good on Linux, and the only complaint I have is the window manager. It works fine on Linux, I hear it works fine on Mac, but crashes the OS on Windows. So SFML sounds like the best solution for a Mac specific engine, but I wouldn't consider SFML for a Windows engine based on its buggy window manager. Still I agree with you that at this point Mac is a developers second choice in terms of operating system to support. While Linux is fine as an operating system most of the Linux users I know left Linux in favor of the Mac. Plus because Mac OS is a commercial operating system the majority of the people using it are willing to pay money for commercial software. All too many Linux users I know are hung up on the free and open source view and absolutely refuse to pay for commercial software in any way, shape, or form. They expect software for Linux to remain free, open source, and without commercial licensing. That is unrealistic considering the fact I have to license music, sounds, and so on that costs me hundreds of dollars per game. The Marxist view that all software should be free, shared, community property is fine to a certain point, but doesn't work if we are dealing with capitalist companies out to make a buck for everything. Therefore since we live in a capitalist society I have to run my software company that way to make a buck myself to continue producing said products. In short, I agree with you. Mac is probably my next choice as well. It has nothing to do with weather I like Linux or not. I've just concluded the money isn't really in it. Between the fact there are less users their and the fact too many are hung up on Marxist idiology it will be very hard to market a commercial product there. If I can produce Linux versions inexpensively and make a few extra on it fine, but Mac and Windows seam to me to be the most financially viable markets long term. HTH On 1/22/11, Philip Bennefall phi...@blastbay.com wrote: Hi Thomas, Just to enter in this discussion a little. I am actually considering buying a Mac when I have enough money saved up. I'm not very
Re: [Audyssey] Game Engines was Heli
Hi Thomas and Rhynhardt, I'm neither for or against open source software. I am very thankful to those who write open source libraries and allow them to be used in commercial applications, as that speeds up my own development by about 500 %. But I would never make any of my games open source because of the simple fact that I don't want people to mess around with or steal my source code. I have spent a considerable sum of money outsourcing a lot of the core parts of my game engine and so it would be utter foolishness for me to simply throw that money in the sea as we say in Sweden. It is for the same reason that I protect my sounds from being altered or stolen, because I don't want the investments I have made in that department to simply be exploited. I'm happy to provide my game engine along with some open source components to do trivial things such as my menu class, my sound pool class to handle audio environments, my number speaker class to intelligently concatenate sound files to have numbers spoken, etc etc. But the real code is protected and always will be. For my Mac port when the time comes, I will probably be using CoreAudio directly. For networking I can stick with what I already have, since ENet fits the bill for BGT perfectly and already works on Mac OS as far as I'm aware. The same goes for AngelScript. Kind regards, Philip Bennefall - Original Message - From: Rynhardt Kruger rynkru...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 2:50 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Game Engines was Heli Hi Thomas and others, Just a few points from a probably biased user :-) I think the idea of Open Source Software are generally miss understood. Part of that may be because of the fact that certain groups prefer to call it Free Software, which is associated with freeware. Open source software is not freeware and will never be. The idea of Open Source Software is just that the source code should be open and available to any one who would like to study or modify it. That is also the reason that many people including myself prefer to use Linux. If I want my computer to say hello every time it begins the boot process, I can do so without having to edit some binary file with a hex editor. Also it encourage the studying of source code. Thus if someone enters the audio gaming community, he/she can immediately find out how a game engine works for instance without having to reinvent the wheel. Some people think that open source software grows faster than other software, but that is mostly open for debate. Nothing prevents one from selling a program under the GPL, although your users must receive the same rights under the GPL, and can for instance sell it themselves, modify it or just give it away. One thing I've thought about is to put the game itself under an open source license, and sell the sounds and/or music. Take care, Rynhardt * Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com [110123 04:53]: Hi Philip, That is very good to know. As I mentioned in my earlier message to the list I'm currently looking at replacing one of my computers with a Mac. Recently my old desktop, we used as a family computer, gave up the ghost over the Christmas holidays. Now, my wife and I are in the process of discussing replacing it. If we do decide to replace it with a Mac I'll be interested in porting my current projects, including the Genesis 3D Engine, to Mac OS. If you happen to release a copy of BGT for Mac before I get there I'd probably consider buying a license for the port. However, that said the APIs for Linux and the APIs for Mac OS are not that different. For example, I have a rough idea of how I'm going to create the Mac OS and Linux version of the Genesis Engine. I'll begin with writing a middleware library similar to Streemway that wraps OpenAL and loads wav, ogg, and other open source file types and mixes them with OpenAL. For things like threading, serialization, etc I'll use the cross-platform boost library. Finally, input, networking, and the window manager will be handled by SDL 1.2. I believe that this would provide an excellent basis for any game engine targeting the Mac or Linux operating systems. Although, there is an alternative way of handling this. SFML already has a decent networking API, supports OpenAL via sfml-audio, input handling is fine, threading works pretty good on Linux, and the only complaint I have is the window manager. It works fine on Linux, I hear it works fine on Mac, but crashes the OS on Windows. So SFML sounds like the best solution for a Mac specific engine, but I wouldn't consider SFML for a Windows engine based on its buggy window manager. Still I agree with you that at this point Mac is a developers second choice in terms of operating system to support. While Linux is fine as an operating system most of the Linux users I know left Linux in favor of the Mac. Plus because Mac OS is a commercial operating
Re: [Audyssey] Heli
Autoit is crap for advanced games like TDV. - Original Message - From: shaun everiss sm.ever...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 2:51 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Heli well tom on that note python is another popular language. then there is the die hard c and c++ programmers like yourself. then the vb dotnet and other dotnet languages. for now the old legacy vb6 and others exist but not for much longer I think. there are also games with autoit, and also games in flash that seem to exist. At 02:49 p.m. 23/01/2011, you wrote: Hi Shaun, True. BGT and G3D will definitely open a lot of doors for new game developers etc, but there still will be plenty of room for qualified game programmers. One of the big reasons is Mac OS is slowly but surely becoming more popular with VI computer users. Engines like BGT currently has no support for Mac OS and Linux at this time, and the few developers like Draconis and USA Games will most likely get there before anyone else does just because we are looking at switching to Mac OS as our platform of choice. In the case of Draconis Josh and Cara both use Mac OS, and I'm undecided if I want to invest in a MacBook next time round or get another IBM compatible PC with Linux OS on it. All the same it is an emerging market that so far has not been very well explored by game developers. The developers who depend on BGT or Visual Basic will never be able to reach those other markets just because the technology they use doesn't support it. Those who know Python, Java, or C++ will be able to tap those markets if they have a mind too. Cheers! On 1/22/11, shaun everiss sm.ever...@gmail.com wrote: yeah and only gona get worse. Now with bgt almost anyone that has a mind to can program without any real fuss. Then with things like the g3d engine people can program without having to spend months on writing loads of things. Game creation engines and kits are the way of the future and we have at least 2 of them going in the works one out allready and rocking. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH?
Hi Julious Brutus, Well, were they that challenging? Seriously, left, right that is insane, why can't they do some panning? - Original Message - From: dark d...@xgam.org To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 7:02 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH? Also, after trying on three different machines, I've never! got the damn things to work, that's one reason why armadillo army has no written description in the database, though I'm tempted to just put something together from the instructions, bad as that sounds (usually I always try to play a game before describing it). Eitherway, apparently they wrote ridiculously symple audio games, slapped a price on them, and called them a revolutionary new product considdering they were the first audio games ever created, despite the fact that a bit of googling would've shown them different. Oh, and the method they apparently use for showing audio directions is just insane! According to someone who described the games on audiogames.net, instead of hereing something in sterrio pan, you here a voice pout of center speakers saying right right right or left left left depending upon where the enemy or object is, which is just ridiculous! Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH?
Edging? Lol! Egg hunt. - Original Message - From: Hayden Presley hdpres...@hotmail.com To: Lori Duncan lori_dunca...@hotmail.com; Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 12:49 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH? Um...Phil did not develop super edging Sent from my iPhone On Jan 23, 2011, at 6:30 AM, Lori Duncan lori_dunca...@hotmail.com wrote: Hi Phil what about young adults who love game fun too, maube someday he'll work on more games for older people too, although I'd think Super Egg Hunt a good one for kids, oh and Packman and Sarah also. - Original Message - From: Phil Vlasak p...@pcsgames.net To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 11:40 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH? Hi Thomas, The games from APH are designed to be purchased by sighted teachers for blind and visually impaired children. They all have large print graphics. Larry Skutchan is the head of development and being totally blind he is aware of the range of games for the blind as he purchased all of PCS earlier DOS games. Unfortunately he has to have the game concepts accepted by a board of advisers who probably reduced the challenge in the game concepts to make them easier to play for young children. I had fun playing Toodle Tiles, Based on the ancient game of Mahjong And Talking Word Puzzles is very challenging. It is an accessible crossword puzzle game. The others, Armadillo Army, Termite torpedo, and Hurry Scurry I wouldn't buy as they are too easy. Phil - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Saturday, January 22, 2011 11:17 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH? Hi Ryan, In my personal opinion the games aren't worth the price. It has always seamed to me the developer who created the APH games wasn't aware there are plenty of competing accessible games out there on the market. Besides the high price they are not that great to begin with. To me Shades of Doom or something else is far better games and are worth the price to license. HTH On 1/22/11, Ryan Conroy staindadd...@juno.com wrote: Hey everyone, I just ran across these games from American Printing House for the Blind, but they seem a little highly priced to me. Does anyone have these games, and are they worth it? The games are: Armidillo Army, Termite Torpedo, and Tudle Tiles or something like that.. Sorry, I know I destroyed the spelling on those, lol. If anyone has any information, please let me know. Take care, Ryan Globe Life Insurance $1* Buys $50,000 Life Insurance. Adults or Children. No Medical Exam. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/4d3b990149a1981410ast05vuc --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1191 / Virus Database: 1435/3396 - Release Date: 01/22/11 --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to
Re: [Audyssey] Game Engines was Heli
Hi Philip, ... But I would never make any of my games open source because of the simple fact that I don't want people to mess around with or steal my source code. ... snip Indeed that is your choice. Actually by using angelscript in BGT you make it available to a wide audience for testing and thus contributing indirectly to it's development. I hope I didn't came across as advocating in my original message. I was just stating the other side of the argument. Maybe I was advocating a bit, but that's my choice as well. smile Take care, Rynhardt * Philip Bennefall phi...@blastbay.com [110123 16:13]: Hi Thomas and Rhynhardt, I'm neither for or against open source software. I am very thankful to those who write open source libraries and allow them to be used in commercial applications, as that speeds up my own development by about 500 %. But I would never make any of my games open source because of the simple fact that I don't want people to mess around with or steal my source code. I have spent a considerable sum of money outsourcing a lot of the core parts of my game engine and so it would be utter foolishness for me to simply throw that money in the sea as we say in Sweden. It is for the same reason that I protect my sounds from being altered or stolen, because I don't want the investments I have made in that department to simply be exploited. I'm happy to provide my game engine along with some open source components to do trivial things such as my menu class, my sound pool class to handle audio environments, my number speaker class to intelligently concatenate sound files to have numbers spoken, etc etc. But the real code is protected and always will be. For my Mac port when the time comes, I will probably be using CoreAudio directly. For networking I can stick with what I already have, since ENet fits the bill for BGT perfectly and already works on Mac OS as far as I'm aware. The same goes for AngelScript. Kind regards, Philip Bennefall - Original Message - From: Rynhardt Kruger rynkru...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 2:50 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Game Engines was Heli Hi Thomas and others, Just a few points from a probably biased user :-) I think the idea of Open Source Software are generally miss understood. Part of that may be because of the fact that certain groups prefer to call it Free Software, which is associated with freeware. Open source software is not freeware and will never be. The idea of Open Source Software is just that the source code should be open and available to any one who would like to study or modify it. That is also the reason that many people including myself prefer to use Linux. If I want my computer to say hello every time it begins the boot process, I can do so without having to edit some binary file with a hex editor. Also it encourage the studying of source code. Thus if someone enters the audio gaming community, he/she can immediately find out how a game engine works for instance without having to reinvent the wheel. Some people think that open source software grows faster than other software, but that is mostly open for debate. Nothing prevents one from selling a program under the GPL, although your users must receive the same rights under the GPL, and can for instance sell it themselves, modify it or just give it away. One thing I've thought about is to put the game itself under an open source license, and sell the sounds and/or music. Take care, Rynhardt * Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com [110123 04:53]: Hi Philip, That is very good to know. As I mentioned in my earlier message to the list I'm currently looking at replacing one of my computers with a Mac. Recently my old desktop, we used as a family computer, gave up the ghost over the Christmas holidays. Now, my wife and I are in the process of discussing replacing it. If we do decide to replace it with a Mac I'll be interested in porting my current projects, including the Genesis 3D Engine, to Mac OS. If you happen to release a copy of BGT for Mac before I get there I'd probably consider buying a license for the port. However, that said the APIs for Linux and the APIs for Mac OS are not that different. For example, I have a rough idea of how I'm going to create the Mac OS and Linux version of the Genesis Engine. I'll begin with writing a middleware library similar to Streemway that wraps OpenAL and loads wav, ogg, and other open source file types and mixes them with OpenAL. For things like threading, serialization, etc I'll use the cross-platform boost library. Finally, input, networking, and the window manager will be handled by SDL 1.2. I believe that this would provide an excellent basis for any game engine targeting the Mac or Linux operating systems. Although, there is an alternative way of handling this. SFML already has a
[Audyssey] Old Game called Gold Runner?
I would like to discuss with someone on this list...offlist...an old game called Gold Runner. I remember this game from when I still had eyesight and it was a most challenging game. But it has been over 20 years since I last played it and I need to refresh mymemory on certain aspects of the game. contact me at: r_montow...@yahoo.com and put Gold Runner in the subject line. thanks for your help Robert --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Game Engines was Heli
Hi Rynhardt, Oh I think I expressed myself carelessly. I have sent off a lot of bug reports to Andreas, the creator of AngelScript, and so I have definitely done what I can to make the library more stable by testing it myself as well as letting all my users test it of course. This benefits both myself, my customers, Andreas and all his other AngelScript users, and is a splended thing. What I was trying to say was that I would not myself want to lead an open source project of the same scale as I can see no way to justify the time and money that would have to go into it. Kind regards, Philip Bennefall - Original Message - From: Rynhardt Kruger rynkru...@gmail.com To: phi...@blastbay.com; Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 3:48 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Game Engines was Heli Hi Philip, ... But I would never make any of my games open source because of the simple fact that I don't want people to mess around with or steal my source code. ... snip Indeed that is your choice. Actually by using angelscript in BGT you make it available to a wide audience for testing and thus contributing indirectly to it's development. I hope I didn't came across as advocating in my original message. I was just stating the other side of the argument. Maybe I was advocating a bit, but that's my choice as well. smile Take care, Rynhardt * Philip Bennefall phi...@blastbay.com [110123 16:13]: Hi Thomas and Rhynhardt, I'm neither for or against open source software. I am very thankful to those who write open source libraries and allow them to be used in commercial applications, as that speeds up my own development by about 500 %. But I would never make any of my games open source because of the simple fact that I don't want people to mess around with or steal my source code. I have spent a considerable sum of money outsourcing a lot of the core parts of my game engine and so it would be utter foolishness for me to simply throw that money in the sea as we say in Sweden. It is for the same reason that I protect my sounds from being altered or stolen, because I don't want the investments I have made in that department to simply be exploited. I'm happy to provide my game engine along with some open source components to do trivial things such as my menu class, my sound pool class to handle audio environments, my number speaker class to intelligently concatenate sound files to have numbers spoken, etc etc. But the real code is protected and always will be. For my Mac port when the time comes, I will probably be using CoreAudio directly. For networking I can stick with what I already have, since ENet fits the bill for BGT perfectly and already works on Mac OS as far as I'm aware. The same goes for AngelScript. Kind regards, Philip Bennefall - Original Message - From: Rynhardt Kruger rynkru...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 2:50 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Game Engines was Heli Hi Thomas and others, Just a few points from a probably biased user :-) I think the idea of Open Source Software are generally miss understood. Part of that may be because of the fact that certain groups prefer to call it Free Software, which is associated with freeware. Open source software is not freeware and will never be. The idea of Open Source Software is just that the source code should be open and available to any one who would like to study or modify it. That is also the reason that many people including myself prefer to use Linux. If I want my computer to say hello every time it begins the boot process, I can do so without having to edit some binary file with a hex editor. Also it encourage the studying of source code. Thus if someone enters the audio gaming community, he/she can immediately find out how a game engine works for instance without having to reinvent the wheel. Some people think that open source software grows faster than other software, but that is mostly open for debate. Nothing prevents one from selling a program under the GPL, although your users must receive the same rights under the GPL, and can for instance sell it themselves, modify it or just give it away. One thing I've thought about is to put the game itself under an open source license, and sell the sounds and/or music. Take care, Rynhardt * Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com [110123 04:53]: Hi Philip, That is very good to know. As I mentioned in my earlier message to the list I'm currently looking at replacing one of my computers with a Mac. Recently my old desktop, we used as a family computer, gave up the ghost over the Christmas holidays. Now, my wife and I are in the process of discussing replacing it. If we do decide to replace it with a Mac I'll be interested in porting my current projects, including the Genesis 3D Engine, to Mac OS. If you happen to release a copy of BGT for Mac before I get there I'd probably consider buying
Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH?
Hi One reason to develop games that don't pan sounds is that some people can only hear out of one ear. There are few games that someone like that can play that are not turn based. Of course panning could be an option to turn on or off. Phil - Original Message - From: Shiny protector muhamme...@googlemail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 9:32 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH? Hi Julious Brutus, Well, were they that challenging? Seriously, left, right that is insane, why can't they do some panning? - Original Message - From: dark d...@xgam.org To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 7:02 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH? Also, after trying on three different machines, I've never! got the damn things to work, that's one reason why armadillo army has no written description in the database, though I'm tempted to just put something together from the instructions, bad as that sounds (usually I always try to play a game before describing it). Eitherway, apparently they wrote ridiculously symple audio games, slapped a price on them, and called them a revolutionary new product considdering they were the first audio games ever created, despite the fact that a bit of googling would've shown them different. Oh, and the method they apparently use for showing audio directions is just insane! According to someone who described the games on audiogames.net, instead of hereing something in sterrio pan, you here a voice pout of center speakers saying right right right or left left left depending upon where the enemy or object is, which is just ridiculous! Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1191 / Virus Database: 1435/3398 - Release Date: 01/23/11 --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH?
I'm not highly strung or easily offended as a rule, but I've read the quoted message below three times now and still can't quite believe it was posted. Presumably either everyone else deletes by default in this case or can't find the words? I don't delete by default, and have found a few: Shaun, I implore you to take a few moments out of your undoubtedly hectic day (scathing sarcasm, yes) to re-read any message you're about to send before you actually send it. In the unlikely event that you can re-read the quoted message and not understand how that advice pertains to you, I'm suggesting that you reign in your choice of dirogatory terms and inappropriate examples. FYI, though the example in the message below seems to describe your public persona quite accurately, it's still pretty far removed from what most sane people would consider appropriate. While we're having this moment of reflection, you might also want to count your lucky sheep that the moderators here are a friendly forgiving bunch. On 1/23/11, shaun everiss sm.ever...@gmail.com wrote: I wouldn't touch them. I played termite torpedo once. Its probably good if you are the average poor handicapt blind retard maybe even a child that has even less inteligence than a deranged retard and is generally bad and likes to format his drive or run things like lets see what this command does kind of thing. But for any real computer user, ie one that can actually know what the internet is, well. Long and short is These are worse than bavisoft and they well are not for us. Maybe some narrow minded sole made these because thats what the retarded blind are worth. I don't want to be associated with the blind retards association and I don't play these though I did find and try these ages ago. To say, bd, is an understatement. If you want something like this, then you should play the kitchensinc games. Yeah, basic, and quite old school but at least they emulate the physical boards and actually are enjoyable. At 03:56 p.m. 23/01/2011, you wrote: Hey everyone, I just ran across these games from American Printing House for the Blind, but they seem a little highly priced to me. Does anyone have these games, and are they worth it? The games are: Armidillo Army, Termite Torpedo, and Tudle Tiles or something like that.. Sorry, I know I destroyed the spelling on those, lol. If anyone has any information, please let me know. Take care, Ryan Globe Life Insurance $1* Buys $50,000 Life Insurance. Adults or Children. No Medical Exam. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/4d3b990149a1981410ast05vuc --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Community Game-building Project
Um no...though I am not willing to Perdue the point. Sent from my iPhone On Jan 23, 2011, at 7:20 AM, burakyuksek burakyuksek...@gmail.com wrote: But he has an account in the audiogames.net called keywasful. sevgiler saygilar - Original Message - From: Hayden Presley hdpres...@hotmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 1:15 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Community Game-building Project Lol...it's keyisfull not keywasfull Sent from my iPhone On Jan 20, 2011, at 10:18 PM, shaun everiss sm.ever...@gmail.com wrote: well I'd like to do some sfx and maybe other things, sertainly test the game. I think you really should shove this in the bgt thing if you want. ask keywasfull if you can get on his bgt folder then ask him for permision to use or look at his chopper code, its a bit like copter man chopper chace or whatever the game is called, but you should get an idea how to do things that way. just add sm.ever...@gmail.com to the dropbox. I may help with sfx, so we will see what happens. At 09:50 a.m. 21/01/2011, you wrote: Well, there has been much talk in the past about a game building project that many people can participate in. Well, I've begun one. Now, here's where the rubber meets the road. Here is where we'll see if gamers are all talk about this subject or if they add their own ideas. The game So far, here is the game, designed in VB6. Yes, it's archaic or whatever, but it's what I know. Wanna translate it? Go ahead. Anyway, the basic idea is that you and a friend just got a couple of those new battle copters, you know, the ones you fly around the house? Well, you're in a living room that's about ten feet high, and 20 by 20. You fly your chopper around the room, trying to shoot down your friend before he gets you. The Trim: Now, you're not the only one that flies this helicopter, because you have a young brother/sister/cousin that plays with it, so every time you start the game you'll need to adjust the trim to 0. To adjust it, use the home and end keys. As you adjust it, you'll hear the clicking of a knob that seems to move around your head. When it gets to 0, the sound of the knob turning will change and be directly in front of you. To fly, hold down the page up key to gain altitude. Since you're flying a helicopter, the faster the rotors turn, the higher it goes. As you increase in height, your velocity in that direction also increases. If you get going too fast you'll smash against the ceiling, and your chopper will fall. You get about ten smashes before it's unusable. Also, page down will slow the rotors, making the chopper descend. You can show off to your friend by landing the chopper on your head, but that takes a lot of work and a little luck. Use left and right arrows to turn, and up and down arrows to fly forward and backward. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH?
I'm a litle confused why the difficulty of the games would be lowered as to be so ridiculous just because they are aimed at young children, something I thought when I tried mudsplat. I think I first completed Golden axe on the Amigar at the age of 8, and super bomberman and street fighter 2 at normal difficulty at the age of nine, though these took a lot of practice. I was playing berzerk and joust when I was about four, and while I did often play on the easy setting, this wasn't that much less difficult than normal (easy on berzerk, the robots didn't fire at you). So while having a range of difficulties for different aged players is reasonable, your probably likely to find not a few kids who could slaughter their way through something if it was made too easy, which seems to be the case with the aph games. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH?
I can't confirm this, sinse I've never managed to get the things to work myself, though i have tried the demos on several occasions, but that is what I have heard, no panning just the words left and right Beware the greu1 Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH?
That's true. Also, you should compare Termite Torpedo's visual mode to the blind mode. It's terrible! I wouldn't recommend those games to anyone. Jim Kitchen's games are far far better, and they're free. Hey Jim, I mention your name here because I'd love it if you could make a mahjong game. Tootle Tiles wasn't bad actually, but I certainly wouldn't pay for it, especially since you or Spoonville games could really do it justice. Ken Downey President DreamTechInteractive! And, Blind Comfort! The pleasant way to experience massage! It's the Caring without the Staring! - Original Message - From: dark d...@xgam.org To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 2:02 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH? Also, after trying on three different machines, I've never! got the damn things to work, that's one reason why armadillo army has no written description in the database, though I'm tempted to just put something together from the instructions, bad as that sounds (usually I always try to play a game before describing it). Eitherway, apparently they wrote ridiculously symple audio games, slapped a price on them, and called them a revolutionary new product considdering they were the first audio games ever created, despite the fact that a bit of googling would've shown them different. Oh, and the method they apparently use for showing audio directions is just insane! According to someone who described the games on audiogames.net, instead of hereing something in sterrio pan, you here a voice pout of center speakers saying right right right or left left left depending upon where the enemy or object is, which is just ridiculous! Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] question about grogan, an old game for the apple
A phone booth where the floor falls out? Do you think that J.K. Rollings played this game and was inspired--Ministry of Magic headquuarters and all that? Ken Downey President DreamTechInteractive! And, Blind Comfort! The pleasant way to experience massage! It's the Caring without the Staring! - Original Message - From: Stephen whocr...@internode.on.net To: gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 3:46 AM Subject: [Audyssey] question about grogan, an old game for the apple Hi. I remember in about 1990 or 1991 there was a game I played on my apple 2gs called something like Grogan. If you dawdle around for too long in any part of the game, something always happens to you to kill you. For example at the start, you are being attacked by a troll with an axe. You can get past the troll by tickling it and running away. Another part of the game is where you have to go into a phone booth and dial a number, and the floor of the booth drops out from under your feet and you are suddenly somewhere else. There is also a character called the kindly old gentleman who demands all your treasures. hurry up, I haven't got all day!! and if he doesn't get what he wants, he calmly shoots you through the head. If you've previously been cheating in the game, he'll know about it, and he says I hate cheaters! then kills you there and then. you could cheat 3 times by typing in cheat to get a hint on what to do next in the game. If you tried to cheat a fourth time, you end up in a room with no exits, and the troll chops off your head and the game ends. There's another part of the game where you are being attacked by a swarm of hungry rats. You feel tiny teeth sink into your ancle. The scurrying sound gets louder. Another part had you wearing rollerscates, trying to make it through a field of deadly poppies. Trying to wear the rollerscates however was a puzzle in itself, you needed to put them on and then tighten them with a gold key, so they wouldn't keep falling off. There was another scene where you are being attacked by a witch on a broomstick. and yet another where you are standing on some train tracks and there is a train speeding towards you. Some parts of the game were faulty. The game was written in apple basic, and if you listed the contents, there was one part of the code that said this section still under construction Does anyone know if this game was ever released for the pc, and where on earth I can find this gem? Thanks. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH?
Hi Yes I meant what I said. On 1/23/2011 7:52 AM, Hayden Presley wrote: Wow are you serious about the voiceovers? Sent from my iPhone On Jan 23, 2011, at 1:13 AM, Valiant8086valiant8...@lavabit.com wrote: Hi. Actually, I like termite torpedo. It actually takes some intelligence and strategy to play that game. And the voiceovers for it are fantastic. I'd venture to say that it has the best recorded voiceover of any game I have ever played, audio or not. On 1/23/2011 12:48 AM, shaun everiss wrote: I wouldn't touch them. I played termite torpedo once. Its probably good if you are the average poor handicapt blind retard maybe even a child that has even less inteligence than a deranged retard and is generally bad and likes to format his drive or run things like lets see what this command does kind of thing. But for any real computer user, ie one that can actually know what the internet is, well. Long and short is These are worse than bavisoft and they well are not for us. Maybe some narrow minded sole made these because thats what the retarded blind are worth. I don't want to be associated with the blind retards association and I don't play these though I did find and try these ages ago. To say, bd, is an understatement. If you want something like this, then you should play the kitchensinc games. Yeah, basic, and quite old school but at least they emulate the physical boards and actually are enjoyable. At 03:56 p.m. 23/01/2011, you wrote: Hey everyone, I just ran across these games from American Printing House for the Blind, but they seem a little highly priced to me. Does anyone have these games, and are they worth it? The games are: Armidillo Army, Termite Torpedo, and Tudle Tiles or something like that.. Sorry, I know I destroyed the spelling on those, lol. If anyone has any information, please let me know. Take care, Ryan Globe Life Insurance $1* Buys $50,000 Life Insurance. Adults or Children. No Medical Exam. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/4d3b990149a1981410ast05vuc --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] help with heli
The first thing you need to do is adjust your trim, which is why you fly in circles. Press home or end until the click is in front of you and its pitch higher. Now you'll be flying straight. Next hold down page up for about five seconds. Let it go and press x to hear your coordinates. If you're at x 0 then adjust your angle with the left and right arrows until your angle is at 0, then fly straight on and you'll hit the switch. For the TV, you have to be flying at or below 3 feet. Smashing the TV makes your opponent fly his best though, so I just recommend shooting it a few times. If you're at x0, y0, at the above mentioned height, your angle needs to be about 335 degrees. Actually, you can hear how the FindAngle function works. Press a and you'll hear your angle, followed by the angle the TV is from the direction you're facing. So if it's directly on your copter's left side, you'll hear 270. Now turn left, and the second angle will change as does the first. You have a hit angle of about twenty, so as soon as the angle gets to between 350 and 10, shoot the tv--or crash into it. One thing I forgot to mention in the manual: as you know by now, Heli flies around you, but the trim, angle, and target changes are heard relative to your head's position. Therefore, when you're cranking the angle knob and hear a click from your extreme right, it means that your chopper is facing 90 degrees. Now, both the opponent and tv might be behind it--but it's not a targetting click, just an angle indicator. I did it this was because a sighted person would see the knob for trim; if the arrow points straight up, the trim is perfect. The angle knob is an offshoot of that idea and works well for me--and it should for you too once you get the hang of flying Heli. By the way, Heli is pronounced Helly--just in case you're saying it the way your screen reader does. Ken Downey President DreamTechInteractive! And, Blind Comfort! The pleasant way to experience massage! It's the Caring without the Staring! - Original Message - From: peter Mahach piterm...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 8:20 AM Subject: [Audyssey] help with heli Hi ken, I got this game and I must say I quite like it, however I don't understand something. How exactly do you move. I'm for instance trying to smash the tv. what I do is hit home until the little click comes from my left instead of the right, then I begin to hold page up to accelerate, then I use my left arrow until I hear a click on my left (where the tv is I think). but when I hold up arrow it just begins flying in circles or that's what it sounds like. I can shoot it to turn it off but can't find it to smash it. likewise I'm trying to hit the light switch but can't. in the manual you say to get 5 feet into the air, but I keep hitting page up but can never get the z access high until I eventually hit the seeling. at that point there's a bug, because I can only hear the fan and the tv but not the helicopters. so it's hard to fly around at that point. Nice idea though. take care! - Peter Mahach |piterm...@gmail.com msn: pitermac...@hotmail.com skype (not very often): pitermach twitter: http://www.twitter.com/pitermach webpage: http://pmsworld.weisi4u.de/ __ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 5266 (20100709) __ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH?
There's no use of stereo whatsoever in those games as far as I remember. Ken Downey President DreamTechInteractive! And, Blind Comfort! The pleasant way to experience massage! It's the Caring without the Staring! - Original Message - From: dark d...@xgam.org To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 11:09 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH? I can't confirm this, sinse I've never managed to get the things to work myself, though i have tried the demos on several occasions, but that is what I have heard, no panning just the words left and right Beware the greu1 Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH?
I can confirm this as I managed to play armadillo army on one pc that I was lucky enough to find it worked on. However I had a weird issue with the game on the pc I had it on where the sample rate of the sounds just dropped to 11khz for some reason. Though that was an old pc with like 256mb ram, so who knows. - Original Message - From: dark d...@xgam.org To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 5:09 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH? I can't confirm this, sinse I've never managed to get the things to work myself, though i have tried the demos on several occasions, but that is what I have heard, no panning just the words left and right Beware the greu1 Dark. __ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 5266 (20100709) __ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
[Audyssey] new link to ken's games?
Could someone please send me the new link for ken's games? Thanks. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
[Audyssey] Novag Citrine chess computer findings
I posted a query to this list, asking if anyone has had experience with this chess computer, then listed info from the web site. I received the computer last night, and here are my initial findings. I'll list the info from the site again, with my comments after each one: This luxury state-of-the-art chess computer will give you the feeling of being royalty. The cabinet, and dark squares are walnut, and the white squares are maple. The chess pieces are boxwood. The Novag Citrine MODEL #1032 chess computer has the most recent state of the art technology using a H8/300H RISC Processor. A comment: On low skill levels, this computer plays an excellent game, and the processor is very quick at coming up with surprising moves. It has been specifically designed for the truly elite chess player. The Novag Citrine is the most powerful, quickest thinking, highest rated, and most elegant chess computer available in the world. Comment: It is a very impressive looking chess board. It has a very nice finish to the squares, and the Staunton pieces are just a touch smaller than the chess set you got if you took the beginner's chess course from Hadley. The bishops aren't as conically shaped as I would like, although they are distinct, and it is a personal preference. . Estimated rating of 2330 Elo Comment: Well, after a bit of play, I now know what that indicates. It will beat the snot out of you! Heh heh heh. . 81 LED's - four in each corner of the squares on the chessboard Comment: You can feel these LEDs, so you know where the squares are, and a light probe will detect them. More on this in a bit. . Wood chess board . Chessboard chassis, and dark squares are walnut, and the white squares are maple . Chess pieces are boxwood Comment: This is a nice chess set to leave sitting on a coffee table for display. When a friend came over and saw it on my desk, he said, Wow! That's a beautiful set! Really looks nice and classy! . Chess board size is 11 3/4 inches x 11 3/4 inches . Hand carved wooden chess pieces with 2.5 King . The King measures 2 1/2 inches tall . RISC Processor H8/300H . Program Size 56K Byte ROM (Read-Only-Memory) . RAM: 3K Byte RAM (Random-Access- Memory) . System Clock Speed 20 MHz . Power Consumption 450 mW max. Comment: This computer does not operate on batteries, so you could not play chess while traveling. Nor is it noisy enough to be heard in a car, bus, or plane. It is for home use only, unfortunately. . Opening Book appr. 24,000 halfmoves Comment: It does have a very wide selection of book openings that it selects at random, based on your first move if you are playing White, or it will select one at random if it is playing White. It's first move is not always the same. . Separate detachable LCD screen has a six character alphanumeric display with a chess clock, shows moves and a full range of game information, also allows insight into the computer's thinking process and verifies positions . Separate detachable LCD screen chassis measures 3 1/2 inches x 2 1/4 inches, and the screen measures 1 3/4 inch x 3/4 inch Comment: The computer works the same whether this LCD unit is plugged in or not, so I play without it. But it does have a very clear and sharp display according to what the friend said about it. . PC interface cable (included) allows the game to be followed on a computer screen . Save and print games or connect to www.playwitharena.com which will allow you to play UCI programs and convert games to pgn. Comment: This is a serial port cable, not a USB. All of the information on the LCD display will show up on the computer screen, along with a board layout so that other people can see the game in progress if you have a big screen. I haven't tried playing other chess engines through this machine, and I'm not really into that sort of thing, so don't know how often I will be using this capability of the machine. . Files for download: 1. Novag Chess Computer to PC Protocol with Microsoft Hyoerterninal program. 2. Citrine PC communication Protocol 3. Citrine to PC with Arena 4. Citrine play a third-party chess engine on the Citrine via Arena. . Auto-sensing of moves on sensory board detects the location of chess pieces Comments: The way it works is this: There is a magnet in the base of each chess piece that will attract a switch that is positioned under each of the board's squares. Pick up a piece, and the switch is released. Place a piece on a square, and the switch is lifted. This is how the computer keeps track of the board position. However, the magnets are not strong enough to hold the pieces in place if you are scoping out your move on the board. I solved this by placing strip magnet material with adhesive backing, cut to the size of the squares, on each square of the board. It was easy to center them using the 4 LEDs in each corner of the squares as a guide. The men now stick to these strip
[Audyssey] weekly schedule for In The Blind Spot
InTheBlindSpot Weekly Schedule Please watch daily schedule for any changes. Sunday, January 23, 2011 8:00 A.M. ET Sunday Morning Listening Blind Spot Radio Broadcast Hosted by Velvet 3:00 PM ET Mississippi Game 1 Mississippi Room Hosted by Tiffany On-going game 4:00 PM ET Mississippi Game 2 Mississippi Room Hosted by Velvet On-going game 9:00 PM ET What's Talking Now Game Spot Hosted by Gary Bear and Sassy Jo Monday, January 24, 2011 1:00 PM ET Mississippi Game 2 Mississippi Room Hosted by Velvet On-going game 4:00 PM ET Ozzy's Place Blind Spot Radio Broadcast Hosted by Ozzy 7:00 PM ET Hans's Country Corner Blind Spot Radio Broadcast Hosted by DJ Hans Country Music 9:00 PM ET Bet your booty Game Spot Hosted by Tim and Gary Bear Tuesday, January 25, 2011 10:00 AM ET Mississippi Game 2 Mississippi Room Hosted by Velvet On-going game 2:00 PM ET Monster's Box of Chocolates Blind Spot Radio Broadcast Hosted by DJ Monster 3:00 PM ET Mississippi Game Mississippi Room Hosted by Velvet On-going Game 5:00 PM ET Zilch Game Zilch Room 9:00 PM ET Game to be decided Game Spot Wednesday, January 26, 2011 1:00 PM ET Snowy's Selections Blind Spot Radio Broadcast Hosted by DJ Snowy 3:00 PM ET Mississippi Game 1 Mississippi Room Hosted by Tiffany On-going game 9:00 PM ET password Game Spot Hosted by Velvet Thursday, January 27, 2011 1:00 PM ET Try to remember Blind Spot Radio Broadcast Hosted by DJ Monster 4:00 PM ET Mel's Musical Menagerie Blind Spot Radio Broadcast Hosted by Mel 9:00 PM ET Jeopardy Game Spot Hosted by Tiffany Friday, January 28, 2011 6:00 PM ET Monster's musicals Blind Spot Radio Broadcast Hosted by DJ Monster 7:00 PM ET Cooking with Fran Cosy Kitchen Room Hosted by Fran Soups and stews, bring your recipes along and share them with others. 9:00 PM ET Cringo Game Spot Hosted by Mel Saturday, January 29, 2011 2:00 PM ET Open Mike Open Mike Room Hosted by Ozzy 7:00 PM ET Delma's music mix Blind Spot Radio Broadcast Hosted by DJ Delma 9:00 PM ET Chain Reaction Game Spot Hosted by Velvet Bring your thinking caps along and try to guess the words in the chain. __._,_.___ --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
[Audyssey] question about grogan, an old game for the apple
oh and I remember there was another bit where you get chased by a wolf. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH?
Hi Phil, Yeah, I realize being produced by APH they are primarily designed for schools and school age children, but I still think games like Termite torpedo are overly priced compared to what else is on the market. There are several other games out here that is as good as and even better than Termite torpedo for less. As for Toodle Tiles I don't think I've ever played that one personally. As far as I know it is the only accessible Mahjong game on the market right now. So That one might be worth paying for just to acquire it but most of the others I wouldn't give a dime for. My personal opinion of course. Cheers! On 1/23/11, Phil Vlasak p...@pcsgames.net wrote: Hi Thomas, The games from APH are designed to be purchased by sighted teachers for blind and visually impaired children. They all have large print graphics. Larry Skutchan is the head of development and being totally blind he is aware of the range of games for the blind as he purchased all of PCS earlier DOS games. Unfortunately he has to have the game concepts accepted by a board of advisers who probably reduced the challenge in the game concepts to make them easier to play for young children. I had fun playing Toodle Tiles, Based on the ancient game of Mahjong And Talking Word Puzzles is very challenging. It is an accessible crossword puzzle game. The others, Armadillo Army, Termite torpedo, and Hurry Scurry I wouldn't buy as they are too easy. Phil --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Games from APH?
Hi Dark, That's my experience as well. Granted I was fully sighted at ages 8, 9, 10, etc but I was playing games way harder than the APH games at that age. At age 9, around 1987, the leading titles ffor the NES were Mario Brothers, Castlevania, Double Dragon, Castlevania, Megaman, and a couple of others. All were released around 87 and 88. If I had been given an APH game at that age not only would I have slotterd my way through it I would probably have been board to tears as I did it. So I don't know why people consistently think things have to be made easy for the blind when I'm certain many of us could rise to the challenge if we wanted to. I'm sick and tired of us being treated as a half-whit, subhuman, retard just because our eyes don't function. What I'm talking about is dignity, and I believe the blind should be given the exact same respect, challenges, and oppertunities as our sighted peers. Cheers! On 1/23/11, dark d...@xgam.org wrote: I'm a litle confused why the difficulty of the games would be lowered as to be so ridiculous just because they are aimed at young children, something I thought when I tried mudsplat. I think I first completed Golden axe on the Amigar at the age of 8, and super bomberman and street fighter 2 at normal difficulty at the age of nine, though these took a lot of practice. I was playing berzerk and joust when I was about four, and while I did often play on the easy setting, this wasn't that much less difficult than normal (easy on berzerk, the robots didn't fire at you). So while having a range of difficulties for different aged players is reasonable, your probably likely to find not a few kids who could slaughter their way through something if it was made too easy, which seems to be the case with the aph games. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Game Engines was Heli
Hi Rynhardt, Rinhardt wrote: I think the idea of Open Source Software is generally miss understood. Part of that may be because of the fact that certain groups prefer to call it Free Software, which is associated with freeware. My response: Agreed. I use Linux myself, have done so for a long time, but unlike a lot of people I've actually read the various license agreements. I pretty much understand where the General Public License stands on various issues, but I don't think your average Joe and Jane does. It is just legal mumbo jumbo to them. They prefer to think of Linux as a free OS when there certainly are commercial distros like Mandriva, Suse, Red Hat, etc that make money off of selling the books, cds, and technical support. It is just that the sourse code is available on demand if you want it. Unfortunately, based on my discussions with several Linux users on various mailing list they are under some illusion that Linux is free and therefore all software for it should be free too. Rynhardt wrote: Open source software is not freeware and will never be. The idea of Open Source Software is just that the source code should be open and available to any one who would like to study or modify it. That is also the reason that many people including myself prefer to use Linux. If I want my computer to say hello every time it begins the boot process, I can do so without having to edit some binary file with a hex editor. Also it encourage the studying of source code. Thus if someone enters the audio gaming community, he/she can immediately find out how a game engine works for instance without having to reinvent the wheel. My reply: Yes, that's exactly what interested me about Linux as well. If there is something I wanted to modify I could make a change in the source, recompile it with gcc, and happily go on my way with my custom program/OS. Admitedly though, this advantage of having the source is really only useful if you are a programmer with the skills to modify'/study it in the first place. For the average Joe/Jane Linux software is often viewed as freeware, and insist that products for Linux remain freeware etc even though that isn't the intent of the GPL. Rynhardt wrote: One thing I've thought about is to put the game itself under an open source license, and sell the sounds and/or music. My reply: That works. I've seen a few games do that. For example, after Loki Games bit the dust ID Software decided to make Quake I open source, putting the source code in the public domain, but the sounds, music, and graphics were under a separate license. There is a lot of advantages to doing this. One, you are still offering the software itself under a open source license allowing potential game developers to use your engine, code, etc for future projects. Second, since the multimedia is under a separate license you can sell the game giving the software away for free but make your money off of the graphics, sounds, and music. The multimedia would be held under standard copyrights while the software is public domain. It is an interesting way of bridging the gap between open source and commercial software. Unfortunately, if there is any kind of product key system etc that can't be released as open source otherwise it would compromise licensing the software. Cheers! --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
