Re: Settlements
Hyman Rosen hyro...@mail.com writes: On 2/26/2010 10:56 AM, RJack wrote: Alexander and I have gone to great lengths to explain to you the difference between a condition precedent and a scope of use condition. The GPL requires that its provisions be honored as a condition of granting permission to copy and distribute a covered work. One of the alternatives available to obtain permission is to make source available upon request. If someone copies and distributes a covered work using this provision but does not intend to honor such requests, he is infringing the copyright of the rights holders. Actually I disagree here: if he does so using this provision, he is violating not copyright, but his obligations to the copyright holder he subjected himself to voluntarily by using this provision. Copyright is what gives the copyright holder the power to insist on the recipients' compliance, but once the recipient states to make use of the license, we are talking of breach of license terms rather than breach of copyright, even though copyright enables the copyright holder to insist. GPLv2 more or less combined the two by automatically terminating the license upon non-compliance. But I don't think that this clause was ever actively pursued in court. -- David Kastrup ___ gnu-misc-discuss mailing list gnu-misc-discuss@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnu-misc-discuss
Re: Settlements
Alexander Terekhov terek...@web.de writes: Hyman Rosen wrote: On 2/26/2010 12:41 PM, Alexander Terekhov wrote: Yes, HOCHBERG, District Judge, United States District Court for the District of New Jersey, sitting by designation, wrote the baloney above. Crank vs. court. Court wins. Q: If you call a tail a leg, how many legs has a dog? Five? Judge HOCHBERG: Of course five. Abraham Lincoln: No, calling a tail a leg doesn't make it a leg! She's got the job, not you. And what _you_ have been calling this poor dog... -- David Kastrup ___ gnu-misc-discuss mailing list gnu-misc-discuss@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnu-misc-discuss
Re: Settlements
Alexander Terekhov terek...@web.de writes: Hyman Rosen wrote: [...] make source available upon request. If someone copies and distributes a covered work using this provision but does not intend to honor such requests, he is infringing the copyright Think of someone simply changing his mind later or just losing all the sources for some reason you retard. Hyman: Hello distributor, I've got your offer, give me the sources. Distributor: Sources? Fuck, where is the sources?! Shit, my wife shredded all that stuff!!! Hyman: You fucking copyright infringer! I'm calling SFLC!!! In this case you'll have little problem getting a court order that orders distribution of binaries to stop. Depending on the case, penalties are easy enough to come by. My wife shredded all that stuff is not seen as a valid defense in other business matters, so this would be no difference. Due diligence can be expected of business people. -- David Kastrup ___ gnu-misc-discuss mailing list gnu-misc-discuss@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnu-misc-discuss
Re: Settlements
RJack u...@example.net writes: Hyman Rosen wrote: On 2/26/2010 12:05 PM, RJack wrote: Hyman Rosen wrote: The GPL requires that its provisions be honored as a condition of granting permission to copy and distribute a covered work. Back to denial already Hyman? Please identify the section of 17 USC 106 where causing someone to license a work conflicts with a specific exclusive right of an owner of copyrights. The GPL requires that as a condition to copy and distribute a covered work, you must license the whole work at no charge to all others. I have no idea what your question above even means; the English seems not quite right. It seems that everyone in the World except a few GNUtians understand that licensing (the act of contract formation) doesn't require the copying and distribution of source code. Contract formation requires the consent of two parties. Most software licensing schemes require an explicit act of the licensee to yield rights that copyright laws would grant him as the purchaser of the media. There is some debate about what forms of shrinkwrap licenses (by breaking this seal you agree to be bound to the following terms, return the media if you don't want to) or click-thru licenses (Click `I agree' to the following obnoxious license terms or return the software for a refund) are actually legally binding, but the whole point is that there is an attempt to have the licensee express explicit agreement to yield rights he otherwise would be granted. The GPL does not attempt to restrict your rights under copyright law. There is no act of contract formation. Making use of the GPL is a voluntary act and decision of the licensee, he can use the software for the normal purpose granted by copyright laws without heeding the GPL at all. But there is nothing other than the GPL that grants you a priori (i.e., without negotiation a different deal with the copyright holder) permission to copy and distribute source or binaries beyond what is allowed to you under copyright laws' definition of fair use. -- David Kastrup ___ gnu-misc-discuss mailing list gnu-misc-discuss@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnu-misc-discuss
Re: Settlements
David Kastrup wrote: [... There is no act of contract formation ...] Uh crackpot dak. In den Gesetzen zum Schutz des Geistigen Eigentums lassen sich insgesamt drei verschiedene Moeglichkeiten feststellen, wie eine Lizenz begruendet werden kann: erstens kraft staatlichen Hoheitsakts, zweitens kraft Gesetzes und drittens durch Vertrag. http://books.google.de/books?id=q2lkquXoZwEC (Lizenz und Lizenzvertrag im Recht des Geistigen Eigentums By Louis Pahlow) Allgemein versteht man unter Lizenz die Befugnis, das Immaterialgut eines anderen zu benutzen. Als Immaterialgueter kommen insbesondere Marken, Urheberrecht oder Patente Dritter in Betracht. Nachdem es nur sehr wenige gesetzliche Regelungen gibt, werden Lizenzen ueblicherweise in individuellen Vertraegen, den Lizenzvertraegen, geregelt. Auf Lizenzvertraege findet zunaechst wie auf alle Vertraege das allgemeine Vertragsrecht Anwendung. Daneben werden verschiedene Vorschriften des BGB analog angewandt. Insbesondere die Bereiche der Rechtspacht, des Mietrechts, des Kaufrechts und des Dienstvertragsrechts finden Anwendung. Soweit Lizenzen (wie haeufig) in Formularvertraegen geregelt werden, finden auch die Regelungen ber die Allgemeinen Geschaeftsbedingungen der 305 ff BGB Anwendung. http://www.boehmanwaltskanzlei.de/mehr-/vertragsrecht/details/lizenzvertragsrecht/355-der-lizenzvertrag.html Hth, silly dak. regards, alexander. P.S. I'm insufficiently motivated to go set up a GNU/Linux system so that I can do the builds. Hyman Rosen hyro...@mail.com The Silliest GPL 'Advocate' P.P.S. Of course correlation implies causation! Without this fundamental principle, no science would ever make any progress. Hyman Rosen hyro...@mail.com The Silliest GPL 'Advocate' -- http://gng.z505.com/index.htm (GNG is a derecursive recursive derecursion which pwns GNU since it can be infinitely looped as GNGNGNGNG...NGNGNG... and can be said backwards too, whereas GNU cannot.) ___ gnu-misc-discuss mailing list gnu-misc-discuss@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnu-misc-discuss
Re: Settlements
Alexander Terekhov terek...@web.de writes: David Kastrup wrote: [... There is no act of contract formation ...] Uh crackpot dak. In den Gesetzen zum Schutz des Geistigen Eigentums lassen sich insgesamt drei verschiedene Moeglichkeiten feststellen, wie eine Lizenz begruendet werden kann: erstens kraft staatlichen Hoheitsakts, zweitens kraft Gesetzes und drittens durch Vertrag. You are citing a private opinion again, not law. And actually, if you take a look at what the author writes later, you find that he does change this statement: http://books.google.de/books?id=q2lkquXoZwEC (Lizenz und Lizenzvertrag im Recht des Geistigen Eigentums By Louis Pahlow) Allgemein versteht man unter Lizenz die Befugnis, das Immaterialgut eines anderen zu benutzen. Als Immaterialgueter kommen insbesondere Marken, Urheberrecht oder Patente Dritter in Betracht. Nachdem es nur sehr wenige gesetzliche Regelungen gibt, werden Lizenzen ueblicherweise in individuellen Vertraegen, den Lizenzvertraegen, geregelt. See? He now reduces this to üblicherweise, commonly. And then talks about the consequences _if_ the license is given in the course of contract formation: Auf Lizenzvertraege findet zunaechst wie auf alle Vertraege das allgemeine Vertragsrecht Anwendung. Daneben werden verschiedene Vorschriften des BGB analog angewandt. Insbesondere die Bereiche der Rechtspacht, des Mietrechts, des Kaufrechts und des Dienstvertragsrechts finden Anwendung. Soweit Lizenzen (wie haeufig) in Formularvertraegen geregelt werden, finden auch die Regelungen ber die Allgemeinen Geschaeftsbedingungen der 305 ff BGB Anwendung. Again, he says: In case that (as often) a license is concocted as a form contract, the rules about AGB are applicable. The GPL is not a form contract since the recipient does not need to agree to it in the course of acquiring a software medium and using it in the normal manner permissable by copyright. That sale may very well be governed by the AGB of the vendor. The GPL concerns additional permissions that the recipient is free to execute _if_ he meets the conditions. http://www.boehmanwaltskanzlei.de/mehr-/vertragsrecht/details/lizenzvertragsrecht/355-der-lizenzvertrag.html Hth, silly dak. Does this Kanzlei know what personal interpretations of yourself you associate them with? -- David Kastrup ___ gnu-misc-discuss mailing list gnu-misc-discuss@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnu-misc-discuss
Re: Settlements
David Kastrup wrote: [...] http://books.google.de/books?id=q2lkquXoZwEC See? He now reduces this to üblicherweise, commonly. And then talks about the consequences _if_ the license is given in the course of contract formation: http://www.boehmanwaltskanzlei.de/mehr-/vertragsrecht/details/lizenzvertragsrecht/355-der-lizenzvertrag.html Does this Kanzlei know what personal interpretations of yourself you associate them with? Uh retard dak. Louis Pahlow http://books.google.de/books?id=q2lkquXoZwEC isn't working for http://www.boehmanwaltskanzlei.de -- can you grok that simple thing, retard dak? Are you sure that you are ready to talk about concepts such as - staatlichen Hoheitsakts - kraft Gesetzes - Vertrag - Allgemeinen Geschaeftsbedingungen you silly dak? Why don't you first make a basic research regarding that material before posting more nonsensical replies here? regards, alexander. P.S. I'm insufficiently motivated to go set up a GNU/Linux system so that I can do the builds. Hyman Rosen hyro...@mail.com The Silliest GPL 'Advocate' P.P.S. Of course correlation implies causation! Without this fundamental principle, no science would ever make any progress. Hyman Rosen hyro...@mail.com The Silliest GPL 'Advocate' -- http://gng.z505.com/index.htm (GNG is a derecursive recursive derecursion which pwns GNU since it can be infinitely looped as GNGNGNGNG...NGNGNG... and can be said backwards too, whereas GNU cannot.) ___ gnu-misc-discuss mailing list gnu-misc-discuss@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnu-misc-discuss
Anatomy of GPL Enforcement fraud
http://www.socallinuxexpo.org/scale8x/presentations/demystifying-gpl-enforcement-using-law-uphold-copyleft regards, alexander. P.S. I'm insufficiently motivated to go set up a GNU/Linux system so that I can do the builds. Hyman Rosen hyro...@mail.com The Silliest GPL 'Advocate' P.P.S. Of course correlation implies causation! Without this fundamental principle, no science would ever make any progress. Hyman Rosen hyro...@mail.com The Silliest GPL 'Advocate' -- http://gng.z505.com/index.htm (GNG is a derecursive recursive derecursion which pwns GNU since it can be infinitely looped as GNGNGNGNG...NGNGNG... and can be said backwards too, whereas GNU cannot.) ___ gnu-misc-discuss mailing list gnu-misc-discuss@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnu-misc-discuss
Re: Settlements
David Kastrup writes: My wife shredded all that stuff is not seen as a valid defense in other business matters, so this would be no difference. Due diligence can be expected of business people. The most that My wife shredded all that stuff would get you is innocent infringement http://itlaw.wikia.com/wiki/Innocent_infringement (but you will have to show that you stopped infringing the instant you were notified by the plaintiff). Damages may be reduced but probably not eliminated and an injunction will still issue. Since cessation of infringement is what the SFLC asks for this would be rather useless. -- John Hasler jhas...@newsguy.com Dancing Horse Hill Elmwood, WI USA ___ gnu-misc-discuss mailing list gnu-misc-discuss@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnu-misc-discuss
Re: Anatomy of GPL Enforcement fraud
Alexander Terekhov wrote: http://www.socallinuxexpo.org/scale8x/presentations/demystifying-gpl-enforcement-using-law-uphold-copyleft regards, alexander. P.S. I'm insufficiently motivated to go set up a GNU/Linux system so that I can do the builds. Hyman Rosen hyro...@mail.com The Silliest GPL 'Advocate' P.P.S. Of course correlation implies causation! Without this fundamental principle, no science would ever make any progress. Hyman Rosen hyro...@mail.com The Silliest GPL 'Advocate' Since Bradley Kuhn is not an attorney, I assume he uses a three foot two-by-four wooden stud to enforce the GPL. Probably a gift from Eben Moglen. Captain Moglen scared them out of the water! http://www.fini.tv/blog/finishing_line_files/a44f9390355368f87dc47b7ec094f93e-36.php ROFL. ROFL. ROFL. Sincerely, RJack :) ___ gnu-misc-discuss mailing list gnu-misc-discuss@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnu-misc-discuss
