Re: [Hornlist] Re: Phrasing, was changing tone color
Wendell, I have read your article and have looked at your video. I do thank you for your helping us. I don't think I have "got it," though I think I know what you mean by arsis and thesis, which are new to me. It's Greek to me :-). For example when I perform "America the Beautiful," I sing or play it as I would say it. That means that the pick-up notes "O" and "for" in "O beautiful for spacious skies," are not emphasized, as I think I have heard teachers say. However, these are not just notes in the rhythm, but I think and perform them as leading into the following notes, which have more emphasis. Maybe that's what you mean, and I do get it. I have heard the next phrase performed as "For amber waves OF grain." That's unmusical to me, though the "of" is the highest note. Herb Foster - Original Message From: Wendell Rider <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: horn@music.memphis.edu Sent: Friday, April 18, 2008 2:09:09 PM Subject: [Hornlist] Re: Phrasing, was changing tone color On Apr 18, 2008, at 10:00 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > message: 10 > date: Fri, 18 Apr 2008 09:48:15 -0700 (PDT) > from: Herbert Foster <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > subject: Re: [Hornlist] Changing tone color > > As well as being a fine teacher, Douglas is a singer, and he adds > that perspective to his teaching. > > This brings up a question. We are taught not to de-emphasize pick- > up notes, if not to emphasize them. However, when I am singing, > pick-up notes are usually on weak syllables. How do I "sing on the > horn" with these seemingly contradictory directions? > > Herb Foster Hi Herb, I'm not sure what you mean by "weak syllables," so maybe this won't help, but pick-up notes and other weak beats are the most expressive notes in music. That is where all expression begins. This was part of what I was writing about in my article in the February Horn Call, if you have it, and what I demonstrated on the video that is now sitting on my web site. This goes back to the ancient Greeks and their poetry. When you set a piece or phrase in motion it is the weak beats or off beats or the weak parts of beats that control the space between the stronger or more static down beats. Its like starting to move your feet when you walk, run or dance. The first move you make sets the tempo for when the feet will come down again. Rhythm comes from what is in between the beats. The pick-up note sets the whole phrase in motion. Don't worry about syllables, if I catch your meaning. Get into the flow, which is controlled by the arsis, or weak beats, that come between the static, or thesis, beats. Syllables are parts of words that contain vowels. Its just a definition. How the "syllables" of music work together is phrasing and musicality. Great singers do the same thing that all great musicians do, and that is to phrase with the weak beats. Sincerely, Wendell Rider For information about my book, "Real World Horn Playing", the DVDs and Regular and Internet Horn Lessons go to my website: http:// www.wendellworld.com ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/herb_foster%40yahoo.com Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Re: Phrasing, was changing tone color
This may seem strange to some, but as a european, to me, the most complete horn player of our modern day still remains Vince DeRosa, I've never heard a horn player with such a variable, true horn sound, combined with a very amazing sense of phrasing and musical ability. How often I've heard and recordings of him, on several styles of music, and said, 'that's it', in terms of 'nailing it' as some people say. It may not totally be on topic, but imo if you want to hear an example of variable tone colors, just listen to him. Never the same, but always spot on. Cheers Tim --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: Wendell Rider <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: horn@music.memphis.edu Subject: [Hornlist] Re: Phrasing, was changing tone color Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2008 11:09:09 -0700 On Apr 18, 2008, at 10:00 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > message: 10 > date: Fri, 18 Apr 2008 09:48:15 -0700 (PDT) > from: Herbert Foster <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > subject: Re: [Hornlist] Changing tone color > > As well as being a fine teacher, Douglas is a singer, and he adds > that perspective to his teaching. > > This brings up a question. We are taught not to de-emphasize pick- > up notes, if not to emphasize them. However, when I am singing, > pick-up notes are usually on weak syllables. How do I "sing on the > horn" with these seemingly contradictory directions? > > Herb Foster Hi Herb, I'm not sure what you mean by "weak syllables," so maybe this won't help, but pick-up notes and other weak beats are the most expressive notes in music. That is where all expression begins. This was part of what I was writing about in my article in the February Horn Call, if you have it, and what I demonstrated on the video that is now sitting on my web site. This goes back to the ancient Greeks and their poetry. When you set a piece or phrase in motion it is the weak beats or off beats or the weak parts of beats that control the space between the stronger or more static down beats. Its like starting to move your feet when you walk, run or dance. The first move you make sets the tempo for when the feet will come down again. Rhythm comes from what is in between the beats. The pick-up note sets the whole phrase in motion. Don't worry about syllables, if I catch your meaning. Get into the flow, which is controlled by the arsis, or weak beats, that come between the static, or thesis, beats. Syllables are parts of words that contain vowels. Its just a definition. How the "syllables" of music work together is phrasing and musicality. Great singers do the same thing that all great musicians do, and that is to phrase with the weak beats. Sincerely, Wendell Rider For information about my book, "Real World Horn Playing", the DVDs and Regular and Internet Horn Lessons go to my website: http:// www.wendellworld.com ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/tim_vg%40techemail.com _ Are you a Techie? Get Your Free Tech Email Address Now! Visit http://www.TechEmail.com ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Changing tone color
Pick up notes are not usually extra loud, but must be solid and substantial as they are the "launching pad" into the melody. A good book to consider is a work on "Note Grouping" by J. Thurmond. Consider the opening of the Strauss First Concerto for horn. Paul Mansur On Apr 18, 2008, at 12:48 PM, Herbert Foster wrote: As well as being a fine teacher, Douglas is a singer, and he adds that perspective to his teaching. This brings up a question. We are taught not to de-emphasize pick- up notes, if not to emphasize them. However, when I am singing, pick-up notes are usually on weak syllables. How do I "sing on the horn" with these seemingly contradictory directions? Herb Foster ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Re: Schumann in St. Louis
This is news to me. Has Ver Meulen moved from Houston and Rice to St. Louis? Paul Mansur On Apr 18, 2008, at 2:06 PM, Bruce Gordon wrote: It was Bill VerMeulen, who also excelled as principal in a fine section effort for SLSO's performance of Sinfonia Domestica a few months back. Bruce On Apr 18, 2008, at 12:00 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: from: Alex Camphouse <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> subject: [Hornlist] Schumann in St. Louis Hello horn world, Does anyone know who was playing Principal horn with St. Louis Symphony on Schumann 3 recently? I've had reports that whoever it was sounded great. Thanks. ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/ options/horn/p_mansur1%40comcast.net ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Re: Schumann in St. Louis
Is he a guest principal,I thought he is in Houston Symphony Nep Bruce Gordon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: It was Bill VerMeulen, who also excelled as principal in a fine section effort for SLSO's performance of Sinfonia Domestica a few months back. Bruce On Apr 18, 2008, at 12:00 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > from: Alex Camphouse > subject: [Hornlist] Schumann in St. Louis > > Hello horn world, > > Does anyone know who was playing Principal horn with St. Louis > Symphony on Schumann 3 recently? > I've had reports that whoever it was sounded great. > Thanks. ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/hornep2000%40yahoo.com - Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Re: Phrasing, was changing tone color
On Apr 18, 2008, at 10:00 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: message: 10 date: Fri, 18 Apr 2008 09:48:15 -0700 (PDT) from: Herbert Foster <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> subject: Re: [Hornlist] Changing tone color As well as being a fine teacher, Douglas is a singer, and he adds that perspective to his teaching. This brings up a question. We are taught not to de-emphasize pick- up notes, if not to emphasize them. However, when I am singing, pick-up notes are usually on weak syllables. How do I "sing on the horn" with these seemingly contradictory directions? Herb Foster Hi Herb, I'm not sure what you mean by "weak syllables," so maybe this won't help, but pick-up notes and other weak beats are the most expressive notes in music. That is where all expression begins. This was part of what I was writing about in my article in the February Horn Call, if you have it, and what I demonstrated on the video that is now sitting on my web site. This goes back to the ancient Greeks and their poetry. When you set a piece or phrase in motion it is the weak beats or off beats or the weak parts of beats that control the space between the stronger or more static down beats. Its like starting to move your feet when you walk, run or dance. The first move you make sets the tempo for when the feet will come down again. Rhythm comes from what is in between the beats. The pick-up note sets the whole phrase in motion. Don't worry about syllables, if I catch your meaning. Get into the flow, which is controlled by the arsis, or weak beats, that come between the static, or thesis, beats. Syllables are parts of words that contain vowels. Its just a definition. How the "syllables" of music work together is phrasing and musicality. Great singers do the same thing that all great musicians do, and that is to phrase with the weak beats. Sincerely, Wendell Rider For information about my book, "Real World Horn Playing", the DVDs and Regular and Internet Horn Lessons go to my website: http:// www.wendellworld.com ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Re: Schumann in St. Louis
It was Bill VerMeulen, who also excelled as principal in a fine section effort for SLSO's performance of Sinfonia Domestica a few months back. Bruce On Apr 18, 2008, at 12:00 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: from: Alex Camphouse <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> subject: [Hornlist] Schumann in St. Louis Hello horn world, Does anyone know who was playing Principal horn with St. Louis Symphony on Schumann 3 recently? I've had reports that whoever it was sounded great. Thanks. ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Horn Teachers
I am looking to begin studying horn seriously again. What would you say are the top schools in the United States for this, and who are the top 10 must-study-with teachers? What teachers are producing working professionals? _ Going green? See the top 12 foods to eat organic. http://green.msn.com/galleries/photos/photos.aspx?gid=164&ocid=T003MSN51N1653A___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] re: Lucien Thevet
FYI - For anyone going to the trouble of ordering, I believe that there are actually 2 volumes of Thevet material available from Arpeges. I can check on this later and will supply information then. For anyone who has not heard the recording of the Bach fugue arrangement for quartet (I believe that Georges Barboteu plays third), be prepared for quite a revelation of virtuoso technique (and endurance) from a recording made way before the digital editing era. Peter Hirsch >message: 7 >date: Thu, 17 Apr 2008 23:05:21 +0200 (CEST) >from: Kevin CLEARY <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >subject: [Hornlist] re: Lucien Thevet > >A recording on CD of the Villanelle, Siegfried,Gallay Preludes,Brahms trio,= > Poulenc Elegie and the Bach Grande Fugue by Lucien Thevet with Jean-Claude= > Ambrosini - piano - is available from Ap=C3=A8ges music in Paris www.arpe= >ges.fr for 19 Euros. I studied with Lucien Thevet for a year 30 years ago -= > he was an outstanding musician and hornplayer even though his style of pla= >ying had already changed in France by the 1970's. ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] Changing tone color
> -Original Message- > From: Herbert Foster [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Friday, April 18, 2008 12:48 PM > To: The Horn List > Subject: Re: [Hornlist] Changing tone color > > As well as being a fine teacher, Douglas is a singer, and he > adds that perspective to his teaching. > > This brings up a question. We are taught not to de-emphasize > pick-up notes, if not to emphasize them. However, when I am > singing, pick-up notes are usually on weak syllables. How do > I "sing on the horn" with these seemingly contradictory directions? "not de-emphasize" is a tricky phrase, Herb. Singing is the best model for most music making, IMHO, so I would trust your instincts when it comes to how to perform a pick-up note. Perhaps by "not de-emphasize," someone was trying to say to make sure you used good technique on all notes, not just the important ones, but that's quite a different thing than playing all the notes the same, IMHO. Although this is only partially related to the subject at hand, I will observe horn playing has helped my breathing in singing quite a bit. I find it far easier to get away with poor breathing in singing than I do on the horn. -S- > Herb Foster > > - Original Message > From: Douglas Lundeen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: horn@music.memphis.edu > Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 4:46:58 PM > Subject: [Hornlist] Changing tone color > > I was really glad to hear Hans comment on changing tone > color. It IS extremely rare in modern wind playing in > general and brass playing in particular to hear people talk > of changing colors. There are (fewer now than formerly) > different tone-colors out there, but each "school" seems to > be aiming for one basic sound. String players (especially chamber > musicians) think a lot about color and changing it, and can > see with there eyes how changing the distance from the bridge > changes the tone color, etc., etc. > > By changing the mouthspace (vowel), and the > air/volume/speed/pressure "recipe" for a given note, horn > tone can also be extremely flexible, and should be changed to > suit the composer/work in question, i.e. Bruckner WAY > different than Rossini:) Sort of stacking the deck there, > but also there is a lot of musical value to changing color > within a phrase or even on a long note the way a fine singer > would. Think of all of the different vowel shadings there > are in vocalization; and while on the topic, why shouldn't we > horn players make the full palette of consonants, voiced and > unvoiced, an integral part of our articulation? > > ___ > post: horn@music.memphis.edu > unsubscribe or set options at > http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/herb_foster%40yahoo.com > > > > > > > > __ > __ > Be a better friend, newshound, and > know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. > http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ > ___ > post: horn@music.memphis.edu > unsubscribe or set options at > http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/steve%40fridays > computer.com > No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.23.1/1384 - Release Date: 4/17/2008 3:47 PM ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Changing tone color
As well as being a fine teacher, Douglas is a singer, and he adds that perspective to his teaching. This brings up a question. We are taught not to de-emphasize pick-up notes, if not to emphasize them. However, when I am singing, pick-up notes are usually on weak syllables. How do I "sing on the horn" with these seemingly contradictory directions? Herb Foster - Original Message From: Douglas Lundeen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: horn@music.memphis.edu Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 4:46:58 PM Subject: [Hornlist] Changing tone color I was really glad to hear Hans comment on changing tone color. It IS extremely rare in modern wind playing in general and brass playing in particular to hear people talk of changing colors. There are (fewer now than formerly) different tone-colors out there, but each "school" seems to be aiming for one basic sound. String players (especially chamber musicians) think a lot about color and changing it, and can see with there eyes how changing the distance from the bridge changes the tone color, etc., etc. By changing the mouthspace (vowel), and the air/volume/speed/pressure "recipe" for a given note, horn tone can also be extremely flexible, and should be changed to suit the composer/work in question, i.e. Bruckner WAY different than Rossini:) Sort of stacking the deck there, but also there is a lot of musical value to changing color within a phrase or even on a long note the way a fine singer would. Think of all of the different vowel shadings there are in vocalization; and while on the topic, why shouldn't we horn players make the full palette of consonants, voiced and unvoiced, an integral part of our articulation? ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/herb_foster%40yahoo.com Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
