Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[J. Roeleveld]

On March 22, 2016 1:37:16 AM GMT+01:00, Dale  wrote:
>Neil Bothwick wrote:
>> On Tue, 22 Mar 2016 00:10:12 + (UTC), Grant Edwards wrote:
>>
> Anyone who boots directly to X'doze without first going through a
> safe console login is a raging mad lunatic who needs his head
> examined.  
 After all, it's not as though it falls back to a console if X fails
>to
 load - as it does with monotonous regularity every eight years or
 so.  
>>> Except X failing to load and falling back toa console never seems to
>>> the failure mode I'd run into.  It's more like X starts up and the
>>> keyboard and mouse don't work, so I've got to go dig out my laptop
>>> (which was hopefully not left at the office) boot it up and then ssh
>>> into the temporarily headless machine and kill X.
>> It's that long since I've had X fail to start (probably because I
>don't
>> use binary drivers) that I can't really remember, but I don't recall
>> every having to do this.
>>
>> Even so, having to look for something else to SSH in with, when my
>phone
>> is always in my pocket, every 8 years would use far less time that
>that
>> I've saved over the years - but I'd try Alt-SysReq-R before hunting
>for
>> an SSH client.
>>
>>
>
>
>The last time I had X to fail when booting was when I tried hal.  Other
>than that, I don't recall it ever failing for me either. 
>
>Dale
>
>:-)  :-) 

You said it! *gasp*horror* :)

Call the exorcist!

--
Joost
-- 
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.

Re: [gentoo-user] Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[J. Roeleveld]

On March 22, 2016 12:26:42 AM GMT+01:00, Neil Bothwick  
wrote:
>On Mon, 21 Mar 2016 17:43:38 +0200, Alan McKinnon wrote:
>
>> Danger, Will Robinson, danger!
>> 
>> The power of the troll is strong with this one.
>
>Read Alert! Res Alert! Mixed movie/TV references!

I think you're getting your reference wrong with the first one :)

The 'Reed alert' came from Lt. Malcolm Reed.

--
Joost
-- 
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[Dale]

Neil Bothwick wrote:
> On Tue, 22 Mar 2016 00:10:12 + (UTC), Grant Edwards wrote:
>
 Anyone who boots directly to X'doze without first going through a
 safe console login is a raging mad lunatic who needs his head
 examined.  
>>> After all, it's not as though it falls back to a console if X fails to
>>> load - as it does with monotonous regularity every eight years or
>>> so.  
>> Except X failing to load and falling back toa console never seems to
>> the failure mode I'd run into.  It's more like X starts up and the
>> keyboard and mouse don't work, so I've got to go dig out my laptop
>> (which was hopefully not left at the office) boot it up and then ssh
>> into the temporarily headless machine and kill X.
> It's that long since I've had X fail to start (probably because I don't
> use binary drivers) that I can't really remember, but I don't recall
> every having to do this.
>
> Even so, having to look for something else to SSH in with, when my phone
> is always in my pocket, every 8 years would use far less time that that
> I've saved over the years - but I'd try Alt-SysReq-R before hunting for
> an SSH client.
>
>


The last time I had X to fail when booting was when I tried hal.  Other
than that, I don't recall it ever failing for me either. 

Dale

:-)  :-) 

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[Neil Bothwick]

On Tue, 22 Mar 2016 00:10:12 + (UTC), Grant Edwards wrote:

> >> Anyone who boots directly to X'doze without first going through a
> >> safe console login is a raging mad lunatic who needs his head
> >> examined.  
> 
> > After all, it's not as though it falls back to a console if X fails to
> > load - as it does with monotonous regularity every eight years or
> > so.  
> 
> Except X failing to load and falling back toa console never seems to
> the failure mode I'd run into.  It's more like X starts up and the
> keyboard and mouse don't work, so I've got to go dig out my laptop
> (which was hopefully not left at the office) boot it up and then ssh
> into the temporarily headless machine and kill X.

It's that long since I've had X fail to start (probably because I don't
use binary drivers) that I can't really remember, but I don't recall
every having to do this.

Even so, having to look for something else to SSH in with, when my phone
is always in my pocket, every 8 years would use far less time that that
I've saved over the years - but I'd try Alt-SysReq-R before hunting for
an SSH client.


-- 
Neil Bothwick

Znqr lbh ybbx!


pgpVlMKec55Ci.pgp
Description: OpenPGP digital signature

[gentoo-user] Re: Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[Grant Edwards]

On 2016-03-21, Neil Bothwick  wrote:
> On Mon, 21 Mar 2016 10:52:26 -0400, Alan Grimes wrote:
>
>> Anyone who boots directly to X'doze without first going through a safe
>> console login is a raging mad lunatic who needs his head examined.

> After all, it's not as though it falls back to a console if X fails to
> load - as it does with monotonous regularity every eight years or so.

Except X failing to load and falling back toa console never seems to
the failure mode I'd run into.  It's more like X starts up and the
keyboard and mouse don't work, so I've got to go dig out my laptop
(which was hopefully not left at the office) boot it up and then ssh
into the temporarily headless machine and kill X.

-- 
Grant

Re: [gentoo-user] Akregator.

[Neil Bothwick]

On Mon, 21 Mar 2016 10:37:25 -0400, Alan Grimes wrote:

> >> What is the exact line I need to add to the pile of hacks, and
> >> workarounds in that file?  

If the fie is full of hacks and workarounds, you are problably doing
something wrong.

> > kde-base/baloo minimal  

> I treat package.use as a last resort because, over the long haul it
> tends to fuck things up and is difficult to maintain. Whenever possible,
> I solve all issues with ufed.

It's a file or directory, it does not f*** things up, that's your job as
administrator.

> I didn't think it was possible to set a package like that, I thought it
> had to be something stupid like:
> 
> >=kde-base/baloo-1.0  

Then you haven't done much manual reading in the last ten years.
 
> or something, which I think it had to be at one point in time. or
> something to target the kde4 version and not the kde 5 version, or some
> other ninjitsu.

If you had read the error message properly, you would see that is not
necessary as the two conflicting version of baloo are in different
categories. Perhaps you should put down your rant-pen for a few minutes
and spend the time on something constructive, like reading the Gentoo
handbook or man pages.


-- 
Neil Bothwick

Be regular. Eat cron flakes.


pgpo2VgFyZP0W.pgp
Description: OpenPGP digital signature

Re: [gentoo-user] Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[Neil Bothwick]

On Mon, 21 Mar 2016 10:14:03 -0400, waltd...@waltdnes.org wrote:

>   Try re-emerging your X drivers.  To get a list of X drivers,
> execute...
> 
> qlist -I -C x11-drivers/
> 
> ...then "emerge -1" all the drivers that are listed.

Or just emerge @x11-module-rebuild


-- 
Neil Bothwick

Anyone able to feel pain is trainable.


pgpobk27wXOGw.pgp
Description: OpenPGP digital signature

Re: [gentoo-user] Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[Neil Bothwick]

On Mon, 21 Mar 2016 10:52:26 -0400, Alan Grimes wrote:

> Anyone who boots directly to X'doze without first going through a safe
> console login is a raging mad lunatic who needs his head examined.

Indeed. I mean, if I have a desktop system built to run desktop
applications, why the hell would I want to set it up to boot to a desktop?

After all, it's not as though it falls back to a console if X fails to
load - as it does with monotonous regularity every eight years or so.

No one in their right mind would continue to use an OS that is clearly so
unsuitable for their needs that they don't even trust it to start up
properly... whatever their IQ.


-- 
Neil Bothwick

Suicide is the most sincere form of self-criticism.


pgpHlFe_C1mtN.pgp
Description: OpenPGP digital signature

Re: [gentoo-user] Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[Neil Bothwick]

On Mon, 21 Mar 2016 17:43:38 +0200, Alan McKinnon wrote:

> Danger, Will Robinson, danger!
> 
> The power of the troll is strong with this one.

Read Alert! Res Alert! Mixed movie/TV references!


-- 
Neil Bothwick

Obscenity is the crutch of inarticulate motherfuckers.


pgppVQzGlbyGS.pgp
Description: OpenPGP digital signature

[gentoo-user] OT. What software can do for you (was: Keyboard is dead after emerge-update)

[Bertram Scharpf]

On Monday, 21. Mar 2016, 10:52:26 -0400, Alan Grimes wrote:
> Anyone who boots directly to X'doze without first going through a safe
> console login is a raging mad lunatic who needs his head examined. This
> is linux we are talking about. It's crap. It always has been crap, and
> it always will be crap. Never ever ever trust it.

Yes, I am a lunatic and I am proud of it. It is a matter of
quality of life whether I have compulsively to keep control
over things or whether they run by itself. If not open
source meets this requirement, who else could do it? Not
just pretending it?

It is a main aspect of software development that code is
written once and runs many times. Therefore it is worth to
spend more effort in writing software than on running it.
Further, it is the other way round. If we expect ourselves
to write just crap, this will have an influence on what we
produce. And what people think about open source.

Bertram


-- 
Bertram Scharpf
Stuttgart, Deutschland/Germany
http://www.bertram-scharpf.de

[gentoo-user] Re: dev-python sub-categories?

[James]

Mike Gilbert  gentoo.org> writes:


> > So /usr/portage/dev-python is around 1500 packages. Is it time to
> > create some new categories to reduce this size, or is it ok, in the
> > "gentoo-way" for everything /python/ to be lumped into dev-python/?

> > We do not organize things around 'C' like that, so since python is
> > ubiquitous in linux now, does it make since to treat /python/ 
> > differently that we do bash or C ?

> > Or am I miss reading this portage tree organizational wisdom? 
> > I understand it  and agree with it for one-off languages, but 
> > surely python has passed that point?

> I think you have asked this question on the wrong mailing list.
> gentoo-dev would be more appropriate.


It is rhetorical in nature:: just looking for ideas and wise guidance from
some other old farts and youngsters.

Besides the bike-shedding on GD sometimes includes the throwing of
gears and sprockets so it's safer to see what folks think here. 
If I'm lucky, a gentoo dev will re-formulate the idea, add a wee bit of
deeper (git) thought to it and then re-master it as his own idea

Furthermore, some other categories are growing large too, so there
does seem to be some logical need to define, as least qualitatively,
the criteria when a portage tree category needs to be split. Or 
at least mention some motivational categorization monikers  related  as
to how and why categories are defined in the first place.

Maybe it's already unofficially  part of the PMS? 
A future GLEP?



;-) 
James

Re: [gentoo-user] dev-python sub-categories?

[Mike Gilbert]

On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 1:43 PM, James  wrote:
> Hello,
>
>
> So /usr/portage/dev-python is around 1500 packages. Is it time to
> create some new categories to reduce this size, or is it ok, in the
> "gentoo-way" for everything /python/ to be lumped into dev-python/?
>
>
> We do not organize things around 'C' like that, so since python is
> ubiquitous in linux now, does it make since to treat /python/ differently
> that we do bash or C ?
>
>
> Or am I miss reading this portage tree organizational wisdom? I understand it
> and agree with it for one-off languages, but surely python has passed that
> point?

I think you have asked this question on the wrong mailing list.
gentoo-dev would be more appropriate.

[gentoo-user] dev-python sub-categories?

[James]

Hello,


So /usr/portage/dev-python is around 1500 packages. Is it time to
create some new categories to reduce this size, or is it ok, in the
"gentoo-way" for everything /python/ to be lumped into dev-python/?


We do not organize things around 'C' like that, so since python is 
ubiquitous in linux now, does it make since to treat /python/ differently
that we do bash or C ?


Or am I miss reading this portage tree organizational wisdom? I understand it
and agree with it for one-off languages, but surely python has passed that 
point?


curiously,
James

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[J. Roeleveld]

On Monday, March 21, 2016 12:30:43 PM »Q« wrote:
> On Mon, 21 Mar 2016 17:43:38 +0200
> 
> Alan McKinnon  wrote:
> > Danger, Will Robinson, danger!
> > 
> > The power of the troll is strong with this one.
> 
> Well, Gentoo *is* a bad system once you've set up automatic
> footguns aimed at you from every possible angle.  The outrage every
> time a toe gets blown off is probably real.

Replace "Gentoo" with any other OS, Distro, Application, System, Appliance, 
Vehicle, and you get the same 

Nice way of putting it, btw

--
Joost

[gentoo-user] Re: Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[»Q«]

On Mon, 21 Mar 2016 17:43:38 +0200
Alan McKinnon  wrote:

> Danger, Will Robinson, danger!
> 
> The power of the troll is strong with this one.

Well, Gentoo *is* a bad system once you've set up automatic 
footguns aimed at you from every possible angle.  The outrage every
time a toe gets blown off is probably real.

"You can get good help from techies by telling them their system is
awful and X, Y, or Z cannot be accomplished with it" seems as true as
ever, and it still makes for painful threads.

[gentoo-user] Re: EAPI-6 dev-python ebuilds

[James]

David M. Fellows  unb.ca> writes:


> grep -r -l "EAPI=5" * |grep 'ebuild$'

grep -r -l "EAPI=6" * |grep 'ebuild$'


yep, it works just fine. sorry for being a bit brain-dead
this am...


thx,
James

Re: [gentoo-user] EAPI-6 dev-python ebuilds

[David M. Fellows]

On Mon, 21 Mar 2016 15:50:02 + 
James wrote -
> Hello,
> 
> I'm looking for some EAPI-6 examples or ebuild templates to
> to review. 
> 
> 
> Is there a simple way to parse the portage tree for EAPI=6 examples
> regardless if they are testing, stable or still just beta in a git
> repo somewhere? Maybe a particular dev has already revised a group
> of ebuilds and I just need to search out, by dev, a list of packages and
> recent date of ebuilds to find a cache of EAPI=6 ebuilds to parse?
> (not sure how to proceed on this hunch).
> 
> 
> # qgrep -H EAPI=5 wstools-0.4.3.ebuild
> dev-python/wstools/wstools-0.4.3.ebuild:EAPI=5
> 
> works for a specific file, but I want to parse the entire /dev-python
> portion of the portage tree. Is there a more robust tool? Maybe I should
> just patch the qgrep applet to suite my needs (hardest option)?

cd /usr/portage/dev-python
grep -r -l "EAPI=5" * |grep 'ebuild$'

Not particularly efficient, but for "one-offs"...


Dave F

Re: [gentoo-user] Akregator.

[Peter Humphrey]

On Monday 21 March 2016 17:07:26 J. Roeleveld wrote:
> On Monday, March 21, 2016 10:37:25 AM Alan Grimes wrote:
> > Neil Bothwick wrote:
> > > On Sun, 20 Mar 2016 18:16:36 -0400, Alan Grimes wrote:
> > >> my package.use -fu is minimal. =\
> > > 
> > > I thought you'd been using Gentoo for ten years?
> > > 
> > >> What is the exact line I need to add to the pile of hacks, and
> > >> workarounds in that file?
> > > 
> > > kde-base/baloo minimal
> > 
> > I treat package.use as a last resort because, over the long haul it
> > tends to fuck things up and is difficult to maintain. Whenever possible,
> > I solve all issues with ufed.
> > 
> > I didn't think it was possible to set a package like that, I thought it
> > 
> > had to be something stupid like:
> > >=kde-base/baloo-1.0
> > 
> > or something, which I think it had to be at one point in time. or
> > something to target the kde4 version and not the kde 5 version, or some
> > other ninjitsu.
> 
> Read the manual.

...and get rid of all those excruciating scripts of yours and start doing 
things manually and sanely, one step at a time.

-- 
Rgds
Peter

linux counter 5290, 1994/04/23

Re: [gentoo-user] Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[Peter Humphrey]

On Monday 21 March 2016 10:52:26 Alan Grimes wrote:
> Anyone who boots directly to X'doze without first going through a safe
> console login is a raging mad lunatic who needs his head examined. This
> is linux we are talking about. It's crap. It always has been crap, and
> it always will be crap. Never ever ever trust it. I leave my computer on
> continuously because booting it is such a risk. Every single time I load
> X'doze and find that my keyboard and mouse are working I ghasp with
> surprise. The linux developers, or the penguins as I like to call them
> are so smug on the sublime superiority of the open source approach that
> they never bother to design essential things such as fail-safe design,
> fallback drivers, stable apis so that it doesn't just die if it's not
> compiled against this specific point release. ... You know, the kind of
> things that any competent programmer would think about. =|

--->8

> IQ is a measure of how stupid you feel.

Indeed.

-- 
Rgds
Peter

linux counter 5290, 1994/04/23

Re: [gentoo-user] Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[J. Roeleveld]

On Monday, March 21, 2016 10:52:26 AM Alan Grimes wrote:
> Anyone who boots directly to X'doze without first going through a safe
> console login is a raging mad lunatic who needs his head examined. This
> is linux we are talking about. It's crap. It always has been crap, and
> it always will be crap. Never ever ever trust it. I leave my computer on
> continuously because booting it is such a risk. Every single time I load
> X'doze and find that my keyboard and mouse are working I ghasp with
> surprise. The linux developers, or the penguins as I like to call them
> are so smug on the sublime superiority of the open source approach that
> they never bother to design essential things such as fail-safe design,
> fallback drivers, stable apis so that it doesn't just die if it's not
> compiled against this specific point release. ... You know, the kind of
> things that any competent programmer would think about. =|

Like in this scripts of yours?

--
Joost

Re: [gentoo-user] Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[J. Roeleveld]

On Monday, March 21, 2016 01:08:19 PM Francisco Ares wrote:
> 2016-03-21 11:52 GMT-03:00 Alan Grimes :
> > Anyone who boots directly to X'doze without first going through a safe
> > console login is a raging mad lunatic who needs his head examined. This
> > is linux we are talking about. It's crap. It always has been crap, and
> > it always will be crap. Never ever ever trust it. I leave my computer on
> > continuously because booting it is such a risk. Every single time I load
> > X'doze and find that my keyboard and mouse are working I ghasp with
> > surprise. The linux developers, or the penguins as I like to call them
> > are so smug on the sublime superiority of the open source approach that
> > they never bother to design essential things such as fail-safe design,
> > fallback drivers, stable apis so that it doesn't just die if it's not
> > compiled against this specific point release. ... You know, the kind of
> > things that any competent programmer would think about. =|
> > 
> > Bertram Scharpf wrote:
> > > Hi,
> > > 
> > > since an emerge-update-world on my notebook the keyboard
> > > does no longer respond in X. This is extremely annoying
> > > because when I have xdm in rc-update, X is started right at
> > > boot. I have no chance to get back to the console using
> > > Ctrl-Alt-F1, and the device in unusable.
> > > 
> > > Yet, this is only a problem of the boot process. At home,
> > > when I ssh into the system, I can do an
> > > 
> > >   # /etc/init.d/xdm restart
> > > 
> > > and from that point on the keyboard works. It is even
> > > possible to disable xdm in rc-update and start it after the
> > > boot process has completed. I solved the problem temporarily
> > > this way, but the problem probably is a bug and should be
> > > reported.
> > > 
> > > So I have a closer look. When I diff "Xorg.0.log" and
> > > "Xorg.0.log.old" (after removing the time stamps) I find one
> > > line that doesn't appear in the log of the working X.
> > > 
> > >   (EE) kbd: Keyboard0: failed to set us as foreground pgrp
> > 
> > (Inappropriate ioctl for device)
> > 
> > > What does this mean? I estimate that "us" is the personal
> > > pronoun and not a keyboard layout, and that the server tries
> > > to do some chgrp on some /dev/*. I have no clue what to try
> > > next.
> > > 
> > > Thanks in advance.
> > 
> > --
> > IQ is a measure of how stupid you feel.
> > 
> > Powers are not rights.
> 
> ... or you may provide checking points, like a script to run all "emerge
> world" processes automatically,
> 
> Open source and Linux' software begins with the premisse you know what you
> are doing, as if you issue a "rm -fR /" you will get exactly what you have
> asked for, a dead system, no "are you sure?" questions will ring.
> 
> Those "craps" made me learn a lot!

Me and a friend did that once to a system that needed reinstalling anyway.
It doesn't actually wipe everything off the disk and processes in memory are 
likely to keep running.

If we'd been running a shell with a lot of built-in functionality or a decent 
editor, we might have been able to restore some of the functionality :)

--
Joost

Re: [gentoo-user] Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[J. Roeleveld]

On Monday, March 21, 2016 05:43:38 PM Alan McKinnon wrote:
> On 21/03/2016 16:52, Alan Grimes wrote:
> > Anyone who boots directly to X'doze without first going through a safe
> > console login is a raging mad lunatic who needs his head examined. This
> > is linux we are talking about. It's crap. It always has been crap, and
> > it always will be crap. Never ever ever trust it. I leave my computer on
> > continuously because booting it is such a risk. Every single time I load
> > X'doze and find that my keyboard and mouse are working I ghasp with
> > surprise. The linux developers, or the penguins as I like to call them
> > are so smug on the sublime superiority of the open source approach that
> > they never bother to design essential things such as fail-safe design,
> > fallback drivers, stable apis so that it doesn't just die if it's not
> > compiled against this specific point release. ... You know, the kind of
> > things that any competent programmer would think about. =|
> 
> Danger, Will Robinson, danger!
> 
> The power of the troll is strong with this one.

No really? :)

--
Joost

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[J. Roeleveld]

On Monday, March 21, 2016 03:02:49 PM Grant Edwards wrote:
> On 2016-03-21, Alan Grimes  wrote:
> > Anyone who boots directly to X'doze without first going through a safe
> > console login is a raging mad lunatic who needs his head examined. [...]
> 
> A bit hyperbolic perhaps, but I've always been a firm believer in the
> "boot to console and start X from the command-line" theory.  I've been
> doing it that way for almost 30 years now, and it's saved me
> innumerable headaches.

I've been booting into X directly for over 13 years (forgot the actual year) 
now and only had an issue 3 times.
Every time I managed to easily fix it by using "init=/bin/sh" and fix it from 
there.

And those have not happened often. (maybe 5 times at the most)

The trick is to run mostly stable and use your brain.

--
Joost

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[J. Roeleveld]

On Monday, March 21, 2016 12:43:36 PM Francisco Ares wrote:
> 2016-03-21 11:25 GMT-03:00 Nikos Chantziaras :
> > On 21/03/16 13:52, Bertram Scharpf wrote:
> >> Hi,
> >> 
> >> since an emerge-update-world on my notebook the keyboard
> >> does no longer respond in X. This is extremely annoying
> >> because when I have xdm in rc-update, X is started right at
> >> boot. I have no chance to get back to the console using
> >> Ctrl-Alt-F1, and the device in unusable.
> > 
> > After xorg-server updates, it's recommended to run:
> >   emerge @x11-module-rebuild
> > 
> > This will automatically rebuild xorg-modules.
> 
> This tip is much better, need to learn more about emerge ...

To complete this, after a kernel-update run:

emerge @module-rebuild

This will rebuild all packages that build kernel-modules (when installed)

--
Joost

Re: [gentoo-user] Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[Francisco Ares]

2016-03-21 11:52 GMT-03:00 Alan Grimes :

> Anyone who boots directly to X'doze without first going through a safe
> console login is a raging mad lunatic who needs his head examined. This
> is linux we are talking about. It's crap. It always has been crap, and
> it always will be crap. Never ever ever trust it. I leave my computer on
> continuously because booting it is such a risk. Every single time I load
> X'doze and find that my keyboard and mouse are working I ghasp with
> surprise. The linux developers, or the penguins as I like to call them
> are so smug on the sublime superiority of the open source approach that
> they never bother to design essential things such as fail-safe design,
> fallback drivers, stable apis so that it doesn't just die if it's not
> compiled against this specific point release. ... You know, the kind of
> things that any competent programmer would think about. =|
>
>
> Bertram Scharpf wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > since an emerge-update-world on my notebook the keyboard
> > does no longer respond in X. This is extremely annoying
> > because when I have xdm in rc-update, X is started right at
> > boot. I have no chance to get back to the console using
> > Ctrl-Alt-F1, and the device in unusable.
> >
> > Yet, this is only a problem of the boot process. At home,
> > when I ssh into the system, I can do an
> >
> >   # /etc/init.d/xdm restart
> >
> > and from that point on the keyboard works. It is even
> > possible to disable xdm in rc-update and start it after the
> > boot process has completed. I solved the problem temporarily
> > this way, but the problem probably is a bug and should be
> > reported.
> >
> > So I have a closer look. When I diff "Xorg.0.log" and
> > "Xorg.0.log.old" (after removing the time stamps) I find one
> > line that doesn't appear in the log of the working X.
> >
> >   (EE) kbd: Keyboard0: failed to set us as foreground pgrp
> (Inappropriate ioctl for device)
> >
> > What does this mean? I estimate that "us" is the personal
> > pronoun and not a keyboard layout, and that the server tries
> > to do some chgrp on some /dev/*. I have no clue what to try
> > next.
> >
> > Thanks in advance.
> >
>
> --
> IQ is a measure of how stupid you feel.
>
> Powers are not rights.
>
>
>

... or you may provide checking points, like a script to run all "emerge
world" processes automatically,

Open source and Linux' software begins with the premisse you know what you
are doing, as if you issue a "rm -fR /" you will get exactly what you have
asked for, a dead system, no "are you sure?" questions will ring.

Those "craps" made me learn a lot!

Best regards,
Francisco

Re: [gentoo-user] Akregator.

[J. Roeleveld]

On Monday, March 21, 2016 10:37:25 AM Alan Grimes wrote:
> Neil Bothwick wrote:
> > On Sun, 20 Mar 2016 18:16:36 -0400, Alan Grimes wrote:
> >> my package.use -fu is minimal. =\
> > 
> > I thought you'd been using Gentoo for ten years?
> > 
> >> What is the exact line I need to add to the pile of hacks, and
> >> workarounds in that file?
> > 
> > kde-base/baloo minimal
> 
> I treat package.use as a last resort because, over the long haul it
> tends to fuck things up and is difficult to maintain. Whenever possible,
> I solve all issues with ufed.
> 
> I didn't think it was possible to set a package like that, I thought it
> 
> had to be something stupid like:
> >=kde-base/baloo-1.0
> 
> or something, which I think it had to be at one point in time. or
> something to target the kde4 version and not the kde 5 version, or some
> other ninjitsu.

Read the manual.

Re: [gentoo-user] Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[Alan McKinnon]

On 21/03/2016 16:52, Alan Grimes wrote:
> Anyone who boots directly to X'doze without first going through a safe
> console login is a raging mad lunatic who needs his head examined. This
> is linux we are talking about. It's crap. It always has been crap, and
> it always will be crap. Never ever ever trust it. I leave my computer on
> continuously because booting it is such a risk. Every single time I load
> X'doze and find that my keyboard and mouse are working I ghasp with
> surprise. The linux developers, or the penguins as I like to call them
> are so smug on the sublime superiority of the open source approach that
> they never bother to design essential things such as fail-safe design, 
> fallback drivers, stable apis so that it doesn't just die if it's not
> compiled against this specific point release. ... You know, the kind of
> things that any competent programmer would think about. =|



Danger, Will Robinson, danger!

The power of the troll is strong with this one.


-- 
Alan McKinnon
alan.mckin...@gmail.com

[gentoo-user] EAPI-6 dev-python ebuilds

[James]

Hello,

I'm looking for some EAPI-6 examples or ebuild templates to
to review. 


Is there a simple way to parse the portage tree for EAPI=6 examples
regardless if they are testing, stable or still just beta in a git
repo somewhere? Maybe a particular dev has already revised a group
of ebuilds and I just need to search out, by dev, a list of packages and
recent date of ebuilds to find a cache of EAPI=6 ebuilds to parse?
(not sure how to proceed on this hunch).


# qgrep -H EAPI=5 wstools-0.4.3.ebuild
dev-python/wstools/wstools-0.4.3.ebuild:EAPI=5

works for a specific file, but I want to parse the entire /dev-python
portion of the portage tree. Is there a more robust tool? Maybe I should
just patch the qgrep applet to suite my needs (hardest option)?


Is there a recommended cache of EAPI=6 ebuilds I can look at, particularly
to note differences in the EAPI=6 versus their EAPI=5 older sibling ebuilds?


Any guidance is welcome.


James

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[Francisco Ares]

2016-03-21 11:25 GMT-03:00 Nikos Chantziaras :

> On 21/03/16 13:52, Bertram Scharpf wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> since an emerge-update-world on my notebook the keyboard
>> does no longer respond in X. This is extremely annoying
>> because when I have xdm in rc-update, X is started right at
>> boot. I have no chance to get back to the console using
>> Ctrl-Alt-F1, and the device in unusable.
>>
>
> After xorg-server updates, it's recommended to run:
>
>   emerge @x11-module-rebuild
>
> This will automatically rebuild xorg-modules.
>
>
>
This tip is much better, need to learn more about emerge ...

Best regards,
Francisco

[gentoo-user] Re: Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[Grant Edwards]

On 2016-03-21, Alan Grimes  wrote:

> Anyone who boots directly to X'doze without first going through a safe
> console login is a raging mad lunatic who needs his head examined. [...]

A bit hyperbolic perhaps, but I've always been a firm believer in the
"boot to console and start X from the command-line" theory.  I've been
doing it that way for almost 30 years now, and it's saved me
innumerable headaches.

-- 
Grant

Re: [gentoo-user] Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[Alan Grimes]

Anyone who boots directly to X'doze without first going through a safe
console login is a raging mad lunatic who needs his head examined. This
is linux we are talking about. It's crap. It always has been crap, and
it always will be crap. Never ever ever trust it. I leave my computer on
continuously because booting it is such a risk. Every single time I load
X'doze and find that my keyboard and mouse are working I ghasp with
surprise. The linux developers, or the penguins as I like to call them
are so smug on the sublime superiority of the open source approach that
they never bother to design essential things such as fail-safe design, 
fallback drivers, stable apis so that it doesn't just die if it's not
compiled against this specific point release. ... You know, the kind of
things that any competent programmer would think about. =|


Bertram Scharpf wrote:
> Hi,
>
> since an emerge-update-world on my notebook the keyboard
> does no longer respond in X. This is extremely annoying
> because when I have xdm in rc-update, X is started right at
> boot. I have no chance to get back to the console using
> Ctrl-Alt-F1, and the device in unusable.
>
> Yet, this is only a problem of the boot process. At home,
> when I ssh into the system, I can do an
>
>   # /etc/init.d/xdm restart
>
> and from that point on the keyboard works. It is even
> possible to disable xdm in rc-update and start it after the
> boot process has completed. I solved the problem temporarily
> this way, but the problem probably is a bug and should be
> reported.
>
> So I have a closer look. When I diff "Xorg.0.log" and
> "Xorg.0.log.old" (after removing the time stamps) I find one
> line that doesn't appear in the log of the working X.
>
>   (EE) kbd: Keyboard0: failed to set us as foreground pgrp (Inappropriate 
> ioctl for device)
>
> What does this mean? I estimate that "us" is the personal
> pronoun and not a keyboard layout, and that the server tries
> to do some chgrp on some /dev/*. I have no clue what to try
> next.
>
> Thanks in advance.
>

-- 
IQ is a measure of how stupid you feel.

Powers are not rights.

Re: [gentoo-user] Akregator.

[Alan Grimes]

Neil Bothwick wrote:
> On Sun, 20 Mar 2016 18:16:36 -0400, Alan Grimes wrote:
>
>> my package.use -fu is minimal. =\
> I thought you'd been using Gentoo for ten years?
>
>> What is the exact line I need to add to the pile of hacks, and
>> workarounds in that file?
> kde-base/baloo minimal


I treat package.use as a last resort because, over the long haul it
tends to fuck things up and is difficult to maintain. Whenever possible,
I solve all issues with ufed.

I didn't think it was possible to set a package like that, I thought it
had to be something stupid like:

>=kde-base/baloo-1.0

or something, which I think it had to be at one point in time. or
something to target the kde4 version and not the kde 5 version, or some
other ninjitsu.


-- 
IQ is a measure of how stupid you feel.

Powers are not rights.

[gentoo-user] Re: Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[Nikos Chantziaras]

On 21/03/16 13:52, Bertram Scharpf wrote:

Hi,

since an emerge-update-world on my notebook the keyboard
does no longer respond in X. This is extremely annoying
because when I have xdm in rc-update, X is started right at
boot. I have no chance to get back to the console using
Ctrl-Alt-F1, and the device in unusable.


After xorg-server updates, it's recommended to run:

  emerge @x11-module-rebuild

This will automatically rebuild xorg-modules.

Re: [gentoo-user] Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[waltdnes]

On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 01:59:50PM +0100, Bertram Scharpf wrote
> On Monday, 21. Mar 2016, 12:37:07 +, Ian Bloss wrote:
> > Did you update your kernel in the process as well?
> > 
> > On Mon, Mar 21, 2016, 07:53 Bertram Scharpf  
> > wrote:
> > > since an emerge-update-world on my notebook the keyboard
> > > does no longer respond in X. [...]
> 
> No. The emerge-update did not install new kernel sources and
> therefore I found no need to reconfigure or to compile the
> old ones.

  Try re-emerging your X drivers.  To get a list of X drivers, execute...

qlist -I -C x11-drivers/

...then "emerge -1" all the drivers that are listed.

-- 
Walter Dnes 
I don't run "desktop environments"; I run useful applications

Re: [gentoo-user] Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[Bertram Scharpf]

On Monday, 21. Mar 2016, 10:17:22 -0300, Francisco Ares wrote:
> 2016-03-21 9:59 GMT-03:00 Bertram Scharpf :
> > > On Mon, Mar 21, 2016, 07:53 Bertram Scharpf  
> > > wrote:
> > > > since an emerge-update-world on my notebook the keyboard
> > > > does no longer respond in X. [...]
> >
> For my experience, if the X server was rebuilt (either a new version, or a
> simple rebuild because of many possible triggers, including USE flags
> change, for example), then you need to rebuild all X drivers as well.
> 
> [...]
> 
> Hope this helps.

Yes, that helped. Thank you!

Nevertheless, what a weird behaviour.

Bertram


-- 
Bertram Scharpf
Stuttgart, Deutschland/Germany
http://www.bertram-scharpf.de

Re: [gentoo-user] Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[Francisco Ares]

2016-03-21 9:59 GMT-03:00 Bertram Scharpf :

> On Monday, 21. Mar 2016, 12:37:07 +, Ian Bloss wrote:
> > Did you update your kernel in the process as well?
> >
> > On Mon, Mar 21, 2016, 07:53 Bertram Scharpf 
> wrote:
> > > since an emerge-update-world on my notebook the keyboard
> > > does no longer respond in X. [...]
>
> No. The emerge-update did not install new kernel sources and
> therefore I found no need to reconfigure or to compile the
> old ones.
>
> Bertram
>
>
> --
> Bertram Scharpf
> Stuttgart, Deutschland/Germany
> http://www.bertram-scharpf.de
>
>
For my experience, if the X server was rebuilt (either a new version, or a
simple rebuild because of many possible triggers, including USE flags
change, for example), then you need to rebuild all X drivers as well.

After I issue a complete emerge update, I run the following script (I have
a nVidia card) as root:

GentooSystem ~ $ cat ~/bin/xorg_rebuild
#! /bin/bash
if ! [ -e /root/.working ]
then
touch /root/.working

XORG_SERVER=`equery l xorg-server`
if [ "$XORG_SERVER" != "`cat /root/xorg-server.txt`" ]
then
EMERGE_LIST=`equery l --format='$name' xf86*`" "`equery l
--format='$name' "xorg*"`" "`equery l --format='$name' nvidia-drivers`
# EMERGE_LIST=`equery l --format='$name' xf86*`" "`equery l
--format='$name' "xorg*"`
emerge -vD --with-bdeps=y --keep-going --quiet-build
$EMERGE_LIST && \
echo $XORG_SERVER>/root/xorg-server.txt && \
echo $NVIDIA_DRVR>/root/nvidia-drvr.txt && \
rmmod nvidia 2>/dev/null && modprobe nvidia
fi

DRIVER="nvidia-drivers"
MOD="nvidia"
VIDEO_DRIVR=`equery l $DRIVER`
if [ "$VIDEO_DRIVR" != "`cat /root/video-drv.txt`" ]
then
EMERGE_LIST=`equery l --format='$name' xf86*`" "`equery l
--format='$name' "xorg*"`" "`equery l --format='$name' $DRIVER`
emerge -vD --with-bdeps=y --keep-going --quiet-build
$EMERGE_LIST && \
echo $XORG_SERVER>/root/xorg-server.txt && \
echo $VIDEO_DRIVR>/root/video-drv.txt && \
rmmod $MOD 2>/dev/null && modprobe $MOD
fi

rm -f /root/.working
fi


It uses three files, the first is used to signal to other scripts (that
uses emerge for some reason) to not try to do anything while other of those
scripts, including this one, is being run. That is "/root/working".

Another file is "/root/xorg-server.txt", that keeps the output of 'equery l
xorg-server', which is compared with up to date result of the same command.
If it is different, the script lists all installed drivers and re-emerges
them. Finally this same file is updated.

The same happens with the nVidia proprietary driver, using file
"/root/video-drv.txt".

Hope this helps.

Best regards,
Francisco

Re: [gentoo-user] Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[Bertram Scharpf]

On Monday, 21. Mar 2016, 12:37:07 +, Ian Bloss wrote:
> Did you update your kernel in the process as well?
> 
> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016, 07:53 Bertram Scharpf  wrote:
> > since an emerge-update-world on my notebook the keyboard
> > does no longer respond in X. [...]

No. The emerge-update did not install new kernel sources and
therefore I found no need to reconfigure or to compile the
old ones.

Bertram


-- 
Bertram Scharpf
Stuttgart, Deutschland/Germany
http://www.bertram-scharpf.de

Re: [gentoo-user] Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[Ian Bloss]

Did you update your kernel in the process as well?

On Mon, Mar 21, 2016, 07:53 Bertram Scharpf 
wrote:

> Hi,
>
> since an emerge-update-world on my notebook the keyboard
> does no longer respond in X. This is extremely annoying
> because when I have xdm in rc-update, X is started right at
> boot. I have no chance to get back to the console using
> Ctrl-Alt-F1, and the device in unusable.
>
> Yet, this is only a problem of the boot process. At home,
> when I ssh into the system, I can do an
>
>   # /etc/init.d/xdm restart
>
> and from that point on the keyboard works. It is even
> possible to disable xdm in rc-update and start it after the
> boot process has completed. I solved the problem temporarily
> this way, but the problem probably is a bug and should be
> reported.
>
> So I have a closer look. When I diff "Xorg.0.log" and
> "Xorg.0.log.old" (after removing the time stamps) I find one
> line that doesn't appear in the log of the working X.
>
>   (EE) kbd: Keyboard0: failed to set us as foreground pgrp (Inappropriate
> ioctl for device)
>
> What does this mean? I estimate that "us" is the personal
> pronoun and not a keyboard layout, and that the server tries
> to do some chgrp on some /dev/*. I have no clue what to try
> next.
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> Bertram
>
>
> --
> Bertram Scharpf
> Stuttgart, Deutschland/Germany
> http://www.bertram-scharpf.de
>
>

[gentoo-user] Keyboard is dead after emerge-update

[Bertram Scharpf]

Hi,

since an emerge-update-world on my notebook the keyboard
does no longer respond in X. This is extremely annoying
because when I have xdm in rc-update, X is started right at
boot. I have no chance to get back to the console using
Ctrl-Alt-F1, and the device in unusable.

Yet, this is only a problem of the boot process. At home,
when I ssh into the system, I can do an

  # /etc/init.d/xdm restart

and from that point on the keyboard works. It is even
possible to disable xdm in rc-update and start it after the
boot process has completed. I solved the problem temporarily
this way, but the problem probably is a bug and should be
reported.

So I have a closer look. When I diff "Xorg.0.log" and
"Xorg.0.log.old" (after removing the time stamps) I find one
line that doesn't appear in the log of the working X.

  (EE) kbd: Keyboard0: failed to set us as foreground pgrp (Inappropriate ioctl 
for device)

What does this mean? I estimate that "us" is the personal
pronoun and not a keyboard layout, and that the server tries
to do some chgrp on some /dev/*. I have no clue what to try
next.

Thanks in advance.

Bertram


-- 
Bertram Scharpf
Stuttgart, Deutschland/Germany
http://www.bertram-scharpf.de