Re: [Hampshire] Cron script problem
On 11 October 2010 23:45, Vic l...@beer.org.uk wrote: After adding the folder that holds the file to $PATH and then changing crontab to run from /folder/file.sh it would not run But when I changed it to /folder/file it ran? Yes - exactly, The name of your script was day1, IIRC. That's its name - calling it day1.sh doesn't work, because that's the name of a completely different file (that doesn't exist). You *also* need to tell the OS where to find your script - either by giving it an explicit pathname, or letting it find it by searching along $PATH - but that's entirely secondary to the problem of needing to use the right name in the first place. I understood the part about the file did not exist, my problem was finding out why it thought it did not exist Simply because it didn't exist. Your script was called day1. day1.sh is not the same file. I think perhaps an explanation that the file extension in linux generally does not affect what the OS will do with the file. In gui window managers, the extension is sometimes used to work out which application to open it with, but when it comes to command line usage, in particular executable scripts, the extension is purely a hint for users. If a file has the executable bit, then the OS will try and run it when asked. If it is a text file, then it looks a the first line. If the first line is #!/bin/bash (usually referred to as she-bang /bin/bash) then when you run ./script the OS will ask /bin/bash to run the contents of the file, even if the file has an extension that might suggest something else Anton -- Anton Piatek email: an...@piatek.co.uk blog/photos: http://www.strangeparty.com pgp: [74B1FA37] (http://www.strangeparty.com/anton.asc) fingerprint: 7401 96D3 E037 2F8F 5965 A358 4046 71FD 74B1 FA37 No trees were destroyed in the sending of this message, however, a significant number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Cron script problem
On Tuesday 05 October 2010 21:52:53 Vic wrote: OK - here are a couple of problems... crontab -l 0 0 * * 1 /backup.day1.sh # Day 1 backup (the same was repeated for each of the other 4 scripts) Note that this is trying to run /backup.day1.sh . You probably don't mean that; the dot after backup would appear to be a typo (should it be a slash?) ls -l /backup -rwxrwxr-x 1 root root 357 2010-10-05 20:43 day1 And here, your script is called day1, not day1.sh. I think I may need to change some of the permission so only root can run and write? Only root can write those. Others may read/execute - it's up to you whether you see a problem with that (depends on the content of the script). I looked in mail and yes there were mails regarding cron there. Basicly it is saying /backups/day1 file not found Yep. And now you know why :-) So the problem is how do I tell it to chnage to the backup folder and then run the script? No. Relying on CWD is usually a problem - a change to your setup later can cause subtle problems. Better either to be *explicit* about what you want to run (which your script attempts to be, but fails), or to ensure your executables will be properly in PATH. I should point out (if it makes any difference) that I am access the server via vnc None at all. Vic. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk -- Thanks for all the help I have now have it working, not sure exactly what the problem was I think it was one or two minor problems Tim -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Cron script problem
On Mon, 11 Oct 2010 18:25:36 +0100, xendis...@gmx.com said: Thanks for all the help I have now have it working, not sure exactly what the problem was Two comments, not meant to sound harsh (but I'm aware that they may do). Firstly, there's no need to quote an entire thread just to say that you have things working now. Secondly, you can approach Linux from a number of perspectives, one of which is to try to understand how it works. That isn't necessarily easy: it's a complex system and I maintain that I learn something new about Linux every week (and I've worked with it full time for ten years, and used it for a lot longer). But if you do want to understand it, I would suggest that when you come across a problem such as you had, and you receive advice about how to solve it, you should try one thing at a time. That will allow you to see what does and does not work (even the 'does not work' may teach you something), and it will also allow you to teach others when you thank Fred, Bill, Alice and Susan for their advice, and say that it turned out to be Susan's idea of doing XXX that fixed it. Keith -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Cron script problem
On Monday 11 October 2010 18:41:25 Keith Edmunds wrote: Two comments, not meant to sound harsh (but I'm aware that they may do). Firstly, there's no need to quote an entire thread just to say that you have things working now. Secondly, you can approach Linux from a number of perspectives, one of which is to try to understand how it works. That isn't necessarily easy: it's a complex system and I maintain that I learn something new about Linux every week (and I've worked with it full time for ten years, and used it for a lot longer). But if you do want to understand it, I would suggest that when you come across a problem such as you had, and you receive advice about how to solve it, you should try one thing at a time. That will allow you to see what does and does not work (even the 'does not work' may teach you something), and it will also allow you to teach others when you thank Fred, Bill, Alice and Susan for their advice, and say that it turned out to be Susan's idea of doing XXX that fixed it. Keith -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk -- OK I have debated about replying and have decided to do so, but I don't wish to turn this into a bun fight but I did find your comments rather grating. Firstly I will put my hands up and apologise for the full quote, that was a schoolboy error. I was in a bit of a rush and wanted to thank those that had taken the time to rply to my request for help. Unfortunately thanking people on userlist like this one is something I don't do enough of. In resolving this problem with the help of all those replies I got, some of which made suggestion which I had forgotten about and when tried\checked the results helped. I have learnt the following, configure crontab from the command line, save text file (in this case crontab) at the command line, add folders to the $PATH. I am a product of the gui era while I understand the power and the complexity of the cli but I am all for an easy life and if the gui will give me that then that is where I will live. So all in all I did learn a lot, but as I said in my thank you post, I am not sure exactly what I did that resolved the problem. I think it was one, two maybe even three little things that was stopping it from working properly (like the file I wanted crontab to run only needed the file name not the .sh on the end of it), ultimately each replied was another piece in a jigsaw which I was trying to complete without a picture to refer to. Unfortunately I have not had a lot of time to resolve the problem hence the time it has taken to resolve a fairly simple problem. Linux is complex (but so is any OS), but I have pretty much taught myself to run, install and resolve problems I come across. My linux usage is a hobby and while I have been playing with Linux from Suse 6 days it has been my main OS at home for at least 6 years. I have asked question here and else where and as you learn something new about linux everyday. But I don't see why you feel the need to think that I have not learnt anything from the replies I had been given, I did not continually come back asking what the next step was, I asked question and learnt from the suggestion I was given and the result I obtained, hence I resolved my problem, not quickly, but I resolved it Tim -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Cron script problem
(like the file I wanted crontab to run only needed the file name not the .sh on the end of it) That *is* the filename. foo.sh is the name of a file. foo is the name of another file. These are not the same file. If you tell the OS to execute a file called foo.sh, then foo.sh is the name of the file it will execute. It will not attempt to execute foo, because that is not the file you told it to run... This was the main problem I saw with your cron scripts - you were telling it to execute a file that did not exist. HTH Vic. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Cron script problem
On Monday 11 October 2010 22:28:06 Vic wrote: (like the file I wanted crontab to run only needed the file name not the .sh on the end of it) That *is* the filename. foo.sh is the name of a file. foo is the name of another file. These are not the same file. If you tell the OS to execute a file called foo.sh, then foo.sh is the name of the file it will execute. It will not attempt to execute foo, because that is not the file you told it to run... This was the main problem I saw with your cron scripts - you were telling it to execute a file that did not exist. HTH Vic. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk -- OK, when I posted the request for help I tried both file.sh and file in crontab and neither of them worked. After adding the folder that holds the file to $PATH and then changing crontab to run from /folder/file.sh it would not run But when I changed it to /folder/file it ran? I understood the part about the file did not exist, my problem was finding out why it thought it did not exist Tim -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Cron script problem
After adding the folder that holds the file to $PATH and then changing crontab to run from /folder/file.sh it would not run But when I changed it to /folder/file it ran? Yes - exactly, The name of your script was day1, IIRC. That's its name - calling it day1.sh doesn't work, because that's the name of a completely different file (that doesn't exist). You *also* need to tell the OS where to find your script - either by giving it an explicit pathname, or letting it find it by searching along $PATH - but that's entirely secondary to the problem of needing to use the right name in the first place. I understood the part about the file did not exist, my problem was finding out why it thought it did not exist Simply because it didn't exist. Your script was called day1. day1.sh is not the same file. Vic. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Cron script problem
So my first question is, where should these 5 scripts reside (they currently live in a folder called backup in the root of the file sytem) Wherever you like. Just make sure you tell cron the full pathname to the script = ./day1 is unlikely to work, because that means the day1 script in the current directory, and your current directory might not be what you want it to be... How do I get cron to run them and where do I find any logs files that may point to what is going wrong? Check root's email. cron can mail anyone you tell it to, but if you haven't specified someone (and I doubt that you have), root tends to get the reports. Vic. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Cron script problem
On 05/10/10 18:25, Vic wrote: So my first question is, where should these 5 scripts reside (they currently live in a folder called backup in the root of the file sytem) Wherever you like. Just make sure you tell cron the full pathname to the script = ./day1 is unlikely to work, because that means the day1 script in the current directory, and your current directory might not be what you want it to be... How do I get cron to run them and where do I find any logs files that may point to what is going wrong? Check root's email. cron can mail anyone you tell it to, but if you haven't specified someone (and I doubt that you have), root tends to get the reports. To add to Vic's comments, the script can be anywhere but if you are running it from root cron, it must be owned by root and not world writable. Otherwise, anyone could modify the script and it would then run as root, opening all kinds of security risks. /usr/local/bin is a good place for root owned cron scripts. If you are running from your own account, the script can be anywhere but only writable by you. Check /etc/cron.allow and /etc/cron.deny don't exist, or if they do your account is in /etc/cron.allow. Make sure crond is running. $ ps ax | grep cron 1950 ?Ss 0:00 crond I normally change /etc/aliases root: line to my account # Person who should get root's mail root: user1 and then run newaliases commands to make it live (creates the binary database). You will then get any output from the cron jobs as an email. If the cron doesn't output anything, you won't get an email. So you could put in the cron script :- echo Start of cron myjob and this will be emailed to root (aliased to you) when the cron runs. You could also run logger and tail /var/log/messages logger -t mycron1 start of cron tail -f /var/log/messages Oct 5 18:45:36 myserver mycron1: start of cron John. -- -- Discover Linux - Open Source Solutions to Business and Schools http://discoverlinux.co.uk -- -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Cron script problem
On 05/10/10 18:49, John Cooper wrote: On 05/10/10 18:25, Vic wrote: [snip excellent advice] How do I get cron to run them and where do I find any logs files that may point to what is going wrong? show us the output of crontab -l as the user who owns these scripts? plus ls -l /path/to/scripts Check root's email. cron can mail anyone you tell it to, but if you haven't specified someone (and I doubt that you have), root tends to get the reports. well, only if the jobs are in root's crontab. ...which is just plain wrong - that's what /etc/cron.d is for (okay, that's a matter of opinion and a little off-track for this) [...snip other excellent advice...] I'm not sure exactly what webmin does with cron. But setting it up manually could be achieved with a bit of advice (and it's a good learning experience too) https://help.ubuntu.com/community/CronHowto (while I don't agree with all of it, it's mostly pretty good) Regards, Stuart -- Stuart Sears RHCA etc. It's today! said Piglet. My favourite day, said Pooh. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Cron script problem
On Tuesday 05 October 2010 19:15:06 Stuart Sears wrote: On 05/10/10 18:49, John Cooper wrote: On 05/10/10 18:25, Vic wrote: [snip excellent advice] How do I get cron to run them and where do I find any logs files that may point to what is going wrong? show us the output of crontab -l as the user who owns these scripts? plus ls -l /path/to/scripts Check root's email. cron can mail anyone you tell it to, but if you haven't specified someone (and I doubt that you have), root tends to get the reports. well, only if the jobs are in root's crontab. ...which is just plain wrong - that's what /etc/cron.d is for (okay, that's a matter of opinion and a little off-track for this) [...snip other excellent advice...] I'm not sure exactly what webmin does with cron. But setting it up manually could be achieved with a bit of advice (and it's a good learning experience too) https://help.ubuntu.com/community/CronHowto (while I don't agree with all of it, it's mostly pretty good) Regards, Stuart OK in no particular order I tried the commands suggested with the following results ps ax | grep crond 4010 pts/0 S+ 0:00 grep --color=auto crond (crond was written in red typeface) So that tell me crond is running crontab -l 0 0 * * 1 /backup.day1.sh # Day 1 backup (the same was repeated for each of the other 4 scripts) This tell me that at midnight on days 1 to 5 the script will run, yes? ls -l /backup -rwxrwxr-x 1 root root 357 2010-10-05 20:43 day1 (the same was repeated for each of the other 4 scripts) This tell that root owns the folder and each of the 5 scripts there in, I think I may need to change some of the permission so only root can run and write? In regards to webmin, it just make it easy for me to administrate the control of the server as opposed to cli I looked in mail and yes there were mails regarding cron there. Basicly it is saying /backups/day1 file not found So the problem is how do I tell it to chnage to the backup folder and then run the script? I should point out (if it makes any difference) that I am access the server via vnc Tim -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Cron script problem
The output of 'the ps ax | grep crond' is just showing you the grep command running, and not the actual cron daemon. I'm sure I've seen some systems where cron is not running as a daemon, but I may be wrong, and this may have been a very long time ago... But if you're getting emails about cron, it must be processing your cronjobs. Your cronjob needs to contain the full path to the script - at the moment it looks like this has /backup.day1.sh - which I think may need to be /backup/day1.sh based on other comments you've made. Yes you need to change the permissions. I presume these jobs are running under root's crontab, so (as root) you could chmod 700 /backup/day*.sh to change them all to read/write/execute for root, and with no permission for users in root's group, or other users of the system. VNC won't be making any difference at least :-) On 5 October 2010 15:13, Tim xendis...@gmx.com wrote: On Tuesday 05 October 2010 19:15:06 Stuart Sears wrote: On 05/10/10 18:49, John Cooper wrote: On 05/10/10 18:25, Vic wrote: [snip excellent advice] How do I get cron to run them and where do I find any logs files that may point to what is going wrong? show us the output of crontab -l as the user who owns these scripts? plus ls -l /path/to/scripts Check root's email. cron can mail anyone you tell it to, but if you haven't specified someone (and I doubt that you have), root tends to get the reports. well, only if the jobs are in root's crontab. ...which is just plain wrong - that's what /etc/cron.d is for (okay, that's a matter of opinion and a little off-track for this) [...snip other excellent advice...] I'm not sure exactly what webmin does with cron. But setting it up manually could be achieved with a bit of advice (and it's a good learning experience too) https://help.ubuntu.com/community/CronHowto (while I don't agree with all of it, it's mostly pretty good) Regards, Stuart OK in no particular order I tried the commands suggested with the following results ps ax | grep crond 4010 pts/0 S+ 0:00 grep --color=auto crond (crond was written in red typeface) So that tell me crond is running crontab -l 0 0 * * 1 /backup.day1.sh # Day 1 backup (the same was repeated for each of the other 4 scripts) This tell me that at midnight on days 1 to 5 the script will run, yes? ls -l /backup -rwxrwxr-x 1 root root 357 2010-10-05 20:43 day1 (the same was repeated for each of the other 4 scripts) This tell that root owns the folder and each of the 5 scripts there in, I think I may need to change some of the permission so only root can run and write? In regards to webmin, it just make it easy for me to administrate the control of the server as opposed to cli I looked in mail and yes there were mails regarding cron there. Basicly it is saying /backups/day1 file not found So the problem is how do I tell it to chnage to the backup folder and then run the script? I should point out (if it makes any difference) that I am access the server via vnc Tim -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk -- -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Cron script problem
Please also bear in mind that running the script from the /backup directory itself - with ./day1.sh - may yeild different results than running it from another working directory with /backup/day1.sh You may want to adjust your script to cd to whatever working directory you want the script to use, as when running as a cronjob it won't be moving into that directory before executing the script. I hope that made sense, it has been a long day! On 5 October 2010 15:34, Martin Elliott sli...@slipnet.org.uk wrote: The output of 'the ps ax | grep crond' is just showing you the grep command running, and not the actual cron daemon. I'm sure I've seen some systems where cron is not running as a daemon, but I may be wrong, and this may have been a very long time ago... But if you're getting emails about cron, it must be processing your cronjobs. Your cronjob needs to contain the full path to the script - at the moment it looks like this has /backup.day1.sh - which I think may need to be /backup/day1.sh based on other comments you've made. Yes you need to change the permissions. I presume these jobs are running under root's crontab, so (as root) you could chmod 700 /backup/day*.sh to change them all to read/write/execute for root, and with no permission for users in root's group, or other users of the system. VNC won't be making any difference at least :-) On 5 October 2010 15:13, Tim xendis...@gmx.com wrote: On Tuesday 05 October 2010 19:15:06 Stuart Sears wrote: On 05/10/10 18:49, John Cooper wrote: On 05/10/10 18:25, Vic wrote: [snip excellent advice] How do I get cron to run them and where do I find any logs files that may point to what is going wrong? show us the output of crontab -l as the user who owns these scripts? plus ls -l /path/to/scripts Check root's email. cron can mail anyone you tell it to, but if you haven't specified someone (and I doubt that you have), root tends to get the reports. well, only if the jobs are in root's crontab. ...which is just plain wrong - that's what /etc/cron.d is for (okay, that's a matter of opinion and a little off-track for this) [...snip other excellent advice...] I'm not sure exactly what webmin does with cron. But setting it up manually could be achieved with a bit of advice (and it's a good learning experience too) https://help.ubuntu.com/community/CronHowto (while I don't agree with all of it, it's mostly pretty good) Regards, Stuart OK in no particular order I tried the commands suggested with the following results ps ax | grep crond 4010 pts/0 S+ 0:00 grep --color=auto crond (crond was written in red typeface) So that tell me crond is running crontab -l 0 0 * * 1 /backup.day1.sh # Day 1 backup (the same was repeated for each of the other 4 scripts) This tell me that at midnight on days 1 to 5 the script will run, yes? ls -l /backup -rwxrwxr-x 1 root root 357 2010-10-05 20:43 day1 (the same was repeated for each of the other 4 scripts) This tell that root owns the folder and each of the 5 scripts there in, I think I may need to change some of the permission so only root can run and write? In regards to webmin, it just make it easy for me to administrate the control of the server as opposed to cli I looked in mail and yes there were mails regarding cron there. Basicly it is saying /backups/day1 file not found So the problem is how do I tell it to chnage to the backup folder and then run the script? I should point out (if it makes any difference) that I am access the server via vnc Tim -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk -- -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
