Re: [gentoo-dev] New global USE flag: introspection
On 21 June 2010 21:23, Arun Raghavan ford_pref...@gentoo.org wrote: [...] I'm still trying to think of a good name. I understand the concerns about introspection being too generic and non GNOME-y, but gir is likely to cause confusion. gir is not good because it gives near-zero information. I can still not think of short enough USE flag. I propose we stick to introspection. There isn't anything on the horizon that might overlap with this flag, and I don't see why we should drop using a simpler flag for the *possibility* that it might overlap with something else in the future. We can deal with this if it happens. Cheers, -- Arun Raghavan http://arunraghavan.net/ (Ford_Prefect | Gentoo) (arunsr | GNOME)
Re: [gentoo-dev] New global USE flag: introspection
On Mon, 21 Jun 2010 10:13:56 +0530 Arun Raghavan ford_pref...@gentoo.org wrote: 2010/6/21 Olivier Crête tes...@gentoo.org: On Sun, 2010-06-20 at 20:12 +0530, Arun Raghavan wrote: I'd like to propose a new global USE-flag: introspection. ... Any objections? I'll wait till Wed (June 23rd) before adding this if there aren't any. Do we really want it to be a USE flag ? I would force it on always for everyone. Due to the direction in which GNOME is heading, it will be required by the core desktop anyway. [...] I do agree with you about it being part of the core desktop and required by most users, so it will be enabled by default for all ebuilds. Won't it be better to enable it by default only in 'gnome' subprofile? I don't see a use for it elsewhere. -- Best regards, Michał Górny http://mgorny.alt.pl xmpp:mgo...@jabber.ru signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] New global USE flag: introspection
On Sunday 20 of June 2010 16:42:58 Arun Raghavan wrote: Hi folks, I'd like to propose a new global USE-flag: introspection. The purpose of the flag is to enable the building of GIR for the package using dev-libs/gobject-introspection. gobject-introspection is going to be quite important in upcoming GNOME releases, allowing for the automated generation of bindings for several languages. We already have 13 packages using this flag, with several more to come. The current description being used in packages' metadata.xml sucks - I'll put something more descriptive in the final flag. Any objections? I'll wait till Wed (June 23rd) before adding this if there aren't any. I don't mind adding it as globally recognizable USE flag, I'd mind however having it enabled by default in desktop/base profile. If Gnome needs it, please enable it in gnome subprofile if you wish (apart from setting all required USE deps in ebuilds), you can also use IUSE defaults for it which would allow more fine grained control or if you or Gnome devs decided to drop the idea at some point. -- regards MM
Re: [gentoo-dev] New global USE flag: introspection
On Mon, Jun 21, 2010 at 1:03 PM, Maciej Mrozowski reave...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday 20 of June 2010 16:42:58 Arun Raghavan wrote: Hi folks, I'd like to propose a new global USE-flag: introspection. I don't mind adding it as globally recognizable USE flag, I'd mind however having it enabled by default in desktop/base profile. There are no plans to enable this USE-flag in the desktop/base profiles. If Gnome needs it, please enable it in gnome subprofile if you wish (apart from setting all required USE deps in ebuilds), There are no plans as yet to do this either. you can also use IUSE defaults for it which would allow more fine grained control or if you or Gnome devs decided to drop the idea at some point. Most of the ebuilds with this USE-flag, have it enabled via IUSE defaults, and that is how we plan to enable it. If that plan changes, however, there will be an RFC on this mailing list as is the proper procedure. Thanks -- ~Nirbheek Chauhan Gentoo GNOME+Mozilla Team
Re: [gentoo-dev] New global USE flag: introspection
On Monday 21 of June 2010 16:22:08 Olivier Crête wrote: On Mon, 2010-06-21 at 09:33 +0200, Maciej Mrozowski wrote: On Sunday 20 of June 2010 16:42:58 Arun Raghavan wrote: Hi folks, I'd like to propose a new global USE-flag: introspection. The purpose of the flag is to enable the building of GIR for the package using dev-libs/gobject-introspection. gobject-introspection is going to be quite important in upcoming GNOME releases, allowing for the automated generation of bindings for several languages. We already have 13 packages using this flag, with several more to come. The current description being used in packages' metadata.xml sucks - I'll put something more descriptive in the final flag. Any objections? I'll wait till Wed (June 23rd) before adding this if there aren't any. I don't mind adding it as globally recognizable USE flag, I'd mind however having it enabled by default in desktop/base profile. If Gnome needs it, please enable it in gnome subprofile if you wish (apart from setting all required USE deps in ebuilds), you can also use IUSE defaults for it which would allow more fine grained control or if you or Gnome devs decided to drop the idea at some point. Oh no! You'll have two small data files for each package! That's so terrible! You should definitely look through /usr/share, there are lots of other files you dont absolutely need too. Maybe you should start filing bugs against every package that install these tiny files you don't need! All those wasted inodes! If that's the case (they are essential for Gnome or whatever to work, just two files per package, not bringing any additional dependencies nor probability of causing compilation failures), I find it rather odd to make it optional at all. As for attempted irony of yours, I've already filled some gtk-doc and USE=doc related bugs, thxbye :P -- regards MM
Re: [gentoo-dev] New global USE flag: introspection
On 21 June 2010 21:14, Maciej Mrozowski reave...@gmail.com wrote: [...] If that's the case (they are essential for Gnome or whatever to work, just two files per package, not bringing any additional dependencies nor probability of causing compilation failures), I find it rather odd to make it optional at all. As I explained, the reason I think it makes sense to make it optional is for embedded systems, where you want to enable introspection for only the subset of your package where you need the dynamically generated bindings. I agree that this is a tenuous argument in itself, but I figure that now that we've started this way, and there /is/ a benefit to it, we might as well carry it through. I'm still trying to think of a good name. I understand the concerns about introspection being too generic and non GNOME-y, but gir is likely to cause confusion. -- Arun Raghavan http://arunraghavan.net/ (Ford_Prefect | Gentoo) (arunsr | GNOME)
[gentoo-dev] New global USE flag: introspection
Hi folks, I'd like to propose a new global USE-flag: introspection. The purpose of the flag is to enable the building of GIR for the package using dev-libs/gobject-introspection. gobject-introspection is going to be quite important in upcoming GNOME releases, allowing for the automated generation of bindings for several languages. We already have 13 packages using this flag, with several more to come. The current description being used in packages' metadata.xml sucks - I'll put something more descriptive in the final flag. Any objections? I'll wait till Wed (June 23rd) before adding this if there aren't any. Cheers! -- Arun Raghavan http://arunraghavan.net/ (Ford_Prefect | Gentoo) (arunsr | GNOME)
Re: [gentoo-dev] New global USE flag: introspection
On Sun, 2010-06-20 at 20:12 +0530, Arun Raghavan wrote: I'd like to propose a new global USE-flag: introspection. ... Any objections? I'll wait till Wed (June 23rd) before adding this if there aren't any. Do we really want it to be a USE flag ? I would force it on always for everyone. Due to the direction in which GNOME is heading, it will be required by the core desktop anyway. -- Olivier Crête tes...@gentoo.org Gentoo Developer signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: [gentoo-dev] New global USE flag: introspection
2010/6/21 Olivier Crête tes...@gentoo.org: On Sun, 2010-06-20 at 20:12 +0530, Arun Raghavan wrote: I'd like to propose a new global USE-flag: introspection. ... Any objections? I'll wait till Wed (June 23rd) before adding this if there aren't any. Do we really want it to be a USE flag ? I would force it on always for everyone. Due to the direction in which GNOME is heading, it will be required by the core desktop anyway. On the other hand, it's not just GNOME-3 which uses gtk+, atk, pango, etc. A lot of the libraries that we package are going to be used outside GNOME, and I really don't see why we should force this stuff onto them when we don't absolutely have to. -- ~Nirbheek Chauhan Gentoo GNOME+Mozilla Team
Re: [gentoo-dev] New global USE flag: introspection
On Sun, Jun 20, 2010 at 04:14:16PM -0400, Olivier Crrrte wrote: On Sun, 2010-06-20 at 20:12 +0530, Arun Raghavan wrote: I'd like to propose a new global USE-flag: introspection. ... Any objections? I'll wait till Wed (June 23rd) before adding this if there aren't any. Do we really want it to be a USE flag ? I would force it on always for everyone. Due to the direction in which GNOME is heading, it will be required by the core desktop anyway. Use deps exist for situations like this ;) Beyond that, the naming kind of sucks from where I'm sitting- it's a gobject/gnome specific flag in intention, but introspection has many meanings elsewhere that may not map cleanly there. Anyone got a better name for it? ~harring pgpHXKyDbfSen.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] New global USE flag: introspection
On Mon, Jun 21, 2010 at 4:25 AM, Brian Harring ferri...@gmail.com wrote: Beyond that, the naming kind of sucks from where I'm sitting- it's a gobject/gnome specific flag in intention, but introspection has many meanings elsewhere that may not map cleanly there. Well, there's nothing else in this namespace (i.e., amongst use-flags) which uses this word, and I don't see anything else that would want to use it in-tree. So, I don't see what the problem is with us taking over it :) As for confusions w.r.t. name, the use-flag descriptions exist precisely to clarify that. I personally wouldn't assume a use-flag's intention before seeing it's corresponding description. Also note that perl/ruby/python/java/javascript etc bindings will be/are using gobject-introspection[1], so this particular usage of the term will become very prevalent in the near future. 1. http://live.gnome.org/GObjectIntrospection/Users -- ~Nirbheek Chauhan Gentoo GNOME+Mozilla Team
Re: [gentoo-dev] New global USE flag: introspection
2010/6/21 Olivier Crête tes...@gentoo.org: On Sun, 2010-06-20 at 20:12 +0530, Arun Raghavan wrote: I'd like to propose a new global USE-flag: introspection. ... Any objections? I'll wait till Wed (June 23rd) before adding this if there aren't any. Do we really want it to be a USE flag ? I would force it on always for everyone. Due to the direction in which GNOME is heading, it will be required by the core desktop anyway. In addition to what Nirbheek pointed out, I think a USE flag would be useful for embedded setups where you might only want introspection for a subset of libraries. I do agree with you about it being part of the core desktop and required by most users, so it will be enabled by default for all ebuilds. Cheers, -- Arun Raghavan http://arunraghavan.net/ (Ford_Prefect | Gentoo) (arunsr | GNOME)
