Re: [Hornlist] Peace ...
For a light hearted view of finding the answer, you might enjoy a side trip to http://www.3dweb.no/galleri/stuestolbm/bilder/anim1.swf ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Peace ...
I just lost 10 IQ points... -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bill Gross Sent: Saturday, July 09, 2005 11:34 AM To: 'The Horn List' Subject: Re: [Hornlist] Peace ... For a light hearted view of finding the answer, you might enjoy a side trip to http://www.3dweb.no/galleri/stuestolbm/bilder/anim1.swf ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/aleksozolins%40hotmail.com ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Peace Comes After Victory
Peace comes after victory. ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Peace ...
That would leave me owing. They already have to use irrational numbers when recording my IQ. -Original Message- From: Aleks Ozolins [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'The Horn List' horn@music.memphis.edu Sent: Sat, 9 Jul 2005 12:33:23 -0400 Subject: Re: [Hornlist] Peace ... I just lost 10 IQ points... -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bill Gross Sent: Saturday, July 09, 2005 11:34 AM To: 'The Horn List' Subject: Re: [Hornlist] Peace ... For a light hearted view of finding the answer, you might enjoy a side trip to http://www.3dweb.no/galleri/stuestolbm/bilder/anim1.swf ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/aleksozolins%40hotmail.com ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/billbamberg%40aol.com ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Peace Comes After Victory
That is the reason,why we cannot get peace Not Giulio Caesar, but Marcus Aurelius !!! The one with strategy, brain, eloquence, but no heart, the other the philosopher, the man with a great heart. Austria did it well in history: they united the countries by marriage. This worked until the selfishness the greed for power by some few groups individuals destroyed the empire. Nationalism, religious misunderstanding onesided fanatism - the worst driving forces to divide nations to create terror. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bill Hauser Sent: Saturday, July 09, 2005 5:51 PM To: horn@music.memphis.edu Subject: [Hornlist] Peace Comes After Victory Peace comes after victory. ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/hans%40pizka.d e ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Peace ...
If one wants peace, you( or they ) must accept the consequences. I doubt these religious fundamentalist radicals will ever accept peace. Hiding in the love for community and brotherhood, terrorists thrive off the trust of others belonging to the same belief ,unless brainwashing is employed, it will never end. War will never be the same as it was in the two world wars, or vietnam, Korea. A strong UN must step up to fix the years of mistakes(yugoslavia). I truly believe our western culture is positive for the future for one Huge reason. The empowerment of the Female in controling her body for all purposes. This is the biggest fear among Men in all non-western cultures, more so the middle east. I will not spout my reasons of strength for the American Woman. Matthew Scheffelman Horn __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Peace ...
matthew scheffelman wrote: (considerable spouting snipped) ... I will not spout my reasons of strength for the American Woman. I admire and appreciate your restraint. ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Peace ...
Matthew others, You forgot important facts or descriptions of the real situation: Women are not liberated (officially) in many muslim societies, but they are in command of the business the household in real life there. There are really resticted circles, where women are forced to use the Chador (veil), because of the existing super-jealousy of their husbands. But still there, women command everything except politics (but they work behind the scene). Women in muslim societies are protected against sexism attacks as there exists capital punishment for violators. If you were invited to a muslim house, you would know that the ladies wear Gucci Dior under their Kaftan. That´s the one side. Religious fanatics fight against the spoilage of their siciety by so called Western decadent behaviour, press, TV, etc. - which is our fault. Why do we export such senseless disgusting useless things to them ? Why do we always try to imply our view of the society to other societies. Are we really free ? I doubt. We live under the pressure of consumism, we nealy believe all what is told us by the TV, we believe it be the truth. An example: They also have brothels in muslim societies like in javanese (95 % muslim) Djakarta, but as a westerner you will never get any chance to visit one od these etablissements, as the Javanese say: That is our case, our territory, no outsider should touch ! We have to understand, that every society has limitations with no exception. We have to understand that we with our narrow (also !) view, are excluded from some parts of their societies. And we have to respect. Some of you talked about the rich being the source for terrorism. That´s right, as they special some of the super-rich get the informations about the super corrupt regimes in Saudi Arabia and ist super corrumped society (!!! E.g. sex parties of any imaginable unimaginable taste, which nobody could even dream about in his worst nightmare, just ten or twenty years ago !) and the former super corrupt regime in Iraq and the corruption in all near East incl. Israel, who sells even high sophisticated military equipment to their worst enemies by using dark channels over third party middlemen. All is BUSINESS, even the TERRORISM. Some events might even been arranged by our side, to get things done quickly, to join forces for the GRIP ON OIL and other resources. If we would give up this politics, we would have a chance to calm down the waves, perhaps, if there would not be another new business related reason behind the other side : POWER, GRIP ON WORLD POWER, WORLD ORDER, from one side to the other, no difference. But common men are BETWEEN. Right, between MILL STONES. We SUFFER by the egocentrism of a few on BOTH SIDES. I see no difference if I been hit by a suicide bomber or by a laser guided bomb or rocket shot from far away in a safe distance. If someone be killed or injured, I do not care which side has done it. It makes no difference at all. You resonate on Srbrenica, but what about Ugand Rwanda-Burundi; Etiopia ? Have you forgotten Biafra ? Cambodia ? Hiroshima, Dresden ? I do not blame our Western friends for these two tragedies. It was just politics necessary perhaps. I blame mankind as a whole, to let such things happen. Auschwitz, Mauthausen the other lagers ? I have seen them. We have the large documentary center here in Dachau I bring all my visiting friends to this place to experience the HELL. But why did mankind let this happen ? Did they close their eyes completely or were they drunk in their magalomania ? And we supported Pol Pot Idi Amin Saddam just for selfish interests. I just work through the official 8000+ pages of the official Kriegstagebuch of the Oberkommando der Wehrmacht (War diary of the suppreme command) to learn more about the facts, but learned, what nonsense came from The Fuehrer himself in his sermons for the generals as early as three years before the collaps, but all the generals remained silent until July 20th, 1944 when a handful of courageous amateur revolutionaries tried to eliminate the devil - unsuccessfully. But all the others remained TACET. That is our illness, our tragedy. It is ashaming for mankind. Deepest ashaming in the 21st century. I really feel sorry for this world, I feel sorry for all children. Their chances for the future are not so nice. For myself, baaah, 63 years have passed quite o.k. I am thankful for that, very thankful. = -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of matthew scheffelman Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 6:55 PM To: horn@music.memphis.edu Subject: [Hornlist] Peace ... If one wants peace, you( or they ) must accept the consequences. I doubt these religious fundamentalist radicals will ever accept peace. Hiding in the love for community and brotherhood, terrorists thrive off
Re: [Hornlist] Peace ...
Were that it was that simple. Take the case of Saudi Arabia for example. It's a kingdom ruled by the House of Sa'ud. The Saudi family came to power through an alliance with the Wahabbi Sect of Islam. The Wahabbi Sect is one of ones holding to a very strict, almost repressive version of Islam. The House of Sa'ud like many other governments around the world made a pact of convenience. It was what they needed at that time. The Saudi family has been a force for change in the nation. In the 1930 the Saudi nation established its first radio station. Their old Wahabbi pals were dead set against it because there was no mention of radio in the Quran, thus it must be of the devil. The first broadcast was a reading of that document. The King justified radio in his kingdom by asking how can this be of the devil, it is providing the words of the Quran across the kingdom. The House of Sa'ud was a force for modernization until a group of radicals captured the Mosque in Mecca in the late 1970s. They were objecting to the changes taking place. The ruing family put down the radical ruthlessly but this act had a major impact upon them. Even today there is officially a strict segregation of women outside the home. Places of employment must provide separate work spaces for women and men. Yet, many Saudi women looking for this employment will note on their application or resume that they are willing to work in a mixed office. In one generation the number of educated women has gone from 20% to 80%. That is 80% of the female population of the kingdom has received some formal classroom education. There are many restrictions on women written into law. Those laws are often more honored in the breach than in being obeyed. The Royal family almost follows a don't ask, don't tell policy wrt to women outside the home. The Wahabbis get to run religious police in the kingdom. They are the ones who enforce these segregation laws. Since the Wahabbis are a major fraction of the population and part of the Royal Family's power base their ability to enforce these laws varies from day to day as the Royal Family gages the need to control the Wahabbis. ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Peace ...
Guys, Please don't spam this list with political discussions - this is a horn list. Thanks. Bill Gross wrote: Were that it was that simple. Take the case of Saudi Arabia for example. It's a kingdom ruled by the House of Sa'ud. The Saudi family came to power through an alliance with the Wahabbi Sect of Islam. The Wahabbi Sect is one of ones holding to a very strict, almost repressive version of Islam. The House of Sa'ud like many other governments around the world made a pact of convenience. It was what they needed at that time. The Saudi family has been a force for change in the nation. In the 1930 the Saudi nation established its first radio station. Their old Wahabbi pals were dead set against it because there was no mention of radio in the Quran, thus it must be of the devil. The first broadcast was a reading of that document. The King justified radio in his kingdom by asking how can this be of the devil, it is providing the words of the Quran across the kingdom. The House of Sa'ud was a force for modernization until a group of radicals captured the Mosque in Mecca in the late 1970s. They were objecting to the changes taking place. The ruing family put down the radical ruthlessly but this act had a major impact upon them. Even today there is officially a strict segregation of women outside the home. Places of employment must provide separate work spaces for women and men. Yet, many Saudi women looking for this employment will note on their application or resume that they are willing to work in a mixed office. In one generation the number of educated women has gone from 20% to 80%. That is 80% of the female population of the kingdom has received some formal classroom education. There are many restrictions on women written into law. Those laws are often more honored in the breach than in being obeyed. The Royal family almost follows a don't ask, don't tell policy wrt to women outside the home. The Wahabbis get to run religious police in the kingdom. They are the ones who enforce these segregation laws. Since the Wahabbis are a major fraction of the population and part of the Royal Family's power base their ability to enforce these laws varies from day to day as the Royal Family gages the need to control the Wahabbis. ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/rkathner%40sbcglobal.net ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Peace ...
Hey, if you think I am an ignoramus on horn-related musical stuff, just wait till you hear my cogent analysis of national world events. -- Alan Cole, rank amateur McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA. Please don't spam this list with political discussions - this is a horn list. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.8.10/43 - Release Date: 7/6/2005 ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Peace ...
To the lister who did not sign his name, This is not spam, . If the same subject is being discussed in six months time then I may come to agree with you. I prefer not to see ream after ream of horn-unrelated correspondence but the odd venture into the wide world can sometimes be enlightening. Please be patient for a while - there's been no animosity yet. :-) All the best, Lawrence þaes ofereode - þisses swa maeg _http://lawrenceyates.co.uk_ (http://lawrenceyates.co.uk/) Dulcian Wind Quintet: _http://dulcianwind.co.uk_ (http://dulcianwind.co.uk/) ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Peace ...
As I get older, I find myself less and less able to see things in black and white, as I did when I was younger. However, I've found that reducing things to simplicity doesn't require black or white, or good or evil classification. In the world today, and probably back to the cave man, we can put all people into one of two categories; A. those who feel empowered to personally take, or destroy, the lives of others, for any reason, and, B those who delegate retribution and punishment to acceptable authority entrusted to defend the rights of all. Either way can work, but majority must demand that one set of rules be applied to everyone. The day of the sword and sixgun is fairly recent. If you carried a weapon, best be prepared to use it. I have cats that like to kill birds. The cat's aren't evil, they're cats. A tree hugger neighbor put bells on the cats to protect her bird feeder. One by one the cats disappeared. Those bells were dinner bells to the local coyotes. The coyotes aren't evil, they're coyotes. I told the tree hugger I'd put the bells back on if she arranges the extermination of the coyotes. Interestingly, a mountain lion ate a bicyclist a few months back and started talk of eradicating the lions. Fortunately, they're protected because they eat the coyotes. People collectively have to decide what to do. With all the scare about terrorists, the US is constantly putting violent sex offenders back on the street, which creates far more victims, by far, than the terrorists do. Terrorists are usually satisfied to cause disruption. In the US, government agencies keep sex offenders supplied with Viagra. Saturday Night Live should spoof that commercial. Then again, we probably make a lot of money on the terrorist munitions. -Original Message- From: Hans [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'The Horn List' horn@music.memphis.edu Sent: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 21:24:17 +0200 Subject: Re: [Hornlist] Peace ... Matthew others, You forgot important facts or descriptions of the real situation: Women are not liberated (officially) in many muslim societies, but they are in command of the business the household in real life there. There are really resticted circles, where women are forced to use the Chador (veil), because of the existing super-jealousy of their husbands. But still there, women command everything except politics (but they work behind the scene). Women in muslim societies are protected against sexism attacks as there exists capital punishment for violators. If you were invited to a muslim house, you would know that the ladies wear Gucci Dior under their Kaftan. That´s the one side. Religious fanatics fight against the spoilage of their siciety by so called Western decadent behaviour, press, TV, etc. - which is our fault. Why do we export such senseless disgusting useless things to them ? Why do we always try to imply our view of the society to other societies. Are we really free ? I doubt. We live under the pressure of consumism, we nealy believe all what is told us by the TV, we believe it be the truth. An example: They also have brothels in muslim societies like in javanese (95 % muslim) Djakarta, but as a westerner you will never get any chance to visit one od these etablissements, as the Javanese say: That is our case, our territory, no outsider should touch ! We have to understand, that every society has limitations with no exception. We have to understand that we with our narrow (also !) view, are excluded from some parts of their societies. And we have to respect. Some of you talked about the rich being the source for terrorism. That´s right, as they special some of the super-rich get the informations about the super corrupt regimes in Saudi Arabia and ist super corrumped society (!!! E.g. sex parties of any imaginable unimaginable taste, which nobody could even dream about in his worst nightmare, just ten or twenty years ago !) and the former super corrupt regime in Iraq and the corruption in all near East incl. Israel, who sells even high sophisticated military equipment to their worst enemies by using dark channels over third party middlemen. All is BUSINESS, even the TERRORISM. Some events might even been arranged by our side, to get things done quickly, to join forces for the GRIP ON OIL and other resources. If we would give up this politics, we would have a chance to calm down the waves, perhaps, if there would not be another new business related reason behind the other side : POWER, GRIP ON WORLD POWER, WORLD ORDER, from one side to the other, no difference. But common men are BETWEEN. Right, between MILL STONES. We SUFFER by the egocentrism of a few on BOTH SIDES. I see no difference if I been hit by a suicide bomber or by a laser guided bomb or rocket shot from far away in a safe distance. If someone be killed or injured, I do not care which side has done it. It makes no difference at all. You resonate on Srbrenica
[Hornlist] Peace...
Everyone is clamoring for peace. Maybe if we stop piling upon one another for some statement that the other person made, there would be peace. Let us all remember that we are responsible for what we say and do and that we should at all times excercise a little self-restraint. Pax vobiscum, Giovanni :- ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Peace...
message: 3 I Second this: Everyone is clamoring for peace. Maybe if we stop piling upon one another for some statement that the other person made, there would be peace. Let us all remember that we are responsible for what we say and do and that we should at all times excercise a little self-restraint. And Would like to add: A little acceptance and forgiveness goes a long way. Richard Burdick First Horn of Regina Symphony Orchestra Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
