Re: [Goanet] Salvation of caste blind atheists (Bhandare)
If there was any other way to attain salvation, God wouldn't have sent Jesus to die. truth Liberates Nigel Britto. On Dec 28, 2007 8:13 PM, Fr. Ivo C da Souza <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Dear Bhandare, > What you think Christianity is saying is not true. All of us need God's > mercy. Only God can save us, you and me. > Jesus came to save us. Christmas message is consoling us. > May God himself enlighten us all! > Yours > Fr.Ivo > > > > - Original Message - > From: "Bhandare" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: > Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2007 7:53 PM > Subject: [Goanet] Salvation of caste blind atheists (Bhandare) > > > > Dear Jose: > > > > Do you mean to say that the abominable practise of > > casteism is atenet of hinduism? > > > > btw though there is no concept of caste in > > christianity , isnt the belief that only christians > > will ascend to heaven while non believers will go to > > hell discriminatory in itself? then how come > > christianity isa religion of equality when it clearly > > differentiates between those who believe in it and > > condemns those who dont to eternal hellfire? > > > > regards > > > > B > > > > > > > > > > > Be a better friend, newshound, and > > know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. > > http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ > > > > > > > > > > -- > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.17.11/1200 - Release Date: > > 12/27/2007 1:34 PM > > > > > > -- Truth Liberates Peace and Love... Nigel
Re: [Goanet] Congratulations Goans we've finally done it!
To Goanet - >Dear Selma and Rajan, > >Please do not communalise a social issue like SEZ. It is bad enough >that it has been politicized. Miguel ol' boy, you need to lighten up. But I can understand if it is hard for you to do so at the moment. After all, you have the arduous task of standing sentinel to GMAS, scrutinizing its every move, word and deed. Such devotion and obsession! Wah! If only those in the GMAS would take a leaf out of your book (figuratively of course. Peaceful that we are, we don't to hurt leaves, do we?) Regards, r Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
[Goanet] One mystery clears, another appears
>From Google:
[Goanet] Digambar Kamat consolidates his vote bank
To Goanet - Very soon the Goan will become irrelevant. "Illegal hutments are mushrooming across Margao town, even as the authorities appear busy plunged in the ongoing festive celebrations or have turned a blind eye to the rising illegalities." http://oheraldo.in/pagedetails.asp?nid=6276&cid=26 Regards, r Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
Re: [Goanet] Year end News
On 28/12/2007, Dr. U. G. Barad <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > CM of Goa appointed MLA Reginald as Chairman of KTC and called Mathany, > Manohar and Shripad for discussion on SEZ Issue! This move indicates that CM > is either trying to buy time or is trying to purchase the opposition. But > one thing is sure CM is not standing right on his feet. News that makes > round these days is that Congress is ready to announce scrapping of SEZs in > Goa except the three notified SEZs. Is this proposal acceptable to Goans? > > Best regards, > > Dr. U. G. Barad REPLR: For goodness sake, scrap the lot and save face ! Diggu is now scraping the barrel. -- DEV BOREM KORUM. Gabe Menezes. London, England
[Goanet] Goa news for December 29, 2007
Goa News from Google News and Goanet.org Visit http://www.goanet.org/newslinks.php for the full stories. *** Develop as a knowledge hub, PM tells Goa - Hindu [Dec 27, 2007] Photo: PTI Prime Minister Manmohan Singh delivering his keynote address after launching the Goa Broadband Network Project at Porvorim in Goa on Thursday. ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=T&ct=us/1-0&fd=R&url=http://www.hindu.com/2007/12/28/stories/2007122858871200.htm&cid=1125410891&ei=CpV1R8qcNpKGrQP02tmyAQ *** Goa is safe, police tell tourists - Hindu [4 hours ago] PANAJI: In an exercise aimed at boosting the morale of tourists and the tourism industry ahead of the New Year bashes, the Goa police on Friday declared ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=T&ct=us/0-0&fd=R&url=http://www.hindu.com/2007/12/29/stories/2007122955151500.htm&cid=1125318537&ei=CpV1R8qcNpKGrQP02tmyAQ *** Goa logs on to hi-speed broadband - Chennai Online [12 hours ago] NEW DELHI, INDIA: Goa logged on to high-speed broadband when prime minister Manmohan Singh launched the Goa Broadband Network at Porvorim, Goa on Thursday. ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=T&ct=us/4-0&fd=R&url=http://www.chennaionline.com/technology/details.aspx?sectid=itnews&linkid=%2Fcontent%2F281207102496.aspx&cid=1125437705&ei=CpV1R8qcNpKGrQP02tmyAQ *** Armed police guard tourists as Goa faces protests over industry parks - Times Online [Dec 26, 2007] Thousands of armed police arebeing deployed to guard holidaymakersin the Indian state of Goa after a group campaigning against industrial parks warned all ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=T&ct=us/3-0&fd=R&url=http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/asia/article3098046.ece&cid=1125395010&ei=CpV1R8qcNpKGrQP02tmyAQ *** Congress allies to press PM for shift of Goa naval base - Economic Times [Dec 27, 2007] PANAJI: Allies of the ruling Congress in Goa will seek Prime Minister Manmohan Singh's intervention in shifting the Indian Navy's base from the state during ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=T&ct=us/2-0&fd=R&url=http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/PoliticsNation/PM_urged_to_shift_Goa_naval_base/articleshow/2656684.cms&cid=1125470235&ei=CpV1R8qcNpKGrQP02tmyAQ *** Goa University to honour Lata - Sahara Samay [Dec 27, 2007] Panaji, Dec 27: The nightingale of Bollywood, Lata Mangeshkar, will be conferred with honorary degree of D. Lit by the Goa University tomorrow in ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=T&ct=us/8-0&fd=R&url=http://www.saharasamay.com/samayhtml/articles.aspx?newsid=91734&cid=1125484077&ei=CpV1R8qcNpKGrQP02tmyAQ *** Enough potable water supply to N Goa in 2 months: Churchill - Navhind Times [21 hours ago] Panaji, Dec 27 The Minister for Public Works Department, Mr Churchill Alemao today said that enough potable water would be provided to entire North Goa from ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=T&ct=us/5-0&fd=R&url=http://www.navhindtimes.com/articles.php?Story_ID=12286&cid=1125454060&ei=CpV1R8qcNpKGrQP02tmyAQ *** Goa\'s complete online news edition - Friday, December 28, 2007 - Herald Publications [20 hours ago] Prime Minister Dr Manmohan Singh being received by Governor SC Jamir on his arrival at the Naval Enclave in Dabolim on Thursday. ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=T&ct=us/6-0&fd=R&url=http://oheraldo.in/pagedetails.asp?nid=6251&cid=1&cid=0&ei=CpV1R8qcNpKGrQP02tmyAQ *** PM S ADDRESS AT THE LAUNCH OF GOA BROADBAND NETWORK - Press Information Bureau (press release) [Dec 27, 2007] "I extremely happy to be associated with the launch of the 1 st Phase of the Goa Broadband Network. This pioneering project is an important milestone in the ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=T&ct=us/9-0&fd=R&url=http://pib.nic.in/release/release.asp?relid=34244&cid=0&ei=CpV1R8qcNpKGrQP02tmyAQ *** Goa to get monorail; new bridge across Zuari - Navhind Times [21 hours ago] Panaji, Dec 27 The government is reconsidering the introduction of a monorail in the state and expanding the existing Cortalim-Margao highway to four lanes ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=T&ct=us/7-0&fd=R&url=http://www.navhindtimes.com/articles.php?Story_ID=12281&cid=0&ei=CpV1R8qcNpKGrQP02tmyAQ Compiled by Goanet News Service http://www.goanet.org/newslinks.php
Re: [Goanet] Give peace a chance (Miguel)
Miguel Braganza wrote: [1] Rajan Parrikar wrote, "I do not advocate the use of violent means in the fight against SEZs. And as I understand it, neither does Matanhy Saldanha, notwithstanding the malicious propaganda unleashed here by the likes of Miguel Braganza. [2] A leading English newspaper in Goa filed this report, "To see that there was no law and order problem, particularly in view of the alleged threat, the state government has requisitioned three companies of central para-military forces." [3] Another Goan wrote on the Internet, "Matanhy's call for tourists to leave Goa before New Year 2008 shows his immaturity in knowing the ground reality of how much a tourist goes through to holiday in Goa." [4] Wrote Deelip Menezes on the internet groups, "If the GBA could achieve so much with any violence, I fail to see why the GMAS cannot do the same." Truth [Satya] and non-violence [ahimsa] are the two "weapons" given to the world by Mahatma Gandhi. Dear Miguel, re [1] Once again, I totally agree with Rajan Parrikar's expressed disgust wrt what is happening to Goa today. However, I have my own reservations as to why he would accuse you of unleashing 'malicious propaganda' against Matanhy. I hope we have taken stock of what a mess develops when chaos is allowed to develop albeit for political purposes. We Goans MUST NOT allow anarchists to destroy our peaceful existence. We do not need another Benazir tragedy. I am personally convinced that at least Manohar Parrikar, Rajan Parrikar, Matanhy Saldanha and Aires Rodrigues were acting in a manner which could easily have led to anarchy in Goa. This behaviour was quite coincidental (in time) to the election results in Goa. And that is troubling. It demonstrates - to me at least - that some individuals are willing to go to any lengths to regains political power. I keep reminding myself that it was M. Parrikar who was in bed with Monserrate and Churchill and it was M. Parrikar who brought IFFI to Goa. [2] What exactly does the State do when individuals threaten to create anarchy and violate the laws of the land? I noted M. Parrikar's threat as to what would happen IF Matanhy was arrested. What is the deal? Does Matanhy have immunity from arrest IF he breaks the law? [3] I doubt that Matanhy's statement demonstrates immaturity. I believe that it was a deliberate attempt to destabilise a duly elected Government. [4] Absolutely! Addendum: IF any individual believes that the State is acting inappropriately - are there NO judicial mechanisms (like PIL and Judicial Review) available? In closing, it is my hope that we Goans will learn at least from the Benazir tragedy and work constructively towards settling our differences peacefully. Violence and Confrontation is NEVER the answer. I also hope that Mr. Digambar Kamat also does the needful re-think and does so immediately. jc
Re: [Goanet] Jesus Christ and caste system
--- Antonio Menezes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > According to the Aquarian Gospel, Jesus' formative > years were spent in > India ( Jagannath in Orissa, Benares, ets ) Tibet, > Persia, Assirya, > Greece and Egypt. RESPONSE: There is absolutely no historical evidence to support the hypothesis that Jesus spent his early life in India. This hypothesis has been put forward by enthusiastic writers, but Jesus has also been spotted in Greece, Egypt and even America by other equally enthusiastic writers and sects of Christianity. > Antonio Menezes wrote: > However, Jesus Christ's disapproval of of casteist > classification of > human beings could be of some interest to '' bamon > '' lordships and > reverends in Goa and elsewhere > > Antonio RESPONSE: The Jews had their own system of discriminatory classification of society. Whatever family Jesus might have been born into, it became important for (supposed) chroniclers of his life to insist he was born into the House of David. This proved his royal lineage and fulfilled the prophecy. Early Christianity was very discriminatory and had no intention of including "non-circumcised gentiles" into this religion. It was St Paul who won this argument and thus began the spread of Christianity to non-Jews. The spread of early Christianity was westwards into feudal Europe, a system parallel to casteism in India, including the bondage of humans to the land, the barriers in inter-marriage and the stratification of labour. Collectively Christianity did little to alleviate the inhumane status of serfs, vassals and other bonded labour, perhaps even colluding in maintaining this system that supported their endless wars in the Holy Land. Christianity at various times have been complicit in regimes that support discrimination of human beings including a soft-approach to casteism in Goa, Apartheid in South Africa and slavery in the US. It is not organised religion or the collective thought of religion that advances humanity. It is always seminal thinkers born into these religions that advance the cause of humanity and then we move forward as a society. Great thinkers have been born into Christianity, as have great thinkers been born into Islam and Hinduism, who have advanced science, mathematics, rationality and humanism. As Bertrand Russel once said, "religions mature like a fine wine", seeing that Bertrand was an agnostic, I interpret this to mean humanity matures like a fine-wine, and then religion follows suite. selma Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
[Goanet] Castes, Christianity, Hinduism et al
J Colaco asked Bandare, BTW: if you know of any other religion which forbids individuals entry into certain temples by virtue of their 'low caste' membership - please advise. This is precisely what Jesus was fighting or arguing with the Rabbis. It was not Caste system but the lame, blind and the sick who were not allowed to enter the holy temple. This is the injustice Jesus was against. ED. - Sent from Yahoo! - a smarter inbox.
Re: [Goanet] Jesus Christ and caste system
On 28/12/2007, Antonio Menezes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > According to the Aquarian Gospel, Jesus' formative years were spent in > India ( Jagannath in Orissa, Benares, ets ) Tibet, Persia, Assirya, > Greece and Egypt. > > No Indian sacred literarure ever mentions the name of Jesus. It is > possible , since He was of the alien caste i.e. below the brahmin, > kshatriya, vysys, sudra, outcaste, untouchable and outlaw ( > illegitimate children) castes, He could not have merited a mention > in the dharmic sacred books. > > However, Jesus Christ's disapproval of of casteist classification of > human beings could be of some interest to '' bamon '' lordships and > reverends in Goa and elsewhere > > Antonio RESPONSE: If your perception of what really happened is true, then it would follow that 'God' had no effect whatsoever on the Hindus i.e. India; much later had no effect on the Catholic Goans ! -- DEV BOREM KORUM. Gabe Menezes. London, England
Re: [Goanet] Castes, Christianity, Hinduism et al (Bhandare)
JC obviously believes that attack is the best form of defence :-) {as
do the others in the equal but opposite
my-religion-is-better-than-yours camp}. FN
On 27/12/2007, J. Colaco < jc> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 1: Yes, I am convinced that the Caste Discrimination is a tent of
> what is being practised as Hinduism. I will hasten to add that Goan
> 'Catholics' who practise the caste system could not be Christians.
> BTW: if you know of any other religion which forbids individuals entry
> into certain temples by virtue of their 'low caste' membership -
> please advise.
--
Frederick Noronha http://fn.goa-india.org Ph +91-832-2409490
Links from Goa: http://goalinks.livejournal.com/
Re: [Goanet] Religious Salvation and its history
--- Victor Rangel-Ribeiro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I disagree when you go on to say > that > "christianity" condemns those who don't believe in > it > to eternal hellfire. That is what I heard preached > when I was a young man; but the Catholic Church has > changed since then, and no longer holds to this > view. >Please take this into account when next you post. >Regards, >Victor - Dear Victor, We must stop wasting our time on Bhandari here. He knows two cents worth of something and presumes to know a whole lot. Inorder to understand anything about Christianity and the Abrahamic monotheistic religions, one must be acquainted with the history of Europe and the Middle East. To the West of Jerusalem were the Francs and the Goths who were convinced by Popes ranging from Urbane to Innocent, to slaughter the pagans. To the East of Jerusalem were the Abbasids, the Assassins, the Seljuk Turks, the Persians and later the Mongols who were just as determined to kill off the infidels. Sandwiched in between and the target of every drunken, killing spree and debauchery were the Jews. The three religions were not just religions, they were political forces that dominated Europe and the Middle East. In this atmosphere it became imperative that entire countries were converted one way or another, every informant, assassin, tax payer, foot-soldier and general mattered in the war. And what was inevitably promised in return for services ranging from information, treachery, spying, diplomatic missions to assassinations, was "eternal salvation" for such acts. Christianity has come a long way from that standpoint and yes, while the doctrine of the Catholic Church is still anchored on the notion of eternal salvation, in real terms we confine this to mean leading our own personal lives so as to attain personal salvation. Bhandari should seriously take up reading history instead of attending fire and brimstone Church services of the Deep South. Selma Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
Re: [Goanet] Goa Chief Minister seeks meeting with GMAS Leaders
On 28/12/2007, Rajan P. Parrikar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > To Goanet - > > Bowing to the severe pressure brought to bear on his > government by GMAS's struggle against SEZs, Goa's Chief > Minister Digambar Kamat has requested a meeting with > GMAS to resolve the SEZ issue. Tomorrow, Dec 29, 2007 > the Chief Minister is scheduled to meet a delegation > composed of the GMAS Convener Matanhy Saldanha, > and the BJP leaders Manohar Parrikar and Shripad Naik. > BJP is one of the constituents of GMAS. > > GMAS has said that its future course of action will be > decided based on the outcome of this meeting. Stay > tuned. > > Regards, RESPONSE: I am rather sceptical of these meetings - it is a matter of who will blink first and who is offered what - this happens time and again...let us hope that this time the Goans will not be sold down the river Mandovi. -- DEV BOREM KORUM. Gabe Menezes. London, England
Re: [Goanet] [Goanet-News] Goanet Reader: Lost identity, roots and a fortnight in Goa
To Martin Van Camp - Duarte and Goa-net! Dear all It was wonderful for me to read the above impression of one goan´s origin! And very surprised with the contender of the massage. I'm also goan natural, residing at Goa, Portugal and Mozambique and getting our family all around the world. I feel very very emotionality by your interesting history and the words that you wrote on your mother "My mother was a born storyteller". It was the important link that bring it you for us. Thanks for your mother and for you because you went more and more far in your investigation. Now I'm at Mozambique, at January I would like to be at Goa and after at Portugal. Our family is sprained over the world- (England, France, Germany, Canada, EUA, Philipinas, Brasil, Angola. My congratulation for Goa-net who is promoting this important link. Boas-Festas e valorisemos tudo o que possuimos através da naturalidade, e pelas variadas origens e pelos posteriores ligações, transformando o mundo num único espaço onde haja sempre Paz e Amor! ( peço, mil desculpas pelos meus erros) *Feliz ano 2008!* ** *Silvia Bragança* 2007/12/27, Goanet Reader <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > Lost identity, roots and a fortnight in Goa > > Martin Van Camp - Duarte > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Goa. Even now, ever since independence the hippies and > tourists seemed to claim the word and the higher middle class > of India gradually finds its way to the paradise, I still > cherish this three letter word as in my childhood. > > My mother was a born storyteller. As a small girl > she herself -- after school -- went to the park in > Rangoon and made up all kinds of stories for the > boys and girls from the neighborhood. Many gathered > and they all sat in a circle round my mother and > gaped at her, not a word to say for themselves. > > At home me and my two sisters had our own little park as we > sat on my parents -- bed, totally absorbed by her stories. > And in between these fairy tales and concocted funny, crazy > stories she felt the need to slowly talk about her family. > > You see, as a young boy born and raised in Belgium, I had a > feeling of being just like everybody else. How could I know > that my hair, the blackest of black, was rare in Belgium and > that my slightly brown colored skin was not the same as the > sunburned brown of most Belgians? When Father James de Souza, > the Goan priest who married my parents in Karachi, visited us > in the seventies, it didn't occur to me that he was > different. And he was really dark like some Goans can be but > that was no issue for us except his age and the fact that he > was a priest, unlike us lay-people ever to be wedded. > > So mama started telling us some facts about her family. A > family completely diverse (in all ways) than my father's > one and so far away as if they were never ever there. > > The only sign of life and true existence was the arrival of > those blue aerogrammes. I used to love it as a child when all > those aerogrammes were brought by the postmen and all of us > at home were very anxious whom these letters would be from. > > Is it from Pakistan, Australia, India, Canada or > the United States? Mostly these letters and some of > the aerogrammes had beautiful stamps which me and > my sisters started to collect. Sometimes, as I > think back on those days I miss it that we didn't > have my mother's family members living nearby whom > we could see daily and with whom we could chat all > day long. It for sure would be a lot easier to > understand my mother's kind of exodus. And nowadays > these aerogrammes left in our family archives are > the symbol of migration. They stand for the rise > and fall of the Karachi Goan civilization. > > I grew up as a Belgian in a rather western way and only > embraced my complete background when I was in my twenties. > > Racism and intolerance have been rising in the west. Not > everyone was keen on meeting "the others" and having to live > with them. And gradually in many Western countries rightwing > parties saw the daylight. And then I noticed that I was (in > their opinion) from the wrong breed. If it was up to them my > 25% Jewish roots (my grandma) would mean deportation as in WWII! > > In 1995, when I had the possibility to take four months leave > at work, I decided to leave everything behind and go to > Karachi. Suffering from a terrible culture shock after my > visit to Zimbabwe, Zambia and Malawi, I thought it sure > wouldn't be any worse to stay among friends and relatives > in Karachi, Pakistan. > > I would do some voluntary work in the Manghopir Development > Project (part of the Mary Adelaide Leprosy Centre) of Sister > Jeannine. She is a Belgian nurse who came to Karachi in the > late 1950's to help root out leprosy and soon became a friend > of my parents. Being there I definitely cou
[Goanet] Castes, Christianity, Hinduism et al (Bhandare)
Dear Dr Colaco: I think you are merely rehashing the "true scottsman fallacy"...what you are trying to do is claim that if any christian ( right wing or otherwise) does something wrong you merely say that he/she is not a "true" christian...but if a hindu practises casteism you call that a tenet of hinduism.. so while slavery racism and the slaughter of indigenous populations of latin america and the persecution of jews as well as the horrible inquisition are acts of christians who werent "true" christians you somehow choose not to apply the same standards to those hindus who practised casteism... here are some points that might make you reflect a bit more..also your comments about them are most welcome too.. 1. the caste of today is not the same as the varna system of ancient India...i am sure you will not agree with this ...further can you quote any scripture which requires a hindu to practise casteism? havent saints like dyaneshwar basavanna tukaram namdeo and many others who rebelled against the caste system and started other traditions like the bhakti traditions given a respectful place in the hinduism? unlike galileo who was put to death, the dyaneshwari is a respected scripture for all hindus including brahmins... 2. I am guessing that you have not read the manusmriti in its entirety..what you have probably read are the english translation of some of its verses which are vile and derogatory. I submit to you that there more vile verses in both the new and old testament. furthermore manusmriti was given undue importance by the british historians who merely wanted an equivalent of the christian bible for hindusim..the fact is no hindu reveres the manusmriti as a christian would revere the bible... 3. if the hindu caste system is indeed as bad as it is made out to be and i agree it is bad why have millions of the oppressed classes chosen to stay within the fold of sanatan dharma? even ambedkars famous conversion was limited to his own caste brethren..the mahars of maharashtra...even today after almost 500 years of supposedly casteless islamic rule followed by 150 years of british rule ( where missionaries without fear of the sangh parivar spread so much education nad empowered the dalits as the apologists for the colonialists would like to repeat ad nauseaum) why did an overwhelming majority of hindus remain hindus inspite of the horrible caste system? paradoxically in modern day afghanistan and pakistan wherever buddhism spread , the buddhists were converted en masse to islam..remember the bamiyan buddhas which the taliban demolished? the modern day kandahar and taxila were ovewhelmingly buddhist populated areas and inspite of buddhism being an egalitarian religion unlike hinduism allmost all budhists became muslims while in the hindu dominated north india which is probably todays UP bihar and all islam as well as christianity suffred its worst defeat...doesnt that strike you as odd? whats ur take on this? finally i wouldnt put clinton guru nanak francis xavier and the dalai lama in the same bracket...but that discussion is for another day. once again i await ur comments... regards B Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
Re: [Goanet] Hindu extremists burn down village churches
Hi Gabe It is truly tragic and unacceptable when religious tensions periodically end up in death and destruction. However, please do not confuse yourself over the judgements you make in your post. No anti-racist and anti-casteist will support an attack on any place of worship anywhere. Indeed, I am on record as saying this on Goanet and happy to reiterate this point now. The anti-racists and anti-casteists are more rational than you might imagine and are against all fundamentalism and definitely not apologists for any. As to your views about caveats to the above, it is incumbent upon you to provide the evidence if you are serious about any "litmus test". Naturally, I await this! Also, there is no podium---just a humble keyboard. Regards Cornel Gabe Menezes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Please read the following, for which our Anti Casteists/anti racists, apologists for the extreme Hindu right fundamentalists, will surely state, that the Christians are responsible for bringing this upon themselves. Our selectively minded friends, will inform from the high podium, that they are against all forms of racism, its variants and so on and so forth and yet with caveats thrown in for good measure ! What load of balderdash, which, upon inspection, sorely fails the litmus test.
Re: [Goanet] Congratulations Goans we've finally done it!
Dear Selma and Rajan, Please do not communalise a social issue like SEZ. It is bad enough that it has been politicized. Though I must accept that there are persons who believe that "after age 18 years, everything is political" in India, I do not agree with this view. Fr. Bismark or Fr. Lino Florindo represent themselves [NOT the Catholic church in Goa Archdiocese] in the GMAS, just as Bro. Orville, Fr. Simon and others represent themselves in SVM. Fr. Maverick Fernandes is a different issue ...because he is the Executive Secretary of the Council for Social Justice & Peace. For details of why and how it is different, contact the office of CSJP or the Archbishop's office at Panaji. It is not as if catholics, hindus and muslims [in case you have forgotten Curchorem, there are Muslims in Goa] drink water from different sources and breathe seggregated air. Those of us who live in Goa are Goans first, religions come later and are often as ambiguous as our political colours. If you have not noticed, Floriano Lobo is in the same outfit and stage as Manohar Parrikar, Christopher Fonseca and Matanhy Saldanha. Some Congressmen may also be with them from behind the curtains! Parde ke peechay kya hai? Kisko pata! SEZ has brought together politicans ...left, right and centre! ;-) Mog asundi. Miguel P.S. South Goa is NOT as "Catholic dominated" as one may like to think after shopping in Margao or on the beachfront. Those days are long past ...and 26.5% population spreads rather thinly in the balance 73.5 % non-Catholic population in Goa. The Julian Calendar may be Roman [even in Devanagri], but it is not Roman catholic. Neither is the New Year celebration. Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 02:56:54 -0800 (PST) From: "Rajan P. Parrikar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [Goanet] Congratulations Goans we've finally done it! Selma wrote: >One has to wonder if such a move was not >pre-meditated and designed to handicap the Goan >Catholic community in the South. This vote-bank is >most dependent on the revenue of tourists as well as >being a Congress vote-bank. Wonder no more. The BJP used its highly secret weapon - Wonder Drug X - to turn the Catholics within GMAS (more than 50%) into unthinking zombies. Men like Floriano Lobo, Father Bismarque etc are now, unbeknownst to them, Trojan Horses The Hindus, on the other hand, were quietly segregated and offered harmless Nescafe and Marie biscuits. Regards, r -- -.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-. Miguel Braganza, S1 Gracinda Apts, Rajvaddo, Mhapsa 403507 Goa Ph 9822982676 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.
[Goanet] Salvation of caste blind atheists
JC said: "The practise of Caste as well as other forms of discrimination is contrary to the central teachings of Christ. jc" THERE WAS AND IS NO CASTE SYSTEM IN JERUSALEM. There were no askanajees and sapharias either. Samarians were not of low caste, they were immigrants from a poorer part of jerusalem. There will always be rich and the poor. (American no matter how poor, are still richer than a lot of Mexican). ED - Sent from Yahoo! - a smarter inbox.
[Goanet] GOACAN and Vasco Consumer Forum protests injustice to BBA students of Goa University
-- Do GOACAN a favour, circulate this email to your family members, relatives, neighbours and friends. Help others be BETTER INFORMED -- -- GOACAN and Vasco Consumer Forum protests injustice to BBA students, demands urgent action from Goa University and Govt. of Goa. --- On the occasion of the 20th Annual Convocation of Goa University being held today, volunteers of GOACAN and the Vasco Civic and Consumer Forum (VCCF) held a protest action in Panjim City to highlight the specific problem of non-refund of fees faced by the affected BBA students of the disaffiliated College of Arts & Management Sciences (CAMAS), Aquem, Margao and to demand immediate action from the Govt. of Goa against unscrupulous elements in the field of Higher Education preying on innocent students in the State. It maybe recalled that College of Arts & Management Sciences (CAMAS), Aquem, Margao managed by the Karpe Education Trust discontinued its BBA course early this year after the Goa University withdrew its affiliation. In April a decision was taken at a meeting of the Principals of the BBA Colleges held under the Chairmanship of the Registrar of Goa University that the College of Arts & Management Sciences (CAMAS) refunds 100% of the fees charged to the students and that the affected students would be relocated to other colleges and this decision was approved by the Standing Committee of the Academic Council of the University in its meeting held on 10th May 2007. However till date the students have not yet received their money and more over the College continues to advertise that it is recognized by the Directorate of Higher Education, Govt.of Goa. In a memorandum signed by Higino Rebelo, Convenor of the Vasco Civic and Consumer Forum(VCCF) addressed to Dr. M.M. Sangodkar, the Registrar of Goa University (GU), the Forum has demanded that Goa University takes immediate steps to arrange for the refund of 100% course fee of the amount of Rs. 25,470 /- to each of the affected students. The Forum has also demanded that the GU immediately registers a complaint with the Goa Police so as to stop the misuse / abuse of the name of Goa University by the Karpe Education Trust, Aquem, Margao and the College of Arts & Management Sciences, Aquem, Margao in the form of printing and circulating prospectus, draft prospectus, brochures advertisements, billboards stating affiliation / recognition by the Goa University to its BBA / MBA / PGDMB courses. Other demands raised by the Consumer Forum included the immediate issuance of a communication to all Higher Secondary Schools and Colleges operating in the state of Goa that the College of Arts & Management Sciences, Aquem, Margao has no permission to operate BBA / MBA / PGDBM courses as well as notices be issued to the public in the form of Advertisements and Press Releases to all the print and visual media operating in Goa informing them that the College managed by the Karpe Education Trust has been disaffiliated by the Goa University and therefore has no permission to conduct BBA / MBA / PGDMB courses. Copies of the VCCF memorandum have been marked to The Governor of Goa, The Minister for Higher Education, The Secretary, (Education), Govt. of Goa, The Director General of Police, and the Chairperson of the University Grants Commission (UGC). GOACAN in a memorandum to Mr. Bhaskar Nayak, Director, Directorate of Higher Education, has demanded a White Paper on unregistered / unrecognized educational institutions / tutorials / services/ etc. operating in the state of Goa in the field of Higher Education and offering Regular/ Correspondence Undergraduate, Post-Graduate/ Diploma Courses and an appointment of a Nodal Officer in the Department of Higher Education to handle all complaints / grievances in all such matters. GOACAN has demanded that the Directorate of Higher Education initiates a process by which the Govt. of Goa drafts a legislation to regulate the management and operation of Educational Institutions in Goa so that students are protected from being cheated of their money & education, and that a system be put in place to crack down on unscrupulous elements preying on innocent students and penalties be imposed to book the unscrupulous criminal elements involved in such acts. GOACAN and VCCF have demanded action on its demands latest by Thursday 3rd January, the reopening of the Educational Institutions in Goa after the Christmas vacation failing which they would consider filing criminal complaints against the public servants for abetment to fraud and conspiracy to cheat. The activists will also consider cases under the Consumer Protection Act 1986 for deficiency of service, causing men
[Goanet] Goanet Reader: Remembering Burma ... another day, another song (Yvonne Vaz Ezdani)
REMEMBERING BURMA: ANOTHER DAY, ANOTHER SONG By Yvonne Vaz Ezdani [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- This is an extract from the book 'Songs Of The Survivors'. Penned by its editor Yvonne Vaz Ezdani, it is an epilogue to the 289-page text, being released by Goa Commissioner for NRI Affairs Eduardo Faleiro at the Xavier Centre for Historical Research in Alto Porvorim on Dec 29, 2007 at 4:30 pm. It will be followed by a discussion 'Visioning Migration'. Details below. --- There is music in my soul when I look back to the girl who lived and dreamed and grew to womanhood in the enchantingly beautiful Shan State of eastern Burma. The deep fragrant pine forests, the wild flowers that grew in abundance, the silence and the sounds of nature were so much a part of my existence. I was nurtured by the natural beauty of the land and by the warmth and kindness of the people, the Shans, the Burmese, the Indians, and the Chinese, who were my friends, teachers and neighbours. My circle of friends included the children of our cooks, drivers, gardeners, and others who lived in the servants quarters in our compound .My friends were also the children of ministers, government officials, doctors, army officers who were golf-mates and friends of my father. Their companionship provided all the joys of friendship that every child needs. The love and fun times I shared with my parents, my three brothers and numerous cousins from both sides of the family, form a very large part of my happy childhood. St. Agnes' Convent High School where my brothers and I studied was an elite school run by Italian missionary nuns in the beautiful hill station of Kalaw, in the Southern Shan State and the boarding section housed children from different parts of Burma. Later my brothers also attended the D'la Salle Christian Brothers' Boarding School s in other parts of Burma. School and learning was fun and devoid of any pressure to perform. Yet we received a very good all-round education. We read a lot, discussed books, played games, played pranks and laughed a lot. I cannot remember anyone being depressed or any neurotic behaviour among my schoolmates. Neither can I recall anyone being judgemental or mean. People who have heard the account of how our family was brutally attacked, by a group of dacoits, would wonder how I can wax eloquent about people I knew in Burma. I was eight at that time and it happened in Kutkai, a north eastern town close to Lashio and the China border. My father, who was a government employee and S.D.O (Sub Divisional Officer) in the PWD (Public Works Department), was away on tour inspecting the Burma-China road and my mother was alone with us four children. It was dark and stormy that night when five masked men forced open the side door and entered our house with the intention of getting money and valuables. They began hacking us with knives when I recognized one of the men who used to do odd jobs for us. My mother was badly injured, I lost my left arm and my right hand too was injured. My eldest brother Patrick (13 years old) got a deep cut on his head which went through his skull and my younger brother Lloyd lost three fingers of his left hand. Only one year old Gordon miraculously escaped without a scratch. Because of the noise of the heavy downpour of rain that night, our servants living in the quarters behind were not aware of what was happening. As I mentioned earlier, many people would think that people in this area of Burma (the Northern Shan State) were savages. But this was the exception, not the rule. When men are addicted to gambling, alcohol and opium and when their minds are influenced by militant insurgent organizations, they cannot be judged by normal standards. We were unfortunate to have been their victims when they needed money desperately. But fortunately we survived against all odds, overcame our disabilities, did well in higher studies and we are now living happy fulfilled lives. The happy memories of my childhood outweigh even this terrible trauma in my life and the outpouring of kindness and help we received from all the good people more than compensates for the evil that entered the hearts of five misguided men. My late father too went through immense mental suffering. Having to stand and watch us suffer and caring for us while we went in and out of hospitals must have caused him deep anguish. Soon after this incident, my father was transferred to Kalaw. The serene beauty and the peace and tranquility prevalent in this lovely hill station restored our bodies, minds and souls. We lived there happily for many years. I grew up there, fell in love, married and had two daughters. THE GOAN CONNECTION: To me 'home' was Burma. Although I knew I was Goan, I never felt like an alien while growing up in the Shan State. My father
Re: [Goanet] [Goanet-News] Goanet Reader: Lost identity, roots and a fortnight in Goa
> Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 15:25:27 +0530> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: > goanet@lists.goanet.org; [EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [Goanet-News] Goanet > Reader: Lost identity, roots and a fortnight in Goa Martin Van Camp - Duarte > [EMAIL PROTECTED] < tourists seemed to claim the word and the higher middle class of India > gradually finds its way to the paradise, I still cherish this three letter > word as in my childhood. >> That was an excellent article, Martin, on the extensive search of your roots. I remember communicating with you a long time back on some aspects of my limited knowledge of the Duartes and ILACO (Indian Life Assurance Co.). Congratulations on finding fruition and bringing the old chapter to a close. Pat de Sousa Maryland, USA http://www.catholic-goan-network.net _ Share life as it happens with the new Windows Live. http://www.windowslive.com/share.html?ocid=TXT_TAGHM_Wave2_sharelife_122007
[Goanet] Seminar: Goan Diaspora - between the Home and the Host
Text by William Gracias, New Delhi Seminar on Goan Diaspora by Goenkarancho Ekvot (New Delhi) On the 15th of December, 2007, Goenkarancho Ekvot (New Delhi) organised a seminar titled "Goan Diaspora - between the Home and the Host" at the India International Centre, Delhi. With a host of invited individuals and speakers with connections in Goa, with Goa, this seminar was an effort to provide a forum to recognise and address issues faced by Goans settled outside India and provide a common platform for Goans outside Goa, and those within India to integrate and share. At the outset, Mr. Eduardo Faleiro (Commissioner for NRI Affairs) reiterated the fact that the word "diaspora" includes Goans who are not within the national boundaries of India, but outside. The Goan diaspora was represented by Ms Beverly Bhangi (Scholar, Jawaharlal Nehru University) from Bahrain, and Mr Constantino Xavier (Scholar, Jawaharlal Nehru University) from Portugal. The seminar was organised in two parts, the first discussion was titled "Place of the Goan Diaspora in making of Contemporary Goa". During this session, eminent speakers who voiced their opinions were Mr. Julio Ribeiro (Ex-Police Chief of Punjab), Mr. D. H. Panandiker (Economist) and Mr. Pramod Kale (Artist). The session was chaired by Mr. Edgar Rebeiro (Architect). Mr. Ribeiro spoke of his experience in policing and his childhood experiences about Goa. It was interesting to note his mention of the "kuds" which were Goan houses in Mumbai meant for Goans in transit (who today constitute the Goan diaspora); people who used these kuds to stay were people travelling abroad and people coming back to Goa from foreign lands. They were meant to be like a "home away from home" to make the transition easier for Goans from a familiar environment to a foreign place. Mr Ribeiro also noted that the Rosary was recited daily as part of the morning at the kuds. This system today no longer exists. A pseudo kud that exists could be the Goa Sadan that is meant for government employees only. There is a need to revive this age-old system, if possible, to help so many Goans who till today go abroad for employment, or join a cruise company, or have to travel to other parts of India. Mr. Panandiker's presentation was an eye-opening one. He pointed out that today, Goa's per capita income is around 66,400 per annum, the highest in India, around 2.5 times higher than the Indian average. He went on to reveal that the major drivers of the state’s income were Agriculture (~ 8%), Tourism (~11%), Mining (~31%) and Manufacturing & Commercial Services (50%). These figures were an eye-opener to me as they squashed the previous notions that Goa's economy was mainly driven by Tourism. Goa is also well in line with the national average of growth in manufacturing and services (~51%). And till today, we think that Tourism is the whole and soul of Goa, while tourism ruins and spoils our beautiful state with increased pollution and exploitation of resources. Due to inadequate planning and inability to uniformly enforce regulations, Goa till today is not well equipped to handle the tourism it attracts which does not augur well for Goan economy, when Goa has to live up to the title of one of the top tourist destinations world-wide! Mr. Panandiker also revealed that from the approximately 24 billion dollars that come into India as remittances from NRIs, Goa gets around 100 million dollars from the Goan diaspora. This itself constitutes 4% of Goa's State Domestic Product. And unfortunately this money is not well-spent within Goan markets. Only around 25% of it is spent within Goa on Goa; leading to huge losses for Goan markets. Today, Goa's growth attributed to these remittances may be around 2% only. These figures are definitely food for thought. Mr. Pramod Kale touched upon the cultural and attitudinal issues plaguing Goa today. He explained how the lower middle class in Goa (constituting a huge bulk of Goa’s population) is neglected when planning development and policy. An example he narrated from his experiences in Goa was whilst travelling in a local bus - the bus conductors earn a meagre living and because of very little regulation and policy in their line of job, they live lives of insecurity and hardships. This group of people (bus conductors, taxi drivers, auto drivers, pilot drivers, etc.) is also the face of Goa to travelers as they are some of the few Goans a tourist will first interact with. The attitude they display goes a long way into building (or breaking) the brand of Goa. In the open discussion that followed, the audience was allowed to ask the speakers questions during which Mr. Eduardo Faleiro assured the support of his department towards any study/work taken up with respect to the "kuds" in Mumbai. The second discussion was post-lunch. Titled "Goan Diaspora and the Host Community", it delved further int
[Goanet] Year end News
CM of Goa appointed MLA Reginald as Chairman of KTC and called Mathany, Manohar and Shripad for discussion on SEZ Issue! This move indicates that CM is either trying to buy time or is trying to purchase the opposition. But one thing is sure CM is not standing right on his feet. News that makes round these days is that Congress is ready to announce scrapping of SEZs in Goa except the three notified SEZs. Is this proposal acceptable to Goans? Best regards, Dr. U. G. Barad
Re: [Goanet] Salvation of caste blind atheists (Bhandare)
Dear Bhandare, What you think Christianity is saying is not true. All of us need God's mercy. Only God can save us, you and me. Jesus came to save us. Christmas message is consoling us. May God himself enlighten us all! Yours Fr.Ivo - Original Message - From: "Bhandare" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2007 7:53 PM Subject: [Goanet] Salvation of caste blind atheists (Bhandare) Dear Jose: Do you mean to say that the abominable practise of casteism is atenet of hinduism? btw though there is no concept of caste in christianity , isnt the belief that only christians will ascend to heaven while non believers will go to hell discriminatory in itself? then how come christianity isa religion of equality when it clearly differentiates between those who believe in it and condemns those who dont to eternal hellfire? regards B Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.17.11/1200 - Release Date: 12/27/2007 1:34 PM
[Goanet] Jesus Christ and caste system
The period between The Boy Jesus in the temple at the age of 12 and the beginning of His Ministry at the age of 30 is a silent period in the Biblical texts as approved by the Council of Nicaeain 0325 AD. However, this period is covered by Aquarian Gospel of Jesus the Christ as transcribed from Akashic Records by Levi H Dowling. According to the Aquarian Gospel, Jesus' formative years were spent in India ( Jagannath in Orissa, Benares, ets ) Tibet, Persia, Assirya, Greece and Egypt. No Indian sacred literarure ever mentions the name of Jesus. It is possible , since He was of the alien caste i.e. below the brahmin, kshatriya, vysys, sudra, outcaste, untouchable and outlaw ( illegitimate children) castes, He could not have merited a mention in the dharmic sacred books. However, Jesus Christ's disapproval of of casteist classification of human beings could be of some interest to '' bamon '' lordships and reverends in Goa and elsewhere Antonio
[Goanet] Goa SEZ: Give peace a chance.
Christmas and violence do not mix
GBA's peaceful action to revoke the RP 2011 succeeded!
On Tuesday it was Christmas and today it is the feast of the "Holy
Innocents" that marks the day when little children were needlessly
butchered by King Herod of Judea. Herod is also remembered at the
feast of "Sanv Juanv" [formerly spelt as Sao Joao, as in Portuguese].
Herod was as adventurous, and reckless, as the modern day politicians.
Goans like feasts, deaths, joys and sorrows. It gives them yet another
occasion to drink the spirit that cheers and dulls their, often
sparingly used, brains.
Jesus Christ, whose birth we celebrate on the day the sunny hours
begin to increase after the Winter Solstice or the longest night in
the Northern hemisphere, is the one who suffered and died for us. He
is the Truth [John 14:6] and Gandhi's guru of ahimsa [non-violence].
If Bapu did not become a Christian it is largely because few
Christians actually follow Christ. We need to walk the talk and see
Jesus as some men did at Emmaus. {Luke 24:29 to 35]
One would have liked to avoid a debate on treatment of tourists on
Christmas Day.
Unfortunately, NRI Goans visiting their homes at Christmas, and tourists on
holiday here, needed to be assured that their lives, and liberty was
not in peril thereafter. Finally, the Leader of the Opposition, who
can read the minds of ordinary men and women, explained to the
journalists what his former Tourism Minister had in his mind when he
said what he did on Christmas eve
Forget about former Union Tourism Minister, Renuka Chowdury's, slogan
of "Athithi Deva Bhava" [ADB or the "Guest is God" slogan for
"Incredible India"] we have our own Goan culture of hospitality to
preserve. What is the use of preserving our land if we cannot preserve
our Goanness? The GMAS leadership seems want to resurrect its lost
credibility at all costs. That hardly seems likely at this stage.
Serafino Cotta and I have strong disagreements on what is the best
script for Konkani. Yet, we seem to understand English like most other
Goans. He has been quoted as saying thus, "We have fought the biggest
land scam, the Regional Plan, democratically without disrupting the
industry, and against SEZ we can, and we will … but not this way" when
asked if it is right to ask the tourists to leave the State over SEZ
issue. Serafino and I have been on the same side of the fence for the
now revoked RP-2011 while continuing with our differences over script.
Like many others do, he does not call me names when we disagree. Name
calling is not such a Christian thing to do!
A Goan doctor living in Bahamas wrote thus on Goanet, "I submit that
Calling on the tourists to leave Goa by a certain date is an act of
violence. If it makes them afraid for their own safety, it is an
assault. It is also an attempt to dislodge a duly elected government
by creating anarchy." The Goa Police seem to agree with this
viewpoint. It has filed a criminal case against one person under
section 121 of the Indian Penal Code [IPC]. However Rajan Parrikar
disagrees with such an assessment. He wrote, "I do not advocate the
use of violent means in the fight against SEZs. And as I understand
it, neither does Matanhy Saldanha, notwithstanding the malicious
propaganda unleashed here by the likes of Miguel Braganza. Calling on
the tourists to leave Goa or to stay out of it does not in itself
equate to prescribing violence." While all of us are against recourse
to violence, we seem to have some points of differences in our
understanding of English.
A leading English newspaper in Goa filed this report, "Expressing
shock over the statement, urging tourists to vacate the state by
December 28, issued by Mr Mathany Saldanha of Goa's Movement Against
SEZs the Chief Minister, Mr. Digambar Kamat, has said that he never
expected such a statement from a person like Mr. Saldanha, who was a
part of government and has been a tourism minister." It added, "To see
that there was no law and order problem, particularly in view of the
alleged threat, the state government has requisitioned three companies
of central para-military forces."
Another Goan wrote on the Internet, "Matanhy's call for tourists to
leave Goa before New Year 2008 shows his immaturity in knowing the
ground reality of how much a tourist goes through to holiday in Goa."
adding for good measure, " I guess better sense prevails and Goans do
not fall prey to such gimmicks by some sad loser politician who is in
the process of rejuvenating his lost career."
The GMAS is obviously a political grouping of parties and individuals
interested in
political fall-out in addition, or in spite of, the achievement of its
stated target. It apparently has an inherent conflict of interests
with the Communist Party, BJP and UGDP... quite literally the
political Left, Right and Centre …. on board. No wonder they are not
moving ahead and are thinking of violence. That is what the Kashmiri
terrorists resorted to when they lost public
[Goanet] Goanet] Who SEZ violence is necessary
Dear Chinmay Bhandare, The spoken word is difficult to retrieve. Matanhy has learnt it the hard way. What Matanhy said was "untoward incidents" and "ugly turn" which almost every reasonable man , woman and child interprested as VIOLENCE, though [to be fair to Matanhy] he did not use that "V" word. Everyone has reacted to the newspaper reports and TV news, including in National channels. Rajan Parikar is happy that it has made National news. The BJP got worried because of exactly the same reason that Rajan was happy. The party has to worry about being seen as a "Violent" party, nationally, an image that haunts it after Ayodhya, Godhra and the like. TWO WRONGS DO NOT MAKE ONE RIGHT! That is what the Mahatma said. It is open to many interpretations but Matanhy must have realised that he is not the one who is right this time. I would recommend to him the same medicine I use when I am wrong ...admit the error, apologise and move on. It does not help to justify a wrong! To err is human. To persist with an error is idiotic. Mog asundi. Miguel Date: Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:00:35 -0800 (PST) From: Bhandare <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [Goanet] Who SEZ violence is necessary Many Goans are dependent on the tourism industry for their livelihood. Many have invested a lot of money in the business and wil be very hard hit if the tourist flow is affected by the anti SEZ agitation. While such tactics are very useful in grabbing the attention of the media all over the world, unfortunately common people will be the worst sufferers while the real culprits will not be inconveniened in any way. I hope that because of these scare tactics the MAs doesnt end up losing the support of a large silent majority especially form te bardez and salcette tourist belt. wish you all a merry Xmas and a happy new year! regards B -- -.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-. Miguel Braganza, S1 Gracinda Apts, Rajvaddo, Mhapsa 403507 Goa Ph 9822982676 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.
[Goanet] Letter in Gomantak Times
To Goanet - In the Dec 27, 2007 edition of the Gomantak Times, a letter by Soter D'Souza was published. I requested a softcopy of the same from Soter. Below is the full version of that letter. " "The ultimatum issued by the convenor of GMAS Mathany Saldanha for tourists to leave the State by 28th December has evoked prompt and interesting responses from some quarters of goans including the Chief Minister and the GPCC. They have made their buck and now need to play for time to overcome their bout of indigestion. So, we have talk about rights of people to enjoy and travel and about the tourism industry being affected due to such threats. There is much hype about inconveniencing the tourists and other pleasure seekers. There is propaganda about giving Goa a bad name which will harm tourism. We also agree that violence is not the solution and should be avoided. So also one can be sure that the anti-SEZ lobbies are no bunch of unemployed hooligans who enjoy rioting. They surely have lot of productive work to do and also want to live in peace. But the question is whether the rich and the powerful are ever known to listen to the cries of the aam admi minus the throwing of tantrums? The people of Saleli pleaded for help for years together but did anyone listen until that fateful day of the uprising? The anti-nylon 66 agitators of Keri village had relentlessly appealed to the government to pack off the project but no one budged until riots broke out and the blood of Nilesh Naik was spilled. The people of Nandigram also told their West Bengal government to back out with the SEZ but it became a prestige issue for the State to crush the people's voice and demonstrate its might by using the very security forces to shoot at the very aam admi from whose taxes they get their salaries. The goan people demanded for konkanni to be made the official language but nothing happened without the blood of Florian Vaz being splattered on the altar of the powers that ruled. And now, the people of Goa have peacefully demanded the scrapping of all SEZs but the government even while promising not to go ahead with the approvals went about notifying the third SEZ. So where does the aam admi stop and where do the rich and powerful begin? Everyone longs for peace even the poorest of the poor. But will the rich allow this to happen? The violence of the rich and powerful gets passed off as development whereas the agitation by the aam admi gets condemned as democratically unacceptable behaviour. The threats of an agitation disturb the rich and powerful who want the freedom and right to make their profits or enjoy their holidays in Goa without any disturbance from the aam admi. The rich and powerful which gets represented by the government is prompt to respond with press conferences and media hype, but where does the aam admi go and who will listen and publicise his cries that his 'roti, kapda and makhan' is under threat? The aam admi is expected to take patience till the study committe submits its report and the white paper on SEZs is presented by the Chief secretary, but meanwhile the rich and powerful are given the license to march on impatiently and ravage the environment and the livelihood of the 15 lakh people of Goa. Loot and plunder by the rich is justified but the aam admi who stands up for his rights definitely needs to condemned by one and all in government and commerce. After all, this is what modern day's just and equitable development is all about, isn't it?" -Soter D'Souza Socorro * Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
[Goanet] Campaign on Copyright Act begins in Goa
http://www.thehindu.com/2007/12/10/stories/2007121052660300.htm Campaign on Copyright Act begins in Goa Special Correspondent Music of various companies are played without paying licence fee PPL issued notices to 80 defaulters last year PANAJI: With the Christmas and New Year celebrations drawing closer, Indian Performing Right Society Ltd. (IPRS), Indian Music Industry (IMI) and Phonographic Performance Ltd. (PPL) will organise an awareness campaign on the implementation of the Copyright Act, 1957, in Goa. The music industry, which drew the ire of the State's hotels and resorts last year for the crackdown on live music with the assistance of the police during the Christmas and New Year celebrations, is now taking the path of generating awareness, according to sources in IPRS. The sources said that the Christmas and New Year season witnessed music events, including live bands, performing at hotels and resorts across the State. For instance, PPL issued notices to 80 defaulters last year. The campaign began last week with a seminar on Copyright Act enforcement problems and remedies, addressed by former Mumbai Police Commissioner Julio Ribeiro, who is the adviser to IMI on music piracy, and president of IMI and PPL Vijay Lazarus. Though there was no substantial music piracy in Goa through duplication of music CDs, a number of hotels, restaurants, discotheques and music joints played music released under labels of various companies without bothering to pay the licence fee, Mr. Ribeiro said. Realising that the police generally treat music piracy as a low priority issue, IMI has taken over the responsibility of investigating piracy with the help of retired police personnel and youth.
[Goanet] Digu sends 6,000 officers to enjoy along beach side
Ever since Digu took over as new CM of Goa no government offices are seen functioning. And now that he has provided full security to tourist by deploying 6,000 officers to patrol beaches and resorts most government offices appear to be holidaying without any work. Most of the government officials have cancelled their leave and are seen loitering with family and friends along the beach sides in the name of providing security. One of the official remarked "I am very thankful to Digu for asking us to go round beaches. This is a rare opportunity given to us to enjoy. We get our official Bhatta while shake owners provide us with free drinks and meals. This year end is really great fun time for us". Best regards, Dr. U. G. Barad
[Goanet] Goa Chief Minister seeks meeting with GMAS Leaders
To Goanet - Bowing to the severe pressure brought to bear on his government by GMAS's struggle against SEZs, Goa's Chief Minister Digambar Kamat has requested a meeting with GMAS to resolve the SEZ issue. Tomorrow, Dec 29, 2007 the Chief Minister is scheduled to meet a delegation composed of the GMAS Convener Matanhy Saldanha, and the BJP leaders Manohar Parrikar and Shripad Naik. BJP is one of the constituents of GMAS. GMAS has said that its future course of action will be decided based on the outcome of this meeting. Stay tuned. Regards, r Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
[Goanet] 2007 Goa Sudharop Annual Awards, Dec 29, Kala Academy, 4 - 6:15pm
GOA SUDHAROP COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT INC. - A Goan diaspora, non-profit, volunteer NGO working for the betterment of Goa and Goans worldwide welcomes you to the 2007 GOA SUDHAROP ANNUAL AWARDS PRESENTATION PROGRAMME: 4.00 p.m.Opening & general welcome by Melinda Powell 4.10 p.m.Bouquet to the Chief Guest 4.12 p.m.Welcome Konkani Song by Anthony (Junior Chico) 4.18 p.m.Address by the Chief Guest 4:30 p.m.Presentation of awards by the Chief Guest Awards to orphanages Awards to Eco-Clubs Competition winners: First Prize to New Era High School, Margao, Goa. Second Prize to St. Britto High School, Mapusa, Goa. Awards to Essay Competition Winners: Essay on Living in harmony with nature for Class IX students: First Prize to student Anupa Pramod Gaunkar of A.J..De Almeida High School, Ponda Second Prize to student Naheera Coutinho of Fatima Convent High School, Margao. Third Prize to student Mallika Raikar of Mushtifond High School, Panaji. Essay on Clean Goa Green Goafor Class VIII students: First Prize to Angel Kalra of Sharad Mandir School, Miramaar, Panjim. Second Prize to Hemant Chandurani of Manovikas English Medium School, Margao. Third Prize to Sujoy Fernandes of Vidya Vikas Academy, Margao. Certificates of Appreciation: 1) to Vidya Vikas Academy, Margao for partnering with Goa Sudharop in the events; N0STALGIA Celebrating Seniors, and ENVIROZEST 2007 inter-school enviro-based competitions. 2) to Botanical Society of Goa, Mapusa for partnering with Goa Sudharop in conducting Rain Water Harvesting Workshop for high school teachers in Goa. Awards for environment-related projects: 1) to Mustard Seed Art Group for staging two shows of the play On the Holy Trail on the land grab scam in Goa, 2) to Environmentalist Clinton Vaz to help finance publication of his new book on Goa-specific waste management subject. 3) to Green Cross NGO to conduct environmental awareness and implementation programmes at schools and village levels in Goa. 5:00 p.m. Konkani song Pariavaram by Sonia 5.05 p.m. Seminar on GOA VISION 2020 Introduction to the Seminar, introduction to the four panelists and their respective subjects of presentation, and Moderator. Each of the panelists will speak for 15 minutes, followed by a question and answer session (10 minutes), and summarization (5 minutes). 6.05 p.m. Comedy song in Konkani by Young Chico 6.10 p.m. GS report and Vote of thanks by Ibonio DSouza. 6.15 p.m. Refreshments while singers entertain. All invited. No cost to attend. 29th December 2007. KALA ACADEMY, Black Box, Panjim Thank you for your support. Goa Sudharop www.goasudhartop.org
[Goanet] Goa news for December 28, 2007
Goa News from Google News and Goanet.org Visit http://www.goanet.org/newslinks.php for the full stories. *** Some tourists shunning India\'s Goa over protests: official, hotelier - AFP [18 hours ago] PANAJI, India (AFP) ” Tourists are cancelling holidays to the Indian beach resort of Goa over fears of violent protests against government plans to build ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=T&ct=us/1-0&fd=R&url=http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5i9WNZUBHrgjDOeU-9bilJUT60KKA&cid=1125318537&ei=jEN0R9KiLJOgqwPf7IHNDg *** Develop as a knowledge hub, PM tells Goa - Hindu [2 hours ago] Photo: PTI Prime Minister Manmohan Singh delivering his keynote address after launching the Goa Broadband Network Project at Porvorim in Goa on Thursday. ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=T&ct=us/0-0&fd=R&url=http://www.hindu.com/2007/12/28/stories/2007122858871200.htm&cid=1125410891&ei=jEN0R9KiLJOgqwPf7IHNDg *** India calls Bhutto\'s assassination an \'abominable act\' - AFP [4 hours ago] Prime Minister Manmohan Singh, who was on a visit to the tourist resort state of Goa, said Bhutto's killing was a reminder of the "common dangers" faced by ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=T&ct=us/8-0&fd=R&url=http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5h05wl3bSedFXeru3OuvqkV9g8A4g&cid=1125447509&ei=jEN0R9KiLJOgqwPf7IHNDg *** Goa University to honour Lata - Sahara Samay [8 hours ago] Panaji, Dec 27: The nightingale of Bollywood, Lata Mangeshkar, will be conferred with honorary degree of D. Lit by the Goa University tomorrow in ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=T&ct=us/4-0&fd=R&url=http://www.saharasamay.com/samayhtml/articles.aspx?newsid=91734&cid=1125437705&ei=jEN0R9KiLJOgqwPf7IHNDg *** Armed police guard tourists as Goa faces protests over industry parks - Times Online [23 hours ago] Thousands of armed police arebeing deployed to guard holidaymakersin the Indian state of Goa after a group campaigning against industrial parks warned all ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=T&ct=us/3-0&fd=R&url=http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/asia/article3098046.ece&cid=1125395010&ei=jEN0R9KiLJOgqwPf7IHNDg *** Congress allies to press PM for shift of Goa naval base - Economic Times [2 hours ago] PANAJI: Allies of the ruling Congress in Goa will seek Prime Minister Manmohan Singh's intervention in shifting the Indian Navy's base from the state during ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=T&ct=us/2-0&fd=R&url=http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/PoliticsNation/PM_urged_to_shift_Goa_naval_base/articleshow/2656684.cms&cid=1125339949&ei=jEN0R9KiLJOgqwPf7IHNDg *** Your First Name: - E! Online [3 hours ago] I spotted Lauren, Audrina, Whitney and Lo shooting scenes upstairs at Goa for the new Hills episodes. They were at a table with a random group of guys. ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=T&ct=us/7-0&fd=R&url=http://www.eonline.com/gossip/partygirl/index.jsp?uuid=9e0bfc10-a4ca-4d5a-8a0f-2054c4d17676&cid=1125445275&ei=jEN0R9KiLJOgqwPf7IHNDg *** Overseas travel locales cheaper than Goa! - Moneycontrol.com [Dec 26, 2007] If you haven't booked your New Year weekend yet, it may be worth your while to travel to nearby foreign destination than go to Goa or Kerala that is ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=T&ct=us/6-0&fd=R&url=http://www.moneycontrol.com/india/news/business/overseas-travel-locales-cheaper-than-goa/20/47/318698&cid=1125403310&ei=jEN0R9KiLJOgqwPf7IHNDg *** Kerala, not Goa, has maximum no. of Christians - Times of India [Dec 24, 2007] If this were a quiz question, the answer most people would give would include the north-eastern states, Kerala, Goa and perhaps Jharkhand. ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=T&ct=us/9-0&fd=R&url=http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/India/Kerala_not_Goa_has_maximum_no_of_Christians/articleshow/2649158.cms&cid=0&ei=jEN0R9KiLJOgqwPf7IHNDg *** Save Goa through dialogue - Herald Publications [20 hours ago] For the past one year, Goa has been under threat by people who want to sell the land under the guise of development. Sadly this development is only a myth ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=T&ct=us/5-0&fd=R&url=http://oheraldo.in/pagedetails.asp?nid=6196&cid=10&cid=0&ei=jEN0R9KiLJOgqwPf7IHNDg Compiled by Goanet News Service http://www.goanet.org/newslinks.php
[Goanet] Triangulation and Mitigation V
On second thoughts, what was the pilot actually doing? Full tank, safe point on the runway, timely ejection etc etc. Seems suspiciously like what a crack test pilot might do. This was no routine flight 'training' sortie. Should Dabolim be used for 'testing' aircraft? I think not.
[Goanet] Name Dropping.
I omitted, among others, Roland, Santosh, Selma, Dotor Colaco, Teo - and you guys have been at the forefront in the quest for moderation and search for the sanity that we justly deserve to see around us. Sorry, and thanks.eric. - Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.
[Goanet] Not the proverbial Kator Re Bhaji
Sharing a letter of protest. Feel free to share with your children. Even if they are getting their MBAs. Again not to ridicule, but as part of living and caring to learn other methodologies. To be clear, since the very word violence gets people up in arms -- I am not advocating any. -- venantius There is nothing participatory about the decision to create an Open space for the Multimedia Studio. Open spaces are decreed, bearing in mind the nature and working process of any given group. So if one is emulating Google, or RGA, one must also not be disingenuous in comprehending that the scopes and time lines of their projects, are remotely similar to what we are routinely, and blithely expected to deliver against. At the Multimedia Studio, we are expected to work — and do so on multiple projects, often with unrealistic scopes, and deadlines. It is our functioning reality. The Multimedia Studio has consistently delivered, under the most trying circumstances. The fact that we have our cubicles, and some among their offices, makes every encountered "unrealistic demand" that much bearable. Furthermore, despite the consistent bad rap, the work showcased at meetings and feel good events, affirms that a significant portion if not all of the work is realized in the Multimedia Studio. The factor that directly impact the Multimedia Studio has to do with a host of reasons all of them pointing only to getting things done. We have succeeded in this largely because we have a small world of our own, that allows for reflection, planning and setting up projects carefully, and focus. An Open environment would be like delivering us to the proverbial wolves. I will not mention any reasons in favor of Open spaces, since those are plentiful, but do not impress upon our reality. The forces that be who are eminently impressed by those reasons, have either missed or have decided to voluntarily ignore basic analysis such as mine above. If a study was conduced by an Environmental Psychologist; and upper management were fair-minded, it becomes all too apparent that the intent to change does not dovetail with an acceptance of the ground reality of what the needs of the Multimedia Studio are. If this is the way of the future at TheAgencyofRecord,* pray say, why choose the one group that needs a ridiculous amount of focus as part of their job, to be used in the test. This is not to say that others are less focused. But it one cannot understand the nature of what takes place in the studio, the programming, the math component, the constant learning to make things work, and now to even suggest how Interactive can sell — then well all this is moot; quite pointless really. In all sincerity and deep respect, Venantius J Pinto * Many of you know where I work. I am covering a technicality, and saying that I am doing so.
[Goanet] Mathany and Mahatany
Dotor or Fator, What's in a name when the rose smells the same. The issue is of essence and primary. You are Barad and will remain one even if I accidentally or even deliberately call you Borod or Bonder. Unless of course these names are deeply etched in your in your personality. Regards John S. Collaco - Bring your gang together - do your thing. Start your group.
Re: [Goanet] Salvation of caste-blind atheists
Dear Victor, Thank you for that insight into your version of Christian Belief. I sincerely appreciate you taking the time to indulge me on this forum. Do we really need to wait for the after-life to develop a closer knowledge of God? "The Kingdom of Heaven is within you; and whosoever knoweth himself shall find it" http://home.comcast.net/~dnichols3/thyself.htm Kevin Saldanha Mississauga, ON. ps. came upon an interesting site while googling... http://www.atheists-for-jesus.com/ = Date: Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:19:42 -0800 (PST) From: Victor Rangel-Ribeiro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> And since you are surely going to ask me next what such a pleasurable spiritual life will consist of, let me hazard a guess: it will involve a closer knowledge of God. Warm regards, Victor
[Goanet] Cheaper to fly abroad than to Goa
Its not melodrama, nor is it ridicule on my part, Philip. You text was factual, mine was being acerbic in short form -- heckling power (it comes in different forms as we see daily) and those who believe that anything can be simply explained away. Its through a response, such as yours, that we begin to better appreciate our concerns. In terms of emotive congruency, I belive our sentiments are in sync. But, it is not even about supply and demand if one was to interpret those words as anything other than the discreet algorithm of economic "reality." That is a fine economic construct which we have been forced to believe in. Capitalism does not have to be allocated the profit margins that one has got used to. Times are different, so the greed levels (or initiative levels) can change. But this system has indeed arrogated such profits to itself. OK , I am a fossil, but hear me out. Those monies always goes to the top executives; for doing what, playing at supply and demand? Take most products and break it down, production wise, service wise and then one is left wondering how does the pricing work! I do not mean the part about branding. My complaint will never be about tourism -- whether the lack or excess of it. This is not the time to spell my views on that subject. But briefly, even for there to be an industry such as tourism, there has to be inculcated a strand of identity of people, self, and how it dovetails into Goaness, what does it mean to make a living, or profit or realize ones dreams through the path of opening a place up to tourism. The travel prices are certainly a concern. And these rates affect specific people (not saying it is planned, since I do not have proof). They are those who do reasonably well, but cannot just drop money -- the working class Goans working on ships, from the Gulf and others realities, whose remuneration cannot absorb fluctuation's, including, prices being raised. |Also, my concern is rarely for myself. I am pretty solid in values and making life decisions, and funnily have never flown into or out of Goa, although I am planning to fly to Goa this time. But it is not even that. I will give an analogous example. Its a kind of existence that is so voracious; although we are left with calling it supply and demand --- a construction of the meanest order -- which is the new reality. A few years ago, I observed the following separately over a duration of two hours each, at three fish markets in Goa. I saw people, including older folk who would just go in circles -- approaching fish vendors and then going away dejected. They would come back in 20 or so minutes, and go away. Why? With the prices going up (supply and demand) they were seeing the fish disappear right before their eyes, bought by people for whom those prices were acceptable. People of lesser means are seeing less and less show up on their tables. One cannot blame people who have money, not the idea of free enterprise, but one could certainly have see how the changes of Goa being tuned into a that would directly impact society This has to to do with policies, that are put into place to prevent or at least alleviate similar stories. Imagine when it becomes hard to buy books, or a decent cup of coffee. The list gets compounded. You are absolutely correct when you say, " I have the sneaking suspicion that we are prisoners here during this season." The season will soon strectch into the new normal. Not understandably, on account of basic inflation, but because this caca is getting Malthusian. And our political punks are not interested in policies, they are all about politics. The political appointees will not even let the bureaucrats do their jobs. Just perhaps, when there is a flood. Your last point about moving to the open spaces holds even more true. I will follow this note with a protest letter I put out to my superiors on Open Spaces (work environment). Its another worthy analogy. Venantius > > Message: 8 > Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 18:57:08 +0530 > From: "Philip Thomas" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Goa. Pardon my lingo, but this is how I see it.venantius> > > There's no need to be so melodranatic, Venantius. Its basically a question > of supply and demand. If Goa is unable or unwilling to increase supply of > capacity at Dabolim (because it cant or wont deal with the Navy and/ or the > civil aviation ministry) then fares are bound to go sky high during the > season which is almost synonymous with Goa among high fliers. > > I thought your first line would be a complaint about the lack of tourist > business to Goa. Maybe you are unhappy about the air fares middle class > Goans have to bear to go in and out. Rightly so. I can fully empathise with > the feeling on this count. I have the sneaking suspicion that we are > prisoners here during this season. Else we have to be prepared to get behind > a wheel (or hire a driver to do so or maybe even take a personal taxi) and > head for the wide open spaces. Which ever way it is
Re: [Goanet] Salvation of caste blind atheists (Bhandare)
--- Bhandare <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Dear Jose: > > Do you mean to say that the abominable practise of > casteism is atenet of hinduism? > > btw though there is no concept of caste in > christianity , isnt the belief that only christians > will ascend to heaven while non believers will go to > hell discriminatory in itself? then how come > christianity isa religion of equality when it > clearly > differentiates between those who believe in it and > condemns those who dont to eternal hellfire? > > regards > > B Dear Bhandare, It is quite possible that you do not receive my posts on this subject, or do not care to read them because they do not agree with your views. That is my loss, entirely. Still, let me try again. I agree with you that christianity "clearly differentiates between those who believe in it" and those who don't. I disagree when you go on to say that "christianity" condemns those who don't believe in it to eternal hellfire. That is what I heard preached when I was a young man; but the Catholic Church has changed since then, and no longer holds to this view. Please take this into account when next you post. Regards, Victor > Be a better friend, newshound, and > know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. > http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ > > > >
Re: [Goanet] Salvation of caste blind atheists
--- Victor Rangel-Ribeiro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >Both within and outside one's own faith, a >good Hindu is better than a not-so-good Hindu, a good >Christian better than a not-so-good Christian, a >good Hindu or a good Christian better than a >not-so-good anything else. > I have to disagree with Victorbab here. A person who is not-so-good Hindu or Catholic, when judged from within his faith, may be good (sometimes much better) when viewed from outside it. Conversely, someone who is a good practitioner of her faith may be terrible from the outside secular viewpoint. For example, a Hindu who eats beef is a not-so-good Hindu viewed from within Hinduism. But from outside his faith he is no worse than the man who eats chicken. A Hindu who believes in the caste system is a good Hindu, but not a good citizen of secular India. A man who propagates his religious teachings that people should not use condoms or that homosexuals should be cured of their sickness, would be regarded as good only by his own faith, Catholicism, not outside it. We have seen evidence of this right in this forum. Some time ago, a few individuals in this forum decried the fact that many Catholics today are cafeteria Catholics, implying that they are bad Catholics. However, from the secular vantage point - indeed, from the perspective of modern society - there is nobody better than a person who becomes a cafeteria Catholic, cafeteria Hindu or a cafeteria Hindu and Catholic, by rejecting the bad in his/her religion and following only the good. We also have evidence here of something that is good within one religion, not within another and not outside both of them. It is again the belief in the caste system. A Catholic who believes that he does not need to get rid of the caste system, that it is just another type of innocuous identity like race, nationality, ethnicity, heritage, etc., is arguably a cafeteria Catholic who would be regarded as not-so-good almost anywhere outside his faith, except within the Hindu faith. Cheers, Santosh
Re: [Goanet] Caste System - The Healing Process
Cornel refuses to answer the questions and provide a full disclosure about himself and his family. Has he invited the castes he champions TO HIS HOME to break bread and meet his children? And sincerely hoping for a long fruitful relation? A sampling of his statements from his post below are analyzed: (They are similar to his other writings) Statements: 1, 7: and other descriptors like "lightweight", "nonsense", "rubbish", and other personal judgements, are PURELY casteist statements - enhancing one's ego / resume by demeaning another Goan / institution. In addition, for those who needed proof why I refer to him as casteist the following is classical Cornel and classical Casteist. (Meaness without presenting any intellectual content). Another recent sampling of his writings to another polite and civil poster, "you display an incredible feudal mind-set but masquerade as though an educated and enlightened contemporary individual with a modern life-style. Regretfully, you fool nobody and it is time you took stock of your racist and casteist views and your supposed attachment to Catholicism. You really have made the anti-casteist case for us. Clearly, those close to the problem, and are indeed part of the problem like you, are too blinkered to see and understand the racist and casteist beast we have been attacking from afar." - Statements: 2, 3, 4, 6: So where is the beef? Most Goans, including those that in his casteist arrogance, he has pigeon-holed as "caste apologists", have moved beyond caste. All of us are saying, "please do not bother us" with a stymied mind set. What part of this sentence is in a foreign language? --- Statement: 5: Makes a problem where none exists. Thus he can justify his time and importance ... not uncommonly seen among academics. The question about the 'Goan scholar': Is Cornel being a purist (in the way he analysis the past or other posts), or is he being intellectually dishonest, or plain argumentative, or just over the top? Until I know here he is coming from and where his discussion is going, (in practical terms) it is a clear a waste of time for me. Several others have stated the same conclusions. Saiba boggos ... let's hope for his sake and our collective sanity ... that 2008 is better. Yet the lurkers who propped him up may make their appearance. I hope they at least have more substance than empty rhetoric. Kind Regards, GL - CORNEL DACOSTA 1. With the greatest respect to Gilbert, I must ask what rubbish he writes from a feudal mind-set whilst living (presumably), in a modern life style? 2. For crying out loud, many people in the Goan Diaspora haven't got a clue about caste among so called Catholic Goans. A majority arrived here from East Africa, and again, significant numbers were never introduced to the notion of caste in Goa. 3. That was the priority of a minority who wanted to propagate it with mother's milk! I am led to understand from a reliable recent source in Goa that, this minority is some 1.5% of the 'Catholic' Goan population in Goa. 4. In my Goan High School, Mombasa, Kenya, the word caste was definitely never ever uttered in the Goan Community context and in our Goan club it simply did not feature. 5. I personally had no clue about caste among the Christian Goans, until I became an activist against racism, as a university student and later as a college and university lecturer in London. 6. So many Goanetters have informed me that they had had no clue earlier about this evil called caste among Catholic Goans and, 7. with respect, for Gilbert to want to casteicise such people (as village Goa does ever so well) through a perverse sense of inherent casteism, illustrates most clearly I would suggest, how deeply this nonsense of caste adherence is for some people.
Re: [Goanet] Benazir Bhutto Assassinated
I was shocked though not surprised at her murder. The military certainly wanted her out of the way in a hurry! She was indeed one of a few who could have helped Pakistan reach some form of so-called democracy, as it exists in the country. It's not quite the democratic party as it ought to be, because there are some areas of this country where the old ways still exists & if you dont vote in the same manner as the head of the village, then you get nothing. The fifedom of the landlord still rules & the everyone has to vote the way the landlord tells them, or leave the village / town etc. But she was indeed the closest you could get to some reasonable /sensible / acceptable level of democracy, the PPP will be much the poorer for her loss. They were so desperate to get her, the suicide bomber not only shot at her & her entourage but also blew himself up in the process, just to make sure. I guess he is now in martyrs' heaven with 81 virgins all eager to please him. At least he had better have this, because he has not only sacrificed himself, but also his family, his friends, his village & all because he was brainwashed into thinking his God was bestowing him with greatness, to killl a woman politician. There will be retaliation no doubt about it. But it wont hit the headlines next time! John Monteiro 27.12.0718.57hrs (UK) Bonefacio Lopes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: For more details log on to www.timesofindia.com or switch on to your TV. Channels. It's a sad ending to one of the most pro-democracy figure of Pakistan. The world has lost an important person. May her soul rest in peace. Bonefacio
Re: [Goanet] [Goanet-News] Bringing Sorpotel to your END!
Dear Rene or the person in charge of Goanet, After reading your Ode to Sorpatel, here is something to add to you verses on Sorpatel or as knighted in North India as Sir Patel. BRJohn C DeSilva For those of us who may be able to relate...this is cute:-) __ 'For the hotch potch known as Haggis Let the Scotsman yearn or yell For the taste of Yorkshire pudding Let the English family dwell. For the famed Tandoori Chicken That Punjabis praise like hell But for us who hail from Goa There's nothing like SORPOTEL! >From the big wigs in Colaba To the small fry in Cavel >From the growing tribes in Bandra To the remnants in Parel. >From the lovely girls in Glaxo To the boys in Burma shell There's no Goan whose mouth won't water When you talk of SORPOTEL! And Oh! for Christmas dinner Don't you think it would be swell If by some freak of fortune Or by some magic spell We could , as they have in Goa A bottle of the cajel And toddy leavened sannas To go with SORPOTEL! VIVA LA SORPOTEL Bringing Sorpotel to your END! It's just occured to me, (and I'm sure to you as well), There must be some who read this, Who've never heard of SORPOTEL! And as I am so thoughtful, I'll do you guys a favour, Though you won't get a mouthful, I'll try to catch the flavour. It's made of many piggy parts, Heart, fat and liver, Vinegar that smells like f*rts, (Looks like water from the river). The meat is chopped in little bits, After being on the boil. Forty chillies to give you the sh*ts, And half a gallon of oil. And all the grand ol' aunties, Will insist, you'll see, On half a pint of piggy blood, For the right consistency. Oh! Why are you gagging? Why do you look so pale? Did you hear granny bragging? "It's better when it's stale!" It's delicious and it's really HOT We eat on 25t h December, On boxing day sit on the pot, And boy! Do we remember! So grab your rope my dearest friends, Draw some water from your well. You'll need plenty of it at both your ends, When you experience SORPOTEL!!! A THOUGHTFUL CHRISTMAS & A MEANINGFUL NEW YEAR 2008 --- Spread the Christmas Cheer, even when you're not here! Send classic greetings to your loved ones in Goa. EXPRESSIONS - 2007 Christmas Hamper Visit http://www.goa-world.com/expressions/xmas/ Or e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- - Chat on a cool, new interface. No download required. Click here.
Re: [Goanet] Congratulations Goans we've finally done it!
--- "Rajan P. Parrikar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: The Hindus, on the > other > hand, were quietly segregated and offered harmless > Nescafe and Marie biscuits. > > Regards, > > > r Dear Rajan, If I'm way off base from my usually astute political punditry, I apologise :-) Paranoia can be healthy under the right set of circumstances. It's nice to know I have your ear, if only in the proverbial sense. selma Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
[Goanet] Goa-lovers, take heart! The party is on
http://www.ibnlive.com/news/goa-lovers-take-heart-the-party-is-on/55091-3.html?xml Goa-lovers, take heart! The party is on CNN-IBN TimePublished on Thu, Dec 27, 2007 at 12:28, Updated at Thu, Dec 27, 2007 in Nation section TagsTags: Goa, Anti-SEZ Movement , Panaji E-mail this report | Print this report PARTY TIME: The comedown by anti-SEZ groups has ensured that there will be no disruption of the New Year party. PARTY TIME: The comedown by anti-SEZ groups has ensured that there will be no disruption of the New Year party. People who read this also read: No New Year party, tourists told to leave Goa Anti-SEZ groups' agitation threatens to spoil Goa's New Year bash. * Babush quits GDA, helps save Congress in Goa * Goa: BJP set to stake claim | Reporter's Blog Featured Blog Rajdeep Sardesai Modi Mandate: Myth and Reality Featured Slideshows Panaji: Goa lovers, take heart! The party will continue in Goa. The BJP, which had been spearheading an anti-SEZ movement along with a group of NGOs in the state and asked tourists to leave the state by December 28, has decided to put off its agitation till January 1 in view of the New Year revelry. The decision comes hours before Prime Minister Manmohan Singh was scheduled to arrive in Goa on a two-day visit later on Thursday. He will inaugurate the Goa Broadband Network. The Leader of the Opposition in Goa Assembly, Manohar Parikkar, has said the future course of the agitation will now be decided only next month. Chief Minister Digambar Kamat has, meanwhile, promised a great time for tourists. He says his government is taking every step to ensure their safety and peaceful festivities. The Goa's Movement Against SEZs (GMAS) had earlier asked tourists to leave the state before the New Year's Day as its agitation may take an ugly turn. The anti-SEZ groups later clarified that they would not agitate during the PM visit. "We have sought an appointment with the Prime Minister to discuss SEZ issue. We are waiting for the reply," GMAS Organising Secretary Siddhanath Buyao said. Taking no chance, the state police force has mounted security in and around Panaji city with policemen being posted at every nook and corner of this capital, which is full of with tourists. GMAS, comprising the BJP and other bodies, has been demanding scrapping of SEZ projects in the state. The Goa Government has allotted about 1,500 acres of land for SEZs till now. The state has 16 SEZs, of which three are notified while four others have been approved. Chief Minister Digamber Kamat has already assured that the issue would be settled taking all the stakeholders into confidence. (With agency inputs)
[Goanet] Adani Bunkering looks beyond Gulf of Kutch
Adani Bunkering looks beyond Gulf of Kutch Archana Mohan / Mumbai/ Ahmedabad December 27, 2007 To soon extend bunkering facilities to cater to ships calling at Mumbai, Goa and Kochi ports. A year after its foray into bunkering services, Gujarat-based Adani Bunkering Services, part of Adani's flagship company Adani Exports, is planning to take its venture outside the Gulf of Kutch. Along with the expansion planned at the Mundra port, the company will soon extend bunkering facilities to cater to ships calling at Mumbai, Goa and Kochi ports. Having touched the 30,000- tonnes fuel capacity mark for its bunkering services which is the process of supplying a ship with fuel, Adani Bunkering is now setting sights on 50,000 tonne capacity by March 2008. For this, the company is set to add two new double-hulled bunker tankers of 3000 tonne to its facility. Both are being constructed at Gujarat where one of them will be ready by the first week of January while the other will be functional by the second week of March 2008. At present, the company has three hired barges of 400 tonne, 1,500 tonne and 1,350 tonne respectively. "We will be expanding our bunkering capacities to cater to very large crude carriers (VLCCs) calling at Sikka, Kandla, Vadinar, Bedi and other ports in the Gulf of Kutch where close to 3,000 vessels arrive every year," said Chandan Samaiyar, head of bunkering, Adani Bunkering Services. He added that with the new barges, the company was targeting 1.2 million tonne of sales by March 2009. On the planned extension of bunkering facilities to Mumbai, Goa and Kochi, Samaiyar said the company was still weighing options of whether to set up their own infrastructure at the ports or take facilities on lease. Investment for the expansion is yet to be worked out. So far, Rs 150 crore has been invested in the Adani's bunkering venture. Operating from a special economic zone (SEZ), the company has been able to get the cost advantage. "Unlike PSUs, who haven't been able to compete with international bunkering rates, Adani Bunkering has placed its spot bunker prices at just $8-10 more than the rates at Singapore and Fujairah, which are usually preferred over Indian ports due to the rate factor," added Samaiyar.
Re: [Goanet] Benezir Bhutto butchered in the name of religion... or politics?
So now we hear of yet another assasination, this time Mrs Benezir Bhutto has been blasted to smithereens with several of her followers & helpers. So much unnecessary deaths, all in the name of the all-poweful. When is this death and distruction going to stop in these countries who call upon religion to play politics & for politics to dictate what religion you are to bow to. God help us all, I sometimes wonder why we even bother trying to find a peaceful solution to our problems when bombs & guns do the talking these days. A promise of a wisp of semi-democracy in an autocratic country, now totally in shambles once again. Next door aint no better, let us hope that Mr Bush does not decide to sit upon & charge on yet another white horse, Pakistan needs all the petrol it can pull out from its grounds.. best leave it to the great Saudi Arabia to resolve. Keep Bush out, but most of all stop all this terror, innocents & poor, helpers & the helpless are being murdered, all in the name of God, or is it politics? John Monteiro 27.12.07..17.00hrs (UK) . .
Re: [Goanet] Castes, Christianity, Hinduism et al (Bhandare)
Bhandare <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Dear Jose: Do you mean to say that the abominable practise of casteism is a tenet of hinduism? btw isnt the belief that only christians will ascend to heaven while non believers will go to hell discriminatory in itself? then how come christianity is a religion of equality when it clearly differentiates between those who believe in it and condemns those who dont to eternal hellfire? == Dear Bhandare, Good questions. I will try to answer them. Do not know IF you agree with my submission. 1: Yes, I am convinced that the Caste Discrimination is a tent of what is being practised as Hinduism. I will hasten to add that Goan 'Catholics' who practise the caste system could not be Christians. BTW: if you know of any other religion which forbids individuals entry into certain temples by virtue of their 'low caste' membership - please advise. This bit about "profession based caste" is a bunch of baloney. A Harijan nuclear scientist will always be a Harijan as far as the 'Brahmans' are concerned. These "Brahmans" are just as fair and balanced as the Popes of Galileo's time...and they will treat dissenters just as fairly and equitably as Galileo was treated. 2: Yes ... I believe that too. But you have to understand what the word "Christian" means. "Christian" means Christ-like. It might surprise you that in many ways - Christ taught equality like Marx (in part) did many years later. So please do NOT confuse the teachings of Christ or his life with the pronouncements of RW Christians or the actions of many who profess to be "Christians". BTW: the teachings of Manu and their place in Hinduism (never mind the revision) are quite clear. I'd say this: If one examines the teachings of Christ, one will have to say that Gandhi, Nelson Mandela, Ambedkar, the Dalai Lama, the Sai Baba of Shirdi, Mahatma Jyotirao Phule, Francis Xavier, Martin Luther King, Bill Clinton are/were all "Christians". All these individuals suffered immense personal hardships in order to improve the lot of poor people. And every single one of them have been maligned by their detractors. Have they made errors? SURE ...but when we evaluate a person - we evaluate the sum total of a person's life. That is how we would like others to judge us - Isn't that right? 3: There is a difference between those who behave according to the teachings of Christ (and Guru Nanak and Gautama Buddha) and those who do not. In that way - we organise our own discrimination by our own bad behaviour (whichever Church or Temple we dress up to attend) I trust you will agree that True Belief leads to Actions. One cannot be a believer in/of Christianity IF one does not ACT accordingly. jc ps: I have left a few pot-holes for those who like to take pot-shots. Please go right ahead.
[Goanet] Promoting Caste Blindness - to Roland
Hello Roland, It did not seem that Edward was being irreverent. He was perhaps just holding your feet to the fire, yuletide and all. One would have been enough. : ) Two are better. A conjecture on my part: based on Edward's analytical ability*, he would have to know the two that you brought up. This year seems to be ending on a good note. Looking forward to India. venantius * for that matter, you too Roland, as well as others on this forum > From: "Roland Francis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote" > Edward, > John 14:6 > Thessalonians 1:8 > Edward, are 2 enough to make the point or do you want more?
[Goanet] GOA SECURITY
With such ugly developments in Orissa , i would request Goans to safeguard the Goan churches ,and Goa at large. Prime Minister is in Goa that's what i read in the newspaper and it's the duty of the Goa administration to safeguard his security. What has happened to Benazir in Pakistan we should not happen it in Goa. It's my humble request to the Goan adminstration/ police/ army Goans to protect the lives of every person not only Goenkar but every human being who are coming down to Goa for holidaying and residents too. It appears the Pakistan example will open the eyes of everyone as regards security is concerned. Forget of throwing Tourist out , this is christmas time forget ill feelings against each other and love one another there is no point of hatred/ anger/ lust/ greed / jealousy all this can be won only by love the rest you leave to the almighty as he has his own ways to sort out the problems of Goenkars. But that does not mean , to stop being vocal for the good cause of Goans but provided it is not being decorated with a politcal blanket. Bonefacio
[Goanet] Talking Photo: JoeGoaUk played 'Mr. India' at Goanetters Annual Meet at Goa 2007 -Part I
Talking Photo: JoeGoaUk played 'Mr. India' at Goanetters Annual Meet at Goa 2007 -Part I Guess who's in photo? From right (back facing camera) Ana Rita Goswami, Melinda Powell-Coutinho (cream blouse), George Pinto (colourful shirt), Goanet moderator Bosco D'Mello (standing, tee shirt), a Goanetter from Frankfurt ? (seated), Cmdr (Retd) John Eric Gomes (seated, long sleeves), Shrikant Vaz ? (chess and Goanet), Ivana's dad and mum, Rajan Parrikar (with arms folded) and some of the children who played Ivana. For those of you, who may not know about 'Mr.India'.. Mr. India is 1987 Indian science fiction hit Bollywood film directed by Shekhar with Sridevi and Anil Kapoor where he plays a role of an invisible man (Mr. India) JoeGoaUk done it right under your noses.. Catch him if you can... http://www.flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=2142973093&size=l Still don't believe (I have deliberately given you this pic, to make u moe confused), wait, wait ,wait.. 3 More pics coming together with a Video Clip Also coming up a clip on PM Manmohan Singh arrival in Goa with 3 helicopters landed at Campal grounds at 4pm same day as Goanet Meet i.e. 27/12 Right now I am off to Mangalore, have to catch 8 o clock bus. Time now 6pm [EMAIL PROTECTED] for Goa & NRI related info... http://in.groups.yahoo.com/group/GOAN-NRI/ For Goan Video Clips http://youtube.com/joeukgoa or http://is.rediff.com/profilevisitor.php?mem_id=48419 ___ Support the World Aids Awareness campaign this month with Yahoo! For Good http://uk.promotions.yahoo.com/forgood/
[Goanet] How many trainer aircraft are left?
In the Dec 6, 2005 post cited in my previous message on this subject there is the following exchange between me and a goanet worthy. Me: The reply: < Maybe it has nothing to do with the location of Dabolim, but more to do with the choice of the Sea Harriers as a suitable aircraft costing billions of rupees.> >From learning in the intervening period I would say that, for Goa, the location at Dabolim is primary while the cost of the planes to the national exchequer is secondary. However I now realise that, of the two broad factors involved in plane crashes (pilot error and technical snags), the Navy is never going to put the onus on pilot error. This would reflect adversely on the flight training program at Dabolim and lead to calls for its closure. As for technical snags one can spend all the time trying to pinpoint blame between MRO at Kochi, mid-life upgrade at HAL and perhaps some last minute tinkering at Dabolim itself. Ultimately one can blame it on the plane's technology (which however the Navy had over 2 decades to master). How to get to the bottom of the Dabolim flight training conundrum?
[Goanet] Triangulation and Mitigation iV
The Navhind Times (NT) has provided some interesting details of the Christmas Eve morning Sea Harrier air crash at Dabolim. http://www.navhindtimes.com/articles.php?Story_ID=12256 Clearly the pilot is no plebe. At 38 years of age he is #2 in the Harrier squadron at Dabolim. Seems like he was trying to trouble shoot the vertical landing procedure which had resulted in an accident in similar circumstances in the multi-navy exercise in the Bay of Bengal in September this year. Then it was at sea on the INS Viraat. Fortunately the Dabolim attempt was made at the eastern end of the runway so the crash didnt obstruct civilian traffic unduly. It is odd that the fuel tank was full which confirms that he was working only on the vertical landing routine and not flying around much. In any event the Dabolim runway should not be used for vertical landings if they are still risky. If the remnants are not properly cleaned up afterwards it could cause a civilian plane using the runway to crash.
[Goanet] PM's address at the launch of the Goa broadband network
http://www.pib.nic.in/release/release.asp?relid=34244 PM 'S ADDRESS AT THE LAUNCH OF GOA BROADBAND NETWORK 17:34 IST Prime Minister, Dr. Manmohan Singh today launched the Goa Broadband Network at Porvorim, Goa. Following is the text of the Prime Minister's address on the occasion: "I extremely happy to be associated with the launch of the 1st Phase of the Goa Broadband Network. This pioneering project is an important milestone in the use of modern telecommunications and IT capabilities for improving public services and also the quality of lives of our people. It is indeed remarkable that such a initiative has come from Goa, whose image is one of modernity and freshness. I compliment the Government of Goa and its partners in this project for having moved forward so rapidly in implementing this project within a short time frame. I hope that as the project rolls out, its benefits will be felt by all sections of Goanese society. It will then truly become a harbinger of change and modernity into the Goan way of life. Today, there are a number of forces driving change in our country. One driver is the rapid growth of our economy. As a result of this rapid growth, the basic structural features of our economy are changing in a manner we could not have conceived even a decade ago. From a predominantly agrarian society, we have transformed into a society where industry and services have become the major components of our economy, although agriculture continues to be the source of livelihood for a majority of our people. This transformation to an industrial society is one which other nations have gone through in the past and which we too would have to undergo. This is the only way in which we can provide rising standards of living for all our people. For this to happen, we need to be increasingly better equipped as individuals to be able to participate actively and productively in the industrial and services sectors. This requires that everyone has the right education and has marketable skills. To put it another way, everyone needs "knowledge". In many ways, knowledge is the key success factor for enabling our people to adjust to the changing economic profile of our country and to find gainful employment in new, emerging sectors. Another force driving change is the rapid improvement in technology in all fields, particularly in telecommunications and IT. This rapid technological change is altering the manner in which production processes are carried out, the manner in which services are delivered and most importantly, the manner in which we work and live. There are a wide range of services that can now be delivered over a telecom link – travel services, healthcare and education. Most importantly, many jobs can now be performed long-distance, over a telephone or computer link. This has led to the growth of long distance service delivery models, more popularly known as call-centres, Business Process Outsourcing and now, Knowledge Process Outsourcing. If we are to utilize the potential of technology for improving our standards of living, we need to invest in technology and its related tools. In other words, we need an investment in knowledge capabilities. The other driver of change – and possibly the most important one – is the gradual rise in the relative importance of knowledge based work in most areas of human endeavour. As manufacturing processes become more automated and as technology changes rapidly through innovation, the highest returns go to those who generate "knowledge" and who know how to use "knowledge". The knowledge worker will be the most valuable worker in the evolving knowledge economy. You can see that knowledge is the common strand in all the forces of change. Investment in knowledge and in knowledge tools is therefore going to be the key success factor for individuals or regions or nations. I am happy that a state like Goa has realized the significance of this. The Goa Broadband Network is a first step in positioning your state for the future. Goa is a beautiful state. Although small in size, it is blessed with extraordinary natural beauty. It occupies a pride of place for its scenic beauty, vibrant culture, tolerant tradition and forward looking people. The warm and hospitable nature of its people has made Goa one of the most sought after international tourist destinations. In many ways, Goa opened the door to large scale tourism into our country. However, size can have its limitations. The potential for industrialization in Goa is limited. After all, you need to strike a balance between maintaining your pristine natural beauty and the needs of industry. Therefore, focusing on the services sector is a good option for Goa's continued economic growth. Tourism has been one success story. The Goa Broadband Network would hopefully be another. It will open the doors of the knowledge economy to Goan people. Goa is quite well positioned to take advantage of the knowledge economy. Yo
[Goanet] Hover and out (India Today ... on the Sea Harriers)
http://indiatoday.digitaltoday.in/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&issueid=31&id=2902&Itemid=1§ionid=36 Hover and out Sandeep Unnithan December 27, 2007 Tools It was past 11 on a warm Monday morning when Commander Janak Bevli's Sea Harrier came to land on the tarmac on the naval air station at Goa's picturesque Dabolim airport. It was not an ordinary fighter aircraft landing, Commander Bevli gently rotated the Sea Harrier's Vertical/Short Take Off and Landing (V/STOL) thrust nozzles down towards the runway, bringing the aircraft to a gentle hover. Just then, the aircraft began yawing out of control. In a flash the experienced pilot yanked the twin handles of the Martin Baker ejection seat between his thighs. His seat rocketed out of the cockpit into the sky. The parachute blossomed minutes after the aircraft thudded on the concrete. Bevli escaped unscathed but his aircraft became the 17th Sea Harrier of a total fleet of 30 aircraft to crash since their induction in 1983. Seven pilots have been killed so far. Six of the ageing aircraft have crashed in the past five years, three in the past 12 months alone. The Indian Navy's fleet of Sea Harrier now hovers at a perilously low figure of 13 aircraft—nine fighters and four twin-seat trainers—which raises serious doubts on its capability to defend its fleet at the sea. PHOTO: A Harrier hovering in to land on the Viraat Among the greatest threats for a carrier battle group out at the sea is from long-range maritime patrol and strike (LRMP/S) aircraft which operate far beyond the range of the ship's sensors and surface-to-air missiles. An LRMP/S like the P3-C Orion can fire up to four Harpoon missiles, each with a range of over 120 km. A single hit from an anti-ship missile can disable a carrier and prevent it from launching aircraft. The only weapon the navy has to speedily intercept enemy aircraft are the Sea Harrier jump jets. Now consider this alarming scenario. Over the next five years, the task of protecting the carrier battle group -- the Viraat, destroyers, frigates and fleet tankers -- will fall on just nine Harriers or just half a squadron of aircraft. This is less than half the required strength of fighter aircraft. This scenario has been worsened by the fact that the refit of the aircraft carrier Vikramaditya, which India bought from Russia, has been delayed by four years and it will arrive only in 2012. Vikramaditya's air group of 18 MiG-29K carrier-capable aircraft will start arriving in batches on time, from next year. The MiG-29s, however, cannot operate from the Viraat's speciallybuilt ski-jump on the flight deck and hence will be shorebased until the Vikramaditya arrives. There are three main reasons why the aircraft crash -- pilot error, faulty maintenance schedule or the failure of a spare part. The navy says it is concerned but has refused to divulge reasons behind the spate of crashes which have destroyed over 60 per cent of the Harrier fleet. Yet at least one crucial factor unifies most recent crashes: all of them occurred while the aircraft were making their landing approach suggesting a loss of control and loss of power in the final stages of landing. Clearly, an engine related issue in an aircraft that is already 25 years old. "The navy conscientiously maintains its aircraft but perhaps there are some components deep inside which are not apparent at regular inspections," says former navy chief Admiral (retired) Arun Prakash, who flew in the first Harriers in 1983. The spate of crashes came to the attention of Right to Information (RTI) activists Hari Kumar P. and Frederick Noronha who petitioned and successfully obtained a list of the crashes from the navy. "The crashes have been occurring with worrying frequency in Goa and seemed to have escaped any national debate," says Noronha. The navy says upgrades will reduce the risk of further accidents. "We have begun an upgradation of sensors, avionics and airframe of the Sea Harriers to improve the pilot's situational awareness and lessen his load," says naval spokesperson Commander Nirad Sinha. The upgrade of the Harriers is now being carried out by Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL) in Bangalore and the first Limited Upgrade Sea Harrier (LUSH) jet is set to fly in the next six months. This upgrade will deliver to the navy a formidable interceptor. Its new Elta EL/M-2032 radar can spot the enemy from over 100 km away and its Derby Beyond Visual Range (BVR) air-to-air missiles can engage them at 60 km. Unfortunately, at the current crash rate of nearly two aircraft every year it seems doubtful that there will be any Harriers left to last through another decade the navy wants them to be in service. Naval officials blame the UK, the original manufacturer of the aircraft for stalling urgently needed upgrades to the Harriers, first proposed in the mid-1990s. The V/STOL aircraft, which can take off from half the runway length required by normal fighter jets, were built by Br
