Re: [Hornlist] "Screech horns"
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was listening to a performance of the Schumann Horn Konzerstueck What kind of horn would the first horn, whose part goes up to at least a high "Z", play? A hornette? A picolo horn? Most first horns on the Schumann seem touse a B-flat/high-F double decsant horn. That like the B-flat side of the regular double + a horn half the size of the regular F horn on top. It doesn't make it physically any easier to play high E's, but it provides some "insurance" against really bad clams for players who *can* play that high. And off the subject: please do not quote the entire digest when sending a message to the list. Good etiquette would be to trim the message, much like I have above, to quote relevent parts. Since yours was an original thread, an otherwise blank email would have been appropriate. Greg ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] "Screech horns"
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello, hornophiles-- I was listening to a performance of the Schumann Horn Konzerstueck and trying not to get depressed about how far I am from ever achieving that level of playing when a thought occurred: What kind of horn would the first horn, whose part goes up to at least a high "Z", play? A hornette? A picolo horn? Jonathan Yoder (For whom playing an "A" above the staff is a victory) I've seen it done a couple of times with a standard double horn on the first part. Most of the time, including the two times I've done it, a descant horn is used. Mine is an alexander 107 in Bb and high F. Phil Myers (NY Phil) used his Schmid Bb high Eb when I heard his section do it live two years ago. The highest notes in the piece are a couple of high "Es", three ledger lines above the treble staff. They are in the third movement, and one of them is really optional, at least in my arrangement. Actually, in many ways, the second horn, which has to go to a high B, has the hardest part, since it is out of their normal range. Wilbert in SC ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] "Screech horns"
On Wednesday, October 6, 2004, at 11:39 AM, Wilbert Kimple wrote: I've seen it done a couple of times with a standard double horn on the first part. Most of the time, including the two times I've done it, a descant horn is used. Mine is an alexander 107 in Bb and high F. Phil Myers (NY Phil) used his Schmid Bb high Eb when I heard his section do it live two years ago. Alan Civil used to do it on his Alex Model 90 Bb single. I heard him a couple of times, I think. One nice example was at the IHS workshop in 1978 at East Lansing. (Concertstück with wind ensemble accompaniment. Mostly before triples, I think.) CORdially, Paul Mansur ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] "Screech horns"
Ooops, oops, Wilbert, I am sorry about your ears. This piece goes up to high e3 (first & third mov.) and several high c3 (31) & high d3 (3) are part of the first part. Did you tune down your arrangement ? Just a half step ? And high b2 is not unusual for second horn (R.Strauss, Wagner, Pre classic, Classic ) I just used my regular double. If a first horn, a soloist for this piece, has no save & no powerful high e3 ALWAYS, he or she should not accept an invitation to play Konzertstueck. Punctum. That´s the rule. What comes first: the capability (potence) to play Konzertstueck or the piece & the invitation or the wish to play it ? Do you know the main cause for ruined (not yet begun) careers ? Trying to play Konzertstueck first horn, when not mature enough embouchure wise & experience wise. === -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Wilbert Kimple Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2004 4:39 PM To: The Horn List Subject: Re: [Hornlist] "Screech horns" [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello, hornophiles-- I was listening to a performance of the Schumann Horn Konzerstueck and trying not to get depressed about how far I am from ever achieving that level of playing when a thought occurred: What kind of horn would the first horn, whose part goes up to at least a high "Z", play? A hornette? A picolo horn? Jonathan Yoder (For whom playing an "A" above the staff is a victory) I've seen it done a couple of times with a standard double horn on the first part. Most of the time, including the two times I've done it, a descant horn is used. Mine is an alexander 107 in Bb and high F. Phil Myers (NY Phil) used his Schmid Bb high Eb when I heard his section do it live two years ago. The highest notes in the piece are a couple of high "Es", three ledger lines above the treble staff. They are in the third movement, and one of them is really optional, at least in my arrangement. Actually, in many ways, the second horn, which has to go to a high B, has the hardest part, since it is out of their normal range. Wilbert in SC ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/hans%40pizka.de ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] "Screech horns"
In a message dated 10/6/2004 4:47:36 PM Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > Do you know the main cause for ruined (not yet begun) careers ? > Trying to play Konzertstueck first horn, when not mature enough > embouchure wise &experience wise. Thank you, Professor Pizka, for this sage advice. My current plan for playing Konzertstueck, is when I have walked through the Pearly Gates of Heaven.for there I will make NO MISTAKES, and hit every e3 with perfect pitch and intonation. Dee Anne Proctor Nashville, TN ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] "Screech horns" - Schumann
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Ooops, oops, Wilbert, I am sorry about your ears. > This piece goes up to > high e3 (first & third mov.) and several high c3 > (31) & high d3 (3) are > part of the first part. > > Did you tune down your arrangement ? Just a half > step ? Hans, The Arrangement of the Schumann I have was published by International Music Company in 1968, (editor unknown) and the last time I performed it was some three years ago. No, it has not been transposed down!!! I have the music in front of me now, and, in this arrangement, I find no high e3s or d3s for the first part in the first movement. The third movement does have two e3s, one (with an optional rest) 19 measures after letter Q, and the other (with an optional octave down passage) five measures from the end of the third movement. At the age of 58, with more than 30 years of first horn orchestral playing behind me, I feel I am more than qualified to perform this work, and have always been able to play the e3s as they appear in my arrangement. You may have access to other, more exact versions, but I do not. I am not a full time pro, and not nearly as talented as you are either, and that does make a difference. Nor do I have access to a section the quality of your's - another consideration. Also, you may play lots of Strauss, etc., where the second horn goes to b above the staff, but the last time we played Strauss in this area was Don Juan, some five years ago. Otherwise, my second horn player seldom goes above a top space g. Wilbert in SC > ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] "Screech horns" - Schumann
Sorry, I read "high "Es" ", but read it in the German way - late night after Frau ohne Schatten - , which would mean "Es" = E-flat. How about the end of the first movement ? There is the climax with the rung over high d up to high e3. And the third movement with the high e3 & several high d3 ? This is from the original. And regarding second horn: did you ever consider that Schumann had the two high horns at position 1 & 2 and the two lower horns at position 3 & 4, as later did Anton Bruckner ? And Richard Strauss did not only compose the symphonic poems, but also many very, very demanding operas. Greetings from early morning (7:00 AM after short sleep). Hans -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Wilbert Kimple Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2004 1:03 AM To: The Horn List Subject: RE: [Hornlist] "Screech horns" - Schumann --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Ooops, oops, Wilbert, I am sorry about your ears. > This piece goes up to > high e3 (first & third mov.) and several high c3 > (31) & high d3 (3) are > part of the first part. > > Did you tune down your arrangement ? Just a half > step ? Hans, The Arrangement of the Schumann I have was published by International Music Company in 1968, (editor unknown) and the last time I performed it was some three years ago. No, it has not been transposed down!!! I have the music in front of me now, and, in this arrangement, I find no high e3s or d3s for the first part in the first movement. The third movement does have two e3s, one (with an optional rest) 19 measures after letter Q, and the other (with an optional octave down passage) five measures from the end of the third movement. At the age of 58, with more than 30 years of first horn orchestral playing behind me, I feel I am more than qualified to perform this work, and have always been able to play the e3s as they appear in my arrangement. You may have access to other, more exact versions, but I do not. I am not a full time pro, and not nearly as talented as you are either, and that does make a difference. Nor do I have access to a section the quality of your's - another consideration. Also, you may play lots of Strauss, etc., where the second horn goes to b above the staff, but the last time we played Strauss in this area was Don Juan, some five years ago. Otherwise, my second horn player seldom goes above a top space g. Wilbert in SC > ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/hans%40pizka.de ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
