Re: SOLVED: Recover from LVM errors? (Was: Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling)
On Donnerstag, 29. März 2007, Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. wrote: > I think you misread me. I'm interested in ext4, and disappointed in > NameSys' > handling of reiser4. I love the *idea* of reiser4, but being able the > resize > the filesystem is *mandatory* for my setup, and I don't get that with > reiser4. However, forward movement on a resizer (and other, currently > vaporware, filesystem features/utilties) had been completely abandoned to > the > effort of getting reiser4 mainlined, well before Hans' legal troubles > started. I feel this was/is a mistake; I have no problem running > mm-sources > when it has a feature I desire. But with the filesystem as it is I can't > actually use it for more than testing. That is your point of view. For others, 'Resizing' is something that is not needed and never used. But being in mainline is mandatory! -mm Kernels are full of experimental stuff, highly unstable and very buggy. Nothing you can really trust. So as long as something does not show up in the Linus' Kernel, it is not usable. And that does not cover the testing something gets in Linus' kernel, that is simply not there with -mm kernels. -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: SOLVED: Recover from LVM errors? (Was: Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling)
On Thursday 29 March 2007 02:19:57 Alan McKinnon wrote: > On Wednesday 28 March 2007, Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. wrote: > > That said, I'm very encouraged about ext4, and will probably migrate > > some unimportant data over to that filesystem in near future and > > perform my own bonnie++ tests. > > How do you plan to get around the decidedly non-trivial task of getting > a decent fsck on a filesystem where plugins handle the metadata? > > Don't get me wrong, I think reiser4 is a good idea, and it's well > thought out. But everything comes at a price, and in this case it's > fsck I think you misread me. I'm interested in ext4, and disappointed in NameSys' handling of reiser4. I love the *idea* of reiser4, but being able the resize the filesystem is *mandatory* for my setup, and I don't get that with reiser4. However, forward movement on a resizer (and other, currently vaporware, filesystem features/utilties) had been completely abandoned to the effort of getting reiser4 mainlined, well before Hans' legal troubles started. I feel this was/is a mistake; I have no problem running mm-sources when it has a feature I desire. But with the filesystem as it is I can't actually use it for more than testing. I've heard some (but not enough) about ext4 and it seems promising. I'm keeping my eye on it, and will probably throw some "production" data on it before it's mainlined. -- Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. ,= ,-_-. =. [EMAIL PROTECTED] ((_/)o o(\_)) ICQ: 514984 YM/AIM: DaTwinkDaddy `-'(. .)`-' http://iguanasuicide.org/ \_/ pgpwBToAGoPth.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: SOLVED: Recover from LVM errors? (Was: Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling)
On Wednesday 28 March 2007, Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. wrote: > On Wednesday 28 March 2007, Alan McKinnon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote about 'Re: SOLVED: Recover from LVM errors? (Was: Re: > [gentoo-user] Help - > > system reboots while compiling)': > > All in all, the odds are tipping in favour of ext4 > > I don't need quite such large filesystems as my largest is just under > 4TB, and my system will probably max out around 7TB, but I need a > filesystem that is maintained (Namesys had basically abandoned > reiserfs in favor of reiser4 well before Hans' current troubles > started), and has good all-around performance characteristics (I have > both large source trees, invloving a multitude of directories and > small-ish files AND a video "library" containing very large files in > my /home). I would also like to see some support for the "tail > packing" of resiserfs -- It's not that important, but last I checked > one saved over 100MB by the portage tree on reiserfs AND > mini-benchmarks like emerge --sync and > find '/usr/portage' > /dev/null actually ran faster than ext3. In my experience that's a representative data set for a Linux geek :-) Mine's very similar and I too find that reiser3 performs better all round. Unpacking 35000 smallish files in a kernel tree is no small task... > That said, I'm very encouraged about ext4, and will probably migrate > some unimportant data over to that filesystem in near future and > perform my own bonnie++ tests. How do you plan to get around the decidedly non-trivial task of getting a decent fsck on a filesystem where plugins handle the metadata? Don't get me wrong, I think reiser4 is a good idea, and it's well thought out. But everything comes at a price, and in this case it's fsck alan -- Optimists say the glass is half full, Pessimists say the glass is half empty, Developers say wtf is the glass twice as big as it needs to be? Alan McKinnon alan at linuxholdings dot co dot za +27 82, double three seven, one nine three five -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: SOLVED: Recover from LVM errors? (Was: Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling)
On Wednesday 28 March 2007, Alan McKinnon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote about 'Re: SOLVED: Recover from LVM errors? (Was: Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling)': > All in all, the odds are tipping in favour of ext4 I don't need quite such large filesystems as my largest is just under 4TB, and my system will probably max out around 7TB, but I need a filesystem that is maintained (Namesys had basically abandoned reiserfs in favor of reiser4 well before Hans' current troubles started), and has good all-around performance characteristics (I have both large source trees, invloving a multitude of directories and small-ish files AND a video "library" containing very large files in my /home). I would also like to see some support for the "tail packing" of resiserfs -- It's not that important, but last I checked one saved over 100MB by the portage tree on reiserfs AND mini-benchmarks like emerge --sync and find '/usr/portage' > /dev/null actually ran faster than ext3. That said, I'm very encouraged about ext4, and will probably migrate some unimportant data over to that filesystem in near future and perform my own bonnie++ tests. -- Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. ,= ,-_-. =. [EMAIL PROTECTED] ((_/)o o(\_)) ICQ: 514984 YM/AIM: DaTwinkDaddy `-'(. .)`-' http://iguanasuicide.org/ \_/ pgp5z1zwcKjFP.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: SOLVED: Recover from LVM errors? (Was: Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling)
On Wednesday 28 March 2007, Jeff Rollin wrote: > openSUSE (or is it > Novell?) certainly seem to be less keen on Reiserfs than they used to > be, judging from reports from about the beginning of the year. It's unlikely that Novell has issues with the current technical quality of reiserfs, which is as good now as it's been for years, and that's pretty good. Much more likely is that Hans Reiser IS NameSys, and with his recent troubles there's a big question mark and uncertainty as to whether NameSys can deliver on support and maintenance. Plus, I see very little ongoing effort to get reiser to support enormous volume sizes. There's reiser4, but I doubt a decent fsck tool for it will ever see the light of day. Meanwhile development on ext4 proceeds, and those who need >16TB filesystems will have one shortly. All in all, the odds are tipping in favour of ext4 alan -- Optimists say the glass is half full, Pessimists say the glass is half empty, Developers say wtf is the glass twice as big as it needs to be? Alan McKinnon alan at linuxholdings dot co dot za +27 82, double three seven, one nine three five -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: SOLVED: Recover from LVM errors? (Was: Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling)
Hi Boyd On 28/03/07, Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On Wednesday 28 March 2007, "Jeff Rollin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote about 'Re: SOLVED: Recover from LVM errors? (Was: Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling)': > > > 1. Frankly, I'm not impressed with Linux in this case*. /var is not > > > a "mission critical" filesystem in the sense that if it contains > > > errors, it can still be mounted and the errors don't necessarily > > > mean the system won't come up. > > > > [F]orcing a mount of a damaged filesystem is asking for trouble. > > It IS a bad idea, but it's not like I "forced" a mount; the system > came up normally and functioned normally until it hit a damaged inode, > whereupon it crashed with nary an indication of what had gone wrong. Ah, yes, that's a problem. What filesystem are you using? I was fairly sure ext2/3 tries to detect damage (even while r/w mounted) and force a r/o re-mount or unmount. [Not that that couldn't cause a freeze or reboot, but at least it's conservative.] The filesystem I am currently using on that partition is Reiserfs3, as you suspected judging from what you say later. However, I am also currently in the process of migrating all my reiserfs filesystems to XFS. I have heard that it is unstable on X86 but I have not had any problems with it (touchwood) to date except insofar as it is only possible to grow xfs volumes, not shrink them. openSUSE (or is it Novell?) certainly seem to be less keen on Reiserfs than they used to be, judging from reports from about the beginning of the year. Reiserfs (and possibly others) is quite stupid, at least in this regard. After the filesystem is mounted it performs basically zero sanity checks, and always assumes the data provided by the block device is complete and accurate. It can't handle a slowly failing HD, and will almost assuredly silently corrupt data on such a device. This is one of the reasons some people strongly recommend against reiserfs. I still use it, but my important data is on RAID6 (underneath LVM), so I can be fairly certain the data received by the filesystem is good. Yes, for this and other reasons I am moving away from it as I said. Hopefully this disk is not "slowly failing", but sometimes we get powercuts here and I suspect the damage occured on one of those occasions. /me is looking for a new favorite file system. I have had no complaints with ext3, but do you have any thoughts on XFS? Jeff -- Q: What will happen in the Aftermath? A: Impossible to tell, since we're still in the Beforemath. http://latedeveloper.org.uk -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: SOLVED: Recover from LVM errors? (Was: Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling)
On Wednesday 28 March 2007, "Jeff Rollin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote about 'Re: SOLVED: Recover from LVM errors? (Was: Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling)': > > > 1. Frankly, I'm not impressed with Linux in this case*. /var is not > > > a "mission critical" filesystem in the sense that if it contains > > > errors, it can still be mounted and the errors don't necessarily > > > mean the system won't come up. > > > > [F]orcing a mount of a damaged filesystem is asking for trouble. > > It IS a bad idea, but it's not like I "forced" a mount; the system > came up normally and functioned normally until it hit a damaged inode, > whereupon it crashed with nary an indication of what had gone wrong. Ah, yes, that's a problem. What filesystem are you using? I was fairly sure ext2/3 tries to detect damage (even while r/w mounted) and force a r/o re-mount or unmount. [Not that that couldn't cause a freeze or reboot, but at least it's conservative.] Reiserfs (and possibly others) is quite stupid, at least in this regard. After the filesystem is mounted it performs basically zero sanity checks, and always assumes the data provided by the block device is complete and accurate. It can't handle a slowly failing HD, and will almost assuredly silently corrupt data on such a device. This is one of the reasons some people strongly recommend against reiserfs. I still use it, but my important data is on RAID6 (underneath LVM), so I can be fairly certain the data received by the filesystem is good. /me is looking for a new favorite file system. -- Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. ,= ,-_-. =. [EMAIL PROTECTED] ((_/)o o(\_)) ICQ: 514984 YM/AIM: DaTwinkDaddy `-'(. .)`-' http://iguanasuicide.org/ \_/ pgpIgsTrUVYjQ.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: SOLVED: Recover from LVM errors? (Was: Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling)
Hi Boyd. On 28/03/07, Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On Wednesday 28 March 2007, "Jeff Rollin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote about 'SOLVED: Recover from LVM errors? (Was: Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling)': > Ignore the following if you don't like minirants. (My reply probably needs the same disclaimer.) > 1. Frankly, I'm not impressed with Linux in this case*. /var is not a > "mission critical" filesystem in the sense that if it contains errors, > it can still be mounted and the errors don't necessarily mean the > system won't come up. By that definition, no filesystem I can think of is "mission critial", they will all withstand some damage and still let your system come up. /var is *at least* as important as /usr -- I can easily recover the contents of /usr in case of critical failure, but reconstructing /var is damn near impossible. Also, /usr can generally be very useful with just r/o access, while /var needs to be r/w to fill it's role. That's true. Also, forcing a mount of a damaged filesystem is asking for trouble. Dangling inodes (or similar) can cause cascading failure; at best some processes will read garbage and crash (or, ideally, "magically" recover) at worst good data on the disk will be overwritten with bad. File locks on a damaged filesystem are meaningless since two files (not simply two dirents like with a hard link, but two unrelated files) might share disk sectors. It IS a bad idea, but it's not like I "forced" a mount; the system came up normally and functioned normally until it hit a damaged inode, whereupon it crashed with nary an indication of what had gone wrong. The system should definitely refuse to mount damaged file systems by default or *at the very least* mount them read-only. Agreed, definitely. I wouldn't mind and interactive prompt to force mounting a damaged filesystem, but I'd need a way to turn that off for unattended systems. -- Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. ,= ,-_-. =. [EMAIL PROTECTED] ((_/)o o(\_)) ICQ: 514984 YM/AIM: DaTwinkDaddy `-'(. .)`-' http://iguanasuicide.org/ \_/ Jeff. -- Q: What will happen in the Aftermath? A: Impossible to tell, since we're still in the Beforemath. http://latedeveloper.org.uk -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: SOLVED: Recover from LVM errors? (Was: Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling)
On Wednesday 28 March 2007, "Jeff Rollin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote about 'SOLVED: Recover from LVM errors? (Was: Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling)': > Ignore the following if you don't like minirants. (My reply probably needs the same disclaimer.) > 1. Frankly, I'm not impressed with Linux in this case*. /var is not a > "mission critical" filesystem in the sense that if it contains errors, > it can still be mounted and the errors don't necessarily mean the > system won't come up. By that definition, no filesystem I can think of is "mission critial", they will all withstand some damage and still let your system come up. /var is *at least* as important as /usr -- I can easily recover the contents of /usr in case of critical failure, but reconstructing /var is damn near impossible. Also, /usr can generally be very useful with just r/o access, while /var needs to be r/w to fill it's role. Also, forcing a mount of a damaged filesystem is asking for trouble. Dangling inodes (or similar) can cause cascading failure; at best some processes will read garbage and crash (or, ideally, "magically" recover) at worst good data on the disk will be overwritten with bad. File locks on a damaged filesystem are meaningless since two files (not simply two dirents like with a hard link, but two unrelated files) might share disk sectors. The system should definitely refuse to mount damaged file systems by default or *at the very least* mount them read-only. I wouldn't mind and interactive prompt to force mounting a damaged filesystem, but I'd need a way to turn that off for unattended systems. -- Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. ,= ,-_-. =. [EMAIL PROTECTED] ((_/)o o(\_)) ICQ: 514984 YM/AIM: DaTwinkDaddy `-'(. .)`-' http://iguanasuicide.org/ \_/ pgpvie0BiI3qY.pgp Description: PGP signature
SOLVED: Recover from LVM errors? (Was: Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling)
Hi lug Here's hoping the problem is solved, thanks to all (especially Alex) for the help. Jeff. I have successfully compiled a few things, so it looks like the problem IS solved. Thanks again where due. Ignore the following if you don't like minirants. 1. Frankly, I'm not impressed with Linux in this case*. /var is not a "mission critical" filesystem in the sense that if it contains errors, it can still be mounted and the errors don't necessarily mean the system won't come up. How about some non-fatal error messages that tell you you have errors on the disk and then go away - oh, and which come up in X11? I have a feeling the reboots were caused by Linux trying to cope with X11 being in control of the screen when the kernel panicked, since twice when I had a VT displayed I got some error messages. At worst what should happen in this sort of situation is that you get brought down to single-user mode and get to repair the error. As you know if you have read this thread before, the constant reboots in response to this problem had me going down not only my own garden path but several else's as too, metaphorically speaking. *You read it here first (unless you read OSNews, anyway.) 2. In attempting to fix the problem, I installed Ubuntu to see whether it's gcc would fail in the same manner as the gcc on Gentoo had done. Much to my surprise, after successfully loading the distro onto my second hard disk by not being too picky about options, and downloading source of gcc and tar, I get the dread "gcc cannot create executables" message when attempting to compile. (This had nothing to do with the reboot problem I was having, since on Gentoo the compile would start, get part way through, and the system would reboot. Also, I then loaded up an old copy of Slackware on the same disk I had put Ubuntu, in the same hardware configuration, and Slack's gcc worked.) This has not improved my relationship with Ubuntu. Jeff -- Q: What will happen in the Aftermath? A: Impossible to tell, since we're still in the Beforemath. http://latedeveloper.org.uk -- Q: What will happen in the Aftermath? A: Impossible to tell, since we're still in the Beforemath. http://latedeveloper.org.uk -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
Hi list On 12/02/07, Jeff Rollin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 12/02/07, Hemmann, Volker Armin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > If you can read german (or if you know someone who is able to translate it for > you): > > http://hardware.thgweb.de/2007/01/15/stresstest_netzteile_2007/index.html > > Luckily, I own the same enermax they tested... > -- F everyone's I, that looks to be the same test someone else mentioned from Tom's Hardware - which is in English. That would probably work better than a machine translation, especially of a language like German, where the order of the words quite often with respect to English up-mixed is. :-) Jeff Sorry to resurrect this thread but I think I may have gotten a little closer to diagnosing the problem, if not to finding a solution. As I wrote to my local (non-gentoo-specialist) lug: "However, I am now reasonably certain, after having attempted to emerge portage several times, that at least in some cases the problem seems to be when the ./configure script gets to "checking dlfcn.h usability" (this actually occurs when emerge attempts to compile gettext as a dependency). I am posting this same info to the Gentoo mailinglist as well." I would be grateful for any ideas. -- Q: What will happen in the Aftermath? A: Impossible to tell, since we're still in the Beforemath. http://latedeveloper.org.uk -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
On 12/02/07, Hemmann, Volker Armin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: If you can read german (or if you know someone who is able to translate it for you): http://hardware.thgweb.de/2007/01/15/stresstest_netzteile_2007/index.html Luckily, I own the same enermax they tested... -- F everyone's I, that looks to be the same test someone else mentioned from Tom's Hardware - which is in English. That would probably work better than a machine translation, especially of a language like German, where the order of the words quite often with respect to English up-mixed is. :-) Jeff
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
On 12/02/07, Alan McKinnon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
On Monday 12 February 2007, Matt Richards wrote:
> I wouldn't of thought it would be the RAM not from behavior like that
> but it does sound like a overheating issue, I have had computers just
> power off because they get too hot.
The thing with memtest is that it does (mostly) predictable tests, which
can detect consistent errors with memory chips, or somewhat random
errors with memory.
BUT, it doesn't help at all with detecting didgy hardware in other
areas. It doesn't give you any valid tests for what happens when the
machine gets hot for example. Compiling a kernel (or openoffice.org) 10
times in a loop does do that.
It does look like it's a problem with the PSU or (God forbid) the cpu. ("God
forbid" because new CPU means new motherboard also).
So, I would say that you have shown that your memory chips are not
likely to be faulty, but you have not yet proven that the cpu (or the
rest of the machine) isn't getting hot and overloading.
Jeff, if you were paying me to diagnose your problem, I'd be telling you
to swap out the psu and test some more, then disassemble the
cpu/heatsink combination and replace the thermal grease and test some
more. If it then fails, the tests are still not conclusive so I would
want to forcefully cool the machine (with an external fan etc) while
putting it through some stress tests (like a looong compile).
Well at the moment it doesn't even survive the early stages of a short
compile (the ./configure stage) so hopefully if any progress at all is made
at diagnosing the problem, it'll be quick. Unfortunately if I were paying
you to diagnose the problem I'd also have enough money to buy spare PSU's -
but I'm not!
Jeff
--
Now, did you hear the news today?
They say the danger's gone away
But I can hear the marching feet
Moving into the street
Adapted from Genesis, "Land of Confusion"
http://latedeveloper.org.uk
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
On Monday 12 February 2007, Matt Richards wrote: > I wouldn't of thought it would be the RAM not from behavior like that > but it does sound like a overheating issue, I have had computers just > power off because they get too hot. The thing with memtest is that it does (mostly) predictable tests, which can detect consistent errors with memory chips, or somewhat random errors with memory. BUT, it doesn't help at all with detecting didgy hardware in other areas. It doesn't give you any valid tests for what happens when the machine gets hot for example. Compiling a kernel (or openoffice.org) 10 times in a loop does do that. So, I would say that you have shown that your memory chips are not likely to be faulty, but you have not yet proven that the cpu (or the rest of the machine) isn't getting hot and overloading. Jeff, if you were paying me to diagnose your problem, I'd be telling you to swap out the psu and test some more, then disassemble the cpu/heatsink combination and replace the thermal grease and test some more. If it then fails, the tests are still not conclusive so I would want to forcefully cool the machine (with an external fan etc) while putting it through some stress tests (like a looong compile). Unfortunately, it happens to be true that only extended periods of high load using all (or most) of the systems in a machine qualify as a decent test. alan -- Optimists say the glass is half full, Pessimists say the glass is half empty, Developers say wtf is the glass twice as big as it needs to be? Alan McKinnon alan at linuxholdings dot co dot za +27 82, double three seven, one nine three five -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
On Mon, 12 Feb 2007 19:46:42 +0300, Hemmann, Volker Armin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: If you can read german (or if you know someone who is able to translate it for you): http://hardware.thgweb.de/2007/01/15/stresstest_netzteile_2007/index.html Nice link, thanks. Re reading German: 1. Google the first line of the article (of course, in quotes). 2. Click "Translate this page" for the only link Google returns. 3. The resulting English text is quite readable. -- Andrei Gerasimenko -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
On Montag, 12. Februar 2007, Alan McKinnon wrote:
> On Sunday 11 February 2007, Jeff Rollin wrote:
> > On 11/02/07, Kent Fredric <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > I would go with Hammann with
> > > "Make sure, that it is overheating and not a weak/dying PSU."
> > >
> > > Many people neglect to realise how important a decent PSU is, and
> > > how major an effect it can have on systems. A dodgy PSU in my
> > > experience can do everything from -CAUSING- overheating, to random
> > > shutoffs, and MURDERING hard drives.
> > > I had one which killed 3 Hard Drives before I realised thats what
> > > the problem was, and the last hard drive was so cooked it didn't
> > > even spin up.
> > >
> > > --
> >
> > Joy. I should certainly hope it is NOT the PSU as it is new, and
> > replaced a dead one.
> >
> > ("New" as in "bought sometime in the summer")
>
> fwiw,
>
> I've given up on the consumer electronics industry being able to
> consistently build high quality power supplies for ANYTHING that plugs
> into the mains. The normal build quality is terrible, and the ability
> of the designer to do the job leaves much to be desired. It almost
> looks like the things are deisnged to be "good enough to just make it
> past a years warranty"
>
> Saying you might have a dodgy and new psu surprises me about as much as
> saying that the sky is blue and water is wet
>
>
> alan
>
If you can read german (or if you know someone who is able to translate it for
you):
http://hardware.thgweb.de/2007/01/15/stresstest_netzteile_2007/index.html
Luckily, I own the same enermax they tested...
--
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 I wouldn't of thought it would be the RAM not from behavior like that but it does sound like a overheating issue, I have had computers just power off because they get too hot. Matty. Jeff Rollin wrote: > On 12/02/07, Dan Farrell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >> I recommend you look into memtest86 to check your ram, it's provided as >> a boot option on the gentoo boot cds. >> -- >> gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list >> >> > Dan, > > Quite correct > > Funnily enough I had an Ubuntu LiveCD to hand with it on, so I used that > instead. Is there a finite number of passes the program needs to make? I > left it running for six hours yesterday and it had done something like 11+ > passes without finding an error. Is that anywhere near long enough? > > Thanks > > Jeff > -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFF0JHxrmnybSDmzlsRAgv4AJ0bN3oRkuiJyi9DNg3+liSJIP/HiwCgllxb 0xij2E2sHmrY/3/iVTtIkfg= =dFD+ -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
On 12/02/07, Dan Farrell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I recommend you look into memtest86 to check your ram, it's provided as a boot option on the gentoo boot cds. -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list Dan, Quite correct Funnily enough I had an Ubuntu LiveCD to hand with it on, so I used that instead. Is there a finite number of passes the program needs to make? I left it running for six hours yesterday and it had done something like 11+ passes without finding an error. Is that anywhere near long enough? Thanks Jeff
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
I recommend you look into memtest86 to check your ram, it's provided as a boot option on the gentoo boot cds. -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
Alan McKinnon wrote: On Monday 12 February 2007, Mark Kirkwood wrote: While I generally agree, not *all* manufacturers provide rubbish for us... e.g in the current context Zalman PSUs are very good quality (robust and quiet), and if you hunt around a bit even some of the less spectacular brands have their moments (e.g I have a couple of Thermaltake 560W PSUs that are very good). True enough, but I was careful to qualify what I said :-) I said "consumer electronics", that's the bargain / reasonably priced stuff that you find in your local electronics/pc store. You do get decent stuff out there but it's in a different class and "consumer grade" isn't a good descriptor Right - sorry, misunderstood what you meant by "consumer electronics". Cheers Mark -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
On Monday 12 February 2007, Mark Kirkwood wrote: > > I've given up on the consumer electronics industry being able to > > consistently build high quality power supplies for ANYTHING that > > plugs into the mains. The normal build quality is terrible, and the > > ability of the designer to do the job leaves much to be desired. It > > almost looks like the things are deisnged to be "good enough to > > just make it past a years warranty" > > > > Saying you might have a dodgy and new psu surprises me about as > > much as saying that the sky is blue and water is wet > > While I generally agree, not *all* manufacturers provide rubbish for > us... e.g in the current context Zalman PSUs are very good quality > (robust and quiet), and if you hunt around a bit even some of the > less spectacular brands have their moments (e.g I have a couple of > Thermaltake 560W PSUs that are very good). True enough, but I was careful to qualify what I said :-) I said "consumer electronics", that's the bargain / reasonably priced stuff that you find in your local electronics/pc store. You do get decent stuff out there but it's in a different class and "consumer grade" isn't a good descriptor alan -- Optimists say the glass is half full, Pessimists say the glass is half empty, Developers say wtf is the glass twice as big as it needs to be? Alan McKinnon alan at linuxholdings dot co dot za +27 82, double three seven, one nine three five -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
RE: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
Often this is the case especially with many so called "good deals". A lot
of the power supplies coming out of China are built for selling and not for
performance. In my own experience I have found Corsair Modular Power
Supplies to have reliable capacitors and provide steady amps. Expect to pay
more for solid core capacitors which are more effective and reliable.
-Original Message-
From: Mark Kirkwood [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, 12 February 2007 9:57 p.m.
To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org
Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
Alan McKinnon wrote:
> On Sunday 11 February 2007, Jeff Rollin wrote:
>> On 11/02/07, Kent Fredric <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>> I would go with Hammann with
>>> "Make sure, that it is overheating and not a weak/dying PSU."
>>>
>>> Many people neglect to realise how important a decent PSU is, and
>>> how major an effect it can have on systems. A dodgy PSU in my
>>> experience can do everything from -CAUSING- overheating, to random
>>> shutoffs, and MURDERING hard drives.
>>> I had one which killed 3 Hard Drives before I realised thats what
>>> the problem was, and the last hard drive was so cooked it didn't
>>> even spin up.
>>>
>>> --
>> Joy. I should certainly hope it is NOT the PSU as it is new, and
>> replaced a dead one.
>>
>> ("New" as in "bought sometime in the summer")
>
> fwiw,
>
> I've given up on the consumer electronics industry being able to
> consistently build high quality power supplies for ANYTHING that plugs
> into the mains. The normal build quality is terrible, and the ability
> of the designer to do the job leaves much to be desired. It almost
> looks like the things are deisnged to be "good enough to just make it
> past a years warranty"
>
> Saying you might have a dodgy and new psu surprises me about as much as
> saying that the sky is blue and water is wet
>
While I generally agree, not *all* manufacturers provide rubbish for
us... e.g in the current context Zalman PSUs are very good quality
(robust and quiet), and if you hunt around a bit even some of the less
spectacular brands have their moments (e.g I have a couple of
Thermaltake 560W PSUs that are very good).
Cheers
Mark
--
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
--
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
Alan McKinnon wrote:
On Sunday 11 February 2007, Jeff Rollin wrote:
On 11/02/07, Kent Fredric <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
I would go with Hammann with
"Make sure, that it is overheating and not a weak/dying PSU."
Many people neglect to realise how important a decent PSU is, and
how major an effect it can have on systems. A dodgy PSU in my
experience can do everything from -CAUSING- overheating, to random
shutoffs, and MURDERING hard drives.
I had one which killed 3 Hard Drives before I realised thats what
the problem was, and the last hard drive was so cooked it didn't
even spin up.
--
Joy. I should certainly hope it is NOT the PSU as it is new, and
replaced a dead one.
("New" as in "bought sometime in the summer")
fwiw,
I've given up on the consumer electronics industry being able to
consistently build high quality power supplies for ANYTHING that plugs
into the mains. The normal build quality is terrible, and the ability
of the designer to do the job leaves much to be desired. It almost
looks like the things are deisnged to be "good enough to just make it
past a years warranty"
Saying you might have a dodgy and new psu surprises me about as much as
saying that the sky is blue and water is wet
While I generally agree, not *all* manufacturers provide rubbish for
us... e.g in the current context Zalman PSUs are very good quality
(robust and quiet), and if you hunt around a bit even some of the less
spectacular brands have their moments (e.g I have a couple of
Thermaltake 560W PSUs that are very good).
Cheers
Mark
--
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
On Sunday 11 February 2007, Jeff Rollin wrote:
> On 11/02/07, Kent Fredric <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > I would go with Hammann with
> > "Make sure, that it is overheating and not a weak/dying PSU."
> >
> > Many people neglect to realise how important a decent PSU is, and
> > how major an effect it can have on systems. A dodgy PSU in my
> > experience can do everything from -CAUSING- overheating, to random
> > shutoffs, and MURDERING hard drives.
> > I had one which killed 3 Hard Drives before I realised thats what
> > the problem was, and the last hard drive was so cooked it didn't
> > even spin up.
> >
> > --
>
> Joy. I should certainly hope it is NOT the PSU as it is new, and
> replaced a dead one.
>
> ("New" as in "bought sometime in the summer")
fwiw,
I've given up on the consumer electronics industry being able to
consistently build high quality power supplies for ANYTHING that plugs
into the mains. The normal build quality is terrible, and the ability
of the designer to do the job leaves much to be desired. It almost
looks like the things are deisnged to be "good enough to just make it
past a years warranty"
Saying you might have a dodgy and new psu surprises me about as much as
saying that the sky is blue and water is wet
alan
--
Optimists say the glass is half full,
Pessimists say the glass is half empty,
Developers say wtf is the glass twice as big as it needs to be?
Alan McKinnon
alan at linuxholdings dot co dot za
+27 82, double three seven, one nine three five
--
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
On Sonntag, 11. Februar 2007, Jeff Rollin wrote:
> On 11/02/07, Kent Fredric <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > I would go with Hammann with
> > "Make sure, that it is overheating and not a weak/dying PSU."
> >
> > Many people neglect to realise how important a decent PSU is, and how
> > major an effect it can have on systems. A dodgy PSU in my experience
> > can do everything from -CAUSING- overheating, to random shutoffs, and
> > MURDERING hard drives.
> > I had one which killed 3 Hard Drives before I realised thats what the
> > problem was, and the last hard drive was so cooked it didn't even spin
> > up.
> >
> > --
>
> Joy. I should certainly hope it is NOT the PSU as it is new, and replaced a
> dead one.
>
> ("New" as in "bought sometime in the summer")
6 month are enough time for a PSU to become bad.
Tomshardware just run a nice PSU test - the results were devastating. Only 4
of the 9 PSUs survived the test.
--
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
On 11/02/07, Hemmann, Volker Armin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On Sonntag, 11. Februar 2007, Jeff Rollin wrote: > Hi list, > > I am having trouble when compiling things on Gentoo. When I start a > compile, it goes partway through and then reboots the machine (I can't > confirm it's due to a compile but it seems likely since I have been > compiling things each of the times this has happened. > > One thing that might be causing the problem (?) is that last time I > compiled the kernel I stupidly left out ACPI support. > > Any ideas? like building a kernel with that ACPI stuff? Or let the case open? I have replaced the kernel with a prebuilt one from the LiveCD, to no effect. (That is, it works, until the machine reboots again) Building one wouldn't be an option as this machine is the only one I currently have w/ Linux on it and it does not "survive" a compile before rebooting Letting the case open I suppose would be a good diagnostic. Hopefully I will find a permanent solution though Jeff
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
On 11/02/07, Kent Fredric <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
I would go with Hammann with
"Make sure, that it is overheating and not a weak/dying PSU."
Many people neglect to realise how important a decent PSU is, and how
major an effect it can have on systems. A dodgy PSU in my experience
can do everything from -CAUSING- overheating, to random shutoffs, and
MURDERING hard drives.
I had one which killed 3 Hard Drives before I realised thats what the
problem was, and the last hard drive was so cooked it didn't even spin
up.
--
Joy. I should certainly hope it is NOT the PSU as it is new, and replaced a
dead one.
("New" as in "bought sometime in the summer")
Will check all the same, thanks
Jeff
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
On 2/11/07, Jeff Rollin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Hi list,
I am having trouble when compiling things on Gentoo. When I start a compile,
it goes partway through and then reboots the machine (I can't confirm it's
due to a compile but it seems likely since I have been compiling things each
of the times this has happened.
One thing that might be causing the problem (?) is that last time I compiled
the kernel I stupidly left out ACPI support.
Any ideas?
TIA,
Jeff
--
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
I would go with Hammann with
"Make sure, that it is overheating and not a weak/dying PSU."
Many people neglect to realise how important a decent PSU is, and how
major an effect it can have on systems. A dodgy PSU in my experience
can do everything from -CAUSING- overheating, to random shutoffs, and
MURDERING hard drives.
I had one which killed 3 Hard Drives before I realised thats what the
problem was, and the last hard drive was so cooked it didn't even spin
up.
--
Kent
ruby -e '[1, 2, 4, 7, 0, 9, 5, 8, 3, 10, 11, 6, 12, 13].each{|x|
print "enNOSPicAMreil [EMAIL PROTECTED]"[(2*x)..(2*x+1)]}'
--
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
On Sun, 11 Feb 2007 11:57:19 +0300, William Kenworthy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Heat (dust bunnies/blocked fans/filters ...) bad memory Bad memory or bad motherboard. This is less likely, but also happens (saw that Thursday). Ideally, switch memory with another similar PC and see what happens to both. -- Andrei Gerasimenko -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
On Sonntag, 11. Februar 2007, Jeff Rollin wrote: > Hi list, > > I am having trouble when compiling things on Gentoo. When I start a > compile, it goes partway through and then reboots the machine (I can't > confirm it's due to a compile but it seems likely since I have been > compiling things each of the times this has happened. > > One thing that might be causing the problem (?) is that last time I > compiled the kernel I stupidly left out ACPI support. > > Any ideas? like building a kernel with that ACPI stuff? Or let the case open? Make sure, that it is overheating and not a weak/dying PSU. -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
070211 William Kenworthy wrote: > On Sun, 2007-02-11 at 08:36 +, Jeff Rollin wrote: >> When I start a compile, it goes partway through >> and then reboots the machine > Heat (dust bunnies/blocked fans/filters ...), bad memory I've had problems in the past due to the CPU overheating: the machine will shut off automatically & you may have it set to reboot. I cured it by taking the CPU & fan apart, blowing & brushing -- carefully ! -- all the dust off & putting some fresh heat compound between the two. -- ,, SUPPORT ___//___, Philip Webb : [EMAIL PROTECTED] ELECTRIC /] [] [] [] [] []| Centre for Urban & Community Studies TRANSIT`-O--O---' University of Toronto -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Help - system reboots while compiling
Heat (dust bunnies/blocked fans/filters ...) bad memory Both the above get extra stress during compiles, the cpu throws a panic and depending on kernel options will reboot. Other things can do it, but the above seem most common. BillK On Sun, 2007-02-11 at 08:36 +, Jeff Rollin wrote: > Hi list, > > I am having trouble when compiling things on Gentoo. When I start a compile, > it goes partway through and then reboots the machine (I can't confirm it's > due to a compile but it seems likely since I have been compiling things each > of the times this has happened. > > One thing that might be causing the problem (?) is that last time I compiled > the kernel I stupidly left out ACPI support. > > Any ideas? > > TIA, > > Jeff -- William Kenworthy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Home! -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
