[Hornlist] to end the discussion
Yes, definitely. And I say it here again, I am just sad about what happen I am not accusing as this is definitely too late would not help the victims. One word, gathering international support means also manipulating informations. This has been done by all societies before will happen in the future again. But today, there is the information society, making it impossible to hide everything completely. See China. The authorities have given up controlling the Internet as they have 64 Million subscribers in the country - 64 millions. That is the difference, which makes it more difficult to betray a people betray the world. The list of supporting nations included giants like San Marino, Bosnia, Burundi, Moldavia, etc. nations, even the US rulers don't even know, where they are. And 1945: Kyoto, Nara, the former imperial capitals with over thousand years history the relevant art, were other targets besides industrial cities as Nagoya. And all these cities were devastated by many air raids before. So the two bombs were senseless, otherwise the authorities (US) would not have prohibited any objective research until the early 1950ies. Forgotten ??? It is not the question how if to end a war quickly. The more important question is to prevent war by trying to understand each other, by reaching the hand out to the brother or sister. It makes definitely no difference for the victims, if a very powerful leader gathers enough support to incend the fire. Killing is crime no matter how civilized or primitive a society might be. I did not polemicize against US, as there are and were too many barbaric acts in worlds history (Nero in Rome, Spanish inquisition, Holocaust, Pearl Harbour, Hiroshima Nagasaki, Verdun, 30 Years War, American Civil War, Uganda Ruanda Burundi, Biafra, Vietnam, Armenia, Chechnya, Kosovo, Kharthoum, just to name a few). And just typical for discussions: not admitting the little error (1944 instead of 1945) could be the beginning of a conflict, a potential conflict which could be avoided by admitting the little error. That´s it. Live with little errors or mistakes admit them. This is not a sign of weakness but a sign of mental strength. Horn players all over the world seem to understand each other except some single discussions about fingerings or mouthpieces. Let´s go on this path further contribute our share to world peace. The problem for most contributors to the list is it, to take all things with emotion America as the center. Things like historic facts have nothing to do with the individual, as the individual seems to be too easily manipulated (lack of information, speak education, too strong one sided influence of religions, no matter which side you are on.) Let us be more universal. And for me ? Well, it does not matter if the other is green, black, brown, red or white, nor if the other is Muslim, Christian, Buddhist or Atheist. If the other does his duty as individual belonging to a very big group more or less, I can get along with. I only have to try it. Amen. Getting back to HORN. My intention in my first letter was, to show how Peter Damm e.g. contributed his share of (musical) prayer to honour the mostly unknown victims of Hiroshima by playing Bernhard Krols Laudatio! in the Peace Park. No accusation against nobody, just reminding the community to be alert to prevent such tragedies as sad memories seem to fade away. Prof.Hans Pizka, Pf.1136 D-85541 Kirchheim - Germany Fax: 49 89 903-9414 Phone: 903-9548 home: www.pizka.de email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] HR partly
But in other cases of even World War II how could we sit down and reason with people like Mussolini and Hitler? Certain people you will never be able to reason with sadly enough. Did you know that in Italy part of the government forces are seriously trying to revaluate Fascism and change history books? There are now school books which regret that Italy lost the war... But war will never end, because its source is thirst of power... Daniel ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Re: Horn Digest, Vol 11, Issue 34--HORN RELATED!
On 11/26/03 6:34 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Send Horn mailing list submissions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/listinfo/horn or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can reach the person managing the list at [EMAIL PROTECTED] When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than Re: Contents of Horn digest... Please edit replies to include only relevant text. Please DO NOT include the entire digest in your reply. Today's Topics: 1. Atom-bombing of Japan in 1944 (Jim Price) 2. Re: Atom-bombing of Japan in 1944 ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) 3. RE: Atom-bombing of Japan in 1944 (Hans Pizka) 4. Re: single ascending horn (Klaus Bjerre) 5. Re: [horn] single ascending horn (Klaus Bjerre) 6. RE: HR partly (Hans Pizka) 7. Re: Atom-bombing of Japan in 1944 ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) 8. Re: Atom-bombing of Japan in 1944 (Amy Jo McBeth) 9. Re: Atom-bombing of Japan in 1944 ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) 10. Re: Atom-bombing of Japan in 1944 (Clayton) 11. Re: NHR, but list related (Dan Phillips) 12. Re: NHR, but list related ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) 13. Re: NHR, but list related ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) 14. HR partly? Not really. (Ralph Mazza) 15. RE: Atom-bombing of Japan in 1944 (Hans Pizka) 16. RE: Atom-bombing of Japan in 1944 (Hans Pizka) 17. RE: Atom-bombing of Japan in 1944 (Hans Pizka) 18. RE: Atom-bombing of Japan in 1944 (Hans Pizka) 19. to end the discussion (Hans Pizka) 20. Re: HR partly (Daniel Canarutto) Wow--I thought I was subscribed to the horn list--my mistake. Could we at least stick to music related topics? Let's see--anyone tried the new Geyer style Paxman? I tried it and was pretty disappointed. Let's go Seth Seth Orgel Louisiana State University LSU Web Site: http://www.music.lsu.edu Phone: 225.578-1409 ABQ Web Site: http://www.atlanticbrassquintet.com Summer seminar: http://www.atlanticbrassquintet.com/seminar.html ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Re: Atom Bombing and NHR
While Dan has stated this very wellthe discussions of Non Horn Related topics has driven many away to the other Horn list. I for one, will be joining them. Any time we get off topic, Prof Pizka has his views..and so do others. Even though we have been constantly reminded, the message just has not gotten through. Maybe it's time someone offered to moderate this list. Mark Thornton Providence, RI PeoplePC: It's for people. And it's just smart. http://www.peoplepc.com ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] HORN RELATED!
On Nov 26, 2003, at 7:17 AM, Seth Orgel wrote: Let's see--anyone tried the new Geyer style Paxman? I tried it and was pretty disappointed. Let's go Thanks, Seth. If you are referring to the model 23 Pax, then I had the same experience. The horn I tried was supposedly brand new direct from the factory through its US importer and part owner, yet a couple of the valve slides already had green crud deposits. The second valve appeared to be misaligned and created a distinct timbre change. Additionally, the horn was quite heavy, and the valve lever travel is greater than almost any other horn I've played. I returned it to WBIC and was told that it was immediately snapped up by a very satisfied customer and that I was imagining all the problems. Whatever. Dan Now if we're going to have a flame war, at least it can be horn related ;-) ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] what are lips?
I have found that I can't play several hours after eating salty food, my lips just don't respond. They don't feel dried out but just too soft with no tension. I have always considered lips to be lips and skin to be skin. Are lips just skin with an abundant amount of blood vessels under them? If so why does salt kill my playing? We have a few MDs on this list... What the heck are lips? Leonard ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Re: Atom Bombing and NHR
I second the motion. The blatant disregard for the MULTIPLE requests over the past months to stay on topic has grown to unacceptable levels. I'd just ask that those wishing to carry on political discussions do so in a proper forum. And, I encourage you to e-mail the horn list with the location of said forum, so that those who enjoy discussing these topics can do so in an unfettered manner. This is a HORN list, not an ATOM BOMB list... - Original Message - From: Mark Thornton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2003 5:46 AM Subject: [Hornlist] Re: Atom Bombing and NHR While Dan has stated this very wellthe discussions of Non Horn Related topics has driven many away to the other Horn list. I for one, will be joining them. Any time we get off topic, Prof Pizka has his views..and so do others. Even though we have been constantly reminded, the message just has not gotten through. Maybe it's time someone offered to moderate this list. Mark Thornton Providence, RI PeoplePC: It's for people. And it's just smart. http://www.peoplepc.com ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/cairnman%40wisetec.com ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] NHR, NON-HORN RELATED
You know what I like about this list? It's not monitored. You know what I dislike about this list? It's not monitored. I like that we sometimes veer from the path of talking about the horn and music only. It sometimes gives us a glimpse at (if not full frontal exposure to) the character of an individual list member. We come to know each other more fully as human beings in these exchanges. And darn it, it sometimes makes things more interesting when you've grown weary of a thread on mouthpiece dimensions and fingering combinations... I do agree that, at times, it really gets frustrating to see long exchanges about non-horn related topics, especially when you've come to the list to talk about only the horn. (That's why I rarely join in these off-topic conversations.) I know it can be annoying to hit the delete button repeatedly, but I believe everyone who has joined in the NHR exchanges has indicated he/she is off-topic in the subject line. Is it not possible to have individual e-mail filters separate out anything that has a subject line containing NHR and either label it as spam, or delete it? Amy ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] NHR-Nagasaki
The bombing of Hiroshima is not considered a war crime any more than the bombing of Pearl Harbor. Both acts were attempts to end the war quickly and minimize the total casualties. To be effective, the shock value had to be overwhelming. You have to wonder about Nagasaki, though... If one gets cynical enough, one may think that perhaps the makers of the atomic bomb wanted to have some more testing on the field. That is the way how weapons industry seems to work anyway. And now back to hornplaying... Jaakko Välimäki [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do you Yahoo!? Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now http://companion.yahoo.com/ ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] I'm so tempted....but I won't (Charles Renfro)
Regarding the thread Atom-bombing of Japan in 1944 Ok! Please stop! As often as I find my world view and political opinions in direct opposition to the ones expressed on this list, I'm REALLY very tempted to respond in kind to some of the remarks and statements recently made regarding the above topic. But I'm doing my best to refrainI really am!! In all honesty, many of the political discussions I read on this list anger me to the point that I think of many of you as complete idiots, instead of thinking in terms of our like interest (the Horn) and the various talents and musical experiences you have. I'm tired of feeling that way. If one day I were to meet some of you at a horn conference or some other horn venue, I would like to be able to experience a click, as if we've known each other beforeas if our shared interest in the horn and participation on this list would eliminate the need for formal introductions. Is that too idealistic? I am not a fan of politics, nor am I a fan of war, but I realize that both are realities of the world we live in, and necessary components of a world full of imperfect people. However, I tend to think and speak passionately on these subjects because they are essential not only to our current society, but to history as well. But when these topics are inserted into the horn list, the magnitude of their importance to society quickly vault them over and above any horn topics. I've monitored this list for about three years now, and the outcome has nearly always been the samepeople get offended and animosity builds. Personally, and unfortunatelly, some of these NHR issues have given me impressions of some of you that are not favorableand I assume some of you probably feel the same way about me. I'm sure that, as usual, some overly articulate person will respond with various good sounding reasons why there's really nothing wrong with these topics, and how we don't have to read them if we don't want to. These statements are probably all true, but they're also crap. We do read them!! We don't bypass them! We're all curious! We all want to see who will add fuel to the fire! We are all humanI think? As Dan Phillips and various others have suggested, lets cut the crap. Lets talk about horn stuff!! If one of you were to start a Yahoo Groups list entitled Political discussions for horn enthusiasts, I would probably sign up. Respectfully, Charles Renfro ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Re: Lips
I totally aggree with the comment about salty foods and playing. I have had to cut out salt on the fries with cafeteria lunch because it would utterly kill my embouchure for afterschool rehearsal. I didn't make this connection at first, and consquently suffered through many poor rehearsals. I too would like to hear from the MDs out there. Any other foods/substances that people have found that might effect the lips? __ Do you Yahoo!? Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now http://companion.yahoo.com/ ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Re: NHR threads
Is it not possible to have individual e-mail filters separate out anything that has a subject line containing NHR and either label it as spam, or delete it? Not if you read the digest, where one is forced to daily wade through the NHR detritus. Following this logic, it would be perfectly OK to discuss ANYTHING one wanted at any time just by sticking NHR on the subject line. Why bother to have a horn-specific list at all ? Ron ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] I'm so tempted....but I won't (Charles Renfro)
I'm sure that, as usual, some overly articulate person will respond with various good sounding reasons why there's really nothing wrong with these topics, and how we don't have to read them if we don't want to. These statements are probably all true, but they're also crap. Assuming this is in reference to what I sent, I'm glad you think I'm overly articulate in expressing my crap ;) Amy ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] what are lips?
Somewhat hysteric reaction ? Several hours ? You must eat extreme salty or mere salt ? What do people living near to the sea ? Exposed to salty winds ? Or is the result of your salty food the use of a lot of beers to spill the salt off. Well, this would result in playing problems, indeed. And if you like salty food, why do you bath your lips in the salty food instead just putting it into your mouth eat it without licking your lips salty ? What salty food ? Salted preserved pork ? Salted potatoes ? Salt water cooked potatoes ? over salted soup ? Salted pickles ? Salted eggs ? Salted bretzels ? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Leonard Peggy Brown Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2003 3:57 PM To: hornlist Subject: [Hornlist] what are lips? I have found that I can't play several hours after eating salty food, my lips just don't respond. They don't feel dried out but just too soft with no tension. I have always considered lips to be lips and skin to be skin. Are lips just skin with an abundant amount of blood vessels under them? If so why does salt kill my playing? We have a few MDs on this list... What the heck are lips? Leonard ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/hans.pizka%40t-online.de ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Re: NHR
NHR pops up on both lists. Perhaps you could set up a filter to ... uh filter out NHR from your inbox? A good portion of us are on both lists anyway. Chris --- Mark Thornton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: While Dan has stated this very wellthe discussions of Non Horn Related topics has driven many away to the other Horn list. I for one, will be joining them. Any time we get off topic, Prof Pizka has his views..and so do others. Even though we have been constantly reminded, the message just has not gotten through. Maybe it's time someone offered to moderate this list. Mark Thornton Providence, RI PeoplePC: It's for people. And it's just smart. http://www.peoplepc.com ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/tedesccj%40yahoo.com __ Do you Yahoo!? Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now http://companion.yahoo.com/ ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Re: NHR
Maybe all those wishing to discuss topics that don't remotely relate to horn playing could self filter and not post to the list. If someone starts something, respond privately to the person and you can talk endlessly about whatever the hell you want. I think we all get enough spam already without having our server space filled with any more unwanted messages. Geez, people, we can argue for years about mouthpieces, horns, music and salty food's effect on the lips without having to drag political and philisophical discussions into the mix. Perhaps a second (NHR) list should be set up for those who want to discuss world affairs with only hornists? I, for one, don't see any good reason why the majority should have to filter and delete messages just to amuse a few. Those who wish to talk NHR should take the discussions off-list. It's the courteous thing to do... - Original Message - From: Chris Tedesco [EMAIL PROTECTED] NHR pops up on both lists. Perhaps you could set up a filter to ... uh filter out NHR from your inbox? A good portion of us are on both lists anyway. Chris ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] what are lips?
Hans, I have noticed this reaction to salt for the last 30 years. I have to avoid salted popcorn or salted Fritos mostly. Just salt IN food has no reaction. After my lips contact salt they are usually worthless for up to 4 or 5 hours. Regards, L. Brown - Original Message - From: Hans Pizka [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Leonard Peggy Brown' [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'The Horn List' [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2003 12:46 PM Subject: RE: [Hornlist] what are lips? Somewhat hysteric reaction ? Several hours ? You must eat extreme salty or mere salt ? What do people living near to the sea ? Exposed to salty winds ? Or is the result of your salty food the use of a lot of beers to spill the salt off. Well, this would result in playing problems, indeed. And if you like salty food, why do you bath your lips in the salty food instead just putting it into your mouth eat it without licking your lips salty ? What salty food ? Salted preserved pork ? Salted potatoes ? Salt water cooked potatoes ? over salted soup ? Salted pickles ? Salted eggs ? Salted bretzels ? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Leonard Peggy Brown Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2003 3:57 PM To: hornlist Subject: [Hornlist] what are lips? I have found that I can't play several hours after eating salty food, my lips just don't respond. They don't feel dried out but just too soft with no tension. I have always considered lips to be lips and skin to be skin. Are lips just skin with an abundant amount of blood vessels under them? If so why does salt kill my playing? We have a few MDs on this list... What the heck are lips? Leonard ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/hans.pizka%40t-online.de ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] HORN RELATED!
On 26 Nov, 2003, at 2:39 pm, Dan Phillips wrote: re the Paxman 23 a couple of the valve slides already had green crud deposits. The second valve appeared to be misaligned and created a distinct timbre change. Those effect an individual horn, not the design, but these are interesting: Additionally, the horn was quite heavy, My yellow medium bell 23 weighs almost exactly 5 lbs on my kitchen scale. On Engelbert Schmid's website, his famously light double horn weighs 4.5 lbs Can we please have some other horn weights for comparison? It might not be a fascinating subject but it's mildly interesting 8-) and the valve lever travel is greater than almost any other horn I've played. I measured the outermost tip of my valve lever travel at 12mm (same as the bore, is that significant or coincidental?) Anyone else? All the best, Tom -- My ol' grandaddy taught me to always; post in plain text, quote only that portion to which you are replying, post replies at the bottom. ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] HORN RELATED!
In a message dated 11/26/2003 7:09:33 PM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Additionally, the horn was quite heavy, My yellow medium bell 23 weighs almost exactly 5 lbs on my kitchen scale. On Engelbert Schmid's website, his famously light double horn weighs 4.5 lbs Can we please have some other horn weights for comparison? It might not be a fascinating subject but it's mildly interesting 8-) Hi Tom, Ask and ye shall receive ... Make #/oz. Comments --- Lawson6/8Cut bell, ambronze, Fourier full dbl Rauch5/13Fixed, full dbl, yellow Schmid6/0Full triple, cut, yellow Paxman6/1Comp triple 1975, cut, Ni Paxman6/5Comp triple 1990, fixed, Ni Finke6/7Full triple, cut, yellow Geyer5/105V Bb, cut, yellow Hoyer3/143V, Hi F, fixed, yellow Kruspe5/4Full dbl, Ni, fixed Berg6/1Full dbl, cut, yellow Holton6/1H177, fixed, Ni Holton6/2H179, fixed, Ni Conn 5/38D,1937, all original, #320445 Conn 5/10 8D, 1957, pre-letter, all original Conn 5/88D, 1972, R series, all original Conn 6/48D, 1978, cut bell, duckfoot Yamaha4/11Vienna horn, cut, yellow, in F All horns were weighted on the same scale but may be off by an oz or two either way. Regards, Jerry in Kansas City ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
