Re: low power linux PC?
I've got a set of the Western Digital 'Green' drives coming in tomorrow (whoops...today now): 8.5 Watts - only 5400 RPM though (so I'm expecting to cache aggressively). I'm trying to build a quiet, powerful 1U server so every Watt counts in keeping the fans slow (quiet). We'll see, WD's haven't been so reliable for me. At work, we recently deployed a storage server in the data-center stuffed full of 1T Green Drives, and I've gotta tell you: Far more then I expected out of them. They can boost performance up to nearly 7200 rpm's when demand is high (power curve goes up with it). Since we're using them primarily as NFS mounts over Gigabit Ethernet, the bottleneck hasn't been the I/O. They're currently configged in RAID-10 (software) with ext3 FS's. Haven't really noticed a huge difference in cache usage from our older choice of drives. It's only been a few weeks with them, so I can't speak to the longterm reliability, though. -- ~ * ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: low power linux PC?
Thanks for the feedback on the Green drives. Good to hear! On Apr 8, 2008, at 09:01, Star wrote: Since we're using them primarily as NFS mounts over Gigabit Ethernet, the bottleneck hasn't been the I/O. They're currently configged in RAID-10 (software) with ext3 FS's. Yeah, and that's a good strategy for dealing with slow drives - RAID 1 or 10 helps ameliorate their slow seeks. With the ariel density these days I don't think rotation speed is so important anymore for transfer, at least for the average case, but the seek can still hurt. I read earlier that even thought they're billed as 5400-7200 RPM drives, they're either 5400 or 7200 depending on model. WD seems to obfuscate what's really going on, at least without having dug deep into spec sheets. -Bill - Bill McGonigle, Owner Work: 603.448.4440 BFC Computing, LLC Home: 603.448.1668 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cell: 603.252.2606 http://www.bfccomputing.com/Page: 603.442.1833 Blog: http://blog.bfccomputing.com/ VCard: http://bfccomputing.com/vcard/bill.vcf ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: low power linux PC?
On Apr 8, 2008, at 00:10, Bill McGonigle wrote: 8.5 Watts - only 5400 RPM though (so I'm expecting to cache aggressively). Ah, nutz, I see Seagate just released something darn close in 7200RPM: http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?p=5552484 -Bill - Bill McGonigle, Owner Work: 603.448.4440 BFC Computing, LLC Home: 603.448.1668 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cell: 603.252.2606 http://www.bfccomputing.com/Page: 603.442.1833 Blog: http://blog.bfccomputing.com/ VCard: http://bfccomputing.com/vcard/bill.vcf ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: low power linux PC?
Bill McGonigle wrote: On Apr 7, 2008, at 23:10, Bob King wrote: On Sun, Apr 6, 2008 at 11:04 PM, Ben Scott [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I suspect the hard drives will be pushing things. Figure 15 watts per disk. Startup watts for the laptop drive I used in my new router was 4.5 watts. I've got a set of the Western Digital 'Green' drives coming in tomorrow (whoops...today now): 8.5 Watts - only 5400 RPM though (so I'm expecting to cache aggressively). I'm trying to build a quiet, powerful 1U server so every Watt counts in keeping the fans slow (quiet). We'll see, WD's haven't been so reliable for me. For what it's worth I've had good luck with WD's this year and abysmal experience with seagate, so things may be looking up for you. 8.5 watts is *nice*. -Bill - Bill McGonigle, Owner Work: 603.448.4440 BFC Computing, LLC Home: 603.448.1668 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cell: 603.252.2606 http://www.bfccomputing.com/Page: 603.442.1833 Blog: http://blog.bfccomputing.com/ VCard: http://bfccomputing.com/vcard/bill.vcf ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/ ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: low power linux PC?
On Sun, Apr 6, 2008 at 10:07 PM, Peter Dobratz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So I want to setup a linux server at home to do backups from various computers around the house. Amanda looks promising ( http://amanda.zmanda.com/ ) If you might be contemplating letting the workstations manage their backups in a push method, you may also want to take a look at Time Warp or Fly-Back for linux. Not sure about a windows method here, however, some crafty scripting with rsync or rsnapshot can give you full backups to remote devices and save a lot on space. Think Apple's Time-Warp while using hard links to represent files that haven't changed. My backups are tiny now without playing the incremental game. For the backup server, I want to setup a separate box, probably running Debian. As the primary purpose of this computer is just to store the backups, my primary feature consideration is power requirements. Is there anything out there that can run Linux, have a few 250 GB or greater hard drives, and run on around 50 Watts or less? It can be a headless box that I ssh into. I've recently fallen in love with the Buffalo line of products for networked storage. Healthy drive size to start with, and a couple of USB 2.0 ports to add more when/if necessary. The tinkerer in me doesn't like that it's all prebuilt and shiny, but for plug-in-and-go it's a good measuring-stick. -- ~ * ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: low power linux PC?
There are a few notebook drive enclosures on the market that work off the power of the USB port with a 2.5 inch disk inside. You have to be careful in the selection of the 2.5 inch drives that you put in the enclosures to have very low power requirements, but you can find 160 GB drives that do work. Then some of the tiny-PC boxes previously mentioned can drive several of these drives, providing a server that can run at very low power, albeit with drives external to the main system box (and the system box might also have its own internal drive). You may want to test one or two external enclosure/drive/tiny-pc combinations, as you are dealing with fairly close tolerances here. I should also mention that if the enclosure/disk combinations need a bit more power most have an axillary power input to get it over the hump, which could be supplied by one power dongle of suitable power output providing the power to all the units at once. You might want to look at the efficiency of these power dongles, however, as some might waste more power than they provide. md -- Jon maddog Hall Executive Director Linux International(R) email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 80 Amherst St. Voice: +1.603.672.4557 Amherst, N.H. 03031-3032 U.S.A. WWW: http://www.li.org Board Member: Uniforum Association Board Member Emeritus: USENIX Association (2000-2006) (R)Linux is a registered trademark of Linus Torvalds in several countries. (R)Linux International is a registered trademark in the USA used pursuant to a license from Linux Mark Institute, authorized licensor of Linus Torvalds, owner of the Linux trademark on a worldwide basis (R)UNIX is a registered trademark of The Open Group in the USA and other countries. ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: low power linux PC?
Peter Dobratz wrote: So I want to setup a linux server at home to do backups from various computers around the house. Amanda looks promising ( http://amanda.zmanda.com/ ) For the backup server, I want to setup a separate box, probably running Debian. As the primary purpose of this computer is just to store the backups, my primary feature consideration is power requirements. Is there anything out there that can run Linux, have a few 250 GB or greater hard drives, and run on around 50 Watts or less? It can be a headless box that I ssh into. The Linksys NSLU2 may be close to what you want. It works with USB drives (any size), is low power, runs debian and is fairly inexpensive. I picked up one on eBay last year for $90, then found some at the MIT flea last year for $45. I have two, one acting as a fileserver for non-RAID data, the other as my DNS/DHCP/LDAP server. Flash based, so aside from any drive noise, it's quiet. -Mark ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: low power linux PC?
On Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 9:37 AM, Jon 'maddog' Hall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There are a few notebook drive enclosures on the market that work off the power of the USB port with a 2.5 inch disk inside. FYI, from what I've read, some of those devices violate the USB spec, in terms of power demands. In particular, the idea of hanging two USB A connectors off one cable does nothing -- the USB spec says devices have to negotiate their power demands with the host controller. Or so I'm told. These things frequently happen to work anyway, but one should be aware of this. I'd recommend buying from a vendor with an easy returns policy, just in case. -- Ben ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: low power linux PC?
I'd recommend buying from a vendor with an easy returns policy, just in case. I agree with Ben's warning, and perhaps I was not clear enough in my write-up that this was more or less a study and try scenario for those that would build their own, ergo easy returns policies and deep study of power requirements for both the enclosure and the disk are necessary. For those that want an enclosure and disk that have been assembled and tested by a manufacturer, here is an example: http://www.microdirect.co.uk/ProductInfo.aspx?ProductID=22807 I tried the Lacie 160 GB USB powered drive and it worked fine with the one power connector to the USB 2.0 bus, with no additional power needed. This is a follow-on product of 250 GB. Note: This is not an endorsement of Lacie or this particular product. md -- Jon maddog Hall Executive Director Linux International(R) email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 80 Amherst St. Voice: +1.603.672.4557 Amherst, N.H. 03031-3032 U.S.A. WWW: http://www.li.org Board Member: Uniforum Association Board Member Emeritus: USENIX Association (2000-2006) (R)Linux is a registered trademark of Linus Torvalds in several countries. (R)Linux International is a registered trademark in the USA used pursuant to a license from Linux Mark Institute, authorized licensor of Linus Torvalds, owner of the Linux trademark on a worldwide basis (R)UNIX is a registered trademark of The Open Group in the USA and other countries. ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: low power linux PC?
On Mon, 2008-04-07 at 09:37 -0400, Jon 'maddog' Hall wrote: There are a few notebook drive enclosures on the market that work off the power of the USB port with a 2.5 inch disk inside. You have to be careful in the selection of the 2.5 inch drives that you put in the enclosures to have very low power requirements, but you can find 160 GB drives that do work. Then some of the tiny-PC boxes previously mentioned can drive several of these drives, providing a server that can run at very low power, albeit with drives external to the main system box (and the system box might also have its own internal drive). You may want to test one or two external enclosure/drive/tiny-pc combinations, as you are dealing with fairly close tolerances here. I should also mention that if the enclosure/disk combinations need a bit more power most have an axillary power input to get it over the hump, which could be supplied by one power dongle of suitable power output providing the power to all the units at once. You might want to look at the efficiency of these power dongles, however, as some might waste more power than they provide. md As an aside, I noticed that most of the low cost network hardware vendors provide power cubes that are very simple transformer/AC bridge designs or alternatively switched type supplies. The switched types are generally much smaller and more efficient. I have one Netgear VPN router that came with a 12 volt power cube of the former type that must weigh close to a pound. Later models came with a switched variant that may have weighed 3 or 4 ozs. The switched supply also generates less heat. -Alex ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: low power linux PC?
On Mon, 2008-04-07 at 11:14 -0400, Alex Hewitt wrote: On Mon, 2008-04-07 at 09:37 -0400, Jon 'maddog' Hall wrote: There are a few notebook drive enclosures on the market that work off the power of the USB port with a 2.5 inch disk inside. You have to be careful in the selection of the 2.5 inch drives that you put in the enclosures to have very low power requirements, but you can find 160 GB drives that do work. Then some of the tiny-PC boxes previously mentioned can drive several of these drives, providing a server that can run at very low power, albeit with drives external to the main system box (and the system box might also have its own internal drive). You may want to test one or two external enclosure/drive/tiny-pc combinations, as you are dealing with fairly close tolerances here. I should also mention that if the enclosure/disk combinations need a bit more power most have an axillary power input to get it over the hump, which could be supplied by one power dongle of suitable power output providing the power to all the units at once. You might want to look at the efficiency of these power dongles, however, as some might waste more power than they provide. md As an aside, I noticed that most of the low cost network hardware vendors provide power cubes that are very simple transformer/AC bridge designs or alternatively switched type supplies. The switched types are generally much smaller and more efficient. I have one Netgear VPN router that came with a 12 volt power cube of the former type that must weigh close to a pound. Later models came with a switched variant that may have weighed 3 or 4 ozs. The switched supply also generates less heat. -Alex ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/ I believe this item, http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/travelpower/7657/; that measures power consumption might have been discussed on the list before but the same folks now offer a more sophisticated model: http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/travelpower/7acf/ I do endorse the ThinkGeek people. I've bought a number of useful items from them and never had a problem... -Alex P.S. These items are especially useful for sizing UPSs. ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: low power linux PC?
Transformer-based wall-wart efficiency: Typically 23 - 28 % Switching wall-wart efficiency: Typically 80 - 90% For a device that will be on 24/7, a switching supply pays for itself in less than a year in New England. --DTVZ On Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 11:14 AM, Alex Hewitt [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 2008-04-07 at 09:37 -0400, Jon 'maddog' Hall wrote: There are a few notebook drive enclosures on the market that work off the power of the USB port with a 2.5 inch disk inside. You have to be careful in the selection of the 2.5 inch drives that you put in the enclosures to have very low power requirements, but you can find 160 GB drives that do work. Then some of the tiny-PC boxes previously mentioned can drive several of these drives, providing a server that can run at very low power, albeit with drives external to the main system box (and the system box might also have its own internal drive). You may want to test one or two external enclosure/drive/tiny-pc combinations, as you are dealing with fairly close tolerances here. I should also mention that if the enclosure/disk combinations need a bit more power most have an axillary power input to get it over the hump, which could be supplied by one power dongle of suitable power output providing the power to all the units at once. You might want to look at the efficiency of these power dongles, however, as some might waste more power than they provide. md As an aside, I noticed that most of the low cost network hardware vendors provide power cubes that are very simple transformer/AC bridge designs or alternatively switched type supplies. The switched types are generally much smaller and more efficient. I have one Netgear VPN router that came with a 12 volt power cube of the former type that must weigh close to a pound. Later models came with a switched variant that may have weighed 3 or 4 ozs. The switched supply also generates less heat. -Alex ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/ ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
power meters [ was low power linux PC? ]
Alex Hewitt [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I believe this item, http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/travelpower/7657/; that measures power consumption might have been discussed on the list before but the same folks now offer a more sophisticated model: http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/travelpower/7acf/ I'm curious what the major differences between these two are. The former costs $129.00, the latter $24.99. Is it that the Watt's UP! model records and stores info whereas the Kill'O'Watt merely displays the current stats? And, does anyone know of something like this that measures 220VAC as well? (I'd really like to know what my stove and clothes dryer cost me :) -- Seeya, Paul ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: low power linux PC?
On Sun, 2008-04-06 at 22:07 -0400, Peter Dobratz wrote: For the backup server, I want to setup a separate box, probably running Debian. As the primary purpose of this computer is just to store the backups, my primary feature consideration is power requirements. Is there anything out there that can run Linux, have a few 250 GB or greater hard drives, and run on around 50 Watts or less? It can be a headless box that I ssh into. For a similar solution, I plug an external SDD (Spun Down Disk) drive into a Dell portable. As for a low power system that runs Linux, I've used disk-less fan-less boxes in the past that were similar to these: http://www.norhtec.com/products/index.html I used them for network monitoring in NOC's running openssh, wireshark, tcpdump, and iperf, on them. The company that made the particular brand, which was StrongARM based, that I had used back then is no longer in business. As for the external SDD drive, I have a Fantom External USB Drive (Fantom Titanium-II TFD500U16 500GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache USB 2.0 External). In addition to spinning down when not in use, it is also fan-less. After ten minutes of inactivity the drive goes into low power mode. It automatically reactivates when any file systems that exist on it are accessed. I power off the drive when I'm not using it in order to save additional energy. But, because my backups (database exports) can take some time to download over my cable modem I'll often go to sleep after starting the back-up process and shut off the drive in the morning. I'm not sure about the watt consumption on the device since I don't have access to a Kill-A-Watt type meter. But, it seems minimal. Aside from a portable drive drawing power over USB, as some one else mentioned, I think it's as low as you'll get for a reasonable cost given what you're trying to do. One note of caution regarding my set-up. Since the Fantom drives are fan-less, they rely on the metal case to dissipate the heat generated by the disk drive. I've heard some people say that their drives have had early failures, possibly due to over heating. I've had my drive for almost a year with no problems. But, I have a second drive of the same model that I replicate to just in case my luck runs out. The Broad Institute has a very large array of SATA-II drives (a full rack) that rely on Spun Down Disk technology to conserve power. They have been very happy with the technology at that scale. That's what convinced me to try it out at home. A higher cost but much lower power solution would be a Flash Memory based storage device. - VAB - V. Alex Brennen[EMAIL PROTECTED] UNIX Systems Administrator x3-9327 MIT Libraries http://vab.mit.edu/ ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: power meters [ was low power linux PC? ]
The Kill-a-watt loses all data on power loss; the other does not. Also, the displayed resolution on the kill-a-watt is a bit coarse for things like wall warts, though it apparently has higher internal resolution. I found it necessary to run a wall wart off of one for a full 48 hours to get repeatable results that agreed with manual calculations using data from a pair of multimeters. The inaccuracies were within 1/2 displayed LSB, but at very low currents that's HUGE. I don't know if the more expensive one has higher display accuracy, however, so it might suffer from the same issue. I can only speak for the one I own, and point out that it would take a LOT of increased power savings to justify the more expensive one. --DTVZ On Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 11:53 AM, Paul Lussier [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Alex Hewitt [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I believe this item, http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/travelpower/7657/; that measures power consumption might have been discussed on the list before but the same folks now offer a more sophisticated model: http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/travelpower/7acf/ I'm curious what the major differences between these two are. The former costs $129.00, the latter $24.99. Is it that the Watt's UP! model records and stores info whereas the Kill'O'Watt merely displays the current stats? And, does anyone know of something like this that measures 220VAC as well? (I'd really like to know what my stove and clothes dryer cost me :) -- Seeya, Paul ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/ ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: power meters [ was low power linux PC? ]
The more sophisticated model has a USB interface. --Bruce PS: For 220, you can measure the two live legs using 2 separate meters. But in general, things like dryers and ranges will have the same readings for both legs. BTW: You're dealing with deadly power here. I don't recommend cobbling this together unless you know what you're doing. Paul Lussier wrote: Alex Hewitt [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I believe this item, http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/travelpower/7657/; that measures power consumption might have been discussed on the list before but the same folks now offer a more sophisticated model: http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/travelpower/7acf/ I'm curious what the major differences between these two are. The former costs $129.00, the latter $24.99. Is it that the Watt's UP! model records and stores info whereas the Kill'O'Watt merely displays the current stats? And, does anyone know of something like this that measures 220VAC as well? (I'd really like to know what my stove and clothes dryer cost me :) ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: power meters [ was low power linux PC? ]
On Mon, 2008-04-07 at 11:53 -0400, Paul Lussier wrote: Alex Hewitt [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I believe this item, http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/travelpower/7657/; that measures power consumption might have been discussed on the list before but the same folks now offer a more sophisticated model: http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/travelpower/7acf/ I'm curious what the major differences between these two are. The former costs $129.00, the latter $24.99. Is it that the Watt's UP! model records and stores info whereas the Kill'O'Watt merely displays the current stats? The killawatt device just displays accumulated power use and wouldn't provide any kind of histogram. The more expensive device has a USB interface and an accompanying program to record and display power usage. The included program only runs on Windows but presumably if the USB port data could be monitored on a Linux system something similar could be created. -Alex P.S. To come up with meaningful power usage for UPS sizing you would want to drive the load as hard as possible. And, does anyone know of something like this that measures 220VAC as well? (I'd really like to know what my stove and clothes dryer cost me :) ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: power meters [ was low power linux PC? ]
On Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 11:53 AM, Paul Lussier [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: And, does anyone know of something like this that measures 220VAC as well? (I'd really like to know what my stove and clothes dryer cost me :) If you bought the appliance within the past 20 years or so, it should have come with a bright yellow sticker that explained it's power consumption. If you don't still have that, contact the manufacturer, they should have it on file. (Nominal factory original specs, of course, but since stoves and dryers are both basically just big resistors, I wouldn't expect much variation.) -- Ben ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: power meters [ was low power linux PC? ]
Ben Scott wrote: On Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 11:53 AM, Paul Lussier [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: And, does anyone know of something like this that measures 220VAC as well? (I'd really like to know what my stove and clothes dryer cost me :) If you bought the appliance within the past 20 years or so, it should have come with a bright yellow sticker that explained it's power consumption. If you don't still have that, contact the manufacturer, they should have it on file. (Nominal factory original specs, of course, but since stoves and dryers are both basically just big resistors, I wouldn't expect much variation.) The dryer (at least mine) has different heat settings, which isn't reflected in the yellow sticker. -Mark ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: power meters [ was low power linux PC? ]
clothes dryer cost me All I know is that I have never, ever had quite the sensation of burying my nose in sheets and towels dried in a clothes drier as I had with clothes right off the clothes line. The lack of that fresh, clean, natural scent is what clothes driers cost me. md -- Jon maddog Hall Executive Director Linux International(R) email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 80 Amherst St. Voice: +1.603.672.4557 Amherst, N.H. 03031-3032 U.S.A. WWW: http://www.li.org Board Member: Uniforum Association Board Member Emeritus: USENIX Association (2000-2006) (R)Linux is a registered trademark of Linus Torvalds in several countries. (R)Linux International is a registered trademark in the USA used pursuant to a license from Linux Mark Institute, authorized licensor of Linus Torvalds, owner of the Linux trademark on a worldwide basis (R)UNIX is a registered trademark of The Open Group in the USA and other countries. ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: power meters [ was low power linux PC? ]
On Mon, Apr 07, 2008 at 11:53:00AM -0400, Paul Lussier wrote: Alex Hewitt [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I believe this item, http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/travelpower/7657/; that measures power consumption might have been discussed on the list before but the same folks now offer a more sophisticated model: http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/travelpower/7acf/ I'm curious what the major differences between these two are. The former costs $129.00, the latter $24.99. Is it that the Watt's UP! model records and stores info whereas the Kill'O'Watt merely displays the current stats? The expensive one has USB so you can offload the data to a PC. I have two of the cheap ones that I'd be happy to loan out, if people are curious but don't necessarily want to buy a device they'll only use a few times. -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] OpenPGP KeyID 0x57C3430B Holder of Past Knowledge CS, O- For perfect happiness, remember two things: (1) Be content with what you've got. (2) Be sure you've got plenty. ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: power meters [ was low power linux PC? ]
On Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 4:27 PM, mike ledoux [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have two of the cheap ones that I'd be happy to loan out ... Yah, if anyone wants to borrow my Kill-A-Watt, same deal. -- Ben ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: power meters [ was low power linux PC? ]
On Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 2:38 PM, Mark Komarinski [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The dryer (at least mine) has different heat settings, which isn't reflected in the yellow sticker. While I'm not an appliance service tech, from what I've seen of that sort of thing, multiple heat settings usually means the same heating element, but with a thermostat. So instantaneous power draw doesn't change; it just cuts off at a lower temperature -- and, presumably, takes longer to run a cycle. I'm not sure how that works out on the bottom line. But I think you raise a good point: While the instantaneous draw might not vary significantly, how you use an appliance is likely going to influence the total watt-hours consumed. -- Ben ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: low power linux PC?
On Sun, Apr 6, 2008 at 11:04 PM, Ben Scott [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I suspect the hard drives will be pushing things. Figure 15 watts per disk. Startup watts for the laptop drive I used in my new router was 4.5 watts. You pay more for a laptop drive, but the power usage is certainly lower...as is the max storage available on each drive. I used a VIA C7 board at 1.2GHz with twin Gb NICs. During boot, the system peaks at 35 watts. Have not run any numbers on throughput yet. You can get a pretty decent server with a light appetite for power. ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: low power linux PC?
On Apr 7, 2008, at 23:10, Bob King wrote: On Sun, Apr 6, 2008 at 11:04 PM, Ben Scott [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I suspect the hard drives will be pushing things. Figure 15 watts per disk. Startup watts for the laptop drive I used in my new router was 4.5 watts. I've got a set of the Western Digital 'Green' drives coming in tomorrow (whoops...today now): 8.5 Watts - only 5400 RPM though (so I'm expecting to cache aggressively). I'm trying to build a quiet, powerful 1U server so every Watt counts in keeping the fans slow (quiet). We'll see, WD's haven't been so reliable for me. -Bill - Bill McGonigle, Owner Work: 603.448.4440 BFC Computing, LLC Home: 603.448.1668 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cell: 603.252.2606 http://www.bfccomputing.com/Page: 603.442.1833 Blog: http://blog.bfccomputing.com/ VCard: http://bfccomputing.com/vcard/bill.vcf ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
low power linux PC?
So I want to setup a linux server at home to do backups from various computers around the house. Amanda looks promising ( http://amanda.zmanda.com/ ) For the backup server, I want to setup a separate box, probably running Debian. As the primary purpose of this computer is just to store the backups, my primary feature consideration is power requirements. Is there anything out there that can run Linux, have a few 250 GB or greater hard drives, and run on around 50 Watts or less? It can be a headless box that I ssh into. Thanks, Peter ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: low power linux PC?
I just order a fit-pc that draws 5 watts. http://www.fit-pc.com/new/ It doesn't have the space that you are looking for, but with a new drive and some working you could get it to whatever size you want. Due to the low profile, it only takes laptop hard drives. I'll have pictures once I get mine (its in transit right now). Dan Peter Dobratz wrote: So I want to setup a linux server at home to do backups from various computers around the house. Amanda looks promising ( http://amanda.zmanda.com/ ) For the backup server, I want to setup a separate box, probably running Debian. As the primary purpose of this computer is just to store the backups, my primary feature consideration is power requirements. Is there anything out there that can run Linux, have a few 250 GB or greater hard drives, and run on around 50 Watts or less? It can be a headless box that I ssh into. Thanks, Peter ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/ ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: low power linux PC?
On Sun, Apr 6, 2008 at 10:07 PM, Peter Dobratz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is there anything out there that can run Linux, have a few 250 GB or greater hard drives, and run on around 50 Watts or less? I suspect the hard drives will be pushing things. Figure 15 watts per disk. Three disks -- without anything else -- will then consume basically all of your 50 watt power budget. But you can have them power-down when not in use, brining your long-term average power consumption down quite a bit. That leaves the rest of the system, and solutions in this area are plentiful these days. Some possibilities: Various vendors have all sorts of bity-boxes with USB ports. You could use one of those, and attach external USB hard disks. Koolu (http://koolu.com/) is one big name -- it claims to use 10 watts. LinkSys has all sorts of crap that might fit the bill. See http://wiki.openwrt.org/TableOfHardware for a list of other possible devices. Soekris (http://www.soekris.com/): While targeted mainly at flash-based storage, some of their SBC (single-board computer) designs have parallel IDE, and all are very low power. Mini-ITX motherboards are often lower-power designs. I've seen mention of models with at least four SATA ports. -- Ben ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
