RE: gEDA-user: Re: VMPlayer Image
VMWare performance is very good on any 2GHz+ machine. It just works. The only real hook is with networking, unfortunately they best I've been able to get working is either shared directories or ftp between virtual machine and host. But internet access has always been a piece of cake, no problem whatsoever. This really is a good solution to the Windows crowd who have no desire to run Linux on a box. I know recently PCB and gSchem have made some strides to work under cygwin/mingw, but really it's a lot of work to get it going(PCB has always worked well under cygwin with the right libraries installed, gschem was always frozen in time with an old mingw compile). It's braindead simple to use, install VMWare player, drop VMWare image on the machine. No install issues, no compatibility issues. From: Kai-Martin Knaak [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: gEDA user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org To: geda-user@seul.org Subject: gEDA-user: Re: VMPlayer Image Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 03:00:11 + (UTC) On Fri, 16 Feb 2007 19:44:27 -0600, John Griessen wrote: I suppose some people might have 5 or so disk images they use in order to avoid integrating it all and getting 5 tools/entertainment_programs that way. Don't know about some people. But to me a vmplayer is a bridge to windows, that win users accept. Is VMware's emulation now THAT good, that the usual 2GHz+ hardware has no trouble with it? Not with such a slender application like geda on linux :^) and they offer a freebie now? (If you get someone else's image) I guess, it is a means to prevent competitors from entering the market via the low price segment. ---(kaimartin)--- -- Kai-Martin Knaak http://lilalaser.de/blog ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user _ With tax season right around the corner, make sure to follow these few simple tips. http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/Taxes/PreparationTips/PreparationTips.aspx?icid=HMFebtagline ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: VMPlayer Image
VMWare Player is free. There are also freeware tools out there to create VMWare images. From there you can do your linux + gEDA install and you are ready to go. The hook I've encountered in the past is I was never able to get the CD installs for gEDA to work on Fedora on a VMWare image. That may have changed recently. I've also tried qemu. It works but is an order of magnitude slower than VMWare. Interestingly certain linux variants were much slower than others on qemu. I did run Fedora Core under qemu for awhile and it was servicable. But once VMWare player was free there was no going back, the performance difference was substantial. From: John Griessen [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED],gEDA user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org To: gEDA user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org Subject: Re: gEDA-user: VMPlayer Image Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 19:44:27 -0600 Craig Niederberger wrote: *Yes*. My EECS students prefer to run linux inside vmware, as they typically have laptops with single drives. Joshua Boyd wrote: What VMware does very right is that it allows you to easily move virtual machines, in the form of images, from one machine to another. I heard from a professor that the concept of offering server machines loaded with gEDA and such was a dead issue because of VMware's market share and popularity for avoiding installation time, and just using huge areas of disks as tools. I suppose some people might have 5 or so disk images they use in order to avoid integrating it all and getting 5 tools/entertainment_programs that way. Is that a good guess? Is VMware's emulation now THAT good, that the usual 2GHz+ hardware has no trouble with it? and they offer a freebie now? (If you get someone else's image) How many images can run at once with Player? Is that their marketing ploy? If you want real convenience, you need a VMware license? John G ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user _ The average US Credit Score is 675. The cost to see yours: $0 by Experian. http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=660600bcd=EMAILFOOTERAVERAGE ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Re: VMPlayer Image
I suppose a torrent option is also viable. I know many of the linux VMWare images are done this way. From: John Griessen [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED],gEDA user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org To: gEDA user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org Subject: Re: gEDA-user: Re: VMPlayer Image Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 19:50:52 -0600 Kai-Martin Knaak wrote: Probably the thing that's holding this up is who wants to host a 500MB+ download? Hmm. I am tempted to volunteer. My webspace is mostly unused. Monthly traffic is 10GB only, I have a server with about 94GB going unused each month. I'll put it up for a while and see... After, (if), traffic gets to 50GB, I'll stop it. John G ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user _ Find what you need at prices youll love. Compare products and save at MSN® Shopping. http://shopping.msn.com/default/shp/?ptnrid=37,ptnrdata=24102tcode=T001MSN20A0701 ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Re: I need to open and print a PCB created in ExpressPCB:What are my options?
Oh. I didn't even know I could do that. Thanks, I'll try and set that up. On 2/16/07, Mark Rages [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 2/16/07, Ales Hvezda [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ok. I will keep those things in mind. p.s. I haven't quite got mailing lists worked out yet, because I've only really ever used forums and IRC channels. Is there some way that I can opt to receive mail only from threads to which I am subscribed? I know that's really a forum thing, so if not, I'll just opt to check the archives every so often instead of receiving mail. Not really, but you could turn on mail list digesting (it's in the mailman web interface), so that you get only get one message per day. This one message includes all the traffic for the list for the day. -Ales Jeremy is using Gmail, so he can do this: 1) set a filter to catch messages with gEDA-user in the subject and archive immediately (bypassing the Inbox). 2) to see threads you have posted in, click Sent Messages. The unread threads are highlighted. 3) to read the list, do a search for gEDA-user. Gmail is excellent for mailing lists. It's even better than NNTP clients. Regards, Mark [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- You think that it is a secret, but it never has been one. - fortune cookie ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user -- Windows [n.] A thirty-two bit extension and GUI shell to a sixteen bit patch to an eight bit operating system originally coded for a four bit microprocessor and sold by a two-bit company that can't stand one bit of competition. (Anonymous) ~*~*~*~*~ * JDP :) * ~*~*~*~*~ ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: YARR (refdes-update)
DJ Delorie wrote: Hehe, another refdes update utility. :-) I have completely lost track of the number of these. I'm sure it is at least 5+ by now. It's pretty amusing actually, we might end up with a new one of these per week. :) So, it's a race between refdes update utilities and PCB HIDs? ;-) I've gotten most of the GTK menus translated to the configurable form the lesstif HID uses... Dan's planning to get the missing functions connected, then lesstif and GTK will be neck and neck... with both having user-quick-changeable menus and bind keys. John G ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Why does auto-mirror mirror the bottom?
DJ Delorie wrote: I'd hate to have to second guess EVERYONE trying to use pcb and what kind of invert/mirror options they need. I like just using understandable language, and maybe tooltips for more detail. No assumptions is the best route because of all the wildly varying ways people use design tools. John G ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: vhdl and gschem
On Feb 16, 2007, at 6:49 PM, Ostheller, Joel A. wrote: Yes. Pick yourself up a copy of Peter Ashenden's The Designer's guide to VHDL. Additionally you may want to get a copy of the IEEE VHDL LRM. There is no reason to use schematic capture packages to do Verilog or VHDL. Some have claimed that using it to import your VHDL/Verilog such that it auto-generates a system block diagram is an acceptable use... I usually will give them that, but not much more. I totally agree. Skip schemtics entirely when doing FPGA designs. My FPGA testbenches include bus-functional models of everything the FPGA talks to. To support this, I use either vendor-supplied models (memories and such) or I write them myself. (PLX wanted me to give them my Verilog models of their 9030 and 9656 chips, so my company said, you'll need to pay us... and that ended that discussion quite quickly.) The microcontroller or whatever talks to the FPGA, which does something interesting, and interesting outputs result, which are compared to an expected result. The automatic block diagram is interesting, if only to put on a slide for a design review, but I'd argue that you should have your block diagram draw BEFORE you start coding ... -a ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: VMPlayer Image
On Fri, Feb 16, 2007 at 05:27:26PM -0500, al davis wrote: I think I am beginning to understand .. A Live CD requires no other software. No operating system other than the one on the CD. Hence anyone can run it, but with a reboot. And while in the Live CD you can't run your normal stuff. I have not tried it, but can't you run a Live CD under VMware, Xen, Qemu, etc ... all of them, with the same Live CD? I don't know about using a LiveCD with any of those. Maybe. Also, I don't know anything about using Xen for graphic stuff, or using Qemu for anything. As to the value of making the VM image .. I guess if it is a step toward moving away from PSpice, etc ... It's good. It saddens me to realize we need to resort to a non-free product to accomplish that. It saddens me that non of the free systems are easy to use. However, if it is any consolation, the VMWare image format is published and there are utilities to convert them to work with other systems. Additionally, the wikipedia article for Qemu says that qemu can just read these files directly. So, if the original poster did share the VMWare image, people would apparently be able to use it with completely free software, which is a worthy goal. -- Joshua D. Boyd [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.jdboyd.net/ http://www.joshuaboyd.org/ ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: VMPlayer Image
On Fri, Feb 16, 2007 at 07:44:27PM -0600, John Griessen wrote: I heard from a professor that the concept of offering server machines loaded with gEDA and such was a dead issue because of VMware's market share and popularity for avoiding installation time, and just using huge areas of disks as tools. I suppose some people might have 5 or so disk images they use in order to avoid integrating it all and getting 5 tools/entertainment_programs that way. Is that a good guess? VMWare probably isn't so good for entertainment programs. It does pass through OpenGL acceleration to some extent though. Also, it is an easy way to test stuff against Ubuntu or different FC versions, without constantly rebooting. I would imagine that Xen would be good as well, but Xen isn't particularly easy to use, and I don't know how it deals with graphical stuff, as I said. Is VMware's emulation now THAT good, that the usual 2GHz+ hardware has no trouble with it? and they offer a freebie now? (If you get someone else's image) VMWare Server runs adequately fast on a 2.8ghz Xeon w/ 2 gigs of ram. At work the IT guy has that set up running something like 6 images. Ram allocations are a bit skimpy (web services have 32-128 megs each, desktop installs for testing stuff have 256 megs allocated). The other developer where I work constantly complains about the speed compared to his desktop, but every time I try to look into it, the laptop runnign linux in vmware beats the pants off the desktop for building software, or even running gedit, so I don't know what he is complaining about. How many images can run at once with Player? One. But, there is also a free Server. It runs lots of images (don't know the max), but it caps the resolution at 1024x768 and doesn't do full screen mode. Is that their marketing ploy? If you want real convenience, you need a VMware license? Previously we (me and the IT guy) had trouble getting networking working nicely with laptops without buying the Workstation product instead of Player. The IT guy says he has resolved that, but I don't know what the trick was. What the problem was that player supported bridge or loopback, but not both at once. With loopback, the VMWare machines can't talk to the outside world (except perhaps via setting up a proxy or routing system on the host I guess), but with bridging, VMWare can't talk to the host when disconnected from a network (like sitting on you lap in an airport without wireless). I don't know where Server sits in this mix. This trouble was discovered when trying to setup Linux on Windows for another developer who refused to remove windows from the laptop, and also refused to try colinux. -- Joshua D. Boyd [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.jdboyd.net/ http://www.joshuaboyd.org/ ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Why does auto-mirror mirror the bottom?
On Fri, Feb 16, 2007 at 11:11:40PM -0500, DJ Delorie wrote: Maybe the dialog should be task-oriented instead of setting-oriented. But if you can come up with a suitable scheme and a patch (it's all in src/hid/ps.c) I'm open to convincing. The current scheme, if I understand it, works like this: mirror | auto-mirror | result ---+-+--- 0 | 0 | as shown on screen 1 | 0 | all layers mirrored 0 | 1 | as if you were looking at the finished pcb 1 | 1 | suitable for toner transfer, transparencies So what about an option button that covers both bits with those descriptions? More advanced would be to produce one set suitable for an entire task. For example all 'assembly' drawings would print 'as if you were looking at the finished pcb', while copper layers would print 'suitable for toner transfer'. Then you could make and assemble a board from one print set. -- Ben Jackson AD7GD [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ben.com/ ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Why does auto-mirror mirror the bottom?
Ben Jackson wrote: The current scheme, if I understand it, works like this: mirror | auto-mirror | result ---+-+--- 0 | 0 | as shown on screen 1 | 0 | all layers mirrored 0 | 1 | as if you were looking at the finished pcb 1 | 1 | suitable for toner transfer, transparencies Mmmm... to be more specific, it is as if you were looking at the top and middle layers as made, but looking at the bottom layer from the back, not looking through the translucent board material. So what about an option button that covers both bits with those descriptions? It would be less confusing to have a layer name list as in your drawing, with per layer option to mirror or not. Then also, if you were still in the mood for GUI coding, offer use cases as check boxes that modify the state of the per layer check boxes, (while also showing that state). And just drop the wording auto-mirror altogether. It's more like assume-o-matic than automatic... John G ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Why does auto-mirror mirror the bottom?
The current scheme, if I understand it, works like this: mirror | auto-mirror | result ---+-+--- 0 | 0 | as shown on screen 1 | 0 | all layers mirrored 0 | 1 | as if you were looking at the finished pcb 1 | 1 | suitable for toner transfer, transparencies Yup. So what about an option button that covers both bits with those descriptions? I was thinking about this, and thinking about wording: None All Back (as seen) Front (photo/tt) but back and front would always mirror the assembly and fab drawings as seen More advanced would be to produce one set suitable for an entire task. For example all 'assembly' drawings would print 'as if you were looking at the finished pcb', while copper layers would print 'suitable for toner transfer'. Then you could make and assemble a board from one print set. Assuming you didn't need inverted coppers for photo negatives, but non-inverted silkscreen plots. The fun never ends. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Why does auto-mirror mirror the bottom?
It would be less confusing to have a layer name list as in your drawing, with per layer option to mirror or not. Then also, if you were still in the mood for GUI coding, offer use cases as check boxes that modify the state of the per layer check boxes, (while also showing that state). And just drop the wording auto-mirror altogether. It's more like assume-o-matic than automatic... I think it would get too messy to put all the options in a layer-specific grid. However, we could do something like Eagle where we have a CAM job that specifies, in excrutiating detail, what the output would be. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Why does auto-mirror mirror the bottom?
On Sat, Feb 17, 2007 at 06:02:42PM -0500, DJ Delorie wrote: I was thinking about this, and thinking about wording: None All Back (as seen) Front (photo/tt) I was totally confused by this until I realized you mean to label the resulting option mirror: so that would be mirror: none, etc, right? That would be a big improvement. BTW, while you're in there, if you check 'individual files', it should put the layer names before any trailing '.ps', otherwise you have to use 'foo.ps' when printing a single file but delete '.ps' for individual files. -- Ben Jackson AD7GD [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ben.com/ ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Why does auto-mirror mirror the bottom?
None All Back (as seen) Front (photo/tt) I was totally confused by this until I realized you mean to label the resulting option mirror: so that would be mirror: none, etc, right? Right. The option name is mirror and the options are as above. BTW, while you're in there, if you check 'individual files', it should put the layer names before any trailing '.ps', otherwise you have to use 'foo.ps' when printing a single file but delete '.ps' for individual files. Hmm... I'll see what I can do. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
gEDA-user: Re: VMPlayer Image
On Sat, 17 Feb 2007 08:51:45 -0600, Mike Hansen wrote: I suppose a torrent option is also viable. I know many of the linux VMWare images are done this way. How about an image based on one of the small footprint distros like DamnSmallLinux? Those might reduce the size of the image quite a bit. In addition they tend to rely on fast running light window managers etc. ---(kaimartin)--- -- Kai-Martin Knaak http://lilalaser.de/blog ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
gEDA-user: LM318 , LT318 any difference?
anyone know? The don't simulate quite the same, and cost is a bunch different - yet the specs look very similar. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: LM318 , LT318 any difference?
On Saturday 17 February 2007 22:00, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: anyone know? The don't simulate quite the same, and cost is a bunch different - yet the specs look very similar. Based on the data sheet, it looks to me that LT318 is a selected LM318. You say they don't simulate quite the same. Did you look at the models to see what is different? If they are binary blobs, do you trust them? I love it when I see models like a transistor model that shows a beta of something like 273.472823. A quick look at the data sheet says beta is between 50 and 500. Do you trust it? ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
